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Author Topic: Planning for Mutual Aid  (Read 762 times)

KG7LEA

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Planning for Mutual Aid
« on: June 23, 2022, 09:16:54 AM »

It has been some years since the subject of mutual aid in the event of a disaster has been discussed here. I have been investigating the plans by various volunteer communications groups, ARES, ACS, etc., for deploying operators out of their home areas. I have seen some impressive plans for recruiting, organizing, equipping, and training volunteers who can be sent as teams to requesting communities to fill gaps after a communications emergency. Although it is less and less likely that public service systems will fail, there are likely to be additional needs for communications such as between shelters and feeding centers and other NGOs. ARRL/ARES has floated a concept of Mutual Aid Teams, but this does not seem to have gotten past a proposal. But one size does not fit all so it is difficult to establish a national structure for mutual aid. State emergency managers rely on the Interstate Mutual Aid Compact to request and provide additional resources including volunteer communicators.

It occurs to me that rather than building up teams which, when deployed, only get broken up by the served agencies, why not plan to receive individual volunteers such as is done with public service events. When a marathon or back-country run comes up, the word goes out and the organizers put together a plan. Year to year these plans are recycled with new people. The same can be done, to the extent possible with a draft activation plan by an ARES or RACES group.

There could be a template where a served agency can put out the word and qualified volunteers show up. It would be up to the served agency to vet volunteers rather than an outside agency, to receive the volunteers, assign and manage them, provide accountability, and plan for demobilization. It should also be up to the served agency to provide logistical support for the volunteers. This business of "be self sufficient for three days" is laudable, but will exclude much qualified talent. Three days is basically a pickup load. The served agencies should do better than that.

It may not be necessary for each volunteer to provide a full VHF/UHF/HF station. There is usually plenty of equipment. I find it laughable when I go to an event each ham sets up his or her own station right next to another fully functional station or two.

Have any groups made plans to receive individual volunteers?
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K1VSK

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Re: Planning for Mutual Aid
« Reply #1 on: June 23, 2022, 09:37:35 AM »

Having some experience professionally in emergency response, no one trusts volunteers and less so for unknown volunteers. Ham radio is essentially a hobby and can often hinder rather than help, require more oversight and supervision than it’s worth and isn’t dependable when and if actually needed.

I understand new hams enter the hobby with a sense that EMCON is real. The marketing is effective albeit misleading.
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WA3SKN

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Re: Planning for Mutual Aid
« Reply #2 on: June 23, 2022, 10:11:52 AM »

Its not what the Gov. agencys want.

-Mike.
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KG7LEA

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Re: Planning for Mutual Aid
« Reply #3 on: June 23, 2022, 10:13:15 AM »

Its not what the Gov. agencys want.

What about NGOs? Neighborhood CERT teams? ARES is organized to support them too.
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K1VSK

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Re: Planning for Mutual Aid
« Reply #4 on: June 23, 2022, 10:37:30 AM »

Its not what the Gov. agencys want.

What about NGOs? Neighborhood CERT teams? ARES is organized to support them too.

Typical of most if not all CERTs, ours communicates directly with the local EMS. Completely unrelated to anything ham radio.
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W9IQ

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Re: Planning for Mutual Aid
« Reply #5 on: June 23, 2022, 10:40:46 AM »

Having some experience professionally in emergency response, no one trusts volunteers and less so for unknown volunteers.

Try asserting that at a volunteer fire station.

Its not what the Gov. agencys want. [sic]

Sure they do. I have personally been involved in MOUs, drills, and station installations with County Emergency Government EOCs, hospitals, Sheriff departments, police departments, Red Cross and airports.

- Glenn W9IQ
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- Glenn W9IQ

God runs electromagnetics on Monday, Wednesday and Friday by the wave theory and the devil runs it on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday by the Quantum theory.

K1VSK

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Re: Planning for Mutual Aid
« Reply #6 on: June 23, 2022, 12:57:37 PM »

Having some experience professionally in emergency response, no one trusts volunteers and less so for unknown volunteers.

Try asserting that at a volunteer fire station.



They know and trust each other. That trust is usually earned, not assumed by donning a yellow vest with some obscure label stuck on it.
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W9IQ

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Re: Planning for Mutual Aid
« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2022, 01:29:59 PM »

Having some experience professionally in emergency response, no one trusts volunteers and less so for unknown volunteers.

Try asserting that at a volunteer fire station.



They know and trust each other. That trust is usually earned, not assumed by donning a yellow vest with some obscure label stuck on it.

Sure and that is why we drill with the served agencies and they credential us as needed per their EOP. Yet we are volunteers but still highly valued and respected even with our requisite personal protective equipment.

- Glenn W9IQ
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- Glenn W9IQ

God runs electromagnetics on Monday, Wednesday and Friday by the wave theory and the devil runs it on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday by the Quantum theory.

K1VSK

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Re: Planning for Mutual Aid
« Reply #8 on: June 23, 2022, 04:05:20 PM »

Having some experience professionally in emergency response, no one trusts volunteers and less so for unknown volunteers.

Try asserting that at a volunteer fire station.



They know and trust each other. That trust is usually earned, not assumed by donning a yellow vest with some obscure label stuck on it.

Sure and that is why we drill with the served agencies and they credential us as needed per their EOP. Yet we are volunteers but still highly valued and respected even with our requisite personal protective equipment.

- Glenn W9IQ

We are discussing outside volunteers:

“It occurs to me that rather than building up teams which, when deployed, only get broken up by the served agencies, why not plan to receive individual volunteers…”

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W9IQ

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Re: Planning for Mutual Aid
« Reply #9 on: June 23, 2022, 04:17:28 PM »

Having some experience professionally in emergency response, no one trusts volunteers and less so for unknown volunteers.

Try asserting that at a volunteer fire station.



They know and trust each other. That trust is usually earned, not assumed by donning a yellow vest with some obscure label stuck on it.

Sure and that is why we drill with the served agencies and they credential us as needed per their EOP. Yet we are volunteers but still highly valued and respected even with our requisite personal protective equipment.

- Glenn W9IQ

We are discussing outside volunteers:

“It occurs to me that rather than building up teams which, when deployed, only get broken up by the served agencies, why not plan to receive individual volunteers…”

That is generally where NIMS training and certification applies. This is the same structure that allows other "outside" agencies to interoperate. NIMS certification is required for all ARES leaders, for example.

Do you have any NIMS certificates? Do you even know under what part of the ICS command structure the amateur radio operators would typically serve? You can at least Google the latter.

- Glenn W9IQ
« Last Edit: June 23, 2022, 04:33:42 PM by W9IQ »
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- Glenn W9IQ

God runs electromagnetics on Monday, Wednesday and Friday by the wave theory and the devil runs it on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday by the Quantum theory.

KG7LEA

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Re: Planning for Mutual Aid
« Reply #10 on: June 23, 2022, 05:24:00 PM »

Begin quote
Do you have any NIMS certificates? Do you even know under what part of the ICS command structure the amateur radio operators would typically serve? You can at least Google the latter.

- Glenn W9IQ


This would be a requirement imposed by the receiving agency. The callout would include that in addition to license level and equipment.

For example, and existing group is supporting CERTs and shelters rather than the local EM agency. The operators are stretched thin. They only need a few more radios, they need more operators.

I am suggesting that the planning be directed to that end vs. shipping a team in that will get broken up.

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W9FIB

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Re: Planning for Mutual Aid
« Reply #11 on: June 24, 2022, 04:42:08 AM »

I find that in a real emergency, the agency is best served if they can count on the volunteers to do anything. Playing radio is only 1 small part of what is usually needed. However, if back up communications are needed, there is the capability to handle it if properly trained in federal, state, and local procedures. However, the need may include doing something else.

A true volunteer is one willing to help those who need help. Stepping up to the plate and doing what is needed, and not grumbling or refusing because you think it is below your status in some self-perceived form of elitism.

The comment of fire departments needing to know each other to work together is also incorrect. As a 25-year volunteer fireman, when you have a big fire beyond what your department can handle, you call in departments from surrounding communities. Do you know them? Not really, just as they don't know you. Yet we have a mutual respect for each other's capabilities. And quickly form a bond to fight the fire and not worry if I know the person's name or not.
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73, Stan
Travelling the world one signal at a time.

K4PIH

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Re: Planning for Mutual Aid
« Reply #12 on: June 24, 2022, 05:07:02 AM »

Comparing volunteer firemen/people to EMCOM is apples and oranges. As a volunteer firefighter just a few years back, I don't remember any volunteer firefighters
showing up with a belt full of cheap Chinese radios and cell phones. I was issued a radio from the department I served. EMCOM on the other hand thrives on
whackers. the ARRL has done a great job of selling EMCOM as the gateway to amateur radio.
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KG7LEA

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Re: Planning for Mutual Aid
« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2022, 06:26:43 AM »

The comment of fire departments needing to know each other to work together is also incorrect. As a 25-year volunteer fireman, when you have a big fire beyond what your department can handle, you call in departments from surrounding communities. Do you know them? Not really, just as they don't know you. Yet we have a mutual respect for each other's capabilities. And quickly form a bond to fight the fire and not worry if I know the person's name or not.
In such responses are the firefighters deployed as teams or broken up and distributed as needed? Do they arrive as teams?
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K1VSK

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Re: Planning for Mutual Aid
« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2022, 07:15:03 AM »



Do you have any NIMS certificates? Do you even know under what part of the ICS command structure the amateur radio operators would typically serve? You can at least Google the latter.

- Glenn W9IQ

As I know. As I clearly stated, my professional background includes experience in emergency response. I was part of the team which developed the ICS.  Try being less condescending and understand what I wrote.
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