Pages: [1]   Go Down

Author Topic: Former FEMA Administrator Advocates Using Mesh Networks for Disasters  (Read 409 times)

KG4RUL

  • Posts: 3781
    • HomeURL

https://www.rrmediagroup.com/Features/FeaturesDetails/FID/1015

If the measures proposed in this article are adopted, it negates the need for any amateur radio participation in disaster relief.
Logged

W1VT

  • Member
  • Posts: 6071
Re: Former FEMA Administrator Advocates Using Mesh Networks for Disasters
« Reply #1 on: August 30, 2020, 11:14:09 AM »

Even when the network is down, those phones can offer communications through two other channels: Wi-Fi and Bluetooth. At the same time, amateur radio users, agencies or commercial technicians can program routers to stop talking directly to the network and begin talking to each other, creating a mesh network.

Fourth paragraph from the top.
Logged

KG5AHC

  • Member
  • Posts: 338
Re: Former FEMA Administrator Advocates Using Mesh Networks for Disasters
« Reply #2 on: August 30, 2020, 01:41:30 PM »

I think there is a good deal of investment in commercial scale mesh networking going on.

SpaceX Starlink satellite constellation might make ground-based radio mesh network less important, if the ground based Starlink transceivers are portable and numerous enough for insertion into disaster areas. I am not endorsing the Starlink project, it has value, but it also has some negative aspects for astronomy and use of orbital space.

In my amateur understanding of it... Cell-phone mesh networks require a lot of phones in close proximity to move traffic. Wifi routers get a bit further. and repeaters obviously can reach many miles, if there is power to run them, and they are not lying on the ground. 

But it looks to me like there is space for amateurs to participate, it just looks much different than an HF shack or 2 meter mobile rig.  for example, The Amateur Radio Emergency Data Network: https://www.arednmesh.org

and the broad band hamnet at Heart o Texas Amateur Radio Club https://hotarc.org/mesh

I learned a few things today, so thanks for posting your topic.

Regards, Jeff KG5AHC





 

Logged

KG4RUL

  • Posts: 3781
    • HomeURL
Re: Former FEMA Administrator Advocates Using Mesh Networks for Disasters
« Reply #3 on: August 30, 2020, 01:51:31 PM »

The one thing amateur radio cannot due is encrypt the data stream.
Logged

K7LZR

  • Posts: 395
    • HomeURL
Re: Former FEMA Administrator Advocates Using Mesh Networks for Disasters
« Reply #4 on: August 30, 2020, 04:47:30 PM »

All fine & dandy, but old fashioned radio-to-radio with no infrastructure needed is probably best for all concerned in an all-out emergency. As the old saying goes - the more complicated the system(s), the easier they are to take down.

With SDR technology, interoperability between radios & agencies should be trivial. No satellites, WI-FI, nor Bluetooth needed. Just radios & antennas, maybe a few repeaters.

With HF, reliable long distances are still possible. And some can even communicate via CW using very minimal equipment if nothing else is available.

I think that we've had it right all along. Let's keep our own proven communications methods and then we can help save the masses when their shiny new technology fails :)

 
Logged

WB8VLC

  • Member
  • Posts: 1155
Re: Former FEMA Administrator Advocates Using Mesh Networks for Disasters
« Reply #5 on: September 14, 2020, 12:26:29 PM »

Setting up a rapid deployment mesh network is not doable in many areas for on the fly use, especially here in the Willamette valley of central Oregon near our fires.

I know one ham group that has spent the past 7 months just working the bugs out of a mesh network here in the Salem Oregon area and this is not even going to be used for emergency use.

25 watt or greater commercial Motorola and GE/MaCom VHF hi band  and 60 watt or greater VHF low band mobile radios Is what I used late last week and this weekend when doing volunteer pet rescues in some of the towns south of our hardest hit fire zones.

Simple VHF to VHF PTT radios are what works the best when you need to get the job done and you are required to have to move from one unknown location to another on the fly.

No chicom radios either, even the yaesu ham mobiles were blowing squelch the first 10 minutes last week and fortunately I had some GE VHF hi and VHF low band RANGRS with Front programmable S990 heads  anmd some Motorola CDM 45 watt mobiles which were the best radios I used.
Logged

W1VT

  • Member
  • Posts: 6071
Re: Former FEMA Administrator Advocates Using Mesh Networks for Disasters
« Reply #6 on: September 14, 2020, 12:39:01 PM »

That is likely--Mesh networks are only going to be useful if you have experienced hams who know how to use it.  It isn't something you can tell someone to do and expect to have running in a few days.  But, the same is true about CW radios.

Zak W1VT
Logged

KG4RUL

  • Posts: 3781
    • HomeURL
Re: Former FEMA Administrator Advocates Using Mesh Networks for Disasters
« Reply #7 on: September 15, 2020, 05:42:58 AM »

That is likely--Mesh networks are only going to be useful if you have experienced hams who know how to use it.  It isn't something you can tell someone to do and expect to have running in a few days.  But, the same is true about CW radios.

Zak W1VT

Properly packaged and designed, mesh networks do not need anywhere near that level of expertise to deploy and operate. 
Logged

WB8VLC

  • Member
  • Posts: 1155
Re: Former FEMA Administrator Advocates Using Mesh Networks for Disasters
« Reply #8 on: September 15, 2020, 10:10:22 AM »

With the local Salem Or. mesh linked system that I mention above they are using the Mesh network to link numerous remote 2 meter receivers for a heavily used 2 meter repeater.

This is good as long as everything in the system has a backup power supply if it were being used for emergencies which it isn't in this case.

In the Salem system It appears to be more of a learning base for the club members and they have done a very good job at linking numerous remote 2 meter receivers via the mesh system and since this really was never intended for emergency use I shouldn't have been so hard on them.

As I mention it was more of a learning experience for the local club members and from what I am hearing on the radio hams aren't really being used in any capacity out here for the fires anyway.

The main 2 meter transmitter site for this repeater with linked mesh 2 meter receivers is within the fire evac zones and one major backup power is solar in addition to having a charging generator on site but I believe  that the generator is off after a long run time with no access to restore gen power and even though our summers run anywhere from 5 to 7 months up here with pretty much constant sunshine, the solar isn't working either due to excessive smoke so the repeater is not being used at all.
Logged

KB8VUL

  • Member
  • Posts: 654
Re: Former FEMA Administrator Advocates Using Mesh Networks for Disasters
« Reply #9 on: October 11, 2020, 01:55:00 PM »

Hams have been messing about with mesh for some time.  It's referred to as ARDEN.  And the slick part of it is it can be as small or large as desired and that you have equipment for.  I am right now sitting in the building were a node exists that has 120 sectors on 900, 2.4, and 5.8  on all four sides of the tower at 190 feet.  The site links cover 4 other counties and will be 5 counties next year.  Now, this is a big site.  But the same gear can be deployed on 20 foot masts and will link between those masts and provide coverage to anyone licensed with the right gear. And I would defy ANYONE that believes they can send documents (files) via CW nearly as fast as we can with this system.  The system as a whole offers chat, web services, email, FTP, IPphone and just about anything else that you would need.  And by design, if a site or node fails, the other nodes will route around that site and continue passing traffic.  Not sure but I don't think Bao Feng offers that option
Logged

KG4RUL

  • Posts: 3781
    • HomeURL
Re: Former FEMA Administrator Advocates Using Mesh Networks for Disasters
« Reply #10 on: October 12, 2020, 09:29:42 AM »

What FEMA is proposing in no way REQUIRES either amateur radio frequencies or licensing to implement.  Non-radio oriented individuals can be trained to use the devices as "appliances".  I.E. you don't need and EE to operate a toaster.
Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up