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Author Topic: California Fires  (Read 635 times)

K6LP

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California Fires
« on: August 24, 2020, 09:15:53 AM »

We're still in the midst of a very large fire in the Santa Cruz area, but here are some initial thoughts. Much of this has been discussed many times, but some points bear repetition:

Repeaters go down. Some of the most important repeaters in the region were in areas worst hit by fires. The repeaters burned and are inoperational. But those are the areas most in need of communication. Small groups fighting fires at their homes are asking for simplex communication on 146.52 (yes, the repeater output frequency on simplex is the preferred method. Just reporting what's happening).

Listening to horse rescues until 2 am, it became obvious that an HT is not adequate. In a mountainous area, signals are tenuous at best. Half an hour was wasted because a party with an HT could not reach the repeater. A backup simplex frequency would have allowed various parties to meet to transport horses, because they were only a few hundred yards apart. But a mobile rig would have made it a non-issue.

Having done 2 meter simplex ARES exercises in the past, I learned that my name brand HT was not adequate in this mountainous area. A mobile rig fixed the problem.

Know your area's ARES/emergency simplex frequencies. Almost every area has one or more emergency simplex frequencies. An HT cannot be depended on for emergency simplex communications. 2 meter VHF mobile rigs from Yaesu, Kenwood, Icom, etc. are not expensive, and can make the difference when the repeaters are down.
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W9IQ

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Re: California Fires
« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2020, 10:24:11 AM »

Thanks, Kevin for the field report.

I have been advising our Missouri ARES teams that adding remote "base" capabilities can be a great help as well. This requires that the "base" radio support this feature - ideally with the requisite Morse ID feature. To make it workable, the ham needs to pre-program the remote base frequencies and tones in both the base radio and the HT and then practice with the setup.

Once properly implemented, a remote base in a strategically placed vehicle while being accessed by a roaming HT user can provide great situational flexibility.

- Glenn W9IQ
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- Glenn W9IQ

God runs electromagnetics on Monday, Wednesday and Friday by the wave theory and the devil runs it on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday by the Quantum theory.

KG4RUL

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Re: California Fires
« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2020, 12:23:50 PM »

I have used a Kenwood TMV-71A in cross-band repeater mode (K model only) with good success.  I have a drive-on mast mount and a 25' fiberglass mast that is used with a dual-band ground plane antenna.  I operated both bands at 25W with an added cooling fan.
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W9IQ

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Re: California Fires
« Reply #3 on: August 24, 2020, 12:35:12 PM »

I have used the TM-V71A in cross-band repeat mode also - it works very nicely. This is also one of the radios that has a built in Morse ID to keep the operation legal.

- Glenn W9IQ
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- Glenn W9IQ

God runs electromagnetics on Monday, Wednesday and Friday by the wave theory and the devil runs it on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday by the Quantum theory.

WB6BYU

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Re: California Fires
« Reply #4 on: August 24, 2020, 12:44:24 PM »

HTs Can be marginal in urban settings as well.
I would add a couple other things...

Have the alternate / backup frequencies
pre-programmed in the HT, and use them
regularly for exercises.

Have an alternate power source for when
your battery pack dies.

Have an antenna better than a stock rubber
duck.  A mag mount on the roof of the car
is a good start.  When I as in Search and
Rescue, using HTs in wilderness areas, I
used a half wave 2m whip mounted on the
frame of my backpack, and it made a huge
difference.


Be willing to consider other means of
communications.  If you are a couple hundred
yards apart, honking a car horn, or even
shouting, might accomplish the task.
(It can also allow you to estimate the distance.)

KG7LEA

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Re: California Fires
« Reply #5 on: August 24, 2020, 01:30:59 PM »

For those HTs trying to work a repeater, was the reverse function available? It's not available on all models and it's not always obvious.

A mobile in a vehicle offers the additional advantage of speed in exiting an area.
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KC6RWI

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Re: California Fires
« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2020, 03:14:17 PM »

I am sorry to hear about the fires up there. I do monitor the fire freqs when there are fires near me in Los angeles. I know you must have felt pretty frustrated listening to the lack of communication going on.
For vacation we visit  Monterey and branch out to Big basin and Nisene state park. We have pretty decided that coming up to monterey next week will be out of the question.
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KG7LEA

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Re: California Fires
« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2020, 05:42:57 PM »

What was the training level of the operators? We are keen to know how to make our own training programs and planning better.
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KD6VXI

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Re: California Fires
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2020, 07:17:21 PM »

I can only imagine the problems up there.  I lived on both lower 236 (by Johnny's) as well as way up on Rebecca Dr.  Also owned a place out by 2Bar.  More than once, my neighbors where redwood climbers.

You have to understand....  In this area you may have 1000 feet of elevation difference in a couple miles.  Boulder creek, the 'metropolis' sits a good thousand feet below my home on Rebecca. Out on Bear Creek there is a kilofoot of elevation change.

As a tow truck driver, I was all over that area.  A mobile was deaf in the valleys that just 6 minutes before you where full quieting.  Cell phone?  Yeah. Sure.

My youngest son was evacuated.  He live(s. d) in Ben Lomond. Hope he has a home to go back to.  Lost internet yesterday so they can't watch the ring doorbell anymore.  Saturday he said they couldn't see a plant 6 feet from the doorbell on their porch.  Too much pollution.

Not much ham radio will be able to do out there, having lived and experienced the terrain, coupled with knowing the evac zones.  And Santa Cruz County (when I lived there) was pretty good about hashing ham radio in their operations center.

I pray for you guys up there.

--Shane
KD6VXI
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W1CDN

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Re: California Fires
« Reply #9 on: August 26, 2020, 11:07:02 AM »

Video talking about how they put together some antennas: https://twitter.com/CentralORFire/status/1297342465939107840
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WB8VLC

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Re: California Fires
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2020, 12:14:35 PM »

Doing 100% volunteer pet rescue this past week and over the weekend here just south east of Salem Oregon right outside the effected areas near SCIO and Jordan Oregon which is about 5 -10 miles south west of the hardest hit areas of Lyons and Mill City Oregon, the only thing that really worked is a 25 watt or greater power VHF radio in this terrain.

I won't even resort to using any chicom radios either only Motorola, and GE/MaCom radios, GE Orions, GE VHF RANGRS with FPP S990 heads and Motorola CDMs and Maxtracs are working very well on both MURS and ham.

One farmer who has a small airstrip south of the fire evac areas only had MURS radios and his grass landing strip was launching Forest service 1/4 million dollar IR drones for fire recon and getting to his property to return some pets to nearby neighbors required the use of MURS radios.

And yes please no this and that about proper MURs requirements and such either.

Initially I tried 2 Yaesu FT series VHF mobiles but they were blowing squelch the first day of use  around Salem and fortunately I also installed a mid power GE RANGR with a front user programmable FPP S990 head and afully programmed 256 channel Motorola CDM1550, both of which were the the best working radios on the VHF bands being used.

A laptop PC with the appropriate software made any frequency changes on the CDM easy which fortunately was not needed due to earlier programming of any and all freq's used around here.

The radios were mostly used 99% of the time for receiving with very little tx'ing which is typical of events like this.

A similar 6 meter GE RANGR with FPP head along with a 2nd 6 meter GE Orion also served as a backups which were not needed.

Best of All is that all rescued pets came home fine and were returned to owners allowed back to their homes yesterday which was the hopeful outcome.

In the Oregon fire zone even though there is active fire in all directions the smoke and ash are so much that one cannot see the flames, the visibility has been anywhere from 50 feet to just over 1/8 of a mile the further away one is and so far we have not seen the sky for 7 straight days.

I now know what astronauts going to mars will experience, the red, orange glow and endless smoke is erie.

The only good thing about the Covid outbreak is that we no have endless supplies of suitable masks which were supplied by many of the nurses of one rural hospital who were the owners of many of the rescued pets and required in most areas of Oregon due to the amount of smoke and ash in the air.

And now it's raining lightly which is something that we have not seen in a couple of months but much welcomed,  3 months of temps greater than 95 degrees and labor day high winds  knocking power poles into trees causing hundreds of fires was the cause of our outbreaks.
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KG7LEA

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Re: California Fires
« Reply #11 on: September 14, 2020, 12:34:27 PM »

Initially I tried 2 Yaesu FT series VHF mobiles but they were blowing squelch the first day of use  around Salem

Can you expand upon this?
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WB8VLC

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Re: California Fires
« Reply #12 on: September 14, 2020, 01:38:25 PM »

One brand new yaesu FT7900 and a slightly older yaesu FT2900 mobile were blowing squelch on several VHF channels, the audio also sucked on both of these radios and was unsuitable in a mobile environment and I only tried them out on the first day, Tuesday,  only because they were small and compact.

After putting both Yaesu's away I pulled out my 25 year old VHF HI and VHF lo GE RANGR's with the FPP heads and they worked flawlessly even though they are classic old trunk mount radios with control heads as large as the 2 yaesu's they worked without any issues.

The GE Rangr VHF hi and 110 watt VHF lo, the 60 watt Ge orion low band, the 45 watt Motorola CDM1550 high and 25 watt maxtrac Hi band radios where quiet with no spurs at all.

I'll probably keep the two FPP GE Rangrs as my daily use radios in my vehicle even though they are large trunk mount radios their quiet loud audio receivers and their on the fly reprogramming ability just like the typical ham radios make them so much better in a mobile environment.

 I did have one Motorola FPP XTS5000 UHF handheld for use with a 1/2 watt GE ExecII mobile repeater that was cross linked to my 60 watt GE Rangr low band radio but it didn't see any use.

25 years of living in northern Arizona prior to moving to Oregon and volunteering for a Arizona SAR group in the  communications  area I learned 20 years ago to scrap any and all HAM equipment for serious use and over the years I have collected a suitable assortment of Motorola and GE/MaCom radios for my personal use.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2020, 01:46:53 PM by WB8VLC »
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WB8VLC

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Re: California Fires
« Reply #13 on: October 23, 2020, 10:52:29 AM »

In the interest of giving Yaesu some slack on the FT7900 radio I have an update on my squelch issue that I previously mentioned while I was operating mobile.

Not wanting to give up on the radio I played around with the receiver adjustments some more and I have improved the squelch operation while mobile.

A minor adjustment of the RF squelch menu item has improved the receivers operation while mobile and while there are still some areas around town where the receiver pops open whereas a side by side GE Rangr is quiet,  I'll admit that a slightly higher carrier squelch/RF SQ setting has made an improvement.

Yaesu's default RF/carrier SQ setting is a bit to low for mobile use; however the RF sq setting is still lacking in resolution.

By this I mean that an increase in the RF squelch setting by 1 step resulted in the random squelch openings being lowered considerably, however; another increase by 1 step resulted in the receiver losing some signals that were not weak so the resolution of the RF squelch adjustment is certainly not optimum but still this setting if carefully adjusted and tested afterwards has improved the receiver performance.

And oh yeah the pets I took in, if only for half a week are actually missed by me but they all made it home safe to their owners.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2020, 10:54:38 AM by WB8VLC »
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