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Author Topic: ZELLO PTT W/T: Yet Another ZELLO Application: NETWORK RADIOS [ UK based? ]  (Read 2512 times)

VK5CQ

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In my youth, I'd be able to slowly tune across 75m or 40m... to find a wide range of topics being discussed, by a number of groups, in polite Round-Table discussion nets.

Then I moved to AU, where Hams are fewer in number & our Ham pop.density much less... Combine that with an uncooperative ionosphere, & it's enough to drive a Ham to seek out alternatives, like our own EchlLink and even lthers' Zello, etc

As I've written elsewhere, ZELLO is Excellent for Disasters - both Before + During / After they've hit.

Now, add UK-initiated "Network Radios" built atop Zello's channelised platform, but now supported by (costly, in my view, even overpriced) 3g/4g phone + Android + WiFi "Network Radios" (I quite about the plural name of the 7 channel net, as it seems to suggest the need to buy one, rather than use a more generic / multi-function SmartPhone or tablet device, running app Zello.

Rather than  summarise the details of this new !to me, just yesterday) social media creation - Network Radios" let me share a link to its proponent's community info site:

+ NetworkRadios.weebly.com

I let the Group introduce itself... :-)
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VK5CQ

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RE: ZELLO PTT W/T: Yet Another ZELLO Application: NETWORK RADIOS [ UK based? ]
« Reply #1 on: December 19, 2018, 03:03:34 PM »

'almost forgot: use the menu icon (at top, left corner of the site's pages) to access the site's various sections.

Name & Non-Hams seem to be mingling on the Network Radios channels... A chance to encourage the clue-ier non's to consider becoming Hams. ;~)
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K6CPO

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RE: ZELLO PTT W/T: Yet Another ZELLO Application: NETWORK RADIOS [ UK based? ]
« Reply #2 on: December 20, 2018, 12:25:08 PM »

You're still overlooking the fact Zello doesn't work without a network or internet connection, both of which are likely to be non-existent in the event of a major disaster.
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NC5P

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RE: ZELLO PTT W/T: Yet Another ZELLO Application: NETWORK RADIOS [ UK based? ]
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2018, 05:50:06 PM »

Cell sites are generally connected via fiber.  There are fiber/network problems in New Mexico today so we have had difficulty reaching some of our family there on their cell phones.  These things do happen, even without a weather emergency present.  This can also effect ham networks such as D-Star, Fusion, DMR, Echolink, etc. 

https://www.kob.com/new-mexico-news/verizon-century-link-outages-affect-new-mexicans/5191901/?cat=500

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K7RBW

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RE: ZELLO PTT W/T: Yet Another ZELLO Application: NETWORK RADIOS [ UK based? ]
« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2018, 03:14:14 AM »

You're still overlooking the fact Zello doesn't work without a network or internet connection, both of which are likely to be non-existent in the event of a major disaster.

The degree of cell/Internet outages depends on a lot of factors.

For example, in Houston after Hurricane Harvey, for example, the cell phone networks were surprisingly robust https://www.cnet.com/news/hurricane-harvey-phone-service/ . OTOH, in Puerto Rico after Hurricane Maria, the situation was a bit different.

While it's important to know the risk in your area, the days of "all else failing" are becoming less common than they used to be. (Or, put another way, it will take a larger catastrophe for all else to fail than it used to.)
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K6CPO

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RE: ZELLO PTT W/T: Yet Another ZELLO Application: NETWORK RADIOS [ UK based? ]
« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2018, 12:03:22 PM »

You're still overlooking the fact Zello doesn't work without a network or internet connection, both of which are likely to be non-existent in the event of a major disaster.

The degree of cell/Internet outages depends on a lot of factors.

For example, in Houston after Hurricane Harvey, for example, the cell phone networks were surprisingly robust https://www.cnet.com/news/hurricane-harvey-phone-service/ . OTOH, in Puerto Rico after Hurricane Maria, the situation was a bit different.

While it's important to know the risk in your area, the days of "all else failing" are becoming less common than they used to be. (Or, put another way, it will take a larger catastrophe for all else to fail than it used to.)

True.  Each new disaster points out where the shortcomings are and steps are taken to eliminate those shortcomings.

Still, coming to rely heavily on something that could fail is not a good idea.  There always should be a reliable backup.
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K2GW

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A few thought on Zello and other internet based communication apps.

1.    First of all, Zello and similar apps are VOIP teleconferencing apps.  They are great tools, but only when Cellular data and internet remain functional.  That functionality isn’t assured in many emergencies.

2.   Zello itself even publicly warned folks in Puerto Rico affected by Hurricane Maria a month later that their app wouldn’t work there unless they had functioning Wi-Fi or level 2 Cellular Data.  Because that actual hurricane did destroy the internet and cellular systems, the Red Cross went to the extraordinary step to fly in Amateur Radio operators from the mainland to get the rudiments of communications reestablished.

3.   Houston wasn’t actually hit by a hurricane; it was hit by flooding from tropical storm remnants, hence no real wind damage or comm outages.  Winds were typically below 50 miles an hour up there as measured by the NWS at Bush International Airport.

4.   Mere flooding rarely disrupts commercial comms, so Zello was a great solution for ad hoc rescuers in Houston like the Cajun Navy.  But look again at that outage map to see how badly cellular services failed down near Rockport where the storm actually did strike with Hurricane force winds.  Zello wouldn’t have worked down there.

5.   Network Radios aren't really true radios but essentially iglorified cell phone and VOIP devices. Without cellular data or the internet, they won’t get very far.

6.   Such products (nor cell phones) wouldn’t have worked in Puerto Rico nor near Tyndall Air Force Base this year where catastrophic wind damage occurred.

7.   Thus, Amateur Radio EmComm efforts using point to point radios will still be needed whenever commercial communications networks are destroyed or overloaded.  While we’re always the last resort, we’ve been called upon in this role numerous times and even this year.

8.   Finally, up here in New Jersey, we have an excellent internet based eTeam communications system that links all of our 21 county EOC’s to the NSJP OEM EOC.  But despite having this, our professional emergency managers know not to put all of their eggs in one basket. 

9.   As a result, NJSP OEM REQUIRES and has funded fully functional Amateur Radio stations in every County EOC.  The State Police run a test monthly to prove that all 21 County EOC’s and the State EOC can still successfully communicate via 75 Meters, 2 Meters, 220 MHz and via APRS on pure point to point RF.

10.   Of course, if normal comms remain intact, then we Amateur Radio operators are quite happy to stay at home and watch it on CNN like everyone else.  But when they fail, like they did up here in Hurricane Floyd, the WTC Attacks, the NE Blackout, and Super Storm Sandy, then we’re ready to respond to requests from help from government and served agencies because we’ve practiced with them monthly.

11.   Certainly, the services we Emergency Communicators provide need to evolve as communications methods and needs change, but the total demise of Amateur Radio EmComm is greatly overrated.  I say this as someone who has actually participated on the ground in over ten actual disasters. 
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W9CN

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A few thought on Zello and other internet based communication apps.

1.    First of all, Zello and similar apps are VOIP teleconferencing apps.  They are great tools, but only when Cellular data and internet remain functional.  That functionality isn’t assured in many emergencies.

2.   Zello itself even publicly warned folks in Puerto Rico affected by Hurricane Maria a month later that their app wouldn’t work there unless they had functioning Wi-Fi or level 2 Cellular Data.  Because that actual hurricane did destroy the internet and cellular systems, the Red Cross went to the extraordinary step to fly in Amateur Radio operators from the mainland to get the rudiments of communications reestablished.

3.   Houston wasn’t actually hit by a hurricane; it was hit by flooding from tropical storm remnants, hence no real wind damage or comm outages.  Winds were typically below 50 miles an hour up there as measured by the NWS at Bush International Airport.

4.   Mere flooding rarely disrupts commercial comms, so Zello was a great solution for ad hoc rescuers in Houston like the Cajun Navy.  But look again at that outage map to see how badly cellular services failed down near Rockport where the storm actually did strike with Hurricane force winds.  Zello wouldn’t have worked down there.

5.   Network Radios aren't really true radios but essentially iglorified cell phone and VOIP devices. Without cellular data or the internet, they won’t get very far.

6.   Such products (nor cell phones) wouldn’t have worked in Puerto Rico nor near Tyndall Air Force Base this year where catastrophic wind damage occurred.

7.   Thus, Amateur Radio EmComm efforts using point to point radios will still be needed whenever commercial communications networks are destroyed or overloaded.  While we’re always the last resort, we’ve been called upon in this role numerous times and even this year.

8.   Finally, up here in New Jersey, we have an excellent internet based eTeam communications system that links all of our 21 county EOC’s to the NSJP OEM EOC.  But despite having this, our professional emergency managers know not to put all of their eggs in one basket. 

9.   As a result, NJSP OEM REQUIRES and has funded fully functional Amateur Radio stations in every County EOC.  The State Police run a test monthly to prove that all 21 County EOC’s and the State EOC can still successfully communicate via 75 Meters, 2 Meters, 220 MHz and via APRS on pure point to point RF.

10.   Of course, if normal comms remain intact, then we Amateur Radio operators are quite happy to stay at home and watch it on CNN like everyone else.  But when they fail, like they did up here in Hurricane Floyd, the WTC Attacks, the NE Blackout, and Super Storm Sandy, then we’re ready to respond to requests from help from government and served agencies because we’ve practiced with them monthly.

11.   Certainly, the services we Emergency Communicators provide need to evolve as communications methods and needs change, but the total demise of Amateur Radio EmComm is greatly overrated.  I say this as someone who has actually participated on the ground in over ten actual disasters. 

Century Link had a 30 state outage on the 28th of December.  it caused 911 calls to go unanswered in Washington State and it took the internet down for subscribers.  The FCC is investigating. 

I heard a rumor that they had some sort of equipment failure that caused this.

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/911-outage-in-washington-and-other-states-triggers-federal-investigation-of-centurylink/

Who was saying that the internet was so robust that this couldn't happen? 

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W9CN

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https://www.geekwire.com/2018/report-huge-centurylink-outage-caused-bad-networking-card-colorado/

Huge Century Link outage caused by a bad card in Colorado. 

Two days to figure it out and fix.

Thousands of customers impacted.


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KN4SKF

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This is an old thread, but, for Christmas I purchased a Baofeng portable ht. I enjoyed listening to the general traffic I could pick up. Then I discovered Zello. I quickly purchased a dedicated device. And found I liked listening and talking. This refueled my desire to become a licensed amateur and began studying. February 2 I passed my exam and am enjoying a new hobby at age 70. All because of baofeng, and network radio. Yes not real radio, but I still communicate with more people than with any other means of communications.
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