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Author Topic: Differences on 10M?  (Read 922 times)

KD0VE

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Differences on 10M?
« on: October 11, 2022, 04:59:46 PM »

I've been a ham for 8 years.  Only very recently has 10M been open like it sometimes is now and I have been working the new to me band.

Over the last several years I have worked much of the world on 20 and 40M using about 500 watts when needed.  Only very rarely have I wished for more.  Antennas are a hexbeam at 40',a 40M 2 element monobander at 75', and an Inv V OCF dipole with apex at 70'.  Amp is ALS-600 with the 10M mod.

15M also improved a lot recently and hexbeam works fine; same as previous experiences with 20M.

When working 10M I consistently have difficulty being heard even with the amp. Hexbeam 10M SWR is below 1.2 and I can hear fine with it.  Also tried tuning up OCF Dipole on 10M just for a comparison and have the same problem.

Looking for comments, maybe this is typical.  I do have a 1500w. amp but it's not even connected as I have found the 500w. amp to be adequate the vast majority of the time.

thx to anyone taking the time to offer advice.

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W1VT

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Re: Differences on 10M?
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2022, 05:05:35 PM »

https://www.voacap.com/hf/
Run VOACAP coverage area maps for the stations you have difficulty working.  Who has the best path to the DX?
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WA2VUY

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Re: Differences on 10M?
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2022, 07:49:05 PM »

Use this:
https://prop.kc2g.com/
I suspect that 10m just hasn't opened that great to MN yet (at least in EU direction). Here in NJ it has been fantastic lately. Even working HS, JA; countless EU qrp stations.
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K6AER

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Re: Differences on 10M?
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2022, 07:50:45 PM »

Difference in S meter readings is probably due to the other hams having a much higher noise levels.

I call CQ with the amplifier off and 50% of the time, no answerer. Turn on the amplifier and get a call right away. Also, many urban hams have very high noise levels. I am out in the high desert and my noise level is S0.
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KA2DDX

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Re: Differences on 10M?
« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2022, 05:42:50 AM »

good comments from all -

However........... are you sure you are receiving ok? I've never owned an amp and presently make contacts on 10m with cw or ft8 running under 100 wts into a ground plane or dipole up 35ft - 10m is smoking hot these days. You appear to have good antennas. I can't help but wonder if you are not hearing stations calling you.

Just my 2 cents.........

Larry ka2ddx
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W1VT

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Re: Differences on 10M?
« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2022, 06:30:56 AM »

The mode makes a difference.  Even running split, most OPs have difficulty pulling weak voice stations out of a huge pileup.
Pulling weaker stations out of the pile is easier on CW and FT8.

It is also harder to work DX on the upside of the cycle.  As "new" countries come on "everyone" needs it, so the pileups can be fierce.
Even common stuff may suddenly be rare due to the lack of activity for years on a particular band/mode.

Zak W1VT
« Last Edit: October 12, 2022, 06:36:27 AM by W1VT »
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KA2DDX

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Re: Differences on 10M?
« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2022, 06:32:42 AM »

monitor 28.200 for a period of time - see which cw beacons you hear...... This may help give you an idea of your receive capabilities...........

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KE6SLS

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Re: Differences on 10M?
« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2022, 10:35:52 AM »

monitor 28.200 for a period of time - see which cw beacons you hear...... This may help give you an idea of your receive capabilities...........

More specifically, SCAN the band between 28.200-28.300, note call (all cw) and qrz them.  Texas is daily here, but I am hearing very well to east.  If you don't know cw, use FLDigi to do the slow decode for you.  You can also set fldigi up to look up the decoded calls and save a step.

My hex is kicking but and I've been doing my qso's at 100w.

Have FUN!

73
j
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WW6L

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Re: Differences on 10M?
« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2022, 12:36:12 PM »

Here from the west coast, 10m has been very good into the Caribbean.
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K0UA

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Re: Differences on 10M?
« Reply #9 on: October 12, 2022, 01:38:42 PM »

Get on 28.074 FT8 and call CQ. Then go to the PSK reporter and see how many stations have heard you, and where they are and how well they have heard you. You will then know how well you are "getting out". You can try this with 5 watts at first, the go to 100 watts which in general your reports should be about 13 dB better than the 5 watts, and then put on your 500 watt amp and gain another 7 dB or so. You will soon know.  you can also look at other nearby stations and get an idea how well they are hearing and how well they are being heard. You can judge by this.
https://pskreporter.info/pskmap


If you are not on FT8 you can also get an idea by using CW on the reverse beacon network. Simply call CQ in about the first 60 khz of the band a couple of times and go check on the website and see how many of the skimmers have heard you and where they are and how well they have heard you. You will be amazed.
\
https://www.reversebeacon.net/

You will also be able to see how others are being heard.

Also WSPR is another method of guaging your transmitting ability.  Of course WSPR is included in the WSJT-x suit of programs including FT8.  Again go to the WSPR website to get an idea of how well you are "getting out".  Start with about 1 watt and go up from there.

https://www.wsprnet.org/drupal/

If you need help understanding any of these services or modes and how to utilize these services, just contact me via email or PM me here and we can discuss it on the phone or email.
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73  James K0UA

KD0VE

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Re: Differences on 10M?
« Reply #10 on: October 13, 2022, 05:20:45 AM »

EVeryone, thx for the advice.  I haven't used the reverse beacon network before but now I will.  Always learning something new with this hobby.

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K0UA

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Re: Differences on 10M?
« Reply #11 on: October 13, 2022, 05:52:52 AM »

EVeryone, thx for the advice.  I haven't used the reverse beacon network before but now I will.  Always learning something new with this hobby.

Yes the RBN is the easiest because it doesn't require any infastructure at all. You can literally hand key in the CQ or I use CQ TEST to try to keep people from answering me for a QSO, although some will ask "what conTEST?"

One other little trick to get new reports when you are for instance trying to compare two antennas or you just want another immediate report is to change frequencies between the sessions. This will make the skimmers report you again right away. Of course propagation (QSB) will change dynamically second by second so you have to look for "trends" not absolute values of the signal report (given by how many dB above their noise floor).  In any case the RBN is a lot of fun to play with and is something you can do immediately as all it requires is a CW key.  And not even that if you have CW memories in a modern transceiver. Just press the button to send a string of a couple of CQ TEST and you callsign a couple of times. Also by changing frequencies you can keep track of what antenna you tested on what frequency as you view the tabular reports. Have fun.
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73  James K0UA

WB0DZX

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Re: Differences on 10M?
« Reply #12 on: October 13, 2022, 01:56:28 PM »

Like in billiards, with many balls (i.e. the ionosphere) on the table, paths are often not reciprocal enough to accomplish contact. That is why off the back of the beam contacts are made.
   
As well as the overall antenna pattern, multi-path and lobes factor in, too. The other stations may be running much more power and/or gain than you, making the effort lopsided.
   
All good suggestions to follow!
   
Mike WBØDZX
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KD6VXI

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Re: Differences on 10M?
« Reply #13 on: November 07, 2022, 06:32:54 AM »


It is also harder to work DX on the upside of the cycle.  As "new" countries come on "everyone" needs it, so the pileups can be fierce.
Even common stuff may suddenly be rare due to the lack of activity for years on a particular band/mode.

Zak W1VT

Tell me about it.  I thought it was going to be easy peasy when I moved to the Caribbean.

Pileups are easy.  Getting operators to actually follow along and play by the rules one sets up for working a pileup, not so much.

I think everyone should have to go somewhere rare and see just how bad most non-dx operators are. 

"I'm only working .eu.  CQ Europe, CQ Europe  WP2ASS calling CQ Europe..  QRZed"....

Never fails to get me a ton of Americans, a couple Central Americans.  South American's tend to be the best in following along.   Just not enough African stations to make a judgement....  And most of them are DX as well so....


--Shane
WP2ASS / ex KD6VXI
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W4KYR

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Re: Differences on 10M?
« Reply #14 on: November 07, 2022, 04:07:58 PM »


 You might want to try to get into the 29.620 repeater out of Wurtsburo, New York.  Their call is KQ2H. The Offset is -0.100 MHz  and the tone is 146.2.

 That repeater has phenomenal coverage now. I was watching the DX Commander in the U.K. access that repeater on one his recent videos. 

 More info here https://www.repeaterbook.com/repeaters/details.php?ID=236&state_id=36
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