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RE: Why Do HTs Lack SSB Capabilities?
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by KD5QLK on March 7, 2003
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JJ1BDX on March 7, 2003 states:
"I've heard that Yaesu/Standard sells a SSB/CW-capable handheld receiver, but not transceiver yet (I think FT817 is not a hand-held one)."
Actually, the Kenwood TH-F6A 3-band HT has SSB and CW receive. Although it is pretty deaf on HF with the stock antenna, at home my G5RV and older full-size MFJ tuner put enough rf into the HT for me to pick up and reasonably copy PLENTY of SSB and CW. In fact, I think it is the only HT that CAN decode SSB, a deciding factor in my choice of this rig. I bought it with this ability so I would listen to HF and get excited about it, and it is my listening to stuff like the Texas 7290 net that drove me on to get my morse code done, and upgrade.
For a general receive radio, even HT size, the TH-F6A is NOT a great choice, but for one radio that has 2m, 220 and 440 transmit, AND can pick up almost anything else transmitted, it fits my needs just right.
Now to get that HF radio...
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Why Do HTs Lack SSB Capabilities?
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by K0WA on March 7, 2003
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George has an interesting question, and I am somewhat dismayed at all the feedback. Why not have SSB on VHF HT? I think it is a grand idea and lets put in CW as well. I would buy one. The ducky would still work on SSB and CW. Why not? People who think that you need beam to be on SSB on two meters is mistaken. Not true. Years ago, AM was big on the two meter band and people were talking hundreds of miles SIMPLEX. And that was AM at 90 watts. Heck, I remember working 30 miles on two meters using 3 watts on AM. SSB would be even better and with today's RX circuits...it could be a very viable mode of communication with an HT. Motorola really studied this issue in the 50s...and found that VHF SSB signals from a BASE to a MOBILE has an average (AVERAGE) range of around 145 miles. FM caught on because of the audio quality, it could be develop for channels (1,2,3,4,etc) and the concept of repeaters (YUK!) Antenna orientation to the verticle was easier and could fit on cars, trucks, planes and bikes. FM could have been otherwise, but the FM service as understood by Motorola and otheres was for service companies, Safety Organizations, etc. Hams put SSB and CW on these bands and have had great success with very little power and inexpensive antennas. I have worked around 15 states on two meters just dinking around with SSB. I lament that there are very few rigs out there right now that offer this capability (SSB/CW) for just VHF and UHF. The TR751A is a great rig and there are others if you want to pay the dollars. I think TenTec has a dual rig that is making some waves in this area. This is not a dumb question by any means. I think it is a very astute observation. How little would it cost the manufacturers to include these features in an HT? Not much.
This is my point of view...your mileage may vary
Lee - K0WA
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RE: Why Do HTs Lack SSB Capabilities?
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by VE3IVM on March 7, 2003
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>>..And now with Echo Link and other enhancements, I wonder if HF is dying anyway...>>
I would not say HF bands these days are less congested than 20 years ago. I would not say CW is in less use than 20 years ago. Echolink is a good compliment for many hams including myself, but I can not get rid of a feeling that I cheat myself when working DX through the Echolink. I enjoy it but not as much as if I worked the guy over the air. I grew up with headphones on my head hunting for weak CW below noise level. That was what kept my blood running (and still is). So far none of Internet VOIP technologies had same effect on me yet. Getting back to question who is going to die first- I already know the answer (no, I am not a fat bold retired person, just 30+)...
Ivan
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Why Do HTs Lack SSB Capabilities?
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by N1KSN on March 7, 2003
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To answer the question: Yes I would buy an HT with SSB (and CW) capabilities. More Modes = More Fun. Be sure to include 6 meters.
Andy N1KSN
Menasha, WI
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Why Do HTs Lack SSB Capabilities?
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by KD7QX on March 7, 2003
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I'd buy an HT that had 6m SSB in a heartbeat. One of the small but growing niches in amateur radio is pedestrian or pack operation. Rig of choice is the FT-817 because it's small and fairly efficient. There are some really nifty antenna designs, including many that are "build-your-own", to compement this actvity. A small HT with 6m SSB potential woud be really great for this.
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RE: Why Do HTs Lack SSB Capabilities?
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by KT8K on March 7, 2003
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I don't know how a more selective ssb receiver would handle 2M intermod that plagues me in urban areas, but SSB would certainly eat up less battery. I would love to have ssb/cw in a handheld, especially a multiband one, and I think the technology is much more ready to do this at an affordable cost now than it was 10 years ago. I would be interested in doing some mobile/portable hilltopping with such a rig, and I love VHF cw/ssb operating. Multibands would be *very* interesting to me, too.
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Why Do HTs Lack SSB Capabilities?
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by KZ1X on March 7, 2003
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No, probably not. The Mizuho and THP SSB VHF "HT" radios didn't sell well, nor did their predecessors, the Icom IC-202 and similar. Too much bother to do the tuning while portable, is why, plus poor ERP.
The 817 is too bulky, eats batteries, and costs too much for this application.
I would, however, buy a VHF "HT" that was CW only, kind of like the Small Wonder Labs RockMite, but on 6 and 2 meters. The S/N advantage of CW would more than make up for the low power and negative antenna gain of the radio. It would have to have a built-in Logikey-type keyer, iambic capacitive keypads on the case, plus a jack for an external key, a variable narrow IF filter like on the TT Scout, and an auto-spot function like the Kenwood 570.
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RE: Why Do HTs Lack SSB Capabilities?
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by KE1MB on March 7, 2003
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why do you need a beam to work VHF SSB, for this reason. Most everyone in the north east anyways runs horzintal. I have a 706 in my car running 50watts and still can barely hear other SSB stations because my ant is vertical. As soon as i get home and hook up the the beam, wham, there they are, strong as can be. If you can tell me you can hold a handheld running a max of 5 watts with a rubber duck and make contacts on SSB then all the power to you. There are some guys here running stacked 12 element beams and 600watts for 2m SSB. I run 10 watts with a 11 element beam 5ft off the ground proped up with a step stool. With this modest station i do very well. Well if there were more of anything with more modes you have a higher chance using and enjoying that mode. I like 2M ssb, it is a lot of fun.
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RE: Why Do HTs Lack SSB Capabilities?
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by N6HBJ on March 7, 2003
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About HF. It is not dying and probably never will. HF is fun and the soul of HAM radio.
Echolink and other similar modes make it easy to talk to far away lands but so does the telephone. For that matter, you can just use the internet to talk around the world even if you are not a HAM. So if you think that modes such as Echolink will eliminate HF, then you really don't get it.
HAM isn't just about talking DX. It is about HAVING FUN doing it! "Getting there" is half the fun. We all communicate on HAM radio for the enjoyment of it. Just like we have groups of people on 2 meters, we have similar groups on HF. You never know what friend will drop by the frequency. The only difference is that the friends may be further away (and you can ragchew for hours). If you really think about it NONE of us really need to be here. We could simply pick up the phone. But we are here because we WANT to be here.
If you are not getting on HF simply because of the code, then I feel you are not really that interested in HF anyway. 5 wpm is EXCEEDINGLY SLOW code. Anyone can learn 5 wpm by simple memorization in a matter of weeks.
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RE: Why Do HTs Lack SSB Capabilities?
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by WB2WIK on March 7, 2003
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Regardless of the technical obstacles, which are many, this has been tried many times only to prove the market is not there. Icom, Kenwood and Yaesu, as well as lesser-known Mizuho, NCG, Santec and others have all had VHF SSB "handheld" rigs on the market at various times, and while they had a small following of speciality enthusiasts, none of the gear sold well. I'd be surprised if the manufacturers were able to break even on their investments with any of them.
One huge technical obstacle for which there is no current solution is battery life. SSB requires the use of 100% linear circuitry in all signal paths except frequency generation; but detection, modulation and amplification all must be linear in order to work. Currently, FM handies all use non-linear stages (Class C) everywhere, to maximize efficiency and minimize battery drain. A 3W HT for FM might have a battery pack life of 24 hours receive and 2 hours transmit; the same HT, with the same battery pack for SSB would theoretically be reduced in battery life to 18 hours receive, and 30 minutes transmit time. Is this acceptable?
(BTW, there is no question at all that a SSB handie-talkie would work just fine and have dramatically better point-to-point communications range than FM, for the same power and antenna. This is a given. However since all terrestrial repeaters are non-linear, channelized FM, going to SSB means not using any of those -- and those are the primary reason for VHF-UHF HT's in the first place.)
WB2WIK/6
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