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Author Topic: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install  (Read 787 times)

WU6R

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Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« on: September 22, 2020, 01:22:21 PM »

I'm hoping someone who has been successful in getting HOA approval for a vertical antenna would be willing to provide me copies of whatever justification they presented to the HOA.  I would like to install a 43' vertical with a tilt base next to the back corner of my home.  I feel like if I'm not very well prepared, I'll get shot down by the HOA architectural board and then it will be that much harder of an upstream swim.  I prefer to pitch a positive story of how ham radio benefits the community vice go to war with the HOA or my community.  Any assistance is greatly appreciated. 

I'm trying to avoid a flagpole antenna if possible since I already have a new Zero-Five 43' vertical still in the box.

Thanks in advance.

73,
Mark WU6R
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Mark

Mark Wheeler
WU6R
mark3575@icloud.com

K1VSK

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Re: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« Reply #1 on: September 22, 2020, 01:39:02 PM »

How to approach them if usually predicated on what is restricted. What are the existing rules from which you are seeking an exemption?
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K6YE

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Re: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« Reply #2 on: September 22, 2020, 01:41:25 PM »

Mark,

Don't forget about the DXE 27' flagpole vertical. I have no experience but have viewed tons of posts relative to both antennas. I purchased a home sans CC&Rs and HOA rules and then found that no vertical limits exist for amateurs.

Sincerely, I hope the very best outcome for you.

Semper Fi,

Tommy - K6YE
DX IS and CW RULES
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KD6VXI

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Re: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« Reply #3 on: September 22, 2020, 01:52:36 PM »

Put a small flag on top of the Zero-5.


--Shane
KD6VXI
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W4MDP

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Re: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« Reply #4 on: September 22, 2020, 02:18:26 PM »

I don't want to pour that bucket of mud on your request but you do have one extremely serious issue.  There is no place on your property that you could place the antenna without your neighbors' lots being within the tower fall zone.  In virtually every zoning code there is a provision that the structure will not fall outside of it's own property.  So aside from esthetics within an HOA the ARC probably would use that fact.  The 27 footer will clear the property lines.
73
Mark
W4MDP
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WU6R

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Re: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« Reply #5 on: September 22, 2020, 02:23:15 PM »

I don't want to pour that bucket of mud on your request but you do have one extremely serious issue.  There is no place on your property that you could place the antenna without your neighbors' lots being within the tower fall zone.  In virtually every zoning code there is a provision that the structure will not fall outside of it's own property.  So aside from esthetics within an HOA the ARC probably would use that fact.  The 27 footer will clear the property lines.
73
Mark
W4MDP

That makes sense and it is good to know.  I may have to stick with a wire antenna that wraps around the house...
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Mark Wheeler
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mark3575@icloud.com

N6MST

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Re: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« Reply #6 on: September 22, 2020, 02:36:05 PM »

Retires from fighting for freedom across the globe only to go up against his most determined foe to date. Good luck, Captain!!  ;D ;D
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K7JQ

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Re: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« Reply #7 on: September 22, 2020, 03:45:17 PM »

Mark,

As a resident in three HOA communities in the last 28 years (all with CC&R antenna restrictions), it's really difficult to give advice on what to do. Every HOA is different in their thinking and propensity to allow antennas. It's usually a matter of aesthetics, the visual impact of your antenna to the rest of the community. A 43' vertical is quite visible, especially if your house is one-story, and/or you have homes close to you on each side and the rear of your house. You also have to understand that if they allow you to erect that antenna, they'll have to allow other hams in the community to erect something similar as well. These are things you'll come up against in your presentation, even if they allow you to make a presentation in the first place. Do the CC&R's state something like..."no antennas allowed, unless approved by the Architectural Committee"? I doubt if "emergency preparedness" to benefit the community would be a factor these days.

Something else to consider...how effective will that vertical be so close to the corner of your house? Where will you run the necessary radials, and RFI problems to your house and shack?

Personally, I've always gone by "It's sometimes better to ask for forgiveness than permission", and have gotten by with totally stealth antennas that no one can see. Dipoles in the attic (not good these days with all the RFI hash generating electronics in the house), and a more effective ground-mounted screwdriver with radials behind my house. For me, a 43' vertical is out of the question. If you do ask for permission and get denied, you've alerted them that you're a ham, and they *might* be on the lookout for antennas on your property.

HOA's and antenna permission is a slippery slope, and only you can determine which way you want to proceed. I don't mean to be a downer, just relating my experiences and what you might be up against. Good luck, and hope things work out.

73,  Bob K7JQ
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K1VSK

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Re: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2020, 04:04:18 PM »

. Do the CC&R's state something like..."no antennas allowed, unless approved by the Architectural Committee"? I doubt if "emergency preparedness" to benefit the community would be a factor these days.

73,  Bob K7JQ

I know of a few including our own HOA which have written rules specifically stating that flexibility be granted for ham radio antenna requests from CERT members so the emcom argument could help if the ham can demonstrate some benefit to HF communications derives to the community.

As you said, a successful strategy depends on how his HOA rules are written which he hadn’t shared yet so it’s difficult to offer constructive advice.
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W9IQ

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Re: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« Reply #9 on: September 22, 2020, 04:25:44 PM »

Please post your relevant HOA regulations.

- Glenn W9IQ
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- Glenn W9IQ

God runs electromagnetics on Monday, Wednesday and Friday by the wave theory and the devil runs it on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday by the Quantum theory.

K6OK

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Re: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« Reply #10 on: September 22, 2020, 04:32:35 PM »

There is no place on your property that you could place the antenna without your neighbors' lots being within the tower fall zone.  In virtually every zoning code there is a provision that the structure will not fall outside of it's own property.

Instead giving advice on a generalization, let's look at what the Fairfax County zoning code actually says: 

Ground-supported  antenna  structures  for  the  operation  of...amateur  radio  facilities...may be permitted in any R district as follows:
A. Structures seventy-five (75) feet or less in height shall not be located closer to any lot line than a distance equal to one-fifth (1/5) of their height.
Code: [Select]
https://www.fairfaxcounty.gov/planning-development/sites/planning-development/files/Assets/documents/Zoning/Zoning%20Ordinance/art10.pdf
Therefore WU6R's vertical can be located within 43/5 = 8.6 ft of the property line.  He has room.  That meets the County's regulations, now it's a matter of getting the HOA's permission.

73 Jim K6OK
« Last Edit: September 22, 2020, 04:36:07 PM by K6OK »
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WU6R

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Re: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« Reply #11 on: September 22, 2020, 05:54:41 PM »

HOA rules say, “ Antenna: To the extent not inconsistent with federal law, exterior tv and other antenna, are prohibited, unless approved in writing by the architectural review board. The ARB shall adopt rules for the installation of such antennas, which rules shall require that antennas be placed as inconspicuously as possible and screened from view; provided, however, that all such rules relating to antennas shall not unreasonably delay installation, interfere with reception or increase cost of installation. It is the intent of this provision that the ARB shall be able to strictly regulate exterior antennas to the fullest extent of the law and should any regulations be adopted herein or by the ARB conflict with federal law, such rules as do not conflict with federal law shall remain in full force and effect.”
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Mark

Mark Wheeler
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WU6R

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Re: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« Reply #12 on: September 22, 2020, 06:22:58 PM »

Our community is new and it was just turned over from the developer to the homeowners. Just this week we received a notice from our newly elected HOA board that the board is seeking volunteers for the community committees. Tonight I filled out and mailed the volunteer form for the architectural review board committee. Let’s see what happens.

I appreciate everyone’s comments. This is all new to me... it fills a bit like navigating shoal water in a navy ship in the fog at night during a storm... keep calm, think through the problem, and seek sound advice from the experts...

73,
Mark
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Mark Wheeler
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AK5B

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Re: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« Reply #13 on: September 22, 2020, 07:20:01 PM »

I'm also planning to erect a 43' vertical (or 85' inverted L with a 42.5' horizontal wire off the top) in a HOA community that has no specific restrictions on antennas (only "TV aerial guy wires that shall not be installed beyond the front line of the house.")

Rather than ask permission I will go rogue and "beg for forgiveness" if worse comes to worst.  Fingers crossed.   We have a lot of oak trees that will hide most of the antenna from the street and the few neighbors we have on our quiet cul-de-sac.

I will also tilt it over when not in use or lightning is forecast.

I will also endeavor to make it as inconspicuous as possible, however,  by a leafy-patterned camo paint job---something I would do even if I was allowed to openly go crazy with a full antenna farm or whatever I wanted to do.  Stealth never hurts!

I can give you tips on leafy camo painting if needed, too---no problem.

73 and GL!

Jeff
« Last Edit: September 22, 2020, 07:23:17 PM by AJ5J »
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K1VSK

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Re: Needed: HOA Presentation for Vertical 43' Antenna Install
« Reply #14 on: September 22, 2020, 07:26:02 PM »



I appreciate everyone’s comments. This is all new to me... it fills a bit like navigating shoal water in a navy ship in the fog at night during a storm... keep calm, think through the problem, and seek sound advice from the experts...

73,
Mark

To continue the metaphor, you should first find out what ocean you’re in. Read the HOA rules - some have no antenna limitations.
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