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Author Topic: ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal  (Read 11742 times)

KE3HO

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« on: February 20, 2005, 04:33:23 AM »

<< Money appeared in my PayPal account so I shipped. Then when I went to withdraw the money, of course the radio was on its way, Pay Pal advised the money was fraudulent and I was out of lost. >>

<I was under the impression PayPal was a secure way to transfer funds. How did they credit your account before they verified the actual receipt of the funds?>

The only thing secure about PayPal is that PayPal never looses anything. You, on the other hand, have everything to loose by dealing with them. If you receive funds from someone via PayPal, the person sending you the money can take the money back at any time by simply saing there was some fraud involved. They can say that you did not deliver the goods as promised, or that the goods were damaged, or almost any other BS. PayPal will immediately remove the money from your account. The buyer can even wait months and still claim fraud, and PayPal will take the money out of your account months after the original transaction. You have no recourse with them. They are GOD. They giveth, and the taketh away. I opened a PayPal account a few years ago when I started buying stuff on ebay. I read all sorts of horor stories about PayPal deals gone bad, and promptly closed my PayPal account. I won't have anything to do with PayPal. You take a far greater risk of loosing your money with them just for the instant transaction. The reverse transaction to take the money back is just as instant. And when they do take it back, you have virtually no chance of ever getting it back.
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WB2IVU

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« Reply #1 on: December 23, 2004, 02:28:24 PM »

Give me cash! Cash talks, "let's make a deal".. If I know the person...  I'll take a US postal money order.
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WILLY

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« Reply #2 on: December 24, 2004, 12:49:06 PM »

 by N5QWA on November 5, 2004     

"...
He asked me if I'd ship overseas to which I agreed IF he paid first via PayPal. He agreed, paid top dollar plus shipping. Money appeared in my PayPal account so I shipped. Then when I went to withdraw the money, of course the radio was on its way, Pay Pal advised the money was fraudulent and I was out of lost. "


It would be most interesting to learn the rest of the story regarding PalPal.

How did they learn it was "fraudulent" and exactly what did they mean by that?

If it was "fraudulent", then what was PayPal's explanation to you for their action in sending you a confirming email, and thus leading you to believe that you had control of the money.   You did ask them to explain why they did that, didn't you?
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WILLY

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« Reply #3 on: December 24, 2004, 12:56:27 PM »

 by WS2E on November 11, 2004     

"...
Last dec sold a non ham item on ebay for ($1200) person paid via paypal, I transfered funds to my account, he picked up the item in person. Then reversed the charges on his charge card. "

I'm under the impression that to dispute a charge on a credit card, the card holder must provide some reason(s), and also must claim that he has communicated with the merchant and cannot come to an agreement.

So, what reasons did the card holder give for disputing the charge?  

And did he claim that he had tried to work it out with you, and if so, was it a true or false claim?


Also, if he picked it up in person, is it fair to assume that he lived within a reasonable driving distance?  
If so, that means that you can visit him and simply ask for your property back, or have the cops come with you to his house when you tell them he has something of yours for which he has not paid.   Have you done this?
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N3ZKP

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2004, 08:56:17 PM »

Unless you personally know the buyer, NEVER, EVER, ship anything until you actually have the cash money in your hand or in your bank. If it takes two weeks for a check to clear, any kind of check, wait the two weeks before shipping.

just common sense ...
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WA4MJF

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2004, 02:42:35 PM »

Err, a Cashiers Check is a check drawn
on the bank.  You give the bank the
money and a fee and they give you a check
for the amount.  If your bank is not
solvent enough to be guaranteed to
clear a check of their own, I would
NOT deal with them!

73 de Ronnie
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N5QWA

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« Reply #6 on: November 05, 2004, 06:02:53 PM »

Just found this forum and thought I'd warn fellow hams of this scheme.  I had sold this rig through Ebay to an overseas customer.  I had very good experience with every EBay deal in the past.  He asked me if I'd ship overseas to which I agreed IF he paid first via PayPal.  He agreed, paid top dollar plus shipping.  Money appeared in my PayPal account so I shipped.  Then when I went to withdraw the money, of course the radio was on its way, Pay Pal advised the money was fraudulent and I was out of lost.  I tried immediately to recall the package at the Post Office, but they were absolutely useless.  In the end, he even emailed me and apologized saying he had SARS and was unable to pay or return the radio.

The small print in Pay Pal / EBay says many foreign countries are at your own risk and prohibited...no recourse there either.

So I lost the radio plus about $100 for postage...total value about $400...

Terry
N5QWA
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N3ZKP

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2004, 04:31:29 PM »

<< Money appeared in my PayPal account so I shipped. Then when I went to withdraw the money, of course the radio was on its way, Pay Pal advised the money was fraudulent and I was out of lost. >>

I was under the impression PayPal was a secure way to transfer funds. How did they credit your account before they verified the actual receipt of the funds?

Sounds like they have some explaining to do, If I correctly understand how they are supposed to work.
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WS2E

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2004, 07:00:19 PM »

Last dec sold a non ham  item on ebay for  ($1200) person paid via paypal,  I transfered funds to my account, he picked up the item in person.  Then reversed the charges on his charge card.  PAYPAL informed me that any purchases through them can be reversed up to 6 months.  If they transfer money to your account and you withdraw they will get the money back from your bank and you will be overdrawn, and still responsible for the money.  If you ship the item you might have some recourse through paypal but if it picked up it's your loss.  Another wonderful scam.  After finding this out the hard way, I WILL NEVER ACCEPT ANY PAYMENTS VIA PAYPAL EVER!  I only use it to make payments.  
ALSO BE WARE!!!  According to my bank, which isn't a little one, CASHIERS CHECKS STILL NEED UP TO 10 DAYS TO CLEAR!!  All that a cashiers check proves is that the money was available in the checking account when the check was issued,  doesn't mean it's good when you get it.  
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KG6PTK

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« Reply #9 on: February 24, 2005, 09:41:13 PM »

I know this is an old post, but I had a similar situation on a much smaller item.  My solution was to get the Paypal Debit Card.  Once the money is credited, I go to an ATM and withdraw it.  Sure it cost's me and additional 1.50 on top of the Paypal fees, but If I have cash in hand, the crooks have no recourse.  Once I have all the cash, then I ship.

Just my .02 worth.

Andy
KG6PTK
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N5JYZ

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2005, 03:09:32 AM »

What you do is the moment the money goes into PayPal have it electronically moved to your checking account. PayPal can't take it back out of your checking account without you starting the transaction I believe.
Bob
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KB0VIY

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2005, 02:57:04 AM »

I work in law enforcement and was reading these posts. Currently, the latest fad (rip-off) is you will get an e-mail from someone wanting to purchase your item. They will pay top dollar and give you a story that where they live (normally overseas), You can't get the item you're selling. Anyway, they send you a cashiers check for the amount plus an extra amount so you arrange shipping. You put the check in your bank, wait a couple of weeks, you haven't heard anything, so you send the item. Sometimes, the check will be for an amount even more than the shipping, in which the purchaser advises for you to just send the extra back to them. Anyway, time goes by, the check is found to be fraud due to that the check coming from an overseas bank, presumably takes longer to clear. By the time you find out, your item is gone, you paid for it to be gone, and typically, your own account may be overdrawn due to the check being pulled back out of you usable balance. The FBI is getting numerous calls everyday from all across the country in which millions of dollars of fraud is taking place. I have heard of cars, electronics, about anythng you can imagine, be taken in this way. Unfortunately, with it occuring overseas, law enforcement have hardly any recourse to prosecute. Internet selling has got to be very dangerous and I would advise everyone to seriously consider any sales you make to outside the CONUS. And don't trust wiring money as well. A scam has been working with that as well. I don't know all the ins of that yet.

73
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N1GXC

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« Reply #12 on: March 24, 2005, 05:41:09 AM »

That's what I do... I set up a debit card account with my bank for free. I leave about $20 in there. When someone pays for an item via PayPal I transfer the money to another account as soon as it's available. Then I ship. I suppose someday PayPal will come crying to me asking for the money back when some fool tries to scam me.

Dan
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NE7L

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« Reply #13 on: May 25, 2005, 01:16:07 PM »

both ways (ATM cash-out and another checking account) sound good, especially combined with CONUS shipping to verified paypal address which also the FCC address for buyer's callsign.

is there any way for PayPal to make you liable anyway? something like "you owe us money, we close your paypal account, here the collection coming" ...
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W4RUO

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ICOM 745 S/N 03503 Stolen Through EBay Bum Deal
« Reply #14 on: June 05, 2005, 01:04:03 PM »

JUst a thought; try Western Union next time.  It works.  They pay at the other end and you cash out at your end.  Never fails.  Even better than PO Money order.  
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