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Author Topic: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct  (Read 1411 times)

W3HF

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #45 on: January 23, 2021, 06:33:04 AM »


it seems to me that while holding onto something for nostalgic reasons isn't in and of itself a bad thing -- there is no special merit to it.  your history and the roads you took to get here are what they are and nothing can take that away. 


Rob -

Well said. Thank you for a perfect summary.

Steve
W3HF
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RADIOPHONE

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #46 on: January 23, 2021, 11:37:06 AM »

Yes, that was nice.  Very sensible.

Just say no to cancel culture.
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SWMAN

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #47 on: January 23, 2021, 08:58:37 PM »

     WOW !  HOW WEIRD !
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N2EY

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #48 on: January 28, 2021, 01:19:04 PM »

As regards the Novice class, I don't think it was ever really intended to be a "terminal" license.

A bit of history....

Way back in the late 1920s, the old ABC system was created. All license classes required 10 wpm code and a somewhat-serious written test; the class A required a year experience and another written test.

In 1936 the code speed was increased to 13 wpm. The written tests were updated as FCC saw the need.

After WW2, there was seen a need for an easier way to get started in Amateur Radio. Learning code to 13 wpm and the theory test of the time was seen as a lot to learn, just to get started.

So, in 1951, the Novice license was created by FCC, with 5 wpm code, very simple 20-25 question test mostly on regulations, and very limited privileges - plus a 1 year, non-renewable term. The idea was that Novices would "learn by doing".

The Novice was an instant success and the number of US hams boomed all through the 1950s and into the 1960s.

The Technician, OTOH, was created as a special-purpose license with privileges on 220 and higher. It was NOT meant as a step between Novice and General, but as a special experiment-with-UHF license. But it never worked out that way.

The Tech, on the other hand was, and gave the same HF privileges as Novice plus full amateur privileges on 50MHz and above. I'm not sure why the FCC allowed Novice licenses to be renewed indefinitely, since the General theory exam, even when you had to write the answers yourself, wasn't all that hard and a Novice could sit for the test and upgrade to Technician. As a Tech you could still hang out in your Novice bands using Xtal control, if that's all you wanted to do, and there were some who did just that.

A bit more history:

One of the perceived problems with the Novice license was the number of dropouts. Not only was the license only good for a year but once someone had held any class of license they couldn't get a Novice.

So in 1967 the Novice term was increased to 2 years.

This still didn't seem to fix the dropout problem, so, in the early 1970s the rule was changed so that if someone held a Novice but then was unlicensed for a year, they could retest and get another Novice. Then the year wait was removed - pass the tests again and get another Novice. Finally in 1978 the Novice became renewable.

Meanwhile, the FCC kept pushing the idea that the Technician was NOT a step between Novice and General, but a special purpose license for experimenters - despite the reality of why most Techs were Techs. They finally gave up in 1977 and gave Technicians the same HF privileges as Novices.

The repeater boom of the 1970s-80s caused many new hams to bypass Novice and go straight to Technician. The Tech had privileges on 2 and 440, the two most popular repeater bands, while the Novice had neither.

Many became Techs for a while to get their code up from 5 to 13wpm, took that test, and upgraded to General...and were perfectly happy to stay there forever. Even after the FCC eliminated code requirements, they could have kept the Advanced class,but for some reason they didn't.                                       

It was clear in 1998-1999 that FCC was serious about reducing the number of license classes, and reducing their administrative workload. Fewer license classes meant fewer test question pools, fewer upgrade applications, and eventually fewer regulations. In FCC's mind, the test requirement differences between Advanced and Extra didn't justify keeping both license classes.

Note that FCC created the Extra as part of the 1951 restructuring that gave us the Novice and Technician. The FCC of that time had been convinced that the old Class A/Advanced wasn't adequate for full privileges, and that the new Extra would replace it as the top license. They stopped issuing new Advanceds at the end of 1952 as part of the plan.

However, for some reason, in that same time period (late 1952), FCC completely reversed itself and gave full privileges to all US hams except Novices and Technicians, effective Feb 1953.

So for about 15 years, there were 6 US license classes but 4 of them had full privileges!

The Advanced stayed closed to new issues until some time in 1967, when, as part of "incentive licensing", FCC reopened it to new issues, seeing it as a step between General/Conditional and Extra.

In the years between the Great Giveaway of Feb 1953 and November 1968, when the restrictions of incentive licensing took effect, only a few thousand US hams got Extras, because there were no added privileges involved. IIRC, by the mid-1960s, less than 2% of US hams were Extras.

73 de Jim, N2EY

Novice 1967, age 13
Technician/Advanced, 1968, age 14
Extra, 1970, age 16

53 years licensed, 50 of them an Extra.

Current call sequentially issued 1977 - not a vanity.

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W3HF

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #49 on: January 29, 2021, 07:49:44 PM »


IIRC, by the mid-1960s, less than 2% of US hams were Extras.


Jim -

Starting with the Fall 1967 callbook, license statistics by class were included. At that time, there were 288,892 amateur licenses. Adding up the totals of Novice through Extra, the total is 275,820. Of those, 5,080 or 1.84% were Extras.

This data (and other info for all printed callbooks that contained license data) are posted here.

Steve
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W1VT

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #50 on: January 30, 2021, 04:07:25 AM »

When I got my Extra in 1979 only 6.5% of US hams were extras.
http://leehite.org/callbooks/Amateur_Radio_License_Statistics%201960-1997.pdf

A couple of smart hams in my social groups got theirs because I had one.  ;)

Zak W1VT
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N2EY

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #51 on: January 30, 2021, 06:29:05 AM »

When I got my Extra in 1979 only 6.5% of US hams were extras.
http://leehite.org/callbooks/Amateur_Radio_License_Statistics%201960-1997.pdf

From that same source, when I got my Extra in 1970, only 3.865% of US hams were Extras....

73 de Jim, N2EY
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W3HF

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #52 on: January 30, 2021, 06:39:06 AM »


From that same source...


Dang, I hate it when someone re-hosts your data. At least Lee acknowledged the source on his home page here.

Look at the bottom of the page and who created it. And compare that page to the one I had posted. (Maybe it wasn't clear that the word "here" was a hyperlink.)

I know it's not copyrighted. Sigh. And FWIW, I now have the Spring 1970 book whose data is missing on that page. I put it in the Excel spreadsheet that's the raw data repo but never posted a PDF version.

Steve
W3HF
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KM1H

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #53 on: January 30, 2021, 06:07:25 PM »

Quote
Dang, I hate it when someone re-hosts your data. At least Lee acknowledged the source on his home page here.

Consider the source.

Carl
Novice in 1955 at age 14
General in 1956 at age 15
First Radiotelephone 1956
30WPM certificate in 57
Extra in July 68 when it actually meant something with special band privileges soon after.
USN code certificates including 5 character crypto groups up to 40 wpm. As an ET I had special permissions to stand Radioman RM Speedkey (bug) watches with my Vibroplex Presentation which I still have.
On station during the Bay Of Pigs fiasco thanks to that POS Kennedy
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KA1VF

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #54 on: January 30, 2021, 06:32:04 PM »

   Jim, the Class A/Class B/Class C were five year renewable Ham licenses.
        But, to get it renewed you had to show some logbook activity entries.
        note: My XYL's uncle Wallace got a Class B license when he was still
                 a teenager living at home. But, he couldn't renew it because
                 he had been on active Army duty thus no logbook activity.
                 
                 73, and take care
                      Bob
   
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N2EY

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #55 on: January 31, 2021, 10:30:37 AM »

   Jim, the Class A/Class B/Class C were five year renewable Ham licenses.

After WW2, they were 5 year. Before Pearl Harbor, US amateur licenses were good for 3 years.

The way the FCC shut down Amateur Radio after Pearl Harbor was to suspend all amateur station licenses. They continued to hold exam sessions and issue amateur operator licenses, but with no amateur stations to operate, the operator license wasn't of much use, except for WERS (Wartime Emergency Radio Service).

It is also my understanding that after V-J Day FCC issued a special order extending the term of all US amateur licenses (not sure for how long) because of the flood of renewals and applications. They also waived the activity requirement.

In those times, FCC made a big distinction between the station license and the operator license; this was modeled after how commercial radio stations operated. That distinction has pretty much disappeared in recent times.


Quote
        But, to get it renewed you had to show some logbook activity entries.
        note: My XYL's uncle Wallace got a Class B license when he was still
                 a teenager living at home. But, he couldn't renew it because
                 he had been on active Army duty thus no logbook activity.

When was that? During WW2 or after?

There was indeed a rule that you had to have had a certain amount of on-air activity in the months preceding the license expiration in order to renew. How much activity, what kind and in what time period varied over time.

The earliest License Manual I have is 1948, and it has the FCC rules (Part 12) back then. The time period was 6 months before expiration, and at least 3 contacts with other US amateurs using radiotelegraphy were required. It doesn't specifically say log entries, but it's safe to assume that even if log entries weren't required, there was always the possibility that FCC could ask for them.

The 1948 LM also reveals that back then there was no "grace period" for renewal. There was a 120 day window at the end of the license term during which renewal applications were accepted, but if someone missed it, they had to start all over again.


73 de Jim, N2EY

Novice 1967, age 13
Technician/Advanced, 1968, age 14
Extra, 1970, age 16

No Elmer, no mentor, no friendly neighbor or teacher spoon-feeding Radio. No formal training in electricity, electronics or radio until the fall of 1972.

53 years licensed, 50 of them an Extra.

Current call sequentially issued 1977 - not a vanity.

ARRL 30 wpm certificate 1968.

WAS and DXCC certificates earned with 100% homebrew 80-40-20 meter 100 watt CW transceiver and inverted V at 40 feet.
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N2EY

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #56 on: January 31, 2021, 10:33:22 AM »


From that same source...


Dang, I hate it when someone re-hosts your data.

Sorry, I didn't realize it was rehosted. I just followed the link provided...

Quote
At least Lee acknowledged the source on his home page here.

Look at the bottom of the page and who created it. And compare that page to the one I had posted. (Maybe it wasn't clear that the word "here" was a hyperlink.)

I know it's not copyrighted. Sigh. And FWIW, I now have the Spring 1970 book whose data is missing on that page. I put it in the Excel spreadsheet that's the raw data repo but never posted a PDF version.


Thanks Steve! I'd modify my post with the correct link if it were possible.


73 de Jim, N2EY
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W3HF

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #57 on: January 31, 2021, 12:26:37 PM »


Thanks Steve! I'd modify my post with the correct link if it were possible.


That's okay Jim, I shouldn't be whining. It would be a lot easier if I had a functioning web site, but I haven't made the effort to try and rebuild what I lost some ten years ago when GeoCities shut down.

I'm glad the data is out there and being used.

Steve
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N2EY

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #58 on: February 03, 2021, 09:50:33 AM »


IIRC, by the mid-1960s, less than 2% of US hams were Extras.


Jim -

Starting with the Fall 1967 callbook, license statistics by class were included. At that time, there were 288,892 amateur licenses. Adding up the totals of Novice through Extra, the total is 275,820. Of those, 5,080 or 1.84% were Extras.

This data (and other info for all printed callbooks that contained license data) are posted here.

Steve

Interesting!

However, note this:

Before 1967, the Callbook didn't list individual license class either. Of course Novices were obvious because of the distinctive callsigns, but the actual license class wasn't listed.

In QST for December, 1963, page 84, there is a listing of US license figures by state and license class. It says the totals were derived from the Winter edition of the Callbook. Looking at the page, it appears they just copied it from the Callbook. So it is probably the case that the Callbook published the totals at least once before 1967. (The Winter 1962, 1963 and 1964 Callbooks aren't in the archive so there's no way for me to be sure).

According to the QST article (it's just one page), the total number of licenses held by individuals in the 48 states was 254,420. US amateurs outside CONUS amounted to 4,167 and were not broken down by license class. This brings the operator total to 258,587

The total license total was 266,202, which includes club, military, and other station-only licenses.

And.....

The 48 state operator totals were (percentages rounded to nearest 0.1%):

16,795 Novices (6.6% - Novice was 1 year and nonrenewable then.)

58,656 Technicians (23.1%)

40,259 Conditionals (15.8% - the retest-if-you-move-closer rule was long gone by 1963 and the "Conditional distance" was only 75 miles.)

95,250 Generals (37.6%)

40,296 Advanceds (15.8% - the Advanced had closed to new issues January 1, 1953, and would not reopen until 1967)

3,164 Extras (1.2% - the Extra had been available for ~12 years at that point)

It is clear from FCC communications of the time that FCC was disappointed that so few amateurs had gone for Extra.

73 de Jim, N2EY

 
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KM1H

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Re: Novice and Advanced Will Become Extinct
« Reply #59 on: February 03, 2021, 01:28:41 PM »

Quote
No Elmer, no mentor, no friendly neighbor or teacher spoon-feeding Radio. No formal training in electricity, electronics or radio until the fall of 1972.

That explains it, no social skills training when most needed.
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