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Author Topic: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?  (Read 404 times)

K7JQ

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Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« on: November 29, 2022, 10:46:48 AM »

I realize that "Assisted/Unlimited" in contests is a separate category to even the playing field for those who participate in using spotting networks. But my question has to do with actual contesting *skills*, not whether or not it's a valid competition category.

I've used spotting networks periodically in contests for many years, but recently got disenchanted and bored by pointing-and-clicking blindly on spots when in Search and Pounce mode. Yes, you still have to listen and confirm that the spot is a valid one, but to me it takes away the skill of manual tuning to see if a station is new (or already worked) by actually decoding the CW or listening to phonetics without the "crutch" of seeing the spot first.

Today's contest logging programs are already so sophisticated for efficiency that they already almost automatically do everything for you. They even have the ability to download Call History files that inject the exchange in the entry window (although you still have to monitor for changes). Adding the ability to click on a spot means you don't even have to type the call sign in the entry window.

Computer logging is a great, efficient alternative to paper logging...no question there. But IMO, competitive S&P contesting *skill* is the ability to find stations *on your own* through the QRM, successfully log (type) the call sign and exchange, and move on manually to the next one. The skill in running (CQing) is the ability to listen and handle multiple stations calling you, and pick them out one by one to log. To me, that's the skill of competition.

This post is not meant to demean those who like and participate in assisted contesting. Everyone has their reasons. My main reason for using it was to rapidly increase my QSO rate, hopefully resulting in a larger final score to contribute points to my contest club's overall score. Now I'm having more fun and competitive satisfaction by going Unassisted. Of course, YMMV ;).

Bob K7JQ

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K1VSK

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Re: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« Reply #1 on: November 29, 2022, 11:39:17 AM »

We both did contesting as have many others while as “rock bound” Novices, a term some of our present day  contesters might not even understand.

It’s much easier now. Today, it’s more a contest of who can sit in a chair the longest.
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K7JQ

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Re: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« Reply #2 on: November 29, 2022, 11:52:04 AM »

We both did contesting as have many others while as “rock bound” Novices, a term some of our present day  contesters might not even understand.

It’s much easier now. Today, it’s more a contest of who can sit in a chair the longest.

Ah yes...my Heathkit DX-40. Until I got the VF-1 VFO...the "Drift-Master". Start out on 20M, then about a hour later you're on 10M. Without moving the bandswitch (well, not that bad, but you get my "drift") ;D.

Now at 77, my BIC (Butt In Chair) ability ain't. what it used to be. And I need my sleep ::).
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KG4RUL

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Re: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2022, 12:00:12 PM »

The net step will be an AI on the computer that selects contacts for your awards, ATNO, etc. from the spotting networks, aims your beam, sets the radio frequency, tunes up your amplifier and completes the digital contact with the other stations computer.  A quick upload to LOTW and you've put another notch in your belt.  No human contact required!  :o
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W0CKI

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Re: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« Reply #4 on: November 29, 2022, 12:03:01 PM »

I couldn't resist. Butt in chair, doesn't work for me much longer than 2 hours anymore. I also played radio when Xtal control ruled for us novices and even as generals that were $ limited.
It's still fun though, especially CW.
Gary W0CKI
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N2SR

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Re: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« Reply #5 on: November 29, 2022, 12:14:02 PM »

It’s much easier now. Today, it’s more a contest of who can sit in a chair the longest.

Anyone can sit in a chair for 48 hours. 

Let us know when you can do 2BISQ at over 300+/hour for hours at a time.   
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K7JQ

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Re: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« Reply #6 on: November 29, 2022, 12:39:59 PM »

 
Let us know when you can do 2BISQ at over 300+/hour for hours at a time.

Not me ;). My club members, N6MJ and N2IC are machines. 300+/hour for "hours at a time" is really pushing it. But mid-200's is doable for hours at a time...still amazing. Check out CQWW CW for ZF1A on 3830.
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N8NK

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Re: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2022, 01:01:53 PM »

Ahhh, yes. Boys-
And yet- when the smoke has cleared, the station shut down, and nothing left but the angry bees in your head...
You ask yourself: "Was it that fun this time around? Seems like it used to be a lot more fun, and I don't know why.. there are more ops than ever...."
Case in point: Field Day by 'The Leage' (that enitity taksed with opening 10 meters as they see fit, and as dues increases allow. But I digress).
Blowzo the Humble Ham (found on the screw toobs by spirit and content, not by name, so as to protect the idiot (me))
Chuck, N8NK
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K1VSK

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Re: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2022, 01:04:34 PM »

It’s much easier now. Today, it’s more a contest of who can sit in a chair the longest.

Anyone can sit in a chair for 48 hours. 

Let us know when you can do 2BISQ at over 300+/hour for hours at a time.

I have neither the patience or interest. But my chair is very comfortable
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KH6AQ

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Re: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« Reply #9 on: November 29, 2022, 01:29:03 PM »

I contest unassisted 90% of the time as I too want to build my manual multiplier search skills and sometimes I just don't care much about multipliers. I must admit it is fun to click the bandmap for mults, work them quickly and get back to running. Where I do operate assisted (unlimited) is in contests where there aren't separate categories for assisted and unassisted.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2022, 01:33:54 PM by KH6AQ »
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K7JQ

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Re: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« Reply #10 on: November 29, 2022, 01:39:12 PM »


Anyone can sit in a chair for 48 hours. 


That's the full duration of a major contest...straight through non-stop. A herculean effort, but yes, it has been done many times. Not so sure if "anyone" can do it ;). The most I ever did was 32 hours.

By the way, you had quite a nice performance this past weekend in 35 hours. Congrats!
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K7JQ

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Re: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« Reply #11 on: November 29, 2022, 01:54:39 PM »


I must admit it is fun to click the bandmap for mults, work them quickly and get back to running.


My ability to run, especially in DX contests, is *very* limited, as I live in the continental 48 in an HOA using a stealth ground-mounted screwdriver antenna ;). So S&P is mainstream for me, and point-and-click on a Q/Mult bandmap is like shooting fish in a barrel. IMO, no skill in that. 
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NI0C

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Re: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« Reply #12 on: November 30, 2022, 02:31:27 AM »

Quote
I'm having more fun and competitive satisfaction by going Unassisted.
My sentiments exactly, Bob. Perhaps "dumbed down"is too harsh for describing assisted contesting, but it certainly is a different game.
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K3TN

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Re: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« Reply #13 on: November 30, 2022, 03:43:49 AM »

Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting? - I'd say, no - it is just another technology advance that allows the really skilled ops to do a lot better and still beat the lesser skilled ops in the assisted category.

Now, if you had asked "Has "the globally interconnected packet spotting system and the Reverse Beacon Network" dumbed-down DXing and if so has that dumbed down contesting in any way" I'd say yes, definitely.

Poor operating in pileups has been complained about at least as long as I've been licensed (1969) and really for many decades before that. But, when individual packetclusters began to be interconnected over the Internet and when general purpose logging software integrated spotting, it seemed to quickly get exponentially worse.

The Reverse Beacon Network showed an immediate negative impact: skimmers don't report if a station is working split, so when "DX P5ABC 7.007" comes out, hundreds start calling on 7.007 and the pileup police startup, and the downward spiral starts up.

Contest pileups are much thinner than rare one DX pileups, and there is almost no split operation, but when human spotters and skimmers make mistakes, a busted spot leads to many callers causing a dupe deluge on poor SP5ABC, who they already worked!

You could have also asked "What has really dumbed down contesting?" and my answer would be history files - ops are using autofiill on name, state, CK, PREC, etc and not even listening to what is actually being sent.

I live in Maryland and have for many years, but a few years ago I started remote opping a station in VA. In contests where MD is the exchange, 30% of stations logged me in MD even though I was sending VA, when the norm was less than 10% busting the exchange if I was in MD and sending MD.

Looking at those calls who obviously were using history files and not overriding them with actual copying, I never saw the callsign of anyone who finished in the top ten in any category. The great contest ops are using the technology skillfully vs. in a dumbed down manner!

73 John K3TN
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John K3TN

KH6AQ

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Re: Has "Assisted" dumbed-down contesting?
« Reply #14 on: November 30, 2022, 07:03:25 AM »

Whether to run unassisted or unassisted (unlimited) gets complicated and here are just a few considerations.

Are you just out for fun or are you out to win? (what is your definition of "fun").
Do you want to place as high as possible in your category? (sometimes unassisted is more competitive)
How did the unassisted and assisted scores turn out last year (and the years before that)?
Do the contest rules drive one to compete assisted? (The IARU drives me to assisted).
Is it a multiplier driven contest? (I use assisted mainly for multipliers).
Do you want to build your mult searching skills?
How do you feel about assisted? (my preference is to see my call sign under "unassisted").

Looking at the 2022 ARRL DX CW contest the unassisted ops generally garnered better scores than the unlimited ops.

I'm going through the process of deciding what category I'll work in 2023 ARRL DX CW contest; unassisted or assisted, single band or all band, and so on. I will agonize over this until the week before the contest when I set my decision in stone and begin to rev up into contest mode.

2022 ARRL DX CW results     https://contests.arrl.org/ContestResults/2022/DX-CW-2022-FinalFullResults.pdf
« Last Edit: November 30, 2022, 07:11:18 AM by KH6AQ »
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