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Author Topic: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!  (Read 658 times)

N4OI

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No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« on: March 30, 2020, 07:13:47 AM »

Yes, I live in an HOA development (no complaints, I knew it from the get-go)...  And I have a multi-band HF dipole in the attic...  And I am a CW op at heart...  And I can usually work what I can copy - including DX...  Life is good!

But last weekend's SSB WPX contest lured me into digging the microphone out to try a few exchanges... Big mistake!  Nearly very attempt resulted in "again? again?" followed by multiple repeats... and then "very weak" or just silence...  10 minutes of that and the mic was back in the drawer...

With CW, I feel like a "normal" ham with great signal reports and few requests to repeat...  Most are surprised when I tell them I have an attic dipole... 

I just don't know you SSB guys do it...  If you have a compromised antenna, give CW a try and have some fun!

Just sayin'

73   8)
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W6QW

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Re: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2020, 08:26:15 AM »

Spot on advice.  For me, 30 years in HOA encumbered QTH's with the associated compromise antennas yielded 234 countries on 40M, more on the higher bands.  The secret - CW, where the S/N is in your favor.  Of course, the recent digital modes capture DX at an even better rate than CW but, for many of us, without the satisfaction factor.
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K1VSK

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Re: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2020, 08:57:14 AM »

SNR considerations aside, it's a lot more difficult to discriminate among a bunch of nearby SSB signals than it is on CW regardless of how 'good" an SSB op's radio might be. I listened a bit over the weekend but nobody likes a self-inflicted headache so I stopped.
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W0CKI

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Re: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2020, 09:45:35 AM »

Talk about self inflected headaches, another contest where the "big guns" set their compression and mic gain to the MAX never thinking that they splatter all over the bands. It's essentially a USA contest when the condx are poor so why are a million over driven watts needed. Oh well, I made my quota of 50 exchanges and then quit.
So there.
Gary W0CKI
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K1VSK

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Re: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2020, 10:03:34 AM »

10 minutes of that and the mic was back in the drawer...





Good place for it/them. For some, however,  its their only 'tool' in the toolchest.
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K1FBI

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Re: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2020, 11:41:33 AM »

Yes, I live in an HOA development (no complaints, I knew it from the get-go)...  And I have a multi-band HF dipole in the attic...  And I am a CW op at heart...  And I can usually work what I can copy - including DX...  Life is good!

But last weekend's SSB WPX contest lured me into digging the microphone out to try a few exchanges... Big mistake!  Nearly very attempt resulted in "again? again?" followed by multiple repeats... and then "very weak" or just silence...  10 minutes of that and the mic was back in the drawer...

With CW, I feel like a "normal" ham with great signal reports and few requests to repeat...  Most are surprised when I tell them I have an attic dipole... 

I just don't know you SSB guys do it...  If you have a compromised antenna, give CW a try and have some fun!

Just sayin'

73   8)

It's simple. I adjust my audio to cut through with good communication quality and that doesn't mean kicking in the compressor. I was listening to someone try to run the Maritime Mobile Net during the contest Saturday. His audio was probably great if he was a DJ on the other side of town.  Unfortunately I could barely understand a word he said. Yet Ops in the contest with only half his signal were perfectly clear and understandable.
Granted CW with my 200Hz filter sounds beautiful and isn't tiring to  listen to. However don't totally discredit SSB, it could just be your audio.
« Last Edit: March 30, 2020, 11:43:59 AM by K1FBI »
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K6AER

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Re: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2020, 11:59:13 AM »

Sorry to hear your experience with the WPX was disappointing. It is all about being heard above the noise level. Worked a lot of stations over the weekend on 20 and 40 meters. Noise level on the band for me was not a factor. After the contest ended my noise level was S1. During the contest my noise level was S5-S7. I live in the desert of NM. A typical 100-watt contacts were in the S4-S7 range. My antenna is a double extended Zep at 50 feet. Remember that many of the stations are in an urban environment. Their noise level may be S8 on a good day. Even if you the only signal on the band they might have difficulties copying you signal.

The problem is 100 watt SSB stations are not copiable most of the time in a big contest. 95% of my contest contacts were on the first transmission. What is different…you guessed it! I was running 1500 watts. Operating the WPX with 100 watts is like going to Indy 500 with a go cart.  I must admit I was surprised at the number of high-power stations that were within 3 KHz band width. The broad bandwith stations seemed to be more noticeable on 40 than 20 meters. If you looked at the total spectrum of stations most were in the sweet spot of 40 meters between 7.160 and 7.260. This, I think, is because of VSWR on their antennas. A lot of SS amplifiers cannot put out full power when the VSWR goes above 1.5:1. With a SDR radio the waterfall tells you the story. High power stations show up as a yellow register. On my radio there was a 100 KHz wide waterfall of yellow.

For stations on 20 meters it was a different story. Many of the stations have at least 3 element beams. This improves your 100 watts to the level of sounding like a station running an amplifier. Also the band has much less signal QRM due to the directional nature of a typical 20 meter antenna.

59K in New Mexico, good luck in the contest.

Mike – K6AER
« Last Edit: March 30, 2020, 12:10:10 PM by K6AER »
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K7JQ

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Re: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2020, 03:18:37 PM »

Success in crowded SSB contests is mainly dependent on your antenna, obviously the bigger and more directional the better. Compromised HOA restricted antennas at SSB 100W?...read a book instead. Add legal limit, and you have a fighting chance to at least achieve somewhat of a Q rate. With SSB signals 3+ kHz wide, the overlap of signals can be nerve wracking to listen to. On CW, you can filter down to 50-100 Hz if necessary and still pick out a signal from the crowd. Your weak signal is discernible on the other side. On SSB, any filtering below about 1.8 kHz is mostly unintelligible, no matter how great your receiver is. Therein lies the problem of anyone hearing your low power with dipole signal. As K6AER said, a directional antenna will null out areas you don't want to hear, and of course increase your transmit gain to desired areas.

I operated the WPX SSB contest with my HOA ground-mounted screwdriver antenna, but able to put near legal limit behind it. Still rough going from (the RF black hole) Arizona. Trying to punch through the midwest and east coast curtain to multiplier-rich Europe was mostly an exercise in futility. However, I was able to get some limited domestic runs with mostly S&P, and wound up with 100K, and 330 Q's in 12 hours. A paltry Q rate, but at least it kept me somewhat interested ;). Without the amp, Netflix would have been a good alternative.

But I agree...CW contesting is by far my favorite. I only do SSB to contribute some points to my local contest club.

73 and stay safe,

Bob K7JQ

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KC0W

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Re: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« Reply #8 on: April 02, 2020, 10:40:45 PM »

 If someone enjoys SSB more more power to them. Why do some insist on pushing their favorite mode on others who have no interest in it? Probably a superiority thing..........

                                                Tom KH0/KC0W 
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K7JQ

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Re: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« Reply #9 on: April 03, 2020, 08:20:45 AM »

If someone enjoys SSB more more power to them. Why do some insist on pushing their favorite mode on others who have no interest in it? Probably a superiority thing..........

                                                Tom KH0/KC0W

Tom,

No "superiority" thing here...not "pushing" anything. I always enjoy good SSB ragchews and predominately domestic, less crowded SSB contests with my compromised HOA antenna situation. I was just agreeing with N4OI's original post regarding his frustration with low power, limited HOA antenna SSB contesting, especially involving DX. In such circumstances, there's no question that CW will get you more and faster contest Q's. If I had a tower and beam, I would absolutely invest more time in SSB contests.

For me, half of the lure of contesting is the quick, rapid fire QSO's building up your score, and ability to somewhat be competitive. The other half is having fun. But when you're constantly having to send repeat exchanges, and getting clobbered by more powerful stations, putting you in back of the line, the frustration diminishes the fun. Proof of the pudding is in the huge difference in QSO's and scores between my CW and SSB portions of the same contest.

The bottom line is, absolutely enjoy your favorite mode and have fun with the hobby. I'm certainly not trying to influence anyone one way or the other. Just offering my experience and response to the posted topic.

73 and be safe,

Bob K7JQ
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K1FBI

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Re: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« Reply #10 on: April 03, 2020, 10:58:41 AM »

Sometimes the little "extra" challenge is it's own reward. If you want to feel like you're REALLY the world's best fisherman, try fishing in a lake instead of a barrel.
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K7JQ

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Re: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« Reply #11 on: April 03, 2020, 12:36:43 PM »

Sometimes the little "extra" challenge is it's own reward. If you want to feel like you're REALLY the world's best fisherman, try fishing in a lake instead of a barrel.

Maybe to you it's an "extra challenge", and that's OK. If you're satisfied with 50 Q's in ten hours, your choice. To me, it's a waste of time.These days, 20M is a lake, and the strongest signal gets the fish. Take a world-class contester used to 100-150++ QSO's/hour, give him 100W and a stealth low hanging dipole with houses all around in the current solar cycle, and see how well he does in a crowded SSB DX contest. If he wasn't bald to begin with, he will be at the end. To complete a QSO, you gotta be heard ;). Just sayin'....

73 and stay safe,
Bob K7JQ 
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AC2RY

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Re: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« Reply #12 on: April 03, 2020, 04:50:59 PM »

Yes, I live in an HOA development (no complaints, I knew it from the get-go)...  And I have a multi-band HF dipole in the attic...  And I am a CW op at heart...  And I can usually work what I can copy - including DX...  Life is good!

But last weekend's SSB WPX contest lured me into digging the microphone out to try a few exchanges... Big mistake!  Nearly very attempt resulted in "again? again?" followed by multiple repeats... and then "very weak" or just silence...  10 minutes of that and the mic was back in the drawer...

With CW, I feel like a "normal" ham with great signal reports and few requests to repeat...  Most are surprised when I tell them I have an attic dipole... 

I just don't know you SSB guys do it...  If you have a compromised antenna, give CW a try and have some fun!

Just sayin'

73   8)

Tell me about compromise antenna - I only have a vertical with 15 in-ground radials and 600W of power. I can work almost anyone I hear on SSB. The limit is my local noise level.

There are some people who do not hear anyone even if they come at S9. But the problem is likely on their side.

To work in contest one needs at least a kW and better than compromised antenna. That is why I do not even try to participate in contests.
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K1FBI

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Re: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« Reply #13 on: April 03, 2020, 07:52:26 PM »

Well if it's all about numbers at any cost, there is a rule that is better than Rule No. 1.

That Rule is that FT-8 Rules compared to CW.
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K0UA

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Re: No. 1 Rule for Success With Compromised Antenna: CW!
« Reply #14 on: April 04, 2020, 06:54:10 AM »

I sure worked a lot of contest in past years with just 100 watts.  i got my first amp on Oct. 31 2019, and haven't used it in a contest yet.

Sure CW has an advantage over SSB.  And FT8 has about the same advantage over CW.
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73  James K0UA
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