Call Search
     

New to Ham Radio?
My Profile

Community
Articles
Forums
News
Reviews
Friends Remembered
Strays
Survey Question

Operating
Contesting
DX Cluster Spots
Propagation

Resources
Calendar
Classifieds
Ham Exams
Ham Links
List Archives
News Articles
Product Reviews
QSL Managers

Site Info
eHam Help (FAQ)
Support the site
The eHam Team
Advertising Info
Vision Statement
About eHam.net

   Home   Help Search  
Pages: Prev 1 2 [3]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Why the hatred for menu driven radios?  (Read 12990 times)
N2EY
Member

Posts: 3913




Ignore
« Reply #30 on: September 20, 2013, 10:19:08 AM »

The problem is the steep learning curve.

Say I want to change the sidetone level.

On the Southgate Type 6 and Type 7, there's a knob for that adjustment. Right on the front panel, near the audio gain control.

On most menu-driven rigs, you have to do a bunch of non-intuitive button presses to get to the point where you can adjust it, then more button-pushes to get out of there.

Yes, one can read the manual. But the instructions of how to change the sidetone level are buried so deep they can be hard to find. Worse, when you don't do something a lot, it's easy to forget the sequence.

What makes it the most frustrating is that a lot of us tend to operate "in real time" - meaning we're in mid-QSO and want to change something, and want to know how to do it NOW.

This is one big reason I keep on homebrewing....that way I can blame the designer....

73 de Jim, N2EY
Logged
K3GM
Member

Posts: 1824




Ignore
« Reply #31 on: September 21, 2013, 06:42:00 PM »

In the case of my ID-880 D-Star mobile transceiver,  if someone asks me to QSY to another repeater, I must  drill down thru so many menu options, that I'm forced to pull off the road to do so.  The days of spinning the little digit wheels on top of an HT, amd setting the offset switch to + or-600KHz.are long gone.
Logged
K5TED
Member

Posts: 781




Ignore
« Reply #32 on: September 21, 2013, 09:15:16 PM »

In the case of my ID-880 D-Star mobile transceiver,  if someone asks me to QSY to another repeater, I must  drill down thru so many menu options, that I'm forced to pull off the road to do so.  The days of spinning the little digit wheels on top of an HT, amd setting the offset switch to + or-600KHz.are long gone.

With the amount of adjustments available on modern mobile radios, if they were brought out to knobs and switches it'd be the size of a 1000MP
Logged
G3RZP
Member

Posts: 4845




Ignore
« Reply #33 on: September 22, 2013, 01:48:11 AM »

But how many of the adjustments are NEEDED? Bells and whistles seem to get put on because they can be, not in many cases, that they are really necessary for the functionality.

If you are mobile, you need channel, repeater shift plus/minus/off, tone coding frequency, and on/off. A useful bell and whistle would be for the receiver to determine the tone code frequency for the repeater you were listening to and automatically select that for transmission. Avoids that awkward situation where the repeater isn't in the directory and you don't know the frequency!

Over here, you don't even need repeater shift plus minus. It's always minus!
Logged
F8WBD
Member

Posts: 77




Ignore
« Reply #34 on: September 22, 2013, 02:09:48 AM »

Hatred is a pretty strong and much over-used word today. Hatred is vicious. May I suggest dislike?

My OHR has 5 controls up front. My HW-9 has 6. My HW-8 has a couple more. Don't have a Cub...yet, but it only has a few,  I believe.

Lovely.

My FT-817 has, I don't remember how many buried in the thing. Fortunately few are used.

Yes, I dislike menu driven radios for some of the reasons previously expressed.
Logged
KK6GMN
Member

Posts: 150




Ignore
« Reply #35 on: September 22, 2013, 09:38:25 AM »

I am a new operator, but an old dude.  My first radio is a shiny new Kenwood TS-2000.  It has menus, and lots of buttons and dials.  I am cutting my ham teeth on this rig and am constantly amazed how easy it is to get to any function I need.  It seems that I always make it more complex then it needs to be in most cases.  There are menus, and there are multi function buttons.  All are labeled and easy to understand if you know what they mean.  For a new ham, the meaning is sometimes confusing, but I would think someone with some ham experience would have little trouble. My only gripe would be the labels are sometimes small and hard to read without good lighting.... but that could b m coke bottle bottom glasses.  Grin
Logged

-SeanM
KK6GMN

"No man is a failure...
...who has friends." --Clarence

Weather at my shack
http://www.pegnsean.net/~sean/weather/wx.htm
G3RZP
Member

Posts: 4845




Ignore
« Reply #36 on: September 22, 2013, 01:47:24 PM »

Cynical as I am, I have severe doubts as to whether for at least 95% of the time, on 80 meter CW, you would really hear the difference with a competent operator between the latest SDR rx and a 1960's 75A4 or HRO 60 - or possibly even a 1930s HRO Senior.

Different on 20meters where the worse image rejection comes in.
Logged
W8JX
Member

Posts: 6476




Ignore
« Reply #37 on: September 22, 2013, 04:12:12 PM »

But how many of the adjustments are NEEDED? Bells and whistles seem to get put on because they can be, not in many cases, that they are really necessary for the functionality.

If you are mobile, you need channel, repeater shift plus/minus/off, tone coding frequency, and on/off. A useful bell and whistle would be for the receiver to determine the tone code frequency for the repeater you were listening to and automatically select that for transmission. Avoids that awkward situation where the repeater isn't in the directory and you don't know the frequency!

Over here, you don't even need repeater shift plus minus. It's always minus!

Still not sure why someone would want to "waste" a HF rig doing 2m FM.
Logged

--------------------------------------
All posted wireless using Win 8.1 RT, a Android tablet using 4G/LTE/WiFi or Sprint Note 3.
AD6KA
Member

Posts: 2238




Ignore
« Reply #38 on: September 22, 2013, 10:26:57 PM »

Mobile HF rigs (FT-100D, IC-706 series) don't have the the
front panel space for a lot of button's and dials like base rigs do.

I think the the 756PROI->III series (I have a PROII) strike a good balance between
features, menus, and manual controls. Still, I always enjoy operating
my TS-940S, which has all but the most obscure controls on it's
65 or so front panel controls. (There are a few controls on the top
of the rig under a small sliding panel). True, a very good many front
panel controls are "set and forget", *but* it is nice to be able to see
and check *what* they are set at at a glance.

I don't think I would want a base rig where I had to access a menu to
change the mic gain or power output. And Steve, WIK made a good
point about continously adjustable pots vs.  preset numerical values
for certain adjustments.

"Hate"? Really?
Isn't there already enough hate in this world?
73, Ken  AD6KA
Logged
Pages: Prev 1 2 [3]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!