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Author Topic: Does anyone know why a particular block of call letters.....  (Read 9951 times)
K3NRX
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« on: February 02, 2014, 09:35:13 AM »

...would have never been issued back in the day? (1950s into the 1960s).....per research from Pete the Greek on my vanity call sign persuits, my vanity selection and it's novice precursor were never issued:

My results are complete and I have a definitive conclusion for you;

K3NRX has never been assigned.
Neither has KN3NRX.

I spent about 6 hours to examine every single callbook from the start of the 3-land K prefix to 1997; the last printed callbook.

The summer edition of 1961 would have been the one to reflect the Novice [KN3NRX] version, but curiously, the entire KN3NR_ series was exempted from issue for some unknown reason. It goes from KN3NQX directly to KN3NSA.


Had these letters been issued, they would have been of mid 20th century ham vintage, but I don't understand why the FCC would exempt the above series of letters from/for ham radio....Why would this block of call letters not be issued?....are there any venerable ops out there who would  know of a reason?....Were they designated for Aircraft of Military at the time or something?.....I'd really love to know if in fact there is still someone one of many years experience out there with such info.....

V
KA3NRX
soon to be K3NRX



« Last Edit: February 02, 2014, 09:40:30 AM by KA3NRX » Logged
N2EY
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« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2014, 02:44:35 PM »

The following is pure speculation - but it's based on history.

From what I have read over the years, FCC records were computerized about 1964. Before then, the records were kept manually - paper files, etc.

This means callsign selection was done manually too.

It seems to me that it's likely that the K(N)3NR_ set of callsigns (26) was simply bypassed by a clerical error. Maybe two pages in a record book got stuck together, and the folks who issued callsigns used one page for each 26 callsigns.

This seems probable to me because, in those days, FCC was issuing new calls at a brisk rate, and they would link the  equivalent Novice and Tech/General/Conditional/Extra calls, so that a Novice would get the corresponding call upon upgrading.

Just speculation on my part.

73 de Jim, N2EY
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K3NRX
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« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2014, 04:34:42 PM »

The following is pure speculation - but it's based on history.

From what I have read over the years, FCC records were computerized about 1964. Before then, the records were kept manually - paper files, etc.

This means callsign selection was done manually too.

It seems to me that it's likely that the K(N)3NR_ set of callsigns (26) was simply bypassed by a clerical error. Maybe two pages in a record book got stuck together, and the folks who issued callsigns used one page for each 26 callsigns.

This seems probable to me because, in those days, FCC was issuing new calls at a brisk rate, and they would link the  equivalent Novice and Tech/General/Conditional/Extra calls, so that a Novice would get the corresponding call upon upgrading.

Just speculation on my part.

73 de Jim, N2EY

Hmmmm...seems like a reasonable theory, considering the time frame, and lack of technology at that point in history.....unless, like I said, certain blocks of letters were reserved for some other service......

V
KA3NRX

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K1CJS
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« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2014, 04:51:45 AM »

Although the block that your call is in may not be one of them, way back when, several blocks were set aside to be issued only to people in certain geographical locations or people in the military who lived on or around overseas bases.
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K3NRX
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« Reply #4 on: February 05, 2014, 03:25:48 PM »

Although the block that your call is in may not be one of them, way back when, several blocks were set aside to be issued only to people in certain geographical locations or people in the military who lived on or around overseas bases.

Here's a theory for ya.....In light of your comments, do you suppose that maybe, just maybe my particular block of letters (KN3NR__) might have been used for a MARS station?....That would be way too cool.....

V
KA3NRX

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K1CJS
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« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2014, 05:19:24 AM »

That I don't know, but it\s doubtful.  If I remember right, however, certain blocks were set aside for Puerto Rico, Hawaii, Guam and so on. 
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KF7CG
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« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2014, 11:03:58 AM »

The Puerto Rico blocks wer KP4s, Guam KH?, Hawaii KH6 as the final destination, KG4 belonged to Guantanamo. There were a bunch like that.

There were also small series of calls containing X in the suffix that were use for experimental stations only and not necessarily Amateur stations at that. I don't know where to find the data, but the NR series may have be an experimental reservation.

David
KF7CG
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W3HF
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« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2014, 01:44:47 PM »

I don't know where to find the data, but the NR series may have be an experimental reservation.

Would be interesting to check if any other "NR" blocks were skipped, i.e., of the form K#NR? (where # is a numeral, and ? is any letter). If this block was not skipped in any other district, I'd probably vote for the "oops we made a mistake" scenario. (I'd check this myself, but I'm 1500 miles away from the callbooks.)

And yes, all of the non-CONUS stations always had two-letter prefixes, at least after 1946. Some of the them changed over time--today's KH2 (Guam) used to be KG6, and today's KP2 (USVI) used to be a KV prefix. But the K3 series (after 1946) was always only Delaware, District of Columbia, Maryland, and Pennsylvania.
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K3NRX
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« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2014, 05:58:46 PM »

Would be interesting to check if any other "NR" blocks were skipped, i.e., of the form K#NR? (where # is a numeral, and ? is any letter). If this block was not  skipped in any other district, I'd probably vote for the "oops we made a mistake" scenario. (I'd check this myself, but I'm 1500 miles away from the callbooks.)

REPLY: FWIW, I just looked up the series on the FCC database....from K 0-9 NRX ....only K4NRX has been issues as a vanity call sign....all of the others are not held, but that doesn't mean they weren't in the past.....

V
KA3NRX
soon to be K3NRX

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AF5CC
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« Reply #9 on: February 08, 2014, 08:30:16 PM »

Vince,

You let the cat out of the bag!  Now I can tell all of the guys on the DX forum what your new call is to be!  Nice selection, though,

73 John AF5CC (ex a lot of stuff).
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K3NRX
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« Reply #10 on: March 13, 2014, 04:17:35 PM »

Gentlemen: I stumbled upon a vintage qsl card site linked here on e-ham to discover the following:

http://w5rg.donretzlaff.com/QSLcards/K3NRU_1948_WilliamsportPennsylvania.jpg

http://w5rg.donretzlaff.com/QSLcards/K7NRU_1950_RenoNevada.jpg

I am convinced now more than ever, and consider this to be evidence, that this block of call letters was designated for military reserves, well before the K(3) call signs were issued to individual operators per the 1948 date.  Can't help but wonder if K3NRX was ever active as such a station....This is extremely cool!....& some serious nostalgia, that I am glad my hand picked personal call sign may have been a part of....

V
K3NRX

P.S. even though this nostalgia of this discovery excites me, the one comment on card appears to be, well, how shall we say, questionable (bigoted?)..that doesn't excite me...but I guess we should remember, it was a different world back then.....
« Last Edit: March 13, 2014, 04:36:35 PM by K3NRX » Logged
W3HF
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« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2014, 04:56:39 AM »

Vince -

It's easy to find K3NR? calls when you know where to look! I only looked in a few books, but from late 48 until early 50s, long before the K3 1x3 calls were issued sequentially, there are a bunch of them. All have references to USNR, so your supposition is supported.

I haven't looked through all the books, but Spring 51 (for example) lists 20 such calls. The missing letters are O, T, V, W, Z, and X.

 Grin

Steve
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K7KBN
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« Reply #12 on: March 14, 2014, 03:47:21 PM »

The Naval Reserve Training Center in Las Vegas NV, where I enlisted in 1960, had a ham station of sorts.  An old TCS transmitter, maybe 50 watts, and a receiver of similar age.  That equipment was licensed as K7NRP, iirc, according to the documents on the wall (er, bulkhead).  It was an ordeal to use: the T/R switching was VERY loud, and would only support maybe 15 WPM.

The active-duty Radioman stationed there, however, had a very nice station to work San Diego on a nightly basis.  He found out I could copy code and guess where I spent most of the time at my first few USNR drills!
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73
Pat K7KBN
CWO4 USNR Ret.
K3NRX
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« Reply #13 on: March 14, 2014, 08:13:11 PM »

So it looks like these NR navel center station call signs were active into the 1960s.  This is so fascinating....I found a 2010 article on line stating that the Williamsport, PA Naval Reserve center was being torn down. Can't help but wonder why these naval return centers are so far inland..but moreso, I know wonder just how many of these facilities there were, who among them had ham stations.....Hey Steve and Pat, thanks for the info...What you stated really explains much.....and if it weren't for the internet, I never would have known any of this, and still would be using my 2x3 version.....

V
K3NRX

« Last Edit: March 14, 2014, 08:15:14 PM by K3NRX » Logged
NJ2E
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« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2014, 05:24:21 PM »

 "Can't help but wonder why these naval return (should be reserve) centers are so far inland"

There was a center in Poughkeepsie NY (I know its on the Hudson River)
that was associated with Naval Security Group activities. The signal intelligence
mission didn't require a location close to water. The fact that IBM was the
major industry locally may have been a factor to, allow NSG to tap local talent.
Distancing it from other Naval activities may actually have been an advantage.
Remember the See Bees were a Naval unit. Construction units are another
mission that doesn't require location near water. Don't forget the political side
too. A local Reserve unit can be quid pro quo to garner favor or reward a favorable
vote.  Regards, Don NJ2E
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