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Author Topic: runningallthosewordstogether  (Read 6832 times)
N9AOP
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Posts: 134




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« Reply #15 on: December 21, 2013, 02:49:15 PM »

Thanks for all the nice replies.  I do believe that some ops are sending faster than their real ability.  Back in the day we all had mentors and they all took the time to make sure that you were trained properly.  The other thing I notice with folks running things together is that most of them are using radios that scroll the code such as the K3; KX3; some TenTec and Yaesu.  If you send good CW, it scrolls across the screen and they don't have the sense to ask you to slow down to where they can copy without that aid and then they reply at that speed and send garbage that is hard to understand.
Art
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GW3OQK
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Posts: 133




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« Reply #16 on: December 22, 2013, 05:15:12 AM »

Have you heard contesters sending CQ NST or NV rather than TEST?
Andrew
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K7KBN
Member

Posts: 2765




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« Reply #17 on: December 22, 2013, 09:49:42 AM »

Only for the past 50 years or so... Grin

The CQ NV group just might be looking for a Nevada station.  The abbreviation was still "NEV" when I was a Novice, and I did hear (and reply to) lots of CQ NEV calls during that time from Vegas.
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73
Pat K7KBN
CWO4 USNR Ret.
KB1WSY
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Posts: 680




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« Reply #18 on: January 02, 2014, 08:10:45 AM »

At the other end of the spectrum, a lot of the CW I hear on the air has slightly exaggerated character spacing. Certainly more than the "standard" three dits. I have two theories about this:

--The op learned CW with Farnsworth spacing and never quite abandoned it; or alternatively
--The op is *deliberately* inserting slightly more space to increase legibility.

What do you think?

For instance: One of my Elmers told me the other day that he has a regular sked with a buddy on 30m and they both set their keyers to 30wpm, but actually transmit somewhat slower than that.

73 de Martin, KB1WSY
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M0LEP
Member

Posts: 200




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« Reply #19 on: January 02, 2014, 11:07:46 AM »

--The op learned CW with Farnsworth spacing and never quite abandoned it; or alternatively
--The op is *deliberately* inserting slightly more space to increase legibility.
Both. I know the second happens, particularly when an experienced op recognises a beginner who's struggling at the other end of the QSO.

73, Rick M0LEP
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N4DSP
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Posts: 124




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« Reply #20 on: January 02, 2014, 05:08:27 PM »

Well said.

Perhaps the reason why operators run their characters and words together is because they are trying to send faster than their true ability?


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KW4M
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Posts: 9




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« Reply #21 on: January 02, 2014, 07:02:10 PM »

Or maybe the op is using a keyboard and can't type fast enough.   Cheesy
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ON6MH
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Posts: 1




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« Reply #22 on: January 03, 2014, 05:15:25 AM »

Hello,

Further to the "running all together" problem, I hear more and more operators not able to control the number of "dits" they are sending.
Often "h" become "5" and "5" is send as 6 or 7 "dits" like in 5......99, just to be sure there are enough "dits"!

I hear it so often, I am afraid it could become a trend, and even be accepted as code variation.
More over, those operators don't even seem to try to improve their sending.
One of the problem is the "no code" license. People are going "on the air" on their own, and nobody is correcting them.
Or maybe they don't listen to critics.

It all come back to a speed problem, without technique.
A bit like going through a tough part on the piano, and playing it fast in hope nobody would notice errors.

Anybody else bothered by this ?

Michel

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N4OI
Member

Posts: 200




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« Reply #23 on: January 03, 2014, 05:25:55 AM »

[…]
--The op is *deliberately* inserting slightly more space to increase legibility.
[…]

Yep - guilty as charged…  I keep the keyer set to 30 wpm but will intentionally increase the spacing a bit if the other op is a little slower.  This usually results in unsolicited comments such as, "armchair cpy" or "ur fist is vy easy to cpi." 

That said, I find it harder to exaggerate the spacing than to just let it go at normal speed…  YMMV

73
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KB1WSY
Member

Posts: 680




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« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2014, 05:52:08 AM »

I keep the keyer set to 30 wpm but will intentionally increase the spacing a bit if the other op is a little slower.

Even though I am a beginner and haven't finished learning all the characters, I find truly slow copy (sent at below 10wpm with the proper spacing) very hard to copy. That's because I've been learning with the character speed set at 20wpm (with extra inter-character spacing) which results in a good "sound picture" of the character. If you slow it down, it becomes almost meaningless noise to my ear. But I also find fast copy (above 20wpm with no extra spacing) impossible to copy! So, to me, what you are doing (not slowing down the characters, but adding space between them) makes the most sense, if you are in a QSO with a slower op.

73 de Martin, KB1WSY
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K7MEM
Member

Posts: 101


WWW

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« Reply #25 on: January 03, 2014, 05:53:54 AM »

Hello,

Further to the "running all together" problem, I hear more and more operators not able to control the number of "dits" they are sending.
Often "h" become "5" and "5" is send as 6 or 7 "dits" like in 5......99, just to be sure there are enough "dits"!

I hear it so often, I am afraid it could become a trend, and even be accepted as code variation.
More over, those operators don't even seem to try to improve their sending.
One of the problem is the "no code" license. People are going "on the air" on their own, and nobody is correcting them.
Or maybe they don't listen to critics.

It all come back to a speed problem, without technique.
A bit like going through a tough part on the piano, and playing it fast in hope nobody would notice errors.

Anybody else bothered by this ?

Michel

I wouldn't say I'm bothered by it, but extra dits are very common.

I have no problem with the new no-code hams. After all, it's just a hobby. If a new ham wants to learn Morse code, I think that's great. However, I think much of the extra dot problem is due to a fascination with "bugs". While they are neat things to have they take a lot of practice and control. Plus, they are designed for speeds of 20 WPM and up. So to slow them down they all use extra weights on the arm. If the bug is not adjusted properly, this can lead to the automatic dots being pretty wild. Synchronizing the dots and dashes can be a real challenge.

I have a bug myself (1916 Blue Racer) and use it regularly. But I have used a keyer for over 30 years and can no longer handle the manual dashes. So I disabled the automatic dots, rewired it a little, and hooked it up to a keyer. It works great that way.
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Martin - K7MEM

http://www.k7mem.com
M0LEP
Member

Posts: 200




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« Reply #26 on: January 04, 2014, 12:02:57 AM »

Anybody else bothered by this ?

It certainly bothers me when I make that mistake (and others, often enough to get me flustered, and then my sending goes completely to pot). A number of things make it more likely to happen; keyer not at my "best" speed (too fast or too slow), paddle not sitting straight, or slipping, and so on...

73, Rick M0LEP
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KD8IIC
Member

Posts: 151




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« Reply #27 on: January 04, 2014, 01:40:45 AM »

  Yes, AXW Thanks. It's an eye opener and a reality check to hear one's fist on the recording sent from a receiving station. Even though I use a side tone and try to warm up before tuning up there are mistakes being made.Didn't think I was that bad but, there it was as evidence! Shocked
 I was reading a '60's ARRL Handbook just yesterday and it taught to never consider that we send good enough and that we need to strive for improvement continually, hear hear! Signed, Slow but sure in Columbus, Lane 73
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VE3FMC
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Posts: 983


WWW

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« Reply #28 on: January 04, 2014, 04:18:19 PM »

Perhaps the reason why operators run their characters and words together is because they are trying to send faster than their true ability?



You sir win the prize!

Or they are trying to send with bugs and have no clue how to set them up or use them properly.
I do not do much CW, never have. Passed the required CW test in 1996 and basically gave up on it.

But I do try to copy once in awhile and here some terrible sending. Then I go back to the digital modes!
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KD8IIC
Member

Posts: 151




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« Reply #29 on: January 04, 2014, 05:38:31 PM »

 Okay, then go, please go. Since you cannot spell "hear' then maybe you can't copy well sent Morse anyway, Hi... Smiley
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