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Author Topic: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?  (Read 1103 times)

KE0ZU

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Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« on: March 27, 2021, 08:13:57 PM »

I'm interested to see how many are still being used today.
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Regards, Mike
https://mikeharrison.smugmug.com/
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N2EY

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Re: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« Reply #1 on: March 28, 2021, 06:48:47 AM »

I'm interested to see how many are still being used today.

There weren't that many made, so the number still in service will be pretty low. Like Hallicrafters SR-2000s.

A part of the "wattmeter war" of the 1960s-70s.
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KM1H

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Re: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« Reply #2 on: March 28, 2021, 12:41:28 PM »

I had two for awhile that came from that 1992 IRS auction. Fantastic audio on AM and SSB.

A wattmeter war is more misinformation from you. The industry was trying to shrink the footprint of high power stations which had left many eager hams out of the picture due to no room for a big rack and the increasingly high cost of separates such as the S Line and 30S1.

Collins led the way in 1955 with the KWS-1/75A4 and then the Cosmophone 1000 offered 1000W input in one box (not a true  transceiver) but sold very few. But the stampede was on with the NCX-1000 1000W input in 68-69 being one of the last. It seems that even 1000W input in a desktop transceiver was not to be in a ham TX/RX package, actual transceiver or not. The SR-2000 had an external PS which omits it for this discussion and was also nit a big seller

The future appears open for an attempt at a 1000-1500W output ham transceiver in one box.  The R&S XK2900L does 1000W with a small external stackable PS from 1.5 kHz to 30 Mhz but I shudder at the price.....havent asked!

Carl
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KB7TT

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Re: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« Reply #3 on: March 28, 2021, 04:47:13 PM »

I have S/N 007 still running over here in Oregon

Greg
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KE0ZU

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Re: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« Reply #4 on: March 31, 2021, 08:26:07 PM »

Thanks all, for your responses.   Mine is #209 previously owned by W7CPA.   

I put in a power on B+ timer, and a P.A. Screen current limiter/cutout.   

I've killed a couple of 8122s over the years and they are getting too expensive to simply rely on what seems to be progressively worsening operator performance. :)
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Regards, Mike
https://mikeharrison.smugmug.com/
Pics and bold print are usually links.

KM1H

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Re: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« Reply #5 on: April 01, 2021, 10:44:47 AM »

Use a 8072 which can be found a lot cheaper and make a heat sink to slide over the top
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N2EY

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Re: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« Reply #6 on: April 01, 2021, 01:22:23 PM »

As information:

The Cosmophone 35 and 1000 were true transceivers. In fact they had what would today be called "dual VFOs" and could operate transceive on either VFO or split, by means of a simple selector that determined which "VFO" controlled receive and which controlled transmit.

In reality, there was only one VFO - but it had two tuned circuits, selected by a small relay inside the VFO box.

What makes a radio a "transceiver" in the modern sense isn't whether it has everything in one box.

What makes a radio a "transceiver" in the modern sense is whether it is an integrated system that permits the receiver and transmitter frequencies to be on the same frequency without having to adjust separate frequency controls.

Having an external power supply does not mean a radio isn't a transceiver - if that were the case, very few of the HF transceivers made for the amateur radio market would meet the requirement. Almost all of them (including the National NCX-3, NCX-5, 200, the various Hallicrafters, the Heathkit SB/HW lines, the Drake TR series, and many many others) had external power supplies - yet they're all transceivers.

The "wattmeter wars" of the 1960s were a real thing. Early amateur HF transceivers were what today would be called "100 watt" rigs, usually using a pair of 6146s or horizontal deflection amplifier tubes (aka "sweep tubes") to provide about 100 watts CW output and SSB PEP output. Some provided a little more. That power level was more than enough to drive a grounded-grid linear amplifier to the legal limit.

Some manufacturers decided to go a step further, however. Swan had their popular 350 and 500 transceivers, Hallicrafters had the SR-400 and SR-2000, Drake had the TR-3 and TR-4, Yaesu with the FT-DX400 and 560, and of course National. Even Signal One got into the game a bit. All ran more power than the usual pair-of-6146s "100 watts" - some a little more, some a lot more.

There isn't a clear "winner", though.

The Hallicrafters SR-2000 could run the old US legal limit on SSB (2000 watts PEP input) but on CW was limited to 900 watts DC input despite having a pair of 8122s in the final amplifier.

The National NCX-1000 could run the old US legal limit on CW (1000 watts DC input) but on SSB was limited to 1000 watts PEP input to its single 8122 in the final amplifier.

The advantages were obvious - fewer adjustments during tuneup, smaller overall size, hopefully less overall cost. But there were disadvantages too. Besides the generally larger size and weight (the NCX-1000 weighs 60 pounds), the power requirements tended to rule out mobile and portable operation compared to "100 watt" rigs.

All of this is easily verified by looking at the rigs, their manuals, and the dates of production.
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KM1H

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Re: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« Reply #7 on: April 01, 2021, 02:00:27 PM »

Quote
The advantages were obvious - fewer adjustments during tuneup, smaller overall size, hopefully less overall cost. But there were disadvantages too. Besides the generally larger size and weight (the NCX-1000 weighs 60 pounds), the power requirements tended to rule out mobile and portable operation compared to "100 watt" rigs.

Yeah sure, another boo boo by Jimmy who is batting zero lately. That is a Hallicrafters SX-42 with a front panel that will fit into a standard 19" relay rack. Many, many other receivers used the same size.

Weee, my first photo post on Eham!

« Last Edit: April 05, 2021, 11:20:51 AM by N2MG »
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KM1H

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Re: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« Reply #8 on: April 01, 2021, 02:32:32 PM »

Plus the NCX-1000 is a complete transceiver with the PS built in and still at only 60 lbs; the SX-42 weighs more !!
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N2EY

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Re: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« Reply #9 on: April 02, 2021, 07:23:44 PM »

Thanks all, for your responses.   Mine is #209 previously owned by W7CPA.   

Then you're probably well aware of his website - in particular this:

http://www.arizona-am.net/PHOENIX/W7CPA/National-Restoration.html#NCX-1000_Restoration

It is interesting that he describes the NCX-1000 as "a prototype that slipped into production status before it was ready. "

I put in a power on B+ timer, and a P.A. Screen current limiter/cutout.   

I've killed a couple of 8122s over the years and they are getting too expensive to simply rely on what seems to be progressively worsening operator performance. :)

It is interesting that the NCL-2000 has a B+ timer to enforce the required warm-up time, but the NCX-1000 doesn't.

Interesting rig. Note that the mechanical dial calibration is only 5 kHz while the competition (even Heathkit!) offered 1 kHz, and that CW sidetone and a crystal calibrator were extra-cost options. And of course no sharp filter for CW.

Too bad it was on the market for such a short time.


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SM0AOM

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Re: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« Reply #10 on: April 03, 2021, 03:00:04 AM »


The future appears open for an attempt at a 1000-1500W output ham transceiver in one box.  The R&S XK2900L does 1000W with a small external stackable PS from 1.5 kHz to 30 Mhz but I shudder at the price.....havent asked!

Carl

I find a "kW in a box" solid-state radio for the amateur market somewhat unlikely.

The cooling problem is quite real, and this is one of the main reasons for the packaging size and cost of the professional gear.

An R&S XK2900L is in the region of $200k each, somewhat depending of what is considered to form part of the transceiver.

The Marconi/SELEX/Leonardo, today somewhat dated, 400 W HF2000-family radio costs about $60k.

 

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W9IQ

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Re: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« Reply #11 on: April 03, 2021, 05:33:35 AM »

Even if you set aside the technical issues, the market filters would reduce the served market to a size that position it as a boutique radio.

- Glenn W9IQ
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- Glenn W9IQ

God runs electromagnetics on Monday, Wednesday and Friday by the wave theory and the devil runs it on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday by the Quantum theory.

KM1H

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Re: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« Reply #12 on: April 03, 2021, 10:21:54 AM »

Quote
It is interesting that he describes the NCX-1000 as "a prototype that slipped into production status before it was ready. "

It wasnt the first ham product that did that and it wont be the last. AND as you have been TOLD in the past National Company was in serious financial trouble due to its parent company trying to cheat in a military contract and lost its ability to bid on future contracts.
OTOH National Radio Company was profitable right to the end but all its profits went to the parent.

Maybe Jimmy, you will grow up some day and quit bashing National as a personal vendetta as a pure TROLL. You really are a bore and each post just helps your popularity score to decrease even more.
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KE0ZU

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Re: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« Reply #13 on: April 03, 2021, 10:06:05 PM »

Thanks again, to all for your comments.

Opinion, speculation, design/feature deficiencies and corporate environment aside, the radio simply is what it is, a somewhat rare, unique, and interesting design, that works sufficiently well to be enjoyable as is.       

It's nice to see there are a fair number of examples still in use today.   It would be interesting to know how many there actually are, but I doubt that'll ever be known.
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Regards, Mike
https://mikeharrison.smugmug.com/
Pics and bold print are usually links.

KM1H

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Re: Are there any NCX-1000 owners here?
« Reply #14 on: April 04, 2021, 08:22:44 AM »

A very nice and well thought out reply Mike, thanks.

Carl
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