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Author Topic: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.  (Read 12328 times)

WB0UQD

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D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« on: May 04, 2018, 02:25:13 PM »

It really depends on where you live. When I lived in Iowa, we had no problem finding a Non-HOA house.

Today it’s all economics. The city saves MILLIONS of dollars by ONLY approving HOA developments. The homeowners’ dues pay for street and utility maintenance, snow removal, etc. The city saves millions.

We now have 9 Subdivisions being built between ERIE and Denver. EVERY single development has HOA’s and CCR’s. For the past 30 years, all developments in this area have been HOA. In the future, all developments will be HOA.

Has the ARRL contacted the D.H.S. or F.E.M.A.?  I would think they would be interested in a fully-functional Emergency Communication Network. They can over-ride the CCR’s like they did with Dish TV and TV antennas.
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K5LXP

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RE: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« Reply #1 on: May 04, 2018, 05:55:52 PM »

The city saves MILLIONS of dollars by ONLY approving HOA developments.

I doubt it's about saving money.  It's about *making* money.  You don't think there's a transfer of wealth between developers and city/county commissioners?   I have also observed HOA's are a vehicle to enforce rules that you could never pass as a law.

Quote
Has the ARRL contacted the D.H.S. or F.E.M.A.?  I would think they would be interested in a fully-functional Emergency Communication Network.

What "fully-functional Emergency Communication Network" are you thinking of?  6.52 simplex?  Amateurs are neither significant enough in numbers, nor in usefulness as any kind of communications resource to warrant any exceptions.

Mark K5LXP
Albuquerque, NM
 
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KS2G

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RE: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2018, 06:21:30 PM »


Has the ARRL contacted the D.H.S. or F.E.M.A.?  I would think they would be interested in a fully-functional Emergency Communication Network. They can over-ride the CCR’s like they did with Dish TV and TV antennas.
[/quote]

ARRL has been pushing for federal legislation to address this problem for several years.

Most recently:

ARRL Executive Committee Hears Updates on Parity Act...

Meeting on April 21 in Windsor, Connecticut, the ARRL Executive Committee (EC) heard a status update on several regulatory matters and the Amateur Radio Parity Act from ARRL General Counsel Chris Imlay, W3KD. Imlay reported that ARRL continues to work multiple avenues in its efforts to secure passage of the Parity Act. He said ARRL continues to have solid support from House leadership, and most notably from Representative Adam Kinzinger (R-IL), who, Imlay noted, has worked tirelessly to see the Parity Act become law.
See: http://www.arrl.org/news/arrl-executive-committee-hears-updates-on-parity-act-fcc-petitions-small-satellites

Amateur Radio Parity Act
See: http://www.arrl.org/amateur-radio-parity-act


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KC2QYM

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RE: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« Reply #3 on: May 05, 2018, 04:49:56 AM »

Many hams have been drinking the ARRL koolaid for years, thinking of themselves as the last resort communicators in times of disasters. With all the communications options available to emergency response organizations who really needs ham radio operators to save the day? People who live in tight packed communities have a right not to be burdened with eye sore wires and such dangling in their midst. The biggest excuse that the ARRL keeps pushing is the ability to have armies of hams on the air during emergencies and HOA restrictions impede that. Guess what? The only reason the ARRL and sycophant hams want easement to put up antennas in HOAs is so that they can BS on the air, enjoy the hobby, and HOA ham dwellers continue to consume ham radio products advertised in QST. The EmComm BS angle is just that....BS.
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KS2G

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RE: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« Reply #4 on: May 05, 2018, 05:34:15 AM »

With all the communications options available to emergency response organizations who really needs ham radio operators to save the day?

These folks did...

Ham radio operators help save lives in Tinder Fire
FLAGSTAFF, Ariz. – Amateur radios and their operators beat out modern technology last Sunday, possibly helping save lives in the Tinder Fire...

See: http://www.kvoa.com/story/38080073/ham-radio-operators-help-save-lives-in-tinder-fire

 ;)

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KC2QYM

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RE: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« Reply #5 on: May 05, 2018, 05:57:33 AM »

Ok, the article doesn't actually detail who they were helping and where the people needing the help were situated. Certainly the responding hams were in an EOC facility and we can assume that they were linked to mobile operators perhaps using VHF/UHF. I am a RACES volunteer and we operate VHF/UHF from our town's EOC to county who in turn can use HF to state. No mention of anyone using radios from their home locations. In fact most EmComm operations can occur in your mobile. And answer one important question; how many hams are EmComm volunteers? Perhaps the only hams living in an HOA who should receive a variance would have to be certified RACES or ARES members. 99% are not so the EmComm argument by the ARRL is still foolish.
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KS2G

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RE: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2018, 11:19:40 AM »

...No mention of anyone using radios from their home locations. In fact most EmComm operations can occur in your mobile. And answer one important question; how many hams are EmComm volunteers? Perhaps the only hams living in an HOA who should receive a variance would have to be certified RACES or ARES members. 99% are not so the EmComm argument by the ARRL is still foolish.

EmComm isn't necessarily local, nor always conducted on VHF/UHF, nor always conducted by certified RACES or ARES members, nor always or from an EOC

There were numerous examples or "every day" home-station operators stepping in to provide EmComm in the aftermath of Hurricane Maria.

Here's just one:

Long Island Ham Radio Operator Helps Relay Messages From Hurricane Victims In Puerto Rico
http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2017/09/22/ham-radio-hurricane-maria/

 ;)
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K3LI

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RE: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« Reply #7 on: May 05, 2018, 11:22:19 AM »

Many hams have been drinking the ARRL koolaid for years, thinking of themselves as the last resort communicators in times of disasters. With all the communications options available to emergency response organizations who really needs ham radio operators to save the day? People who live in tight packed communities have a right not to be burdened with eye sore wires and such dangling in their midst. The biggest excuse that the ARRL keeps pushing is the ability to have armies of hams on the air during emergencies and HOA restrictions impede that. Guess what? The only reason the ARRL and sycophant hams want easement to put up antennas in HOAs is so that they can BS on the air, enjoy the hobby, and HOA ham dwellers continue to consume ham radio products advertised in QST. The EmComm BS angle is just that....BS.

Where does this mystical "right" come from?    They have a "right" not to see a wire?  BS.  If they have that, then I also have the right to have a wire.  Dumbest statement ever.
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AA2UK

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RE: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« Reply #8 on: May 06, 2018, 05:52:51 AM »

Many hams have been drinking the ARRL koolaid for years, thinking of themselves as the last resort communicators in times of disasters. With all the communications options available to emergency response organizations who really needs ham radio operators to save the day? People who live in tight packed communities have a right not to be burdened with eye sore wires and such dangling in their midst. The biggest excuse that the ARRL keeps pushing is the ability to have armies of hams on the air during emergencies and HOA restrictions impede that. Guess what? The only reason the ARRL and sycophant hams want easement to put up antennas in HOAs is so that they can BS on the air, enjoy the hobby, and HOA ham dwellers continue to consume ham radio products advertised in QST. The EmComm BS angle is just that....BS.

Where does this mystical "right" come from?    They have a "right" not to see a wire?  BS.  If they have that, then I also have the right to have a wire.  Dumbest statement ever.
It's pretty much the same Kool-Aide opponents of 2A use, usually a string of incoherent inaccuracies "babble".
We have a society brung up on situation ethics...
  
Bill, AA2UK
« Last Edit: May 06, 2018, 05:56:36 AM by AA2UK »
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KC2QYM

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RE: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2018, 06:07:18 AM »

Many hams have been drinking the ARRL koolaid for years, thinking of themselves as the last resort communicators in times of disasters. With all the communications options available to emergency response organizations who really needs ham radio operators to save the day? People who live in tight packed communities have a right not to be burdened with eye sore wires and such dangling in their midst. The biggest excuse that the ARRL keeps pushing is the ability to have armies of hams on the air during emergencies and HOA restrictions impede that. Guess what? The only reason the ARRL and sycophant hams want easement to put up antennas in HOAs is so that they can BS on the air, enjoy the hobby, and HOA ham dwellers continue to consume ham radio products advertised in QST. The EmComm BS angle is just that....BS.

Where does this mystical "right" come from?    They have a "right" not to see a wire?  BS.  If they have that, then I also have the right to have a wire.  Dumbest statement ever.

A perfect example of the lack of critical thinking abilities. The agreements and covenants that buyers sign stipulate clearly what is not allowed. If you sign you agree? Has anyone cared to even mention RF exposure by close proximity antenna systems? Of course not. Even though the FCC places much emphasis on RF safety and ARRL license study materials cover a good percentage of this issue, it seems to disappear in this zealous campaign to push 'antenna rights'.
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WB2KSP

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RE: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2018, 06:53:48 AM »

If you feel that ham radio is nothing more than an eyesore, why do you hold a ham license? How about this case:http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2015/04/29/ham_radio_used_in_nepal_after_earthquake.html
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N9AOP

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RE: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2018, 01:00:37 PM »

Volume, Volume, Volume.  Until we have critical mass nothing will change.  Today there are not enough active hams to make a dent in any legislation that could make common sense to the mass of citizens out there.  Most citizens are oblivious to any real or perceived danger until they become a statistic and then it is too late.
Art
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KC2QYM

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RE: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2018, 04:16:56 PM »

If you feel that ham radio is nothing more than an eyesore, why do you hold a ham license? How about this case:http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2015/04/29/ham_radio_used_in_nepal_after_earthquake.html


Ok, here we go, a guy who doesn't read what people write. We're discussing the overturn of antenna restrictions in HOAs. I don't live in an HOA and don't plan to. I enjoy the hobby and am an active RACES member. Are you engaged in emcomm activities? I am making the point that if you live in an HOA you do because you chose to do so and you abide by the agreements. Most people except hams think that wires and antennas in their midst are an eyesore. Hams are in the minority in these communities ergo abide or don't reside in the HOA. Nobody forced you to move to such a community. It is folly to keep believing that the ARRL can change this. And again, such a small percentage of hams are emcomm volunteers. In a previous statement I did indicate that any variance to erect an antenna could be ceded to active, certified RACES and ARES participants. If you just want to get on the bandwagon to get such a variance for idle chit chat activities you're SOL.
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WB2KSP

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RE: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« Reply #13 on: May 07, 2018, 03:51:33 AM »

If you feel that ham radio is nothing more than an eyesore, why do you hold a ham license? How about this case:http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2015/04/29/ham_radio_used_in_nepal_after_earthquake.html


Ok, here we go, a guy who doesn't read what people write. We're discussing the overturn of antenna restrictions in HOAs. I don't live in an HOA and don't plan to. I enjoy the hobby and am an active RACES member. Are you engaged in emcomm activities? I am making the point that if you live in an HOA you do because you chose to do so and you abide by the agreements. Most people except hams think that wires and antennas in their midst are an eyesore. Hams are in the minority in these communities ergo abide or don't reside in the HOA. Nobody forced you to move to such a community. It is folly to keep believing that the ARRL can change this. And again, such a small percentage of hams are emcomm volunteers. In a previous statement I did indicate that any variance to erect an antenna could be ceded to active, certified RACES and ARES participants. If you just want to get on the bandwagon to get such a variance for idle chit chat activities you're SOL.

That's fine however, try to find a recently built home (2000 to 2018) in a non HOA neighborhood today. I don't live in a HOA either. My current home was built in 1985. I've been looking at homes in neighborhoods which I can retire to. From my experience there are no new homes which have access to high sped internet, sewers, public water and gas as opposed to wells and oil tanks, and good hospitals and other amenities being built, which are not in HOA communities.
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WA7PRC

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RE: D.H.S. and F.E.M.A.
« Reply #14 on: May 07, 2018, 03:54:49 AM »

That's fine however, try to find a recently built home (2000 to 2018) in a non HOA neighborhood today. I don't live in a HOA either. My current home was built in 1985. I've been looking at homes in neighborhoods which I can retire to. From my experience there are no new homes which have access to high sped internet, sewers, public water and gas as opposed to wells and oil tanks, and good hospitals and other amenities being built, which are not in HOA communities.
Again, more self-imposed requirements = fewer choices.
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