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[KU3X]

Without going into mobile antenna classes, the current portion of the antenna radiates the most RF. Also, the truck is now your counter poise. Size matters. A full size van without windows makes for a better ground than a passenger type window van. A full size four door car is a better counter poise than a two door compact car. Remember, your truck is the second part of your antenna.

Never base load antenna if you have a choice. Center loading is always better than base loading.

The best thing I can tell you is to purchase the ARRL Antenna Book and read the mobile antenna section. It's all there. You can take it to the bank that everything they show as to coil placement, antenna length and band of operation is all true. I've tested the theory and the results of my test where the same as what in the book.

If you think the Hustler two foot mast is going to be as good as their 54 inch mast, "It Won't !"

Don't expect to get the same performance out of a very short mobile antenna as you will out of a very long mobile antenna. Size matters and so does coil placement.

If all you can use is a short antenna, than use it, it's better than no antenna at all. Whatever you use, make the most of it by learning how to design an efficient mobile antenna.

Barry

[KA4NMA]

Steve,

Check out k0bg.com. great resource on all things mobile!

Randy ka4nma

[WB9WIA]

Thanks Randy!

Read it a couple weeks ago. Thought it was outstanding.

Followed his advise on several things such as bonding.

Steve

[W4FID]

I have a 3 magnet mount -- 5" dia each -- and hamsticks for 75 - 40 - 20 with quick disconnects on the mag mount and sticks. I can swap an antenna in about 30 seconds. TRUE -- the efficiency is not high. It's HF mobile not a home DX/contest station. I work whomever I work and enjoy whatever QSOs I have. The 3 hamsticks were carefully tuned to be resonant at my favorite frequency for that band and that does help. I have about $100 total invested and enjoy HF mobile when I travel. For me it's a balance between what I want to put on my car, what I want to spend, how often I use it, and I keep my expectations in line with reason. Pie in the sky is not for this guy. Real is the deal.

[WB9WIA]

Thanks John,

I have enjoyed Ham Sticks for years as I said. Need a few more to replaced ones I lost.

So my question is do I replace or is there something better to go to before I spend the money on replacement.

Not sure if a center loaded ant would be better, think it certainly might.

Two meters is pretty quiet from what I remember. Hoping to find a local that runs HF mobile and conduct some comparison tests for the both of us and see that might work best.

Have been very busy lately and getting tired of going in circles with this, might just replace the missing ants with the Hustler system...

Thank you very much for taking the time to reply and sharing your experience with Ham Sticks.

Steve

[K9AQ]

Steve,

I have had 392M antenna for about 5 years and love it.  I find that I can work anyone that I can hear on 20M and higher.  I use a 6ft whip.  The only negative is having to manually change the taps, but I usually stay on one band so that isn't a big deal. 

I thought they were no longer selling this antenna, but after reading your post, I found his ebay store.  That was good to know.

I have had hamsticks in the past and after using the 392M for awhile I sold all of my hamsticks.  I have never had a screw driver antenna so I can't give you any real-world comparison.  I thought I was going to buy one this year and looked at them at Xenia.  I think that I am going to save the money and keep using the 392M.

73,

Don
K9AQ

[WB9WIA]

Don,

Thank you very much for the reply.

Glad to hear you like yours. Would be great to see how it compares to a ham stick and center loaded ant. I was going to buy one for sure then decided a base loaded ant might not be the best in my situation.

I have been trying to find someone locally who operates HF and do some real comparisons before I buy. Hard for me to believe I have not been able to find any one YET in the Houston area. I really have not been on 2 mtrs in Houston in YEARS and it is not nearly as active as it once was.

Thank you very much for the report. The 392M is back on my list. It would be a great option to have one ant and switch taps. I do have a tool box where I could store all the ants in the event I buy the remaining ham sticks or go the center loaded coil Hustler way.

A buddy of mine who I shoot long distance with just told me he has a Little Tarheel 2 antenna that he used for 5 years and he will bring it over tomorrow when we shoot. I will do a comparison test when we are taking a break. That should eliminate the bottom loaded ant!

Thanks again Don for the report on the 392M, back on the comparison list.....

Steve

[KG6TR]

I have a 3 magnet mount -- 5" dia each -- and hamsticks for 75 - 40 - 20 with quick disconnects on the mag mount and sticks. I can swap an antenna in about 30 seconds. TRUE -- the efficiency is not high. It's HF mobile not a home DX/contest station. I work whomever I work and enjoy whatever QSOs I have. The 3 hamsticks were carefully tuned to be resonant at my favorite frequency for that band and that does help. I have about $100 total invested and enjoy HF mobile when I travel. For me it's a balance between what I want to put on my car, what I want to spend, how often I use it, and I keep my expectations in line with reason. Pie in the sky is not for this guy. Real is the deal.

What kind of SWR are you seeing? I thought a magnet mount wouldn't ground properly. I tried a lip mount with a Diamond 20m monoband with minimal grounding (scratching off some paint at the mount screws) and could not get the SWR down below 2:1.

[KB3UWC]

 I have been running HF. mobile, since 2013. Using a IC 706 original. I have tried quite a few antennas. The  first were mfj hamstick type antennas, for 10, 15 and 20 meters.they were mounted on a K400 trunk mount. The performance was ok, i made a lot of dx contacts. You have to remember, Propagation was a whole lot better then. On the higher bands you can get usable swr on most of the bands
 
 The next antenna i used was a 392m with a 60 inch whip, also on the k400 mount. It added 40 meters. it wasn't much of an improvement over the hamsticks, on the higher bands,  I tried a freinds 40 meter hamstick, and the 392m was a bit better on 40.  After about 2 weeks i started having intermittent problems, receive would cut out. I paid to send it back and he repaired it. After a few months it started cutting out again. I gave up on it and it is still setting on the shelf. I will cut the heat shrink off sometime and see what might be wrong with it.
 
 About 4 years ago i switched to a Texas Bug catcher 440 coil a 54 inch mast and a 54 inch whip. I bolted a plate to the frame rail under the car, and use a Breedlove puck mount. The coil is about a foot above the roof, of the car. For extra support, i used the k400 mounted a foot or so ahead of the lower mast and drilled 2 holes in a 3 in. wide piece of 1/2 inch cutting board, and slid one hole on to the mast and a 3/8 24 wing bolt through the other hole onto the k400 mount, so i could get the trunk open.  Performance is great, especially on 40 meters. But its a pain, having to stop to change bands. To get the entire general portion of 40 meters it needs 3 taps on the coil. Band width on the higher bands is wide enough that 1 tap covers most of the 15,17, and 20 meters bands. It took quite a bit of work to get it tuned right but it was well worth the effort. I neglected to properly maintain the antenna, and the western Pa. salt took its toll, on the mount and lower mast.
 The first thing i did was bond the hood, trunk, doors and exhaust. I have the + hooked to the battery and the - hooked  where the battery cable connects to the frame. I have never have any rf or noise problems.

 I recently bought a High Sierra screwdriver antenna, no more getting out to change bands. I hope to at least make few contacts on 80 meters when i get it mounted.
 Steve KB3UWC

[K0UA]

Steve, your screwdriver should work well, and be convenient. I have the Little Tarheel II and it works pretty well on 80 and it is tiny. I have the tune matic lite to take some of the burden of getting the antenna into the range needed and also give more granular control for "tweaking up" with its 1/4 speed control. The screwdriver is way more efficient than mini ham sticks, that I can testify too for sure.

[KW6LA]

Dont use magnet mounts  and make the antenna as long as possible. Just forget about  160 and 80 meter mobile. Stick to the money bands like 40,30 and 20 meters which will  deliver the most contacts both local and DX.

This is my strategy using a monoband 20 meter coil loaded antenna  and another dual band coil for 40 and 30 meters which I can change quickly. I can even change the tap on the 40/30 to any of the other bands.  Basically a Bug Catcher style design.

Hams roughly know when they are in the mobile  and  this pattern rarely changes. Hams also generally know when the bands are open so there is no need for changing  bands every 10 seconds. Thats one of the reasons I have abandoned big heavy screwdrivers. I go to work early in the morning and 40/30 meters is  all that I need most of the time.  When the propagation season swings towards early morning 20 meter DX paths I will select that antenna. 20 Meters is also good when leaving work so thats the coil I use when leaving work. Its a pretty consistent routine. I also have a  small Active antenna on my car  that is a modified version of the MiniWhip that allows me to tune the whole HF spectrum and then I can decide what antenna choice I make.

Dont over  complicate your  ham life with expensive antennas whose advantages look sensible but are rarely needed(Big Fat heavy Screwdrivers) There is no denying the excellent performance and flexibility but  I dont mind  the inconveniences of changing Coils or pulling into a service stations to buy a coffee and change coils. How much performance you will require is  what  should really drive your decisions. On bands like 20 meters  a ham stick style of antenna is good  and successful enough  and its an antenna that wont make you feel like you using  5 watts QRP and a miracle whip! The performance is good enough.  40 meters is different kettle of fish and requires  a large wide bandwidth to cover  how you operate and for this reason I prefer a monoband coil or antenna.

I would stay away from "miracle" base loaded antennas, "mil antennas" and other mobile antennas with UNUN's and other expensive voodoo. Use the ham stick as a your baseline, then something like a Outbacker then finally the high performance screwdriver type antennas. If ultimate DX performance is not your thing and just working local short skip then anything would do especially on 40 meters. If this was my choice then  I would use a decent Commercial Design like the professional Codan 9350 Antenna which is widely used by the UN, red Cross and other professional HF radio users. Its automatically tuned based loaded antenna that  works from 1 to 30 mhz and has a active Pre-amp for tuning around the bands.  But its a base loaded antenna  thats frequency agile and its base loaded which delivers a  3 to 6db penalty even against a Hamstick! Great antenna but very rare  in the USA.

My work has an expensive EMC test range  with a massive ground plane and professional EMC measuring equipment. I have spent a lot of time measuring various antennas to know that proper installation, vehicle size is more important than worrying about ultimate antenna performance differences. The only bands that require the best engineering practice and antenna designs is  for frequencies below  5 mhz and above  18 mhz. The average ham mobile antenna between the frequencies of 5 and 18 mhz has enough performance to make  using these sub optimal antennas and OK experience. But if  you want a potent signal from the mobile I am not saying pursuing these goals are a waste of time, it is warranted but not needed most of the time for the limited time spent in the vehicle. If I was a truck driver spending that much time in my vehicle I would go through this engineering  effort.

Experiment and dont be afraid to try  various antennas thats the  fun part learning about what works. Just  reading about what works for others is not a good way  of learning about  whats best for you. "if you dont measure and test you will never know"!

Zenki.. YOU nailed this !   

[K0UA]

Well, 80 meter mobile works. Even with my Little TarheelII  screwdriver. I can reliable check into my state net and the net controls are usually not local. I can usually QSO regionally (600-800)miles after dark too. Sure the efficiency is very low. Of course adding on 24 foot more wire to the whip makes a huge difference and I do that with my telescoping fiberglass crappie pole in the stake bed hole of the pickup truck.  Can't move with that though, so that is portable not mobile. But the 48 inch whip will get you by on 80 with 100 watts. So I wouldn't say "forget" 80 mobile. If you were using hamsticks, then I would say forget 80 meter mobile. Without a doubt 20 meter mobile works a heck of a lot better.  Even with a hamstick. 

[SP9HZX]

Definitely Outbacker.Very good performer
Nothing to spoil.

[W4FID]

Tower Electronics in Green Bay has "hamsticks" for ALL the bands. In stock. Theirs are very good because they have 2 set screws at 90* to lock the stinger securely. Some others have only 1 which if it loosens will cause problems. Also the stinger has it's own collet that unscrews so you can take the stinger off WITHOUT changing the length. You get the antenna resonant at the freq you like since all "hamsticks" are fairly hi Q/low bandwidth.  Then you can take the antenna apart to a couple sections -- the mast and the stinger -- that are about 4 feet each. Easy to transport. East to stick in your trunk. I know Tower well -- for about 30 years -- and theya re good people to deal with.