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Author Topic: Forum philosophy statement needed!  (Read 19336 times)
N5INP
Member

Posts: 921




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« Reply #15 on: November 03, 2013, 11:25:06 AM »

No offense, INP, but you're the only person whining about this.  And if you're so darned great at moderating web forums, why don't you go start your own?  If you're so brilliant and clever, people will FLOCK to your website, right? 

Oh I have, but it's not a subject related to this hobby.   Cheesy

Quote
IOW, if you can do it better, go do it.  Otherwise, maybe you need to quit banging your spoon on the highchair.

There's lots of reasons why I wouldn't start another Ham forum. The main reason is, it would be duplicating what's already out there, so it would not be a good use of my time. However, because I'm an expert on SMF and Administering forums in general, I'm happy to share my vast knowledge about that with the Admins here. If they want my advice, they'll use it, if not, they won't. You make the same mistake as K1CJS. Just because I offer helpful advice doesn't mean I'm a bad member, In fact, it's just the opposite. It means I care enough to take the time to make these posts. If I didn't care, I wouldn't offer to help them. Nobody is forcing you at gunpoint to read any of my posts or even this thread, so really, I wonder why you are even bothering to make responses. If they don't like my advice they can lock the thread. That doesn't mean the issues I'm raising will vanish, however.  Smiley
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K1CJS
Member

Posts: 6034




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« Reply #16 on: November 03, 2013, 01:05:09 PM »

You beat me to it, Ken.  Let him start his own ham website.  Better yet, if he doesn't like the way this one is run, just suggest--no, I'll suggest--him stop coming here.  73.
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N5INP
Member

Posts: 921




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« Reply #17 on: November 03, 2013, 02:05:24 PM »

Perhaps a quote from one of the Admins would be appropriate for my position -


All in all, I think I'd more easily tolerate being accused of "caring too much" (being overly strict with interpretation of these rules) than or "not caring enough".
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KD0REQ
Member

Posts: 950




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« Reply #18 on: November 05, 2013, 12:56:20 PM »

there is BROKEN... there is MISREPRESENTED... and then there is LYING and DUCKING RESPONSIBILITY.

there are also occasionally MISTAKES.

find it hard to work up a reason to start a brushfire over which is which.  if somebody can't be pleased with a vendor, say it simply and move on with life.  there are some folks you can't please if you hang 'em with a NEW rope, you know.

all the pretty blinking lights in red when you prefer blue, well, pick something else off the shelf and let the manufacturer know.  unless the blue lights turn red when the magic smoke escapes and the company hangs up on you...
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N4TTS
Member

Posts: 155




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« Reply #19 on: November 06, 2013, 02:49:39 PM »

<snip> However, because I'm an expert on SMF and Administering forums in general, I'm happy to share my vast knowledge about that with the Admins here. <vomit - snip>

THAT'S what this forum needs. One more self-centered egomaniac with a massively overblown sense of self worth to come riding into town to save us from the horrible fate we've all been suffering from before now; having fun without N5INP.

Don't feed the trolls...

Don N4TTS
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N5INP
Member

Posts: 921




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« Reply #20 on: November 06, 2013, 04:02:16 PM »

THAT'S what this forum needs. One more self-centered egomaniac with a massively overblown sense of self worth to ...

It just so happens I know what I'm talking about.

The updates that SMF releases are for the most part for the security of the forum - emails, passwords and so on. This forum is lagging behind by more than a few security updates. The Admins should be aware of the risks of not installing the SMF updates.

You think I'm trolling because I think the security patches need to be installed as they come out, to protect the members here?

Uh huh ...


(note: thread views at time of this post: 2177)
« Last Edit: November 06, 2013, 04:10:35 PM by N5INP » Logged

N2MG
Administrator

Posts: 123



« Reply #21 on: November 07, 2013, 05:11:12 AM »

The site's limited resources have been working to update the overall site as well as the forums software.  I was personally unaware of any security issues but it wouldn't surprise me.  I'll make sure our back office folks know.

We have a very small staff so what might appear inefficient or wrong to some, with regard to how we manage the forums, works for us.

Also, if we are going to pick nits...people are "broke", things are "broken". ;-)

Mike N2MG
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N5INP
Member

Posts: 921




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« Reply #22 on: November 07, 2013, 06:06:16 AM »

The site's limited resources have been working to update the overall site as well as the forums software.  I was personally unaware of any security issues but it wouldn't surprise me.  I'll make sure our back office folks know.

Hello. I'm only really just trying to help (believe it or not).

The updates are just patches that can be installed from the Admin panel. Here's a description of the latest one, but you'd need to apply all the patches in order since 1.1.11.

http://www.simplemachines.org/community/index.php?topic=512964.0

If you have any Mods (modification packages) installed, you'd need to make sure each of them would be compatible with the final package (1.1.19). But really, the update packages should be installed as they come out, to protect the forum and make sure it runs well. There are lots of things that can happen behind the scenes that regular members who just read the forum don't see, such as errors in the error log caused by problems that have been fixed since 1.1.11. People who are exclaiming that the forum doesn't appear to have any problems simply don't see what the Admins can see.

Anyway, just trying to help.  Smiley
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N2MG
Administrator

Posts: 123



« Reply #23 on: November 07, 2013, 06:37:31 AM »

I'm certain we've customized the code and I think those modifications might be just what's preventing us from simply installing updates. Like I said, I'll look into this some more.

-Mike

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N4TTS
Member

Posts: 155




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« Reply #24 on: November 07, 2013, 08:57:36 AM »

<clip>You think I'm trolling because I think the security patches need to be installed as they come out, to protect the members here? <clip>

Not in the least. It's all in how one presents oneself. Knowledge is a useful commodity. Braggadocio is simply off putting and obfuscates any value you may actually be able to add.

A narrow or incomplete view of a technical system may also prompt one to make blanket statements that may not be applicable due to extenuating circumstances.

Don N4TTS 
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K1CJS
Member

Posts: 6034




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« Reply #25 on: November 10, 2013, 01:47:21 PM »

I'm certain we've customized the code and I think those modifications might be just what's preventing us from simply installing updates. Like I said, I'll look into this some more.

Which is what I said (OK, meant) in reply #10.  A while back, Mike--and I do mean a while, you told me that a lot of the code had been customized, which is why I suspected updates couldn't just be plugged in.  Although my profile has a 2009 date on it, I believe that was the date of a major site update, not my sign-up date.  I've been on this site since the early 2000s
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N5INP
Member

Posts: 921




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« Reply #26 on: November 10, 2013, 02:56:21 PM »

All I'm saying is that SMF releases updates for security reasons and that they need to be installed on a regular basis. This is only for the security of the site and it's members private information. The updates aren't to add pretty colors or things like that. They are for serious reasons.

According to my research, the update that followed the version running here was released -

SMF 1.1.12    October 22 2010

That's three years ago. And of course there are numerous more after that, and not even mentioning that SMF has moved way beyond this series to SMF 2.x.x, which has many more features and looks a whole lot better.

I know what a default installation of SMF looks like and I know this forum has customizations. However, it's a wise policy, if you decide to go that route, that you plan on how to add the updates in light of your customizations. You should never customize a forum to the point it prevents timely installations of the SMF security patches. If someone realized the patches couldn't be installed, they should have called a meeting years ago to get a procedure down to move forward. Just ignoring the issue is not a viable alternative.

I only add my recommendations in light of my experience - no one need pay attention to them nor even read them. They are here to use or not use as you please.  Smiley



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K9IUQ
Member

Posts: 1832




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« Reply #27 on: November 12, 2013, 03:02:09 PM »

No offense, INP, but you're the only person whining about this.  And if you're so darned great at moderating web forums, why don't you go start your own?  

I have to agree. I could care less what Version of whatever software is being used here. It works and most of us are comfortable with it. Like a pair of old jeans, eham fits.

Here is an example of "Updating forums". Yahoo groups recently changed "updated" their software. The result was disastrous. Everyone hated the new and improved forum software and complained about the new software. Worse many people like me just stopped using Yahoo groups. eham can do whatever they like. I personally hope they do not change.

Stan K9IUQ  
« Last Edit: November 12, 2013, 03:12:02 PM by K9IUQ » Logged
K9IUQ
Member

Posts: 1832




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« Reply #28 on: November 12, 2013, 03:07:01 PM »

I'm the right guy - I do most of the damage here. I asked other managers to stay out because I was unable to defend actions of which I had no knowledge or control. So I asked for it and I got it. Wink

Mike N2MG

As one (K9IUQ) who has had his posts deleted countless times because of being too controversial, I have to say that since you took over things have been handled much more fairly. I do not always agree with your actions, but I respect them. Thanks Mike, for the thankless job you do here on eham.

Stan K9IUQ
« Last Edit: November 12, 2013, 03:10:01 PM by K9IUQ » Logged
N5INP
Member

Posts: 921




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« Reply #29 on: November 12, 2013, 04:58:20 PM »

I have to agree. I could care less what Version of whatever software is being used here. It works and most of us are comfortable with it. Like a pair of old jeans, eham fits.

The security updates I'm talking about aren't something the members would even see or notice. It's all behind the scenes and is taken care of by the Admins and they don't get any credit or thanks for doing it. Of course if your personal information, private PMs, or password got stolen because of the lack of security updates, you'd probably change your tune pretty quickly. These "old jeans" would be ready to be thrown in the trash.

Really, arguing about anything to do with SMF with me isn't a good idea, because I've got nearly ten years of experience with these issues.  Unless you have experience with administering SMF, you'd probably be better off talking about dipoles or something radio related. Smiley
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