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Author Topic: Operating abroad—how?  (Read 5387 times)
K7RNO
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Posts: 279




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« on: December 07, 2013, 08:18:15 AM »

I am planning a trip to the Greek islands next summer and would like to bring my KX3 to make some contacts from there.
What do I have to do in order to get it all sorted out and legalized?

To complicate things, read this: I am holding a General US license but am not a US citizen.
I am a German citizen, but I am not holding a German ham license.
As you will know, Germany and Greece are both members of the EU.

My understanding is that, with a US Extra license, I could operate in Greece, if I were a US citizen.
While I try to find European regulations for German citizens, perhaps someone can chime in who already knows.

Where is the common denominator in all this?

Thank you for your comprehensive response.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2013, 08:30:42 AM by K7RNO » Logged

73,
aRNO
NAQCC #6870, SKCC #11131
N0IU
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Posts: 1291


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« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2013, 08:48:31 AM »

Your best bet might be to contact the Radio Amateur Association of Greece at sv1iw@raag.org
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K7RNO
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Posts: 279




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« Reply #2 on: December 07, 2013, 08:59:53 AM »

Thank you, N0IU, I just contacted them.

Will report what I find out.
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73,
aRNO
NAQCC #6870, SKCC #11131
DJ1YFK
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Posts: 188


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« Reply #3 on: December 07, 2013, 09:46:26 AM »

I am planning a trip to the Greek islands next summer and would like to bring my KX3 to make some contacts from there.
What do I have to do in order to get it all sorted out and legalized?

To complicate things, read this: I am holding a General US license but am not a US citizen.
I am a German citizen, but I am not holding a German ham license.
As you will know, Germany and Greece are both members of the EU.

My understanding is that, with a US Extra license, I could operate in Greece, if I were a US citizen.
While I try to find European regulations for German citizens, perhaps someone can chime in who already knows.

Where is the common denominator in all this?

Thank you for your comprehensive response.

Hi Arno,

your citizenship should not matter in this case.

If you're in Greece, you can operate under the CEPT rules as a foreigner. If you happen to have several foreign (to Greece) licenses which are eligible for CEPT operation, you can pick the one most convenient to you. The only case where you wouldn't be allowed to use your US call under CEPT rules is in Germany.

Regarding the license class: US General is only accepted for VHF+ operations under CEPT in most countries, whereas US Extra is equivalent to full privileges, depending on the local regulations (there's a nice summary available here: https://www.darc.de/uploads/media/CEPT-Laenderliste_2013.pdf)

73
Fabian, DJ1YFK / WB6LQR (US Extra)
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N0IU
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Posts: 1291


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« Reply #4 on: December 07, 2013, 09:53:25 AM »

your citizenship should not matter in this case.

According to the CEPT rules, if you are operating with a US license, you have to bring three things with you:

1) Your original US license
2) Proof of US Citizenship
3) A copy of the FCC's Public Notice (this notice contains its information in three languages, English, French and German) which details what US Amateurs need to consider, and bring with them, when traveling to a CEPT country.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2013, 09:56:03 AM by N0IU » Logged
DJ1YFK
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Posts: 188


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« Reply #5 on: December 07, 2013, 12:29:23 PM »

Hello,

your citizenship should not matter in this case.

According to the CEPT rules, if you are operating with a US license, you have to bring three things with you:

1) Your original US license
2) Proof of US Citizenship
3) A copy of the FCC's Public Notice (this notice contains its information in three languages, English, French and German) which details what US Amateurs need to consider, and bring with them, when traveling to a CEPT country.
This is from http://www.arrl.org/cept which references to the FCC public note http://www.arrl.org/files/file/Regulatory/DA-11-221A1.pdf

DA 11-221 opens with
Quote
Subject to the regulations in force in the country visited, a U.S. citizen holding a General,
Advanced, or Amateur Extra Class amateur radio service operator license grant by the Federal
Communications Commission (FCC) is authorized to utilize temporarily an amateur station in a
European Conference of Postal and Telecommunications Administrations (CEPT) country that has
implemented certain recommendations with respect to the United States.
and is therefore not relevant in this case.

T/R 61-01 (http://www.erodocdb.dk/docs/doc98/official/pdf/TR6101.pdf) is the document I consider to be authoritative and it does not mention nationality, only residency (and only in the sense that it doesn't apply for residents of a country, i.e. I as a German resident could not operate as DL/WB6LQR under CEPT).

Of course, I am not a lawyer; this is just my interpretation.
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K7RNO
Member

Posts: 279




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« Reply #6 on: December 07, 2013, 01:19:24 PM »

Reading between the lines of everything I have seen officially published in this context, I take the liberty to act as if I were Italian, not German. Wink That means, I have a license, I am a citizen (somewhere) an I have a radio. So, I am good to go, and if some Greek asks me for documentation, I will dazzle him with what I have.

Ok, seriously now, it has been my experience that, when non-military or non-similar official entities require US citizenship, they include Green Card holders with a US residence. I can document both, so I consider myself being legit.

Fabian, thank you for that link and I studied it. I am not familiar with their term "Dhiamerísmata" and how to apply it. Does it mean that if I want to indicate a more specific location, I can use one of the listed prefixes, but I don't have to use them? I.e., the appropriate SV/ or SY/ alone is sufficient?

BTW, their (Greece's) frequency privileges for what they call a Novice aren't just limited to VHF+. According to that page, a Novice can also use 40, 20, 15 and 10m  Smiley
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73,
aRNO
NAQCC #6870, SKCC #11131
NV5E
Member

Posts: 19




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« Reply #7 on: December 07, 2013, 02:01:49 PM »

If you're a German operating in Greece, I'd make very sure I had all paperwork in order.
http://www.raag.org/news.asp?ITMID=492&LANG=EN
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K7RNO
Member

Posts: 279




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« Reply #8 on: December 07, 2013, 02:17:49 PM »

Thank you, NV5E, and I will definitely have all paperwork in order and with me.

I consider the referenced isolated incidence as just that, an isolated incidence, and I will approach my visit with this view: "Every year thousands of tourists come to Greece, among them hundreds of radio amateurs, who have never faced any problem operating their equipment, and have a great time here."
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73,
aRNO
NAQCC #6870, SKCC #11131
K7RNO
Member

Posts: 279




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« Reply #9 on: December 07, 2013, 02:30:13 PM »

K, from the raag.org site I conclude that my Greek call must be this: SV8/K7RNO/P

With that call I definitely want to be on the initiating side of a pileup!
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73,
aRNO
NAQCC #6870, SKCC #11131
G3RZP
Member

Posts: 4543




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« Reply #10 on: December 07, 2013, 02:48:34 PM »

Make sure you have all the documentation. But bear in mind that for most of Europe, enforcement of anything is negligible - only the Germans, and to some extent the Dutch, do much. So provided you're not causing too much QRM to police or military or to TV sets, you'll likely get away with whatever. Certainly would be the case in the UK!!

However, bear in mind that the Greeks are extremely fussy about people taking photos around air bases and airports, even though the whole world knows what the "order of battle" of the Greek forces are - even if they have the money now to send them to war, which is doubtful.

Reports suggest that corruption is rife there, too......
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K8AXW
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Posts: 3825




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« Reply #11 on: December 07, 2013, 04:32:12 PM »

RNO:  If I was you, I would spend all of my spare time contacting everyone who understand the situation and have, as one other pointed out, ALL of the documentation in order.

Greece and Egypt are two places you don't want to be doing anything but spending you money without absolutely the correct documentation!!

Getting that information here on eHam is a START..... but by no means the end.

Al - K8AXW
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G3RZP
Member

Posts: 4543




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« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2013, 04:52:51 AM »

If you aren't used to retsina, (resinated wine) try a small glass before buying a bottle. It's something you either love or hate. Similarly with ouzo.
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K7RNO
Member

Posts: 279




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« Reply #13 on: December 08, 2013, 07:56:10 AM »

Retsina? Like!
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73,
aRNO
NAQCC #6870, SKCC #11131
G3RZP
Member

Posts: 4543




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« Reply #14 on: December 08, 2013, 02:33:20 PM »

Retsina - like - Me too - but a lot of people don't. I like Greek food and often cook it.....I like some German food too, especially sauerkraut and blodwurst and schweinehaxe and I know Englishmen aren't supposed to!
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