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Author Topic: ARRL Petition RM-11828  (Read 2665 times)

KY5U

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ARRL Petition RM-11828
« on: April 03, 2019, 09:43:27 AM »

Please go to https://www.fcc.gov/ecfs/ and comment "against" ARRL petition to thee FCC RM-11828.  This seeks to give Technicians HF Phone privileges on all bands only passing the 35 question test.  The two goals are: Prop up sagging ARRL Membership numbers and secondly to allow sailboaters to get hf email easier.  They had complained about having to pass the General license test "when all we want to do is email". 

The important thing is that the petition serves no regulatory purpose. 



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W9FIB

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RE: ARRL Petition RM-11828
« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2019, 01:59:08 AM »

In the era of CW no longer being required to operate on HF, and in an era when so many say HR is dying, what is wrong with expanding the privileges on more bands then they currently have? It really shouldn't matter what frequency they talk on. As long as they follow the rules, I see no difference in allowing them to use an open 10M band or an open 40M band. Either way they can talk farther then a 2M repeater.

And isn't that what we look for is ways to bring in new people and have them become active and actually use their license?

To blame ARRL because of sagging membership and sail boat users because it may be a convenience for them is hardly the total reasoning behind this proposal. That is if you want to give an honest overview of the proposal.
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73, Stan
Travelling the world one signal at a time.

ND6M

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RE: ARRL Petition RM-11828
« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2019, 06:29:06 AM »

In the era of...

Using your (ill)logic, Why don't "we" just give away ALL licences and ALL band privileges?

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W9FIB

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RE: ARRL Petition RM-11828
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2019, 07:20:35 AM »

In the era of...

Using your (ill)logic, Why don't "we" just give away ALL licences and ALL band privileges?



No, you still need to take the test and stay in the segments assigned just like it works now. Just some added voice segments for the Techs.

Maybe we should give them the segments currently set aside for Extras.  ;D

Maybe learning to spell licenses would ease the pain.  ;)
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73, Stan
Travelling the world one signal at a time.

KB9BVN

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RE: ARRL Petition RM-11828
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2019, 10:05:13 AM »

35 Questions, you only need to get 26 correct. Poof and just like that you're a General with all the rights and privileges.

We don't need to give the Technician class access to HF...they already have it.

Just take the test.  We have 13 yr old kids pass it on the first try.

ARRL needs to be promoting upgrades instead of give aways.
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KD6UBX

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RE: ARRL Petition RM-11828
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2019, 04:21:12 PM »

Great subject. Just think though, how super high tech radios we are buying these days are priced competitively. They are very inexpensive with all they can do compared to ancient radios of yester-year. How did this phenomenon happen? You guessed it, technicians buying these things. The half a million techs are enticing the manufacturers into competition with each other for your best interests. If the hardliners could bring back code and eliminate the riff raff, they would be paying triple the cost for the same radio that is “specially made” as a rare thing. Thank a tech and let them have a little more fun. By the way, as a tech, I own 3- 857d’s, a 991, an ICOM hf rig and much more goodies. Like I said, thank a tech like myself.

I say, let the tech experience active HF bands for the next few years of this flat solar cycle.
I can't mentor newbies on a dead band(10 meter) and flash a General test to them to get them to use HF.

The amazement of Ham Radio is being replaced by new hobbies like drones, etc.
Folks need better bait if we wanna catch fish these days.
      
« Last Edit: April 09, 2019, 04:32:11 PM by KD6UBX »
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SOFAR

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RE: ARRL Petition RM-11828
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2019, 04:41:23 PM »

Great subject. Just think though, how super high tech radios we are buying these days are priced competitively. They are very inexpensive with all they can do compared to ancient radios of yester-year. How did this phenomenon happen? You guessed it, technicians buying these things. The half a million techs are enticing the manufacturers into competition with each other for your best interests. If the hardliners could bring back code and eliminate the riff raff, they would be paying triple the cost for the same radio that is “specially made” as a rare thing. Thank a tech and let them have a little more fun. By the way, as a tech, I own 3- 857d’s, a 991, an ICOM hf rig and much more goodies. Like I said, thank a tech like myself.

I say, let the tech experience active HF bands for the next few years of this flat solar cycle.
I can't mentor newbies on a dead band(10 meter) and flash a General test to them to get them to use HF.

The amazement of Ham Radio is being replaced by new hobbies like drones, etc.
Folks need better bait if we wanna catch fish these days.
      

Lacking motivation (for the past 16 years?) to take a 35 question test. Will not get you a thank you.
Completely delusional...

If you wanted to expand your frequency allocation. You would have upgraded to General many years ago.
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W3DBB

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RE: ARRL Petition RM-11828
« Reply #7 on: April 10, 2019, 06:00:57 AM »

Great subject. Just think though, how super high tech radios we are buying these days are priced competitively. They are very inexpensive with all they can do compared to ancient radios of yester-year. How did this phenomenon happen? You guessed it, technicians buying these things. The half a million techs are enticing the manufacturers into competition with each other for your best interests. If the hardliners could bring back code and eliminate the riff raff, they would be paying triple the cost for the same radio that is “specially made” as a rare thing. Thank a tech and let them have a little more fun. By the way, as a tech, I own 3- 857d’s, a 991, an ICOM hf rig and much more goodies. Like I said, thank a tech like myself.

I say, let the tech experience active HF bands for the next few years of this flat solar cycle.
I can't mentor newbies on a dead band(10 meter) and flash a General test to them to get them to use HF.

The amazement of Ham Radio is being replaced by new hobbies like drones, etc.
Folks need better bait if we wanna catch fish these days.
      
Every time the amateur radio licenses are devalued the price of used gear jumps. Used gear is an attractive option for the new ham who wishes to see if amateur radio is for them. The license giveaways wind up hurting the people they are supposed to help. Supply and demand. There is only so much used gear available for sale and the demand for it jumps. After a year or two prices go back down to normal but everybody made a buck. Nice.

If what you write about Technician Class licensees buying "super high tech radios" is true, then logically the amateur radio manufacturers have a business plan that relies to some extent on Techs purchasing equipment they are largely precluded from operating due to license limitations. That doesn't bode well for the future of these companies fielding offerings in the amateur radio market.

There's always been a 'creative tension' for lack of a better phrase between amateur radio manufacturers/dealers/publishers desires for FCC to continue to water down licensing requirements versus just about everyone else who thinks standards matter. It's been going on for decades. Not a healthy dynamic.

The writing on the wall says radio is old hat and taken for granted by recent generations. A smartphone holds more appeal for a typical person than amateur radio does. That doesn't mean a smartphone is or should be the same thing as ham radio. Recruiting from the pool of soon to be retired folks makes a lot more sense. They have money and have a developed desire for what they want to do with their later years. Comparing drone flying to participating in the Amateur Radio Service is like comparing apples and oranges. Flying a drone is visceral whereas ham radio is an intellectual activity despite the near constant attempts at lowering standards.
 
The spate of recent petitions that have been assigned RM numbers by the FCC are 99% hokum. It's a shame FCC has to waste it's budget on these when it could be doing worthwhile things like monitoring the ham bands and reclaiming amateur radio testing.  
« Last Edit: April 10, 2019, 06:09:10 AM by W3DBB »
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W4KVW

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RE: ARRL Petition RM-11828
« Reply #8 on: May 07, 2019, 09:14:03 AM »

The ARRL is a totally USELESS organization & if it were up to them everyone would use all of the bands & there would only be one license class. No upgrades required just open it all up & let it go. It would not take long before we would just have the 11 meter band on all bands with noise toys,echo microphones,roger beeps & we could call the The Children's Bands. The proposal makes Zero common sense but extra Cents for the ARRL who is hoping the Technician Class hams will reward their efforts on their behalf by joining their floundering organization & helping them keep their heads about the waterline in the toilet where they reside. It is beyond a TERRIBLE change. If the Technician Class Hams want the use of those bands all they need to do is UPGRADE. Giving the bands away does not motivate anyone to upgrade because the ARRL will propose another FREE give away before long & they will again get more band usage for FREE. ARRL = Amateur Radios Real Losers.  ??? ::)

Clayton
W4KVW
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ND6M

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RE: ARRL Petition RM-11828
« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2019, 10:11:47 AM »

In the era of...

Using your (ill)logic, Why don't "we" just give away ALL licences and ALL band privileges?



No, you still need to take the test and stay in the segments assigned just like it works now. Just some added voice segments for the Techs.

Maybe we should give them the segments currently set aside for Extras.  ;D

Maybe learning to spell licenses would ease the pain.  ;)

Actually, I'm just an "appliance operator" with a keyboard. stoopid spellchecker ;)
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W6EM

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RE: ARRL Petition RM-11828
« Reply #10 on: May 17, 2019, 06:18:56 AM »

Late to be saying this, I suppose, but back in the 1960s, ARRL convinced the FCC to take away privileges from General class and Advanced class licensees so as to "incent" them to want to take higher class exams and gain full privileges.

They called it "Incentive Licensing."  Now, that membership is only a tad more than 21% of licensed amateurs, ARRL wants to do just the opposite, in hopes of gaining more of those Technicians out there as members.

I opposed it based on them being disingenuous.  I was an angry teenager when Incentive Licensing took away privileges from me.  Now, I'm an angry 72 year old in seeing the League try to do just the opposite.

Over time, I saw the benefit of Incentive Licensing to encourage advancement of the technical and operating side of amateur radio.  It was, in retrospect, a good idea.  The idea of erasing incentive to advance and going the other way is totally wrong, IMO.

73.
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NN4RH

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RE: ARRL Petition RM-11828
« Reply #11 on: May 18, 2019, 07:33:44 AM »

They called it "Incentive Licensing." 


I think that was a typo.  I think they meant to say "insensitive licensing".


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KA3ZAI

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RE: ARRL Petition RM-11828
« Reply #12 on: May 19, 2019, 04:58:57 AM »

How about reinstituting the 5, 13, and 20 wpm CW requirement.
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W1BR

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RE: ARRL Petition RM-11828
« Reply #13 on: May 19, 2019, 09:29:42 AM »

I hold an Extra, and worked my way up the ladder since being a Novice in the very early 1960s.  CW was my stumbling block, but I managed to pass the test.  Held an FCC First Class Radiotelephone since I was 16 years old.  I was adversely affected by incentive licensing... but instead of whining I worked at the code and upgraded.

I don't see this proposal as being as evil or outlandish as some are making it out.  The expanded privileges are very modest.

phone privileges at 3.900 to 4.000 MHz, 7.225 to 7.300 MHz, and 21.350 to 21.450 MHz.
RTTY and digital privileges in current Technician allocations on 80, 40, and 15 meters.


This would not give them full access to all HF privileges.  It might be some incentive for inactivity stations to get back on the air. And, perhaps upgrade.

Just my opinion as a guy who has some skin in the game.
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MACGUFFIN

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RE: ARRL Petition RM-11828
« Reply #14 on: May 20, 2019, 03:52:33 PM »

How about reinstituting the 5, 13, and 20 wpm CW requirement.

Go ahead and write up a petition and submit it to the FCC.  Let me know how well that works out for you.
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