Pages: [1] 2   Go Down

Author Topic: HOA post by Mike  (Read 2238 times)

W6UXB

  • Member
  • Posts: 89
HOA post by Mike
« on: January 14, 2022, 05:04:43 PM »

Totally agree with this, I was forced into HOA with my wife's health problems, still want to enjoy my hobby!
Logged

K8AXW

  • Posts: 7391
    • HomeURL
Re: HOA post by Mike
« Reply #1 on: January 15, 2022, 10:58:01 AM »

UXB:  We can always find "one-book" information on any facet of ham radio....rather it be QRP or EME and everything in between.

I've never seen a much needed book on Amateur Radio and HOAs!  That would be a fascinating read or perhaps a challenge for some writer!

After all, there was a time when clandestine radio operating was the ultimate challenge for some.
Logged
A Pessimist is Never Disappointed!

N6MST

  • Posts: 307
    • HomeURL
Re: HOA post by Mike
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2022, 11:42:20 AM »

I've never seen a much needed book on Amateur Radio and HOAs!

There is an entire section about this in the ARRL Antenna Book. It's called "Small Transmitting Loops" and in the edition I have it's section 5.3
Logged

K8AXW

  • Posts: 7391
    • HomeURL
Re: HOA post by Mike
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2022, 11:30:27 AM »

MST:  Thanks for the info.  HOA radio is a 'whole book' subject dealing with antennas, gear, power and even operating times.  Using loop antennas creates more problems than they solve. However, I will say they're better than no antenna!

I bought one (1) ARRL Antenna book several decades ago and after reading it a few times came to the conclusion that an antenna can't work!  Never bought another ARRL "Antenna" book. 

Thanks again. 

Logged
A Pessimist is Never Disappointed!

N6MST

  • Posts: 307
    • HomeURL
Re: HOA post by Mike
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2022, 01:11:55 PM »

Using loop antennas creates more problems than they solve.

Hm, I guess nobody ever told that to the folks successfully using loops every day.
Logged

AC2EU

  • Member
  • Posts: 2793
    • McVey Electronics
Re: HOA post by Mike
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2022, 02:51:38 PM »

HOAs aren't a radio problem, it's a legal one.  What can ARRL possibly do to help with thousand of thousand of very specific contracts signed by the homeowner? Its not a "one size fits all" situation.
Some hams are stuck with stealth.
Some hams get some slack from the HO board.
Some hams move.

If you really don't know where to start' Consult a local lawyer who may be familiar with how your HOA operates when granting variances.
Bottom line; you signed away some of your rights when you bought in. Maybe the agreement  can be modified, maybe not...

K8AXW

  • Posts: 7391
    • HomeURL
Re: HOA post by Mike
« Reply #6 on: January 19, 2022, 09:29:37 AM »

Two things:  1 - I never indicated that loop antennas can't be use "successfully."  They are.

2 - People who sign a HOA contract have no right to seek a lawyer's services to get around the contract.  MY opinion.

My initial comment was I saw a need for a book to help those who find themselves restricted by a HOA contract.  Read "stealth" here. Nothing more. 

Perhaps some wannabe writer can step up and be counted?  Or maybe someone who can research and accumulate already published articles and put them into a book.

Logged
A Pessimist is Never Disappointed!

W1VT

  • Member
  • Posts: 6067
Re: HOA post by Mike
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2022, 10:19:14 AM »

Maybe something along the lines of Paul Wade's online Microwave Book?  Except for hams in HOAs.

http://www.w1ghz.org/antbook/preface.htm
"On the other hand, I keep trying new ideas and learning new things, particularly about antennas.  Many of these come from other hams who read the articles and explain things better or simply ask questions that get me thinking or reading.  Then I'd like to go back and revise the articles, but how?  One way might be to put the articles online, with instant update capability.  As I thought about reorganizing the material,  it occured to me a that it might become an online book, which can remain unfinished.  Already there is material here that is unavailable anywhere else."
Logged

K7JQ

  • Member
  • Posts: 2602
Re: HOA post by Mike
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2022, 11:21:49 AM »


2 - People who sign a HOA contract have no right to seek a lawyer's services to get around the contract.  MY opinion.


One always has a "right" to hire a lawyer to circumvent a CC&R, but they're just wasting their time and money. If a CC&R violates a Federal or State law, a different story, but you can fight that without a lawyer.

As a HOA/CC&R dweller with antenna restrictions, I agree with you. Upon home purchase, you signed an agreement (essentially a contract) to abide by the provisions of the CC&R's, and allow the HOA to legally enforce them. It's up to you to decide to do one of three things when dealing with ham radio antenna restrictions/prohibitions:

1. Abide strictly by the rule, and abandon your pursuit of ham radio.
2. Ask the HOA for a variance to allow you to have some accommodation for an antenna. If they
    turn you down, you notified them that you're a ham radio operator.
3. Go with a stealth antenna, and take your chances that no one will notice. Sometimes it's
    better to ask for forgiveness than permission.
Logged

KH6AQ

  • Member
  • Posts: 9290
Re: HOA post by Mike
« Reply #9 on: January 20, 2022, 02:07:06 PM »

I have lived at four HOA QTHs with decent HF success. Once I got the antenna situation dialed in (they caught me on the first try) I ended up with an antenna and power that allowed worldwide CW DX on even 80 meters. 
Logged

K8AXW

  • Posts: 7391
    • HomeURL
Re: HOA post by Mike
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2022, 09:52:59 AM »

AQ:  THIS is what I'm talking about!  You're not the only one with both failures and success and these experiences should be documented with easy access.  Thank you.

Al - K8AXW
Logged
A Pessimist is Never Disappointed!

K7JQ

  • Member
  • Posts: 2602
Re: HOA post by Mike
« Reply #11 on: January 21, 2022, 10:37:30 AM »

KH6AQ and I have extensive experience living in HOA's (I've been in three) with antenna restriction CC&R's. I've gone with #3 in my comment above - go stealth without asking for HOA permission. Thirty years now of HF contesting, DXing, and ragchewing fun in CW, SSB, and RTTY, using screwdriver antennas and attic dipoles.

Bob K7JQ
Logged

KH6AQ

  • Member
  • Posts: 9290
Re: HOA post by Mike
« Reply #12 on: January 22, 2022, 07:40:08 AM »

We have had similar HOA experiences. The "ultimate" HOA antenna for me was a ground mounted Tarheel 200A-HP screwdriver antenna hidden inside a 5' length of 4" x 4" hollow vinyl fence post. I got that idea from a photo at the Tarheel website. On one side at the top a small wooden birdhouse was attached. During the day a 3' mobile whip was attached using a Hustler quick disconnect coupler. The antenna could be seen from the street 100' away thru a see-thru fence yet no one ever asked about it, not even the patrollers who caught my first antenna attempt. Various whips were attached depending on the band, what DX I was after and the time of day. The long antenna whip extensions were used under the cover of darkness when the lower bands opened. The longest whips used coupled Hustler mobile mast extensions with a 9' CB whip on top. MFJ makes the longest such whip. A length of 0.625" aluminum tubing slipped over the mast extensions for reinforcement.

The 25' x 50' yard had 90 radials radiating out from the center. I'm sure 32 would have been enough but once I going I got radial fever and kept adding radials all weekend. This made for a low base-referred GND loss of 5-10 ohms depending on the band. Using the 24' whip on 80 meters the calculated radiation efficiency was around 50%. With 1200W it was great for DXing. The input resistance varied depending on the band and the whip in use and an DX Engineering DXE-MM-1 matching transformer as a shunt coil did not take care of all the combinations. The transformer has 1:2 and 1:4 taps. For 1:1 the coax was connected directly. Between the transformer and adjusting the screwdriver from the shack an SWR under 1.5:1 could be found on any band. This was necessary to keep the AL-600 and later the AL-1200 amp happy. I wrote an article on it for AntenneX magazine. The Birdhouse Antenna

3' whip, 40-10 meters
6' whip, 80-10 meters
9' whip, 80-17 meters
13.5' whip, 80-30 meters
24' whip, 160-40 meters

Tarheel https://www.tarheelantennas.com/mobile_antennas

Hustler Quick Disconnect https://www.dxengineering.com/parts/hsr-qd-2

Hustler Mast  https://www.dxengineering.com/parts/hsr-mo-2

DXE-MM-1   https://www.dxengineering.com/parts/dxe-mm-1
« Last Edit: January 22, 2022, 07:47:56 AM by KH6AQ »
Logged

K8AXW

  • Posts: 7391
    • HomeURL
Re: HOA post by Mike
« Reply #13 on: January 22, 2022, 09:51:22 AM »

JQ/AQ:  VERY interesting and well documented! 

It's information and experiences like yours that would help hundreds if not thousands of other HOA dwellers enjoy our hobby. 

Perhaps some Internet/computer wise person could start a collection point for this type of information and assemble it into a book form?
Logged
A Pessimist is Never Disappointed!

KH6AQ

  • Member
  • Posts: 9290
Re: HOA post by Mike
« Reply #14 on: January 22, 2022, 12:32:46 PM »

My basic HOA antenna tools have been a manual antenna tuner, TV twin lead and #32 wire. Copper tubing, aluminum tubing, 1 x 2 wood and that sort of thing make for some creations. It can be fun and educational to try different antennas with the idea that none are permanent.
Logged
Pages: [1] 2   Go Up