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Author Topic: Still using XP??  (Read 50311 times)
K1CJS
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Posts: 6042




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« Reply #165 on: June 21, 2014, 06:34:55 PM »

This is probably one of the most pointless debates on the internet, I see it on so many forums and it keeps going and going.

People can debate it all they want but facts are facts and the fact is that Win8 has been a complete disaster for Microsoft, they have admitted it by their own actions and the sales of the OS have left no doubt that it's not what the public wants.

The only reason that people keep on debating Win8 is because it is NOT a flawed OS in design and structure like Vista, in fact it works very well and by all standards is a step up from Win7.  With that said even though it's a great OS from an engineering standpoint it was the ill conceived GUI design by management that made it a disaster and that's why most of the people who were involved in that decision making process got fired.

I also agree.  Thanks for simplifying matters.
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KE7TMA
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Posts: 471




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« Reply #166 on: June 21, 2014, 07:11:56 PM »

Quote
AND, "AI" is a good thing in what way?

Products with AI will render non AI procucts "obsolete" and create new consumer demand.
New consumer demand will produce more sales.

At the same time the required user skill level will decrease making some categories of workers "cheaper". Or even obsolete. (ie if the car can drive itself to a destination why have a human cab driver consuming oxygen and smelling up the place . Taxis would fit five passengers instead of four.)
Of course the money "saved" paying the driver will be spent towards the new taxis and the the software and hardware to operate them, and of course software upgrades down the road. So cab ride prices will go up by a little bit. But someone is going to rake in some bucks.
Not you.
How can you not see that products with AI are good for everyone?
Whata mata wit you?


The biggest boost for AI is for end user. Things like Siri just use canned responses and prediction are based on remote help. With AI a computer or smart phone will be able to be far more responsive to voice commands and user interaction. Grow CPU power will make the use of long complex algorithms to run it real time and provide some limited learning an AI on device in use.  

You've completely misrepresented Siri.  While it's true that certain questions will lead nowhere, as long as you ask the right question in the right way, it can be surprisingly helpful.

We are not at the point where a useful "AI" can be self-hosted on a cell phone.
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VK6IS
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Posts: 87




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« Reply #167 on: June 21, 2014, 10:51:57 PM »

"Funny this "End of Support"
since Micro$oft has done this before:

- they had endless issues in getting people to move from Win_3x up to their 'new" Win_95 series.
there was a group who simply bypassed the whole Win_95 thing and went directly to Win_XP.
- this included a whole pile of the business community.

now there will be another group who will bypass Win_5/6/7/8 and move directly to Win_9.
- actually they should have moved to Win_7, but they didn't - since they were too comfortable with Win_XP.
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W4KYR
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Posts: 568




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« Reply #168 on: June 22, 2014, 01:14:31 AM »

"Funny this "End of Support"
since Micro$oft has done this before:

- they had endless issues in getting people to move from Win_3x up to their 'new" Win_95 series.
there was a group who simply bypassed the whole Win_95 thing and went directly to Win_XP.
- this included a whole pile of the business community.

now there will be another group who will bypass Win_5/6/7/8 and move directly to Win_9.
- actually they should have moved to Win_7, but they didn't - since they were too comfortable with Win_XP.


Actually I know of some still running Windows NT 4.0 as well as Windows 2000.  But don't tell anyone, some here might get upset.  Some programming software for used LMR radios (that are still selling on ebay) as well as the Icom M710  require MS DOS and serial ports to run and program.
.

.
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Still using Windows XP Pro.
W8JX
Member

Posts: 6038




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« Reply #169 on: June 22, 2014, 07:47:24 AM »

Quote
AND, "AI" is a good thing in what way?

Products with AI will render non AI procucts "obsolete" and create new consumer demand.
New consumer demand will produce more sales.

At the same time the required user skill level will decrease making some categories of workers "cheaper". Or even obsolete. (ie if the car can drive itself to a destination why have a human cab driver consuming oxygen and smelling up the place . Taxis would fit five passengers instead of four.)
Of course the money "saved" paying the driver will be spent towards the new taxis and the the software and hardware to operate them, and of course software upgrades down the road. So cab ride prices will go up by a little bit. But someone is going to rake in some bucks.
Not you.
How can you not see that products with AI are good for everyone?
Whata mata wit you?


The biggest boost for AI is for end user. Things like Siri just use canned responses and prediction are based on remote help. With AI a computer or smart phone will be able to be far more responsive to voice commands and user interaction. Grow CPU power will make the use of long complex algorithms to run it real time and provide some limited learning an AI on device in use.  

You've completely misrepresented Siri.  While it's true that certain questions will lead nowhere, as long as you ask the right question in the right way, it can be surprisingly helpful.

We are not at the point where a useful "AI" can be self-hosted on a cell phone.

Siri is merely a programmed algorithm you say this, it says that and nothing more. MS is releasing Cortana soon and it is much more advance than Siri. It has a form of very limited AI as it remembers your interaction and modifies its responses based on past queries.

As far as a point of a useful AI on a phone, Cortana could change rules. As computational power of a phone increases more things are possible.
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All posted wireless using Win 8.1 RT, a Android tablet using 4G/LTE/WiFi or Sprint Note 3.
N4AAB
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Posts: 58


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« Reply #170 on: June 22, 2014, 08:26:56 AM »

AI, Artificial Insemination?? Wink
Self driving cars?? What happens when you are on the side of a hill (Buxton > Maccesfield route for example if you are a Brit) and the program locks up?
I don't fancy a 1000ft fall when the car goes straight instead of making the turn. Shocked
Personally I want the machine to do what I want, not what it (or the programmer) wants.

KF6QEX, I presume you are "Having a giraffe"
Otherwise these AI products will render us obsolete (Shades of Skynet)

They may just put us in a zoo instead of killing us off.
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KA8OCN
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Posts: 48




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« Reply #171 on: June 23, 2014, 09:37:24 PM »

I upgraded my desktop to windows 7 and I purchased a new Windows 8.1 laptop, I had it less than 2 weeks and got a virus! I own 3 companies and are replacing the XP machines with windows 7. I do not think its necessary I think its a scam. You know when Microsoft comes out with a really bad operating system, they do things to FORCE people onto it.

My Credit card processor wants all XP computers on our networks to be replaced. Its a pain in the butt but I have found Windows 7 computers with legal copies of Windows 7 for about 150$ on eBay. I save a couple hundred dollars a month in each store using the internet to process our credit card sales so I guess I can replace a few computers and still be money ahead.

I have a XP computer in my barn that I use to listen to talk radio with and sometimes I watch netflix and to date have not had any problems. I did do a scan with Malewarebytes and it does not have any problems. I'm going to use it until it dies!

I myself an going to try me best to learn some Linux I have already installed ubuntu 14.04. It works just fine for regular stuff I just need to figure out how to run some of my business software and I hope to transition to is so I am never in this position again with Microsoft.

I do not in any way fault Microsoft trying to make some money, they should not work for free but to continue to force upgrades that take away function that people and companies have came to rely on is just wrong. I would have preferred to just pay 20$ a year per computer for their support (updates) and with the millions and millions of XP machines out there they would have made a pile of money.
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NN4RH
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Posts: 328




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« Reply #172 on: June 24, 2014, 03:12:26 AM »

Quote
My Credit card processor wants all XP computers on our networks to be replaced. Its a pain in the butt but I have found Windows 7 computers with legal copies of Windows 7 for about 150$ on eBay. I save a couple hundred dollars a month in each store using the internet to process our credit card sales so I guess I can replace a few computers and still be money ahead.

Processing customer credit card information via the internet with unsecure, unsupported XP computers. Great. Even scarier is that there are probably lots of other small businesses doing exactly the same thing.

On the other hand, you've probably got at least one other competitor who has invested in modern, secure credit card processing computer systems. So when the hackers take down your system and wipe out your business, at least your customers will have somewhere else to spend their money (after they get new credit cards and fix their credit records).

Quote
I purchased a new Windows 8.1 laptop, I had it less than 2 weeks and got a virus!

Let me guess: Windows autoupdating turned off, and no anti-malware software, or auto-updating turned off if you do, combined with unsafe internet activity. Malware infections don't just happen for no reason.

In my opinion, there is no legitimate reason for anyone to get a virus or have sensitive information compromised on a modern computer system regardless of whether you prefer PC or Mac or Linux.

As much as I dislike Windows 8x from a "user experience" point of view, I would take 8x over XP on any computer connected to the internet, just from the information security point of view.


And personally, I don't think $150 computers from eBay is the right solution. They're probably already infected.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2014, 03:54:40 AM by NN4RH » Logged
KF6QEX
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Posts: 605




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« Reply #173 on: June 24, 2014, 02:22:00 PM »

Quote
I purchased a new Windows 8.1 laptop, I had it less than 2 weeks and got a virus!

See....you only got one!!!Instead of two or more Smiley


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N1DVJ
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Posts: 509




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« Reply #174 on: June 25, 2014, 06:03:13 AM »

"I purchased a new Windows 8.1 laptop, I had it less than 2 weeks and got a virus!"

And whose fault is that?
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G8YMW
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Posts: 237




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« Reply #175 on: June 25, 2014, 10:52:44 AM »

Quote
"I purchased a new Windows 8.1 laptop, I had it less than 2 weeks and got a virus!"

And whose fault is that?

Cannot be the poster, his other computers are OK.
Therefore it has to be the O/S

Quote
Let me guess: Windows autoupdating turned off, and no anti-malware software, or auto-updating turned off if you do, combined with unsafe internet activity. Malware infections don't just happen for no reason.

More meaningless speculation.
Anti-malware, yes
Auto-update shouldn't make any difference unless this shiney new O/S leaks like a colander.
I do not use auto update but I have it show me what the updates are and then I pick what to update

Quote
Processing customer credit card information via the internet with unsecure, unsupported XP computers. Great. Even scarier is that there are probably lots of other small businesses doing exactly the same thing

Absolute FUD
They are protected BEFORE the computer.
Think of it like a football match. Would you field a football team of just a goalkeeper against a fully manned team??
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73 details Tony
Sent by WW2 Royal Navy signal lamp
N1DVJ
Member

Posts: 509




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« Reply #176 on: June 25, 2014, 12:30:09 PM »

Quote
"I purchased a new Windows 8.1 laptop, I had it less than 2 weeks and got a virus!"

And whose fault is that?

Cannot be the poster, his other computers are OK.
Therefore it has to be the O/S
Uh oh, now we know which computer he uses to visit the sites for naughty bits!
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KF6QEX
Member

Posts: 605




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« Reply #177 on: June 25, 2014, 01:23:34 PM »

Imagine this:
You have taught your kinds to stay of drugs.
Lets also say you know most of their "close friends" do drugs.
And just to make it interesting...lets also say you know some of these "close friends" are allowed to do drugs in their house with no parental objection.

A) You sit back confidently "knowing" there is no chance in hell you have anything to worry about
B) You do something else that doesn't depend on you kids "saying no".

Lets also say they are 12 and 14 years old.

Now switch this around to Operating systems.
Most malware / viruses  infect the computer using an attachment you clicked on ("You've won!!! Click here to claim your prize!!!), that may be a Word document (Not the OS) , and Excel spreadsheet (ot the OS), a pdf  exploiting an Adobe Reader vulnerability (not the OS), or  and that's the one no on ever seems to talk about or being bother by,  you are sitting with your web browser on a web site with rolling ads being displayed that change every so often and one of those exploiting a Flash or other "make web sites fancy" plugin manages to download and install "something" without you being aware it even took place. (Again....not the OS).

All this sounds like depending on the OS to protect "itself" from something bad happening is like depending on your 14 year old to say no to drugs when you knowingly let them hang out at their friend's drug infested house.

Windows has always been a shell plagued by "convenient" features.
The 2000 infection of the "I love you virus would not have had a chance to spread like it did if two things were being taken care of.
A) NOT hiding the extension of file name so when you are looking at Funny_Picture.jpg.vbs is not being displayed as funny_picture.jpg
and of course
B) NOT being able to run vbs code without warning straight from an email
(They made a feeble attempt to correct this at some point by Outlook not accepting .exe  files as attachments. - SO the infectors "got smart and they started sending them out as .zip files that windows in its infinite wisdom displayes them as a folder that you can click on the contents and do whatever you want... From an email.. back to square one)

Not of the above has changed much other than windows has been made to ask for confirmation every time you try to do something potentially dangerous, aka User Account Control and it's most annoying implementation as it appeared in Windows VISTA, before they fixed it somewhat in Windows 7.

Security updates? There are numerous ways the machien can be prevented from being infected before the malware/ virus even has a chance to hit the machine.

But hey.....I told my kids not to do it and I'm all set !








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AE4RV
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« Reply #178 on: June 25, 2014, 03:15:07 PM »

That's really not a bad analogy but personally, I've stopped "spreading FUD" in this thread because I learned that the people still using XP on the net are having NONE of it.
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W8JX
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Posts: 6038




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« Reply #179 on: June 25, 2014, 06:25:23 PM »

That's really not a bad analogy but personally, I've stopped "spreading FUD" in this thread because I learned that the people still using XP on the net are having NONE of it.

They are playing Russian Roulette and every few months or so you add another bullet until one day it is sure to go off. Why anyone would cling to a 15 year old OS is beyond me.
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All posted wireless using Win 8.1 RT, a Android tablet using 4G/LTE/WiFi or Sprint Note 3.
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