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eHam Forums => Company Reviews => Topic started by: N9FB on June 30, 2015, 09:25:21 PM

Title: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on June 30, 2015, 09:25:21 PM
so, in April it was announced that RKR designs had bought Ten-Tec and Alpha Amplifiers from RF Concepts...

Since about that time, the website has this info:

Quote from: http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/
Press Release
(April 2, 2015) RKR Designs, LLC of Longmont Colorado has announced that they have acquired the assets of Alpha Amplifier and TEN-TEC brands from RF Concepts. RKR plans to expand the product line, while continuing to service their customers that have enjoyed their products over the years.

The principals of RKR Designs are Richard Gall, Ken Long and Rich Danielson (Gall and Danielson of QSC Systems, Longmont, Colorado have been a successful contract manufacturer, for over 20 years). Ken Long, N0QO has over 20 years in the electronics and amateur radio industry. Long will be President and CEO of the new company. QSC has been building Alpha amplifiers for over 5 years. They have also been building boards for TEN-TEC since their purchase by RF Concepts last year. Mr. Long said “QSC has always been a fantastic contract manufacturer, and has the expertise and knowledge that will allow us to bring down costs, while increasing quality and reducing manufacturing times.”

When asked for comment, Michael Seedman, AA6DY said “I can’t think of a more capable group of people to take over the 45 year Alpha Amplifier/TEN-TEC legacy. Ken Long has been involved with the industry for years, and has a great feeling for products and operations. He has the manufacturing and engineering resources available to deliver quality products that our customers demand”. Mr. Seedman went on to say “Alpha and TEN-TEC have always had a warm spot in my heart, and I am thrilled that RKR Designs will be able to continue the operations of the business. I wish them the best”.

Ken, Richard and Rich have been working very close over the past several years and feel that this new relationship will benefit the company and customers moving forward. This closer relationship to the contract manufacturer will allow a more consistent process and delivery of quality products along with significant cost benefits.

RKR Designs LLC is privately held, and terms of the acquisition were not disclosed.

Anyone out there heard any updates on where the Ten-Tec line is headed?  Will there be an Orion 3, an Omni VIII and/or maybe an ArgoVI/Eagle hybrid in the future?  I'd love to see them come out with a Pegasus II as an affordable quality option for the low budget ham...  Will they retain the Ten-Tec name(s) and location or might that all change?  I suppose it is only speculation until there is an official announcement; but if July is the start of a new fiscal year, perhaps the future is starting to be put into place...?

I did read recently on QRZ read that John Henry had taken a position working for Ham Radio Deluxe ...
http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?485075-The-Ham-Radio-Deluxe-Team-is-Growing-Again! (http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?485075-The-Ham-Radio-Deluxe-Team-is-Growing-Again!)

The Ten-Tec fans I have come across who happen to know the new owners are expecting great things; i guess we will all have to stay tuned.


Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on July 01, 2015, 04:08:10 AM
I am concerned. TenTec the last few years seems to be getting its rear-end kicked by Elecraft. Elecraft has become the new American Radio cult company. They have been able to bring out new products FAST.

TenTec on the other hand has become slow to bring out new products, and lacks real innovation in higher end radios (yeah, I know the Rebel and Patriot are some innovation). Look at the Argo for example. Missing HF bands and no 6 meter! That is not innovation.

Several years ago I went to the TenTec booth at Dayton and asked them why their new Argo was missing bands and did not include 6 meters. I said why is it that Elecraft can do it, but not TenTec. The smart-a$$ed person working the booth said, "I don't know, you'll have to ask Elecraft." So I did. Elecraft's response was "we're just able to build a better product." OK, TenTec, got the answer.

BTW, I have only owned many TenTec radios and do not own a single Elecraft.

The only good thing recently is that TenTec has brought the price of the radios down to a realistic price. However, they kind of screwed the existing customer base by sharply devaluing what they purchased at the higher price point.

In summary, TenTec needs to recapture its lost leadership. Bring out new radios, bring out new products fast, be more innovative and keep products are reasonable prices. Losing John Henry though does not signal that happening any time soon.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KC8Y on July 01, 2015, 11:17:21 AM
I acquired the the TT-Argonaut VI (539) QRP transceiver in May, 2015; it's great!
NOT into high-power, only operate digital & CW modes.

RKR Design's service dept. operates fine &  is OK with me.

Ken KC8Y
 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W7AIT on July 04, 2015, 03:31:48 PM

I purchased a Ten Tec RX-340 and its the best receiver I ever owned.  Beats the TS-590 too which surprised me.  All this based on specs, bench testing and actual use.  Great for SWL and surprisingly, is an excellent performer in the ham bands as well.  One Hertz resolution and high intercept point. 

RKR is building many of these every month and its in full production;  many units sold to the commercial / government market and a few to hams/ SWL.  They also make a 1RU no knob version for listening server farms as well.  Has a very high MTBF of 20,000 hours also so failures are a thing of the past.  A superb receiver.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on July 25, 2015, 05:31:07 AM
Looks like RKR is having a

"Once in a Lifetime Inventory Reduction Sale" only on the

ALPHA 9500
&
TEN-TEC Eagle 599AT

some pretty awesome prices. 

http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/ (http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/)

i have heard some of the usual doomsday predictions, but i wonder if this instead signals that they are getting ready to begin some new products in their line-ups(?) 
An Eagle with auto-tuner and CW and SSB filters for just $1099 is imo pretty spectacular.

http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/products/transceivers-receivers/ten-tec-model-599at-eagle-transceiver-100-watts-if-dsp-with-tuner/ (http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/products/transceivers-receivers/ten-tec-model-599at-eagle-transceiver-100-watts-if-dsp-with-tuner/)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8VVE on July 29, 2015, 05:38:16 AM
The once in a lifetime inventory reduction sale is now over.
Sam W8VVE
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on July 29, 2015, 03:19:51 PM
I've read where the Eagle will back in production later this year... there was some concern that this signaled the end of the Eagle production... but hopefully it will be offered again soon. I am still hoping to see an Orion III on the horizon. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 03, 2015, 06:33:37 AM
I don't understand the thinking of the new owners. You have an inventory reduction sale to eliminate the inventory of the radio? Now there are no Eagles in stock? The Eagle is not currently in production? And to get to this you take another $400 off the price? Why would a company do such a thing?

The problem with their current pricing methodology is that now people will be afraid to purchase a radio at list because if they do, and TenTec or whatever they are calling the company now, discounts the radio steeply, the value of their radio on the used market plummets.

So it seems that all TT is left with now is the Omni, Argo, the Rebel and the Patriot. Not much of a leadership position now. It appears from this that Elecraft must be kicking their butts when it comes to the U.S. manufactured radio market.

Seems so sad to me and I have had a number of TT transceivers over the years.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on August 03, 2015, 10:08:46 AM
If the new ownership is making some changes to the lineup, wouldn't this be just the kind of thing they would do in order to free up labor to work on the new direction?  With the Eagle sales that have happened in the last year or so, everyone who wanted one and could afford one -- probably now has one...   
I guess we are just going to have to be patient and see what happens next...  I'm hoping for good things  :)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 03, 2015, 10:57:21 AM
I hoping for good things, but you can't sell a 1500 dollar radio for 1100 bucks, and then increase the price a few days later. Who in their right minds would pay more than the sale price?? 

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on August 03, 2015, 01:56:18 PM
Black Friday sales happen every year in retail, but people continue buying those products year round.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 03, 2015, 04:24:00 PM
I don't understand the thinking of the new owners. You have an inventory reduction sale to eliminate the inventory of the radio? Now there are no Eagles in stock? The Eagle is not currently in production? And to get to this you take another $400 off the price? Why would a company do such a thing?

Whats the mystery here? Its called quick cash for profit by liquidating equipment and when not building replacements none of sales money has to be used to reinvest. Large corporations do this ll the time with buyouts or mergers. They are not going to come out and say TenTec is going out of business until AFTER they sell everything. They are slowly bleeding it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on August 04, 2015, 05:05:05 PM
I don't understand the thinking of the new owners. You have an inventory reduction sale to eliminate the inventory of the radio? Now there are no Eagles in stock? The Eagle is not currently in production? And to get to this you take another $400 off the price? Why would a company do such a thing?

Whats the mystery here? Its called quick cash for profit by liquidating equipment and when not building replacements none of sales money has to be used to reinvest. Large corporations do this ll the time with buyouts or mergers. They are not going to come out and say TenTec is going out of business until AFTER they sell everything. They are slowly bleeding it.

Guys I hate to say it but JX is exactly right.  Who would buy a Ten Tec radio or an Alpha Amp at even those discounted prices if they said they were about to close the doors?  This is exactly what happens when companies are bought out. The new parent company sells off the inventory and liquidate the acquired companies assets. This Business model was perfected in the 1980's during the Reagan era.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KC8HXO on August 04, 2015, 07:06:05 PM
I have had 2 service experiences with TenTec over the last year. Unsatisfied, I bought an Elecraft. Likewise, I have had 2 experiences with their service department. Elecraft Service EXEMPLARY. Sorry, TenTec. Your service department is costing you sales. ..... I HOPE I am wrong, but I do believe I hear the fat lady warming up in Tennessee.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 05, 2015, 04:09:36 AM

Guys I hate to say it but JX is exactly right.  Who would buy a Ten Tec radio or an Alpha Amp at even those discounted prices if they said they were about to close the doors?  This is exactly what happens when companies are bought out. The new parent company sells off the inventory and liquidate the acquired companies assets. This Business model was perfected in the 1980's during the Reagan era.


Well if TenTec is using that so-called model perfected during the Reagan era, then I guess TenTec will be experiencing some unprecedented growth since that is what happened to business and jobs in the 1980s when the economy exploded with growth. Looking forward to seeing this happen with TenTec.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 05, 2015, 04:37:36 AM

Guys I hate to say it but JX is exactly right.  Who would buy a Ten Tec radio or an Alpha Amp at even those discounted prices if they said they were about to close the doors?  This is exactly what happens when companies are bought out. The new parent company sells off the inventory and liquidate the acquired companies assets. This Business model was perfected in the 1980's during the Reagan era.


Well if TenTec is using that so-called model perfected during the Reagan era, then I guess TenTec will be experiencing some unprecedented growth since that is what happened to business and jobs in the 1980s when the economy exploded with growth. Looking forward to seeing this happen with TenTec.

Reagan era job growth was at the expense of a lot of jobs in other areas. Reaganomics increased national debt over 30 fold in 8 years and laid ground work for future debt increases. (it was the begining of borrowing and spending money at a rate faster than nation could afford normally and let future politicians worry about how to pay it back and blame them for debt you their predecessors created) Social Security will go broke soon if not fixed because its surplus's, that were invested in past, Reagan used on the debt to mask effect of tax cuts and size of debt. No thought or concern was given to future impact on SS. The rich got richer and average person got by until bubble burst many years later. With TenTec the owners "tax cut" is selling of assets for quick profit and living with a unsustainable profit margin. They can get more money quietly liquidating than announcing it is closing its doors and having a fire sale. You will see more and more item disappear for tentec until there are defunct.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI8P on August 05, 2015, 06:47:59 AM

Guys I hate to say it but JX is exactly right.  Who would buy a Ten Tec radio or an Alpha Amp at even those discounted prices if they said they were about to close the doors?  This is exactly what happens when companies are bought out. The new parent company sells off the inventory and liquidate the acquired companies assets. This Business model was perfected in the 1980's during the Reagan era.


Well if TenTec is using that so-called model perfected during the Reagan era, then I guess TenTec will be experiencing some unprecedented growth since that is what happened to business and jobs in the 1980s when the economy exploded with growth. Looking forward to seeing this happen with TenTec.

Reagan era job growth was at the expense of a lot of jobs in other areas. Reaganomics increased national debt over 30 fold in 8 years and laid ground work for future debt increases. (it was the begining of borrowing and spending money at a rate faster than nation could afford normally and let future politicians worry about how to pay it back and blame them for debt you their predecessors created) Social Security will go broke soon if not fixed because its surplus's, that were invested in past, Reagan used on the debt to mask effect of tax cuts and size of debt. No thought or concern was given to future impact on SS. The rich got richer and average person got by until bubble burst many years later. With TenTec the owners "tax cut" is selling of assets for quick profit and living with a unsustainable profit margin. They can get more money quietly liquidating than announcing it is closing its doors and having a fire sale. You will see more and more item disappear for tentec until there are defunct.

I will add to that, the jobs that were created from the Regan era and since are service based jobs (think nail salons and tattoo parlors) while the good paying jobs in manufacturing started fleeing the country.  The difference between the two types of jobs are one pays well and typically either provides benefits or pays well enough the workers can afford them. The other one pays minimum wages with no benefits.  I think we all know which is which.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 05, 2015, 08:03:32 AM
I will add to that, the jobs that were created from the Regan era and since are service based jobs (think nail salons and tattoo parlors) while the good paying jobs in manufacturing started fleeing the country.  The difference between the two types of jobs are one pays well and typically either provides benefits or pays well enough the workers can afford them. The other one pays minimum wages with no benefits.  I think we all know which is which.

We saw the birth of "trickle down economics" or also known as Voodo Economics under Reagan (that later caused big recession). The philosophy here is that give massive breaks to wealthy and and hope they invest it to create low paying jobs in US and allow them to export jobs and get a tax break for it too. There are those that never want to see debt go away as they are making hundreds of billions of dollars off interest on it. The scary part is debt was a mere 160 billion when Reagan took office during which he increased to nearly 4 trillion (before using SS surplus) If debt had been paid down then and taxes not cut so money was not needed to borrow to run government we would have saved several trillion today in interest that could have gone to inter-structure. Until congress and get serious and raise taxes and cuts spending in some area well will only get in deeper. It is not possible to cut our way out of this debt but there are those that believe another tax cut for wealthy will fix everything. You know during the bubble burst and when market was flooded with houses in foreclosure available for bargain prices the GOP suggested that the wealthy should be allowed to buy them up (and at bargain prices to get them off market) AND pay no taxes on gains from it. It did not get far fortunately.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 07, 2015, 06:44:10 AM
One thing has been proven over and over again is that tax cuts boost the economy and tax income then goes up more to offset the cuts. That's what happened and why we had unprecedented economic growth under Reagan. However, when Congress sees greater income, they always want to spend it and hence why the debt mostly increased. The other thing causing spending increases is when politicians see a way to buy votes through various welfare programs. The more people on the government handout list, the more votes for people giving the handouts. Hence why spending skyrocketed during this administration and has now put the U.S. on the same course as Greece.

In spite of the comments, the reality is that trickle down economics works and works very well. We have never had that much growth in the economy since WWII ended. What we have now under the current regime is stagnation. The only way unemployment went down is that millions just gave up trying to find a job and thus the government no longer counts them as unemployed. Incomes are flat, house ownership is now at the lowest rate since the 60's, labor participation rate is the lowest since the 60's, debt has more than doubled with is unprecedented in history, healthcare insurance has doubled in cost, deductibles are way up, yet 30 million are still uninsured, and the majority of people in this country when surveyed say the country is on the wrong track. Most people know the truth. When things are that bad, you are not going to see real economic growth. I think even the stock market at this point is around zero growth for the year and that usually is a leading economic indicator that the economy might start tanking again. Proof once again that the Keynesian economics used by the current regime just don't work over the long term.

That being said, the possible fading away of TenTec has more to do with competition than tax selling by the new owners. The reality is that over the last ten years, TenTec has been slow to bring out new products and its domestic competitor Elecraft has been kicking their butts. Elecraft has become more nimble and fast at bringing products to market, while TenTec slowed to a crawl. In this day and age, technology is moving too fast and for companies who cannot keep up and change, they die and fade away. We might be seeing that with TenTec now.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI8P on August 07, 2015, 09:55:48 AM
One thing has been proven over and over again is that tax cuts boost the economy and tax income then goes up more to offset the cuts. That's what happened and why we had unprecedented economic growth under Reagan. However, when Congress sees greater income, they always want to spend it and hence why the debt mostly increased. The other thing causing spending increases is when politicians see a way to buy votes through various welfare programs. The more people on the government handout list, the more votes for people giving the handouts. Hence why spending skyrocketed during this administration and has now put the U.S. on the same course as Greece.

In spite of the comments, the reality is that trickle down economics works and works very well. We have never had that much growth in the economy since WWII ended. What we have now under the current regime is stagnation. The only way unemployment went down is that millions just gave up trying to find a job and thus the government no longer counts them as unemployed. Incomes are flat, house ownership is now at the lowest rate since the 60's, labor participation rate is the lowest since the 60's, debt has more than doubled with is unprecedented in history, healthcare insurance has doubled in cost, deductibles are way up, yet 30 million are still uninsured, and the majority of people in this country when surveyed say the country is on the wrong track. Most people know the truth. When things are that bad, you are not going to see real economic growth. I think even the stock market at this point is around zero growth for the year and that usually is a leading economic indicator that the economy might start tanking again. Proof once again that the Keynesian economics used by the current regime just don't work over the long term.

That being said, the possible fading away of TenTec has more to do with competition than tax selling by the new owners. The reality is that over the last ten years, TenTec has been slow to bring out new products and its domestic competitor Elecraft has been kicking their butts. Elecraft has become more nimble and fast at bringing products to market, while TenTec slowed to a crawl. In this day and age, technology is moving too fast and for companies who cannot keep up and change, they die and fade away. We might be seeing that with TenTec now.

If you really believe "Trickled on Economics" worked, explain why the GDP shows the opposite.  You Google any site you wish to verify this, but here's one http://www.multpl.com/us-gdp-growth-rate/table/by-year (http://www.multpl.com/us-gdp-growth-rate/table/by-year)  GDP during his first four years was near what it was the four years previous, and then dropped off the next four years.  People claim Reaganomics worked because they liked Ron and wanted it to work, but the truth is it did not.  The jobs created, as I stated earlier, were lower paying service jobs which can not compete in either wages or benefits with manufacturing jobs, hence the drop in GDP.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SOFAR on August 07, 2015, 11:45:02 AM
This editorial message is brought  to you by...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 07, 2015, 12:37:39 PM
I will be happy to explain. If you will recall, we went through four punishing years of Jimmy Carter when inflation skyrockets. So as you know, GDP is the value of all goods produced as measured in dollars. If inflation is causing prices to skyrocket, then it will appear as if the GDP is larger than reality. For simplicity. If my company sells widgets at $1.00 each this year and we sell one million units, we will have added $1 million to the GDP. Now the next year, if inflation has increased 20% and forced us to increase our prices 20%, then next year all things being equal, we will sell another 1 million units and have sales of $1.2 million or a 20% increase to the GDP. The reality is that there was no real increase in what we produced and sold. And to keep it simple, if everyone's business stagnated, but all had to increase their prices by 20%, the GDP would increase by 20%. Wow that looks good doesn't it. But no jobs were added.

So we had the punishing interest rates, as I recall mortgage rates in some cases got up around 18%, which slowed the economy, so the fact that Reagan did what he did with high interest rates at the beginning of his term, is remarkable. Ultimately the real unemployment rate was below 5%. Today we have a REAL unemployment rate around 10%. But the government is reporting 5.3% - reason is they stop counting the unemployed when they become hopeless and give up looking for work. They still need a job, they just cannot find one and therefore the government says, well OK then, we're not counting you.

Those of us who lived through the Reagan years and before that the Carter years, know the difference. Looking at raw numbers or statistics without all the background information is useless. This is why our schools need to teach economics and how capitalism works because today so many have no idea how the economy works and how it works best and are therefore easily duped by the politicians.

I get a kick out of people who say how good it is that Obama's budget deficit is shrinking. They think that means the country's entire debt. They don't even understand the difference between debt and budget deficit.

So frankly, this is all so off topic. Time to end it. Back to the TenTec discussion where I still hold that TenTec's woes are self inflicted and have nothing to do with tax selling of current inventory.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K0IZ on August 07, 2015, 05:20:11 PM
Let's see - was this topic about Ten-Tec????
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on August 08, 2015, 06:19:15 AM
Let's see - was this topic about Ten-Tec????

good question! looks like the left and rights wings can't work together and crashed the proverbial plane into the ground (once again).
i am hoping RKR will release some new Ten-Tec xcvr's in the next year or two despite the eulogy JX has already given them :)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 08, 2015, 07:01:13 AM
Let's see - was this topic about Ten-Tec????

good question! looks like the left and rights wings can't work together and crashed the proverbial plane into the ground (once again).
i am hoping RKR will release some new Ten-Tec xcvr's in the next year or two despite the eulogy JX has already given them :)

That's the issue I raised. If it takes them a year or two to bring out new models of transceivers, that's just not going to cut it. Their competitors are just moving faster. TenTec has to introduce new radios much more quickly. You cannot announce radios such as the Patriot, then take another year to deliver it. Just too slow. I hope this inventory reduction means that something is going to be introduced in the next few months. If that is the case, it may show new leadership and direction for TenTec.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on August 08, 2015, 07:24:34 AM

Hi,

The three biggest lies:
1. The check is in the mail.
2. I will respect you in the morning.
3. There will be no changes after the acquisition.

 73,

John W5JON
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI8P on August 08, 2015, 07:30:11 AM
I will be happy to explain. If you will recall, we went through four punishing years of Jimmy Carter when inflation skyrockets. So as you know, GDP is the value of all goods produced as measured in dollars. If inflation is causing prices to skyrocket, then it will appear as if the GDP is larger than reality. For simplicity. If my company sells widgets at $1.00 each this year and we sell one million units, we will have added $1 million to the GDP. Now the next year, if inflation has increased 20% and forced us to increase our prices 20%, then next year all things being equal, we will sell another 1 million units and have sales of $1.2 million or a 20% increase to the GDP. The reality is that there was no real increase in what we produced and sold. And to keep it simple, if everyone's business stagnated, but all had to increase their prices by 20%, the GDP would increase by 20%. Wow that looks good doesn't it. But no jobs were added.

So we had the punishing interest rates, as I recall mortgage rates in some cases got up around 18%, which slowed the economy, so the fact that Reagan did what he did with high interest rates at the beginning of his term, is remarkable. Ultimately the real unemployment rate was below 5%. Today we have a REAL unemployment rate around 10%. But the government is reporting 5.3% - reason is they stop counting the unemployed when they become hopeless and give up looking for work. They still need a job, they just cannot find one and therefore the government says, well OK then, we're not counting you.

Those of us who lived through the Reagan years and before that the Carter years, know the difference. Looking at raw numbers or statistics without all the background information is useless. This is why our schools need to teach economics and how capitalism works because today so many have no idea how the economy works and how it works best and are therefore easily duped by the politicians.

I get a kick out of people who say how good it is that Obama's budget deficit is shrinking. They think that means the country's entire debt. They don't even understand the difference between debt and budget deficit.

So frankly, this is all so off topic. Time to end it. Back to the TenTec discussion where I still hold that TenTec's woes are self inflicted and have nothing to do with tax selling of current inventory.

I always love it when someone says "Time to end it" after they've had their say.  So be it.   ::)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 08, 2015, 07:57:51 AM
Why tax sales?  It could be a means of generating some fast cash, to cover expenses.

The Orion II was a great radio, too bad the parts were becoming obsolete..  TenTec should have had a successor in line, but I think they knew that the sale was inevitable, and left it up to the new owners to expand and improve the line.

Elecraft stole a lot of sales. If TenTec could have kept up with the current trends, and came out with a larger panel radio with a simple menu, they could have done much better.

I own several TenTec rigs, mostly Paragon II, and a few Omni VI series.  So long as I can repair them, I'll probably keep them running, since they meet my needs and work quite well... providing the birdies on ten meters isn't a deal killer!

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 08, 2015, 08:38:36 AM
Why tax sales?  It could be a means of generating some fast cash, to cover expenses.

The Orion II was a great radio, too bad the parts were becoming obsolete..  TenTec should have had a successor in line, but I think they knew that the sale was inevitable, and left it up to the new owners to expand and improve the line.

Elecraft stole a lot of sales. If TenTec could have kept up with the current trends, and came out with a larger panel radio with a simple menu, they could have done much better.

I own several TenTec rigs, mostly Paragon II, and a few Omni VI series.  So long as I can repair them, I'll probably keep them running, since they meet my needs and work quite well... providing the birdies on ten meters isn't a deal killer!

Pete

I do hope they get their act together. I have owned many TenTec radios. The Paragon II, Omni VI+, Jupiter, Argo V, Rebel and the Patriot. When TenTec came out with their recent Argonaut, that's what was a clear indicator they were falling behind. The radio had missing HF bands and no 6 Meter capability. In other words, it had fewer bands than its predecessor. In my mind they were going backwards instead of forward. When you bring out a new model, you usually improve and add capability, not provide less. Not to mention the time it took to bring it out. Lack of speed and innovation will quickly kill a company today. Elecraft has obviously figured out how to do it successfully (I do not own any Elecraft radios) and TenTec could learn a thing or two from them.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 08, 2015, 04:39:50 PM
i am hoping RKR will release some new Ten-Tec xcvr's in the next year or two despite the eulogy JX has already given them :)

Do not hold you breath. Kenwood, Icom and Yaesu does not sell of old rigs when there is not a new one out or nearly out. By dumping rigs with no replacement they are losing market they will never get back. But if you are going out of business quietly, you do  not worry about lost future sales. I know many want to believe their not going away but writing is on the wall. They bought TenTec for some quick cash for assets. We have seen this many times with other mergers. You kill of old lines or low profit products and liquidate assets for cash. When Boeing mergered with McDonaldDouglas  They killed off highly successful MD8x/9x series aircraft that had a excellent track record and excellent engine out performance with near center line thrust vs 737 that replaced it. Jobs were lost and consumer have less choice in end so someone can make more profit.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on August 08, 2015, 07:34:49 PM
Do not hold you breath.

that does not sound good, but maybe there is still hope...  have you ever been wrong about anything?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 09, 2015, 04:21:24 AM
Do not hold you breath.

that does not sound good, but maybe there is still hope...  have you ever been wrong about anything?

I do not walk on water but TenTec has the strong smell of death on it. The year before merger TenTec had a big spread at Hamvention and lots of products but this year they had very little space and product on display. Alpha had the rest of their space for display. I honestly think that they used TenTec assets sales to prop up Alpha which is seeing increased competition for its over priced amps and it days may be numbered too.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on August 09, 2015, 10:39:48 AM
your opinion is noted -- i am hoping this signals they are moving their lineup in order to make way for a new, and perhaps leaner, one.  might be hard to sell the older rigs for profit if new ones are already out.  If so, I am glad they are not in a hurry.  If the new rigs are solid, Ten-Tec fans will buy 'em.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on August 09, 2015, 01:32:41 PM
I really do not like to speculate because sometimes it is a crapshoot.  A while back TT discontinued the sale of Titan III amps stating that the tubes were increasingly difficult to obtain.  (4CX800A).  But now ACOM says that they have a mega warehouse full of them and we should be good for the next 20 years.  I do hope that TT stays in business so that there are a couple of US manufacturers.  As far as ALPHA goes, it looks like ACOM and OM power are giving them a good run on the world market.
Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 10, 2015, 06:01:58 AM
I really do not like to speculate because sometimes it is a crapshoot.  A while back TT discontinued the sale of Titan III amps stating that the tubes were increasingly difficult to obtain.  (4CX800A).  But now ACOM says that they have a mega warehouse full of them and we should be good for the next 20 years.  I do hope that TT stays in business so that there are a couple of US manufacturers.  As far as ALPHA goes, it looks like ACOM and OM power are giving them a good run on the world market.
Art

Alpha has its own problems in being able to sell over priced amps in face of serious competition and not a asset to TenTec merger as Alpha were hemorrhaging. Alpha will survive until they bleed TenTec of all assets to stay afloat or they start producing more reasonably priced amps that sell better. There is only so much market for their over priced product and it is drying up. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 10, 2015, 07:36:53 AM
John Henry of TEN TEC responded to the rumors of TEN TEC going under shortly after the acquisition was announced.  He basically poo pooed the rumor that TEN TEC was going down.  A few months after that statement, John Henry leaves TEN TEC for another job.  Seems he changed his mind.  Another bad sign...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on August 10, 2015, 07:51:37 AM
John Henry of TEN TEC responded to the rumors of TEN TEC going under shortly after the acquisition was announced.  He basically poo pooed the rumor that TEN TEC was going down.  A few months after that statement, John Henry leaves TEN TEC for another job.  Seems he changed his mind.  Another bad sign...

People change jobs all the time. CEOs come and go all the time. Not a real good indicator of anything other then someone moved on to a different company. Unless of course they specifically make public any particular reason for leaving.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on August 10, 2015, 09:15:51 AM
John Henry of TEN TEC responded to the rumors of TEN TEC going under shortly after the acquisition was announced.  He basically poo pooed the rumor that TEN TEC was going down.  A few months after that statement, John Henry leaves TEN TEC for another job.  Seems he changed his mind.  Another bad sign...

People change jobs all the time. CEOs come and go all the time. Not a real good indicator of anything other then someone moved on to a different company. Unless of course they specifically make public any particular reason for leaving.

Hi,

The three biggest lies:
1. The check is in the mail.
2. I will respect you in the morning.
3. There will be no changes after the acquisition.

Just wait for the new owner to say, "soon my son will have your job".  

In my 20+ years with a $12B company, after many of our "acquisitions" I saw it happen often.  No matter small, large, or giant size companies, acquisitions are the same, as human nature is the same. The new smart management always wants to have people they know and trust watching their backs.

 73,

John W5JON
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 10, 2015, 11:02:45 AM
John Henry of TEN TEC responded to the rumors of TEN TEC going under shortly after the acquisition was announced.  He basically poo pooed the rumor that TEN TEC was going down.  A few months after that statement, John Henry leaves TEN TEC for another job.  Seems he changed his mind.  Another bad sign...

Last thing he would do is to admit it was going belly up then as it would of greatly reduced value of remaining assets. Many companies never say they are closing until they close the doors.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 12, 2015, 06:08:53 AM
John Henry of TEN TEC responded to the rumors of TEN TEC going under shortly after the acquisition was announced.  He basically poo pooed the rumor that TEN TEC was going down.  A few months after that statement, John Henry leaves TEN TEC for another job.  Seems he changed his mind.  Another bad sign...

People change jobs all the time. CEOs come and go all the time. Not a real good indicator of anything other then someone moved on to a different company. Unless of course they specifically make public any particular reason for leaving.

TEN TEC is a small company.  Many of its key people have left since the acquisition.  It cannot be good when your key people are jumping off like rats on a sinking ship.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on August 12, 2015, 12:39:24 PM
true, however as this whole thread is filled with wild speculations, it doesn't seem that extraordinary to think RKR might wish to put their own people in place to man/woman the new company and possibly might even move it to the same campus as Alpha (or move both to some central location).  They might even change the name from 'Ten-Tec' since the name signifies a home base in Tennessee... 

If that is the case, and they plan to call it something new Like Alpha-Tec or CO-Tech or simply RKR as well as release a whole new innovative line-up -- and given that they are a small company -- it might take them a couple of years to get the ball rolling.  Maybe they are condfient they can give Elecraft and others a run for their money.  That would be good for the ham community -- would it not?

am i being too hopeful?   :)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on August 12, 2015, 02:39:07 PM
true, however as this whole thread is filled with wild speculations, it doesn't seem that extraordinary to think RKR might wish to put their own people in place to man/woman the new company and possibly might even move it to the same campus as Alpha (or move both to some central location).  They might even change the name from 'Ten-Tec' since the name signifies a home base in Tennessee... 

If that is the case, and they plan to call it something new Like Alpha-Tec or CO-Tech or simply RKR as well as release a whole new innovative line-up -- and given that they are a small company -- it might take them a couple of years to get the ball rolling.  Maybe they are condfient they can give Elecraft and others a run for their money.  That would be good for the ham community -- would it not?

am i being too hopeful?   :)

I don't think so. Consolidation usually brings leaner operating into play. Especially when they were already interrelated in a business sense. And obviously redundant people will be gone. Reducing costs a goal. And ultimately a great small company. In some ways, I think this consolidation was a smart move. But time will tell.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 12, 2015, 06:28:41 PM
it doesn't seem that extraordinary to think RKR might wish to put their own people in place to man/woman the new company and possibly might even move it to the same campus as Alpha (or move both to some central location). 

Both very bad moves. You cannot replace talent that easy moving it to same place as alpha is not good because Alpha is on life support of its own. RKR likely got it for fire sale prices. I think both will be history soon. Sad part is TenTec had more potential and diversity than Alpha and they are liquidating TenTec assets to keep Alpha a float.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K9MHZ on August 13, 2015, 09:42:50 AM
I really hate writing this, because I really admire Ten-Tec.  At Dayton, they had a 238C antenna tuner on display.  Great product, OK I'm sold.  NONE to sell there, just taking orders.  They said "June or July", which I understand, given the small biz nature of their production runs.  August comes, and I send email inquiries.  Nothing for a reply, just crickets.  Left a voice message, and just more crickets.  Finally got a person the other day, and he reports "November or December at the earliest."  Canceled the order.  What the heck?

Anecdotal for sure, but that wasn't a sign of a healthy, well-run organization.  Hope I'm wrong.

 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 13, 2015, 10:10:47 AM
You can't just run an ad in the local paper and find hardware or software engineers that have extensive experience designing and producing Ham radio transcievers.  Especially since the majority of TEN TEC's transcievers are DSP IF based.  It takes a multidisciplinary guy to do this kind of work for a small company.  They simply can not afford to hire four engineers with no Ham radio product manufacturing experience to replace a guy that has been with the company for years and knows the ins and outs of the products they produce.

You are delusional if you think that RKR is "cleaning house" or wishing to put their own people (what people???) in place.  That is just nonsense.  Henry would not have left if he thought there was any future in the company... ditto for others who have moved on.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on August 13, 2015, 01:21:58 PM
You can't just run an ad in the local paper and find hardware or software engineers that have extensive experience designing and producing Ham radio transcievers.  Especially since the majority of TEN TEC's transcievers are DSP IF based.  It takes a multidisciplinary guy to do this kind of work for a small company.  They simply can not afford to hire four engineers with no Ham radio product manufacturing experience to replace a guy that has been with the company for years and knows the ins and outs of the products they produce.

You are delusional if you think that RKR is "cleaning house" or wishing to put their own people (what people???) in place.  That is just nonsense.  Henry would not have left if he thought there was any future in the company... ditto for others who have moved on.

Delusional? Hardly. Happens every day in every industry. The product I work on has 2 of the original 8 engineers left on the team. We still make production, and still provide service for our product. We are not going out of business. In fact we started with 1 factory making the product, and now we have 4 factories. All but 1 left for different jobs. The last one retired. And that is just our little division of the company. There are very few jobs in this world that an effective replacement can't be found.

So a highly trained and educated EE that worked in RF can't pick up a current design and understand it? Does TenTec use some magical chips that no one else uses for DSP algorithm? Or anything else for that matter? Last time I peeked under the hood of a TenTec looked like most if not all the parts were manufactures production components. You figure that EE can't read the data sheets on them and understand them?

Like I said before. Time will tell for TenTec. But employees leaving after an acquisition is old news for them or any other company.

As for Brad's example, that is a good indicator that there may be problems. But that at least is a plausible example. Again, only time will tell.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 13, 2015, 01:32:21 PM
You can't just run an ad in the local paper and find hardware or software engineers that have extensive experience designing and producing Ham radio transcievers.  Especially since the majority of TEN TEC's transcievers are DSP IF based.  It takes a multidisciplinary guy to do this kind of work for a small company.  They simply can not afford to hire four engineers with no Ham radio product manufacturing experience to replace a guy that has been with the company for years and knows the ins and outs of the products they produce.

You are delusional if you think that RKR is "cleaning house" or wishing to put their own people (what people???) in place.  That is just nonsense.  Henry would not have left if he thought there was any future in the company... ditto for others who have moved on.

Delusional? Hardly. Happens every day in every industry. The product I work on has 2 of the original 8 engineers left on the team. We still make production, and still provide service for our product. We are not going out of business. In fact we started with 1 factory making the product, and now we have 4 factories. All but 1 left for different jobs. The last one retired. And that is just our little division of the company. There are very few jobs in this world that an effective replacement can't be found.

So a highly trained and educated EE that worked in RF can't pick up a current design and understand it? Does TenTec use some magical chips that no one else uses for DSP algorithm? Or anything else for that matter? Last time I peeked under the hood of a TenTec looked like most if not all the parts were manufactures production components. You figure that EE can't read the data sheets on them and understand them?

Like I said before. Time will tell for TenTec. But employees leaving after an acquisition is old news for them or any other company.

As for Brad's example, that is a good indicator that there may be problems. But that at least is a plausible example. Again, only time will tell.

TEN TEC is a small company.  They also do not pay very well, partly because of their location.   Some of the engineers that left were both RF engineers as well as software engineers doing embedded programming in addition to DSP programming.  Because of the small size of TEN TEC as well as the market they serve, they will have a hard time finding anyone that call fill all those shoes.  Do you really think they are going to hire four engineers for the price of one?  Yes, they may be able to slug along producing the stuff that is already on the market, but expect no firmware updates and no new products.  That combination spells doom...

p.s. Just because you occupy and a few engineers occupy an insignificant position within your company does not mean that the loss of key people at Ten Tec is insignificant.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 13, 2015, 02:27:54 PM
elecraft is a small company.  What does that prove?  TenTec did a massive downsizing as well. If you look at John Henry's work history, you will see he has moved upwards quite frequently.  I also question what is happening, but it is too easy to read too much into things.  They've changed hands two times in a year, and some churn and changes are to be expected.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 13, 2015, 02:40:06 PM
elecraft is a small company.  What does that prove?  TenTec did a massive downsizing as well. If you look at John Henry's work history, you will see he has moved upwards quite frequently.  I also question what is happening, but it is too easy to read too much into things.  They've changed hands two times in a year, and some churn and changes are to be expected.

Pete

Yeah, and if Elecraft had Wayne, Eric, and Lyle as well as a few others all leave in a matter of months of each other, Elecraft would be in trouble too.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on August 13, 2015, 03:05:47 PM
elecraft is a small company.  What does that prove?  TenTec did a massive downsizing as well. If you look at John Henry's work history, you will see he has moved upwards quite frequently.  I also question what is happening, but it is too easy to read too much into things.  They've changed hands two times in a year, and some churn and changes are to be expected.

Pete

Yeah, and if Elecraft had Wayne, Eric, and Lyle as well as a few others all leave in a matter of months of each other, Elecraft would be in trouble too.

Not if they were replaced with competent people. Just like any other company in the world, big or small. You say they can't. History is on my side that says they can. If a company were that dependent on an employee to survive, they have a very poor business plan. That one employee could die for some reason suddenly. Then what? Poor planning yields poor results. But maybe that's all you know.

Time will tell. Not the comings and goings of employees.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 13, 2015, 03:20:00 PM
elecraft is a small company.  What does that prove?  TenTec did a massive downsizing as well. If you look at John Henry's work history, you will see he has moved upwards quite frequently.  I also question what is happening, but it is too easy to read too much into things.  They've changed hands two times in a year, and some churn and changes are to be expected.

Pete

Yeah, and if Elecraft had Wayne, Eric, and Lyle as well as a few others all leave in a matter of months of each other, Elecraft would be in trouble too.

Not if they were replaced with competent people. Just like any other company in the world, big or small. You say they can't. History is on my side that says they can. If a company were that dependent on an employee to survive, they have a very poor business plan. That one employee could die for some reason suddenly. Then what? Poor planning yields poor results. But maybe that's all you know.

Time will tell. Not the comings and goings of employees.

Exactly where did I say that they can not be replaced? Do you have some kind of reading comprehension problem? Don't put words into my mouth.  Practically every one can be replaced with enough money and time.  It becomes much harder when you are a small company that does not pay much like Ten Tec.  It is much more difficult on a small company when it is your key players leaving all at once like rats on a sinking ship.   You can't seem to comprehend that either...

Also please spare us the platitudes.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on August 13, 2015, 03:30:33 PM
LOL Time will tell!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KK5DR on August 13, 2015, 04:14:22 PM


TEN TEC is a small company.  They also do not pay very well, partly because of their location.   Some of the engineers that left were both RF engineers as well as software engineers doing embedded programming in addition to DSP programming.  Because of the small size of TEN TEC as well as the market they serve, they will have a hard time finding anyone that call fill all those shoes.  Do you really think they are going to hire four engineers for the price of one?  Yes, they may be able to slug along producing the stuff that is already on the market, but expect no firmware updates and no new products.  That combination spells doom...

p.s. Just because you occupy and a few engineers occupy an insignificant position within your company does not mean that the loss of key people at Ten Tec is insignificant.



Hot shot RF engineers right out of college can get $120k-250k a year with the top RF design companies like RF Harris, Rockwell/Collins, Thales, RaCal, etc, etc.
Engineers that can write software code as well, are highly paid.
Ten-Tec can't hope to attract that type of talent, it's just not in their budget.
So, you typically have older engineers who may already be retired, going to work for them as more of a "for the love of ham radio" reasoning for working there.
However, these guys may not be fully up to date on cutting edge RF technology, and they may be abit too conservative on ideas for new radio designs.
Sorry if this statement ruffles a few feathers. Its not personal, it's just the truth. And sometimes people need to hear it, and think about it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 13, 2015, 05:28:56 PM
 TenTec did a massive downsizing as well.

No TenTec was raped of assets and products for quick profit with no future. Its sad but is is dying and soon alpha unless they can come up with more affordable amps for masses but that is not likely. Their niche market is bout gone now.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on August 13, 2015, 05:38:19 PM
Ten-Tec can't hope to attract that type of talent, it's just not in their budget.

That's true. That's why amateur equipment does not have the quality or technology of those big companies and the commercial equipment they make. If they can't afford the talent, they also can't afford the R+D that is needed to go beyond established technology. 1 goes hand in hand with the other. And engineers of that caliber are all over the place.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 13, 2015, 05:52:22 PM
 TenTec did a massive downsizing as well.

No TenTec was raped of assets and products for quick profit with no future. Its sad but is is dying and soon alpha unless they can come up with more affordable amps for masses but that is not likely. Their niche market is bout gone now.

Speculation as to what transpired when they changed hands.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 13, 2015, 06:12:48 PM
 TenTec did a massive downsizing as well.

No TenTec was raped of assets and products for quick profit with no future. Its sad but is is dying and soon alpha unless they can come up with more affordable amps for masses but that is not likely. Their niche market is bout gone now.

Speculation as to what transpired when they changed hands.

The writing is on the wall. If you cannot see or read it you need to take off rose colored glasses.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 13, 2015, 09:15:48 PM
 TenTec did a massive downsizing as well.

No TenTec was raped of assets and products for quick profit with no future. Its sad but is is dying and soon alpha unless they can come up with more affordable amps for masses but that is not likely. Their niche market is bout gone now.

Speculation as to what transpired when they changed hands.

The writing is on the wall. If you cannot see or read it you need to take off rose colored glasses.

Nope. I see what is going on. But, until they do a news release I don't see the need to bad mouth the company.  If you want to keep preaching doom and gloom, go for it. But you are off base on several points.  I'd be surprised if all of the design work was done in house at Elecraft, without using temporary contractors. TenTec also had military products in their stable.

Pete

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 14, 2015, 03:32:27 AM
TenTec did a massive downsizing as well.

No TenTec was raped of assets and products for quick profit with no future. Its sad but is is dying and soon alpha unless they can come up with more affordable amps for masses but that is not likely. Their niche market is bout gone now.

Speculation as to what transpired when they changed hands.

The writing is on the wall. If you cannot see or read it you need to take off rose colored glasses.

Nope. I see what is going on. But, until they do a news release I don't see the need to bad mouth the company.  If you want to keep preaching doom and gloom, go for it. But you are off base on several points.  I'd be surprised if all of the design work was done in house at Elecraft, without using temporary contractors. TenTec also had military products in their stable.

Pete



None of those comments above are from me, yet your editing of the quotes shows me as a source.  Please be more careful about your editing in the future - I am assuming at this point it was not intentional.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 14, 2015, 05:55:00 AM
Nope. I see what is going on. But, until they do a news release I don't see the need to bad mouth the company.  If you want to keep preaching doom and gloom, go for it. But you are off base on several points. 

No you do not see at all. You want to wish it will come back but it will not. Alpha/Tentec was sold/dumped to RKR because owner knew it was dying and had no future. They will not say they are closing until after they close the door because to d otherwise would further decrease value of any assets left and put sales in toilet too. I am not preaching gloom and doom but rather stating what is plain to see if you are willing to remove rose colored glasses and see it. Sadly when TenTec was taken over it was for assets to liquidate for quick profit and little more.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 14, 2015, 08:15:44 AM
As I said, you are off base on a few points... I don't like what I am seeing, but at least RKR has attempted to take over the two companies. Whether they can make a go of it remains to be seen. But, just because Johh Henry has left doesn't mean they can't find contract engineers to help with new products--if they ever happen.  I'd still bet that companies such as Elecraft have used contracted software engineers to develop their products... that is only good business sense.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 14, 2015, 09:49:58 AM
As I said, you are off base on a few points... I don't like what I am seeing, but at least RKR has attempted to take over the two companies. Whether they can make a go of it remains to be seen. But, just because Johh Henry has left doesn't mean they can't find contract engineers to help with new products--if they ever happen.  I'd still bet that companies such as Elecraft have used contracted software engineers to develop their products... that is only good business sense.

Pete

Past owners would not of unloaded it if it had any future. They sold it to RKR to cut future losses. You seem to forget this. When key people leave the ship that tells you far more than is in the official news. Alpha was once a good niche amp but its day is past as it priced itself out of the game with decent foreign built amps coming on line for far less. Alpha/Tentec is kinda like Kmart/Sears merger. Sears was very solid in past but now is in deep trouble and its future questionable as it has taken on kmart debt and it is draining it dry. Sears only hope for future is to split from Kmart. RKR/Alpha is bleeding TenTec to stay afloat. Said part is that chances of someone taking over Tentec and away from RKR Alpha drain to bring it back to life is nil because tentec has little left to work with and most assets are gone. Many years ago Tractor supply bought Farm and Fleet store chain which was quite viable and better known than tractor supply (TSC) In merger that liquidated Farm and Fleet and it is history. Soon TenTec too and Alpha as well.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 14, 2015, 11:57:36 AM
The only thing that was keeping TEN TEC afloat when Jack owned it was their non-amateur work.  If they had relied on their Ham radio products, TEN TEC would have been belly up years ago.  Jack retired and then shortly unloaded the business.  The stuff that was keeping them afloat has dried up with several key people leaving.  They only have the Ham radio products now and most future products are on hold or canceled.  I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently and the news is not good.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 14, 2015, 02:18:11 PM
The only thing that was keeping TEN TEC afloat when Jack owned it was their non-amateur work.  If they had relied on their Ham radio products, TEN TEC would have been belly up years ago. 

Makes sense abut TenTec. Kenwood makes more money off land mobile radio systems than ham gear these days.(not even counting Kenwood JVC audio which makes a lot of money) Their success in land mobile radio and profits enabled them to fund designing some new Ham rigs. Were it not for land mobile sales there might not be a ham radio division today. Kenwood has wisely stayed out of amps and has no desire to make them from what I have heard.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9CW on August 14, 2015, 05:21:27 PM
This is an off-topic reply to W8JX's post regarding the demise of Farm & Fleet stores... I believe you are incorrect, as Farm & Fleet is not history, it is alive and well.

Blain's Farm & Fleet, founded in 1955, and is based in Janesville, WI.  Perhaps you are talking about another "Farm & Fleet."   We have a very large Farm & Fleet store here in my city, and it does tremendous business.  A Farm & Fleet store has been located here for decades.  And, there is absolutely no connection to TSC (Tractor Supply Company).  Here's a copy and paste on their history:

Blain's Farm & Fleet was founded in 1955 by brothers Claude and Bert Blain. Bert's daughter, Jane Blain Gilbertson recently took the position as CEO and President after working with the organization for over 30 years herself. The company now has 36 stores within Wisconsin, Illinois and Iowa. Along with the Blain Supply Inc. located in Janesville, Wisconsin, the company employs over 4,000 people. The business was built and ran on strong family values as it still does today.


See link below:

http://www.farmandfleet.com/about/history.aspx
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 14, 2015, 05:46:46 PM
This is an off-topic reply to W8JX's post regarding the demise of Farm & Fleet stores... I believe you are incorrect, as Farm & Fleet is not history, it is alive and well.

Blain's Farm & Fleet, founded in 1955, and is based in Janesville, WI.  Perhaps you are talking about another "Farm & Fleet."   We have a very large Farm & Fleet store here in my city, and it does tremendous business.  A Farm & Fleet store has been located here for decades.  And, there is absolutely no connection to TSC (Tractor Supply Company).  Here's a copy and paste on their history:

Blain's Farm & Fleet was founded in 1955 by brothers Claude and Bert Blain. Bert's daughter, Jane Blain Gilbertson recently took the position as CEO and President after working with the organization for over 30 years herself. The company now has 36 stores within Wisconsin, Illinois and Iowa. Along with the Blain Supply Inc. located in Janesville, Wisconsin, the company employs over 4,000 people. The business was built and ran on strong family values as it still does today.


See link below:

http://www.farmandfleet.com/about/history.aspx

I think he was talking about Quality Farm and Fleet stores.  Never heard of Brian's Farm and Fleet.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 15, 2015, 04:58:04 AM
This is an off-topic reply to W8JX's post regarding the demise of Farm & Fleet stores... I believe you are incorrect, as Farm & Fleet is not history, it is alive and well.

Slight typo.  Quality store chain that owned Quality Farm and Fleet and a few other names in 2002. They had approx 700 stores in 30 states and we used to shop them a lot verses TSC. QFF stores generally had better wider selections and prices too. they were supposed to rebrand many of them but all the locations around this area closed up for good.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 15, 2015, 05:41:13 AM
The only thing that was keeping TEN TEC afloat when Jack owned it was their non-amateur work.  If they had relied on their Ham radio products, TEN TEC would have been belly up years ago.  Jack retired and then shortly unloaded the business.  The stuff that was keeping them afloat has dried up with several key people leaving.  They only have the Ham radio products now and most future products are on hold or canceled.  I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently and the news is not good.

SWL2002 is pretty much an anonymous post and it references two other anonymous people as in "I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently." Information from anonymous sources posted by an anonymous individual just is not believable. It might be true, it just has no credibility.

Make yourself know, disclose the sources, then we might be able to seriously evaluate the information.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 15, 2015, 07:26:35 AM
The only thing that was keeping TEN TEC afloat when Jack owned it was their non-amateur work.  If they had relied on their Ham radio products, TEN TEC would have been belly up years ago.  Jack retired and then shortly unloaded the business.  The stuff that was keeping them afloat has dried up with several key people leaving.  They only have the Ham radio products now and most future products are on hold or canceled.  I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently and the news is not good.

SWL2002 is pretty much an anonymous post and it references two other anonymous people as in "I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently." Information from anonymous sources posted by an anonymous individual just is not believable. It might be true, it just has no credibility.

Make yourself know, disclose the sources, then we might be able to seriously evaluate the information.

Yes, but first please post your social security number here on this forum so we can verify that you are indeed WB8NUT and not someone who has stolen his identity.  How do we know that you are who you say you are? 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8VVE on August 15, 2015, 08:50:40 AM
RKR Designs...in their ad in QST Sept 2015...is showing the Ten Tec 588AT Omni 7
"Returning to production soon!"  Just an FYI...no comment.  73. Sam. W8VVE
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 15, 2015, 09:01:18 AM


SWL2002 is pretty much an anonymous post and it references two other anonymous people as in "I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently." Information from anonymous sources posted by an anonymous individual just is not believable. It might be true, it just has no credibility.
 

Opinion is opinion... and we all have opinions right or wrong. What I know was passed to me confidence. What other people have shared with other posters on this board should be treated accordingly. Passing rumors--and some of the statements were based on pure speculation--doesn't serve any purpose.

My personal opinion is that TenTec owners were getting on in years and were ready to enjoy retirement.

Elecraft may have been an unseen competitor.  But, does Elecraft do all software and hardware engineering in house, or do they use contractors as needed to develop a new product?

RKR has taken over both Alpha and TenTec.  Contract engineers come and go... unless you have a product under development, why would you keep excess staff?  What advantage is there to duplicity of staff when companies are combined under one entity?  Would it make more sense to eventually consolidate all of the businesses at one location, instead of being spread across the country? Is the military/commercial market more profitable than the ham market, or is it the other way around?? Speculation here, I am just giving my own opinion, which is not based rumors or contacts.

Pete

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on August 15, 2015, 09:38:48 AM
Quote from: K1ZJH

Opinion is opinion... and we all have opinions right or wrong. What I know was passed to me confidence. What other people have shared with other posters on this board should be treated accordingly. Passing rumors--and some of the statements were based on pure speculation--doesn't serve any purpose.


well said.  putting ones callsign online is not anything like putting ones social security # online.  the anonymous suggestion upthread that the two are equivalent is pure hogwash and calls further into question that anonymous author's musings on this topic.

Quote from: K1ZJH

My personal opinion is that TenTec owners were getting on in years and were ready to enjoy retirement.

Elecraft may have been an unseen competitor.  But, does Elecraft do all software and hardware engineering in house, or do they use contractors as needed to develop a new product?

RKR has taken over both Alpha and TenTec.  Contract engineers come and go... unless you have a product under development, why would you keep excess staff?  What advantage is there to duplicity of staff when companies are combined under one entity?  Would it make more sense to eventually consolidate all of the businesses at one location, instead of being spread across the country? Is the military/commercial market more profitable than the ham market, or is it the other way around?? Speculation here, I am just giving my own opinion, which is not based rumors or contacts.

Pete

exactly.  Some of the staff, in addition to the original owners who did retire, may have been looking at retiring soon as well too. starting up new product lines takes capital and that may have also played into the recent sales -- which some here are reading as fire sales.   From what i understand, the folks at RKR who bought Ten-Tec were TT fans and wanted to keep it going.  I have a feeling rumors of TT's demise are premature. Perhaps the vultures circling here in this thread are mistaking the smell of incubation & rebirth for the smell of death. Who knows?   It may be that RKR will decide to rename TT if they move it to a different state like CO.

If The Sept. 2015 QST ad says Omni VII's will soon again be available -- sounds like RKR is keeping the wheels turning.

If the buy and sell for quick profit argument were true -- why would they start manufacturing Omni VII's again now?...



Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 15, 2015, 10:35:03 AM
Contract engineers come and go... unless you have a product under development, why would you keep excess staff?  What advantage is there to duplicity of staff when companies are combined under one entity?  

If you are serious about your future you do not get rid of talent that knows your hardware and hire some one off street UNLESS you are trying to save money and shoestring by but that will kill you in products and support. TenTec as we know it is gone and only a shadow of it at most remains.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 15, 2015, 10:57:47 AM
Contract engineers come and go... unless you have a product under development, why would you keep excess staff?  What advantage is there to duplicity of staff when companies are combined under one entity?  

If you are serious about your future you do not get rid of talent that knows your hardware and hire some one off street UNLESS you are trying to save money and shoestring by but that will kill you in products and support. TenTec as we know it is gone and only a shadow of it at most remains.


To be clear, you are claiming that Elecraft NEVER used contract engineers??  Can you support that?  Otherwise they are in the same boat as TenTec.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 15, 2015, 11:19:20 AM
Contract engineers come and go... unless you have a product under development, why would you keep excess staff?  What advantage is there to duplicity of staff when companies are combined under one entity?  

If you are serious about your future you do not get rid of talent that knows your hardware and hire some one off street UNLESS you are trying to save money and shoestring by but that will kill you in products and support. TenTec as we know it is gone and only a shadow of it at most remains.


To be clear, you are claiming that Elecraft NEVER used contract engineers??  Can you support that?  Otherwise they are in the same boat as TenTec.

Pete

Wow, a lot guys here sure have reading comprehension problems.  How do you get that he said that "Elecraft never used contract engineers" from JX's statement above?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 15, 2015, 11:29:03 AM
Wow, a lot guys here sure have reading comprehension problems.  How do you get that he said that "Elecraft never used contract engineers" from JX's statement above?

I would like to know that too!!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 15, 2015, 11:47:43 AM
Wow, a lot guys here sure have reading comprehension problems.  How do you get that he said that "Elecraft never used contract engineers" from JX's statement above?

I would like to know that too!!

Exactly... if TenTec lets an engineer go, or if that engineer finds better employment, than the company is in dire straits.

Yet, any other normal ham company that hires contractors when needed isn't an issue.

Double standard???

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 15, 2015, 11:58:23 AM
Exactly... if TenTec lets an engineer go, or if that engineer finds better employment, than the company is in dire straits.

Yet, any other normal ham company that hires contractors when needed isn't an issue.

Double standard???

Pete

Not at all. To replace engineers with working knowledge of products when trying to save a few buck and turn things around is dumb. Do you see Kenwood or Yaesu or Icom firing their engineers and hiring new ones to design new gear? Last year at Hamvention I talked to engineer at kenwood booth that designed 570 years ago. He worked some on 590 too. You keep talent because lack of it makes or breaks your company more "wasting" a few bucks more on salaries.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 15, 2015, 12:09:03 PM
Exactly... if TenTec lets an engineer go, or if that engineer finds better employment, than the company is in dire straits.

Yet, any other normal ham company that hires contractors when needed isn't an issue.

Double standard???

Pete

Not at all. To replace engineers with working knowledge of products when trying to save a few buck and turn things around is dumb. Do you see Kenwood or Yaesu or Icom firing their engineers and hiring new ones to design new gear? Last year at Hamvention I talked to engineer at kenwood booth that designed 570 years ago. He worked some on 590 too. You keep talent because lack of it makes or breaks your company more "wasting" a few bucks more on salaries.

Going back to my statement, and since you are obviously such an astute insider, I again have to ask a simple question:

Did Elecraft ever use contract engineers to write software or to assist with hardware designs??  Simple question, really. And, it is on topic. Otherwise, you might stop your vendetta against RKR and TenTec, unless you can post some solid facts.  If an engineer leaves one company, it is doom and gloom? But another competitor that uses contractors isn't comparable?  You don't see that it might make good business sense to cut expenses, at least until it is time hire back contractors? 

Quit making yourself look like a fool, and that goes for the JX cheerleaders who have little substance to offer.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on August 15, 2015, 12:28:09 PM
SWL2002 is pretty much an anonymous post and it references two other anonymous people as in "I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently." Information from anonymous sources posted by an anonymous individual just is not believable. It might be true, it just has no credibility.

Make yourself know, disclose the sources, then we might be able to seriously evaluate the information.

Yes, but first please post your social security number here on this forum so we can verify that you are indeed WB8NUT and not someone who has stolen his identity.  How do we know that you are who you say you are?  

Simple, if your a real Ham operator then just log into QRZ and you can get his email address and then shoot him an email asking the "Real" WB8NUT if he made posts to this thread.  If he replies "Yes" then you know it's the real person.  I do that kind of verification all the time when people are selling stuff on eHam or QTH.

Of course if your not a real ham operator you won't be able to log into QRZ so he won't get an email from you.  WB8NUT please let us know what happens.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on August 15, 2015, 12:41:16 PM
Do you see Kenwood or Yaesu or Icom firing their engineers and hiring new ones to design new gear?

wow, more hyperbole from JX...  ::)

Ten-Tec did not fire JH.  He found a position with another company that he found interesting, challenging, and desirable.
When talent changes employers are you really suggesting that defacto means the company being left is a goner ... ???
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 15, 2015, 12:47:48 PM

Did Elecraft ever use contract engineers to write software or to assist with hardware designs??  Simple question, really. And, it is on topic. Otherwise, you might stop your vendetta against RKR and TenTec, unless you can post some solid facts. 


I never commented on electrocraft and tell me how did it get in this thread when it did not have a fire sale or liquidate assets or recently change hands too???  I have no vendetta but you have rose colored glasses on. I have seen this before many times. You do not liquidate products if you want to stay in business and when talent jumps ship it it not a good sign either. I have little doubt RKR has heard of this thread by now and if they were not going away they would chime in.  Many times I have seen companies quietly close doors and say nothing till doors are closed. If I am wrong great but it has the smell of death and if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck it is a duck and it is leaving the ham radio pond. Said part is this countries business model is that buying and liquidating companies and eliminating jobs for the sake of quick profit is quite acceptable and a way of life here.  
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI8P on August 15, 2015, 01:59:07 PM
SWL2002 is pretty much an anonymous post and it references two other anonymous people as in "I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently." Information from anonymous sources posted by an anonymous individual just is not believable. It might be true, it just has no credibility.

Make yourself know, disclose the sources, then we might be able to seriously evaluate the information.

Yes, but first please post your social security number here on this forum so we can verify that you are indeed WB8NUT and not someone who has stolen his identity.  How do we know that you are who you say you are?  

Simple, if your a real Ham operator then just log into QRZ and you can get his email address and then shoot him an email asking the "Real" WB8NUT if he made posts to this thread.  If he replies "Yes" then you know it's the real person.  I do that kind of verification all the time when people are selling stuff on eHam or QTH.

Of course if your not a real ham operator you won't be able to log into QRZ so he won't get an email from you.  WB8NUT please let us know what happens.



Don't lose any sleep over this guy.  Even if someone took him up on his offer by posting their SS number, he'd still refuse to post his call sign, if he even has one.  People suffering from paranoia can't help it as it's a form of mental illness, and since they are paranoid, they'd never trust someone to help them or even admit they need help.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on August 15, 2015, 03:01:03 PM
Do you see Kenwood or Yaesu or Icom firing their engineers and hiring new ones to design new gear?

wow, more hyperbole from JX...  ::)

Ten-Tec did not fire JH.  He found a position with another company that he found interesting, challenging, and desirable.
When talent changes employers are you really suggesting that defacto means the company being left is a goner ... ???

The only way that is true is if it is a one person operation. When that persons quits, then things are doomed as there is no one left. Last I heard, TT is not a 1 person operation. But then again this is like the third time around for this same silly old rumor (if not more).

Also others are right about contractors. I see more and more permanent engineering jobs becoming contract positions. I have been doing contract work since 2006. And I see many others doing the same thing, as well as companies using them when needed. Why would TT or anyone else not take the same advantage as many other companies?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 15, 2015, 03:46:59 PM
Also others are right about contractors. I see more and more permanent engineering jobs becoming contract positions. I have been doing contract work since 2006. And I see many others doing the same thing, as well as companies using them when needed. Why would TT or anyone else not take the same advantage as many other companies?

Not really. They employ contractors because of less liability and easy to terminate, not because you get a superior pool for engineers to choose from. Today workers are not considered a asset for those wanting to make a quick profit and they want no strings and little liability to be able to loose person and hence contract work is on rise. Not because it makes a better product but rather a cheaper one (cheaper to make not sell) What I have seen is usually C or B rated contractors are in pool and the really good ones, A's, want more than quick contract and smart businesses hang on to them when they get them.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on August 15, 2015, 04:41:18 PM
Also others are right about contractors. I see more and more permanent engineering jobs becoming contract positions. I have been doing contract work since 2006. And I see many others doing the same thing, as well as companies using them when needed. Why would TT or anyone else not take the same advantage as many other companies?

Not really. They employ contractors because of less liability and easy to terminate, not because you get a superior pool for engineers to choose from. Today workers are not considered a asset for those wanting to make a quick profit and they want no strings and little liability to be able to loose person and hence contract work is on rise. Not because it makes a better product but rather a cheaper one (cheaper to make not sell) What I have seen is usually C or B rated contractors are in pool and the really good ones, A's, want more than quick contract and smart businesses hang on to them when they get them.

Well if you spent a day in my shoes, you would know I am right. I live it every day. Do you? I field calls from recruiters almost every day. Almost never is it for permanent employment. So I can base what is happening by just being there and observing. I don't need to read some techie blog and regurgitate what some writer thinks.

But you are correct as to some of the reasons. And the use of them for a quick profit is quite true. Funny you don't apply the same thinking to TT and RKR. As far as I know they are a for profit company just like others. Why can't they use that same advantage?

As to your grading of contractors, that is more opinion then fact. You put the wrong contractor on a job, they are going to look bad. That said, there are lousy contractors out there. But I sure don't think you can lump them all together as to talent and ability. Otherwise companies would no longer use them. Using bad contractors would cost to much compared to the benefit they receive. And that effects profits.

Ah well, you have your opinion, I have my reality based on almost 10 years in the contract business, and even more where I was in a permanent position.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 15, 2015, 06:33:54 PM
SWL2002 is pretty much an anonymous post and it references two other anonymous people as in "I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently." Information from anonymous sources posted by an anonymous individual just is not believable. It might be true, it just has no credibility.

Make yourself know, disclose the sources, then we might be able to seriously evaluate the information.

Yes, but first please post your social security number here on this forum so we can verify that you are indeed WB8NUT and not someone who has stolen his identity.  How do we know that you are who you say you are?  

Simple, if your a real Ham operator then just log into QRZ and you can get his email address and then shoot him an email asking the "Real" WB8NUT if he made posts to this thread.  If he replies "Yes" then you know it's the real person.  I do that kind of verification all the time when people are selling stuff on eHam or QTH.

Of course if your not a real ham operator you won't be able to log into QRZ so he won't get an email from you.  WB8NUT please let us know what happens.



Don't lose any sleep over this guy.  Even if someone took him up on his offer by posting their SS number, he'd still refuse to post his call sign, if he even has one.  People suffering from paranoia can't help it as it's a form of mental illness, and since they are paranoid, they'd never trust someone to help them or even admit they need help.

Save the stupid psychobabble... it makes you look like an idiot.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 15, 2015, 06:38:10 PM
Wow, a lot guys here sure have reading comprehension problems.  How do you get that he said that "Elecraft never used contract engineers" from JX's statement above?

I would like to know that too!!

Exactly... if TenTec lets an engineer go, or if that engineer finds better employment, than the company is in dire straits.

Yet, any other normal ham company that hires contractors when needed isn't an issue.

Double standard???

Pete


Notice how fast K1ZJH sidesteps and dances like a side show clown to draw attention away when someone points out his stupid attempt at creating a straw man.  JX never said anything about Elecrap, not to mention anything about contract engineers.  

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on August 15, 2015, 08:13:36 PM
Quote from: SWL2002
 JX never said anything about Elecrap, not to mention anything about contract engineers.  

so why is it that you call Elecraft crap and want to give RKR a eulogy even though they are alive & kicking?
are you just a hater or are there amateur radio companies that you like?

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 16, 2015, 03:40:12 AM
The only thing that was keeping TEN TEC afloat when Jack owned it was their non-amateur work.  If they had relied on their Ham radio products, TEN TEC would have been belly up years ago.  Jack retired and then shortly unloaded the business.  The stuff that was keeping them afloat has dried up with several key people leaving.  They only have the Ham radio products now and most future products are on hold or canceled.  I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently and the news is not good.

SWL2002 is pretty much an anonymous post and it references two other anonymous people as in "I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently." Information from anonymous sources posted by an anonymous individual just is not believable. It might be true, it just has no credibility.

Make yourself know, disclose the sources, then we might be able to seriously evaluate the information.

Yes, but first please post your social security number here on this forum so we can verify that you are indeed WB8NUT and not someone who has stolen his identity.  How do we know that you are who you say you are? 

Nice sidestep to avoid addressing the issue. Still no credibility.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 16, 2015, 05:08:12 AM
The only thing that was keeping TEN TEC afloat when Jack owned it was their non-amateur work.  If they had relied on their Ham radio products, TEN TEC would have been belly up years ago.  Jack retired and then shortly unloaded the business.  The stuff that was keeping them afloat has dried up with several key people leaving.  They only have the Ham radio products now and most future products are on hold or canceled.  I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently and the news is not good.

SWL2002 is pretty much an anonymous post and it references two other anonymous people as in "I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently." Information from anonymous sources posted by an anonymous individual just is not believable. It might be true, it just has no credibility.

Make yourself know, disclose the sources, then we might be able to seriously evaluate the information.

Yes, but first please post your social security number here on this forum so we can verify that you are indeed WB8NUT and not someone who has stolen his identity.  How do we know that you are who you say you are? 

Nice sidestep to avoid addressing the issue. Still no credibility.

I am not avoiding the issue at all.  If you want to know my callsign that badly, to get it, just post your social security number here - maybe some of your credit card number too. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 16, 2015, 05:14:35 AM
Quote from: SWL2002
JX never said anything about Elecrap, not to mention anything about contract engineers.  

so why is it that you call Elecraft crap and want to give RKR a eulogy even though they are alive & kicking?
are you just a hater or are there amateur radio companies that you like?



The more interesting question is why it upsets you so badly?

As to why I call it Elecrap or Elecrapped, is because of the toy like quality of their radios with their cheap plastic knobs and poor tactile feel buttons. Below is the typical plastic toy quality you see in Elecraft's K3 or K3X:

(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/ODQ0WDExMzc=/z/Ln4AAOSwgQ9Vpw9b/$_57.JPG)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on August 16, 2015, 06:18:15 AM
The only thing that was keeping TEN TEC afloat when Jack owned it was their non-amateur work.  If they had relied on their Ham radio products, TEN TEC would have been belly up years ago.  Jack retired and then shortly unloaded the business.  The stuff that was keeping them afloat has dried up with several key people leaving.  They only have the Ham radio products now and most future products are on hold or canceled.  I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently and the news is not good.

SWL2002 is pretty much an anonymous post and it references two other anonymous people as in "I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently." Information from anonymous sources posted by an anonymous individual just is not believable. It might be true, it just has no credibility.

Make yourself know, disclose the sources, then we might be able to seriously evaluate the information.

Yes, but first please post your social security number here on this forum so we can verify that you are indeed WB8NUT and not someone who has stolen his identity.  How do we know that you are who you say you are?  

Nice sidestep to avoid addressing the issue. Still no credibility.

Hi,

He and other anonymous posters like Zenki, enjoy the anonymity so they can insult companies and individuals with impunity, and without responsibility.  As this is an "HAM Radio" radio forum, it should not be to much to ask for the HAM Radio callsign of the individual posting a comment.  It would seem to me to be a common courtesy, to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor.  

IMO Eham would be much better if anonymity was not permitted.

And I am,

John  W5JON - V47JA
    
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 16, 2015, 07:25:00 AM
The only thing that was keeping TEN TEC afloat when Jack owned it was their non-amateur work.  If they had relied on their Ham radio products, TEN TEC would have been belly up years ago.  Jack retired and then shortly unloaded the business.  The stuff that was keeping them afloat has dried up with several key people leaving.  They only have the Ham radio products now and most future products are on hold or canceled.  I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently and the news is not good.

SWL2002 is pretty much an anonymous post and it references two other anonymous people as in "I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently." Information from anonymous sources posted by an anonymous individual just is not believable. It might be true, it just has no credibility.

Make yourself know, disclose the sources, then we might be able to seriously evaluate the information.

Yes, but first please post your social security number here on this forum so we can verify that you are indeed WB8NUT and not someone who has stolen his identity.  How do we know that you are who you say you are?  

Nice sidestep to avoid addressing the issue. Still no credibility.

Hi,

He and other anonymous posters like Zenki, enjoy the anonymity so they can insult companies and individuals with impunity, and without responsibility.  As this is an "HAM Radio" radio forum, it should not be to much to ask for the HAM Radio callsign of the individual posting a comment.  It would seem to me to be a common courtesy, to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor.  

IMO Eham would be much better if anonymity was not permitted.

And I am,

John  W5JON - V47JA
    

Sorry to tell you, but the FCC does not regulate eHam like it does Amateur radio.  There are no rules requiring that you have a licence to post on eHam (there is a eHam SWL forum) and no rules that you have to identify with your callsign if you are a Ham.  Get over it.  If you don't like it, don't come to the eHam forums.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on August 16, 2015, 09:50:38 AM
Quote from: W9KEY

so why is it that you call Elecraft crap and want to give RKR a eulogy even though they are alive & kicking?
are you just a hater or are there amateur radio companies that you like?


Quote from: SWL2002

The more interesting question is why it upsets you so badly?


stop dodging the 2nd question by changing the channel.  i am simply trying to gauge whether you are capable of being more than a critic, and one that hides behind an anonymous ID at that  ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI8P on August 16, 2015, 10:24:44 AM
SWL2002 is pretty much an anonymous post and it references two other anonymous people as in "I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently." Information from anonymous sources posted by an anonymous individual just is not believable. It might be true, it just has no credibility.

Make yourself know, disclose the sources, then we might be able to seriously evaluate the information.

Yes, but first please post your social security number here on this forum so we can verify that you are indeed WB8NUT and not someone who has stolen his identity.  How do we know that you are who you say you are?  

Simple, if your a real Ham operator then just log into QRZ and you can get his email address and then shoot him an email asking the "Real" WB8NUT if he made posts to this thread.  If he replies "Yes" then you know it's the real person.  I do that kind of verification all the time when people are selling stuff on eHam or QTH.

Of course if your not a real ham operator you won't be able to log into QRZ so he won't get an email from you.  WB8NUT please let us know what happens.



Don't lose any sleep over this guy.  Even if someone took him up on his offer by posting their SS number, he'd still refuse to post his call sign, if he even has one.  People suffering from paranoia can't help it as it's a form of mental illness, and since they are paranoid, they'd never trust someone to help them or even admit they need help.

Save the stupid psychobabble... it makes you look like an idiot.


Wow, I must have really hit close to home.  Thanks for the confirmation!   ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 16, 2015, 11:30:27 AM
SWL2002 is pretty much an anonymous post and it references two other anonymous people as in "I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently." Information from anonymous sources posted by an anonymous individual just is not believable. It might be true, it just has no credibility.

Make yourself know, disclose the sources, then we might be able to seriously evaluate the information.

Yes, but first please post your social security number here on this forum so we can verify that you are indeed WB8NUT and not someone who has stolen his identity.  How do we know that you are who you say you are?  

Simple, if your a real Ham operator then just log into QRZ and you can get his email address and then shoot him an email asking the "Real" WB8NUT if he made posts to this thread.  If he replies "Yes" then you know it's the real person.  I do that kind of verification all the time when people are selling stuff on eHam or QTH.

Of course if your not a real ham operator you won't be able to log into QRZ so he won't get an email from you.  WB8NUT please let us know what happens.



Don't lose any sleep over this guy.  Even if someone took him up on his offer by posting their SS number, he'd still refuse to post his call sign, if he even has one.  People suffering from paranoia can't help it as it's a form of mental illness, and since they are paranoid, they'd never trust someone to help them or even admit they need help.

Save the stupid psychobabble... it makes you look like an idiot.


Wow, I must have really hit close to home.  Thanks for the confirmation!   ;D

You mean confirmation that your psychobabble makes you look like an idiot?  That is confirmed!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 16, 2015, 12:31:42 PM
Exactly... if TenTec lets an engineer go, or if that engineer finds better employment, than the company is in dire straits.

Yet, any other normal ham company that hires contractors when needed isn't an issue.

Double standard???

Pete

Not at all. To replace engineers with working knowledge of products when trying to save a few buck and turn things around is dumb. Do you see Kenwood or Yaesu or Icom firing their engineers and hiring new ones to design new gear? Last year at Hamvention I talked to engineer at kenwood booth that designed 570 years ago. He worked some on 590 too. You keep talent because lack of it makes or breaks your company more "wasting" a few bucks more on salaries.

John

Kenwood and Yaesu can certainly afford to keep engineers on staff, they have extensive lines besides making a few rigs ror cheap hams. When I retired, we were upgrading the entire RR system to Kenwood and Icom radios that were both narrow-band and digital ready.  That is a huge market in itself.

TenTec was a small company. They are sold. RKR may have their own preferences when it comes to contractors for future work.  You can't quite compare payrolls for Kenwood, Icom as to what the current downsized TenTec factory can afford. I'd also bet most of the software is, or was, done off site, in home offices.  If there was proper software documentation, than any competent engineer should be able to take over.  I am sure Elecraft uses contractors as needed, and they seem to be doing quite well for a very small company in a very competitive market.

73
 
Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on August 16, 2015, 01:19:32 PM
The only thing that was keeping TEN TEC afloat when Jack owned it was their non-amateur work.  If they had relied on their Ham radio products, TEN TEC would have been belly up years ago.  Jack retired and then shortly unloaded the business.  The stuff that was keeping them afloat has dried up with several key people leaving.  They only have the Ham radio products now and most future products are on hold or canceled.  I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently and the news is not good.

SWL2002 is pretty much an anonymous post and it references two other anonymous people as in "I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently." Information from anonymous sources posted by an anonymous individual just is not believable. It might be true, it just has no credibility.

Make yourself know, disclose the sources, then we might be able to seriously evaluate the information.

Yes, but first please post your social security number here on this forum so we can verify that you are indeed WB8NUT and not someone who has stolen his identity.  How do we know that you are who you say you are?  

Nice sidestep to avoid addressing the issue. Still no credibility.

Hi,

He and other anonymous posters like Zenki, enjoy the anonymity so they can insult companies and individuals with impunity, and without responsibility.  As this is an "HAM Radio" radio forum, it should not be to much to ask for the HAM Radio callsign of the individual posting a comment.  It would seem to me to be a common courtesy, to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor.  

IMO Eham would be much better if anonymity was not permitted.

And I am,

John  W5JON - V47JA
  
 

Sorry to tell you, but the FCC does not regulate eHam like it does Amateur radio.  There are no rules requiring that you have a licence to post on eHam (there is a eHam SWL forum) and no rules that you have to identify with your callsign if you are a Ham.  Get over it.  If you don't like it, don't come to the eHam forums.

Sorry to tell you, but the FCC does not regulate eHam like it does Amateur radio.  There are no rules requiring that you have a licence to post on eHam (there is a eHam SWL forum) and no rules that you have to identify with your callsign if you are a Ham.  Get over it.  If you don't like it, don't come to the eHam forums.






Sir or madam anonymous (although I am pretty sure you are a Madam),

You have a real reading comprehension problem.  I said:

"As this is an "HAM Radio" radio forum, it should not be to much to ask for the HAM Radio call
sign of the individual posting a comment.  It would seem to me to be a common courtesy, to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor".  


You may want to check and see what "common courtesy" means. Trust me it has nothing to do with the FCC or regulations, but as usual, your standard MO is to throw in a red herring just to change the subject.  So maybe just your name, city and state,  if you have no license and /or do not work for a competitor, that should not be a problem.  BTW ''license" is spelled L-I-C-E-N-S-E, not licence, but if you had one you would know.  So how about you post your "Paystub" just to prove you do not work for the competition, and all your insults are merely because your company can not beat your competitors.  

BTW, to remain on topic.  Prior to my retirement I worked for Schlumberger. Yes, that is the same Schlumberger that in 1962 purchased Heathkit, for about $40M, however Schlumberger was about $8B at that time (now about $11B), so it was not a big deal.  The main reason for that purchase was to acquire the Data Acquisition Products from Heath, and once that was done it was sold, and as history shows Heath continued on very well after it was sold. So indeed it is often about an Amateur Radio companies' non radio products that makes them ripe for purchase.   But I can assure you the big lie, "there will be no changes after the acquisition" is indeed a big lie.

I am still,

John  W5JON -  V47JA

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 16, 2015, 02:55:07 PM
The only thing that was keeping TEN TEC afloat when Jack owned it was their non-amateur work.  If they had relied on their Ham radio products, TEN TEC would have been belly up years ago.  Jack retired and then shortly unloaded the business.  The stuff that was keeping them afloat has dried up with several key people leaving.  They only have the Ham radio products now and most future products are on hold or canceled.  I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently and the news is not good.

SWL2002 is pretty much an anonymous post and it references two other anonymous people as in "I know a couple of guys that worked there until recently." Information from anonymous sources posted by an anonymous individual just is not believable. It might be true, it just has no credibility.

Make yourself know, disclose the sources, then we might be able to seriously evaluate the information.

Yes, but first please post your social security number here on this forum so we can verify that you are indeed WB8NUT and not someone who has stolen his identity.  How do we know that you are who you say you are?  

Nice sidestep to avoid addressing the issue. Still no credibility.

Hi,

He and other anonymous posters like Zenki, enjoy the anonymity so they can insult companies and individuals with impunity, and without responsibility.  As this is an "HAM Radio" radio forum, it should not be to much to ask for the HAM Radio callsign of the individual posting a comment.  It would seem to me to be a common courtesy, to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor.  

IMO Eham would be much better if anonymity was not permitted.

And I am,

John  W5JON - V47JA
  
 

Sorry to tell you, but the FCC does not regulate eHam like it does Amateur radio.  There are no rules requiring that you have a licence to post on eHam (there is a eHam SWL forum) and no rules that you have to identify with your callsign if you are a Ham.  Get over it.  If you don't like it, don't come to the eHam forums.

Sorry to tell you, but the FCC does not regulate eHam like it does Amateur radio.  There are no rules requiring that you have a licence to post on eHam (there is a eHam SWL forum) and no rules that you have to identify with your callsign if you are a Ham.  Get over it.  If you don't like it, don't come to the eHam forums.






Sir or madam anonymous (although I am pretty sure you are a Madam),

You have a real reading comprehension problem.  I said:

"As this is an "HAM Radio" radio forum, it should not be to much to ask for the HAM Radio call
sign of the individual posting a comment.  It would seem to me to be a common courtesy, to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor".  


You may want to check and see what "common courtesy" means. Trust me it has nothing to do with the FCC or regulations, but as usual, your standard MO is to throw in a red herring just to change the subject.  So maybe just your name, city and state,  if you have no license and /or do not work for a competitor, that should not be a problem.  BTW ''license" is spelled L-I-C-E-N-S-E, not licence, but if you had one you would know.  So how about you post your "Paystub" just to prove you do not work for the competition, and all your insults are merely because your company can not beat your competitors.  

BTW, to remain on topic.  Prior to my retirement I worked for Schlumberger. Yes, that is the same Schlumberger that in 1962 purchased Heathkit, for about $40M, however Schlumberger was about $8B at that time (now about $11B), so it was not a big deal.  The main reason for that purchase was to acquire the Data Acquisition Products from Heath, and once that was done it was sold, and as history shows Heath continued on very well after it was sold. So indeed it is often about an Amateur Radio companies' non radio products that makes them ripe for purchase.   But I can assure you the big lie, "there will be no changes after the acquisition" is indeed a big lie.

I am still,

John  W5JON -  V47JA



1. You have quoted improperly.

2. eHam does not require those who register to have Ham Radio licenses.  They also allow usernames other than callsigns.

3. The users of this site are under no obligation to identify themselves, let alone identify with a callsign

If you want to know my name so badly, it can be deduced from my name and email address that I provided when I signed up years ago.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on August 16, 2015, 03:43:26 PM
1. You have quoted improperly.

2. eHam does not require those who register to have Ham Radio licenses.  They also allow usernames other than callsigns.

3. The users of this site are under no obligation to identify themselves, let alone identify with a callsign

If you want to know my name so badly, it can be deduced from my name and email address that I provided when I signed up years ago.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++



You really need to work on that reading comprehension problem you have, I wrote:

"As this is an "HAM Radio" radio forum, it should not be to much to ask for the HAM Radio callsign of the individual posting a comment.   It would seem to me to be a common courtesy, to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor".  



Still,

John  W5JON- V47JA


 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA0HCP on August 16, 2015, 04:19:55 PM
*Rumors*

I heard Ten Tec was responsible for Russia invading the Crimea and that the Rawandan massacre of Huttu's and Tutsi's started over a Ten Tec Eagle that needed to be returned for warranty service.

Ahem.

This thread smells like a sewage tank and half the posters need to be taken out and hanged.  You should be ashamed of yourselves for running down Ten Tec with nothing but lies and supposition.  b.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 16, 2015, 04:23:44 PM
1. You have quoted improperly.

2. eHam does not require those who register to have Ham Radio licenses.  They also allow usernames other than callsigns.

3. The users of this site are under no obligation to identify themselves, let alone identify with a callsign

If you want to know my name so badly, it can be deduced from my name and email address that I provided when I signed up years ago.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++



You really need to work on that reading comprehension problem you have, I wrote:

"As this is an "HAM Radio" radio forum, it should not be to much to ask for the HAM Radio callsign of the individual posting a comment.   It would seem to me to be a common courtesy, to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor".  



Still,

John  W5JON- V47JA


 

Again, your quoting skills need work.

You need to get your glasses fixed.  I don't give a hoot about your OPINION on whether you think people should identify with their Ham radio callsigns, if they have one.  You ASSUME that his is a Ham radio forum, but the SWL forum here is obviously for SWLs whether they have a Ham license or not.  No where in the title of this forum "Company Reviews" does the word Ham appear.  If it was titled "Ham Radio Company Reviews by Ham Radio Operators" you would have a point.  Since it does not indicate that this forum is ONLY for Ham radio operators, then you blowing in the wind.  Until eHam requires everyone be identified by a Ham radio callsign, I will continue to identify as SWL2002, a user name I have used for years and a name that reflects my primary interest beyond Ham radio.

Now go take your nap, you are making yourself look silly...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 16, 2015, 04:26:48 PM
*Rumors*

I heard Ten Tec was responsible for Russia invading the Crimea and that the Rawandan massacre of Huttu's and Tutsi's started over a Ten Tec Eagle that needed to be returned for warranty service.

Ahem.

This thread smells like a sewage tank and half the posters need to be taken out and hanged.  You should be ashamed of yourselves for running down Ten Tec with nothing but lies and supposition.  b.

If this is a sewage tank, you are at the bottom of it friend.  No one is running down TEN TEC.  I would rather see them stay in business for a long time.  The problem is that the current situation does not look well for the longevity of TEN TEC since Jack retired and sold his interest in the company.

A few years ago I met with Jack and also had a tour of TEN TEC including the Engineering department.  It was obvious and Jack clearly stated that their other non-Ham related business was what was keeping them afloat.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA0HCP on August 16, 2015, 05:45:21 PM
Quote
...I would rather see them stay in business for a long time.  The problem is that the current situation does not look well for the longevity of TEN TEC since Jack retired and sold his interest in the company.

A few years ago I met with Jack and also had a tour of TEN TEC including the Engineering department.  It was obvious and Jack clearly stated that their other non-Ham related business was what was keeping them afloat.
Plenty of people have done nothing but spew garbage opinions and fabricated falsehoods.

I can respect your statements above, since they are based on your personal experience with Ten Tec and are reasonable and thoughtful observations.  b.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on August 16, 2015, 05:59:41 PM
Hi,

It seems Sherwood Engineering does not agree with some of "expert" assessment of Elecraft vs TenTec  on here:

http://www.sherweng.com/table.html

73 and still,

John W5JON
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 17, 2015, 03:53:02 AM
Hi,

It seems Sherwood Engineering does not agree with some of "expert" assessment of Elecraft vs TenTec  on here:

http://www.sherweng.com/table.html

73 and still,

John W5JON

What do you mean by "agree"?  This is such a silly, uninformed statement.

1. Rob Sherwood has said (multiple times) that he could not live with some of the top radios on his list because of other issues, such as ergonomics and AGC performance.  He has commented on the poor ergonomics of the Elecraft K3.  

2. Anyone who makes a radio purchasing decision by where the radio falls on Sherwood's list, which is sorted by one criteria - narrow spaced dynamic range,  is a total buffoon.  Sort by another column and the top radio on the list changes.  

3. I challenge anyone to tell the difference in the narrow spaced dynamic of the top ten radios on that list when listening by just by ear and not using a piece of expensive test equipment.  

4. A few dBs of one criteria on a list should not be the criteria for purchasing a radio.

5. The position on Rob Sherwoods list does not negate the fact that the Elecraft radios are plasticy, rattlely, ergonomic failures in radio interface design and have harsh sounding receive.  The KX3 has a toy, rattle-bastard of a speaker too.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI8P on August 17, 2015, 04:57:32 AM

If you want to know my name so badly, it can be deduced from my name and email address that I provided when I signed up years ago.


"Bob", you mean the email address that you chose to hide?  One more substantiation of what I posted earlier concerning your mental state. You can deny it all you want and try to deflect it with your comments, but it's true whether you chose to admit it or not.  After all, nearly all mentally challenged people think everyone else is wrong, and your denial is proving my point. I'd suggest you seek help but I already know you won't.  99% of people with your problem won't unless it's forced upon them, and even then it generally fails because it's help they don't think they need. Psychobabble?  Nope, just astute observation.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 17, 2015, 05:01:23 AM

If you want to know my name so badly, it can be deduced from my name and email address that I provided when I signed up years ago.


"Bob", you mean the email address that you chose to hide?  One more substantiation of what I posted earlier concerning your mental state. You can deny it all you want and try to deflect it with your comments, but it's true whether you chose to admit it or not.  After all, nearly all mentally challenged people think everyone else is wrong, and your denial is proving my point. I'd suggest you seek help but I already know you won't.  99% of people with your problem won't unless it's forced upon them, and even then it generally fails because it's help they don't think they need. Psychobabble?  Nope, just astute observation.

You might want to go to your doctor and tell him you want to be evaluated for Wernicke’s aphasia.  I think that is your problem.  Make sure you take someone along with you to tell your doctor that, because coming from you, it will all be babble...

As to mental state, you might want to look in the mirror and ask why it is so important to you to know someone's identity on the internet.  You have some issues for sure.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI8P on August 17, 2015, 05:35:48 AM

If you want to know my name so badly, it can be deduced from my name and email address that I provided when I signed up years ago.


"Bob", you mean the email address that you chose to hide?  One more substantiation of what I posted earlier concerning your mental state. You can deny it all you want and try to deflect it with your comments, but it's true whether you chose to admit it or not.  After all, nearly all mentally challenged people think everyone else is wrong, and your denial is proving my point. I'd suggest you seek help but I already know you won't.  99% of people with your problem won't unless it's forced upon them, and even then it generally fails because it's help they don't think they need. Psychobabble?  Nope, just astute observation.

You might want to go to your doctor and tell him you want to be evaluated for Wernicke’s aphasia.  I think that is your problem.  Make sure you take someone along with you to tell your doctor that, because coming from you, it will all be babble...

As to mental state, you might want to look in the mirror and ask why it is so important to you to know someone's identity on the internet.  You have some issues for sure.

See, more deflection, aka denial.  ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 17, 2015, 05:49:02 AM

If you want to know my name so badly, it can be deduced from my name and email address that I provided when I signed up years ago.


"Bob", you mean the email address that you chose to hide?  One more substantiation of what I posted earlier concerning your mental state. You can deny it all you want and try to deflect it with your comments, but it's true whether you chose to admit it or not.  After all, nearly all mentally challenged people think everyone else is wrong, and your denial is proving my point. I'd suggest you seek help but I already know you won't.  99% of people with your problem won't unless it's forced upon them, and even then it generally fails because it's help they don't think they need. Psychobabble?  Nope, just astute observation.

You might want to go to your doctor and tell him you want to be evaluated for Wernicke’s aphasia.  I think that is your problem.  Make sure you take someone along with you to tell your doctor that, because coming from you, it will all be babble...

As to mental state, you might want to look in the mirror and ask why it is so important to you to know someone's identity on the internet.  You have some issues for sure.

See, more deflection, aka denial.  ;D

I could not agree more.  You are deflecting. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on August 17, 2015, 07:37:18 AM
1. You have quoted improperly.

2. eHam does not require those who register to have Ham Radio licenses.  They also allow usernames other than callsigns.

3. The users of this site are under no obligation to identify themselves, let alone identify with a callsign

If you want to know my name so badly, it can be deduced from my name and email address that I provided when I signed up years ago.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++



You really need to work on that reading comprehension problem you have, I wrote:

"As this is an "HAM Radio" radio forum, it should not be to much to ask for the HAM Radio callsign of the individual posting a comment.   It would seem to me to be a common courtesy, to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor".  



Still,

John  W5JON- V47JA


 

Again, your quoting skills need work.

You need to get your glasses fixed.  I don't give a hoot about your OPINION on whether you think people should identify with their Ham radio callsigns, if they have one.  You ASSUME that his is a Ham radio forum, but the SWL forum here is obviously for SWLs whether they have a Ham license or not.  No where in the title of this forum "Company Reviews" does the word Ham appear.  If it was titled "Ham Radio Company Reviews by Ham Radio Operators" you would have a point.  Since it does not indicate that this forum is ONLY for Ham radio operators, then you blowing in the wind.  Until eHam requires everyone be identified by a Ham radio callsign, I will continue to identify as SWL2002, a user name I have used for years and a name that reflects my primary interest beyond Ham radio.

Now go take your nap, you are making yourself look silly...




Here you go again with that reading comprehension problem again, I WROTE:

["..... to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor".  


I have NEVER said it is an Eham REQUIREMENT, I have said numerous times it is  COMMON COURTESY.  COMMON COURTESY, two words that you choose to totally ignore,  given your reading comprehension problem.  But then if you were not anonymous you would need to stand behind your personal insults, and the insults you make about your business competition.    

And you believe that "Bob" answers that statement.  "Now go take your nap, you are making yourself look silly..."

Still'

John W5JON

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 17, 2015, 07:58:00 AM
1. You have quoted improperly.

2. eHam does not require those who register to have Ham Radio licenses.  They also allow usernames other than callsigns.

3. The users of this site are under no obligation to identify themselves, let alone identify with a callsign

If you want to know my name so badly, it can be deduced from my name and email address that I provided when I signed up years ago.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++



You really need to work on that reading comprehension problem you have, I wrote:

"As this is an "HAM Radio" radio forum, it should not be to much to ask for the HAM Radio callsign of the individual posting a comment.   It would seem to me to be a common courtesy, to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor".  



Still,

John  W5JON- V47JA


 

Again, your quoting skills need work.

You need to get your glasses fixed.  I don't give a hoot about your OPINION on whether you think people should identify with their Ham radio callsigns, if they have one.  You ASSUME that his is a Ham radio forum, but the SWL forum here is obviously for SWLs whether they have a Ham license or not.  No where in the title of this forum "Company Reviews" does the word Ham appear.  If it was titled "Ham Radio Company Reviews by Ham Radio Operators" you would have a point.  Since it does not indicate that this forum is ONLY for Ham radio operators, then you blowing in the wind.  Until eHam requires everyone be identified by a Ham radio callsign, I will continue to identify as SWL2002, a user name I have used for years and a name that reflects my primary interest beyond Ham radio.

Now go take your nap, you are making yourself look silly...




Here you go again with that reading comprehension problem again, I WROTE:

["..... to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor".  


I have NEVER said it is an Eham REQUIREMENT, I have said numerous times it is  COMMON COURTESY.  COMMON COURTESY, two words that you choose to totally ignore,  given your reading comprehension problem.  But then if you were not anonymous you would need to stand behind your personal insults, and the insults you make about your business competition.    

And you believe that "Bob" answers that statement.  "Now go take your nap, you are making yourself look silly..."

Still'

John W5JON



WOW... another Wernicke’s aphasia patient...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on August 17, 2015, 08:08:42 AM
And again you ignore, now try and focus........ COMMON COURTESY....... COMMON COURTESY.    

Still.

John W5JON
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: ZS6DX on August 17, 2015, 08:09:19 AM
1. You have quoted improperly.

2. eHam does not require those who register to have Ham Radio licenses.  They also allow usernames other than callsigns.

3. The users of this site are under no obligation to identify themselves, let alone identify with a callsign

If you want to know my name so badly, it can be deduced from my name and email address that I provided when I signed up years ago.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++



You really need to work on that reading comprehension problem you have, I wrote:

"As this is an "HAM Radio" radio forum, it should not be to much to ask for the HAM Radio callsign of the individual posting a comment.   It would seem to me to be a common courtesy, to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor".  



Still,

John  W5JON- V47JA


 

Again, your quoting skills need work.

You need to get your glasses fixed.  I don't give a hoot about your OPINION on whether you think people should identify with their Ham radio callsigns, if they have one.  You ASSUME that his is a Ham radio forum, but the SWL forum here is obviously for SWLs whether they have a Ham license or not.  No where in the title of this forum "Company Reviews" does the word Ham appear.  If it was titled "Ham Radio Company Reviews by Ham Radio Operators" you would have a point.  Since it does not indicate that this forum is ONLY for Ham radio operators, then you blowing in the wind.  Until eHam requires everyone be identified by a Ham radio callsign, I will continue to identify as SWL2002, a user name I have used for years and a name that reflects my primary interest beyond Ham radio.

Now go take your nap, you are making yourself look silly...




Here you go again with that reading comprehension problem again, I WROTE:

["..... to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor".  


I have NEVER said it is an Eham REQUIREMENT, I have said numerous times it is  COMMON COURTESY.  COMMON COURTESY, two words that you choose to totally ignore,  given your reading comprehension problem.  But then if you were not anonymous you would need to stand behind your personal insults, and the insults you make about your business competition.    

And you believe that "Bob" answers that statement.  "Now go take your nap, you are making yourself look silly..."

Still'

John W5JON



WOW... another Wernicke’s aphasia patient...

With every post you make your credibility drops mr SWL "Bob"
The very fact that you refuse to say who you are shows intent to deceit and in general to be "up to no good". Do you not have the guts to own up to your statements? Maybe you are a schoolkid playing in your room?

You degrade the normally good eHam experience, I think it is time the rest of the respectable guys here lobby to have you removed or at least to make it compulsory that everyone should be identified.

Only cowards and crooks hide behind anonymity.....

Rudi de ZS6DX  
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 17, 2015, 08:15:02 AM
1. You have quoted improperly.

2. eHam does not require those who register to have Ham Radio licenses.  They also allow usernames other than callsigns.

3. The users of this site are under no obligation to identify themselves, let alone identify with a callsign

If you want to know my name so badly, it can be deduced from my name and email address that I provided when I signed up years ago.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++



You really need to work on that reading comprehension problem you have, I wrote:

"As this is an "HAM Radio" radio forum, it should not be to much to ask for the HAM Radio callsign of the individual posting a comment.   It would seem to me to be a common courtesy, to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor".  



Still,

John  W5JON- V47JA


 

Again, your quoting skills need work.

You need to get your glasses fixed.  I don't give a hoot about your OPINION on whether you think people should identify with their Ham radio callsigns, if they have one.  You ASSUME that his is a Ham radio forum, but the SWL forum here is obviously for SWLs whether they have a Ham license or not.  No where in the title of this forum "Company Reviews" does the word Ham appear.  If it was titled "Ham Radio Company Reviews by Ham Radio Operators" you would have a point.  Since it does not indicate that this forum is ONLY for Ham radio operators, then you blowing in the wind.  Until eHam requires everyone be identified by a Ham radio callsign, I will continue to identify as SWL2002, a user name I have used for years and a name that reflects my primary interest beyond Ham radio.

Now go take your nap, you are making yourself look silly...




Here you go again with that reading comprehension problem again, I WROTE:

["..... to allow others to know who they are conversing with, and be able to establish the credentials of the individual making a post, and not an employee of a competitor".  


I have NEVER said it is an Eham REQUIREMENT, I have said numerous times it is  COMMON COURTESY.  COMMON COURTESY, two words that you choose to totally ignore,  given your reading comprehension problem.  But then if you were not anonymous you would need to stand behind your personal insults, and the insults you make about your business competition.    

And you believe that "Bob" answers that statement.  "Now go take your nap, you are making yourself look silly..."

Still'

John W5JON



WOW... another Wernicke’s aphasia patient...

With every post you make your credibility drops mr SWL "Bob"
The very fact that you refuse to say who you are shows intent to deceit and in general to be "up to no good". Do you not have the guts to own up to your statements? Maybe you are a schoolkid playing in your room?

You degrade the normally good eHam experience, I think it is time the rest of the respectable guys here lobby to have you removed or at least to make it compulsory that everyone should be identified.

Only cowards and crooks hide behind anonymity.....

Rudi de ZS6DX  

I tell you what cowards do.  They lobby eHam to have users removed because they can't stand to hear an opinion in contrary to their own.  They go crying to the eHam moderators like a little school girl who has skinned her knee on the playground.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 17, 2015, 08:27:47 AM
Hi,

It seems Sherwood Engineering does not agree with some of "expert" assessment of Elecraft vs TenTec  on here:

http://www.sherweng.com/table.html

73 and still,

John W5JON

Hi John

I don't understand your point?  I like TenTec, and own two Omni VI rigs, and a Paragon II. I prefer the larger panel layout and simplicity, and the fact the radios work to my satisfaction, and also that I can repair them myself.  And, they are dirt cheap these days. I paid 300 bucks for the Omni VI Plus, fully loaded, and the gent was willing to sell it for shipping costs?!?! It took a day or two on the bench and it was good as new. The only bad thing I can note are the few birdies on the low end of the ten meter band. But, I can live with them.

Elecraft makes nice rigs; but I personally don't like the small panel layouts--I have big hands and I am fat fingered.  If I didn't own the TenTec rigs, Elecraft would be my second choice--again because they work well, and I think they are repairable by any ham with any technical background.

As to the Sherwood reviews; the final decision for which radio is the best match for a ham's needs goes a bit beyond the numbers--there are quite a few radios with good scores; and after that it comes down to ergonomics, service, user comfort, and reliability. 

73

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on August 17, 2015, 08:28:56 AM

"I tell you what cowards do" .......

Yes, you hide behind your anonymity, so you do not have to stand behind your personal insults, and the insults you make about your business competition.    

Still,

John W5JON


Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 17, 2015, 08:32:28 AM

"I tell you what cowards do" .......

Yes, you hide behind your anonymity, so you do not have to stand behind your personal insults, and the insults you make about your business competition.    

Still,

John W5JON


You just got your feelings hurt because I shot down your comment about Sherwood's list.  You cannot argue with me on technical points, so instead you focus in on my anonymity.  

Signed "Bob"
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 17, 2015, 08:35:20 AM
Hi,

It seems Sherwood Engineering does not agree with some of "expert" assessment of Elecraft vs TenTec  on here:

http://www.sherweng.com/table.html

73 and still,

John W5JON

Elecraft makes nice rigs; but I personally don't like the small panel layouts--I have big hands and I am fat fingered.  If I didn't own the TenTec rigs, Elecraft would be my second choice--again because they work well, and I think they are repairable by any ham with any technical background.

As to the Sherwood reviews; the final decision for which radio is the best match for a ham's needs goes a bit beyond the numbers--there are quite a few radios with good scores; and after that it comes down to ergonomics, service, user comfort, and reliability.  

73

Pete
 

I agree.  Sounds like what I posted already:

1. Rob Sherwood has said (multiple times) that he could not live with some of the top radios on his list because of other issues, such as ergonomics and AGC performance.  He has commented on the poor ergonomics of the Elecraft K3.  

2. Anyone who makes a radio purchasing decision by where the radio falls on Sherwood's list, which is sorted by one criteria - narrow spaced dynamic range,  is a total buffoon.  Sort by another column and the top radio on the list changes.  

3. I challenge anyone to tell the difference in the narrow spaced dynamic of the top ten radios on that list when listening by just by ear and not using a piece of expensive test equipment.  

4. A few dBs of one criteria on a list should not be the criteria for purchasing a radio.

5. The position on Rob Sherwoods list does not negate the fact that the Elecraft radios are plasticy, rattlely, ergonomic failures in radio interface design and have harsh sounding receive.  The KX3 has a toy, rattle-bastard of a speaker too.

Signed "Bob"  ::)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on August 17, 2015, 08:38:47 AM
Hi,

It seems Sherwood Engineering does not agree with some of "expert" assessment of Elecraft vs TenTec  on here:

http://www.sherweng.com/table.html

73 and still,

John W5JON


Hi John,


I don't understand your point?  I like TenTec, and own two Omni VI rigs, and a Paragon II. I prefer the larger panel layout and simplicity, and the fact the radios work to my satisfaction, and also that I can repair them myself.  And, they are dirt cheap these days. I paid 300 bucks for the Omni VI Plus, fully loaded, and the gent was willing to sell it for shipping costs?!?! It took a day or two on the bench and it was good as new. The only bad thing I can note are the few birdies on the low end of the ten meter band. But, I can live with them.

Elecraft makes nice rigs; but I personally don't like the small panel layouts--I have big hands and I am fat fingered.  If I didn't own the TenTec rigs, Elecraft would be my second choice--again because they work well, and I think they are repairable by any ham with any technical background.

As to the Sherwood reviews; the final decision for which radio is the best match for a ham's needs goes a bit beyond the numbers--there are quite a few radios with good scores; and after that it comes down to ergonomics, service, user comfort, and reliability.  

73

Pete






Hi Pete,

I agree with all you say.  I also do not own any TenTec, and the only Elecraft I own is a KPA500, which I really like.  Indeed my opening sentence was without point.

73,

John W5JON
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on August 17, 2015, 08:41:20 AM

"I tell you what cowards do" .......

Yes, you hide behind your anonymity, so you do not have to stand behind your personal insults, and the insults you make about your business competition.    

Still,

John W5JON


You just got your feelings hurt because I shot down your comment about Sherwood's list.  You cannot argue with me on technical points, so instead you focus in on my anonymity.  

Signed "Bob"


And again you ignore, now try and focus........ COMMON COURTESY....... COMMON COURTESY.     

Still.

John W5JON

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 17, 2015, 08:43:54 AM

"I tell you what cowards do" .......

Yes, you hide behind your anonymity, so you do not have to stand behind your personal insults, and the insults you make about your business competition.    

Still,

John W5JON


You just got your feelings hurt because I shot down your comment about Sherwood's list.  You cannot argue with me on technical points, so instead you focus in on my anonymity.  

Signed "Bob"


And again you ignore, now try and focus........ COMMON COURTESY....... COMMON COURTESY.     

Still.

John W5JON



Thank you for demonstrating what I stated earlier: You just got your feelings hurt because I shot down your comment about Sherwood's list.  You cannot argue with me on technical points, so instead you focus in on my anonymity.

Signed "Bob"
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 17, 2015, 08:45:59 AM
Hi John

I fully support American companies.  I've owned too many imports that were virtually repairable once the line was dropped.

TenTec's service has been legendarily.  Elecraft also scores high points; few unhappy customers.  

It will be a sad day when we don't have choices to deal with local companies, based in the USA, who produce decent ham rigs.

BTW, the IGNORE feature works well... if you don't respond to trolls, they will starve to death!!

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on August 17, 2015, 08:59:04 AM
And again you ignore, now try and focus........ COMMON COURTESY....... COMMON COURTESY.     

Still.

John W5JON
Let it go, John. 

Clearly someone is trying to irritate you.  Don't let him, just ignore him.

BTW, thanks for the contest QSO 2 years ago.

73
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on August 17, 2015, 09:40:12 AM

BTW, the IGNORE feature works well... if you don't respond to trolls, they will starve to death!!

Pete


good tip, thanks.  however, it would be great if eham allowed users to turn on an "ignore all anonymous posters" option.
if enough of us used it, eham might see the light :-)  they could always accommodate anonymity by having a small subsection for those unwilling to share their callsign & name...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on August 17, 2015, 11:04:10 AM

And again you ignore, now try and focus........ COMMON COURTESY....... COMMON COURTESY.    
Still.

John W5JON

John follow the others advice, just ignore all his posts and warn others in new threads whenever you see him post to them.  I found another one of these anonymous guys last year on eHam, who was doing the same stuff, I finally realized he was a big forum member on CBTricks and he was only on eHam to irritate Ham operators.  When confronted he admitted it and laughed that he was able to make fools of Ham operators so easily.  In truth he did not make a fool of anyone, but countless people spent time arguing with him.

73s
Rob


Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 17, 2015, 11:20:57 AM
You guys eat it up.  That is why you keep coming back time and time again to post your silly responses.

You all start clucking like old hens in a hen house.  ::)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: ZS6DX on August 17, 2015, 11:23:56 AM
Ignore list updated.....

Wish I could get my hands on a local Ten-Tec but have not seen one yet, the other option is eBay but that is always a risk.

My collection would not be complete without a Ten-Tec  ;D

73, Rudi de ZS6DX
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 26, 2015, 03:05:33 AM
I was on the Yahoo Groups TT Patriot group. Apparently those trying to get a Patriot have to wait months and months. Some ordered in June and still no radio. Others ordered and are being told December. So it appears that most of the radios are just not being produced right now. You have to wonder what is going on at TenTec that they cannot manufacture radios? When I was in retailing years ago, they preached the worst sin in retail is being out of stock. Because if customers cannot find it at your place, they will go elsewhere and they might like elsewhere better and start going there to shop and then not ever come back to your store. In other words, you lose customers. If people want radios, many might not be willing to wait and if something better comes along while waiting, they might buy it and not come back. TenTec seems to be poorly managed right now and lacks direction and product. Not good for the long term viability of the company.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 26, 2015, 03:44:08 AM
It is amazing how many people go into denial when confronted with news they don't want to hear.

The same thing happened when I said that GRE was out of business in 2013:

http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,90771.0.html (http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,90771.0.html)

I wonder if those guys in the thread above are still in denial about the now defunct GRE?

The same thing is happening here.  Time will tell.  I'll make sure I give every denier a "told you so" in a year or two.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 26, 2015, 04:01:33 AM
TenTec seems to be poorly managed right now and lacks direction and product. Not good for the long term viability of the company.

That is because the president of the company (after Jack retired) saw the writing on the wall and jumped ship for another job.  Many other long term employees did the same.  When all your talented and experienced people make a mass exodus out of the door it is very hard to find people, who are familiar with that type of business, to replace them.

TEN TEC is located in Sevieville TN where there is not a large pool of talent to pick from.  It is unlikely that too many people would be willing to relocate from somewhere like Colorado to eastern TN unless they are getting ready to retire.  Because, if they did and TEN TEC goes out of business thereafter, there are not many jobs in that area.  Most of the jobs are low paying service jobs in Sevierville, Pigeon Forge, and Gatlinburg, and Maryville.  There are very few technology jobs.  A TEN TEC manager or engineer could quickly find themselves as an employee of Cracker Barrel or McDonalds in that area.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on August 26, 2015, 05:00:29 AM
Did someone say something?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 27, 2015, 06:23:18 AM
I think I have to agree with anonymous. What I am seeing is not the mark of a growing company. Seemingly no products being produced, no word from the company as to what is going on, fire sale on the Eagle radio, shrinking number of models, people who say radios are on backorder for months, yet that is not indicated on the website, I mean you have to ask WTF is going on?

On the other hand, Elecraft is bringing on new models, demand is high, satisfaction is high, so things must be good there. It seems to me Elecraft has taken over the market for U.S. manufactured radios leaving TenTec to die on the vine. BTW, I do not own an Elecraft but have owned many TenTec radios and still have a Rebel and a Patriot.

The new owners of TenTec would be well served to issue some sort of statement as to their plans and direction. Silence is deafening and giving customers a very uneasy feeling.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on August 27, 2015, 07:19:47 AM
I would be lying if I didn't admit that I find the lack of news troubling, and that I'm concerned about the future of the company.

However, no news is not necessarily bad news. 

I remain hopeful that the new ownership & management are hard at work getting things back in order, and just don't feel (correctly or not) the need to broadcast it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 27, 2015, 10:00:39 AM
But I think no news is bad news. The new owners have to have some clue that customers are concerned. I find it hard to believe they are completely in the dark on this. So that being said, you would think they would put something out there to calm the fears.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on August 27, 2015, 04:20:47 PM
I would be lying if I didn't admit that I find the lack of news troubling, and that I'm concerned about the future of the company.

However, no news is not necessarily bad news. 

I remain hopeful that the new ownership & management are hard at work getting things back in order, and just don't feel (correctly or not) the need to broadcast it.

Very wishful thinking. You snooze you loose in this market and TenTec is in a coma....
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3OWL on August 27, 2015, 04:37:58 PM
I've had to return my Argonaut VI for warranty work three times since receiving it in Nov. 2014.  It's been at the TT shop for 5 weeks and no word from anyone.  At this point I'd just like to get my money back and forget TT in the future. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 28, 2015, 02:56:10 AM
I've had to return my Argonaut VI for warranty work three times since receiving it in Nov. 2014.  It's been at the TT shop for 5 weeks and no word from anyone.  At this point I'd just like to get my money back and forget TT in the future. 

TenTec service used to be lightening fast. Five weeks! Try calling Stan and asking him what is happening at TenTec. Service taking forever, no products seemingly being manufactured. Tell him you want to know what's up with your radio and customers are really concerned the company is cratering. Would love to hear an honest response.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WK3B on August 28, 2015, 07:36:16 AM
I posted a thread back in May on QRZ when I first noticed the OMNI-VII not in production.  Everyone told me then that I was making a big deal out of nothing.  We shall see what happens, but I think it is becoming apparent that changes are afoot at RKR/Ten-Tec/Alpha.  They may be, like smart businessmen should, re-thinking the company direction and how to turn it profitable.  Using contractors to do design work may make better sense than having a very small in-house staff.  Maybe shifting product focus.  I'm sure the service organization was disrupted during the move, and the recent sales have increased the number of units out there, some of which may need repair.  Oh, and the company was sold again.  A lot of change in a short time for a small company.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on August 28, 2015, 11:40:09 AM
Instead of everyone guessing, why not somebody have a nice chat with those in charge? That would end the speculation and rumors. Or better yet, why not invite them to post here and other forums where their Amateur Radio customers can be informed?

In a way, they may come to understand the concern of their customers if they are not totally up to date to the concerns.

Guessing and rumors are basically useless.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 28, 2015, 01:03:21 PM
Instead of everyone guessing, why not somebody have a nice chat with those in charge? That would end the speculation and rumors. Or better yet, why not invite them to post here and other forums where their Amateur Radio customers can be informed?

In a way, they may come to understand the concern of their customers if they are not totally up to date to the concerns.

Guessing and rumors are basically useless.

Excellent idea! Thank you for volunteering!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 28, 2015, 01:32:09 PM
I posted a thread back in May on QRZ when I first noticed the OMNI-VII not in production.

Why does that product still show on their website as being available? Can you show us where the Omni VII has been discontinued??

http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/products/transceivers-receivers/

http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/products/transceivers-receivers/ten-tec-model-588at-omni-vii-with-auto-tuner/

Too much speculation, and incorrect information.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 28, 2015, 03:57:05 PM
I posted a thread back in May on QRZ when I first noticed the OMNI-VII not in production.

Why does that product still show on their website as being available? Can you show us where the Omni VII has been discontinued??

http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/products/transceivers-receivers/

http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/products/transceivers-receivers/ten-tec-model-588at-omni-vii-with-auto-tuner/

Too much speculation, and incorrect information.

Pete

He said not in production.  He did not say discontinued. 

The TEN TEC website says: "Sold Out. Orders accepted when production parts become available."

That is not a good sign.   Sounds like the future of the OMNI VII is uncertain.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on August 28, 2015, 06:05:54 PM
I've had to return my Argonaut VI for warranty work three times since receiving it in Nov. 2014.  It's been at the TT shop for 5 weeks and no word from anyone.  At this point I'd just like to get my money back and forget TT in the future. 

Get it back ASAP, even if it's not fixed.  I know a couple of guys who had sent THP amps back to Japan just before they closed and those amps have been lost for good.  The fact that RKR has not sent someone onto the forum to give us some reassurances is either a very naive business move or a sign that they are not going to make any false promises.


73s
Rob
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 29, 2015, 03:55:48 AM
Rob I agree. One suggestion made was to have someone call TenTec and ask them to get on the boards and offer an explanation.

However, after thinking about this, in this day and age with all the social media, I think it is the responsibility of the company to monitor the more popular ham social media sites like this one and QRZ and respond to comments about their company, direction, lack of product, service issues, etc. Good companies do exactly that, but the only thing from the "new" TenTec is the sound of crickets.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3OWL on August 29, 2015, 09:53:45 AM
Well, what a surprise/coincidence (?).  Within 24 hours of my post, I received a phone call from a TT service guy.  It was clear from his line of questioning that no one had even looked at this Argonaut until recently.  I'm guessing that it just sat on a shelf for the first 4 weeks.  He promised to "continue checking it out" and let me know something soon.  This is easily the worst rig I have ever owned, and the worst warranty repair I have experienced since being licensed in 1970. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on August 29, 2015, 10:18:56 AM
Rob I agree. One suggestion made was to have someone call TenTec and ask them to get on the boards and offer an explanation.

However, after thinking about this, in this day and age with all the social media, I think it is the responsibility of the company to monitor the more popular ham social media sites like this one and QRZ and respond to comments about their company, direction, lack of product, service issues, etc. Good companies do exactly that, but the only thing from the "new" TenTec is the sound of crickets.

I Completely Agree, if they don't think its worth the effort to reassure customers, then something must be up.

As for W3OWL, I don't think it's coincidence, he was the only one who came on the forum with concrete evidence that something had seriously changed and now they respond toot sweet with reassurances.  If it was me I would still get my rig out of there as fast as possible.

73s
Rob

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N2SR on August 29, 2015, 12:40:49 PM
Instead of everyone guessing, why not somebody have a nice chat with those in charge? That would end the speculation and rumors. Or better yet, why not invite them to post here and other forums where their Amateur Radio customers can be informed?

In a way, they may come to understand the concern of their customers if they are not totally up to date to the concerns.

Guessing and rumors are basically useless.

If you think that the CEO is going to waste his time logging on to a ham radio forum board to post an honest answer to your (and anyone else's) questions, I've got a bridge to sell you.  It's a used bridge.  Kinda old, but in decent shape.  It's still in use today, so you could still use it.

That would be like getting a straight answer from your company's CEO, or even your own boss.

Good Luck with that.

Tom, N2SR
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on August 29, 2015, 01:34:35 PM
Instead of everyone guessing, why not somebody have a nice chat with those in charge? That would end the speculation and rumors. Or better yet, why not invite them to post here and other forums where their Amateur Radio customers can be informed?

In a way, they may come to understand the concern of their customers if they are not totally up to date to the concerns.

Guessing and rumors are basically useless.

If you think that the CEO is going to waste his time logging on to a ham radio forum board to post an honest answer to your (and anyone else's) questions, I've got a bridge to sell you.  It's a used bridge.  Kinda old, but in decent shape.  It's still in use today, so you could still use it.

That would be like getting a straight answer from your company's CEO, or even your own boss.

Good Luck with that.

Tom, N2SR


Do you ever go on to Amazon and look at the reviews?  Take a look at the replies to some of the negative reviews.  A lot of the companies actually have an employee that spends a few hours each day answering reviews that are complaints and offering a number to reach them at.  That's what a company does when it's serious about customer satisfaction and the potential loss of revenue that one negative review can have.  Many people get their problems fixed and one star reviews get replaced by 5 stars.

If your selling Ham Gear and have a major 10 page thread like this festering on one of the largest Ham forums, you sure as hell send in an employee to clarify the situation before the rumors start to spread.  And yes if I was the CEO of RKR and I knew this thread was just BS I would come on the forum and personally make a statement.  At the very least he could ask one of his assistants to do a post.  How many sales have they lost due to this thread?

The silence is deafening!

73s
Rob
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 29, 2015, 03:28:45 PM
What is amazing to me is that they do not have any OMNI VII radios to sell and no estimated  date at all in the future when it will be available again.  I can see running out of stock on a new rig, like Flex did when they announced the 6300, but Flex gave an estimate of three months before the next production run was ready.  TEN TEC can't even give a tentitive date! TEN TEC has been selling the OMNI VII for how long now?  I think the OMNI VII will never be produced again.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N5PG on August 29, 2015, 03:58:57 PM
I almost bought an Eagle in the big sale but I was too late. They said more would come in six weeks or so so who knows?

Maybe some locals could do a drive-by and take a look at the parking lot.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on August 29, 2015, 08:08:00 PM
Instead of everyone guessing, why not somebody have a nice chat with those in charge? That would end the speculation and rumors. Or better yet, why not invite them to post here and other forums where their Amateur Radio customers can be informed?

In a way, they may come to understand the concern of their customers if they are not totally up to date to the concerns.

Guessing and rumors are basically useless.

If you think that the CEO is going to waste his time logging on to a ham radio forum board to post an honest answer to your (and anyone else's) questions, I've got a bridge to sell you.  It's a used bridge.  Kinda old, but in decent shape.  It's still in use today, so you could still use it.

That would be like getting a straight answer from your company's CEO, or even your own boss.

Good Luck with that.

Tom, N2SR


If you have a clear legal title, might be worth the investment. Otherwise the comment is useless.

And yes, my boss gives me clear concise answers when asked. Just need to work for a good company.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8VVE on August 30, 2015, 04:13:44 AM
Paul, N5PG, if you are looking for a new TT Eagle drop me an email.
Sam W8VVE.  nwsam"at"ntelos.net
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 30, 2015, 04:27:01 AM
Paul, N5PG, if you are looking for a new TT Eagle drop me an email.
Sam W8VVE.  xxxxx@ntelos.net

By posting your email in this forum, you set yourself up to be a huge spam magnet.  You might want to edit your post.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 30, 2015, 04:27:35 AM
And yes, my boss gives me clear concise answers when asked. Just need to work for a good company.

Or so you think...  ::)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on August 30, 2015, 05:27:40 AM
And yes, my boss gives me clear concise answers when asked. Just need to work for a good company.

Or so you think...  ::)

Has never given me bad information yet...and it has been 5 years now...so I know, not think.

Nice try.

Besides if he did not, the product we make would not work with bad information. Like I said try working for a good company and you just don't have those problems.

Or is it just your own paranoia?

Or is it just you trying desperately to feel good about yourself?

What is your call anyway? Otherwise your commentary has little to no value.

Of course your attempts to make people argue also give you little credibility, so it really doesn't matter if you answer or not. So don't bother answering. Its a waste of everyone's time. But somehow I know you will...its what you do!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N3QE on August 30, 2015, 06:13:07 AM
I've dealt with Ten-Tec service in the past year, since their acquisition by Alpha, and they were very quick to acknowledge a problem with one of their parts suppliers and repair the rig with fast turnaround and excellent communications at every step. I got to talk to the folks in Tennessee but a lot of the paperwork and E-mails had Alpha's Colorado address.

Obviously I would've been happier if the rig hadn't come with a flaky relay, at the same time (from my day job) I know that the parts supply chain for relays has been tumultuous in recent years and was very impressed at how efficiently and effectively they dealt with the situation.

I now have two Ten-Tec Eagles and am very happy, with over 100,000 QSO's on the "old one" and about 30,000 QSO's on the "new one". They are now used SO2R.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N2SR on August 30, 2015, 10:21:28 AM
Instead of everyone guessing, why not somebody have a nice chat with those in charge? That would end the speculation and rumors. Or better yet, why not invite them to post here and other forums where their Amateur Radio customers can be informed?

In a way, they may come to understand the concern of their customers if they are not totally up to date to the concerns.

Guessing and rumors are basically useless.

If you think that the CEO is going to waste his time logging on to a ham radio forum board to post an honest answer to your (and anyone else's) questions, I've got a bridge to sell you.  It's a used bridge.  Kinda old, but in decent shape.  It's still in use today, so you could still use it.

That would be like getting a straight answer from your company's CEO, or even your own boss.

Good Luck with that.

Tom, N2SR


Do you ever go on to Amazon and look at the reviews?  Take a look at the replies to some of the negative reviews.  A lot of the companies actually have an employee that spends a few hours each day answering reviews that are complaints and offering a number to reach them at.  That's what a company does when it's serious about customer satisfaction and the potential loss of revenue that one negative review can have.  Many people get their problems fixed and one star reviews get replaced by 5 stars.

If your [sic] selling Ham Gear and have a major 10 page thread like this festering on one of the largest Ham forums, you sure as hell send in an employee to clarify the situation before the rumors start to spread.  And yes if I was the CEO of RKR and I knew this thread was just BS I would come on the forum and personally make a statement.  At the very least he could ask one of his assistants to do a post.  How many sales have they lost due to this thread?

The silence is deafening!

73s
Rob

Oh wow.  I didn't realize that RKR would pay someone to surf the internet all day looking for "bad" posts about their company, and then post some serious answers to said questions, all while alleviating all of the concern that everyone has. 

How much do you think a job like that is worth?  Lesee, in Colorado, it might be $15/hour, no?   Maybe you should apply and see what kind of real information you get out of them so you can tell all your friends.  It would probably go something like:
"We are doing all we can to maintain our customers loyalty during this changeover to RKR.  Please bear with is as we evaluate our product lines and rest assured we are preparing to bring out some new and exciting products that will absolutely wow our previous customer and future customers!  Stay tuned!"

How was that? 

Do you think GM cares about why they screwed customers with that ignition switch issue? 
Do you think that Tokyo High Power was all that concerned about their customers? 

If I were you, I'd keep a computer handy so that you can be the first to read and disseminate any new and exciting news from RKR! 


Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 30, 2015, 10:31:41 AM
And yes, my boss gives me clear concise answers when asked. Just need to work for a good company.

Or so you think...  ::)

Has never given me bad information yet...and it has been 5 years now...so I know, not think.

Nice try.

Besides if he did not, the product we make would not work with bad information. Like I said try working for a good company and you just don't have those problems.

Or is it just your own paranoia?

Or is it just you trying desperately to feel good about yourself?

What is your call anyway? Otherwise your commentary has little to no value.

Of course your attempts to make people argue also give you little credibility, so it really doesn't matter if you answer or not. So don't bother answering. Its a waste of everyone's time. But somehow I know you will...its what you do!

Or maybe you are just delusional?

And, if I have so little credibility as you say, why do you always compulsively respond to my posts in a defensive tone?  Oh, I know, it's what you do.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: NI0C on August 30, 2015, 02:35:45 PM
I've dealt with Ten-Tec service in the past year, since their acquisition by Alpha, and they were very quick to acknowledge a problem with one of their parts suppliers and repair the rig with fast turnaround and excellent communications at every step. I got to talk to the folks in Tennessee but a lot of the paperwork and E-mails had Alpha's Colorado address.

Obviously I would've been happier if the rig hadn't come with a flaky relay, at the same time (from my day job) I know that the parts supply chain for relays has been tumultuous in recent years and was very impressed at how efficiently and effectively they dealt with the situation.

I now have two Ten-Tec Eagles and am very happy, with over 100,000 QSO's on the "old one" and about 30,000 QSO's on the "new one". They are now used SO2R.
I had my Ten Tec Centurion serviced at the factory last December.  Turn around time was quick and the amplifier works great. Several weeks ago, I recommended the Eagle to a newly licensed local ham when the sale price was announced, and he was able to snatch one up before the price went back up. 
73,
Chuck  NI0C
 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on August 30, 2015, 04:52:41 PM
Do you ever go on to Amazon and look at the reviews?  Take a look at the replies to some of the negative reviews.  A lot of the companies actually have an employee that spends a few hours each day answering reviews that are complaints and offering a number to reach them at.  That's what a company does when it's serious about customer satisfaction and the potential loss of revenue that one negative review can have.  Many people get their problems fixed and one star reviews get replaced by 5 stars.

If your [sic] selling Ham Gear and have a major 10 page thread like this festering on one of the largest Ham forums, you sure as hell send in an employee to clarify the situation before the rumors start to spread.  And yes if I was the CEO of RKR and I knew this thread was just BS I would come on the forum and personally make a statement.  At the very least he could ask one of his assistants to do a post.  How many sales have they lost due to this thread?

The silence is deafening!

73s
Rob

Oh wow.  I didn't realize that RKR would pay someone to surf the internet all day looking for "bad" posts about their company, and then post some serious answers to said questions, all while alleviating all of the concern that everyone has. 

--SNIP--- 


Yes your so right  ::)
It's much better to just sit back and have the rumors spreading while your sales are dropping.  I guess it's only the really stupid companies that come to this section of the forum and present their side of the story when they see incorrect information being posted.  If you think RKR does not know about this thread I also have a bridge you might be interested in buying ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on August 30, 2015, 07:27:35 PM
And yes, my boss gives me clear concise answers when asked. Just need to work for a good company.

Or so you think...  ::)

Has never given me bad information yet...and it has been 5 years now...so I know, not think.

Nice try.

Besides if he did not, the product we make would not work with bad information. Like I said try working for a good company and you just don't have those problems.

Or is it just your own paranoia?

Or is it just you trying desperately to feel good about yourself?

What is your call anyway? Otherwise your commentary has little to no value.

Of course your attempts to make people argue also give you little credibility, so it really doesn't matter if you answer or not. So don't bother answering. Its a waste of everyone's time. But somehow I know you will...its what you do!

Or maybe you are just delusional?

And, if I have so little credibility as you say, why do you always compulsively respond to my posts in a defensive tone?  Oh, I know, it's what you do.

LOL I rest my case!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on August 31, 2015, 03:22:57 AM
And yes, my boss gives me clear concise answers when asked. Just need to work for a good company.

Or so you think...  ::)

Has never given me bad information yet...and it has been 5 years now...so I know, not think.

Nice try.

Besides if he did not, the product we make would not work with bad information. Like I said try working for a good company and you just don't have those problems.

Or is it just your own paranoia?

Or is it just you trying desperately to feel good about yourself?

What is your call anyway? Otherwise your commentary has little to no value.

Of course your attempts to make people argue also give you little credibility, so it really doesn't matter if you answer or not. So don't bother answering. Its a waste of everyone's time. But somehow I know you will...its what you do!

Or maybe you are just delusional?

And, if I have so little credibility as you say, why do you always compulsively respond to my posts in a defensive tone?  Oh, I know, it's what you do.

LOL I rest my case!

Can't fight your compulsion, can you?  LOL I rest MY case!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 31, 2015, 10:55:49 AM
Actually good companies do pay people to check on what customers say about them on the Internet. So in this day and age, yes it is expected. Not that you pay someone to "surf" all day, but it doesn't take a lot of analysis to understand where most hams are discussing topics of interest like this. So they have an admin look at the forums or they have scripts set-up, or third party services are contracted to look for key words that alert them to posts commenting on their company or products and then they respond as appropriate.

Poorly managed companies do not do this and hence why you see companies that ignore social media end up having serious issues. I can think of three in the ham radio business right now who ignored the social media, and ignored their customers, who went through or are still going through difficult financial situations because they ignored social media and their customers. One in particular got adversarial with their customers. I am actually surprised that company is even still in business.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on August 31, 2015, 12:20:50 PM
What is amazing to me is that they do not have any OMNI VII radios to sell and no estimated  date at all in the future when it will be available again.  I can see running out of stock on a new rig, like Flex did when they announced the 6300, but Flex gave an estimate of three months before the next production run was ready.  TEN TEC can't even give a tentitive date! TEN TEC has been selling the OMNI VII for how long now?  I think the OMNI VII will never be produced again.
You would prefer that they picked a date at random, then stalled if the parts they're waiting for would still be unavailable?

I suspect that if they did so, you'd be complaining then, too.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on August 31, 2015, 12:45:48 PM
I really do hope RKR will be successful but if they fold up they will leave a vacuum.  This can't be tolerated so someone will step in to fill the space.   Maybe the Chinese.  At a recent hamfest I saw that over 3/4 of the attendees had Chinese HT's.

That being said, any well operated company would have issued a statement about their future plans if they really give a **** about their loyal customers.

As far as contractual employees, that is the name of the game today -- even in the medical field.

Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 31, 2015, 12:46:38 PM
They probably schedule production runs for the PCB boards according to a schedule.  RKR was the company that provided PC boards for TenTec.  It might make sense that would make the boards in batches, and stick to a plan that also meets the needs of other product lines that they manufacturer?  I guess this is difficult concept for most... but some TenTec radios may not be at top of the food chain for that company.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on August 31, 2015, 02:02:58 PM
Actually good companies do pay people to check on what customers say about them on the Internet. So in this day and age, yes it is expected. Not that you pay someone to "surf" all day, but it doesn't take a lot of analysis to understand where most hams are discussing topics of interest like this. So they have an admin look at the forums or they have scripts set-up, or third party services are contracted to look for key words that alert them to posts commenting on their company or products and then they respond as appropriate.

Poorly managed companies do not do this and hence why you see companies that ignore social media end up having serious issues. I can think of three in the ham radio business right now who ignored the social media, and ignored their customers, who went through or are still going through difficult financial situations because they ignored social media and their customers. One in particular got adversarial with their customers. I am actually surprised that company is even still in business.


i think it is dangerous to make blanket statements without qualifying them with exceptions for the size of the company, their market -- and the possibility that during times of transition they may have other priorities which preclude them from necessarily fitting into the preconceptions of others.

that said some public update, even if quite general, on the mission and likely future of RKR especially with regard to HF xcvrs would probably be a good idea...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on August 31, 2015, 06:10:45 PM
I made no exceptions because there are no exceptions. Regardless of the size of your company, you better pay attention to the customer, how they want to communicate, how they buy and what they are saying about your company and its products. There are no exceptions to good marketing, quality and customer service.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on August 31, 2015, 06:41:29 PM
I made no exceptions because there are no exceptions. Regardless of the size of your company, you better pay attention to the customer, how they want to communicate, how they buy and what they are saying about your company and its products. There are no exceptions to good marketing, quality and customer service.

Exactly! Even mom and pop operations search the relevant review pages to make sure they don't have any festering negative reviews.

Even if RKR is some how not following this practice I am 100% sure that someone has already informed them about this thread. So IMO they either have no good news to give or they are seriously out of touch with the way business works in the Internet age.

73s
Rob
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on August 31, 2015, 06:59:31 PM
I made no exceptions because there are no exceptions. Regardless of the size of your company, you better pay attention to the customer, how they want to communicate, how they buy and what they are saying about your company and its products. There are no exceptions to good marketing, quality and customer service.

Exactly! Even mom and pop operations search the relevant review pages to make sure they don't have any festering negative reviews.

Even if RKR is some how not following this practice I am 100% sure that someone has already informed them about this thread. So IMO they either have no good news to give or they are seriously out of touch with the way business works in the Internet age.

73s
Rob

I agree. And it is a much more plausible guess then many of the rumors.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WE1X on September 01, 2015, 06:03:22 AM
Hmmm....Lots of posturing on this thread likely based upon rumors, assumptions and "insight" from "personal experiences".

Someone(s) stated RKR's sales are plummeting. Have RKR posted their financials?  If not, you don't know.

Is RKR a public or private company? Makes a big difference how information is released, including legal and shareholder obligations.

Apart from amateur radio what lines of business do RKR support? Is the customer base limited to the amateur community?

Does a product's production run tied to demand an indication of a company in trouble, especially when inventory is available for other products and when product support continues? Or is the company being responsible by being responsive to market demand?  Is the Omni VII competitive (price and performance) with other transceivers in the same tier? What are the annual unit sales of Omni VIIs over the past 3 years (to cover Ten Tec and RKR ownership). Growing, flat, dropping?

Whether a company monitors forums and threads isn't the real issue. Why? Because unless they post or respond most of you won't know if they monitor a particular forum or thread. And whether they monitor or not doesn't necessarily make them a good or bad company. Icom, Kenwood, Yaesu, AOR, Flex, Elecraft and others monitor various forums. The Japanese seldom, if ever, respond in public but do so among key individuals (influencers) and stakeholders (senior execs among key retailers).  Flex and Elecraft do respond in a public forum, but often when there is a major negative issue.

As to a comment posted earlier about Tokyo Hy-Power letting it's customers down and thereby implying it was not responsive to the amateur community, nothing could be further from the truth. THP's core business was RF amplifiers for the medical device market.  The tsunami and Fukashima disasters trashed the core business. Management attempted to keep the amateur side of the business going to no avail. Japanese culture and business practices in general did not allow THP to make any public announcements regarding the state is its business and plans for the future. Japanese law regarding acquisitions, copyrights, intellectual property made this even more challenging.

In short it's important to recognize what you don't know.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA5IPF on September 01, 2015, 07:50:10 AM
Well said WE1X.

Most of this thread reminds me of a knitting session where ladies discuss the latest rumors and start new ones.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 02, 2015, 04:51:54 AM
Hmmm....Lots of posturing on this thread likely based upon rumors, assumptions and "insight" from "personal experiences".

Someone(s) stated RKR's sales are plummeting. Have RKR posted their financials?  If not, you don't know.

Is RKR a public or private company? Makes a big difference how information is released, including legal and shareholder obligations.

Apart from amateur radio what lines of business do RKR support? Is the customer base limited to the amateur community?

Does a product's production run tied to demand an indication of a company in trouble, especially when inventory is available for other products and when product support continues? Or is the company being responsible by being responsive to market demand?  Is the Omni VII competitive (price and performance) with other transceivers in the same tier? What are the annual unit sales of Omni VIIs over the past 3 years (to cover Ten Tec and RKR ownership). Growing, flat, dropping?

Whether a company monitors forums and threads isn't the real issue. Why? Because unless they post or respond most of you won't know if they monitor a particular forum or thread. And whether they monitor or not doesn't necessarily make them a good or bad company. Icom, Kenwood, Yaesu, AOR, Flex, Elecraft and others monitor various forums. The Japanese seldom, if ever, respond in public but do so among key individuals (influencers) and stakeholders (senior execs among key retailers).  Flex and Elecraft do respond in a public forum, but often when there is a major negative issue.

As to a comment posted earlier about Tokyo Hy-Power letting it's customers down and thereby implying it was not responsive to the amateur community, nothing could be further from the truth. THP's core business was RF amplifiers for the medical device market.  The tsunami and Fukashima disasters trashed the core business. Management attempted to keep the amateur side of the business going to no avail. Japanese culture and business practices in general did not allow THP to make any public announcements regarding the state is its business and plans for the future. Japanese law regarding acquisitions, copyrights, intellectual property made this even more challenging.

In short it's important to recognize what you don't know.


Well here is what we do know. The number of models of TenTec transceivers being marketed have declined. Those models still carried are mostly out-of-stock. For example, in the Patriot Yahoo Group, one writer said they ordered a Patriot in June and still does not have it. Another writer noted that they ordered one in August and were quoted a December delivery date. The Eagle I believe is also on a delay. I don't know about the Argo.

So some simple logic will tell you if you don't have product to sell, or you have fewer products to sell, then you probably have declining sales. I doubt the Eagle alone (if it is even currently shipping) is making up the lost sales of the Omni, Orion, etc. And remember, they reduced the prices significantly so you have to sell even more radios to make up for the lost margins.

You will never see TenTec/RKR, or whatever they are calling the company, post its numbers because it is a private company. But like many private companies, there are groups out there who develop sales estimates for private companies based on information that can find and analyze.

Whether or not RKR monitors social media is an issue when they leave their customers in the dark. No one wants to buy a radio that is going to be soon orphaned because a company went out of business. I know a lot of Saturn and Pontiac owners who will never buy another GM product because their cars are orphaned and the value declined as a result.

It is interesting in that several months have now past since this latest acquisition of TenTec and no statements of any type from the new owners. That is not typical. In most every acquisition I have witnessed, be it a public or private company, the first thing the acquiring company does is to send out a letter to their customers/market to reassure their customers or tell them how great it is going to be and what their plans are for the future. They want to keep customers engaged and loyal. The sound of crickets is all the TenTec customers and prospective customers are hearing and that is not reassuring at all.

So people can criticize the speculation all they want and condemn it. But it is a natural response to a company with a once loyal following who has not followed good business practices and is not communicating with its customer base. Shame on RKR, not the concerned posters to forums.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on September 02, 2015, 08:09:25 AM
I remember a few years ago when pundits were predicting that Kenwood would be abandoning the ham market and not to expect new product lines.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 02, 2015, 09:09:04 AM
While Kenwood still services the amateur market, I think they are a distant third. I do have a few of their radios. The D710, D72 and the TS-590. That being said, a number of their radios are long in the tooth. Kenwood has not delivered a digital radio of any type to the amateur market. Several of their radios are about 15 years old, which is very old in electronics. So I would not say Kenwood's amateur business is very healthy. Look how long it took them to bring out a high end HF transceiver. But I am glad they still service the amateur market.

There are some rumors that Kenwood is going to introduce a multi-mode digital voice radio. That could be a real boost for them if they can deliver that first.

Some of the areas to look at to judge the health of any company is their product innovation (are they introducing new and innovative products), reputation for quality, high demand/sales of their products, growing product line, facility expansions, ability to meet demand, and excellent customer communication. When you see any or all of those areas lacking, then something is wrong. This is not to say they will go out of business, but it means the company is having difficulty. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 02, 2015, 11:38:13 AM
I remember a few years ago when pundits were predicting that Kenwood would be abandoning the ham market and not to expect new product lines.

Pete

It probably was true.  The company never released anything new for years, they must have abandoned doing any R&D work on ham radio for several years.  It's not uncommon that a new CEO comes in and decides to do something like that and then refocus the budget on a different line of products.  A few years pass, the guy is replaced and a new person comes in and restarts the Ham Radio R&D division.

It would be fair to say that Icom, Kenwood and Yaesu have abandoned the Linear amplifier market.  None of them have developed a new amplifier for years!  Who knows maybe that will change one day but for now it's true.

73s
Rob
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 02, 2015, 12:09:33 PM

As to a comment posted earlier about Tokyo Hy-Power letting it's customers down and thereby implying it was not responsive to the amateur community, nothing could be further from the truth. THP's core business was RF amplifiers for the medical device market.  The tsunami and Fukashima disasters trashed the core business. Management attempted to keep the amateur side of the business going to no avail. Japanese culture and business practices in general did not allow THP to make any public announcements regarding the state is its business and plans for the future. Japanese law regarding acquisitions, copyrights, intellectual property made this even more challenging.

In short it's important to recognize what you don't know.


It's also important not to quote people out of context.  I never said anything about Tokyo Hy-Power letting it's customers down.  I said that people had amplifiers that were sent to THP for repair and when it closed those amplifiers were lost for good.  This will happen when almost any company closes down due to bankruptcy, there are always some peoples stuff that gets caught in the sudden closure.  Who do you contact to get back your stuff back when it's sitting on a repair bench in a padlocked facility?  

So people can criticize the speculation all they want and condemn it. But it is a natural response to a company with a once loyal following who has not followed good business practices and is not communicating with its customer base. Shame on RKR, not the concerned posters to forums.

Exactly right and the fact that WE1X is trying to tell people to turn off their brains and just sit back and wait is kind of crazy.   We can all see that something is not right, he admits that all the other companies reply to these kind of threads either directly or indirectly yet at the same time says we should give RKR a free pass and assume the best.   Personally I have no stake in this, I do not own any Ten-Tec radios or any Alpha amps but I can see when something is obviously wrong with a company.

I was one of the few people arguing with the Group who kept on posting that CQ magazine was going to close.  I recognized that CQ was not responding to the thread just like RKR but the big difference was that in the real world they were trying, it was obvious that they were trying to fix the problems and get the company back up to scratch and thankfully they seem to have succeeded.  On the other hand RKR has neither come to the forum nor is the company making any real world attempts to show that they are moving forward, in fact everything they have done so far smells of liquidation.

73s
Rob
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 02, 2015, 01:53:17 PM
But CQ was horrible at communication. As a result I will NEVER subscribe or buy anything from them and I read many other amateurs who are of the same opinion. While they may have somehow found a way to continue the magazine, it is my opinion what they did or did not do caused themselves substantial damage because of how they ignored and abused their customers. So while they may have survived, the question is will they thrive? My opinion is that they will continue to struggle, it just will not be obvious to the outside world.

It should be a lesson for RKR/TenTec. Ignore your customers, fail to communicate and a similar fate may await.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WE1X on September 02, 2015, 03:39:55 PM

As to a comment posted earlier about Tokyo Hy-Power letting it's customers down and thereby implying it was not responsive to the amateur community, nothing could be further from the truth. THP's core business was RF amplifiers for the medical device market.  The tsunami and Fukashima disasters trashed the core business. Management attempted to keep the amateur side of the business going to no avail. Japanese culture and business practices in general did not allow THP to make any public announcements regarding the state is its business and plans for the future. Japanese law regarding acquisitions, copyrights, intellectual property made this even more challenging.

In short it's important to recognize what you don't know.


It's also important not to quote people out of context.  I never said anything about Tokyo Hy-Power letting it's customers down.  I said that people had amplifiers that were sent to THP for repair and when it closed those amplifiers were lost for good.  This will happen when almost any company closes down due to bankruptcy, there are always some peoples stuff that gets caught in the sudden closure.  Who do you contact to get back your stuff back when it's sitting on a repair bench in a padlocked facility?  

So people can criticize the speculation all they want and condemn it. But it is a natural response to a company with a once loyal following who has not followed good business practices and is not communicating with its customer base. Shame on RKR, not the concerned posters to forums.

Exactly right and the fact that WE1X is trying to tell people to turn off their brains and just sit back and wait is kind of crazy.   We can all see that something is not right, he admits that all the other companies reply to these kind of threads either directly or indirectly yet at the same time says we should give RKR a free pass and assume the best.   Personally I have no stake in this, I do not own any Ten-Tec radios or any Alpha amps but I can see when something is obviously wrong with a company.

I was one of the few people arguing with the Group who kept on posting that CQ magazine was going to close.  I recognized that CQ was not responding to the thread just like RKR but the big difference was that in the real world they were trying, it was obvious that they were trying to fix the problems and get the company back up to scratch and thankfully they seem to have succeeded.  On the other hand RKR has neither come to the forum nor is the company making any real world attempts to show that they are moving forward, in fact everything they have done so far smells of liquidation.

73s
Rob

Rob, Rob, Rob....

First, my reference regarding a comment about THP had nothing to do with you. Chill out and go back a few posts to N2SR. Geeeez!

Second, I'm neither telling nor encouraging anyone not to use their brains. Contrary to your statement, I'm asking people to use their brains. Get the data and not speculate. Ask probing questions instead of posturing.  It wasn't so long ago that a frequent visitor to the various forums claimed that (a) Ten Tec was going out of business due to their location move and (b) Flex was about to go under by taking people's hard earned money as deposits for the then pending 6000 series. He didn't possess any data or info. He lacked any insight into those companies operations. Yet he had no issue disparaging these businesses based upon his "experience". Having run businesses, invested in businesses (mostly start-ups) and represented investors on Boards of Directors I can appreciate good and poor business operations. Further, having been a chief exec of a business going through transition I can attest to the damage done by folks siting on the sidelines and speculating. A natural response to that statement is "well then, they should tell the customers what's going on." Certainly. However, if they do it, when they do it and how they do it are often dictated by other parties and circumstances.

Third, I went to the RKR site. The only transceiver and receiver not available is the OMNI VII and the RX-340.  The OMNI VII is awaiting production ramp up and the RX-340 has been discontinued. There is a notice that the RX-340s been discontinued. There is no notice the OMNI VII has.  Other transceivers, kits, etc. are available. So we have the demise of Ten Tec based upon 1 product that no one knows how many have been sold, whether it's competitive, what the product plans are for it or a successor. Go figure.

Fourth, this is not to say RKR/Ten Tec is or isn't in trouble. I don't know and I won't speculate as I don't have the info.  What I do know is if they are in trouble and depart the amateur community then that's just part of the process that many other fine companies experienced. The sun will rise in the east, set in the west and all of us will go on about our business and hobby.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 02, 2015, 09:06:51 PM

Rob, Rob, Rob....

First, my reference regarding a comment about THP had nothing to do with you. Chill out and go back a few posts to N2SR. Geeeez!

Harry I apologize, I did not realize someone else had mentioned THP in this thread.
My mistake, I should have looked before opening my mouth, sorry.

Second, I'm neither telling nor encouraging anyone not to use their brains. Contrary to your statement, I'm asking people to use their brains. Get the data and not speculate. Ask probing questions instead of posturing.  It wasn't so long ago that a frequent visitor to the various forums claimed that (a) Ten Tec was going out of business due to their location move and (b) Flex was about to go under by taking people's hard earned money as deposits for the then pending 6000 series. He didn't possess any data or info. He lacked any insight into those companies operations. Yet he had no issue disparaging these businesses based upon his "experience". Having run businesses, invested in businesses (mostly start-ups) and represented investors on Boards of Directors I can appreciate good and poor business operations. Further, having been a chief exec of a business going through transition I can attest to the damage done by folks siting on the sidelines and speculating. A natural response to that statement is "well then, they should tell the customers what's going on." Certainly. However, if they do it, when they do it and how they do it are often dictated by other parties and circumstances.

I remember that thread and I think a lot of people were not comfortable with the management change, then the merger and later the acquisition. (going from memory here)
I think this was part one of that sinking feeling that some people felt. At the time I was not sure of what to make of it.

Third, I went to the RKR site. The only transceiver and receiver not available is the OMNI VII and the RX-340.  The OMNI VII is awaiting production ramp up and the RX-340 has been discontinued. There is a notice that the RX-340s been discontinued. There is no notice the OMNI VII has.  Other transceivers, kits, etc. are available. So we have the demise of Ten Tec based upon 1 product that no one knows how many have been sold, whether it's competitive, what the product plans are for it or a successor. Go figure.

Fourth, this is not to say RKR/Ten Tec is or isn't in trouble. I don't know and I won't speculate as I don't have the info.  What I do know is if they are in trouble and depart the amateur community then that's just part of the process that many other fine companies experienced. The sun will rise in the east, set in the west and all of us will go on about our business and hobby.

Harry while I agree that one out of stock model and a discontinued model is not something to start speculating over. I think it adds to the uneasy feeling that many who may be thinking of investing in their products is feeling.  Overall as you said you don't know, I also do not know what is going on and I doubt anybody else on this forum really knows and that in itself is a big problem when you expect a potential customer to plunk down a few thousand dollars on a product that may or may not have any support six months from now.
IMO the compounded changes are serious enough to create doubt and I would think any smart company would address that doubt ASAP.

73s
Rob
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 03, 2015, 04:00:14 AM
WE1X - I don't think the statement on availability is accurate. From what I read in the Yahoo Groups, there aren't any Patriots available either. People who ordered in June have not received their shipments and August orders are being told maybe December.

They had a big sale just a little while ago blowing out the Eagle for just over $1,000. Why I don't really understand, but as I recall, there aren't any Eagles available right now. You can order them, but I am not sure if you are told they are on backorder until the order confirmation.

Because if the folks posting in the Yahoo Groups are correct, and the Patriot is not available for immediate shipment, why isn't that noted on the website now? TenTec used to post that information on their website in the past, but apparently no longer.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WE1X on September 03, 2015, 05:36:29 AM
Rob and 8NUT,

Yes, mergers and moves generate many sinking feelings for customers, suppliers and employees alike. Far too frequently they don't deliver on the promise. Hopefully, RKR-Ten Tec isn't one of them. We should be aware that Ten Tec went into this acquisition/merger for a reason...likely financial, possibly lack of resources for new products to remain competitive...really don't know. I recall that its founder or one of its founders was an active ham responsible for building the amateur part of the business. Maybe with his passing the company's amateur vision or commitment wasn't there. But clearly there was a reason.

And yes, no one wants to put money into a new rig and not have it delivered or supported. I'm there with you. However, over the past 10 years we've been witnessing rigs with relatively short shelf lives...frequent model turnovers, more complexity and reliance on to-be-scarce components...among the Big 3. One of the wonderful things about Ten Tec was / is their support for many of their legacy rigs.

Not being a member of the Ten Tec Yahoo Group I can't comment on what's been said or implied.  I do know RKR was selling the Eagle for about $1500 and continues to do so and at that price it's a really hot rig. . I don't recall it ever being sold for a little over $1000, but I could be wrong.  What we did see with RKR is the pricing of Ten Tec products became far more reasonable and competitive that I think was long overdue. For example, in my opinion Ten Tec's $2100 price tag was unreasonable

In the end people (including me far too frequently) and corporations do stupid stuff. RKR made the investment probably hoping it could revitalize Ten Tec's amateur business. Like many on this threat I hope they succeed.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on September 03, 2015, 01:43:44 PM
It is rather unfair, and a bit odd, to compare RKR to CQ, Kenwood, or even Idiom Press... what have they done to deserve these comments?  If you have doubts, don't place orders, and wait for the dust to settle.  I haven't seen any reports where someone has been ripped off by RKR?  Maybe I missed something? 

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA0HCP on September 03, 2015, 03:10:05 PM
Let's get down to brass tacks....

How's the quality of the janitorial service at RKR/Ten-Tec.  Customers want to know! 

*rolls eyes*
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 03, 2015, 06:25:11 PM
It is rather unfair, and a bit odd, to compare RKR to CQ, Kenwood, or even Idiom Press... what have they done to deserve these comments?  If you have doubts, don't place orders, and wait for the dust to settle.  I haven't seen any reports where someone has been ripped off by RKR?  Maybe I missed something? 

Pete

You have missed the point!
Nobody is talking about ripping anybody off, what we don't want to see is people having doubts and not placing orders and therefore sinking the company. We don't want to lose another ham radio company so we are literally begging them to reassure customers that everything is ok and that a purchase made today will not be regretted later.

73s
Rob
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N2SR on September 04, 2015, 03:17:51 AM
Let's get down to brass tacks....

How's the quality of the janitorial service at RKR/Ten-Tec.  Customers want to know! 

*rolls eyes*

We don't really know.  But I'm sure there is a forum somewhere that is discussing it, where some posters feel that the company is also paying someone to monitor the entire internet for posts about their janitorial service, and that they feel that the CEO should join the forums and make a post to discuss it amongst those who feel they should know.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 04, 2015, 05:16:45 AM


Not being a member of the Ten Tec Yahoo Group I can't comment on what's been said or implied.  I do know RKR was selling the Eagle for about $1500 and continues to do so and at that price it's a really hot rig. . I don't recall it ever being sold for a little over $1000, but I could be wrong.  What we did see with RKR is the pricing of Ten Tec products became far more reasonable and competitive that I think was long overdue. For example, in my opinion Ten Tec's $2100 price tag was unreasonable

In the end people (including me far too frequently) and corporations do stupid stuff. RKR made the investment probably hoping it could revitalize Ten Tec's amateur business. Like many on this threat I hope they succeed.

First, I believe it was July when TenTec had a limited time sale and was selling the Eagle as something like "inventory clearance sale." The price was just over $1,000 including tuner as I recall. Maybe someone can provide more specifics.

Second, here are the posts from the Patriot Yahoo Group:

"Just ordered mine and was told December maybe."
Don Meyerhoff

"Ahoy

have been waiting since the second of June for a 507
anybody else of late received their back ordered Patriot

yours truly
mac"

Both of the above posts were dated August 20, 2015.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on September 04, 2015, 07:05:41 AM
I do know RKR was selling the Eagle for about $1500 and continues to do so and at that price it's a really hot rig. . I don't recall it ever being sold for a little over $1000, but I could be wrong.  What we did see with RKR is the pricing of Ten Tec products became far more reasonable and competitive that I think was long overdue.

In 2014, RF Concepts had a July "MegaSale" and started selling Eagles for $1400. with the Auto-Turner, NB, and 600 Hz filter options included.  They sold out quickly and had to ramp up production with a backlog of just over 3 months.  After July 2014, the deal continued but it went up a 100 bucks to $1500 (and high demand continued).  i will hazard a guess that they probably built & sold more Eagles since 2014 than they did in all the years prior to that despite the original ownership retiring and selling the business

More recently RKR had an Eagle sale and I think it may have been slightly less than the above price but it was a very short-lived deal - if i remember correctly ...

The price for an Eagle now is $1499 (including Factory installed Auto Tuner, 320 Noise Blanker & SSB, CW Roofing filters in 9 MHz IF, and all DSP CW & Sideband filters). 
That is still listed as a sale price (normal price listed as $2193).

http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/products/transceivers-receivers/ten-tec-model-599at-eagle-transceiver-100-watts-if-dsp-with-tuner/ (http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/products/transceivers-receivers/ten-tec-model-599at-eagle-transceiver-100-watts-if-dsp-with-tuner/)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 04, 2015, 10:47:48 AM
You are mostly correct. It was a short-lived deal, I believe it was early July and I think it was $1,069 or $1,169. It was a heck of a deal.

However, to state the "regular price" is $2,193 is kind of silly because the "sale" has now gone on for close to a year. They should just establish the new list at the "sale"  price because I doubt it is ever going to go back up. If it did, they would be none competitive again.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3OWL on September 04, 2015, 12:49:06 PM
I just received an email from TT informing me that my repaired Argonaut VI will be shipped later today.  By the time it arrives here, this will have taken about 8 weeks for warranty repair.  Apparently it was a bad microphone and/or mic cord/connector.  The mic will be replaced under warranty.  So it took TT nearly 7 weeks to figure this out?  I think I'll just keep this thing until the warranty expires in November, then sell it.  My guess is that it will need to be returned for repair again in the next few months.  This will be my first and last TT product.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on September 04, 2015, 02:29:33 PM
I'd be embarrassed to return a rig for warranty repair for a bad microphone.  This hobby has become an appliance operator pursuit.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3OWL on September 04, 2015, 02:46:35 PM
How would I determine the problem with the rig if I did not return the mic also?  Trouble-shoot this myself while still under warranty?  I don't think so.  They built it and provided a 1 year warranty, so back it goes.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 05, 2015, 04:32:47 AM
I agree. Should he spend his time trying to figure out an issue with a radio under warranty? I don't think so. In addition, some manufacturers will not take the word of the owner as to the issue. Before they send out parts, they usually want to investigate the problem themselves.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 05, 2015, 04:35:45 AM
Another interesting tidbit. The TenTec website at the top of the main page, has a scrolling display. When it gets to the Patriot, it says it is available and shipping. However the people trying to buy Patriots are told they are not available now and will be in December - maybe.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9VO on September 05, 2015, 04:49:01 AM
You are mostly correct. It was a short-lived deal, I believe it was early July and I think it was $1,069 or $1,169. It was a heck of a deal.

However, to state the "regular price" is $2,193 is kind of silly because the "sale" has now gone on for close to a year. They should just establish the new list at the "sale"  price because I doubt it is ever going to go back up. If it did, they would be none competitive again.

It actually was 1099.00 and that did include the cw and ssb filters, at and nb plus a microphone. It was the last weekend in july. I'm looking at my receipt that I printed and it is dated the 27th of July.

It was not a unlimited sale and was restricted to "extra" units on hand. Not sure what that meant, but they sold out pretty quick. Not sure of current availability but I have one on the bench right now listening to the breakfast club net.

And while its a great little rig, I'm not ready to sell the K3!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on September 05, 2015, 09:00:31 AM
I honestly suspect RKR sets up production runs for specific boards on a schedule. They may be a small company, and only do specific product runs on a limited basis. There was a long waiting list for the Patriot when it was first announced. 

Personally, I am interested in buying a used Orion, but I will wait until the dust settles. Orions are mostly board level swap repairs, and if RKR abandons the ham market, I suspect repairs will be almost impossible, since there is little service info out there for these radios.  But, the same holds for many other legacy radios: if the uP in my FT-736R is damaged, it also becomes a doorstop.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on September 09, 2015, 02:27:53 PM
I think RKR is just stringing everyone along until they can liquidate Ten Tec's assets.  I did see an article that said Baofeng will be distributing a new product line through RKR in 2016 but time will tell.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on September 09, 2015, 03:20:49 PM
if you go Googling Ten Tec Cabinets, the web pages are still visible.  if you try and order a cabinet, you get what amounts to a cart-blew-up error.  is this just me, or does it look like no more fabrication?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on September 09, 2015, 04:01:29 PM
It was noted eons ago that they sold off the metal fabrication portion of the business when they downsized.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 10, 2015, 04:39:46 AM
I think RKR is just stringing everyone along until they can liquidate Ten Tec's assets.  I did see an article that said Baofeng will be distributing a new product line through RKR in 2016 but time will tell.

If this Baofeng/RKR thing is correct (I did a search and found an article), then in my opinion that is another nail in the coffin. People like me bought TenTec for years because they were solidly American for a long time until they started bringing in the Chinese QRP rigs. Then those disappeared and I thought they regained their sanity.

So when you started putting together TenTec's lack of inventory with this apparent Chinese deal, well the future does not look too good to me.

Maybe it's time for the TenTec loyalists to start moving into being Elecraft loyalists as they may end up being the only American radio company in the not-to-distant future.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on September 10, 2015, 06:31:49 AM
If tentec survives it will be in name sake only with its label of Chinese equipment.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 10, 2015, 07:12:33 AM
That would be great! Love to see $200 hf rigs.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on September 10, 2015, 08:47:43 AM
I find it interesting that only the Elecraft fan club members feel that way.  As far as I knew, there are quite a few American manufacturers that are producing numerous rigs for hams. I'll avoid mentioning the numerous QRP rigs that are being marketed by individuals and QRP groups.

But, I also find it fascinating that companies such as Sienna  (http://www.dzkit.com/), FlexRadio and others are still offering radios for sale. The bias in many of these posts is obvious.

To be honest, it would be a cold day in hell when I would consider any product in the current Elecraft product line.  Personally, I like larger panels with good spacing between knobs or buttons, simple menu systems, etc.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 10, 2015, 12:24:20 PM
Yes, forgot about Flex. It's not a bias. I had a Flex1500 and loved it. Then of course there are all the mini manufacturers, but I was referring to larger more mainstream companies.

I don't have a bias. I owned a bunch of TenTec Radio and still have the Rebel and the Patriot. I had a K1 (?) QRP kit radio that I bought used and it was OK.

So it not really any bias one way or the other. I just don't see any true continuity or vision from TenTec since it went through the first sale and things do not seem to be getting better there. It's a shame really.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 10, 2015, 02:20:20 PM
If tentec survives it will be in name sake only with its label of Chinese equipment.

It kind of makes no sense that they would buy Ten-Tec and then discontinue there product line and sell Chinese radios instead.  I am not sure if they are going to rebadge Chinese HF Radios with the Ten-Tec brand or if they have some sort of other agenda.
Personally I don't see the Chinese ever breaking into the HF market in the USA.  VHF and UHF products are easy to do and they sell by the boat load for all sorts of global industries including the local Chinese business markets.  HF on the other hand is low volume and I just don't see the Chinese getting to involved in that.  Sure some small outfit may try but I doubt your going to find an Icom or Yaesu Chinese equivalent HF manufacturer in China.

73s
Rob
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on September 10, 2015, 02:25:59 PM

I don't have a bias. I owned a bunch of TenTec Radio and still have the Rebel and the Patriot. I had a K1 (?) QRP kit radio that I bought used and it was OK.

So it not really any bias one way or the other. I just don't see any true continuity or vision from TenTec since it went through the first sale and things do not seem to be getting better there. It's a shame really.

it is true that we have not seen continuity or vision from Ten-Tec since the first sale, but absence of something is not proof that it might not re-emerge.  we can presume and suppose, but it is just presumption and supposition.  Changes in ownership often mean changes in direction.

The real shame is when we start funeral proceedings before actually knowing if the party is dead...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 10, 2015, 03:17:56 PM
Hence why I go back to my assertion that no communication is damaging to their brand. For cripe sakes TenTec, communicate with your customers!!!!!!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on September 10, 2015, 04:19:44 PM
if they are still setting things up and ironing out bugs in a new lineup, why rush?  The American ham radio market will not dry up for them if they release good products in the future.  All those Eagles they sold cheap may have been a strategy to hold a customer base till they can get the next lineup pumping out.   i am sure they will communicate their plans when the cement starts hardening.  to do so before would be cart in front of the horse stuff
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 11, 2015, 02:41:32 AM
Wow, well why rush? Because markets today move fast. It's the period of instant gratification, right or wrong, people are not going to wait years because the competition is delivering now. What is there to set-up? There was an existing business set-up and producing radios.

The need to communicate their plans. They need to let people know they are working on new products and exciting ones. If not, people will simply ignore them and move on. People try to imply that the ham radio market is "different" because it is smaller and does not move that fast. The reality is that it does because people are bringing their everyday buying habits into the ham market place. They expect fast delivery, they expect social communication, they expect innovation and they expect inventory on-hand.

Selling radios cheap was not trying to hold on to a market. I am not sure why they did something that crazy as it actually devalued the Eagle in the market, but I am sure it was not to hold onto an eroding customer base.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on September 11, 2015, 03:35:17 AM
If tentec survives it will be in name sake only with its label of Chinese equipment.

It kind of makes no sense that they would buy Ten-Tec and then discontinue there product line and sell Chinese radios instead.  I am not sure if they are going to rebadge Chinese HF Radios with the Ten-Tec brand or if they have some sort of other agenda.


If they go Chinese they would rename/rebadge equipment with name they bought. Actually this scenario is likely only chance they have of staying viable. Would not be the first time a name was bought to use on products made by someone else. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N0YXB on September 11, 2015, 07:42:07 AM

it is true that we have not seen continuity or vision from Ten-Tec since the first sale, but absence of something is not proof that it might not re-emerge.  we can presume and suppose, but it is just presumption and supposition.  Changes in ownership often mean changes in direction.

The real shame is when we start funeral proceedings before actually knowing if the party is dead...

Indeed, there sure is a lot of idle speculation going on here.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 11, 2015, 07:50:48 AM
Yea if there is no news, lets make something up, claim its from someone who knows (unidentified of course), and spread it around the forums as gospel!  ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on September 11, 2015, 10:00:05 AM
there are plenty of examples where "build a community" publicity has worked out well.  might start a firestorm by mentioning the endless ramp-up of Signal/One sort of in public, but it generated lots of interest in its day.  and something just over 1400 radios all told came out of it.  along with some terrible stories of rip-off.

there are also plenty of examples of buying a company to kill the competition, mostly but not all in the computer/software sphere.  if the new owners were going to swing Tennessee "titan" Ten-Tec to a dockside vendor, this would be one way to do it.

if they got in over their heads and figured on liquidating the company at this point, well, the pattern is there, too.

only one way to end the wild speculations, RKR.......
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on September 11, 2015, 11:32:46 AM
RKR was supplying boards for TenTec and building the Alpha amps.  Nothing news here... they took over two ailing companies. If you look at their webpages they have a large number of active products, and a few in the pipeline.  They may continue on with a much more refined and reduced TenTen line, while concentrating on a few promised new Alpha products... or they just might stick with government contracts.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 11, 2015, 11:37:43 AM
Yea if there is no news, lets make something up, claim its from someone who knows (unidentified of course), and spread it around the forums as gospel!  ;)

Did I miss something?  Did someone make a claim that they got some inside information from RKR?   I think in the first few pages they said one engineering employee left and that was indeed fact and someone said things are not good over there.  In the last 5-6 or pages I don't recall anyone saying they had spoken to someone in RKR or that they had heard anything.  If I am wrong please let me know the post number, I would like to read this post myself.

73s
Rob
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 11, 2015, 11:52:00 AM
only one way to end the wild speculations, RKR.......
Some people on this forum seem to lack any business experience, that's why they think silence from RKR does not mean anything or they think that it's RKR's right to remain silent if they feel like.  The second part may be true, just like it's anyone's right to put a gun to their head and blow their brains out.  
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 11, 2015, 12:25:02 PM
Yea if there is no news, lets make something up, claim its from someone who knows (unidentified of course), and spread it around the forums as gospel!  ;)

Did I miss something?  Did someone make a claim that they got some inside information from RKR?   I think in the first few pages they said one engineering employee left and that was indeed fact and someone said things are not good over there.  In the last 5-6 or pages I don't recall anyone saying they had spoken to someone in RKR or that they had heard anything.  If I am wrong please let me know the post number, I would like to read this post myself.

73s
Rob

Guess you need to read em all! That's what I did.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 11, 2015, 06:15:50 PM
Yea if there is no news, lets make something up, claim its from someone who knows (unidentified of course), and spread it around the forums as gospel!  ;)

Did I miss something?  Did someone make a claim that they got some inside information from RKR?   I think in the first few pages they said one engineering employee left and that was indeed fact and someone said things are not good over there.  In the last 5-6 or pages I don't recall anyone saying they had spoken to someone in RKR or that they had heard anything.  If I am wrong please let me know the post number, I would like to read this post myself.

73s
Rob

Guess you need to read em all! That's what I did.

No thanks!
I suspect you pulled that statement out of thin air and have nothing to back it up.
I am not going to search for information on it. You said it, so its your burden of prove it. I hope your not writing your own gospel.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AB4D on September 11, 2015, 08:50:23 PM
I did see an article that said Baofeng will be distributing a new product line through RKR in 2016 but time will tell.

I see there's another person who's been fooled by the infamous Factual Amateur Radio Technology Service.  I thought most know, that everything they publish is horse malarkey stories.  I figure the photo of Groucho Marx on the site and the name (FARTS) would be enough to tip off most hams ::), that true news is not posted on the FARTS Wordpress page. It would be nice if people didn't spout inaccurate information as it's factual from a parody site.


"Factual Amateur Radio Technology Services

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We’re often asked where we get our information.  We use a number of sources to provide you with up to date information, most of them credible, but all of them wishing to remain anonymous.

Additionally, we use the Internet.  If it’s published on the Internet, it must be true!

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Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 11, 2015, 09:30:34 PM
Yea if there is no news, lets make something up, claim its from someone who knows (unidentified of course), and spread it around the forums as gospel!  ;)

Did I miss something?  Did someone make a claim that they got some inside information from RKR?   I think in the first few pages they said one engineering employee left and that was indeed fact and someone said things are not good over there.  In the last 5-6 or pages I don't recall anyone saying they had spoken to someone in RKR or that they had heard anything.  If I am wrong please let me know the post number, I would like to read this post myself.

73s
Rob

Guess you need to read em all! That's what I did.

No thanks!
I suspect you pulled that statement out of thin air and have nothing to back it up.
I am not going to search for information on it. You said it, so its your burden of prove it. I hope your not writing your own gospel.

I stopped reading for other people. Not my problem you can't or won't do your own research. But a hint, you need to go back farther then you did, or at least what you said you did. Another hint, it came from anonymous sources.

As to gospel...the wink should have given the clue the statement was just a general statement aimed at no one. Just a comment on the state of this thread. Everyone is guessing since the company itself is not saying anything.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N2SR on September 12, 2015, 05:59:15 AM
Yea if there is no news, lets make something up, claim its from someone who knows (unidentified of course), and spread it around the forums as gospel!  ;)

And when someone makes comments against the grain of the funeral community, that person also gets cruicifed because they dare to make said comments against the funeral committee.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on September 12, 2015, 09:19:04 AM

And when someone makes comments against the grain of the funeral community, that person also gets cruicifed because they dare to make said comments against the funeral committee.


LOL, just what is it makes that funeral committee so tight?  :-\ 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 12, 2015, 11:03:46 AM
I did see an article that said Baofeng will be distributing a new product line through RKR in 2016 but time will tell.

I see there's another person who's been fooled by the infamous Factual Amateur Radio Technology Service.  I thought most know, that everything they publish is horse malarkey stories.  I figure the photo of Groucho Marx on the site and the name (FARTS) would be enough to tip off most hams ::), that true news is not posted on the FARTS Wordpress page. It would be nice if people didn't spout inaccurate information as it's factual from a parody site.
--SNIP--

If RKR was just adding new Baofeng VHF/UHF equipment to their lineup that would be no surprise!  It would just be "Welcome to the club" of Baofeng and Wouxun distributors, there are now so many Ham companies that sell their stuff it's hard to keep up.  So if that was the great rumor it would not matter one way or the other.    On the other hand if RKR was having Baofeng make HF equipment exclusively for them and planned on rebadging it, that would be real news and as I said in an earlier post I seriously doubted it and dismissed it out of hand until I see it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA0HCP on September 13, 2015, 01:55:48 PM

And when someone makes comments against the grain of the funeral community, that person also gets cruicifed because they dare to make said comments against the funeral committee.


LOL, just what is it makes that funeral committee so tight?  :-\ 

Their shared brand of antisocial behavior.  ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 15, 2015, 01:28:19 PM

And when someone makes comments against the grain of the funeral community, that person also gets cruicifed because they dare to make said comments against the funeral committee.


LOL, just what is it makes that funeral committee so tight?  :-\ 

Their shared brand of antisocial behavior.  ;)


Sounds like 1984 has finally arrived in 2015  ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 21, 2015, 05:58:42 AM
Very interesting that the October 2015 edition of QST has not a single ad for Alpha, RKR, or TenTec. When you are selling direct, I think you need to advertise on a consistent basis.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on September 21, 2015, 09:07:13 AM
(for the hopers in the crowd, and to avoid legal entanglements, thank you)

there is a lead time for placing advertising.  most periodical schedules require the copy and the check from 3 to 6 months before the cover date.  I am not in a position to know what QST's schedule is, but it appears to be a couple months before the copy date for material (contests, especially) locks.  some publishers will let you submit standard ads to hold the space with a possibility of sending a new page a couple days before the mag goes to press, if you dangle some extra scratch for the privilege.

there always is another explanation...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 21, 2015, 09:43:02 AM
I think they are well aware of the ad requirements since they - RKR- did place ads in previous issues of QST.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on September 21, 2015, 10:29:34 AM
RKR's  products are shown on their websites. If the product is not currently in production the website shows it as such.

I'd rather see them plow limited funds into finishing promised products, rather than advertising fluff.  Advertising costs money that could be better used for product development or to fund further production runs. Best to have the products ready to deliver, before advertising...

Or, do any of you haters think the Idiom Press line of BS was better??????  Really??  You guys need a life-- unless you can show where RKR has ever screwed anyone out of money or funds.  Why such hatred for a company that has taken over two failing American manufacturers??  And, if they had advertised, how many of the guys bitching on here would be buying Alpha Amps or TenTec rigs?  Good God. Give them a chance to succeed before slandering them into the ground.

Peter
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 21, 2015, 11:16:48 AM
I know that politicians now profess disagreement as hatred and try to push that on people in order to try to better control them but the reality is, disagreement is not hatred.

The quickest way to kill off a company is to stop marketing and advertising. I know you want them to put money into product instead of advertising, but the reality is that both are required. One without the other simply will not work and will lead to a decline in both sales, products and quality of product.

Some people will back TenTec and other companies no matter what they do or don't do. Others when they see something they do not like, or question the direction of a company or product, will call them out on it. That does not make us haters or want to see a company fail. We simply want to see them do better, better communicate or whatever.

As for TenTec's website showing stock status, I would disagree. For example, the Patriot shows as taking orders. It does not show that there is no current inventory. Yet, if you go to the Patriot group on Yahoo Groups, you'll see post of people who have ordered back in June, and August, who still do not have a Patriot and the August guy was told "maybe" December.

So TenTec's actions are puzzling at best right now and I know giving many of us a reason to be concerned.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on September 22, 2015, 04:38:40 AM
The quickest way to kill off a company is to stop marketing and advertising. I know you want them to put money into product instead of advertising, but the reality is that both are required. One without the other simply will not work and will lead to a decline in both sales, products and quality of product.

That depends on the product. Some do well simply by word of mouth if it is a good product. Marginal products need advertising more to convince you that you really need to buy it.

So TenTec's actions are puzzling at best right now and I know giving many of us a reason to be concerned.

Puzzling if you are wearing rose colored glasses maybe. If you see clearly the writing is on the wall here.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on September 22, 2015, 10:42:20 AM
must be a slow week for the
Quote
"entity-X-looks-ill-to-us-so-let's-plan-the-funeral"
Committee  ::)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on September 22, 2015, 10:54:22 AM
I
As for TenTec's website showing stock status, I would disagree. For example, the Patriot shows as taking orders. It does not show that there is no current inventory. Yet, if you go to the Patriot group on Yahoo Groups, you'll see post of people who have ordered back in June, and August, who still do not have a Patriot and the August guy was told "maybe" December.

So TenTec's actions are puzzling at best right now and I know giving many of us a reason to be concerned.

The point is they show their NO current inventory. They are NOT taking money for products that aren't currently available. Big difference. There is no attempt at deceit. What is available is available. What isn't isn't. Either wait, or buy something else.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 23, 2015, 02:23:32 AM
I agree there is no attempt at deceipt but don't the other things make you the least bit suspicious? Reduced Sales, Reduced inventory and no advertising!
That's not a recipe for success but more like disaster.

Rob
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 23, 2015, 03:34:36 AM
I agree there is no attempt at deceipt but don't the other things make you the least bit suspicious? Reduced Sales, Reduced inventory and no advertising!
That's not a recipe for success but more like disaster.

Rob

Concerned, maybe. Suspicious, of what? I can see where it is a concern to TT people. But suspicious? Again too many here is taking a tid bit of info and writing a death sentence to a company in transition. Did you ever stop and think that advertising is suspended so they don't make promises that they can't keep at the moment? And wouldn't that keep them on a higher moral standard rather then suspicious?

Again, this whole thread is nothing but rumors and speculation. The people that really know are not talking at the moment. And until they do, this entire thread is useless.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 23, 2015, 05:33:59 AM
I think some of the comments here show some ignorance on proper business practices. Word of mouth does not maximize sales. It may sell some products, but will not provide for maximum sales penetration of a given market. In other words, a company MUST market and advertise their products to be fully successful.

Second, no one said they were trying to deceive anyone. However, they are not keeping their website up to date and fully informing the customer of the accurate stock and delivery information.

Frankly, I think it is just laziness to not frequently update the website; or maybe they are simply downsizing TenTec to operate more along the lines of how some of the kit producers operate. They make a batch, it sells out, then it takes a while until they kit the next batch. Then the cycle repeats. New products being few and far in between.

I am not sure the new owners have the passion for TenTec like the original owner and founder and we may never see TenTec return to its former glory that it had 5 to 15 years ago when we saw a lot of new products, high end transceivers and the like.

I'll give them 18 to 21 months to see if the new owners are actually going to do something with TenTec. If we do not see any significant product introductions by Dayton 2017, then I think you could see TenTec slowly and quietly fade away. The amateur radio market is moving too fast and if they cannot keep up with the innovations and products, they are going to fall too far behind to ever catch up again and recapture some of the lost customers.

JMHO
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 23, 2015, 12:02:49 PM
I agree there is no attempt at deceipt but don't the other things make you the least bit suspicious? Reduced Sales, Reduced inventory and no advertising!
That's not a recipe for success but more like disaster.

Rob

Concerned, maybe. Suspicious, of what? I can see where it is a concern to TT people. But suspicious? Again too many here is taking a tid bit of info and writing a death sentence to a company in transition. Did you ever stop and think that advertising is suspended so they don't make promises that they can't keep at the moment? And wouldn't that keep them on a higher moral standard rather then suspicious?

Again, this whole thread is nothing but rumors and speculation. The people that really know are not talking at the moment. And until they do, this entire thread is useless.

As a person who runs a company and has run several before I can tell you straight up that unless these guys at RKR are super wealthy and also have no business experience then yes something is up!  As much as you try to frame the situation with your rose colored glasses and say everything is speculation, there is one thing that is not speculation.  Every Friday Pay checks have to be written and in a company of this size with this level of talent it's not a small check.
I have never seen a case were diminished sales and large salary payouts ended well.  Maybe you can point one out to me, but in my experience it ends with layoffs and then closure.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on September 23, 2015, 01:50:41 PM
Possibly MFJ will buy this company.  Then we will really have something to talk about.
Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on September 23, 2015, 01:58:08 PM
MFJ buying out Ten Tec brands would be interesting! If anyone could do it, Martin would be the man to pull it off.

But. I would be surprised if anyone would buy into the Alpha brand. Martin already has  respected amplifier lines in production. 

It will be interesting to see how this plays out. I am personally hoping they guys at RKR can make a go of it.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB2WIK on September 23, 2015, 02:03:11 PM
MFJ buying out Ten Tec brands would be interesting! If anyone could do it, Martin would be the man to pull it off.



We are proud to introduce our new line of (previously known as) Ten Tec products, now all available in semi-kit form.

We didn't mean them to be quite that way, but that's the way they turned out.  Warm up your soldering irons and enjoy the new products! :D :P
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 23, 2015, 03:29:11 PM
I agree there is no attempt at deceipt but don't the other things make you the least bit suspicious? Reduced Sales, Reduced inventory and no advertising!
That's not a recipe for success but more like disaster.

Rob

Concerned, maybe. Suspicious, of what? I can see where it is a concern to TT people. But suspicious? Again too many here is taking a tid bit of info and writing a death sentence to a company in transition. Did you ever stop and think that advertising is suspended so they don't make promises that they can't keep at the moment? And wouldn't that keep them on a higher moral standard rather then suspicious?

Again, this whole thread is nothing but rumors and speculation. The people that really know are not talking at the moment. And until they do, this entire thread is useless.

As a person who runs a company and has run several before I can tell you straight up that unless these guys at RKR are super wealthy and also have no business experience then yes something is up!  As much as you try to frame the situation with your rose colored glasses and say everything is speculation, there is one thing that is not speculation.  Every Friday Pay checks have to be written and in a company of this size with this level of talent it's not a small check.
I have never seen a case were diminished sales and large salary payouts ended well.  Maybe you can point one out to me, but in my experience it ends with layoffs and then closure.

RKR has far more things they do then just TT. They were a board house that made boards for TT. But that was not their sole product.

So even what you say you know is pure speculation. Unless you have an intimate knowledge of what they all produce and for who. I have worked at board houses. They NEVER depend on 1 customer for their livelihood. If they did, then yes, they have a poor business model and will probably fail. Now you have me speculating as well.

Remember all the doom and gloom with CQ magazine? They seem to be turning around based on reports I have seen posted. I was not their customer, and I won't be. My beef with them is they kept saying what they were going to do and failed to live up to it for a while.

RKR has said nothing. So there is nothing they need to live up to except the promises I have seen posted of pending orders. So I don't as you say look from rose colored glasses, but rather give them the benefit of the doubt until REAL information is made available. Until then, you can only speculate no matter how many years you were in the business. I don't see you quoting from their books to back up your speculation. So that is all it is. Speculation!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on September 23, 2015, 05:58:54 PM
why?  they are way out of MFJ's price point per pound.  if you have a successful modus operandi, don't fool with it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 23, 2015, 06:15:46 PM

RKR has far more things they do then just TT. They were a board house that made boards for TT. But that was not their sole product.

I took that into account.  It has been mentioned several times before.

So even what you say you know is pure speculation. Unless you have an intimate knowledge of what they all produce and for who. I have worked at board houses. They NEVER depend on 1 customer for their livelihood. If they did, then yes, they have a poor business model and will probably fail. Now you have me speculating as well.

They certainly would fail if there only customer was themselves.

Remember all the doom and gloom with CQ magazine? They seem to be turning around based on reports I have seen posted. I was not their customer, and I won't be. My beef with them is they kept saying what they were going to do and failed to live up to it for a while.

And if you read that Thread you will see I was one of the few people who was standing up for CQ Magazine and saying that they needed breathing room and that they are trying so people should cut them some slack.


RKR has said nothing. So there is nothing they need to live up to except the promises I have seen posted of pending orders. So I don't as you say look from rose colored glasses, but rather give them the benefit of the doubt until REAL information is made available. Until then, you can only speculate no matter how many years you were in the business. I don't see you quoting from their books to back up your speculation. So that is all it is. Speculation!

Your assumption is based on a bad business model.  You don't buy an asset and then have it sitting around bleeding your main company dry.  Those pay checks are coming from somewhere and no matter how you want to spin it RKR is losing money on this deal as we speak.  The only question is do they have a plan to stem the bleeding and make TenTec and Alpha into money makers and not Liabilities for RKR.



Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 23, 2015, 06:41:17 PM

RKR has far more things they do then just TT. They were a board house that made boards for TT. But that was not their sole product.

I took that into account.  It has been mentioned several times before.

So even what you say you know is pure speculation. Unless you have an intimate knowledge of what they all produce and for who. I have worked at board houses. They NEVER depend on 1 customer for their livelihood. If they did, then yes, they have a poor business model and will probably fail. Now you have me speculating as well.

They certainly would fail if there only customer was themselves.

Remember all the doom and gloom with CQ magazine? They seem to be turning around based on reports I have seen posted. I was not their customer, and I won't be. My beef with them is they kept saying what they were going to do and failed to live up to it for a while.

And if you read that Thread you will see I was one of the few people who was standing up for CQ Magazine and saying that they needed breathing room and that they are trying so people should cut them some slack.


RKR has said nothing. So there is nothing they need to live up to except the promises I have seen posted of pending orders. So I don't as you say look from rose colored glasses, but rather give them the benefit of the doubt until REAL information is made available. Until then, you can only speculate no matter how many years you were in the business. I don't see you quoting from their books to back up your speculation. So that is all it is. Speculation!

Your assumption is based on a bad business model.  You don't buy an asset and then have it sitting around bleeding your main company dry.  Those pay checks are coming from somewhere and no matter how you want to spin it RKR is losing money on this deal as we speak.  The only question is do they have a plan to stem the bleeding and make TenTec and Alpha into money makers and not Liabilities for RKR.





As I said before...Show me the books and prove it.

And if it is such a bad business model, MFJ should have bled to death many times over when Martin has bought out many dead or dying AR manufacturers.

Time to drop the academia description and get the real facts first. I doubt very much that RKR bought them out to bleed to death. But as said before...all pure speculation with the absence of facts.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on September 24, 2015, 02:08:33 AM
Possibly MFJ will buy this company.  Then we will really have something to talk about.
Art

are you poking at what you take to be a critter playing possum here hoping to get some response? 

we are just going to have to wait for RKR to make public their next move.  i doubt they'll get too worked up about the alarmists in this thread... could we at least wait for some official word on the proverbial patient's condition before we start throwing dirt on top of him or suggesting Elecraft or Flex Radio or MFJ has bought them out  ???
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N3QE on September 24, 2015, 07:44:24 AM
Regarding QST ads... I don't know if ads actually sell all that many rigs. I think it's nice when a manufacturer supports QST by advertising in it, or they sponsor ARRL programs or contests or awards, but I suspect that internet advertising and review sites and word-of-mouth figure much more heavily into most buying decisions.

They seem to have no trouble selling huge numbers of Eagles and Alpha amplifiers past few years.

Would be a nice touch if they sponsored more ARRL stuff but historically neither Ten-Tec or Alpha was big into sponsorships.

The RKR ads showing the Eagle and Alpha 9500 side-by-side is very nice. The Eagle is a great rig and the Alpha 9500 is a great amplifier. For a long time I was scratching my head wondering "when is Ten-Tec going to come out with another amplifier?" and combining Alpha with Ten-Tec makes perfect sense.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 25, 2015, 09:54:23 AM
LOL, Art that was good. Wouldn't that be a hoot!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on September 25, 2015, 09:59:26 AM
On 23 Sep I asked RKR when the plan to resume production of the Omni VII and I received a response from Robert Marine, W4NTN.


Quote
"RF Concepts, LLC. info@rfconcepts.com via bounces.netsuite.com   

12:55 PM (23 hours ago)

to me
Update for Case #36616 - "availability"   

Hello John,
We hope to start another production run on the 588 Omni VII
sometime after the end of the year. It could be January or February
we are still waiting on parts and now our production staff are
working on some large receiver orders and will be busy with them for some time. Please check back at anytime for updates on production and when they may be available."

Thank You and 73
Robert Marine
W4NTN

So there you have it, looks like they are in business and building receivers.  The only thing I found strange was that the Email is addressed RF Concepts LLC and not RKR Design LLC.  For some reason I was under the impression that RF Concepts no longer existed after they were bought out by RKR but I guess not.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 25, 2015, 11:46:03 AM
I also found the time frame strange since it leaves them without product during Christmas.
I also wonder what he means by "We hope to start another production run".  These guys must have a lot of cash if they can just wait around for months without certainty.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 25, 2015, 12:24:51 PM
I also found the time frame strange since it leaves them without product during Christmas.
I also wonder what he means by "We hope to start another production run".  These guys must have a lot of cash if they can just wait around for months without certainty.

Not to mention, as they stated, that they are building a different product which pays the production people and keeps the lights on. Or did you miss that part? Did you also miss the part that says they don't have parts in stock to run a batch? Those 2 little tid bits of information shows they are not burning cash having a bunch of people standing around doing nothing. And the fact they don't have parts to actually complete a run, it would cost more to start a run, then stop, then finish the run at another time when parts arrive. Plus the product would not be available to the market any sooner.

For someone "in the business" as you said to me earlier, you have really no clue how a contract manufacturer works. It works by looking at 3 things. Priority...what needs to get done first. Parts availability...pretty much explains itself. Workflow...what makes the most sense to be working on and how long. Related would be backlog of orders and its effect on the 3 things.

Thanks DPO for posting the response. It may not be much on the surface, but it packs a lot of information to someone who was a contract manufacturer production manager/designer.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on September 25, 2015, 12:32:03 PM
If they are building receivers for a govt. contract, the cash is probably flowing in.  The only problem is that hams are not patient and unless they absolutely want TT products they will shop elsewhere.  When TT discontinued the O2 due to critical parts unavailability, I asked them when there would be a replacement and they told me it would be sometime but not sure when.  I sold it while it still had value and bought a K3.  I liked the product and the way Elecraft does business so I bought other equipment from them.  Their current business model reminds me of what TT was like 25 years ago when Khan was still there.
Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on September 25, 2015, 01:25:29 PM
I also found the time frame strange since it leaves them without product during Christmas.
I also wonder what he means by "We hope to start another production run".  These guys must have a lot of cash if they can just wait around for months without certainty.

Its a stall tactic. They will have another excuse at end of year if they are still around.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 25, 2015, 02:06:52 PM
If the new owners of TenTec think that hams are going to wait 6 or more months to buy one of their radios, they are sadly mistaken.

I don't think TenTec will close down, but it seems the commitment is just not there.

These production delays are really going to help Elecraft, especially for those hams who want to still buy American.

I used to really love buying and operating TenTec radios. Great company, but after this last sale of the company, I've just lost the passion since the ham customer is no longer their passion. Time to move on.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 25, 2015, 07:05:45 PM
For someone "in the business" as you said to me earlier, you have really no clue how a contract manufacturer works. It works by looking at 3 things. Priority...what needs to get done first. Parts availability...pretty much explains itself. Workflow...what makes the most sense to be working on and how long. Related would be backlog of orders and its effect on the 3 things.

You seem to lack an understanding of what Acquisition of new assets entails.
Acquisition 101:  You don't buy a shaky company and then throw it into limbo with the consumers unless you plan to liquidate the company.  Contract Manufacturing is what the parent company QSC systems does. It's pretty hard to imagine that they have incorporated all the TenTec and Alpha engineers into what's basically a PCB fabrication company to work on some large project.  Even if that's the case they are using highly skilled engineers in capacities that are worth a quarter of their pay grade.  Meanwhile what happens to TenTec and Alpha, are all the loyal customers just supposed to wait for new products.

Anyway let me not interrupt your wishful dreaming.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 25, 2015, 08:00:49 PM
For someone "in the business" as you said to me earlier, you have really no clue how a contract manufacturer works. It works by looking at 3 things. Priority...what needs to get done first. Parts availability...pretty much explains itself. Workflow...what makes the most sense to be working on and how long. Related would be backlog of orders and its effect on the 3 things.

You seem to lack an understanding of what Acquisition of new assets entails.
Acquisition 101:  You don't buy a shaky company and then throw it into limbo with the consumers unless you plan to liquidate the company.  Contract Manufacturing is what the parent company QSC systems does. It's pretty hard to imagine that they have incorporated all the TenTec and Alpha engineers into what's basically a PCB fabrication company to work on some large project.  Even if that's the case they are using highly skilled engineers in capacities that are worth a quarter of their pay grade.
Anyway let me not interrupt your wishful dreaming.


Hmmm TT built radios. And the company said it is building radios. Again you try to cloud the simple facts with speculation. They are not just doing ham radio. No matter how much you think they are.

Also, do you know the terms of the buyout? I don't. But there must have been something good or there might never have been a deal. Speculation on my part. But it does closer fit to what RKR said then simply call it shaky and wrong.

Still waiting for your proof. Show me the books you analyzed to come up with how shaky they are. Or is it simply you can't admit they may know what they are doing even if it does not fit your finite idea of a business plan?

It was said here that hams are not patient to wait. Probably true. But did you ever stop to think that they took over TT for the non ham items they build? And it may be true that they lose market share in ham radio because of it. Is it not their choice as to where they want to concentrate their efforts? Like in products that have a bigger profit margin? And not concentrate on ham equipment where many hams demand 5 pounds of gold for the price of 2 pounds?

If your going to tell me that it is a bad deal, you need to look at everything they do. Not just 1 segment which is probably its poorest segment.

You also never countered the bad business plan buster of MFJ. While they are not as high end as TT, Martin has bought dead and dying companies and kept their products alive in MFJ. You trying to say MFJ is wrong when they have proven you wrong several times as far as your business model goes? And why can't RKR do the same thing? Maybe not in ham radio, but as a business as a whole.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 26, 2015, 04:21:54 AM
I don't know if TenTec is shaky or not. One thing I do know is that if they continue to operate like they currently are operating, they will soon be shaky.

The amateur market requires innovation. You have to be able to deliver radios. You have to advertise consistently to build product demand. Customers are not seeing any of this from TenTec lately.

Here's what we do know.

People are placing orders or want to buy products like the Omni and Patriot. In each case they are told maybe December or first quarter next year. If TenTec is building radios, what are they building? Just Eagles and Argos? Has anyone ordered and received an Eagle or Argo within the last month?

You hear this talk about waiting for parts? Are these parts being delivered via a donkey caravan? The speed with which manufacturing operates today, parts should arrive in a week - not months. Something just does not smell right with the current TenTec story.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9VO on September 26, 2015, 05:51:00 AM
Enough of the new product arguments. No way to prove either side. How about input from the service side of the house? Anyone had repairs done recently. How is service doing? Time delays? I would think health of company could also be reflected in service support being provided.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 26, 2015, 06:45:02 AM
Something just does not smell right with the current TenTec story.

Of course not since that is what you preach.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 26, 2015, 11:05:37 AM
https://forums.qrz.com/index.php?threads/how-long-have-you-been-waiting-for-your-tentec.492036/
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA0HCP on September 26, 2015, 12:42:14 PM
"A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush".

In other words, a government contract today is better than sitting idle while waiting for ham parts five months from now.

Seems like smart business operations to me.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on September 26, 2015, 08:13:39 PM
Enough of the new product arguments. No way to prove either side. How about input from the service side of the house? Anyone had repairs done recently. How is service doing? Time delays? I would think health of company could also be reflected in service support being provided.


I found this website kind of interesting.

http://www.alpha9500.com/index.html

http://www.alpha9500.com/contact--purchase.html

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 26, 2015, 11:25:35 PM
Enough of the new product arguments. No way to prove either side. How about input from the service side of the house? Anyone had repairs done recently. How is service doing? Time delays? I would think health of company could also be reflected in service support being provided.


I found this website kind of interesting.

http://www.alpha9500.com/index.html

http://www.alpha9500.com/contact--purchase.html



Wow you really must have a bone to pick if you buy a URL and hosting then setup your own website just to complain!

The Relevance of his site to to this thread depends on when he made the website but I have to say it's the first time I have seen someone go this far to make a complaint.

https://forums.qrz.com/index.php?threads/how-long-have-you-been-waiting-for-your-tentec.492036/

Well that was enlightening!
It seems the fire is spreading yet some think it's not an issue  ::)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N0YXB on September 27, 2015, 09:10:30 AM

Again, this whole thread is nothing but rumors and speculation.

Still true. And I'll add educated guessing so that I don't unintentionally insult anyone.

Getting some money-making orders handled while the company is dealing with parts issues, etc. on the amateur side of the house is also a perfectly reasonable explanation. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AC7CW on September 27, 2015, 10:38:56 AM

Again, this whole thread is nothing but rumors and speculation.

Getting some money-making orders handled while the company is dealing with parts issues, etc. on the amateur side of the house is also a perfectly reasonable explanation. 

It's also a perfectly resonable excuse to start homebrewing  8)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on September 27, 2015, 11:46:23 AM
Enough of the new product arguments. No way to prove either side. How about input from the service side of the house? Anyone had repairs done recently. How is service doing? Time delays? I would think health of company could also be reflected in service support being provided.


I found this website kind of interesting.

http://www.alpha9500.com/index.html

http://www.alpha9500.com/contact--purchase.html



Wow you really must have a bone to pick if you buy a URL and hosting then setup your own website just to complain!

The Relevance of his site to to this thread depends on when he made the website but I have to say it's the first time I have seen someone go this far to make a complaint.

https://forums.qrz.com/index.php?threads/how-long-have-you-been-waiting-for-your-tentec.492036/

Well that was enlightening!
It seems the fire is spreading yet some think it's not an issue  ::)

That was my impression too, someone went to an awful lot of trouble to lodge a complaint.  One wonders why he didn't just pick up the phone and call?

That being said I would not personally buy an automatic amplifier for the reasons that he stated.  Eventually it will fail and components may not be available.  I prefer simple manually tuned amps because I can always get parts for them.

One other thing that is puzzling, When Ten Tec was in business under the original ownership they somehow managed to make military/industrial radios and amateur radios at the same time.  That makes me think that either the new owners are short staffed or, the older pick and place equipment had to be sold so they have less manufacturing capacity until they can buy newer equipment.  That would mean new circuit boards and design specs for any future amateur radio production.

Also, getting service for a Ten Tec radio or Alpha amplifier used to be easier than with any other manufacturer.  I'm not sure that's now the case but I have to admit I no longer own any Ten Tec equipment except my 238 tuner.   I wont part with that but I doubt it will ever need any service that I can't do myself.

So I would like to see some official word out of Ten Tec/Alpha ownership like "Hey, we are still going to make amateur radio equipment".  So far the only thing I know is they are building receivers, don't know what kind or for who but I do know they are not making ham gear.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N2SR on September 28, 2015, 04:55:52 AM

I found this website kind of interesting.

http://www.alpha9500.com/index.html

http://www.alpha9500.com/contact--purchase.html

That was my impression too, someone went to an awful lot of trouble to lodge a complaint.  One wonders why he didn't just pick up the phone and call?

That being said I would not personally buy an automatic amplifier for the reasons that he stated.  Eventually it will fail and components may not be available.  I prefer simple manually tuned amps because I can always get parts for them.


15,000 Q's over 4 years.  Wow.   That's (a little bit of math) 3750 Q's every year.   Some people make that in one contest.  I think in one ARRL contest, I made over 2500. 

Any amp may fail.   

Less money?   Hmmm.

Alpha/Ten-Tec/RKR 9500:  $6995.00 
Expert 2K-FA:   $7395.00 

There is some math involved, but I think one is cheaper. 

Some manual amps have digital circuitry in them which sometimes makes them difficult to repair. 

Have you priced power transistors?   They are not cheap either.   And if you stick your hands into a HV compartment of a tube amplifier without proper precautions, maybe you shouldn't own an amplifier.   

Most amps are "pretty."   Antennas are also pretty.  So are towers.  As are radios. 

Alpha is/was not a solid state amplifier designer.  So saying they "are still using tubes!" is the equivalent of saying that Ford is still using an internal combustion engine and complaining that Ford is saying that their latest/greatest vehicle with an internal combustion engine is state of the art.   "Nothing that uses an gasoline engine is state of the art!" 

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on September 28, 2015, 08:45:20 AM
Ten Tec still has quite a few radios available. There is nothing wrong with the Eagle, many hams love them.  Perhaps they needed to thin the herd and concentrate on the more popular models, while keeping an eye on profit margins.  They did take over two brands, and this quite an undertaking for any small company.

Elecraft has a very small stable of products, and they are successful.  No doubt many of the Ten Tec products were nearing end of life, due to many parts becoming obsolete.  Heck, I own several rigs made by JRC and Yaesu that use custom IC packages that are no longer available. There are Kenwood rigs that also use custom chips that are becoming door stops. 

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on September 28, 2015, 09:02:43 AM
There are thousands of older Ten Tec rigs still going and sure there are parts that are unobtainium and the same goes for all of the other brands, Kenwood included.  Having been an evaluator for the Army for many years I can tell you for a fact that government contracts are very lucrative and amateur radio is not.  The one thing that continues to gnaw at me is that RKR has discounted everything to almost fire sale prices and they don't appear to be building anything new for the amateur market.  They showed up at Dayton last year with a pretty tuner but that looks to have been vaporware as nothing has happened with it in over a year.

Building receivers for the government is lucrative so if that's what they are doing then I guess I don't blame them.  If they were serious about amateur radio they would have said so by now, just selling off the inventory does not mean they intend to build more.  The waiting for parts story doesn't hold water either, parts can be had from a zillion different suppliers overnight.  I am pretty convinced that Ten Tec is history, at least as we knew it.  They might still make or import some rinky dink stuff from China to keep the name alive but I'm even skeptical about that.

So it looks like they are headed to the dustbin of American radio manufacturers.  I wish that wasn't true, I hope that isn't true but my gut keeps telling me the situation just smells all wrong.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 28, 2015, 10:08:13 AM
More speculation.

And yes lead times can seem long, to those who don't run production lines, if they don't intend to start up a production line yet because they are building a different product. They won't order parts until needed. Its called JIT (Just In Time) inventory. Many companies use it.

When you pick one part of a statement and ignore the rest, then yes it is not plausible. Taken on the whole you get a plausible reason.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 28, 2015, 03:00:14 PM
More speculation.

And yes lead times can seem long, to those who don't run production lines, if they don't intend to start up a production line yet because they are building a different product. They won't order parts until needed. Its called JIT (Just In Time) inventory. Many companies use it.

When you pick one part of a statement and ignore the rest, then yes it is not plausible. Taken on the whole you get a plausible reason.

LOL
I hope you are not an active trader in the stock market :'(
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB2WIK on September 28, 2015, 03:06:06 PM
More speculation.

And yes lead times can seem long, to those who don't run production lines, if they don't intend to start up a production line yet because they are building a different product. They won't order parts until needed. Its called JIT (Just In Time) inventory. Many companies use it.

When you pick one part of a statement and ignore the rest, then yes it is not plausible. Taken on the whole you get a plausible reason.

JIT can't be employed when lead times are long and variable because the supplier cannot guarantee a delivery date.

You just have to order LL items way in advance, schedule everything else around those, and keep your fingers crossed.

However, I am in the electronics manufacturing business and there aren't any components on the planet with longer than 12-14 week lead times, and that includes very custom FPGAs, motor bearings for disk drives, custom high capacity flash memory and everything else.  There isn't anything we can't get in three months.  We use custom made-to-order cooling fans from Rotron (made in U.S.A. is a contract requirement we have with the USAF) which they won't even set up to make until we place an order and pay for it, and they take 12 weeks.

So, being out of production for six months due to long lead components doesn't make much sense.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on September 28, 2015, 08:09:54 PM
I agree, it doesn't make any sense at all.  It almost seems like they are slow rolling the ham community until they can sell out the inventory.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 28, 2015, 10:28:36 PM
More speculation.

And yes lead times can seem long, to those who don't run production lines, if they don't intend to start up a production line yet because they are building a different product. They won't order parts until needed. Its called JIT (Just In Time) inventory. Many companies use it.

When you pick one part of a statement and ignore the rest, then yes it is not plausible. Taken on the whole you get a plausible reason.

LOL
I hope you are not an active trader in the stock market :'(


Nope I'm in real estate and product engineering. I only believe in things that even if I loose some money, I don't get wiped out. Real estate is always worth something. And I am a long term investor. Not an emotional one. Just like product engineering. You need a plan over time, not something you do on a whim.

All as I can say is you all are dreaming if you think components can't take a long time if the vendor drags its feet. For example, the product I work on we ordered parts in Dec 2013. Finally got them May 2015. Had to get a second source to keep production going. And then we paid almost double the price to get the parts. Plus the time wasted qualifying the new parts by building a pilot unit and put it through rigorous testing to make sure it will work and last according to specifications. Not very cost effective on a tight profit margin. But it happens.


JIT can't be employed when lead times are long and variable because the supplier cannot guarantee a delivery date.


A good buyer should always know the lead times from the vendor. That is how JIT works. Except as above when the vendor failed to deliver. But that was a commitment the vendor broke, not the buyer. If the buyer can't get a vendor to commit to a date, chances are quite good they will be replaced with one that can. Just as you expect good customer service from TT, a factory expects no less from their vendors.

And please don't quote government procurement. It does not even closely resemble industry. Never has, and never will. It is its own animal. And I am not ready to tame that one. As to the example of the fans, you stated the lead time, so you obviously knew how long it would take to get, and ordered accordingly. Or did you wait until today to order something for tomorrow that takes 12 weeks to get?

You all just keep speculating and ignoring what has been told by RKR. For all the bleeding hearts who want TT to survive you all sure can make up your own reasons for them to fail. Keep up with the doom and gloom, they may just find a different market to concentrate on. And then your precious TT AR products will be history.

And yes...the last paragraph is my speculation. But at least I am trying to give RKR the benefit of the doubt, rather than calling for the funeral parade. Which one are you doing?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N2SR on September 29, 2015, 03:19:17 AM

JIT can't be employed when lead times are long and variable because the supplier cannot guarantee a delivery date.

You just have to order LL items way in advance, schedule everything else around those, and keep your fingers crossed.

However, I am in the electronics manufacturing business and there aren't any components on the planet with longer than 12-14 week lead times, and that includes very custom FPGAs, motor bearings for disk drives, custom high capacity flash memory and everything else.  There isn't anything we can't get in three months.  We use custom made-to-order cooling fans from Rotron (made in U.S.A. is a contract requirement we have with the USAF) which they won't even set up to make until we place an order and pay for it, and they take 12 weeks.

So, being out of production for six months due to long lead components doesn't make much sense.

Ever try ordering rad hardened regulators, Ku Band or V band FETs? 

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on September 29, 2015, 03:40:38 AM

Ever try ordering rad hardened regulators, Ku Band or V band FETs? 


Is TenTec using those types of parts in their radios? For what TenTec uses, the parts are readily available.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KF5JOT on September 29, 2015, 06:59:16 AM
I've been involved in projects where a commercial part going out of production causes a major cascade effect on the design and production. One of our units was out of production for almost a year due to a single part going obsolete. It went from a supposedly simple vendor/part change and ended up with a major redesign of several multilayer boards, the chassis, and we had to run the full certification process on the design. The toughest part was that it had to be completely back compatible with the units in the field. All that for a 1$ part.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N2SR on September 29, 2015, 09:02:44 AM

Ever try ordering rad hardened regulators, Ku Band or V band FETs? 


Is TenTec using those types of parts in their radios? For what TenTec uses, the parts are readily available.

Dunno.  I don't work for TenTec.

If you can't follow along, my comment was referring to "there aren't any components on the planet with longer than 12-14 week lead times."   

Try and keep up.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB2WIK on September 29, 2015, 10:25:34 AM

A good buyer should always know the lead times from the vendor. That is how JIT works. Except as above when the vendor failed to deliver. But that was a commitment the vendor broke, not the buyer. If the buyer can't get a vendor to commit to a date, chances are quite good they will be replaced with one that can. Just as you expect good customer service from TT, a factory expects no less from their vendors.

And please don't quote government procurement. It does not even closely resemble industry. Never has, and never will. It is its own animal. And I am not ready to tame that one. As to the example of the fans, you stated the lead time, so you obviously knew how long it would take to get, and ordered accordingly. Or did you wait until today to order something for tomorrow that takes 12 weeks to get?

Since our assembly, test and inspection times are much longer than that we order six months in advance and have all the needed fans (and everything else) in stock before we even begin work.  With our contracts, all materials must be traceable and from non-conflict raw material sources, etc.  It's complex.

However we do pretty much the same with commercial goods, just omitting the X-rays and all the source inspections and stuff.

Your first statement about a good buyer always knowing lead times and good vendors living up to what they committed, that's nice in a dream world but it sure doesn't apply to us.  MANY materials are sole-source, such as our 24-port 6Gb/s SAS Expander ASICs which are made by exactly one company in the world and everyone uses them.  They do not sell direct, and have ONE authorized distributor, so everyone uses them also.  No chance to "change vendors" if you want to sell a product like this.  Ditto goes for the ASICs used for Thunderbolt-PCIe bridges, which are made only by Intel, period.  There isn't any other vendor, and they have three authorized distributors who are all the same.  Ditto goes for most M.2 memory devices; they can carry fifty different labels, but they're all from Samsung. :D

In our world, "changing vendors" is a possibility that only exists for very common components.  Even chip discretes are pretty much "sole source," since Vishay bought out virtually all their competitors, so while sold under dozens of brand names, they all come from the same few factories.  The ideal there is to work with a solid distributor, develop a relationship so you're important to them, and hope for the best.  But if Vishay shuts a line down, all the distributors will be out of stock very quickly and then lead times are whatever they are.

Still, despite such obstacles, we really never have to wait more than three months for anything, even the "rare" sole-source items. 

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB2WIK on September 29, 2015, 10:27:48 AM

Ever try ordering rad hardened regulators, Ku Band or V band FETs? 



No, but if you hum a few bars I might be able to join in. ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 29, 2015, 11:11:57 AM
Your first statement about a good buyer always knowing lead times and good vendors living up to what they committed, that's nice in a dream world but it sure doesn't apply to us. 

Then that is the difference between us. We require vendors to be on time. Our buyers specifically set up deliveries so JIT works properly. Just because your company can't or won't do that does not mean it is impossible for others. Our factory floor would be totally screwed up if it didn't work.

So while it may be a dream for you, it is reality for me. I didn't invent it. I had to learn the proper skills to deal with it when I got hired. It is a top to bottom system. And while I have my very tiny slice of that pie, it is still important that it be done right.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AC7CW on September 29, 2015, 11:21:18 AM
I've been involved in projects where a commercial part going out of production causes a major cascade effect on the design and production. One of our units was out of production for almost a year due to a single part going obsolete. It went from a supposedly simple vendor/part change and ended up with a major redesign of several multilayer boards, the chassis, and we had to run the full certification process on the design. The toughest part was that it had to be completely back compatible with the units in the field. All that for a 1$ part.

I've seen very common parts get a one-year lead time. It was when the economy was absolutely in goldrush mode though. Nowadays I wouldn't expect long lead times due to the economy.

I used to earn my keep by finding substitute parts that didn't have long lead times. I'd buy mil-spec parts or slightly more expensive parts. Purchasing people couldn't do that because they are clueless about what will work. People that are single sourced don't have that option either.

We had suppliers that acted like they would do anything for us but unless you were the biggest game in town you couldn't get them to keep the pipeline filled for you.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 29, 2015, 11:46:38 AM
W9FIB just about all your posts are also speculation!  The only difference is that you ignore the overall problem and hammer away at the improbable possibilities as to why TenTec has gone from were they once were, a company producing new products and having stock. To right now were they are selling out current stock at a discount and seem to have no interest in replacing it.

You have said more about the sorry state of TenTec then they have said themselves.  Personally I think you should give it a break, if RKR had the slightest interest in a positive future for TenTec and Alpha they would have been on eHam, QRZ and all the other forums giving us some sort of official statement. If they think they are too big to come on a forum and speak to their customer base then that's not a company I would do business with.

73s
KD8MJR


Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 29, 2015, 12:16:17 PM
W9FIB just about all your posts are also speculation!  The only difference is that you ignore the overall problem and hammer away at the improbable possibilities as to why TenTec has gone from were they once were, a company producing new products and having stock. To right now were they are selling out current stock at a discount and seem to have no interest in replacing it.

You have said more about the sorry state of TenTec then they have said themselves.  Personally I think you should give it a break, if RKR had the slightest interest in a positive future for TenTec and Alpha they would have been on eHam, QRZ and all the other forums giving us some sort of official statement. If they think they are too big to come on a forum and speak to their customer base then that's not a company I would do business with.

73s
KD8MJR




And your displeasure with RKR is my problem how?

I am an optimist and believe all your doom and gloom scenarios are unfounded and state my reasons why based on information available, and experience in contract manufacturing. I cant help if people are not as experienced and think I am wrong based on feelings, chopping up what RKR said so it fits their own idea, reading tea leaves, crystal ball visions, or any other baseless supposition.

So I would counter that you all stop arranging the funeral and then I would not need to say anything. If not, both sides will be represented. And besides you and others are speculating based on no facts, so correct yourself first. Then you can correct others...correctly.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on September 29, 2015, 01:10:52 PM
W9FIB just about all your posts are also speculation!  The only difference is that you ignore the overall problem and hammer away at the improbable possibilities as to why TenTec has gone from were they once were, a company producing new products and having stock. To right now were they are selling out current stock at a discount and seem to have no interest in replacing it.

You have said more about the sorry state of TenTec then they have said themselves.  Personally I think you should give it a break, if RKR had the slightest interest in a positive future for TenTec and Alpha they would have been on eHam, QRZ and all the other forums giving us some sort of official statement. If they think they are too big to come on a forum and speak to their customer base then that's not a company I would do business with.

73s
KD8MJR




And your displeasure with RKR is my problem how?

I am an optimist and believe all your doom and gloom scenarios are unfounded and state my reasons why based on information available, and experience in contract manufacturing. I cant help if people are not as experienced and think I am wrong based on feelings, chopping up what RKR said so it fits their own idea, reading tea leaves, crystal ball visions, or any other baseless supposition.

So I would counter that you all stop arranging the funeral and then I would not need to say anything. If not, both sides will be represented. And besides you and others are speculating based on no facts, so correct yourself first. Then you can correct others...correctly.

You said (referring to RKR) that no one would enter into such a venture without a plan and I wholeheartedly agree with you.  But I am beginning to sense that the plan was to liquidate the remaining amateur radio assets and apply the company assets to much more profitable ventures.  KD8MJR makes a
compelling argument, they could easily reach out to the community but instead remain silent which is frankly very ominous.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on September 29, 2015, 01:31:12 PM
If that were their plan, to liquidate for a quick profit -- wouldn't they have been on here posting that they are fighting to keep TT radios going and asking for your help by buying them up asap?  and then maybe a year later thank everyone for the support and the try but in the end they just could not make it? 

afaik, the people who bought RKR were hams who held TT history in high regard and want that to continue.  Revamping the lineup now that it is their company probably takes time. so whether the funeral-planning side or the phoenix-rising-from-the-ashes is correct -- we really do not know yet.  Maybe it will be something in the middle with a smaller new lineup but some xcvrs which are real beauties in every way.

till then it is all just speculation -- and given the tenor of some of the detractors here -- i don't think i would dignify them with a response if i were RKR ownership. instead i would wait till we were ready to release some new rigs and then let the word spread through QST reviews and advertisements, etc.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on September 29, 2015, 03:06:42 PM
Silent??? Funny how someone took the time to email them and post the response in this thread. That is not silent to me. Silent would be no response at all. I made the suggestion to email them a long time ago. And got ridiculed. Probably because nobody wants an answer. It would conflict with all the speculation and funeral planners!

Even the QRZ thread mentioned on this thread showed people asking questions were getting responses. And yet you feel they are silent? You need an engraved document stating every detail about everything RKR is doing? Even then you will probably take it apart and try to prove it wrong so it fits your speculation.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on September 29, 2015, 03:07:11 PM
If that were their plan, to liquidate for a quick profit -- wouldn't they have been on here posting that they are fighting to keep TT radios going and asking for your help by buying them up asap?  and then maybe a year later thank everyone for the support and the try but in the end they just could not make it? 

They went one better they offered huge discounts.  No need to lie just drop the price and you get huge sales.

Quote
afaik, the people who bought RKR were hams who held TT history in high regard and want that to continue.  Revamping the lineup now that it is their company probably takes time. so whether the funeral-planning side or the phoenix-rising-from-the-ashes is correct -- we really do not know yet.  Maybe it will be something in the middle with a smaller new lineup but some xcvrs which are real beauties in every way.

Maybe, I smell Chinese radios coming.

Quote
till then it is all just speculation -- and given the tenor of some of the detractors here -- i don't think i would dignify them with a response if i were RKR ownership. instead i would wait till we were ready to release some new rigs and then let the word spread through QST reviews and advertisements, etc.

They dropped their advertising and they have no new products to review!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 01, 2015, 04:45:21 AM
Silent??? Funny how someone took the time to email them and post the response in this thread. That is not silent to me. Silent would be no response at all. I made the suggestion to email them a long time ago. And got ridiculed. Probably because nobody wants an answer. It would conflict with all the speculation and funeral planners!

Even the QRZ thread mentioned on this thread showed people asking questions were getting responses. And yet you feel they are silent? You need an engraved document stating every detail about everything RKR is doing? Even then you will probably take it apart and try to prove it wrong so it fits your speculation.

I think what he means by "silent" is that TenTec/RKR is not being proactive in communicating. Let's see a PR release or some interviews outlining their future plans.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 01, 2015, 06:26:47 AM
Silent??? Funny how someone took the time to email them and post the response in this thread. That is not silent to me. Silent would be no response at all. I made the suggestion to email them a long time ago. And got ridiculed. Probably because nobody wants an answer. It would conflict with all the speculation and funeral planners!

Even the QRZ thread mentioned on this thread showed people asking questions were getting responses. And yet you feel they are silent? You need an engraved document stating every detail about everything RKR is doing? Even then you will probably take it apart and try to prove it wrong so it fits your speculation.

I think what he means by "silent" is that TenTec/RKR is not being proactive in communicating. Let's see a PR release or some interviews outlining their future plans.

Precisely, I did Email them and I did get a response but someone else recently got the exact same canned response.  They could very easily put a page in QST describing their plan for the future and write it off as an advertising expense.  It would cost almost nothing and it would restore confidence in the brand because right now I have none since I don't think they plan to stick around for the long haul.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 01, 2015, 07:47:41 AM
Well they probably learned from the way people excoriated CQ mag when they did try to tell what they were trying to do. Now I realize that for quite some time they failed to live up to what they promised and it was well deserved over time. But that is a separate issue. The issue was they were struggling, tried to set some goals, but were unable to meet them. And many kept arguing CQ is dead. Well they didn't die, and from anecdotal evidence they are slowly improving. And I wish them all the best.

But I really can't blame RKR for not issuing a timeline/statement. As I said before, some people here would simply tear it apart to accomplish their own agendas. And then will come all the loads of "TT is dead" posts if they fail by 30 seconds. That really bolsters commitment by a company. They gave some information, though limited, but there it is...information. Really what is needed is to stop saying things don't make sense, etc. Take the information at hand. And wait to see if they follow through. If they don't, I will be one of those to question why. But until then, NO ONE but RKR can speak to the future. And they really do not owe it to individuals to make statements beyond what they have told interested potential customers that took the time to ask questions.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 01, 2015, 08:41:46 AM
Well they probably learned from the way people excoriated CQ mag when they did try to tell what they were trying to do. Now I realize that for quite some time they failed to live up to what they promised and it was well deserved over time. But that is a separate issue. The issue was they were struggling, tried to set some goals, but were unable to meet them. And many kept arguing CQ is dead. Well they didn't die, and from anecdotal evidence they are slowly improving. And I wish them all the best.

But I really can't blame RKR for not issuing a timeline/statement. As I said before, some people here would simply tear it apart to accomplish their own agendas. And then will come all the loads of "TT is dead" posts if they fail by 30 seconds. That really bolsters commitment by a company. They gave some information, though limited, but there it is...information. Really what is needed is to stop saying things don't make sense, etc. Take the information at hand. And wait to see if they follow through. If they don't, I will be one of those to question why. But until then, NO ONE but RKR can speak to the future. And they really do not owe it to individuals to make statements beyond what they have told interested potential customers that took the time to ask questions.

I don't have an agenda, I am a potential customer, and I was not very moved by the response I got.  We are building receivers, wow, that's groovy but they didn't give me any other information other than we might build ham radios sometime next year.

 I just ordered a GT 350 from Ford and they told me it would be delivered in 8 to ten weeks.  Better still they just sent me the VIN number so I know they are for real.  If they had said, we are building trucks right now but will probably get around to GT production some time next year I would have bought a Vette because that is a crummy answer.  You keep making excuses for Ten Tec, do you work for them in some capacity? 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 01, 2015, 09:13:46 AM
Wish I did. And if I did, I could probably give you many more details.

And yes, I am still giving RKR the benefit of the doubt. I am an optimist and hope for the best. And every reply is based on that. But then I have said this before. But I guess those that preach doom and gloom just don't understand this, or just don't want to.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on October 01, 2015, 10:57:15 AM
Well, FWIW, I just had a short private email exchange with someone very familiar with the situation at Ten-Tec.

I am not at liberty to go into details... suffice to say, though, that things are not as dire as some here would have you believe.

I would strongly suggest that anyone with concerns contact people on site directly, rather than continue to trade in speculation and rumors, let alone treat such trade as facts.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 01, 2015, 09:14:46 PM
Thanks Ron that's good to know.  Here is a link to their facebook page.  Lots of good info on there.  Could have bought an Eagle for $1099.00, now that is a really great price for that radio.
Unfortunately it looks like the inventory reduction sale ended in August but I bet they might still sell one for that price.

   https://www.facebook.com/AlphaTenTec
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 02, 2015, 05:50:49 AM
Well they probably learned from the way people excoriated CQ mag when they did try to tell what they were trying to do. Now I realize that for quite some time they failed to live up to what they promised and it was well deserved over time. But that is a separate issue. The issue was they were struggling, tried to set some goals, but were unable to meet them. And many kept arguing CQ is dead. Well they didn't die, and from anecdotal evidence they are slowly improving. And I wish them all the best.


No CQ did not explain clearly what they were trying to do. The used words like "challenging" market and "production" problems and other ways of dancing around. Whenever someone called (if they could get through) or emailed to cancel, it was usually ignored.

What CQ could have said is "hey we extended ourselves too far. Too many magazines and not enough subscribers and advertising. As a result, we have severe money issues preventing us from sending out magazines on time. We are trying to work through them, or get some financing, or whatever. Those who want to cancel because of this, can do so and we'll issue refunds when we become financially able to do so. Those who choose to stay subscribers, we thank you for your support", or something to that effect.

The reality is that CQ was not clear. Production problems usually mean something happened at the printer. That's not being straight forward. Upset customers were mostly ignored. They claimed they answered all calls and emails, but they did not.

So CQ's method of dealing with a crisis is the model for NOT doing it that way. Being open, honest, straight forward with a complete description of the situation, plans to fix or address it, challenges faced, etc, usually wins the hearts and minds of most people.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 02, 2015, 06:13:34 AM
Well they probably learned from the way people excoriated CQ mag when they did try to tell what they were trying to do. Now I realize that for quite some time they failed to live up to what they promised and it was well deserved over time. But that is a separate issue. The issue was they were struggling, tried to set some goals, but were unable to meet them. And many kept arguing CQ is dead. Well they didn't die, and from anecdotal evidence they are slowly improving. And I wish them all the best.


No CQ did not explain clearly what they were trying to do. The used words like "challenging" market and "production" problems and other ways of dancing around. Whenever someone called (if they could get through) or emailed to cancel, it was usually ignored.

What CQ could have said is "hey we extended ourselves too far. Too many magazines and not enough subscribers and advertising. As a result, we have severe money issues preventing us from sending out magazines on time. We are trying to work through them, or get some financing, or whatever. Those who want to cancel because of this, can do so and we'll issue refunds when we become financially able to do so. Those who choose to stay subscribers, we thank you for your support", or something to that effect.

The reality is that CQ was not clear. Production problems usually mean something happened at the printer. That's not being straight forward. Upset customers were mostly ignored. They claimed they answered all calls and emails, but they did not.

So CQ's method of dealing with a crisis is the model for NOT doing it that way. Being open, honest, straight forward with a complete description of the situation, plans to fix or address it, challenges faced, etc, usually wins the hearts and minds of most people.

Well some people are not happy with anything anyone does. Oh well...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KG4YBH on October 02, 2015, 06:33:30 AM
Well for what it is worth there is a guy on the 100 watts and a wire facebook page saying he is a ten tec employee and they did not pay him because they could not make payroll. Of course he then posted that he may have to beg for money from other hams to pay his bills.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 02, 2015, 07:54:46 AM
Well for what it is worth there is a guy on the 100 watts and a wire facebook page saying he is a ten tec employee and they did not pay him because they could not make payroll. Of course he then posted that he may have to beg for money from other hams to pay his bills.

sounds like it could be a pretty good scam -- did he actually post a callsign?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KG4YBH on October 02, 2015, 02:18:12 PM
Well for what it is worth there is a guy on the 100 watts and a wire facebook page saying he is a ten tec employee and they did not pay him because they could not make payroll. Of course he then posted that he may have to beg for money from other hams to pay his bills.

sounds like it could be a pretty good scam -- did he actually post a callsign?

Funny as I just went back looking for the 2 posts on facebook and they appear to have been deleted as I can not find them. Don't think he would have gotten much money as one guy said the simple answer was to get a new job. And the poster got an attitude and replied simple for you maybe.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on October 02, 2015, 04:20:32 PM
Well for what it is worth there is a guy on the 100 watts and a wire facebook page saying he is a ten tec employee and they did not pay him because they could not make payroll. Of course he then posted that he may have to beg for money from other hams to pay his bills.
Hmmm.  There are two characters on another forum who both claim to be TT employees... and each guarantees that the other one is... who have a REAL nasty attitude.  Makes me wonder if one of them is the same guy.

Well, all I can say is, I've known my source for a good many years, and he has no reason at all to fib.  And he could just as easily told me (politely or otherwise) to MYOB, but he didn't.

You pays your money, you takes your chances.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA0HCP on October 02, 2015, 07:54:37 PM
-Yaesu doesn't have a recent public business plan.  They must be failing

-Icom hasn't responded to complaint or communicated with me this week. They must be failing. 

Phooey.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 02, 2015, 09:26:23 PM
perhaps MJR needs to read his own tag line:
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is still putting its boots on"  -- Mark Twain
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 03, 2015, 04:05:51 AM


Well some people are not happy with anything anyone does. Oh well...

Simply not true; and a gratuitous statement can be refuted with an equally gratuitous statement. Because many hams are not happy with CQ Magazine or TenTec right now does not mean we are not happy with all the other amateur radio related companies and how they run their business.

If you are happy with all the vendors, great, good for you. Not everyone is happy with every vendor.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 03, 2015, 04:12:21 AM
-Yaesu doesn't have a recent public business plan.  They must be failing

-Icom hasn't responded to complaint or communicated with me this week. They must be failing. 

Phooey.

Your logic has simply failed here. The difference between Yaesu and Icom is that they are constantly bringing out new products, able to ship products to their dealers to fill orders so no one is concerned about their ability to continue as an on-going concern.

However, since TenTec has been taken over (twice and both very recent), the number of models has been reduced, they have trouble manufacturing radios thus they cannot ship radios, people who have ordered radios have been told the wait could be a significant number of months before production and shipping, and I believe I read where service times have slowed down quite a bit.

The summary is Icom and Yaesu have given no one a cause for concern. On the other hand, TenTec has and why people want to know what's going on and future plans. It's just that simple.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 03, 2015, 05:30:45 AM


Well some people are not happy with anything anyone does. Oh well...

Simply not true since a gratuitous statement can be refuted with an equally gratuitous statement. Because many hams are not happy with CQ Magazine or TenTec right now does not mean we are not happy with all the other amateur radio related companies and how they run their business.

If you are happy with all the vendors, great, good for you. Not everyone is happy with every vendor.

Yea we know. You must have told us that same thing like a hundred times now. And you missed my original point. But that's ok. It did not fit your line of thinking. I sure we will hear from you about CQ for at least another year or 2. Even if its not what we are talking about. And the beat goes on.....
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 03, 2015, 10:29:49 AM
So I am glad you finally know. See, it takes hundred times to convey the point.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 03, 2015, 12:37:01 PM
So I am glad you finally know. See, it take hundred times to convey the point.

Not really, I knew what you were sayin 99 times ago. Just was hoping you would feel better about yourself.

But you still missed my point. Should I repeat it a hundred times? Nah, everyone else probably got it the first time.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 04, 2015, 03:28:03 AM
No, because you cannot write in coherent English, repeating it another hundred times isn't going to make anyone understand your babble any better. I'd just hang it up if I were you.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 04, 2015, 03:58:06 AM
No, because you cannot write in coherent English, repeating it another hundred times isn't going to make anyone understand your babble any better. I'd just hang it up if I were you.

LOL...but then I am not the person who actually did repeat himself a hundred times.

If you could not understand it, then you should not have commented at all IMO. Or at least asked for a clarification first if it truly was hard to understand.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 04, 2015, 07:10:10 AM
I know, I repeated it a few times as a courtesy so you could understand since you apparently did understand the first time.

But I will not comment further because people like yourself always have to have the last word and this garbage could go on and on and actually has nothing to do with the RKR/TenTec discussion so I will end my involvement in your tit-for-tat until some other pertinent new information comes out about RKR/TenTec.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on October 04, 2015, 09:58:17 AM
It's amazing that 21 pages with 311 posts on this subject have been written based on pure speculation, currently degrading into name-calling and questioning of one's character and intelligence (like so many other threads). Now, I've never owned any Ten-Tec or Alpha products, and I can appreciate the concerns of those who have been loyal to them over the years, wanting to know what's going on.

However the bottom line is that RKR is a privately owned company, no invested shareholders, and they really don't owe anyone an explanation of their business plan. They may be shooting themselves in the foot with the amateur radio community, but so be it...that's their decision. Seemingly, they deem a more profitable situation building receivers for the government, in deference to investing in amateur radio equipment. As long as they don't fraudulently take people's money and not deliver product, they're not legally doing anything wrong. If you're not happy with their production runs and lag time, buy another brand...there's plenty of them out there.

If they wind up closing down and not providing support or repair parts, s--t happens. You have the choice of keeping your radio/amp, or selling it before it craps out. Latest case in point, Tokyo Hy-Power. Boom, gone...no fore-warning, no explanation published.  Happens all the time.

Just my two-cents. Carry on..... 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on October 04, 2015, 10:11:40 AM
Amen, dude.   You nailed it!!  And, all I have seen is endless diatribes by disgruntled posters in my kill file!!

Gotta love it...

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N0YXB on October 04, 2015, 12:11:18 PM
Yes indeed, he nailed it. Thanks JQ.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on October 06, 2015, 03:07:57 PM
It's amazing that 21 pages with 311 posts on this subject have been written based on pure speculation, currently degrading into name-calling and questioning of one's character and intelligence (like so many other threads). Now, I've never owned any Ten-Tec or Alpha products, and I can appreciate the concerns of those who have been loyal to them over the years, wanting to know what's going on.

However the bottom line is that RKR is a privately owned company, no invested shareholders, and they really don't owe anyone an explanation of their business plan. They may be shooting themselves in the foot with the amateur radio community, but so be it...that's their decision. Seemingly, they deem a more profitable situation building receivers for the government, in deference to investing in amateur radio equipment. As long as they don't fraudulently take people's money and not deliver product, they're not legally doing anything wrong. If you're not happy with their production runs and lag time, buy another brand...there's plenty of them out there.

If they wind up closing down and not providing support or repair parts, s--t happens. You have the choice of keeping your radio/amp, or selling it before it craps out. Latest case in point, Tokyo Hy-Power. Boom, gone...no fore-warning, no explanation published.  Happens all the time.

Just my two-cents. Carry on.....  

I don't own a dam thing from Ten Tec or Alpha but you hit the nail on the head.

Quote
they really don't owe anyone an explanation of their business plan. They may be shooting themselves in the foot with the amateur radio community, but so be it...that's their decision. Seemingly, they deem a more profitable situation building receivers for the government, in deference to investing in amateur radio equipment.

They have already shot themselves in the foot, the question is do they plan on bandaging the wound or do they plan on amputating the leg?


73s
Rob

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on October 06, 2015, 07:11:09 PM
Logically, if they're making more money with government contracts (and confidently remain sustainable in the future), and they have limited resources to also invest in amateur radio, they'll amputate the leg. Wouldn't you? Problem is, putting all your eggs in one basket can be a slippery slope. Hopefully, they know what they're doing...but none of my business  ::)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB2WIK on October 07, 2015, 01:41:57 PM


sounds like it could be a pretty good scam -- did he actually post a callsign?

Yes, and also here:
Quote
  From KC4NOZ: Well actually I don't care. He isn't working here and I am. My check did not come and so did none of the others. So, you can sugarm coat it all you want but ant any reputable businessman will tell you if a company can't meet payroll they are in trouble.

That was from here: https://forums.qrz.com/index.php?threads/re-tentec-in-trouble.495221/




Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on October 07, 2015, 02:46:48 PM


sounds like it could be a pretty good scam -- did he actually post a callsign?

Yes, and also here:
Quote
 From KC4NOZ: Well actually I don't care. He isn't working here and I am. My check did not come and so did none of the others. So, you can sugarm coat it all you want but ant any reputable businessman will tell you if a company can't meet payroll they are in trouble.

That was from here: https://forums.qrz.com/index.php?threads/re-tentec-in-trouble.495221/


Weirdest thread I have read in years.  It seems like at least two employee's from TenTec are saying they have not been paid and no one else has.  Then you have guys verifying that they do work at TenTec and yet other posters keep on plowing forward as if none of this was said!  I would say add the lack of paid employees to the past iffy statements from RKR about delays due to parts and also the terrible repair situations people are reporting and it's pretty clear TenTec and Alpha are being liquidated.

 And for those TenTec Fanatics, Yes it's a bloody assumption!  Thats why God gave us Brains, so we can figure out $hit before it happens, I am sure some early cavemen heard rustling in the bushes and while the others ran away one guy thought it might be the wind rustling the tree's, so he  remained calm all the way until he saw the lions teeth.


73s
Rob
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 07, 2015, 03:24:24 PM


sounds like it could be a pretty good scam -- did he actually post a callsign?

Yes, and also here:
Quote
  From KC4NOZ: Well actually I don't care. He isn't working here and I am. My check did not come and so did none of the others. So, you can sugarm coat it all you want but ant any reputable businessman will tell you if a company can't meet payroll they are in trouble.

That was from here: https://forums.qrz.com/index.php?threads/re-tentec-in-trouble.495221/


Weirdest thread I have read in years.  It seems like at least two employee's from TenTec are saying they have not been paid and no one else has.  Then you have guys verifying that they do work at TenTec and yet other posters keep on plowing forward as if none of this was said!  I would say add the lack of paid employees to the past iffy statements from RKR about delays due to parts and also the terrible repair situations people are reporting and it's pretty clear TenTec and Alpha are being liquidated.



LOL Yes this has become a weird thread. Take a bunch of rumors and speculations, mix in some made up things, accuse the owners of all kinds of things, disregard any facts presented, base conclusions on opinion, then say things don't add up,  conclude its a dead company or they are liquidating parts of the company, and work so hard to run down any optimism from those trying to give them some slack. Yea really weird!

Why not just say goodbye and forget the thread even exists!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on October 07, 2015, 08:13:10 PM

LOL Yes this has become a weird thread. Take a bunch of rumors and speculations, mix in some made up things, accuse the owners of all kinds of things, disregard any facts presented, base conclusions on opinion, then say things don't add up,  conclude its a dead company or they are liquidating parts of the company, and work so hard to run down any optimism from those trying to give them some slack. Yea really weird!

Why not just say goodbye and forget the thread even exists!

Keep up, I was talking about the QRZ thread ::)
It would seem that actual employees of TenTec are posting to it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 07, 2015, 10:20:53 PM
Keep up, I was talking about the QRZ thread ::)
It would seem that actual employees of TenTec are posting to it.

i imagine they had to hire an increased number of employees to deal with the upsurge in orders and backorders that the MegaSale on Eagles Omni VII's and Argo VI's created last Summer.  Now if they have run into a snafu regarding parts for assembly you would think they would downsize before failing to meet payroll...

it also sounds strange that they would not meet payroll yet still be actively making receivers for govt contracts.  how do you do that if you are not paying employees???  have you by any chance in your interest in this topic done any research on Alpha and its employees too since RKR is based in Colorado not Tennessee?

also, you seem to be taking a little pleasure in your conclusion that Ten-Tec is going belly-up -- am i reading you wrong?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 08, 2015, 01:28:19 AM

LOL Yes this has become a weird thread. Take a bunch of rumors and speculations, mix in some made up things, accuse the owners of all kinds of things, disregard any facts presented, base conclusions on opinion, then say things don't add up,  conclude its a dead company or they are liquidating parts of the company, and work so hard to run down any optimism from those trying to give them some slack. Yea really weird!

Why not just say goodbye and forget the thread even exists!

Keep up, I was talking about the QRZ thread ::)
It would seem that actual employees of TenTec are posting to it.

Keep up, I was talking about this thread in general, not specifically your commentary. If I were, it would have specifically mentioned items from your commentary, which I did not. Need to brush up on comprehension. But you seem to be too interested in bashing then you are being constructive. Otherwise you would not have made such a comment.

But you are right, the QRZ thread is just as screwed up as this one is. So my commentary can apply to both. So as far as keeping up...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 09, 2015, 12:23:16 PM
That company is done for.  They have no parts, a small office building, a factory that stuffs boards for other companies, and they can't pay their employees even though they are supposedly building receivers. 

The Omni VII wasn't that great and the TS-590 blew the Eagle out of the water for about the same price.  I will be very surprised if we ever see anything other than small Chinese SDR's out of them after this.  I also think Alpha is done and I don't see any new products coming out of them either.  You can all put your rose colored glasses on all you want but the writing is on the wall.  If Ten Tec was serious they would have said so by now.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on October 09, 2015, 03:54:53 PM
That company is done for.  They have no parts, a small office building, a factory that stuffs boards for other companies, and they can't pay their employees even though they are supposedly building receivers. 

The Omni VII wasn't that great and the TS-590 blew the Eagle out of the water for about the same price.  I will be very surprised if we ever see anything other than small Chinese SDR's out of them after this.  I also think Alpha is done and I don't see any new products coming out of them either.  You can all put your rose colored glasses on all you want but the writing is on the wall.  If Ten Tec was serious they would have said so by now.

They will be sold again or will go out of business.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 09, 2015, 05:39:34 PM
That company is done for.  They have no parts, a small office building, a factory that stuffs boards for other companies, and they can't pay their employees even though they are supposedly building receivers. 

The Omni VII wasn't that great and the TS-590 blew the Eagle out of the water for about the same price.  I will be very surprised if we ever see anything other than small Chinese SDR's out of them after this.  I also think Alpha is done and I don't see any new products coming out of them either.  You can all put your rose colored glasses on all you want but the writing is on the wall.  If Ten Tec was serious they would have said so by now.

They will be sold again or will go out of business.

LOL Sure. Whatever you say. I believe it when I see it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on October 09, 2015, 08:38:17 PM
That company is done for.  They have no parts, a small office building, a factory that stuffs boards for other companies, and they can't pay their employees even though they are supposedly building receivers. 

The Omni VII wasn't that great and the TS-590 blew the Eagle out of the water for about the same price.  I will be very surprised if we ever see anything other than small Chinese SDR's out of them after this.  I also think Alpha is done and I don't see any new products coming out of them either.  You can all put your rose colored glasses on all you want but the writing is on the wall.  If Ten Tec was serious they would have said so by now.

And who appointed you judge, jury, and executioner? Problem is, there's no gun or body. The vultures are circling the carcass, but there's no carcass. If I was in a coma with a chance to come out of it, I wouldn't want you to make a decision on pulling the plug  ;D

Now there are 325 posts of "opinions" based on pure supposition and speculation. I guess it's true..."opinions" are like a--holes....everybody has one. Carry on....
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 09, 2015, 08:43:48 PM
That company is done for.  They have no parts, a small office building, a factory that stuffs boards for other companies, and they can't pay their employees even though they are supposedly building receivers. 

The Omni VII wasn't that great and the TS-590 blew the Eagle out of the water for about the same price.  I will be very surprised if we ever see anything other than small Chinese SDR's out of them after this.  I also think Alpha is done and I don't see any new products coming out of them either.  You can all put your rose colored glasses on all you want but the writing is on the wall.  If Ten Tec was serious they would have said so by now.

The 590s does not blow the Eagle out of the water.  it is not nearly as quiet nor easy on the ears as the Eagle. The 590 does offer more stock options for the price -- at least in terms of the original Eagle price before it went on sale w/ AT and filters included.

I can't help but wonder if RKR won't eventually move its xcvr site (presently known as Ten-Tec) to Colorado so that it and Alpha share a common campus location (and possibly some human resources), but like everything else here that is pure speculation. certainly a lot of folks have placed their bets here on Ten-Tec riding into the proverbial sunset to never be heard from again...

73 from the proud owner of a Blue Screen Ten-Tec Jupiter
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 09, 2015, 08:51:51 PM
That company is done for.  They have no parts, a small office building, a factory that stuffs boards for other companies, and they can't pay their employees even though they are supposedly building receivers. 

The Omni VII wasn't that great and the TS-590 blew the Eagle out of the water for about the same price.  I will be very surprised if we ever see anything other than small Chinese SDR's out of them after this.  I also think Alpha is done and I don't see any new products coming out of them either.  You can all put your rose colored glasses on all you want but the writing is on the wall.  If Ten Tec was serious they would have said so by now.

The 590s does not blow the Eagle out of the water.  it is not nearly as quiet nor easy on the ears as the Eagle. The 590 does offer more stock options for the price -- at least in terms of the original Eagle price before it went on sale w/ AT and filters included.

I can't help but wonder if RKR won't eventually move its xcvr site (presently known as Ten-Tec) to Colorado so that it and Alpha share a common campus location (and possibly some human resources), but like everything else here that is pure speculation. certainly a lot of folks have placed their bets here on Ten-Tec riding into the proverbial sunset to never be heard from again...

73 from the proud owner of a Blue Screen Ten-Tec Jupiter

That's right and since my opinion is no less valid than yours I say they are toast.  The difference is I know I'm right cause I remember when Hallicrafters, Hammarlund, Galaxy, Swan/Cubic, Atlas, Heath, SBE, and Drake to name a few, went under because they couldn't compete at a profit. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 09, 2015, 09:56:40 PM
I love it when someone shares a speculative opinion and "know" they are right. Too funny!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on October 10, 2015, 05:24:42 AM
The deniers are going to have a lot of egg on the face before too long.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N8YX on October 10, 2015, 06:56:03 AM
I recently tried ordering some replacement parts for a tuner from them. Parts which are common to a lot of Ten-Tec's 80's-90's era equipment, and which I was able to obtain as service spares as recently as the fall of 2013. Bear in mind that Ten-Tec used to stock a considerable inventory of this kind of stuff, and for gear much older than my tuner.

"No longer available".

One hopes the writing on the wall doesn't say what it's purported to but there aren't too many other ways to interpret it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 10, 2015, 08:15:46 AM
to the funeral committee that has formed before the party in question has stopped breathing or announced any terminal illness: why haven't they started selling off all the accessories which they carry at a discount, let alone a mega-sale type discount? 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N8YX on October 10, 2015, 08:59:45 AM
to the funeral committee that has formed before the party in question has stopped breathing or announced any terminal illness: why haven't they started selling off all the accessories which they carry at a discount, let alone a mega-sale type discount?  
Because they aren't in the business of losing money.

Discontinue certain product lines and sell the inventory at regular prices. It doesn't kill a company to keep limited (existing) stock on hand but restarting a line for a minimum run of, say, 500 units when you're projecting annual sales of 25 or so is a sure way to deplete your coffers.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on October 10, 2015, 10:21:48 AM
I recently tried ordering some replacement parts for a tuner from them. Parts which are common to a lot of Ten-Tec's 80's-90's era equipment, and which I was able to obtain as service spares as recently as the fall of 2013. Bear in mind that Ten-Tec used to stock a considerable inventory of this kind of stuff, and for gear much older than my tuner.

"No longer available".

One hopes the writing on the wall doesn't say what it's purported to but there aren't too many other ways to interpret it.

How much junk should they carry on inventory, and pay taxes on, in order to keep some cheapo ham's twenty year old (or older) ham rig running?????  Specialized parts for many on my imported rigs were obsolete just before the last few radios were sold. They downsized, cleaned out the excess old inventory, and moved into lower rent quarters.  To be fair, I was able to recently order some common parts for my Omni VI rigs; but I wouldn't expect them to service them or have all of the parts used in radios of this age.  Fortunately, 90% of the parts are still available via other parts vendors.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N2SR on October 12, 2015, 03:19:00 AM
I recently tried ordering some replacement parts for a tuner from them. Parts which are common to a lot of Ten-Tec's 80's-90's era equipment, and which I was able to obtain as service spares as recently as the fall of 2013. Bear in mind that Ten-Tec used to stock a considerable inventory of this kind of stuff, and for gear much older than my tuner.

"No longer available".

One hopes the writing on the wall doesn't say what it's purported to but there aren't too many other ways to interpret it.

What specific parts are they?   How many people have ordered that/those parts in the last 5 years?   Maybe Ten-Tec had those parts on hand, and after others before you purchased them, and the stock ran out, those parts became unavailable.   

Why do you think that Ten-Tec stopped production of the Omni VI?  (I think it was the Omni VI).  Because the CPU was no longer available. 



Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 12, 2015, 04:18:57 AM
What I think is funny are people who argue in favor of TenTec, insult others on this board who show concern about TenTec's future, but who have never been a customer of TenTec or bought very little from TenTec to help keep them going.

As a suggestion to all here. If you are going to argue in favor of TenTec, then at least post pictures of your shack in your profile showing TenTec equipment and not just Icom, Yaesu and the like. Help give yourself some credibility.

I love TenTec equipment. Have bought new from TenTec a Paragon II, an Omni 6+, Jupiter, Argo V, Patriot, Rebel and several T-Kit QRP radios. But I am very concerned about their future.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 12, 2015, 05:56:38 AM
What I think is funny are people who argue in favor of TenTec, insult others on this board who show concern about TenTec's future, but who have never been a customer of TenTec or bought very little from TenTec to help keep them going.

As a suggestion to all here. If you are going to argue in favor of TenTec, then at least post pictures of your shack in your profile showing TenTec equipment and not just Icom, Yaesu and the like. Help give yourself some credibility.

I love TenTec equipment. Have bought new from TenTec a Paragon II, an Omni 6+, Jupiter, Argo V, Patriot, Rebel and several T-Kit QRP radios. But I am not very concerned about their future.



That begs the question on why an American can't be optimistic that an American company survives and even thrives even if they have not been a customer? Is that really wrong to do that? If so, please explain...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 12, 2015, 07:33:35 AM
Sure, I will be happy to do so since you asked.

There is Optimism and there is Blind Optimism. The second one is the most dangerous.

A person can be optimistic about the future of a company because it has excellent sales, products, customer communication, service, financial situation, etc. If the company seems to be doing everything right, customers are saying great things about the company and happy about its products and support, then it is easy to be optimistic about the company and its future.

Blind Optimism is when you are hopeful for the future of the company, but you see the company in a very perilous situation. For example, a company's products have had a good reputation in the past, but there have been a number of recent management changes over a short period. There is also a lack of new product introductions. Maybe quality and service issues have started to rise. Maybe employees and/or suppliers have stated they are not being paid or paid on-time. The company has pulled back or eliminated advertising. The company may have also cut back on product lines and downsized the operation. You've noticed that some long-term employees have left the organization to go to work for competitors or complementary companies in the same industry. You see the company maybe losing some of its tribal knowledge. The company may even offer an excuse for the recent business behavior and while it sounds a little weak, you might accept it as totally plausible. Yet, with that being said, the Blind Optimist tells everyone that their observations are nothing but rumors or speculation, that everything is going to be fine. That everyone should continue to back the company, yet they don't actually back the company themselves by making a substantial purchase to help the company succeed. In other words, they support the company verbally, but deep down they are afraid to put their money behind their support and are maybe waiting to make a purchase themselves until they see proof of a resurgence that is if resurgence is to take place.

Hopefully that will clear it up.

Now as for TenTec, we all hope any American company succeeds. But sometimes companies fail, and actually sometimes a company needs to fail. We used to produce a lot of buggy whips in this country but we don't need to manufacturer as many buggy whips as we used to. Sometimes a competitor comes up with a better product, a better way to produce a product, or are quicker and more agile in creating and producing products and thus drive inefficiency out of the market. It's the basic law of survival. The strong grow, the weak get eaten and die out.

For TenTec, right now they appear to be old and tired. The American competition like Flexradio and Elecraft look young, vibrant, agile, quick to market, can deliver product and bringing out new products. Can they renew and reinvigorate themselves? Sure, but they need to move fast as customers are losing patience. Markets move too fast today. If you cannot keep up, your business will die in spite of some people being blindly optimistic, but not customers.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N0YXB on October 12, 2015, 07:36:31 AM
I have purchased items from Ten-Tec over the years but agree with FIB, owning their products is not a prerequisite to having an opinion.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 12, 2015, 08:27:31 AM
Sure, I will be happy to do so since you asked.

There is Optimism and there is Blind Optimism. The second one is the most dangerous.

A person can be optimistic about the future of a company because it has excellent sales, products, customer communication, service, financial situation, etc. If the company seems to be doing everything right, customers are saying great things about the company and happy about its products and support, then it is easy to be optimistic about the company and its future.

Blind Optimism is when you are hopeful for the future of the company, but you see the company in a very perilous situation.

Why is it blind? I have been in HR since the 80s. I have known others who own TT equipment and loved them. Even got to operate a few along the line at Field Day and special events.

I have looked at their equipment many times, but it has never been in my budget. I have bought only 1 new hf radio so far in my life and it was an original FT-897 when AES was closing them out at a bargain basement price. Not every ham can just order new equipment at a whim. Some day I hope I can go online and order a nice new TT radio.

So it is not blind since I actually do admire TT equipment. So I find your argument that my opinion and optimism for the success of TT is somehow dangerous to simply be an attempt to somehow make what I say irrelevant. But for the same reason you can do that is also the same reason I can give my opinion and optimistic view.

I would also add the reverse. If you are the great customer of TT that you say, how can you take a little bad news and publically work to destroy the company with wild speculation that TT is toast?

That is the difference between me and the death march people here. I see the glass as still half full, while the others see the glass as half empty. And so far, no one has given me factual information to change my opinion. And yes, I said my opinion.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on October 12, 2015, 08:36:27 AM
What I think is funny are people who argue in favor of TenTec, insult others on this board who show concern about TenTec's future, but who have never been a customer of TenTec or bought very little from TenTec to help keep them going.

As a suggestion to all here. If you are going to argue in favor of TenTec, then at least post pictures of your shack in your profile showing TenTec equipment and not just Icom, Yaesu and the like. Help give yourself some credibility.

I love TenTec equipment. Have bought new from TenTec a Paragon II, an Omni 6+, Jupiter, Argo V, Patriot, Rebel and several T-Kit QRP radios. But I am very concerned about their future.



I guess I'm one of the targets of the above post, so I'll respond.

As a ham for 56 years, I've never owned any Ten-Tec or Alpha products. Never had anything against them or for them, just bought other brands...my choice. But I can't comment about the hundreds of posts on this thread from those getting dressed for a funeral without a body? I didn't insult anyone...I just get a kick out of the baseless comments, without any facts being brought to light, just heresay. As far as I can determine, RKR is still in business, manufacturing receivers for the government. Good for them if it's a profitable venture for them. If they want to put amateur radio products on the back burner for a while, that's their business decision. They don't owe anyone an explanation or apology for what they're doing.

I never liked to see any business, especially American, go belly up, whether I owned their products or not....don't like to see anyone lose their jobs. But I've owned Hallicrafters, Hammerlund, National, Drake, Heathkit, and Tokyo Hy-Power. Liked all of 'em, but I had no control over their demise. I moved on, now own Icom and Acom. I only wish the best for RKR, and hope they can continue the Ten-Tec and Alpha lines for those that have supported them, and those who wish to purchase their products.

I see that WB8NUT has another post. I'm not a "blind optimist" (dangerous?), just not ready to blindly comment on perceived indications and heresay. Until I see a legal posting that RKR has filed for bankruptcy and liquidation (THAT'S credibility), I'll refrain from throwing dirt on an empty coffin.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 12, 2015, 09:48:52 AM

Why is it blind? I have been in HR since the 80s. I have known others who own TT equipment and loved them. Even got to operate a few along the line at Field Day and special events.

I have looked at their equipment many times, but it has never been in my budget. I have bought only 1 new hf radio so far in my life and it was an original FT-897 when AES was closing them out at a bargain basement price. Not every ham can just order new equipment at a whim. Some day I hope I can go online and order a nice new TT radio.

So it is not blind since I actually do admire TT equipment. So I find your argument that my opinion and optimism for the success of TT is somehow dangerous to simply be an attempt to somehow make what I say irrelevant. But for the same reason you can do that is also the same reason I can give my opinion and optimistic view.

I would also add the reverse. If you are the great customer of TT that you say, how can you take a little bad news and publically work to destroy the company with wild speculation that TT is toast?

That is the difference between me and the death march people here. I see the glass as still half full, while the others see the glass as half empty. And so far, no one has given me factual information to change my opinion. And yes, I said my opinion.

First and foremost, I am NOT working to destroy the company. That is the biggest amount of hogwash ever written. I am concerned about the company, very concerned. I became concerned with the latest Argo when they brought out a QRP rig with missing bands. In this day and age, just should not happen. Elecraft on the other hand created a QRP rig with all bands, plus 6 meters and tuner and option to add 2 meters or if in the UK, 4 meters. The previous Argo had all bands less 6 meters. Seems like TT was going backwards instead of forwards.

Blind Optimism is ignoring the signs and the obvious. It's not a question of the half-full/half-empty argument.

If you really want to help TenTec and really support them with more than words, sell some of your Japanese equipment and buy one of TenTec's radios. Then your argument can have some credibility. Even buying a $200 Rebel will help TenTec. Heck, if you didn't have money to buy new, why didn't you buy a used TenTec? According to you, you still chose Japanese rigs over an American TenTec rig. So bashing me and others over our concern for the future of the company, since we have a lot of skin in the TenTec game and you have none, is just unfair. I like many others here expressing concern, have supported the company with our dollars and want to see the company continue. You on the other hand want to ignore some obvious signs, but only support the company with your words while sending your dollars to others.

If you are so concerned about TenTec and comments of concern about the company, then start supporting them as a customer instead of simply being a cheerleader. Cheerleaders can't win games, but actual participants can. Get in the game. TenTec needs more than just a bunch of cheerleaders.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 12, 2015, 02:10:52 PM


Blind Optimism is ignoring the signs and the obvious. It's not a question of the half-full/half-empty argument.



When I get some actual facts as to the future, then I may change MY opinion. So far the only facts shown was the email sent by TT. Which I interpret much differently being in the manufacturing field. So many put doom and gloom interpretations, rumors, made up things, speculations, and just plain nonsense in this thread that it is impossible for anyone to get a clear picture.

As to ignoring the signs...what signs. All the garbage not fact based written here? Give me a break.

As to the biggest hogwash ever written, I can find much bigger ones. If you speak negatively on a subject, it does not make you a supporter. When you regurgitate rumors with no facts, doesn't make you much of a supporter.

As to buying something from TT, guess you didn't read the part where I hope to in the future. Or you can give me the money to get what I want, not just some low priced thing they make that does not fill my needs. I don't think anyone will give me enough money for my old FT-897 to buy what I want.

A few posts ago you said you were done with this topic with me. Why don't you take your own advice. Its obvious you will never change me no matter what spin you put on it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 12, 2015, 08:27:08 PM
All I know is that it has been over a year since they have made any public announcement other than a fire sale that basically said everything must go.  Other than that all we hear are crickets.  So by all means keep those heads in the sand but I'm not waiting  for Ten Tec, Icom is bringing out a juicy new SDR that is supposed to have killer specs.  If the price is right I will own one of those as soon as it becomes available.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on October 12, 2015, 08:58:27 PM
Wow 23 pages of the same stuff.  I keep on wondering what are the lies that people are spreading? All I have seen are people expressing their opinions as to what this kind of silence from a company means. Some are concerned and think it's a sign of bad news to come and others think it means nothing.

As for RKR they could settle this PR problem with one post and not even have to give any specifics.

Something like:

Contrary to recent rumors RKR is still dedicated to making and selling TenTec and Alpha equipment.  While we have no specific dates set we assure you we have not abandoned these product lines and further announcements will come in the future.

Why Do it:
It's in their best interest to inform their customer base that all is well.
If they have no interest in doing that then what's the point of buying a product from a company that has nothing to say to its customer base.

73s
Rob
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 12, 2015, 10:44:26 PM
so you are just trying to spook them out and that is why you've suggested a funeral will soon be announced? you want them to come *here* and post?(!)

okay i get it.   i also get why they haven't dignified it with a reply.  they probably are not in a position planning wise right now to announce anything.  they also probably feel this thread has just too many hungry vultures and this is not the time or place.  

so crickets it is!  you seem to want them to behave like a publicly-owned company.  good luck with that.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on October 13, 2015, 02:10:24 AM
I didn't start this thread or the QRZ thread. It's here, it asks legitimate questions and it draws on several theries, including yours!  It's no skin off my back if they are thinking like you and decide an explanation is beneath them. It's their company and if they find publicly responding to be a waste of time then they have to deal with the communities confidence factor, not me.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 13, 2015, 04:14:43 AM

When I get some actual facts as to the future, then I may change MY opinion. So far the only facts shown was the email sent by TT. Which I interpret much differently being in the manufacturing field. So many put doom and gloom interpretations, rumors, made up things, speculations, and just plain nonsense in this thread that it is impossible for anyone to get a clear picture.

As to ignoring the signs...what signs. All the garbage not fact based written here? Give me a break.

As to the biggest hogwash ever written, I can find much bigger ones. If you speak negatively on a subject, it does not make you a supporter. When you regurgitate rumors with no facts, doesn't make you much of a supporter.

As to buying something from TT, guess you didn't read the part where I hope to in the future. Or you can give me the money to get what I want, not just some low priced thing they make that does not fill my needs. I don't think anyone will give me enough money for my old FT-897 to buy what I want.

A few posts ago you said you were done with this topic with me. Why don't you take your own advice. Its obvious you will never change me no matter what spin you put on it.

Yeah, Thomas was a doubter and could not believe what others told him and he also demanded facts and proof. Jesus put Thomas in his place because he did not believe the observations the others reported. To this day there are still many like Thomas, they ignore observations and what others have reported.

So as for the signs, I and others have pointed them out here over and over. I am not sure if you cannot remember, do not read the comments, or in the case of Blind Optimism, just ignore them. The signs pointed out previously by the way, does not mean the company is going out of business anytime soon, but it does point to the company having issues which may impact their viability. We'll have to see how all that plays out.

In addition, to be a supporter one does not have to be a cheerleader. I can support my child, but point out their bad decisions or bad behavior. I can support my country, but point out bad leadership, bad decisions and criticize them. I can support my employer, but criticize some of their decisions, direction, product, quality, etc.  When you provide support and ignore all issues, that is Blind Optimism.

As for you radio decisions, "I hope to in the future." Well TenTec cannot succeed on simply hopes. It needs customers with money buying their products. I understand that you may not get much for your FT-897 since it is not a very good radio and a very noisy receiver. You should have purchased a TenTec which typically have very quiet receivers and excellent audio. I am not going to give you any money so you can buy a TenTec. I am not Obama and will not give away money to people who do not earn it. You'll have to find a way to earn the money yourself and buy it on your own. I would suggest you not wait too long to make that purchase. Sell the FT-897, scrape up some additional money, and buy an Eagle. Put your money where you mouth is and support the company as a customer - now.

Finally, I said I would not comment on TenTec directly unless new information or observations came to light. What I am commenting on are your posts continuing to challenge me and others over criticism of TenTec, the meaning of Blind Optimism, etc. Also, I have to admit, I know you are one of those people who always has to have the last word so I have been having a bit of fun with these responses. So, go ahead and make the next post as I know you will just have to make it. On the other hand, I think this has been beat to death so I will refrain from posting again.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 13, 2015, 05:15:13 AM

On the other hand, I think this has been beat to death so I will refrain from posting again.

LOL Where have I seen that before?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K9MHZ on October 13, 2015, 08:13:06 AM
Yeah, 24 pages.....a lot of opinion and passion on this one for some reason.

Whatever the case, I hope they pull it together.  My little anecdotal experience with them in ordering a TT tuner at Dayton, and being strung along for the whole summer and into the fall, only to be told "Nov or Dec at the earliest....." was pretty eye-opening and very un-Ten-Tec like.

Dunno.

  
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 13, 2015, 09:59:32 AM
Yeah, 24 pages.....a lot of opinion and passion on this one for some reason.

Whatever the case, I hope they pull it together.  My little anecdotal experience with them in ordering a TT tuner at Dayton, and being strung along for the whole summer and into the fall, only to be told "Nov or Dec at the earliest....." was pretty eye-opening and very un-Ten-Tec like.

Dunno.

  

Yep, when I asked about the Omni VII I got the same response and that bothered me.  When I read a post from a current Ten Tec employee who said he wasn't getting paid it was enough for me, companies that don't pay their employees are usually dead players.

But I'm an optimist, I know that just because we have not heard anything out of Hallicrafters in a while they are coming back.  It's their company and they don't have to say anything if they don't want to so you can speculate all you want.  All of you naysayers can just jump off a cliff because Hallicrafters is coming back and you know it, yes siree Bob. ::)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on October 13, 2015, 12:34:44 PM
But I'm an optimist, I know that just because we have not heard anything out of Hallicrafters in a while they are coming back.  It's their company and they don't have to say anything if they don't want to so you can speculate all you want.  All of you naysayers can just jump off a cliff because Hallicrafters is coming back and you know it, yes siree Bob. ::)

 ;D ;D

(https://s3.amazonaws.com/lowres.cartoonstock.com/education-teaching-meteor-age_of_the_dinosaurs-dinos-dinosaurs-asteroid-bwhn859_low.jpg)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 13, 2015, 08:00:22 PM
But I'm an optimist, I know that just because we have not heard anything out of Hallicrafters in a while they are coming back.  It's their company and they don't have to say anything if they don't want to so you can speculate all you want.  All of you naysayers can just jump off a cliff because Hallicrafters is coming back and you know it, yes siree Bob. ::)

 ;D ;D

(https://s3.amazonaws.com/lowres.cartoonstock.com/education-teaching-meteor-age_of_the_dinosaurs-dinos-dinosaurs-asteroid-bwhn859_low.jpg)

LOL, like the Ten Tec fan club, it will only be a surprise to them when the company dries up and blows away.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 14, 2015, 12:20:56 AM
(http://letters2mindanao.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/bday.jpg)

Just like this thread...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 14, 2015, 02:35:18 AM
Just like this thread...

those who are coming here dressed for a funeral and cracking jokes seem like the same guys who slow way down if there is an accident to gape at any potential injuries and then concoct imaginary carnage if no overt signs can be found.  this thread has degenerated into that kind of traffic jam -- a whole lot of slow cars forgetting where they are going in the quest to peer & point at something they are guessing is injured...   ::)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K5WLR on October 14, 2015, 06:55:18 AM

Just like this thread...

A mortuus equus pulsus.

Will Rogers
K5WLR
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on October 14, 2015, 04:40:11 PM

Just like this thread...

A mortuus equus pulsus.

Will Rogers
K5WLR

And I second your "mortuus Equus pulsus"  ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9VO on October 15, 2015, 05:33:07 AM
This thread has certainly:  Equitatus erat severiter et madidus stabulatus est
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K5WLR on October 15, 2015, 05:47:31 AM
This thread has certainly:  Equitatus erat severiter et madidus stabulatus est


Mr. Murphy (my high school Latin teacher) would be proud!

Will Rogers
K5WLR
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 15, 2015, 10:31:11 AM
This thread has certainly:  Equitatus erat severiter et madidus stabulatus est


Rode hard and stabled wet? Anyone else what to post their favorite Latin phrase unrelated to this tread ;-)

Maybe Sheldon Cooper will replace his "Fun With Flags" with "Fun With Latin" on some upcoming episodes.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9VO on October 15, 2015, 07:24:27 PM
Glad you enjoyed. It is as close to "rode hard and put away wet" that I could do. Which is exactly what we should do with most of you and this thread!!!

Love, Barry Kripke.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on October 16, 2015, 02:59:17 PM
Glad you enjoyed. It is as close to "rode hard and put away wet" that I could do. Which is exactly what we should do with most of you and this thread!!!

Love, Barry Kripke.


Ahem  ??? ??? OKay
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N4DOV on October 16, 2015, 04:52:04 PM
" Cives videret scribentis in pariete."
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on October 18, 2015, 05:45:54 PM
Sic semper WTF.

if you have money and want a radio, buy a radio.  if you have money later, buy a radio then.  choose from what's on the market at that time.

if TT is around, they're on the list.  if not, not.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0BKR on October 21, 2015, 12:15:57 PM
Not sure what the real future is for TT, but to be honest, if I had a TT radio right now I would definitely be concerned about future support (i.e. repairs, etc.)....just saying...it has been quite a while since they "moved", "merged" etc and to me, certainly not very promising...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AC4RD on October 21, 2015, 09:27:07 PM

Maybe Sheldon Cooper will replace his "Fun With Flags" with "Fun With Latin" on some upcoming episodes.

He can't.  He went to Long Beach; they're having an intervention for his Cousin Leo.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on October 22, 2015, 08:02:26 AM
Not sure what the real future is for TT, but to be honest, if I had a TT radio right now I would definitely be concerned about future support (i.e. repairs, etc.)....just saying...it has been quite a while since they "moved", "merged" etc and to me, certainly not very promising...

I have radios from overseas manufacturers that are newer than some of the stuff TenTec was repairing, up until recently. 1980's vintage Paragons and Omni VI rigs were still be serviced, long before rigs such as my FT-736R had turned into a pumpkin.  One or two custom IC devices go out of production, and almost any radio can become obsolete almost overnight.

At this point I try to own stuff that I know I can repair. The early Omni VI rigs are easy; and there are enough tech specials and resellers offering boards that will be around for as long I will able to keep active.

But yeah, an Orion II or Orion is going to be hard, since they were mostly board level swaps if a major board had a problem. And, that was NOT cheap.  Coupled with the lack of factory level service data, a used one might be risky investment.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WK3B on October 23, 2015, 01:07:12 PM
Not sure what the real future is for TT, but to be honest, if I had a TT radio right now I would definitely be concerned about future support (i.e. repairs, etc.)....just saying...it has been quite a while since they "moved", "merged" etc and to me, certainly not very promising...

Well, I like the brand, and have an Orion II and an Alpha 8410.  I've also been concerned about the Omni VII "waiting for parts" for most of the year now, as well as some of the other stories I hear.  So, in order to try to change the situation, I decided to order some things from RKR to give them some business.  Ordered a spare 3CX800 tube for my Ameritron AL-800.  Best price I've found, and showed up at my door in about two weeks, not the 4-6 weeks they quoted.  Also order both an Alpha and a Ten-Tec hat, neither of which have yet arrived, so go figure.  So -- if you like the brand -- go buy something!  I DO think that RF Concepts did a FAR better job of communicating with the amateur community, especially with the newsletters.  I think the CIA is more communicative than RKR has been.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 23, 2015, 02:24:07 PM
I think the CIA is more communicative than RKR has been.

finally someone w/ something positive to say about RKR: they are better at being secretive than is the CIA.   :-\
then again, maybe the CIA has ordered them to be like that   :P
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on October 25, 2015, 01:59:24 PM
Logically, if they're making more money with government contracts (and confidently remain sustainable in the future), and they have limited resources to also invest in amateur radio, they'll amputate the leg. Wouldn't you? Problem is, putting all your eggs in one basket can be a slippery slope. Hopefully, they know what they're doing...but none of my business  ::)

Many years ago there was a machine shop near here that got some lucrative government contracts and they built and expanded 10 fold in a few years and several years later they were out of business when contracts were gone. Betting farm on them is not best move if you plan to be around long term.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 25, 2015, 03:31:34 PM
But on the other hand a good business does not turn down work now because it might not be there in the future.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on October 25, 2015, 04:05:12 PM
But on the other hand a good business does not turn down work now because it might not be there in the future.

I knew a guy that owned a plastic inject mold company and made high strength plastic parts many years ago. He started turning down and moving away from GM car parts contracts. He said they were too unpredictable to build a business on and limited them to a small amount and was expanding. A massive fire caused by a overloaded 3 phases 400 amp circuit and that destroyed most of factory is what put the out of business. Insurance company did not want to pay what it was supposed too and wore him down and bled him dry in litigation.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 25, 2015, 05:56:34 PM
OK well turning down GM orders didn't start the fire, at least by the story told here. So there was really no cause and effect of one to the other.

While a good business doesn't turn down work, a good business also doesn't build on 1 customer either. And having more then 1 customer gives choices and the ability to choose what work to keep the business busy and healthy. In the case above, they chose not to do business with GM and remained busy. Sounded like a good decision to me.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on October 25, 2015, 06:29:10 PM
While a good business doesn't turn down work, a good business also doesn't build on 1 customer either.

A good business will turn down work that is not in its best Interest.  I know I have when not likely to be very profitable.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 25, 2015, 07:37:58 PM
Which is why they build their business in a way so they can choose.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on October 26, 2015, 03:54:48 AM
Which is why they build their business in a way so they can choose.

There are two business models used today mostly. One is using a long term stability and steady growth and the other for quick profit and cashing out and then using laws favoring them to limit liability when they raid assets and take money and run. Lot of corporations  and equity groups have made good quick dirty money using later method buying companies and liquidating assets while claiming to do otherwise.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on October 26, 2015, 05:50:38 AM
For what it's worth...

There was a post made to one of the Ten Tec email reflectors end of last week.  The amateur alleged that he had called Ten Tec sales looking for a used Omni VII that might have been traded in.

He alleged that he was told (and I'm paraphrasing here) that while they were currently out of used O7's, there was a small inventory of NEW ONES almost completely assembled, sitting in the factory.  They were waiting on front panels to be delivered.  There were also additional units waiting on a part shipment.

( I say "alleged" not because I disbelieve the poster, simply because I didn't hear the information directly from the source, so I can not state that I know this to be true)

I would politely suggest that anyone who has concerns or doubts about that information call Ten Tec sales directly and make their own inquiries. 

I'm sure that if someone did so and found that the OP was given misinformation, they will waste no time whatsoever posting it here!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on October 26, 2015, 07:53:14 AM
I will be VERY surprised if they come back viable. Generally if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck it is one.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N8YX on October 26, 2015, 09:16:12 AM
I will be VERY surprised if they come back viable. Generally if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck it is one.
I wanted to buy a couple replacement bills and maybe a feather or two for my ducks. "No longer available".

Okay...on a 20-year-old radio, I could possibly understand IF the requested components were sourced third-party (such as an IC) and not fabricated in-house (as the parts I wanted to order were).

But then I'm taken to this bit right out of the old owner's manuals:

Quote
"Ten-Tec's service department can repair and service virtually everything we have built going back to our first transceivers in the late 1960's. It is our ability to continue offering service on these rigs that has led to their re-sale value remaining high and has made a major contribution to our legendary service reputation."

Any RKR staff paying attention here?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 26, 2015, 02:21:50 PM
Ten Tec's reputation and loyal following was built in large part by their legendary service.  When I looked at the Facebook page there is a sale ad that sounds like a fire sale, you know, all items must go.  I was not instilled with confidence and I too think that RKR is liquidating the Ten Tec assets to either transition to other business ventures or to just close them out.  Same goes for Alpha, like the dream tuner that is still a dream.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N0YXB on October 26, 2015, 08:16:49 PM
And life will go on. Hopefully like this thread, which has amazing longevity.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on October 27, 2015, 07:49:40 AM
And life will go on. Hopefully like this thread, which has amazing longevity.

If you are bored with the thread, then move on.  No one is making you read or respond to these threads.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N0YXB on October 27, 2015, 07:58:28 AM
And life will go on. Hopefully like this thread, which has amazing longevity.

If you are bored with the thread, then move on.  No one is making you read or respond to these threads.

Calm down thread police, I was not being snarky and I'm not bored. Amused, but not bored.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0BKR on October 27, 2015, 08:05:36 AM
I have to be honest.  I haven't been following the TT saga that much, but from what I recall, they announced the RKR take over (or whatever you want to call it) in April 2015 or there abouts.  Now, 6 months later, and most of the public still knows little more then they did in April of this year.  So, for me, although I like some of the TT gear, I wonder if in all honesty, are they (TT) really going to have any real product makings for the market in the calendar year 2015 ?  Doesn't seem like it.  I sure hope they prove me wrong, but I haven't seen this kind of delay/lagging in previous manufacturers in quite some time, unless they were struggling to stay afloat and finally gave up the ghost and called it quits.  I certainly hope they do come back to the market with some stellar products but I am not going to hold my breath on that one.....GL to TT...I hope they do make it....
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N0YXB on October 27, 2015, 08:12:26 AM
GL to TT...I hope they do make it....

Ditto and me too.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 27, 2015, 09:59:18 AM
And life will go on. Hopefully like this thread, which has amazing longevity.

If you are bored with the thread, then move on.  No one is making you read or respond to these threads.

just curious, what led you to the false hypothesis that he was bored or that it is your place to be his thread-navigation elmer?    :)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 27, 2015, 10:19:26 AM
I have to be honest.  I haven't been following the TT saga that much, but from what I recall, they announced the RKR take over (or whatever you want to call it) in April 2015 or there abouts.  Now, 6 months later, and most of the public still knows little more then they did in April of this year.  So, for me, although I like some of the TT gear, I wonder if in all honesty, are they (TT) really going to have any real product makings for the market in the calendar year 2015 ?  Doesn't seem like it.  I sure hope they prove me wrong, but I haven't seen this kind of delay/lagging in previous manufacturers in quite some time, unless they were struggling to stay afloat and finally gave up the ghost and called it quits.  I certainly hope they do come back to the market with some stellar products but I am not going to hold my breath on that one.....GL to TT...I hope they do make it....

thanks for the relatively reasonable reply to this thread i started a little less than 4 months ago...

supposing RKR plans to revamp the whole TT line and spend up to 6 months on the new designs after they get the acquisition grunt work out of the way -- how long of a lag is there between designing the new rigs, lining up relationships with across-the-globe parts manufacturers / suppliers and delivery of those parts and subsequent domestic manufacture in terms of a time gap? Then also consider that some of this same time-lag (parts acquisition) may be impacting their ability to make and sell Omni VII's in the interim. Add in to the mix that they are doing government contracts for receivers and they also have Alpha amplifiers to oversee.

I am thinking the doomsdayers cannot start to play the i-told-you-so card until mid 2016 and the TT-phoenix-will-rise-from-this-acquisition folks will have to start to be seriously worried a year from now in the absence of any news.   

i wonder what the odds are that the funeral committee camped out here on this thread will now let me have it for non-conformance with their funeral planning?   :)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on October 27, 2015, 12:24:25 PM

I am thinking the doomsdayers cannot start to play the i-told-you-so card until mid 2016 and the TT-phoenix-will-rise-from-this-acquisition folks will have to start to be seriously worried a year from now in the absence of any news.   

i wonder what the odds are that the funeral committee camped out here on this thread will now let me have it for non-conformance with their funeral planning?   :)

What are you of all people starting to have some Doubts?  If TenTec goes under you will be seen the way I see you already. As an incredibly naive business person. Either that or your just so in love with TT that you are blinded to the business reality.

If this had been Kenwood and they had a fire sale followed by little or no products, a service department that seemed to be in a Coma, employees coming on forums and saying they are not being paid and then the company became shrouded in complete silence on any future plans, I figure you would be coming to the same conclusion that we have had about TenTec and Alpha.   Anyway keep dreaming, who knows maybe some wealthy Ham will come along and bail them out.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 27, 2015, 12:31:54 PM
W9KEY...That didn't take long! But I agree with what you said.

Wonder who else will crawl out of the woodwork and plan the funeral?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 27, 2015, 12:53:17 PM
.
What are you of all people starting to have some Doubts?

about your funeral committee?  let's just say that if i did have any doubts, your fast reply above has made them feel foolish  ;)

Quote from: KD8MJR
If TenTec goes under you will be seen the way I see you already.

if  ??? -- are you of all people starting to have some Doubts?

Quote from: KD8MJR
As an incredibly naive business person. Either that or your just so in love with TT that you are blinded to the business reality.


if someone looks to be in questionable health, announcing that they have a terminal illness -- especially when you are only speculating -- is not appropriate nor respectful behavior... this is not high school, so why exactly is it that you are badgering me for not joining your Funeral committee?     ;)


Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on October 27, 2015, 03:53:09 PM
RKR was the board manufacturer for Ten Tec. 

They took over two failing companies.  Cut them some slack.  You can assume that neither Ten Tec nor Alpha will have the same the level of products or service going into the future.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on October 27, 2015, 04:28:41 PM
.
What are you of all people starting to have some Doubts?


about your funeral committee?  let's just say that if i did have any doubts, your fast reply above has made them feel foolish  ;)

So it seems you were starting to have doubts!  My LOL fast reply was 2 hours after your post.  It happened to be my lunch time at work so I came on the forum and saw your post that showed your no longer feeling so sure.

Quote from: KD8MJR
If TenTec goes under you will be seen the way I see you already.
Quote from: W9KEY
if  ??? -- are you of all people starting to have some Doubts?

I do not believe I have ever said that TenTec was going under for certain, I have been conveying that from a business point of view they are either going under or are incredibly un-business like not to come onto the forum and write at least one paragraph saying they are fine.  Something you believe is beneath the might of such a great company.

Quote from: KD8MJR
As an incredibly naive business person. Either that or your just so in love with TT that you are blinded to the business reality.

Quote from: W9KEY
if someone looks to be in questionable health, announcing that they have a terminal illness -- especially when you are only speculating -- is not appropriate nor respectful behavior... this is not high school, so why exactly is it that you are badgering me for not joining your Funeral committee?     ;)

So now their health looks questionable :o  Before you seemed certain they were doing what they needed to do and that all we had to do was wait until they decided to inform us of their plans.

Your a very Black and White kind of guy, you believe because people like myself and others make post saying that this seems odd and that it does not look good that we must be rooting for the company to go under.   One of the saddest days for me was Dec 24 2013 when Tokyo Hy-Power went bankrupt.  I certainly do not want to see another Ham Radio company go under and I don't think anyone else posting to this thread wants to see TenTec or Alpha go out of business.  On the other hand we I won't sit back like a Sheep being fed something that sounds like BS to me by a company, especially when I have seen the same BS used several times before. I will ask questions and when there is silence I get suspicious.

Stop being paranoid, there is no funeral committee cheering for the death of TenTec or Alpha.  There are just hams that are asking questions and not getting any answers.  If TenTec should go out of business you can thank RKR, because nothing they have done from day one suggest they ever had any plans of keeping TenTec going.




Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 27, 2015, 06:31:35 PM
there is no funeral committee cheering for the death of TenTec or Alpha.

Really? LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 27, 2015, 08:48:04 PM
I have to be honest.  I haven't been following the TT saga that much, but from what I recall, they announced the RKR take over (or whatever you want to call it) in April 2015 or there abouts.  Now, 6 months later, and most of the public still knows little more then they did in April of this year.  So, for me, although I like some of the TT gear, I wonder if in all honesty, are they (TT) really going to have any real product makings for the market in the calendar year 2015 ?  Doesn't seem like it.  I sure hope they prove me wrong, but I haven't seen this kind of delay/lagging in previous manufacturers in quite some time, unless they were struggling to stay afloat and finally gave up the ghost and called it quits.  I certainly hope they do come back to the market with some stellar products but I am not going to hold my breath on that one.....GL to TT...I hope they do make it....

thanks for the relatively reasonable reply to this thread i started a little less than 4 months ago...

supposing RKR plans to revamp the whole TT line and spend up to 6 months on the new designs after they get the acquisition grunt work out of the way -- how long of a lag is there between designing the new rigs, lining up relationships with across-the-globe parts manufacturers / suppliers and delivery of those parts and subsequent domestic manufacture in terms of a time gap? Then also consider that some of this same time-lag (parts acquisition) may be impacting their ability to make and sell Omni VII's in the interim. Add in to the mix that they are doing government contracts for receivers and they also have Alpha amplifiers to oversee.

I am thinking the doomsdayers cannot start to play the i-told-you-so card until mid 2016 and the TT-phoenix-will-rise-from-this-acquisition folks will have to start to be seriously worried a year from now in the absence of any news.   

i wonder what the odds are that the funeral committee camped out here on this thread will now let me have it for non-conformance with their funeral planning?   :)

I worked for Harris Corp many years ago and it took us between 6 to 9 months to design high end military radios.  Once the designs were completed parts were a breeze, there are a thousand wholesale suppliers of parts here in the US so no need to go global, the distributors do that for you.

With modern design techniques I would expect to see them bending metal within four months and placing ads in QST.  Since that hasn't happened I doubt they are even looking at that approach.  They are selling a couple of rebranded Chinese Arduino rigs right now and I expect that if we see anything at all out of TT in the future that will be it, a few rinky dink kit type SDR radios.

I don't know where you got the notion about it being difficult to get parts but parts are easy to get.  The hard part might be enclosures since they no longer produce their own and They sold off all of Ten Tecs metal fabricating equipment.

As for government receivers?  How do you know they are really building receivers at all let alone for the government.  They might be subbed to put out some boards but since they cant pay their employees it leaves me wondering if they are actually building anything at all.

Last update out of the company was over a year ago, no new product announcements and they are only selling existing inventory  (until gone ) as the Face Book ad says.  Sounds like a liquidation sale to me.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 27, 2015, 08:48:55 PM
Quote from: KD8MJR
So it seems you were starting to have doubts!  My LOL fast reply was 2 hours after your post.  It happened to be my lunch time at work so I came on the forum and saw your post that showed your no longer feeling so sure.

The doubts I was expressing in context were about whether the Funeral committee here would really behave so predictably and accuse me of not conforming to their presuppositions -- re-visit the context

Quote from: W9KEY
if someone looks to be in questionable health, announcing that they have a terminal illness -- especially when you are only speculating -- is not appropriate nor respectful behavior... this is not high school, so why exactly is it that you are badgering me for not joining your Funeral committee?     ;)

Quote from: KD8MJR
So now their health looks questionable :o  Before you seemed certain they were doing what they needed to do and that all we had to do was wait until they decided to inform us of their plans.

I am talking about how you and the funeral committee keep saying not only is the party in question in questionable health but you also seem to be planning the funeral – if we look back we may even find some even started tossing dirt on the proverbial (but imaginary) corpse.  My point is that it is neither respectful or appropriate to gossip secondhand about the health of a third party.  That is what has gone on quite a bit in this thread.  From the first post you can see I was not proclaiming where TT was going – rather I was wondering and open-minded about it.  I still am and will continue to be until RKR announces something.     

Quote from: KD8MJR
Your a very Black and White kind of guy, you believe because people like myself and others make post saying that this seems odd and that it does not look good that we must be rooting for the company to go under.   One of the saddest days for me was Dec 24 2013 when Tokyo Hy-Power went bankrupt.  I certainly do not want to see another Ham Radio company go under and I don't think anyone else posting to this thread wants to see TenTec or Alpha go out of business.  On the other hand we I won't sit back like a Sheep being fed something that sounds like BS to me by a company, especially when I have seen the same BS used several times before. I will ask questions and when there is silence I get suspicious.
Stop being paranoid, there is no funeral committee cheering for the death of TenTec or Alpha.  There are just hams that are asking questions and not getting any answers.  If TenTec should go out of business you can thank RKR, because nothing they have done from day one suggest they ever had any plans of keeping TenTec going.

So now you think I am really imagining an actual Funeral committee?  ??? LOL 

It is good and a little surprising to hear you wish TT well and hope they survive. Noone is asking you to be a sheep or buy into rosy scenarios.  At the risk of being called naïve [insert mock horror here] I would suggest that we lower the volume on telling them how they should run their business and give them more time to show their cards before we proclaim they are going under.     

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on October 28, 2015, 03:23:55 AM
And life will go on. Hopefully like this thread, which has amazing longevity.

If you are bored with the thread, then move on.  No one is making you read or respond to these threads.

just curious, what led you to the false hypothesis that he was bored or that it is your place to be his thread-navigation elmer?    :)

I said IF...  So, what led you to the false hypothesis that I said he was bored?  IF is not is...  Clearly you have reading comprehension problems.

To keep on subject, Ten Tec and Alpha will not last another year unless someone buys them from RKR.  They are in big trouble.  Just wait and you'll see.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 28, 2015, 09:15:05 AM
And life will go on. Hopefully like this thread, which has amazing longevity.

If you are bored with the thread, then move on.  No one is making you read or respond to these threads.

just curious, what led you to the false hypothesis that he was bored or that it is your place to be his thread-navigation elmer?    :)

I said IF...  So, what led you to the false hypothesis that I said he was bored?  IF is not is...  Clearly you have reading comprehension problems.


you said "if you are bored" and then suggested what advice you believed he should follow if your "if" hypothesis was indeed true.
so please revisit your suggestion that i am the one with reading comprehension issues.  no need to reply, unless you want to apologize for (and thus own) your condescending nonsense  ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on October 28, 2015, 09:25:59 AM
And life will go on. Hopefully like this thread, which has amazing longevity.

If you are bored with the thread, then move on.  No one is making you read or respond to these threads.

just curious, what led you to the false hypothesis that he was bored or that it is your place to be his thread-navigation elmer?    :)

I said IF...  So, what led you to the false hypothesis that I said he was bored?  IF is not is...  Clearly you have reading comprehension problems.


you said "if you are bored" and then suggested what advice you believed he should follow if your "if" hypothesis was indeed true.
so please revisit your suggestion that i am the one with reading comprehension issues.  no need to reply, unless you want to apologize for (and thus own) your condescending nonsense  ;)

IF is not a hypothesis.  Had I said "since you are bored", I would have been stating a hypothesis.  If I say "IF there are unicorns...", I am not stating that there are unicorns.  

Now I did make a hypothesis about your comprehension problems.  Seeing how you responded to my comment, I am sticking to that hypothesis.   :D :D :D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 28, 2015, 09:30:05 AM

I am talking about how you and the funeral committee keep saying not only is the party in question in questionable health but you also seem to be planning the funeral –
[/quote]

Unless you work for the company in question your predictions of success are no more valid than the opinions of others  that they are a bankrupted organization.  In fact your assumptions are even less valid because everything we have seen, and more to the point, not seen, indicates that they are out of the amateur radio business for good.

 
Quote
I would suggest that we lower the volume on telling them how they should run their business and give them more time to show their cards before we proclaim they are going under.

I have not seen anyone telling them how to run their company and who care anyway?  I seriously doubt they read this and if they do they should have responded by now.  They have had more than ample time to "show their cards" and we have seen nothing out of them but total silence.  I would have expected to see something like a press release in QST but all we have are crickets.  They don't even have a facebook page, the old Ten Tec page under RF Concepts pops up with the fire sale add and then total silence.  

So I have to wonder what you base your enthusiasm on because the majority of us just don't see them coming back at this point.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 28, 2015, 10:03:26 AM
Quote
I am talking about how you and the funeral committee keep saying not only is the party in question in questionable health but you also seem to be planning the funeral –

Quote from: KA4DPO
Unless you work for the company in question your predictions of success are no more valid than the opinions of others  that they are a bankrupted organization.  In fact your assumptions are even less valid because everything we have seen, and more to the point, not seen, indicates that they are out of the amateur radio business for good.
 

i agree voicing hope that RKR manufacturers xcvrs in the TT tradition of quality and innovation-- whether that is in CO or TN or wherever -- is no more valid than the opinions predicting their demise.
 
Quote
I would suggest that we lower the volume on telling them how they should run their business and give them more time to show their cards before we proclaim they are going under.

Quote from: KA4DPO
I have not seen anyone telling them how to run their company and who care anyway?  I seriously doubt they read this and if they do they should have responded by now.  They have had more than ample time to "show their cards" and we have seen nothing out of them but total silence.  I would have expected to see something like a press release in QST but all we have are crickets.  They don't even have a facebook page, the old Ten Tec page under RF Concepts pops up with the fire sale add and then total silence. 

So I have to wonder what you base your enthusiasm on because the majority of us just don't see them coming back at this point.

RKR acquired TT in April 2015, when TT was already in flux -- so it is a little premature imo to issue a death certificate.  There have been plenty of suggestions that -- unless RKR plans on ending TT and riding off into the sunset -- they should post here and silence their doubters. That sounds to me like telling them how to run their business.   Has TT ever officially posted on eham, either the original TT or the second incarnation as RF Concepts?  Does Kenwood, Yaesu, or Icom officially participate in eham threads? 

i am not asking anyone to share my hope that they continue making xcvrs and issuing new products long into the future.  as an analogy to the RKR purchase -- if someone goes into a hospital for an operation, absent a death certificate or announcement from their family -- i don't find it appropriate or respectful to suggest they won't come out of it alive or that they are in critical condition.  i generally hope for the best in such situations, especially if it is someone i am fond of.  It would not surprise me for someone's enemies to root against them in such a case.  some businesses end and some make turn-arounds all the time. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 28, 2015, 10:45:57 AM

I have not seen anyone telling them how to run their company and who care anyway?


Really?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on October 28, 2015, 12:13:19 PM
  Has TT ever officially posted on eham, either the original TT or the second incarnation as RF Concepts?  Does Kenwood, Yaesu, or Icom officially participate in eham threads?  

I am not sure about TT but Judging from the personal attitude people seem to have about Molly, I suspect Alpha did come to the forums, but thats just a guess.

As for other companies, YES many if not all of them either post directly or have a surrogate post for them. for example Adam (AB4OJ) comes to eHam and speaks on behalf of Icom.
Tom Rum (W5RUM) was here on behalf of Tokyo hy-power. And MFJ has sent many employees along with lots of other companies.

Another example that happened this week that shows  exactly how RKR should have handled this situation is right here.

http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,105766.0.html

I like how you W9KEY joined in at Post number 4 and added in your "sarcastic hyperbole" which if not for Post number 5 would have been nice red meat for everyone else to run with.

So notice how Post number 5 stopped what would have been a rather lengthy and unnecessary argument right in its tracks.  

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 28, 2015, 12:49:32 PM

Another example that happened this week that shows  exactly how RKR should have handled this situation is right here.

http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,105766.0.html

So notice how Post number 5 stopped what would have been a rather lengthy and unnecessary argument right in its tracks. 


The ARRL is a membership organization with a lot more people working for and with them.  The issue was a cut and dried one, and I was surprised that rumor was not squelched even faster than it was.  Manning a Facebook page is a lot of work and it does not surprise me that a privately owned company in a state of flux is not throwing resources at social media or eham which is somewhat an amateur radio equivalent.  The hams who own RKR may be more old school and not even use Facebook.  They may still be finalizing designs, campus moves or who knows what else.  Silence can signal death and it can signal incubation too.  Many things could delay them wanting to prematurely announce anything at this point.  And this is not exactly a welcoming atmosphere we have created here to bait them into doing so ...

we really don't know and those who do are not saying anything.   the next sentence will probably lead to more posts rather than fewer, but here goes: i propose we all go QRT here until something substantial is announced  :-\
 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 28, 2015, 01:14:00 PM
And life will go on. Hopefully like this thread, which has amazing longevity.

If you are bored with the thread, then move on.  No one is making you read or respond to these threads.

just curious, what led you to the false hypothesis that he was bored or that it is your place to be his thread-navigation elmer?    :)

I said IF...  So, what led you to the false hypothesis that I said he was bored?  IF is not is...  Clearly you have reading comprehension problems.


you said "if you are bored" and then suggested what advice you believed he should follow if your "if" hypothesis was indeed true.
so please revisit your suggestion that i am the one with reading comprehension issues.  no need to reply, unless you want to apologize for (and thus own) your condescending nonsense  ;)

IF is not a hypothesis.  Had I said "since you are bored", I would have been stating a hypothesis.  If I say "IF there are unicorns...", I am not stating that there are unicorns.  

if you said "since you are bored" -- it would have been a conclusion, not an hypothesis  but you said: "if you are board" -- and that suggests a working hypothesis (which you then went on to build on...)

Quote from: SWL2002
Now I did make a hypothesis about your comprehension problems.  Seeing how you responded to my comment, I am sticking to that hypothesis.   :D :D :D

the hypothesis that anyone responding to your comments here has a comprehension problem is a fairly formidable construct -- i have to give you that  ;)

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on October 28, 2015, 01:34:33 PM

Another example that happened this week that shows  exactly how RKR should have handled this situation is right here.

http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,105766.0.html

So notice how Post number 5 stopped what would have been a rather lengthy and unnecessary argument right in its tracks. 


The ARRL is a membership organization with a lot more people working for and with them.  The issue was a cut and dried one, and I was surprised that rumor was not squelched even faster than it was.  Manning a Facebook page is a lot of work and it does not surprise me that a privately owned company in a state of flux is not throwing resources at social media or eham which is somewhat an amateur radio equivalent.  The hams who own RKR may be more old school and not even use Facebook.  They may still be finalizing designs, campus moves or who knows what else.  Silence can signal death and it can signal incubation too.  Many things could delay them wanting to prematurely announce anything at this point.  And this is not exactly a welcoming atmosphere we have created here to bait them into doing so ...

we really don't know and those who do are not saying anything.   the next sentence will probably lead to more posts rather than fewer, but here goes: i propose we all go QRT here until something substantial is announced  :-\
 

I found it very interesting that you were the one stirring the Pot in that thread, one that actually dealt with real Funerals, kind of ironic!  Yet your so upset about anyone saying anything about TenTec and RKR.  Hmmm double standard!

As for being "Old School", no one seems to be more old school in terms of using social media than ARRL.  Have you ever seen one of their YouTube productions?   The fact is that within any company you have numerous employees that are computer savvy and it only takes  one of them to squash a rumor.  Evidently a company that makes state of the art circuit boards has no one available to squash these terrible rumors, only employees that have time to come on forums and say that they are not getting paid!  ::)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 28, 2015, 01:38:18 PM
 
Quote
Manning a Facebook page is a lot of work and it does not surprise me that a privately owned company in a state of flux is not throwing resources at social media or eham which is somewhat an amateur radio equivalent.  The hams who own RKR may be more old school and not even use Facebook. 


Are you for real?  Keeping a Facebook page is hard???  Little old ladies with kitchen businesses have facebook pages, give us a break.


Quote
we really don't know and those who do are not saying anything. 

Yeah except the poor guy who didn't get paid.


Quote
i propose we all go QRT here until something substantial is announced  :-\


And you are?  And we should because?????
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 28, 2015, 01:41:58 PM

As for other companies, YES many if not all of them either post directly or have a surrogate post for them. for example Adam (AB4OJ) comes to eHam and speaks on behalf of Icom.
Tom Rum (W5RUM) was here on behalf of Tokyo hy-power. And MFJ has sent many employees along with lots of other companies.

That's correct, they are called Shills and they are not looked upon favorably.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 28, 2015, 02:11:11 PM
I found it very interesting that you were the one stirring the Pot in that thread, one that actually dealt with real Funerals, kind of ironic!  Yet your so upset about anyone saying anything about TenTec and RKR.  Hmmm double standard!

i did suggest that the amount of snail mailings I get from the ARRL to sell me things leads me to wonder sometimes about their priorities.  I never suggested the ARRL might be dying or that it should not give silent keys respect -- quite the contrary if you read between my lines.  so you will have to dig some more and try and find some real dirt (no pun intended) ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on October 28, 2015, 02:11:19 PM

As for other companies, YES many if not all of them either post directly or have a surrogate post for them. for example Adam (AB4OJ) comes to eHam and speaks on behalf of Icom.
Tom Rum (W5RUM) was here on behalf of Tokyo hy-power. And MFJ has sent many employees along with lots of other companies.

That's correct, they are called Shills and they are not looked upon favorably.

What are you talking about?  Tom Rum worked for Tokyo Hy-Power and Adam is one of Icoms lead beta testers and is given information by Icom months in advance of the rest of us.  Adam is literally their USA ham radio user laison.  None of the company reps I have ever met have come to eHam to sell products, they have come to squash rumors and to provide info on how to get support help.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on October 28, 2015, 02:14:00 PM
I found it very interesting that you were the one stirring the Pot in that thread, one that actually dealt with real Funerals, kind of ironic!  Yet your so upset about anyone saying anything about TenTec and RKR.  Hmmm double standard!

i did suggest that the amount of snail mailings I get from the ARRL to sell me things leads me to wonder sometimes about their priorities.  I never suggested the ARRL might be dying or that it should not give silent keys respect -- quite the contrary if you read between my lines.  so you will have to dig some more and try and find some real dirt (no pun intended) ;)

I think what you said in post 4 is very clear for anyone to read and interpret.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 28, 2015, 04:38:12 PM
Quote from: W9KEY
I never suggested the ARRL might be dying or that it should not give silent keys respect -- quite the contrary if you read between my lines.  so you will have to dig some more and try and find some real dirt (no pun intended) ;)

Quote from: KD8MJR
I think what you said in post 4 is very clear for anyone to read and interpret.

very true  http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,105766.0.html (http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,105766.0.html)

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 28, 2015, 07:52:02 PM
This is a thread about RKR designs/ Ten Tec, and Alpha.  Attempts to derail the thread won't work.[/b]  If you want to discuss the ARRL thread go discuss it there.

The evidence is getting pretty clear with Christmas fast approaching and not a single ad in QST, not even for stuff they supposedly have in stock.  All of the other manufacturers are coming out with newer and higher performance radios so what has Ten Tec done? 

The Eagle is already losing ground to other comparably priced radios.  Also, it has a dirty transmitter along with no way to switch an amplifier built in, you have to buy that as an option.  Man that is pathetic.  If they don't do something pretty soon it may take them years to regain a following like they had and without service that doesn't look good.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 28, 2015, 11:47:09 PM
Man that is pathetic. 

Yep just like this thread has become.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on October 29, 2015, 04:24:51 AM
And life will go on. Hopefully like this thread, which has amazing longevity.

If you are bored with the thread, then move on.  No one is making you read or respond to these threads.

just curious, what led you to the false hypothesis that he was bored or that it is your place to be his thread-navigation elmer?    :)

I said IF...  So, what led you to the false hypothesis that I said he was bored?  IF is not is...  Clearly you have reading comprehension problems.


you said "if you are bored" and then suggested what advice you believed he should follow if your "if" hypothesis was indeed true.
so please revisit your suggestion that i am the one with reading comprehension issues.  no need to reply, unless you want to apologize for (and thus own) your condescending nonsense  ;)

IF is not a hypothesis.  Had I said "since you are bored", I would have been stating a hypothesis.  If I say "IF there are unicorns...", I am not stating that there are unicorns.  

if you said "since you are bored" -- it would have been a conclusion, not an hypothesis  but you said: "if you are board" -- and that suggests a working hypothesis (which you then went on to build on...)


You need a lesson in linguistics:

Conditional statement

I wrote "If you are bored with the thread, then move on" which is a conditional sentence, not a hypothesis.  A conditional sentence contains two clauses, the protasis and the apodosis.  

"If you are bored..." is the protasis and "then move on" is the apodosis.  A conditional sentence or statement is not a hypothesis.

Hypothesis

A hypothesis is in the form:  If XXXX is related to YYYY, then ZZZZ.   A hypothesis contains a dependent variable and an independent variable.  

XXXX is the dependent variable.  YYYY is the independent variable.  ZZZZ is the conclusion if XXXX is related to YYYY.  The independent variable is the one you control and the dependent variable is the one that you observe or measure the results from.

The statement "If you are bored with the thread, then move on" is in not a hypothesis.   It is a conditional statement, since there is no independent variable.  

I hope you learned something, but judging by your posts, I seriously doubt it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 29, 2015, 07:20:15 AM
i concede that elevating your snipe to the level of a hypothesis definitely assigned it more importance than it deserved.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on October 29, 2015, 09:15:02 AM
i concede that elevating your snipe to the level of a hypothesis definitely assigned it more importance than it deserved.

You don't have any valid counter argument so you just spew nastiness and nonsense instead.  Typical W9KEY...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 29, 2015, 08:20:29 PM
Meanwhile RKR Designs LLC and Ten Tec / Alpha remain QRT.  Christmas is right around the corner and not a single ad in QST, not a peep about re-entering the amateur radio market.  Looks like EKY was just plain wrong, they are down for the count.

Even thought he could hijack the thread but it's just not going to work.  We are here to talk about and lament the demise of Ten Tec one of the last great American radio manufacturers.  And lets not forget the once legendary Alpha amplifiers. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 29, 2015, 08:31:51 PM
We are here to talk about and lament the demise of Ten Tec one of the last great American radio manufacturers.  And lets not forget the once legendary Alpha amplifiers. 

well, the thread was started when RKR took over 6 months ago and released this statement:

Quote from: http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/
Press Release
(April 2, 2015) RKR Designs, LLC of Longmont Colorado has announced that they have acquired the assets of Alpha Amplifier and TEN-TEC brands from RF Concepts. RKR plans to expand the product line, while continuing to service their customers that have enjoyed their products over the years.

The principals of RKR Designs are Richard Gall, Ken Long and Rich Danielson (Gall and Danielson of QSC Systems, Longmont, Colorado have been a successful contract manufacturer, for over 20 years). Ken Long, N0QO has over 20 years in the electronics and amateur radio industry. Long will be President and CEO of the new company. QSC has been building Alpha amplifiers for over 5 years. They have also been building boards for TEN-TEC since their purchase by RF Concepts last year. Mr. Long said “QSC has always been a fantastic contract manufacturer, and has the expertise and knowledge that will allow us to bring down costs, while increasing quality and reducing manufacturing times.”

When asked for comment, Michael Seedman, AA6DY said “I can’t think of a more capable group of people to take over the 45 year Alpha Amplifier/TEN-TEC legacy. Ken Long has been involved with the industry for years, and has a great feeling for products and operations. He has the manufacturing and engineering resources available to deliver quality products that our customers demand”. Mr. Seedman went on to say “Alpha and TEN-TEC have always had a warm spot in my heart, and I am thrilled that RKR Designs will be able to continue the operations of the business. I wish them the best”.

Ken, Richard and Rich have been working very close over the past several years and feel that this new relationship will benefit the company and customers moving forward. This closer relationship to the contract manufacturer will allow a more consistent process and delivery of quality products along with significant cost benefits.

RKR Designs LLC is privately held, and terms of the acquisition were not disclosed.

i started this thread wondering what the future holds wrt Ten-Tec, but based on your above post i guess some like you are already in the grieving stage and lamenting the ending of the Ten-Tec that was...  what was your favorite xcvr they ever made and how many TT rigs have you owned?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 29, 2015, 09:00:53 PM
I owned an Omni D and it was a very nice radio.  My favorite was the Omni VI+, I used to operate one that belonged to a friend and nearly got one but I bought a Yaesu FT-1000D instead.  I really like Ten Tec in fact, I still have a 238C that I won't part with, one of the best high power tuners ever made IMO.

It is, unfortunately, all too obvious that RKR has no intentions of building Amateur radio equipment.  Notice I said building.  They may import some Chinese stuff and package it but I don't see Ten Tec coming back in any capacity as the high end radio manufacturer they once were.  It has simply been too long with no word from the company.  If they were to make a public statement I would change my tune but until then I am convinced that they are history.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on October 29, 2015, 09:38:48 PM
I owned an Omni D and it was a very nice radio.  My favorite was the Omni VI+, I used to operate one that belonged to a friend and nearly got one but I bought a Yaesu FT-1000D instead.  I really like Ten Tec in fact, I still have a 238C that I won't part with, one of the best high power tuners ever made IMO.

It is, unfortunately, all too obvious that RKR has no intentions of building Amateur radio equipment.  Notice I said building.  They may import some Chinese stuff and package it but I don't see Ten Tec coming back in any capacity as the high end radio manufacturer they once were.  It has simply been too long with no word from the company.  If they were to make a public statement I would change my tune but until then I am convinced that they are history.

I picked up an Omni D series C (546C) on Craig's list 5 years ago that was in great shape and got to find out what it was like to own the kind of rig I only dreamed about 30 years ago when it came out. http://www.tentecwiki.org/doku.php?id=546 (http://www.tentecwiki.org/doku.php?id=546) Sweet rig! I ended up selling it to help fund the purchase of a Jupiter, but sometimes wish I could have kept it.
   
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N8YX on October 30, 2015, 06:08:59 AM
I owned an Omni D and it was a very nice radio.  My favorite was the Omni VI+, I used to operate one that belonged to a friend and nearly got one but I bought a Yaesu FT-1000D instead.  I really like Ten Tec in fact, I still have a 238C that I won't part with, one of the best high power tuners ever made IMO.

It is, unfortunately, all too obvious that RKR has no intentions of building Amateur radio equipment.  Notice I said building.  They may import some Chinese stuff and package it but I don't see Ten Tec coming back in any capacity as the high end radio manufacturer they once were.  It has simply been too long with no word from the company.  If they were to make a public statement I would change my tune but until then I am convinced that they are history.

I picked up an Omni D series C (546C) on Craig's list 5 years ago that was in great shape and got to find out what it was like to own the kind of rig I only dreamed about 30 years ago when it came out. http://www.tentecwiki.org/doku.php?id=546 (http://www.tentecwiki.org/doku.php?id=546) Sweet rig! I ended up selling it to help fund the purchase of a Jupiter, but sometimes wish I could have kept it.
   
I did similar (though with Drake's 7 line, and not via CL) a while ago. Then I began to gather T-T gear - always wanted a Paragon II, and got the opportunity to snag one at Dayton a few years back. An Omni VI-Opt3 followed immediately thereafter. Then another Paragon II, an Omni V and lately a couple of Corsair IIs. Along with the various peripherals.

Although I enjoy my other equipment, the Ten Tec gear is what's used most at my shack. Never owned an early Omni but have used them frequently over the years. Would have loved to own a new Orion II - or a III.

If support for T-T's legacy products does in fact dwindle away I suspect a cottage industry of parts suppliers will spring up to fill the void, much as has been done for Drake's various offerings. The stuff deserves a better fate than ending up in a landfill or on a recycle pile due to unavailable components.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 30, 2015, 07:57:49 AM
I would bet money on someone filling the void.  I just bought a filter cap (can) for my T4XB from an Ebay store that sells a lot of Drake parts.  I had the Omni D series B in 1979 and it was a really good rig, had the fastest break in I ever saw on CW even now.  The only nit was the PTO drifted a bit, there were some mods to fix it but I was lazy and wanted something else so I sold it and got an IC-740 which I still have.  It is a far better radio than people gave them credit for.

I really do wish that the folks at RKR would man up and say they are either in or out, stringing people along just isn't cool for a company that has had such a loyal following for so many years.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N3QE on October 30, 2015, 09:47:43 AM
i started this thread wondering what the future holds wrt Ten-Tec, but based on your above post i guess some like you are already in the grieving stage and lamenting the ending of the Ten-Tec that was...  what was your favorite xcvr they ever made and how many TT rigs have you owned?

My favorite "old timey" Ten-Tec rig is the Ten-Tec Triton. I still have mine.

I currently own and extensively use two Eagles. I got one in the summer sale after the acquisition. The Eagle is very similar in size/weight to the Triton.

I also get to frequently use Orions (I's and II's) as a guest op.

I prefer the Eagles over the Orions. I also prefer the Eagles over K3's and FT-DX5000's (which I also get to frequently use as a guest op.)

Of course you might think, after I have 120,000 QSO's on the Eagle, I might be getting used to it :-)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0TKX on October 31, 2015, 06:28:05 PM
Wow.

Well, I am a Ten Tec Fan-Boi, but my newest is a Pegasus. In many ways my favorites are the little transverters. Omni D's and Corsairs are great, for their time. I have some and they are amazing, for their time, and still very fun to play with. Kenwood, Yaesu, and Icom have limited or no support for certain rigs because it's over and done. But enterprising scroungers and wizards keep 'em alive, and that's pretty cool. DDS anyone?

Speculation is just that. The newer TT rigs depended on processors and DSP chips that have been discontinued. So there is a finite life to products in a smallish market. Again, still, always. Especially now, development cycles are short, and sometimes, brutal. No wonder it might take them a while, and it's OK if they do. Just because there are not Christmas ads in QST is kind of meaningless. I wouldn't count them out, yet.

Elecraft and Flex make excellent products. I'm a very happy Flex 3000 owner... a product that is also end of life.

To quote Kurt Vonnegut's time travelers... And so it goes. Ting-a-ling.  ::)

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 31, 2015, 07:50:11 PM

 I wouldn't count them out, yet.


I would, they're are done.  You can get chips in 24 hrs. and in large quantities.  Custom arrays can be had in two weeks.  Nope, they bought the same farm as Heath, Hallicrafters, Drake, Swan (Cubic), SBE, and the list goes on but the farm continues,,,,,,,and so it goes, ting a ling.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 01, 2015, 04:19:41 AM

 I wouldn't count them out, yet.


I would, they're are done.  You can get chips in 24 hrs. and in large quantities.  Custom arrays can be had in two weeks.  Nope, they bought the same farm as Heath, Hallicrafters, Drake, Swan (Cubic), SBE, and the list goes on but the farm continues,,,,,,,and so it goes, ting a ling.

There is no way you can get a 1000 obsolete chips made and delivered in 24 hours. Or any quantity for that matter. And the cost can be very prohibitive for production purposes depending on complexity. I have been down that road. It is not as easy and/or cost effective as you make it seem.

And then there is the time required to qualify these custom parts to make sure they are correct in every aspect to prevent bugs either in production or down the road once delivered to the customer. Again very time consuming and not as simple as just inserting the replacement and shipping it. Unless you like recalling your product and totally pissing off your customers who think they are getting the same quality as the original qualified parts in their product. Defects come at a huge price and really needs to be avoided. And that takes time.

Case on point...The line I directly work for had a simple IGBT that went obsolete. We contracted a direct replacement for it. We put it in a prototype unit for qualifying. It failed in testing. There are half a million dollars of useless parts on the floor and 2 months shut down while the "direct replacement" was analysed and the problem found. And the shutdown was caused by running out of original "working" parts we thought we had a replacement for. Total time for direct replacement parts, that actually worked, from ordering them to production using them...9 months. Not even close to 2 weeks or 24 hours as you think. And semiconductor fabrication wise, it was a simple part.

BTW that part is rated at 8000 volts @ 200 amps. Not something you can just throw any old part at.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 01, 2015, 07:11:11 AM

 I wouldn't count them out, yet.


I would, they're are done.  You can get chips in 24 hrs. and in large quantities.  Custom arrays can be had in two weeks.  Nope, they bought the same farm as Heath, Hallicrafters, Drake, Swan (Cubic), SBE, and the list goes on but the farm continues,,,,,,,and so it goes, ting a ling.

There is no way you can get a 1000 obsolete chips made and delivered in 24 hours. Or any quantity for that matter. And the cost can be very prohibitive for production purposes depending on complexity. I have been down that road. It is not as easy and/or cost effective as you make it seem.

And then there is the time required to qualify these custom parts to make sure they are correct in every aspect to prevent bugs either in production or down the road once delivered to the customer. Again very time consuming and not as simple as just inserting the replacement and shipping it. Unless you like recalling your product and totally pissing off your customers who think they are getting the same quality as the original qualified parts in their product. Defects come at a huge price and really needs to be avoided. And that takes time.

Case on point...The line I directly work for had a simple IGBT that went obsolete. We contracted a direct replacement for it. We put it in a prototype unit for qualifying. It failed in testing. There are half a million dollars of useless parts on the floor and 2 months shut down while the "direct replacement" was analysed and the problem found. And the shutdown was caused by running out of original "working" parts we thought we had a replacement for. Total time for direct replacement parts, that actually worked, from ordering them to production using them...9 months. Not even close to 2 weeks or 24 hours as you think. And semiconductor fabrication wise, it was a simple part.

BTW that part is rated at 8000 volts @ 200 amps. Not something you can just throw any old part at.

Who said anything about obsolete parts?  I'm talking about current state of the art.  Computer design systems can help a small team of engineers design a top notch amateur radio in just a couple of weeks.  The days of breadboarding are long into the history books and computer simulation is the state of the art.  Your experience is not relevant since we are talking about new parts, not replacement parts.  Why would Ten Tec want replacement parts for old stuff?  Their current Eagle is behind the curve on specs and the Omni VII is a dinosaur.

I am however, glad to know that you were able to solve your knotty problem, that's great and I'm sure the good folks at Ten Tec can learn from your experience.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AC7CW on November 01, 2015, 10:16:35 AM
"I would, they're are done.  You can get chips in 24 hrs. and in large quantities.  Custom arrays can be had in two weeks.  Nope, they bought the same farm as Heath, Hallicrafters, Drake, Swan (Cubic), SBE, and the list goes on but the farm continues,,,,,,,and so it goes, ting a ling."

Off the shelf parts can be gotten but not all older ones. Custom programmable gate arrays can be produced if the netlist can be found and the part is still available but getting a few wafers of custom chips is going to cost a fortune and maybe won't happen fast. If Ten Tec used custom parts then it's even less likely that something is repairable.

Is this even the first time that Ten Tec is nearly defunct? I think they were about out of business just before they came out with the Scout? They sold a zillion of those...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 01, 2015, 10:40:58 AM
"I would, they're are done.  You can get chips in 24 hrs. and in large quantities.  Custom arrays can be had in two weeks.  Nope, they bought the same farm as Heath, Hallicrafters, Drake, Swan (Cubic), SBE, and the list goes on but the farm continues,,,,,,,and so it goes, ting a ling."

Off the shelf parts can be gotten but not all older ones. Custom programmable gate arrays can be produced if the netlist can be found and the part is still available but getting a few wafers of custom chips is going to cost a fortune and maybe won't happen fast. If Ten Tec used custom parts then it's even less likely that something is repairable.

Is this even the first time that Ten Tec is nearly defunct? I think they were about out of business just before they came out with the Scout? They sold a zillion of those...

Not talking about repair, I'm talking about brand new designs you know, like other radio manufacturers do when their current line becomes outdated.  I worked fo Harris Corp. many years ago and Harris Semiconductor could turn out custom chips in less than a month and that was in the 80's.  New (current production) state of the art devices are available right off the shelf and hundreds of them can be programmed in house in a day.  So I continue to wonder why they have not announced any new products?  They say they will have parts for the Omni VII after the first of the year but the Omni VII is not even up to par with newer radios anymore. 

I don't know about repairing older rigs but I'm sure that parts can be found if you look around because they don't seem to have any at Ten Tec.  So they have not updated their facebook page in over a year and they have not put out any information other than to announce the buyout by RKR Design LLC. It looks like they are dead in the water but who knows, maybe they will import Chinese stuff.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 01, 2015, 12:02:11 PM

 I wouldn't count them out, yet.


I would, they're are done.  You can get chips in 24 hrs. and in large quantities.  Custom arrays can be had in two weeks.  Nope, they bought the same farm as Heath, Hallicrafters, Drake, Swan (Cubic), SBE, and the list goes on but the farm continues,,,,,,,and so it goes, ting a ling.

There is no way you can get a 1000 obsolete chips made and delivered in 24 hours. Or any quantity for that matter. And the cost can be very prohibitive for production purposes depending on complexity. I have been down that road. It is not as easy and/or cost effective as you make it seem.

And then there is the time required to qualify these custom parts to make sure they are correct in every aspect to prevent bugs either in production or down the road once delivered to the customer. Again very time consuming and not as simple as just inserting the replacement and shipping it. Unless you like recalling your product and totally pissing off your customers who think they are getting the same quality as the original qualified parts in their product. Defects come at a huge price and really needs to be avoided. And that takes time.

Case on point...The line I directly work for had a simple IGBT that went obsolete. We contracted a direct replacement for it. We put it in a prototype unit for qualifying. It failed in testing. There are half a million dollars of useless parts on the floor and 2 months shut down while the "direct replacement" was analysed and the problem found. And the shutdown was caused by running out of original "working" parts we thought we had a replacement for. Total time for direct replacement parts, that actually worked, from ordering them to production using them...9 months. Not even close to 2 weeks or 24 hours as you think. And semiconductor fabrication wise, it was a simple part.

BTW that part is rated at 8000 volts @ 200 amps. Not something you can just throw any old part at.

Who said anything about obsolete parts?  I'm talking about current state of the art.  Computer design systems can help a small team of engineers design a top notch amateur radio in just a couple of weeks.  The days of breadboarding are long into the history books and computer simulation is the state of the art.  Your experience is not relevant since we are talking about new parts, not replacement parts.  Why would Ten Tec want replacement parts for old stuff?  Their current Eagle is behind the curve on specs and the Omni VII is a dinosaur.

I am however, glad to know that you were able to solve your knotty problem, that's great and I'm sure the good folks at Ten Tec can learn from your experience.

I'm sure RKR has had plenty of similar experiences. I doubt they need advice. My example is to help other people understand how your post was not realistic view.

And isn't the big complaint from most here they can't get current production rigs? And didn't they say they need to get parts to build them?

This whole thread was an argument about getting their current stuff out. Now if it is all obsolete as you say, why would they even start up production again?

And your probably right. If RKR had the resources of Harris they could turn out products much quicker. And to have your own semiconductor fab house also enhances that possibility. I highly doubt RKR has that capability. So they are dependent on what's available. And hampered by what is not.

I also don't believe that Harris takes products to market without prototyping and testing. There are a myriad of problems that simulations can not check. Plus the fact that any components used need to be qualified for use, durability, and physical reaction with other parts in and around each part. If these things are not done, Harris would not have the quality that they have.

So I find your time estimates even for Harris to be far too optimistic. Somewhere between the design lab and production a lot of things need to happen. And they don't happen in a few days.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 01, 2015, 04:46:01 PM
Seems to me that people who claim to know so much about business, electronic product development, etc., would then be incredibly successful in business. And if they were successful in business, they would have enough savings to be able to purchase a high-end TenTec radio.

My experience is that people who boast about what they know, claim everyone else is wrong, then have so little money, usually don't really know all that much. If they did, they would have put that knowledge to use successfully to have a great career and thus earned a lot of money through their brilliance.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 01, 2015, 05:48:08 PM
Seems to me that people who claim to know so much about business, electronic product development, etc., would then be incredibly successful in business. And if they were successful in business, they would have enough savings to be able to purchase a high-end TenTec radio.

My experience is that people who boast about what they know, claim everyone else is wrong, then have so little money, usually don't really know all that much. If they did, they would have put that knowledge to use successfully to have a great career and thus earned a lot of money through their brilliance.



Oh I think I did pretty well but that has nothing to do with the discussion.  I designed radios at Harris in the 1970"s and 80's, I know how long it took then and we were building stuff for the military which was miles ahead of amateur radio.  If Ten Tec was going to introduce a new high end radio they would have done it by now.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 01, 2015, 08:27:25 PM
Seems to me that people who claim to know so much about business, electronic product development, etc., would then be incredibly successful in business. And if they were successful in business, they would have enough savings to be able to purchase a high-end TenTec radio.

My experience is that people who boast about what they know, claim everyone else is wrong, then have so little money, usually don't really know all that much. If they did, they would have put that knowledge to use successfully to have a great career and thus earned a lot of money through their brilliance.



LOL I'm doing just fine too. My family has a nice home. They are well fed and clothed. Not bad for a salaried position. And a persons wealth only measured by money does not represent many fine families. 

But you are right, I hold no patents to collect on for the rest of my life. But on the other hand, I am happy in my current position. My efforts bring a product to market. I have gained a huge amount of knowledge and experience with each job I have done. But that seems to be a problem for some. Oh well. It keeps the pay checks coming. It also helps me work on improving both a product and my life. But for some, I fail because I have not somehow become rich doing my job that I have chosen to do and the compensation that it gives. And that in itself shows a lack of knowledge on how most people live and work. Or is it that some are so unsuccessful they need to run down those that are happy with what they have?

Just because I don't meet your idea of success NUT does not change the fact that I am happy with my life, happy with my job, happy with my family, and happy with what I have. I have no thoughts that I could build a company like the one I work for. Some just simply need to do their jobs within a successful company. Not every employee can be CEO. You seem to consider that a failure. I do not. And that's the big difference between you and me.  But I doubt you can understand that.

Its not my fault that people state incredible things that have little to do with real world production methods and practices. But at the same time, most hams have no such experience and can be misled by poor information. If you call it boasting to help educate people based on my experience, then so be it. Again...oh well.

DPO...why do you feel a private company needs to adhere to your schedule? Can't they be allowed to run their business their way? Is your idea the only way to do things? Your the only one that knows?

That's the difference between you and me. I show examples of why it may be taking them time to ramp up. I have absolutely no idea if I am accurate. And I don't claim that either. But for every naysayer rumor there can be a perfectly legitimate reason why it is false. I try to show some of the reasons why based on current real world operations. But again, that does not make me right. Just hopeful and giving the benefit of the doubt based on what I do know. And that beats the hell out of writing off the company because it does not fit your, or anyone else's idea of how RKR should run their business.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2GWK on November 01, 2015, 10:40:30 PM

 I wouldn't count them out, yet.


I would, they're are done.  You can get chips in 24 hrs. and in large quantities.  Custom arrays can be had in two weeks.  Nope, they bought the same farm as Heath, Hallicrafters, Drake, Swan (Cubic), SBE, and the list goes on but the farm continues,,,,,,,and so it goes, ting a ling.

There is no way you can get a 1000 obsolete chips made and delivered in 24 hours. Or any quantity for that matter. And the cost can be very prohibitive for production purposes depending on complexity. I have been down that road. It is not as easy and/or cost effective as you make it seem.

And then there is the time required to qualify these custom parts to make sure they are correct in every aspect to prevent bugs either in production or down the road once delivered to the customer. Again very time consuming and not as simple as just inserting the replacement and shipping it. Unless you like recalling your product and totally pissing off your customers who think they are getting the same quality as the original qualified parts in their product. Defects come at a huge price and really needs to be avoided. And that takes time.

Case on point...The line I directly work for had a simple IGBT that went obsolete. We contracted a direct replacement for it. We put it in a prototype unit for qualifying. It failed in testing. There are half a million dollars of useless parts on the floor and 2 months shut down while the "direct replacement" was analysed and the problem found. And the shutdown was caused by running out of original "working" parts we thought we had a replacement for. Total time for direct replacement parts, that actually worked, from ordering them to production using them...9 months. Not even close to 2 weeks or 24 hours as you think. And semiconductor fabrication wise, it was a simple part.

BTW that part is rated at 8000 volts @ 200 amps. Not something you can just throw any old part at.

Who said anything about obsolete parts?  I'm talking about current state of the art.  Computer design systems can help a small team of engineers design a top notch amateur radio in just a couple of weeks.  The days of breadboarding are long into the history books and computer simulation is the state of the art.  Your experience is not relevant since we are talking about new parts, not replacement parts.  Why would Ten Tec want replacement parts for old stuff?  Their current Eagle is behind the curve on specs and the Omni VII is a dinosaur.

I am however, glad to know that you were able to solve your knotty problem, that's great and I'm sure the good folks at Ten Tec can learn from your experience.

Hardware is the easy part. Firmware takes much, much longer.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 02, 2015, 07:23:08 AM
Seems to me that people who claim to know so much about business, electronic product development, etc., would then be incredibly successful in business. And if they were successful in business, they would have enough savings to be able to purchase a high-end TenTec radio.

My experience is that people who boast about what they know, claim everyone else is wrong, then have so little money, usually don't really know all that much. If they did, they would have put that knowledge to use successfully to have a great career and thus earned a lot of money through their brilliance.



LOL I'm doing just fine too. My family has a nice home. They are well fed and clothed. Not bad for a salaried position. And a persons wealth only measured by money does not represent many fine families.  

But you are right, I hold no patents to collect on for the rest of my life. But on the other hand, I am happy in my current position. My efforts bring a product to market. I have gained a huge amount of knowledge and experience with each job I have done. But that seems to be a problem for some. Oh well. It keeps the pay checks coming. It also helps me work on improving both a product and my life. But for some, I fail because I have not somehow become rich doing my job that I have chosen to do and the compensation that it gives. And that in itself shows a lack of knowledge on how most people live and work. Or is it that some are so unsuccessful they need to run down those that are happy with what they have?

Just because I don't meet your idea of success NUT does not change the fact that I am happy with my life, happy with my job, happy with my family, and happy with what I have. I have no thoughts that I could build a company like the one I work for. Some just simply need to do their jobs within a successful company. Not every employee can be CEO. You seem to consider that a failure. I do not. And that's the big difference between you and me.  But I doubt you can understand that.

Its not my fault that people state incredible things that have little to do with real world production methods and practices. But at the same time, most hams have no such experience and can be misled by poor information. If you call it boasting to help educate people based on my experience, then so be it. Again...oh well.

DPO...why do you feel a private company needs to adhere to your schedule? Can't they be allowed to run their business their way? Is your idea the only way to do things? Your the only one that knows?

That's the difference between you and me. I show examples of why it may be taking them time to ramp up. I have absolutely no idea if I am accurate. And I don't claim that either. But for every naysayer rumor there can be a perfectly legitimate reason why it is false. I try to show some of the reasons why based on current real world operations. But again, that does not make me right. Just hopeful and giving the benefit of the doubt based on what I do know. And that beats the hell out of writing off the company because it does not fit your, or anyone else's idea of how RKR should run their business.

I simply point out the obvious while you make flimsy excuses for them.  Excuse me for saying so but you sound like a shill.  Are they paying you or compensating you in some way?  As for RKR having experience with this sort of thing, they filed on March 24 2015 so it doesn't sound like they have a long corporate history.  

as far as what I know, I did design radios for Harris way back when and I know things have changed a lot.  from the 1990's until I retired in 2008 I was the Airborne and Special Operations Evaluator and AST Chairman for the US Army.  I oversaw the testing and evaluation of everything that SF soldiers would use in combat.  Besides weapons, parachutes, and body armor I also evaluated specialized communications systems so I met regularly with manufacturers to discuss progress, problems, upgrades, etc.  Just so you know it wasn't all glamor, I also evaluated mundane stuff like socks and underwear, MRE's, and even boots.

I do know that relatively complex radios can be designed in a few months, of course many of these were based on legacy designs the way most amateur radios are done.  There were a few radios that took much longer to design but they were like comparing a heathkit to the space shuttle.  Most of the radios systems are SDR these days, military radios have been for a long time, so the primary operating characteristics are all done in software.  and sure they bend metal for a test bed but that only takes a couple of weeks and the RF assemblies and SDR interfaces are tested.  Please remember that Mil Spec is much more stringent than any commercial radio requirements.  Just look at the Transmit IMD of the Eagle, no military radio would ever make it out the door with such a non linear transmitter, and while military rigs are all digital now they still have to have a clean transmitter to avoid high bit error rates.  

So I guess the fact that they have no facebook page, the old RF Concepts page is over a year old, the fact that they had an everything must go fire sale, and they barely service anything except the latest equipment (perhaps) is not enough to make you shake your head in wonder?  You are a very stalwart fellow, I'm certain that you are just swimming in loot since you brought it up I can only guess you want everyone to know how well off you are.  That tells me a lot without saying a word.

So it looks for all the world like Ten Tec aint coming back this time but if you want to believe by all means please do.  I hope they compensate you well.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 02, 2015, 08:28:07 AM
LOL Been accused of that before. The simple answer is I wish they would. But I don't believe in getting compensated for being a fan and hoping they do well. Also I don't expect to be compensated to push back on stupidity.

But you can believe what you want. Your knowledge from the 70s and 80s makes you an expert in 2015. Never mind that things change over time. You must simply be the best expert in radio designs and production in the world. And in this case, I agree with NUT. Where is your top notch brand of equipment since your the worlds foremost expert?

Fortunately I make no such claim. I only push back with what is real and current in electronics production knowledge based on the methods used by a global company that produces thousands of products in many factories in many countries. And let me emphasize the fact it is their methods and not my own or by my invention. They have been in business far longer then I have been alive. Their methodology seems to be working.

And now what is wrong with a company merging into their business other businesses and then changing their corporate identity? News flash...it happens all the time. But again you seem to be the expert of corporate management and feel this is a big negative. Why?

Good luck with your company and line of equipment. I bet its the worlds best. Funny there is no facebook, qst advertising, or anything anywhere to show your line to the public. So your company must be failing before it even starts. But how can that be? You know everything about the business, and everyone else is wrong.

At least I have a job that produces a product that is selling. What are you doing Mr. Expert?

I really don't expect answers to the questions above. My sides hurt from laughing so hard at your responses. But I know you will...your the expert! LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on November 02, 2015, 09:28:18 AM
Back in the 70's and 80's you were a valuable human resource.  Now you are a contractual number on a spread sheet.  And don't forget to reapply for your job 3 months before the end of your fiscal year. 

Today the news said that Caterpillar is shedding 10,000 workers.  I can remember not that long ago that the Joliet, IL. plant had almost that many.

Perhaps Elecraft is picking up some of Ten Tec's sales.  Their K3 works for me as well as the O2 did and after this much time the customer base surely went elsewhere.
Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N8YX on November 02, 2015, 09:40:48 AM
Perhaps Elecraft is picking up some of Ten Tec's sales.  Their K3 works for me as well as the O2 did and after this much time the customer base surely went elsewhere.
If I want a new HF rig - in kit form or otherwise - Elecraft, DZKit and Flex are firmly in the running. They'll also (for now) solidly support everything they sell, which counts for a lot.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on November 02, 2015, 09:56:52 AM
Like Energizer Bunny this thread keeps going and going. Many want to believe that TenTec is coming back and cannot see writing on the wall. When you buy a company you do not take its products and development off line unless you plan to eventually liquidate its assets. You snooze you loose in this industry,
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 02, 2015, 10:00:24 AM
LOL Been accused of that before. The simple answer is I wish they would. But I don't believe in getting compensated for being a fan and hoping they do well. Also I don't expect to be compensated to push back on stupidity.

But you can believe what you want. Your knowledge from the 70s and 80s makes you an expert in 2015. Never mind that things change over time. You must simply be the best expert in radio designs and production in the world. And in this case, I agree with NUT. Where is your top notch brand of equipment since your the worlds foremost expert?

Fortunately I make no such claim. I only push back with what is real and current in electronics production knowledge based on the methods used by a global company that produces thousands of products in many factories in many countries. And let me emphasize the fact it is their methods and not my own or by my invention. They have been in business far longer then I have been alive. Their methodology seems to be working.

And now what is wrong with a company merging into their business other businesses and then changing their corporate identity? News flash...it happens all the time. But again you seem to be the expert of corporate management and feel this is a big negative. Why?

Good luck with your company and line of equipment. I bet its the worlds best. Funny there is no facebook, qst advertising, or anything anywhere to show your line to the public. So your company must be failing before it even starts. But how can that be? You know everything about the business, and everyone else is wrong.

At least I have a job that produces a product that is selling. What are you doing Mr. Expert?

I really don't expect answers to the questions above. My sides hurt from laughing so hard at your responses. But I know you will...your the expert! LOL

I'm sorry you got your feelings hurt and felt that you had to resort to personal attacks.  Making things up like " since your the worlds foremost expert" make you look childish and don't help your argument.  

Anyway you have my permission to keep your head firmly planted in the sand as Ten Tec swirls the drain of history.  Another American radio manufacturer has to give it up.  I don't like it either but I have seen it too many times over the years to ignore.  

Like I said before they might come out with some rebranded Chinese stuff but they no longer have the metalworking and fabrication capability to make nice enclosures that Ten Tec used to have in house.  I'm not sure if it is profitable to farm that out.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 02, 2015, 10:16:39 AM
DPO, I wouldn't be laughing at you if my feelings were hurt. Just the opposite, I enjoy seeing how far you will carry this. So I injected some sarcasm. Funny how you took the bait! LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on November 02, 2015, 10:39:17 AM
Perhaps Elecraft is picking up some of Ten Tec's sales.  Their K3 works for me as well as the O2 did and after this much time the customer base surely went elsewhere.
If I want a new HF rig - in kit form or otherwise - Elecraft, DZKit and Flex are firmly in the running. They'll also (for now) solidly support everything they sell, which counts for a lot.

DZKit is a very interesting option.  What bothers me is that is a one man show.  And, the design is becoming dated with each passing day.  There are few options: no matching band-scope, amplifier, or other major peripherals. What percentage of hams own a DZ product, compared to any other HF radio manufacturer?  Why would a ham choose DZ, over Elecraft (just out of curiosity.... I think both companies are great, but I have no need for either's offerings...)

I'm sure DZ is a good radio, but I am also very happy with my Omni VI rigs.  Yeah, they are OLD, but they still hold their own against some of the newest high end rigs. All I know is that my Paragon and Omni VI rigs work what I can hear, and they work well.  Sure, you can buy the latest and greatest for several grand, and end up with a rig that is only a few dB under spec (according to Sherwood Engineering's test data results) for the latest and greatest radios being offered.  And, the numbers don't reflect the ergonomics of the design.  Even my Paragon II does everything I need when chasing DX.  Once you reach a certain level for IMD and Blocking, the final determinations as to suitability are related to computer control and/or ease of use (panel layout, features, etc.)

A few years ago everyone was proclaiming that Kenwood was going out of the ham business, yet they are still with us.

I suspect RKR will continue with a much more leaner product line for both Alpha and Ten Tec products.  Whether they can ever offer radios that match the Orion series remains to be seen.  But, they might be able to survive with a much more modest line up. There is a lot of competition in the amplifier market.  I am surprised we have the options that exist.

I can keep my rigs running for many more years, and have enough backups to not be worried about the factory shutting down. Regarding parts, if you don't believe the tripe about chips not becoming obsolete, you can make a fortune supplying programmed uP chips for FT-736R and many other radios (the Kenwood 850 synthyesizer IC for example).  And, I personally know several hams who own TS-850 doorstops. 

I don't see many hams rushing to provide replacements parts for these markets?????? So you can buy a blank chip; what good is it?  I have no doubt that many of the devices used in the Orion I and II are no longer being being offered OEM.

Harris never produced or sold equipment directly to the ham market. Collins Radio was an exception for many years.  But, Collins is long gone from the ham market.  Was Harris gear designed to run split operation, or QSK, or even designed for frequency agility or computer control?  Comparing Harris to Ten Tec is asinine at best.  Two widely divergent markets with different goals and requirements. And the government has deeper pockets than most hams.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AC7CW on November 02, 2015, 11:48:51 AM
I'd say that If TT comes out with a product competitive with Flex's best then fine, I'm interested...If we never hear from them again that's also fine
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N8YX on November 02, 2015, 12:04:12 PM
DZKit is a very interesting option.  What bothers me is that is a one man show.  And, the design is becoming dated with each passing day.
My Drake 7-line gear is "dated" yet still manages to pull things from the aether quite well. There are only one or two specialized discrete components in the entire equipment series; everything else is COTS. To the point, I would have no issues with one of 'DZ's setups were I in the market for a new HF rig.

Quote
There are few options: no matching band-scope, amplifier, or other major peripherals.
Ten-Tec's offerings got a little thin in that department towards the end. They've never offered a band scope for their gear. Amplifiers, PSUs, antenna tuners are about it.

Quote
What percentage of hams own a DZ product, compared to any other HF radio manufacturer?  Why would a ham choose DZ, over Elecraft (just out of curiosity.... I think both companies are great, but I have no need for either's offerings...)
Why would a ham of the 1980s choose a Signal One or similar limited-run rig over anything else on the market? Choices...are good.

Quote
I'm sure DZ is a good radio, but I am also very happy with my Omni VI rigs.  Yeah, they are OLD, but they still hold their own against some of the newest high end rigs. All I know is that my Paragon and Omni VI rigs work what I can hear, and they work well.  Sure, you can buy the latest and greatest for several grand, and end up with a rig that is only a few dB under spec (according to Sherwood Engineering's test data results) for the latest and greatest radios being offered.  And, the numbers don't reflect the ergonomics of the design.  Even my Paragon II does everything I need when chasing DX.  Once you reach a certain level for IMD and Blocking, the final determinations as to suitability are related to computer control and/or ease of use (panel layout, features, etc.)
And now we circle back to the meat and potatoes of the thread. Re: the bolded...my results and sentiments mirror yours. And my main gripe with the new entity is the apparent shift away from providing support of "legacy" products. Obsolete semiconductors I can understand...but...simply slamming the door on the production and warehousing of ALL service spares is somewhat disheartening.

Quote
I suspect RKR will continue with a much more leaner product line for both Alpha and Ten Tec products.  Whether they can ever offer radios that match the Orion series remains to be seen.  But, they might be able to survive with a much more modest line up. There is a lot of competition in the amplifier market.  I am surprised we have the options that exist.
I suspect that if RKR cannot or will not support anything older than their currently in-production equipment, I simply won't be buying anything from them.

Quote
I can keep my rigs running for many more years, and have enough backups to not be worried about the factory shutting down.
Likewise, and I'm acquiring more as I go.

Quote
Harris never produced or sold equipment directly to the ham market. Collins Radio was an exception for many years.  But, Collins is long gone from the ham market.  Was Harris gear designed to run split operation, or QSK, or even designed for frequency agility or computer control?  Comparing Harris to Ten Tec is asinine at best.  Two widely divergent markets with different goals and requirements. And the government has deeper pockets than most hams.
Give me an RF-590A + RF-1310A +RF-110A and we'll call it a day. If I want PC control or QSK I'll turn my Ten-Tecs on.  ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 02, 2015, 01:29:04 PM
DPO, I wouldn't be laughing at you if my feelings were hurt. Just the opposite, I enjoy seeing how far you will carry this. So I injected some sarcasm. Funny how you took the bait! LOL

Whatever, for the sake of keeping you happy we will pretend you are a genuine Old Timer (let the vanity call slide), I know your looking for legitimacy.  You better rev up those laugh muscles though because it looks like I have a lot of company.

Someday you can tell everyone how you saw Ten Tec drop out of the business because in this business silence is akin to so long. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB2WIK on November 02, 2015, 02:13:31 PM

 I wouldn't count them out, yet.


I would, they're are done.  You can get chips in 24 hrs. and in large quantities.  Custom arrays can be had in two weeks.  Nope, they bought the same farm as Heath, Hallicrafters, Drake, Swan (Cubic), SBE, and the list goes on but the farm continues,,,,,,,and so it goes, ting a ling.

There is no way you can get a 1000 obsolete chips made and delivered in 24 hours. Or any quantity for that matter. And the cost can be very prohibitive for production purposes depending on complexity. I have been down that road. It is not as easy and/or cost effective as you make it seem.

What chips, specifically?

Every manufacturer I've ever dealt with issues an EOL statement 3 years before they discontinue production, and then reminders at 2 years and 1 year, usually with replacement recommendations and often applications engineering assistance to help the user select a suitable replacement which may require a pinout change or different programming.  But I've never run across any "chip" manufacturer who just stops and that's that.

Since we make a lot of stuff for the military which was actually designed back in the 1980s and uses 100% obsolete technology for 2015, we have to assure a constant supply source of 386-type devices and lots of stuff that was technically discontinued 20 years ago.  Hasn't been a problem, we have distributors who hold them for us forever and started doing that when the parts were being manufactured.  Because they're now so old, we have to X-ray them and test them to assure they're really the correct parts and haven't suffered damage after prolonged storage -- but we can get them anytime we want.

Quote

And then there is the time required to qualify these custom parts to make sure they are correct in every aspect to prevent bugs either in production or down the road once delivered to the customer. Again very time consuming and not as simple as just inserting the replacement and shipping it. Unless you like recalling your product and totally pissing off your customers who think they are getting the same quality as the original qualified parts in their product. Defects come at a huge price and really needs to be avoided. And that takes time.

Case on point...The line I directly work for had a simple IGBT that went obsolete. We contracted a direct replacement for it. We put it in a prototype unit for qualifying. It failed in testing. There are half a million dollars of useless parts on the floor and 2 months shut down while the "direct replacement" was analysed and the problem found. And the shutdown was caused by running out of original "working" parts we thought we had a replacement for. Total time for direct replacement parts, that actually worked, from ordering them to production using them...9 months. Not even close to 2 weeks or 24 hours as you think. And semiconductor fabrication wise, it was a simple part.

BTW that part is rated at 8000 volts @ 200 amps. Not something you can just throw any old part at.

What's the part number of the IGBT?  It would have to be a module or array of devices for that kind of rating, but hundreds of shops produce custom power hybrids to spec and I've had them turned in 4 weeks and less (with expedite fees).
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 02, 2015, 03:40:46 PM
DPO, I wouldn't be laughing at you if my feelings were hurt. Just the opposite, I enjoy seeing how far you will carry this. So I injected some sarcasm. Funny how you took the bait! LOL

Whatever, for the sake of keeping you happy we will pretend you are a genuine Old Timer (let the vanity call slide), I know your looking for legitimacy.  You better rev up those laugh muscles though because it looks like I have a lot of company.

Someday you can tell everyone how you saw Ten Tec drop out of the business because in this business silence is akin to so long. 

LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 02, 2015, 04:17:50 PM
What chips, specifically?

What's the part number of the IGBT?  It would have to be a module or array of devices for that kind of rating, but hundreds of shops produce custom power hybrids to spec and I've had them turned in 4 weeks and less (with expedite fees).

I was not referring to any specific device since the original post did not either. However there are plenty of obsolete parts scattered throughout ham radio products. And reproducing them, especially those that have specific firmware to be programmed with which may or may not be available, is going to take time to reproduce. I don't deal with the military market, so I can't speak to specifics of that market. And not all EOL statements get sent down to the consumer level to know that their equipment has parts going obsolete in them. Some consumer electronics manufacturers keep a line running until parts are exhausted. Then they come out with a new model. A board house I worked for back in the 90s was great for that. One of the reasons I no longer work there.

As to the IGBT, it was a part made by our own company fab house in Poland. They came out with a new part to replace the old. It failed. But they already scrapped the tooling for the original. So they had to find the problem with the new ones and correct it. Now how true it all is, I cant say. But that is the story I gathered from all the emails flying around. I have no clue how the devices are made, and I really don't need to. My job is to help keep production running and the product passing testing before it ships. And I need working components to do that. And we did try to qualify 4 other brands that were supposed to meet our spec. They all failed as well. Hitachi devices did work in our lower power products, but not the high power end. And yes these are big bricks that need to be mounted on huge heat sinks.

I can get you a part numbers when I go back to work next week. I don't have that information at home, and I am on vacation this week.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N2SR on November 03, 2015, 03:09:14 AM
Seems to me that people who claim to know so much about business, electronic product development, etc., would then be incredibly successful in business. And if they were successful in business, they would have enough savings to be able to purchase a high-end TenTec radio.

My experience is that people who boast about what they know, claim everyone else is wrong, then have so little money, usually don't really know all that much. If they did, they would have put that knowledge to use successfully to have a great career and thus earned a lot of money through their brilliance.

The IRONY in this post is very strong.   

Did you not mention 6 months ago that C[hicken] Q[uack] magazine 'was done?'   And kept harping about it, and harping about it, and harping about it, and harping about it, and harping about it, and harping about it, and harping about it.......
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 03, 2015, 05:00:30 AM
Perhaps Elecraft is picking up some of Ten Tec's sales.  Their K3 works for me as well as the O2 did and after this much time the customer base surely went elsewhere.
If I want a new HF rig - in kit form or otherwise - Elecraft, DZKit and Flex are firmly in the running. They'll also (for now) solidly support everything they sell, which counts for a lot.

I would have to agree. TenTec, unfortunately, will soon be irrelevant. They are not fast and nimble and that's what the markets require today. You just cannot put production of other radios on hold for half a year to meet some big order. Most customers are just not going to wait half a year for a radio when there are so many other choices out there.

Just take a look at Elecraft. Excellent products, new developments coming all the time, choice of assembled or kit, and innovative. They are fast and nimble. In my opinion, Elecraft's ability to execute may have led to the decline of TenTec. Throw in Flex and it's a double whammy at TenTec.

So, and I can only speculate on this, if TenTec cannot produce radios now because they are trying to satisfy other orders, I kind of doubt there is a lot of new product development taking place. If you are not designing new, innovative radios, you are going to fall further and further behind. When you fall behind, your potential market continues to shrink. You can all guess as to what will eventually happen to companies over time who have a continually shrinking set of potential customers.

It's really sad because I loved TenTec radios. My first was a Paragon II, followed by an Omni 6+, then a Jupiter, Argo V, Rebel and Patriot. The Patriot may have been the last TenTec I will ever purchase. My current FTdx-1200 and Kenwood TS590 are excellent radios, full-featured and fun to operate. My next acquisition will probably be the KX3 from Elecraft. TenTec is no longer on the radar. TenTec's answer was the Argo VI which has missing HF bands and no 6 meter option. For just a little more money you can have a KX3 with all the HF bands and 6 meters. It also has an option for internal tuner, 2 meters and internal batteries.

A company like TenTec just cannot stay in business with products that do not match or exceed the competition. Excellent service with inferior products only will take you so far. Too bad, time and technology move on. If you cannot keep up, you're dead.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WE1X on November 03, 2015, 07:27:54 AM
Perhaps Elecraft is picking up some of Ten Tec's sales.  Their K3 works for me as well as the O2 did and after this much time the customer base surely went elsewhere.
If I want a new HF rig - in kit form or otherwise - Elecraft, DZKit and Flex are firmly in the running. They'll also (for now) solidly support everything they sell, which counts for a lot.

I would have to agree. TenTec, unfortunately, will soon be irrelevant. They are not fast and nimble and that's what the markets require today. You just cannot put production of other radios on hold for half a year to meet some big order. Most customers are just not going to wait half a year for a radio when there are so many other choices out there.

Just take a look at Elecraft. Excellent products, new developments coming all the time, choice of assembled or kit, and innovative. They are fast and nimble. In my opinion, Elecraft's ability to execute may have led to the decline of TenTec. Throw in Flex and it's a double whammy at TenTec.

So, and I can only speculate on this, if TenTec cannot produce radios now because they are trying to satisfy other orders, I kind of doubt there is a lot of new product development taking place. If you are not designing new, innovative radios, you are going to fall further and further behind. When you fall behind, your potential market continues to shrink. You can all guess as to what will eventually happen to companies over time who have a continually shrinking set of potential customers.

It's really sad because I loved TenTec radios. My first was a Paragon II, followed by an Omni 6+, then a Jupiter, Argo V, Rebel and Patriot. The Patriot may have been the last TenTec I will ever purchase. My current FTdx-1200 and Kenwood TS590 are excellent radios, full-featured and fun to operate. My next acquisition will probably be the KX3 from Elecraft. TenTec is no longer on the radar. TenTec's answer was the Argo VI which has missing HF bands and no 6 meter option. For just a little more money you can have a KX3 with all the HF bands and 6 meters. It also has an option for internal tuner, 2 meters and internal batteries.

A company like TenTec just cannot stay in business with products that do not match or exceed the competition. Excellent service with inferior products only will take you so far. Too bad, time and technology move on. If you cannot keep up, you're dead.

Well said.

I wonder, however, whether any company devoted solely to amateur radio transceivers can compete per scale of manufacturing, R&D, costs, etc.  When we look at the Big 3, ham radio is a complement to their other lines of business (e.g., land mobile, marine, aviation). When we look at Flex their ham products are likely leveraged from their commercial customers and government contracts. Not sure what other customers, if any, support Elecraft. Even specialty product companies such as AOR rely on other markets. As for Ten Tec, I suspect its amateur radio business was a love of labor by one of the company's founders and when he passed so did the company's mojo.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0BKR on November 03, 2015, 07:43:08 AM
I wish TT well, under whatever name they go under but honestly, from my perspective, it doesn't look promising to but out of touch this long with the amateur community.  I don't think the new owners plan to really push the TT product lines much as their interests seem to be elsewhere, I would be wrong and hope so, but to be out of touch this long....

Just sayin....

THink if I had any inkling to procure a TT product, I would not be holding my breath or waiting around to see that happens.  I remember the old Swan company, went out of business, came back and then were buried after that....not sure but I don't think TT can compete in this environment with thier limited offerings.  10 years ago, I think they were doing okay but now.....

GL and hope it all works out, regardless of the speculation, including mine.... ???
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 03, 2015, 08:36:07 AM
I wish TT well, under whatever name they go under but honestly, from my perspective, it doesn't look promising to but out of touch this long with the amateur community.  I don't think the new owners plan to really push the TT product lines much as their interests seem to be elsewhere, I would be wrong and hope so, but to be out of touch this long....

Just sayin....

THink if I had any inkling to procure a TT product, I would not be holding my breath or waiting around to see that happens.  I remember the old Swan company, went out of business, came back and then were buried after that....not sure but I don't think TT can compete in this environment with thier limited offerings.  10 years ago, I think they were doing okay but now.....

GL and hope it all works out, regardless of the speculation, including mine.... ???

When Cubic bought out Swan in the 1960's, Cubic Corp was primarily a government supplier of communications equipment, they did a lot of work for the Navy.  It didn't take long for them to see the writing on the wall, they simply could not compete against the Japanese in the commercial amateur radio market and focused all of their efforts on more profitable government contracts.

They are still around today and still build communications systems, among other things for the government.

The guy who originally owned Swan radio started Atlas radio in the 70's.  They were short lived as by then the Japanese were firmly established and no American company could compete with them.  That was around the time most of the American amateur radio manufactures got out of the ham business or folded.

Anyone who was a ham in the 60's remembers the competition between Swan and Yaesu.  Actually Swan made some pretty decent stuff at the time but they got a bad rap for being drifty compared to the Ftdx-400 (which wasn't that good) and especially Collins and Drake rigs which were amazingly stable at the time.  The later Swan/Cubic solid state rigs were really very good high quality radios.

I just feel like without the metal fabrication capability that they used to have and no real manufacturing facilities anymore Ten Tec is on the way out.  
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 03, 2015, 08:39:53 AM

 As for Ten Tec, I suspect its amateur radio business was a love of labor by one of the company's founders and when he passed so did the company's mojo.


Actually, before Ten Tec was sold to RF Concepts, Ten Tec's sheet metal shop manufactured enclosures for other companies, their machine shop did a lot of plastic injection mold business for the local automotive industry, and they had a non-Ham commercial/government receiver business, to name a few of their non-Ham related operations that kept the business afloat.  With RF Concepts and then RKR, all of that business that sustained Ten Tec is GONE.  Ten Ten has none of the sheet metal and machine shop capabilities they had before the move/acquisition.  All of their PCB assembly equipment has been sold off.

Due to its prime location on the Dolly Parton Parkway, a large chain retail company wanted the property that Ten Tec was on and paid handsomely to buy it.  That is why the company was sold in a hurry to RF Concepts with out any concern for those who worked there or Ten Tec's legacy.

Here is the former site where the Ten Tec building was:  

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Ten-Tec/@35.8637118,-83.5294064,3a,75y,203.1h,84.06t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1skxAh5plWRt63LxYgrJs4iA!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DkxAh5plWRt63LxYgrJs4iA%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D303.10852%26pitch%3D0!7i13312!8i6656!4m2!3m1!1s0x885bf90d1615a929:0x76d6380a5092ba3f (https://www.google.com/maps/place/Ten-Tec/@35.8637118,-83.5294064,3a,75y,203.1h,84.06t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1skxAh5plWRt63LxYgrJs4iA!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DkxAh5plWRt63LxYgrJs4iA%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D303.10852%26pitch%3D0!7i13312!8i6656!4m2!3m1!1s0x885bf90d1615a929:0x76d6380a5092ba3f)



Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N8YX on November 03, 2015, 08:58:33 AM
...The later Swan/Cubic solid state rigs were really very good high quality radios.
The Astro 10x series were especially good "amateur band" gear. Some of Cubic's other lines - the Astro 15x and Astro B/C/D - were a little less feature laden but offered wider spectrum coverage than the 10x line, owing to their being synthesized.

I own several examples of each. Nice equipment, but not equivalent to, say, an Omni VI.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB2WIK on November 03, 2015, 09:55:30 AM
What chips, specifically?

What's the part number of the IGBT?  It would have to be a module or array of devices for that kind of rating, but hundreds of shops produce custom power hybrids to spec and I've had them turned in 4 weeks and less (with expedite fees).

I was not referring to any specific device since the original post did not either. However there are plenty of obsolete parts scattered throughout ham radio products. And reproducing them, especially those that have specific firmware to be programmed with which may or may not be available, is going to take time to reproduce. I don't deal with the military market, so I can't speak to specifics of that market. And not all EOL statements get sent down to the consumer level to know that their equipment has parts going obsolete in them. Some consumer electronics manufacturers keep a line running until parts are exhausted. Then they come out with a new model. A board house I worked for back in the 90s was great for that. One of the reasons I no longer work there.

As to the IGBT, it was a part made by our own company fab house in Poland. They came out with a new part to replace the old. It failed. But they already scrapped the tooling for the original. So they had to find the problem with the new ones and correct it. Now how true it all is, I cant say. But that is the story I gathered from all the emails flying around. I have no clue how the devices are made, and I really don't need to. My job is to help keep production running and the product passing testing before it ships. And I need working components to do that. And we did try to qualify 4 other brands that were supposed to meet our spec. They all failed as well. Hitachi devices did work in our lower power products, but not the high power end. And yes these are big bricks that need to be mounted on huge heat sinks.

I can get you a part numbers when I go back to work next week. I don't have that information at home, and I am on vacation this week.

Sure.  Whatever the P/N is, if it was custom made for your application it may not be listed anywhere, anyway.  Some things are like that.

A super power IGBT (array) is a pretty special part, one that I'd try really hard to not design anything around for the very reason you offered: Sole source and the source is too likely to disappear.

But ham gear isn't really like that.  Many custom ASICs are used, but there are millions of FPGAs around and the difference from one to the next is their scale and how they're programmed.  Lose the source code and it can all be history, but that would be very irresponsible.

There are custom power hybrid manufacturers in the U.S. and elsewhere who will build big power circuits like multi-kilowatt IGBTs and such "to spec," but you have to give them a real spec and not just say "it must be equivalent to this, which by the way we don't know much about." ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 03, 2015, 11:28:53 AM

A super power IGBT (array) is a pretty special part, one that I'd try really hard to not design anything around for the very reason you offered: Sole source and the source is too likely to disappear.

But ham gear isn't really like that.  Many custom ASICs are used, but there are millions of FPGAs around and the difference from one to the next is their scale and how they're programmed.  Lose the source code and it can all be history, but that would be very irresponsible.

There are custom power hybrid manufacturers in the U.S. and elsewhere who will build big power circuits like multi-kilowatt IGBTs and such "to spec," but you have to give them a real spec and not just say "it must be equivalent to this, which by the way we don't know much about." ;)

Well the source didn't disappear. It is part of our factory network. And it is unlikely it will disappear without a replacement as it makes many components used in many products our company builds. As I said, somehow there was a mistake made and the new components failed. It turned out to be a costly mistake. And to my way of thinking, was just as catastrophic as NASA crashing probes on Mars due to a math error. __it happens.

Unfortunately consumer electronics is well known for just such problems. It often revolves around who had the firmware. Yes it is irresponsible. I will fully agree with that. But it is a common problem. There are a few examples stated by others in the ham community. Including the big 3. Just as I can no longer get an original LCD display for a radio I have. And it is less then 7 years old. And it too is from the big 3.

I am sure the R&D department knows how to spec a device. After all, it is their job.  And I am sure they didn't just send other manufactures some general spec. But as stated, their products failed in testing as well. Which is why the process of qualification is so important. I highly doubt that R&D would just start pulling something in that is similar without a rather extensive amount of scrutiny. Or at least I would hope they would. Again as I said that is way beyond the scope of my job and knowledge level. I work on the production side which under normal circumstances is after R&D has released the design. I just know what happens when we don't have working components and how it effects a production schedule. And I also have to deal with the problems when for any reason we don't have parts. And that gives me a pretty good insight  into procurement and the headaches that come with it.

As bad as watching units fail in testing, at that power level it made for a couple of pretty good arc flashes that really lit up the test cell. And it was good it happened in a test cell with all of its safety controls and not in a customers electrical room.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on November 03, 2015, 02:11:09 PM
folks used to say that about RCA, too.  from the mike to the speaker, they used to advertise.  invented the music synthesizer and on-screen graphics, among other things.

they shed the storied broadcast equipment division without warning one October day in the early 80s for a $17 million dollar tax writeoff.  half the broadcasters in the country were up s-creek without a paddle overnight; a TV transmitter on a tower that is the only high point around attracts every lightning stroke.  the RCA-special parts immediately ceased, off to some surplus outfit that had no idea what this thing was.  no second sourcing.

they shed TV, tubes, and semiconductors shortly afterwards.  the CMOS stuff went to GE-Intersil, which went to Harris, which catalog went all to heck in a handbasket over 10 or so years.  old masks for small wafers, declining sales, the whole gamut of "drop this line."

if your fab goes cash flow negative for several quarters, it may go poof, too.  business is like that these days.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: VA3RTX on November 03, 2015, 05:36:07 PM
It will certainly be sad if we loose another domestic company, but it doesn't look promising. Maybe MFJ will buy up the scraps  ::) Being in the telecom business for the last 30 years, I've seen this happen many times. New products don't happen, shipments of existing products are late, tech support slowly disappears and then you get a notice from the lawyers.

Last week I was on the RKR Design site and noticed that they had matched sets of 4 811A tubes for $70 ! I figured at that price, it wasn't much of a risk to pick up a spare set of tubes. I emailed RKR and got a reply the next morning. I put in an online order and they arrive by Fedex in 3 days. I was quite surprised when the tubes arrived, as I was expecting some untested generic tubes.

These tubes are not just some generic no name Chinese tubes. They were custom made, labelled and packaged for Alpha Amps. I've seen other sets of "so called" matched tubes that come unlabelled, with no sign of testing. Each of these tubes were serial numbered, had an inspection label with test specs and a certificate in each box. Each tube was also embossed with the date code 1535, which I assume is the 35th week of this year. Aug 2015 ? Maybe this was an order that Alpha placed some time ago and they just received them now. I have not tested them yet in my amp, so I'm hoping they work as good as they look. My question is, does anyone out there have any experience with Alpha 811A Tubes ???

Now, I think I'll just store them away, as they may become a collector's item. If you want to see what these tubes look like, check out,

http://www.robotnut.com/radio/Alpha%20811a.jpg (http://www.robotnut.com/radio/Alpha%20811a.jpg)

VA3RTX
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 05, 2015, 09:53:58 AM

 As for Ten Tec, I suspect its amateur radio business was a love of labor by one of the company's founders and when he passed so did the company's mojo.


Actually, before Ten Tec was sold to RF Concepts, Ten Tec's sheet metal shop manufactured enclosures for other companies, their machine shop did a lot of plastic injection mold business for the local automotive industry, and they had a non-Ham commercial/government receiver business, to name a few of their non-Ham related operations that kept the business afloat.  With RF Concepts and then RKR, all of that business that sustained Ten Tec is GONE.  Ten Ten has none of the sheet metal and machine shop capabilities they had before the move/acquisition.  All of their PCB assembly equipment has been sold off.

Due to its prime location on the Dolly Parton Parkway, a large chain retail company wanted the property that Ten Tec was on and paid handsomely to buy it.  That is why the company was sold in a hurry to RF Concepts with out any concern for those who worked there or Ten Tec's legacy.

Here is the former site where the Ten Tec building was:  

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Ten-Tec/@35.8637118,-83.5294064,3a,75y,203.1h,84.06t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1skxAh5plWRt63LxYgrJs4iA!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DkxAh5plWRt63LxYgrJs4iA%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D303.10852%26pitch%3D0!7i13312!8i6656!4m2!3m1!1s0x885bf90d1615a929:0x76d6380a5092ba3f (https://www.google.com/maps/place/Ten-Tec/@35.8637118,-83.5294064,3a,75y,203.1h,84.06t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1skxAh5plWRt63LxYgrJs4iA!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DkxAh5plWRt63LxYgrJs4iA%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D303.10852%26pitch%3D0!7i13312!8i6656!4m2!3m1!1s0x885bf90d1615a929:0x76d6380a5092ba3f)


Thanks for posting that, it kind of sheds some light on what's happening.  I believe W1EX was spot on about it being a labor of love.  For years the owner and a few dedicated hams used the commercial radio business to shift some of the newer technology to amateur radio.  I remember in the 1990's the Omni VI was one of the best rigs you could get, especially if you were a CW op. Then the Orion II came out for a short while and it was top notch but only for a short time. 

It seems like Ten Tec never really caught up after that, the Omni VII was OK but not great and the Eagle had stiff competition from Kenwood in it's price range.  The TS-590 has now surpassed it and Icom is getting set to release a direct sampling radio at a very competitive price.  Given the lack of fabrication facilities, and no future product announcements in over a year except for an auto tuner that has yet to materialize, I don't see them coming back.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WE1X on November 06, 2015, 08:18:46 AM
We should also keep in mind that while Ten Tec certainly had its following - and deservedly so - it was lacking in a number of areas that severely compromised its competitiveness.  First, at times its HF rigs lacked the ergonomics and fit & finish associated with the Big 3. For example, I had an Argonaut V with a meter needle that would pin if there was static buildup on the meter face. While some features such as selectivity were great others were lacking. Note that for many years hams (including Ten Tec devotees) and reviewers would try to impress upon Ten Tec to improve their ergonomics and fit & finish. From what I've heard (and very well could be wrong) Ten Tec's culture repeatedly downplayed this. Second, in the late 1980s to early 1990s Ten Tec abandoned its retail distribution network (eg., HRO was a reseller of Ten Tec gear) and sold only direct.  While there may have been good reasons for doing so, selling direct limited a ham's ability to walk into a store, engage with the rig, and make a buying decision. Further, the loss of a retail network also reduced Ten Tec's visibility..something quite important in a highly competitive market especially when Ten Tec was introducing newer rigs. Third, was pricing. Some of Ten Tec's transceivers, especially later models including  the Eagle and Omni VII, were exceptionally expensive vis a vis the competition.  That changed when RKR took over and pricing became more reasonable, albeit maybe too late.

Now one could argue that some of the issues Ten Tec foisted upon itself are true with other vendors. For example, both Elecraft and FlexRadio sell directly, yet they seem to be doing okay.  As said in a previous post, I suspect Flex's amateur business is complemented by its commercial and government contracts. Not sure about Elecraft. And while Elecraft gear too is lacking in some ergonomics and fit & finish, it's K3 design allows one to customize a rig per options at time of order or later. For many that may a reasonable trade-off.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 07, 2015, 03:36:11 AM
It will be interesting to see if TenTec comes to some of the large upcoming Hamfests like Hamcation and Hamvention. I hope some hams will question them on what's going on with the company, lack of available products, and what if anything is happening with new products development. The lack of advertising if very telling.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 07, 2015, 05:39:33 AM
It will be interesting to see if TenTec comes to some of the large upcoming Hamfests like Hamcation and Hamvention. I hope some hams will question them on what's going on with the company, lack of available products, and what if anything is happening with new products development. The lack of advertising if very telling.

You keep asking others to talk to them...Why not give them a call yourself? Oh yea I said that to you before and you told me to do it.

Your good at whining and looking for others to do your bidding. Why not do it for yourself for a change?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 07, 2015, 07:56:57 AM
W9FIB, please re-read my last post. I did not ask anyone to do anything. I just said I hope some people ask them questions. I will of course ask them when I am at Dayton this year. Talking on the phone is useless since you cannot read the person you are talking to.  A person needs to look them in the eye to see if they are telling the truth.

For a guy who has done nothing to help keep them in business by purchasing any of their products, you sure seem to have a lot of interest in the company. Might I suggest you stay out of the discussion here and leave it to those of us who have been customers and supported the company over the past 20 to 30 years? We're the ones who have real skin in the game. You on the other hand do nothing but cheer them on then purchase some noisy Yaesu radio. TenTec needs REAL customers who invest with money, not invest with useless chatter.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 07, 2015, 08:53:52 AM
Then why don't you buy something now. Your the one whining. Tell us all about what you got. Write a review on it.

You just said you want others to ask questions...again. And now you want me to buy something to earn my right to defend them. So you see you do want, or demand in my case, others to do something.

And like I said before...send me the funds if it is so important to you. I am still recovering from my house fire last summer. Matter of fact, we are finally moving in this weekend. I have had to lay out almost everything I have to do it. So your demands are not even reasonable on any level.

But yet you whine. And moan. And say they are dead. And want others to do what you won't do. So when you finally do do something, maybe I and others will also. But don't tell me I need to purchase to stand up for them. That is pure arrogance on your part. Just like all the blather you made about CQ magazine. As far as I can tell they are healing and getting back on track. How many months and posts did you make about CQ? I lost count and don't really care to go back to that thread since at this point, most of it is meaningless anyway.

If you don't like the fact I defend TT, fine. But until I see proof (not internet rumors and speculations) I will continue to support an American business even if it is only moral support. That is my right just as it is your right to whine, which you do well.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 07, 2015, 10:36:23 AM
So you lost your house to a fire, I am truly sorry to hear that.

However, you are in the process of moving after such a catastrophic event and you have time for this nonsense?  Man you seriously need to reexamine your priorities.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 07, 2015, 10:39:52 AM
Quote from: WB8NUT
For a guy who has done nothing to help keep them in business by purchasing any of their products, you sure seem to have a lot of interest in the company. Might I suggest you stay out of the discussion here and leave it to those of us who have been customers and supported the company over the past 20 to 30 years?

It isn't your place to suggest FIB stay out of the discussion here.  I initiated this thread and if it were up to me he would be one of the last to be asked to leave  ;)  the necrophiliacs here have announced the funeral, the TT fan boys have announced that RKR has TT in the incubation phase and will soon spread wings, and the realists have taken a wait-and-see-approach.

Why don't we all just take that third approach and re-visit this thread if and when RKR announces something.  Once that happens anyone who wishes to can come back and dance on the grave singing an "i told you so" diddy if they find it appropriate.

 73
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 07, 2015, 02:31:10 PM
So you lost your house to a fire, I am truly sorry to hear that.

However, you are in the process of moving after such a catastrophic event and you have time for this nonsense?  Man you seriously need to reexamine your priorities.

Its not nonsense to stand up for a company many try to write off as dead. As to priorities, what's wrong with sitting down for a break and using the time here? I am not a robot that can be turned on...do heavy work all day... then turned off.

I don't have an operable station right now. So I stay connected with some aspects of ham radio here. And probably wont be back on the air till next year some time.

My priorities are getting my family back into a real home instead of living in a garage. My salvageable equipment sits in boxes waiting for the time I can start cleaning and restoring it. Other equipment will need to be replaced. I don't have the money for that right now, so station building is on a low priority. So I think I have priorities in the right place. But I would not expect all people to understand this until they have to pick through their ruins and try to save what ever is left that can be saved like I had to do.

So when NUT demands I buy something, I tell him to show me the money. And he says no. So what good are his demands? Not to mention the fact that my equipment may not be the worlds greatest to him and others, but it works and does what I want it too. What is wrong with that?

In reality, comments like those of DPO and NUT make me wonder why I even want to rebuild a station. But then others like KEY remind me why. And yes I still hope some day to have a very nice radio. Which is one reason why I support TT and hope I can have my own. But sorry NUT, it wont be today.

I know this was probably a waste of time to write because I highly doubt they will listen and probably find another reason to attack. But still that's why I do write. Because others will knuckle under to them, but I wont!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 07, 2015, 02:55:08 PM
First, my opinions are not whining. Second, if you want money for a radio, you'll have to earn it yourself. Maybe Obama can give you some money since he seems to be giving it out to everyone. Or, just take the insurance money you received for your destroyed station and buy a new radio. Please tell me you had insurance to cover everything, because it would be a shame to spend money on that other equipment before spending it on a full-coverage insurance policy. When you do buy a new radio, please make sure it is a TenTec.

Oh, and I have written a number of reviews on TenTec and other radios. They are here on eham. I see where W9KEY has a Jupiter. Excellent radio. Sad to see them drop it from the line. The only issue I ever had with the radio was RF coming in on the digital audio lines. Some Ferrite Chokes on the audio lines solved the issue. Great QSK on CW, but W9KEY already knows that.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 07, 2015, 04:31:34 PM
First, my opinions are not whining. Second, if you want money for a radio, you'll have to earn it yourself. Maybe Obama can give you some money since he seems to be giving it out to everyone. Or, just take the insurance money you received for your destroyed station and buy a new radio. Please tell me you had insurance to cover everything, because it would be a shame to spend money on that other equipment before spending it on a full-coverage insurance policy. When you do buy a new radio, please make sure it is a TenTec.

Oh, and I have written a number of reviews on TenTec and other radios. They are here on eham. I see where W9KEY has a Jupiter. Excellent radio. Sad to see them drop it from the line. The only issue I ever had with the radio was RF coming in on the digital audio lines. Some Ferrite Chokes on the audio lines solved the issue. Great QSK on CW, but W9KEY already knows that.

So where is your new radio and new review? Come on dude, you want to spend my money, what's wrong with spending yours and supporting TT?

And why do I need to bother Obama when it is you that demands I buy it now? Pony up or shut up.

As far as how I spend my money, it is family first, then what ever I need to maintain my properties, then transportation, then any other common expenses, then hobbies, then demands from people that think I have to bow to their wishes. Fortunately for me, the last one never makes it in the budget. And right now, a TT radio as you demand is not in the budget. And your right about 1 thing. I earn what I have. I have not asked for a thing from anyone. Except to those who demand I buy something.

As to insurance, I had full coverage for what I had. But since I had to rebuild the whole thing, I elected to make some changes to make things better. Things like rearranging walls to have a larger kitchen and reduce wasted space in other places. And those items were not lost in the fire, so they are not covered. So no room for your demanded TT there either. OMG the horror that must bring you! I built something better instead of a TT!

Don't like it...tough. It is a reality of life. My life. Not what you think my life should be.

As to your opinions...once or twice is an opinion. After that it is whining...just like the CQ thread.

And just as I said you needed to find fault. What's it going to be this time? Put on a cheaper roof so I can get your demanded TT? Or should I have just given my family a port-a-potty instead of a bathroom? Or should I find a way to get it with other tax payers money? Or how about no new beds for the wife and kids. Let them sleep on the floor. Or a propane camp stove instead of a real stove? Or plastic shelving instead of cabinets? How about putting in no electrical wiring? Or plumbing?  Or how about my family never eating? How about we just live on the street and look at that demanded TT sitting on the curb next to us? What's it going to be NUT??? I'm sure you will think of something.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 08, 2015, 05:25:53 AM
So then your endless rebuttals must then be whining using your logic.

As for the reviews, look them up. They are all over eham's equipment review section. Seems to be an issue with just being lazy to me that someone else has to look them up for you.

Can't wait to see the picture of your new shack with all that homebrew equipment instead of helping TenTec survive by buying their equipment. You're great at providing verbal support for TenTec. Too bad TenTec cannot pay their bills with verbal support.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 08, 2015, 06:12:46 AM
So then your endless rebuttals must then be whining using your logic.

As for the reviews, look them up. They are all over eham's equipment review section. Seems to be an issue with just being lazy to me that someone else has to look them up for you.

Can't wait to see the picture of your new shack with all that homebrew equipment instead of helping TenTec survive by buying their equipment. You're great at providing verbal support for TenTec. Too bad TenTec cannot pay their bills with verbal support.

LOL To use your word, it is a rebuttal to your whining. Nice try to shift the blame though. Just like I said, you would think of something! What's next?

Did you ever stop to think if you would stop I would have nothing to rebut? Seems like you just don't get that. Oh well I will be ready for the next one.

OK I will watch daily for your new review of your new TT. Would you like to me to send a daily reminder when I don't find a new one? I wouldn't want you to forget. Then they can pay their bills since you seem to be worried about that. I am sure you will agree that it is the right thing to do since they can't pay their bills now...according to you.

So now homebrew is bad too? Why do so many say it is a big problem in ham radio that many don't homebrew any more then? I guess we all need to conform to your idea of a station now. There goes all the experimentation that a lot of hams do. What a shame. That will make all equipment inferior unless it is just commercial gear repurposed to ham radio. Nothing new should be tried since it does not fit your idea of a station. What a shame!

Keep swingin NUT. Some day you will strike out...LOL Oh wait, that happened with CQ magazine.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 08, 2015, 07:09:37 AM
You are amazing. For a guy who is moving in this weekend, you have a tremendous amount of spare time to post here. When I moved two years ago, I did not have much time for anything except working and getting the new house in order for several weeks.

You know, you're right, I do need to post reviews of my Rebel and Patriot. Here are a few of my other reviews:

http://www.eham.net/reviews/review/56493

http://www.eham.net/reviews/review/22567

If you want to see all the reviews that I posted over the years, you can go here:

http://www.eham.net/reviews/search and enter my call.

Now here's a post about my Omni 6+

http://lists.contesting.com/_tentec/2001-03/msg00222.html

Another post that mentions my Omni 6+ and the Paragon II

http://lists.contesting.com/_tentec/1998-10/msg00305.html

Now see, I've done all the work for you. I even have receipts for the Jupiter, Argo V and the Patriot. Rebel receipt is around here somewhere.  Would you like pictures of my Rebel and Patriot next to my QSL card to prove it? So you see I have indeed been a BIG TenTec supporter and DID purchase their American-made radios in the past and actually with the Rebel and Patriot, quite recently.

No, I don't care if people homebrew, I think it's great. The issue is how long it will take you, and how expensive it may become, to create more than a simple QRP radio all on your own.

As for CQ Magazine, yes my prediction was not accurate. I think they must have received an influx of cash. However, I still think they will diminish over time. How long is the remaining question. But I am much happier with RadCom so no big loss except for the money CQ still owes me.

But back to the central issue, talk is cheap. If you want to really help TenTec survive, buy their radios like me and stop whining about not having the money - use a credit card, some offer 12 months same as cash, and pay it off over the next year. And no, I am not going to find you an appropriate credit card. You have to do some work yourself. I can't do everything for you LOL!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on November 08, 2015, 07:33:47 AM
Man, the thread that never ends.  The truth is, who needs to buy a NEW radio every few years?  Even the earliest Ten Tec Omni's are still at the top of the Sherwood Engineering list.  A few more dB of dynamic range or lower phase noise comes at what price, and at what benefit?  Even my Paragon II with it's triple conversion scheme was 10 dB better than most of the imports.

I'd buy a new radio when I have a real need for one.  The problem with Ten Tec is they supported older gear for far too long. That hurt sales just as much as this transition period is doing presently.  Personally, I could buy a Hiberling PT-8000; but what can it do that even a TS-590S can't?

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0BKR on November 08, 2015, 10:41:51 AM
Exactly.  And, frankly, of the newer offerings, there isn't much I really find that grand of a radio that my current models can stand up to....I honestly don't need to be at the top of Rob's receiver test list....mine (all of them) all give me what I want...enjoyment....
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 08, 2015, 03:55:52 PM
You are amazing. For a guy who is moving in this weekend, you have a tremendous amount of spare time to post here. When I moved two years ago, I did not have much time for anything except working and getting the new house in order for several weeks.

You know, you're right, I do need to post reviews of my Rebel and Patriot. Here are a few of my other reviews:

http://www.eham.net/reviews/review/56493

http://www.eham.net/reviews/review/22567

If you want to see all the reviews that I posted over the years, you can go here:

http://www.eham.net/reviews/search and enter my call.

Now here's a post about my Omni 6+

http://lists.contesting.com/_tentec/2001-03/msg00222.html

Another post that mentions my Omni 6+ and the Paragon II

http://lists.contesting.com/_tentec/1998-10/msg00305.html

Now see, I've done all the work for you. I even have receipts for the Jupiter, Argo V and the Patriot. Rebel receipt is around here somewhere.  Would you like pictures of my Rebel and Patriot next to my QSL card to prove it? So you see I have indeed been a BIG TenTec supporter and DID purchase their American-made radios in the past and actually with the Rebel and Patriot, quite recently.

No, I don't care if people homebrew, I think it's great. The issue is how long it will take you, and how expensive it may become, to create more than a simple QRP radio all on your own.

As for CQ Magazine, yes my prediction was not accurate. I think they must have received an influx of cash. However, I still think they will diminish over time. How long is the remaining question. But I am much happier with RadCom so no big loss except for the money CQ still owes me.

But back to the central issue, talk is cheap. If you want to really help TenTec survive, buy their radios like me and stop whining about not having the money - use a credit card, some offer 12 months same as cash, and pay it off over the next year. And no, I am not going to find you an appropriate credit card. You have to do some work yourself. I can't do everything for you LOL!

Guess you need lessons in reading comprehension. I never asked about old reviews, so you wasted your time with that. Go back and re-read what I said. Maybe the second try will help you.

See, you had to whine about CQ again. With all the whining you did you should still owe them money. But that's not my problem. I'm just an observer on that.

I don't use credit cards. I pay my way right away. If I don't have it, I don't buy it. Save all that stupid interest that others pay. But I guess you have money to burn for that. That's fine for you. I do not want to waste money like that. So again your demands become more and more ridiculous that I need to buy something to support a company.

I never did ask you to do anything other then follow your own demand, and I did ask you to stop posting to me, but you can't seem to do that either.

2 days to move? you must have a lot of crap then. We were done in 4 hours. But to be fair, I only had to move from my garage to back in my house. Most of what I have is now new and set up by the dealers I bought it all from. Remember, it was a fire and not much was salvageable? Oh yea there is the comprehension thing again.

So what are you going to come up with now? Rob a bank? Only you know. LOL I will be waiting.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 09, 2015, 03:56:59 AM
You are amazing. For a guy who is moving in this weekend, you have a tremendous amount of spare time to post here. When I moved two years ago, I did not have much time for anything except working and getting the new house in order for several weeks.

You know, you're right, I do need to post reviews of my Rebel and Patriot. Here are a few of my other reviews:

http://www.eham.net/reviews/review/56493

http://www.eham.net/reviews/review/22567

If you want to see all the reviews that I posted over the years, you can go here:

http://www.eham.net/reviews/search and enter my call.

Now here's a post about my Omni 6+

http://lists.contesting.com/_tentec/2001-03/msg00222.html

Another post that mentions my Omni 6+ and the Paragon II

http://lists.contesting.com/_tentec/1998-10/msg00305.html

Now see, I've done all the work for you. I even have receipts for the Jupiter, Argo V and the Patriot. Rebel receipt is around here somewhere.  Would you like pictures of my Rebel and Patriot next to my QSL card to prove it? So you see I have indeed been a BIG TenTec supporter and DID purchase their American-made radios in the past and actually with the Rebel and Patriot, quite recently.

No, I don't care if people homebrew, I think it's great. The issue is how long it will take you, and how expensive it may become, to create more than a simple QRP radio all on your own.

As for CQ Magazine, yes my prediction was not accurate. I think they must have received an influx of cash. However, I still think they will diminish over time. How long is the remaining question. But I am much happier with RadCom so no big loss except for the money CQ still owes me.

But back to the central issue, talk is cheap. If you want to really help TenTec survive, buy their radios like me and stop whining about not having the money - use a credit card, some offer 12 months same as cash, and pay it off over the next year. And no, I am not going to find you an appropriate credit card. You have to do some work yourself. I can't do everything for you LOL!

Guess you need lessons in reading comprehension. I never asked about old reviews, so you wasted your time with that. Go back and re-read what I said. Maybe the second try will help you.

See, you had to whine about CQ again. With all the whining you did you should still owe them money. But that's not my problem. I'm just an observer on that.

I don't use credit cards. I pay my way right away. If I don't have it, I don't buy it. Save all that stupid interest that others pay. But I guess you have money to burn for that. That's fine for you. I do not want to waste money like that. So again your demands become more and more ridiculous that I need to buy something to support a company.

I never did ask you to do anything other then follow your own demand, and I did ask you to stop posting to me, but you can't seem to do that either.

2 days to move? you must have a lot of crap then. We were done in 4 hours. But to be fair, I only had to move from my garage to back in my house. Most of what I have is now new and set up by the dealers I bought it all from. Remember, it was a fire and not much was salvageable? Oh yea there is the comprehension thing again.

So what are you going to come up with now? Rob a bank? Only you know. LOL I will be waiting.

I don't think anyone here cares about your personal life and problems.  Narcissist maybe?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 09, 2015, 04:23:42 AM

I don't think anyone here cares about your personal life and problems.  Narcissist maybe?

NUT does.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 09, 2015, 09:33:51 AM
I don't think anyone here cares about your personal life and problems.  Narcissist maybe?

SWL, what was it that fueled your initial interest in amateur radio? correct me if i am wrong, but judging by your posts here the odds seem better that it was about some inner drive to some day make ascerbic posts on an amateur radio website than it was about any interest in using radio communication to foster goodwill amongst amateurs...  :-\

http://www.eham.net/articles/30512 (http://www.eham.net/articles/30512)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 09, 2015, 10:10:38 AM
I don't think anyone here cares about your personal life and problems.  Narcissist maybe?

SWL, what was it that fueled your initial interest in amateur radio? correct me if i am wrong, but judging by your posts here the odds seem better that it was about some inner drive to some day make ascerbic posts on an amateur radio website than it was about any interest in using radio communication to foster goodwill amongst amateurs...  :-\

http://www.eham.net/articles/30512 (http://www.eham.net/articles/30512)

What fueled your interest in becoming a forum cop?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 09, 2015, 11:25:03 AM
I don't think anyone here cares about your personal life and problems.  Narcissist maybe?

SWL, what was it that fueled your initial interest in amateur radio? correct me if i am wrong, but judging by your posts here the odds seem better that it was about some inner drive to some day make ascerbic posts on an amateur radio website than it was about any interest in using radio communication to foster goodwill amongst amateurs...  :-\


What fueled your interest in becoming a forum cop?

 ::)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 10, 2015, 03:29:09 AM
You should have expected a sarcastic answer when you ask a rhetorical question.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: VA3RTX on November 10, 2015, 11:15:44 AM
What's this thread about  ???

Any news about Ten Tec or Alpha  ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N8YX on November 10, 2015, 11:19:08 AM
What's this thread about  ???
About 33 hole(sic) pages as of this posting.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AC7CW on November 10, 2015, 12:44:43 PM
Are we there yet?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 10, 2015, 12:58:09 PM
Gee I was hoping the funeral committee would start preaching again. I don't think they repeated themselves often enough yet. Maybe another 20 pages or so.  :D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N4DOV on November 10, 2015, 08:48:04 PM
De mortuis nil nisi bonum
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 11, 2015, 03:31:51 AM
Gee I was hoping the funeral committee would start preaching again. I don't think they repeated themselves often enough yet. Maybe another 20 pages or so.  :D

Unlike yourself of course. Is that the pot I hear calling?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 11, 2015, 05:22:01 AM
Gee I was hoping the funeral committee would start preaching again. I don't think they repeated themselves often enough yet. Maybe another 20 pages or so.  :D

Unlike yourself of course. Is that the pot I hear calling?

Funny how you would say that. But then again I am not part of the funeral committee which is what was stated. Comprehension problem again? So if the shoe fits...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 11, 2015, 07:30:23 AM

Funny how you would say that. But then again I am not part of the funeral committee which is what was stated. Comprehension problem again? So if the shoe fits...

No, not at all. I comprehend most intelligent people very well. You on the other hands refer to people who express a concern about TenTec's future as a "funeral committee." Funeral implies dead. TenTec is not dead, but they have given their customers enough cause to be concerned as to their on-going viability. But that's been stated clearly many times by a number of people, but it seems you cannot comprehend those statements. Funny how you wonder why people repeat themselves.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 11, 2015, 10:34:34 AM

Funny how you would say that. But then again I am not part of the funeral committee which is what was stated. Comprehension problem again? So if the shoe fits...

No, not at all. I comprehend most intelligent people very well. You on the other hands refer to people who express a concern about TenTec's future as a "funeral committee." Funeral implies dead. TenTec is not dead, but they have given their customers enough cause to be concerned as to their on-going viability. But that's been stated clearly many times by a number of people, but it seems you cannot comprehend those statements. Funny how you wonder why people repeat themselves.

Hmmm interesting. So since you are not as you say part of the funeral committee, why did you need to respond to my sarcastic comment aimed at a couple posts prior to that which you did not author, or even resemble any particular author? And my comprehension is fine. Your right. Some are not part of the funeral committee. But on the other hand, there are plenty of posts from various people that did say TT is dead.

Again you did not comprehend what I said and somehow think you are being attacked. Maybe it is because you feel guilty for so many posts ridiculing people like me who support TT in what ever manner we see fit. That would be my guess anyway.

Try something new...let it go and stop trying to make an argument with me. But like before, you probably won't. You just need to keep going after me instead of just agreeing we disagree. Which is what I told you a long time ago. Can I make it any clearer?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on November 11, 2015, 11:30:44 AM
Ten Tec????
What about Alpha.  Seems like Acom and  OM Power are giving them a huge run for the money.  Also, don't forget about Emtron.
Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 12, 2015, 03:21:49 AM

Try something new...let it go and stop trying to make an argument with me. But like before, you probably won't. You just need to keep going after me instead of just agreeing we disagree. Which is what I told you a long time ago. Can I make it any clearer?


WOW... Everything you said can be applied to yourself.  Go look at yourself in the mirror.  You can't even take your own advice.  I guess that shows the actual value of your advice.   ::)



Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 12, 2015, 03:38:06 AM

Try something new...let it go and stop trying to make an argument with me. But like before, you probably won't. You just need to keep going after me instead of just agreeing we disagree. Which is what I told you a long time ago. Can I make it any clearer?


WOW... Everything you said can be applied to yourself.  Go look at yourself in the mirror.  You can't even take your own advice.  I guess that shows the actual value of your advice.   ::)


Ah yes, and it can also apply to you since now you are the agitator. Your a poor example of someone who has the right to accuse me of anything based on what is said above in this post.

As to taking my own advice, if agitators like you would leave me alone, you would not hear from me. So I repeat myself...agree we disagree and let it go. If you can. But I doubt it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 12, 2015, 04:52:36 AM

Try something new...let it go and stop trying to make an argument with me. But like before, you probably won't. You just need to keep going after me instead of just agreeing we disagree. Which is what I told you a long time ago. Can I make it any clearer?


WOW... Everything you said can be applied to yourself.  Go look at yourself in the mirror.  You can't even take your own advice.  I guess that shows the actual value of your advice.   ::)


Ah yes, and it can also apply to you since now you are the agitator. Your a poor example of someone who has the right to accuse me of anything based on what is said above in this post.

As to taking my own advice, if agitators like you would leave me alone, you would not hear from me. So I repeat myself...agree we disagree and let it go. If you can. But I doubt it.

How about practicing what you preach?  Let it go, you hypocrite.   :D  If you can...  But I doubt it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI0T on November 12, 2015, 07:45:00 AM
Have we hit Godwin's Law yet ?

 ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N0YXB on November 12, 2015, 07:51:19 AM
Have we hit Godwin's Law yet ?

 ;D

Nice! If we haven't surely we will, with 34 pages of comments and counting.   
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 12, 2015, 08:40:41 AM
Have we hit Godwin's Law yet ?

 ;D

No, but this on-going banter has been about as successful as the Nazis and Hitler in their conquest of Russia.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 12, 2015, 10:04:32 AM
KC4NOZ just sent me a note that he has been laid off by TenTec/RKR. The Deathwatch folks will be able to say "I told you so" while the Blind Cheerleaders will be able to say "happens with businesses all the time, doesn't really mean anything."
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N7BMW on November 12, 2015, 11:42:28 AM
This is reply number 500.  I had to post this congratulatory note.  499 posts of hams pissing on each other.  Job well done.  
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 12, 2015, 01:10:47 PM
Quote from: W9FIB
Try something new...let it go and stop trying to make an argument with me. But like before, you probably won't. You just need to keep going after me instead of just agreeing we disagree. Which is what I told you a long time ago. Can I make it any clearer?

Quote from: SWL2002
WOW... Everything you said can be applied to yourself.  Go look at yourself in the mirror.  You can't even take your own advice.  I guess that shows the actual value of your advice.   ::)

really???   how ironic that the above is from the same guy who asked the question below to me:

Quote from: SWL2002
What fueled your interest in becoming a forum cop?

SWL when u point your finger at someone else remember that 3 of your fingers are pointing at you  ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 12, 2015, 01:10:54 PM
This is reply number 500.  I had to post this congratulatory note.  499 posts of hams pissing on each other.  Job well done.  

Congratulations, please don't forget to wear your raincoat.

In other news, Ten Tec is still QRT.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 12, 2015, 01:11:13 PM
KC4NOZ just sent me a note that he has been laid off by TenTec/RKR. The Deathwatch folks will be able to say "I told you so" while the Blind Cheerleaders will be able to say "happens with businesses all the time, doesn't really mean anything."

could be a lull or it could foretell a move of the TT campus to CO to be close to Alpha and share labor, resources and maybe the Alpha name.  Course the TT funeral committee will then claim victory while those hoping TT will continue in some form will feel victorious & happy too.   A wait and see approach takes far too much patience though -- right?  ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 12, 2015, 02:20:29 PM
Quote from: W9FIB
Try something new...let it go and stop trying to make an argument with me. But like before, you probably won't. You just need to keep going after me instead of just agreeing we disagree. Which is what I told you a long time ago. Can I make it any clearer?

Quote from: SWL2002
WOW... Everything you said can be applied to yourself.  Go look at yourself in the mirror.  You can't even take your own advice.  I guess that shows the actual value of your advice.   ::)

really???   how ironic that the above is from the same guy who asked the question below to me:

Quote from: SWL2002
What fueled your interest in becoming a forum cop?

SWL when u point your finger at someone else remember that 3 of your fingers are pointing at you  ;)

Again, you have reading comprehension problems.  No where did I ask FIB to stop posting or responding to my posts.  I have not told anyone what they can post or not post, unlike you, who (ineffectively) plays a forum cop here.

You are also a hypocrite.  You are doing the exact same thing that you are accusing me of doing. 

And yeah, when you point your finger at someone else remember that 3 of your fingers are pointing at you.  You've got three of your stubby fingers pointed at YOUR face in this post.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 12, 2015, 03:10:07 PM
at least it's not my foot  ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on November 12, 2015, 03:18:43 PM
KC4NOZ just sent me a note that he has been laid off by TenTec/RKR. The Deathwatch folks will be able to say "I told you so" while the Blind Cheerleaders will be able to say "happens with businesses all the time, doesn't really mean anything."

could be a lull or it could foretell a move of the TT campus to CO to be close to Alpha and share labor, resources and maybe the Alpha name.  Course the TT funeral committee will then claim victory while those hoping TT will continue in some form will feel victorious & happy too.   A wait and see approach takes far too much patience though -- right?  ;)

You Seriously need to wake up and stop dreaming.   Can you point out to me one thing in the last 6 months that says Ten Tec or Alpha are even trying to make a come back?   You attack anyone whose assessment varies from yours and yet you have nothing to back up any of your own optimism.

I can imagine that if KC4NOZ had reported that Ten-Tec had just hired two new engineers you would be jumping up and down and saying see I told you so, you guys were dead wrong and I was right.  Have you noticed no one is jumping up and down about KC4NOZ being laid off and saying we are right and your wrong.  We are just sitting here watching and hoping for the best but we see no signs that to make us feel optimistic and your attempts to make lemonade with these limes is not working because not even RKR is backing you.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KK5DR on November 12, 2015, 05:09:28 PM
Try not to hang so much sentiment on radio gear. It's just a complex machine. It has no soul, no awareness. The atoms inside don't know what type matter they are.
Too many, place far too high an emotional value on gear.
It's just stuff. We all have our favorites. I just don't marry a piece of gear.
Everybody needs to have a tall warm glass of calm the hell down.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N8YX on November 12, 2015, 06:12:35 PM
...
Everybody needs to have a tall warm glass of calm the hell down.
The problem is...our favorite brewery just might have shuttered its doors without so much as a going-away nod, and most other places are simply "crafting" swill.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 12, 2015, 07:29:25 PM
Quote from: W9KEY
could be a lull or it could foretell a move of the TT campus to CO to be close to Alpha and share labor, resources and maybe the Alpha name.  Course the TT funeral committee will then claim victory while those hoping TT will continue in some form will feel victorious & happy too.   A wait and see approach takes far too much patience though -- right?  ;)

Quote from: KD8MJR
You Seriously need to wake up and stop dreaming.   Can you point out to me one thing in the last 6 months that says Ten Tec or Alpha are even trying to make a come back?   You attack anyone whose assessment varies from yours and yet you have nothing to back up any of your own optimism.

Since I have no direct relationship with RKR/Ten-Tec/ or Alpha -- I am simply being open to what might be going on.  RKR has owned TT for only 6 months and it was already in flux when they bought it.  Could spell trouble, or a revamp -- until there is definitive proof they are dead and not just transforming it is premature to send out funeral arrangements -- is it not?   The only thing I have attacked is speculative doomsday predictions here disguised as facts -- and i have offered alternative possibilities to try and balance them out a little in the absence of any official info.  I have never claimed to see the writing on the wall one way or the other.   

Quote from: KD8MJR
I can imagine that if KC4NOZ had reported that Ten-Tec had just hired two new engineers you would be jumping up and down and saying see I told you so, you guys were dead wrong and I was right.  Have you noticed no one is jumping up and down about KC4NOZ being laid off and saying we are right and your wrong.  We are just sitting here watching and hoping for the best but we see no signs that to make us feel optimistic and your attempts to make lemonade with these limes is not working because not even RKR is backing you.

You can imagine anything you want. I am not here to say "i told u so" to anyone, the facts as they unfold do that without assistance anyway.   afaik, the engineer TT let go was not a FT employee but was on contract and found a FT position that had more breath of work and so he moved on.  Could it mean TT is going away?  sure, but it might not mean that at all.   my guess has been that they would move most of the TT operation to CO because two campuses make less sense to me than one.   Can you point to anything that suggests Alpha is going bye-bye?   If so it will give the funeral committee more cred, but until we hear something definitive, both hope and doom are open to question.  only thing here so far in response to my opening of this thread have been guesses as to the future of RKR & TT -- we can agree on that much, right ???
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 12, 2015, 07:35:54 PM

You Seriously need to wake up and stop dreaming.


What's wrong with dreaming?

Seems to me it isn't any worse then speculating their death.

Everyone has their opinion. Just some don't match. Why is that such a bad thing?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 13, 2015, 08:46:24 AM
Try not to hang so much sentiment on radio gear. It's just a complex machine. It has no soul, no awareness. The atoms inside don't know what type matter they are.
Too many, place far too high an emotional value on gear.
It's just stuff. We all have our favorites. I just don't marry a piece of gear.
Everybody needs to have a tall warm glass of calm the hell down.

You pretty much hit the nail on the head because like you said in the end it's just radio equipment and not a religion.  I am sad to see any American business go under, I'm a big fan of made in America no matter what the product is.  The folks at RKR have been QRT since they took over and it seems like they had planned on liquidating all along.  The one thing that makes me think that more than any other factor is that they did not purchase the metal fabricating assets of the company that would enable them to build radio enclosures.  Outsourcing enclosures is not profitable.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: VE3YF on November 13, 2015, 09:25:23 AM
Try not to hang so much sentiment on radio gear. It's just a complex machine. It has no soul, no awareness. The atoms inside don't know what type matter they are.
Too many, place far too high an emotional value on gear.
It's just stuff. We all have our favorites. I just don't marry a piece of gear.
Everybody needs to have a tall warm glass of calm the hell down.

You pretty much hit the nail on the head because like you said in the end it's just radio equipment and not a religion.  I am sad to see any American business go under, I'm a big fan of made in America no matter what the product is.  The folks at RKR have been QRT since they took over and it seems like they had planned on liquidating all along.  The one thing that makes me think that more than any other factor is that they did not purchase the metal fabricating assets of the company that would enable them to build radio enclosures.  Outsourcing enclosures is not profitable.

John:

I don't quite understand your comment. I recently had my amp in for repair and it came back working 100% and that was done while under the RKR Designs Logo. I have also ordered some spare parts for my other amp under the RKR Designs logo.

A friend just contacted them last week about buying a 8410.

I don't know where you are getting your info from, and nothing of what you speak of is on their website or on their answering machine.

73 DE Mike
VE3YF
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 13, 2015, 09:46:17 AM
They do have parts in inventory for Alpha products and still have Tubes as well.  They also will service late model Alpha amps provided they have the parts to repair them. 

The Ten Tec side of the house is another story.  They will service some late model Ten Tec radios but they don't have any replacement parts inventory for the radios, only the amps.  The warranty only covers equipment purchased after July 1st 2014 and is limited in some cases and they do not advertise that they will service any Ten Tec radio equipment purchased before that date.

They, Ten Tec,  used to have legendary customer service and support before the buyout by RF Concepts.  As for Alpha, I think once the supply of amplifiers is exhausted they may not be building any more since they no longer have any chassis or enclosure fabrication capability.

Someone also stated that they just laid off one of their long time employees.  A company that is financially solid and is building radios very rarely does that.  It looks like they are getting out of ham radio, there are just too many clues in the tea leaves to think otherwise.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: VE3YF on November 13, 2015, 10:28:21 AM
They do have parts in inventory for Alpha products and still have Tubes as well.  They also will service late model Alpha amps provided they have the parts to repair them. 

The Ten Tec side of the house is another story.  They will service some late model Ten Tec radios but they don't have any replacement parts inventory for the radios, only the amps.  The warranty only covers equipment purchased after July 1st 2014 and is limited in some cases and they do not advertise that they will service any Ten Tec radio equipment purchased before that date.

They, Ten Tec,  used to have legendary customer service and support before the buyout by RF Concepts.  As for Alpha, I think once the supply of amplifiers is exhausted they may not be building any more since they no longer have any chassis or enclosure fabrication capability.

Someone also stated that they just laid off one of their long time employees.  A company that is financially solid and is building radios very rarely does that.  It looks like they are getting out of ham radio, there are just too many clues in the tea leaves to think otherwise.


Actually and I could be mistaken, but I thought RF Concepts (Alpha) had all their cabinetry made by RKR Designs for quite some time. However as you said too many clues in the tea leaves might be true, seen nothing to date. I sure hope not as I would hate
to see Alpha and Ten Tec go by the wayside.

73 De Mike
VE3YF
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 13, 2015, 11:00:38 AM
I noticed today on the TenTec/RKR website that they are now only offering the 80 meter version of the QRP kit radio. Looks like the end of the T*Kit line of QRP transceivers.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI0T on November 13, 2015, 11:08:35 AM
I noticed today on the TenTec/RKR website that they are now only offering the 80 meter version of the QRP kit radio. Looks like the end of the T*Kit line of QRP transceivers.

Life's too short for QRP anyway....

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 13, 2015, 11:16:31 AM
WI0T, you are probably correct  ;) and I guess with all the better QRP kits out there now, the TenTec kits were dying a natural death anyway. My TenTec T*Kit QRP radios were so microphonic, I never liked them.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 13, 2015, 11:59:56 AM
Life's too short for QRP anyway....

don't know about ^all that^... if we look at the example of WA2TPU, one could say life is too long for QRO  ;)

Quote from: http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,97729.0.html

[WA2TPU] has achieved DXCC (over 100 countries worked) on every ham band from 160-6 meters, excluding 60 meters, running 5 watts or less for all QSOs. He used a mix of modes, and 100% natural power (off the grid, in other words). He used a variety of transceivers.

Don was issued the only 10-band QRP DXCC certificate in the history of QRP ARCI on April 4th, 2014. (In fact he was also issued the only 8- and 9-band QRP DXCC certificates a couple of months earlier. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on November 13, 2015, 12:42:49 PM
starting to look like my old guess of "transfer in lieu of payment" could be the fact.  fits all the data.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI0T on November 13, 2015, 01:10:26 PM
Life's too short for QRP anyway....

don't know about ^all that^... if we look at the example of WA2TPU, one could say life is too long for QRO  ;)

Quote from: http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,97729.0.html

[WA2TPU] has achieved DXCC (over 100 countries worked) on every ham band from 160-6 meters, excluding 60 meters, running 5 watts or less for all QSOs. He used a mix of modes, and 100% natural power (off the grid, in other words). He used a variety of transceivers.

Don was issued the only 10-band QRP DXCC certificate in the history of QRP ARCI on April 4th, 2014. (In fact he was also issued the only 8- and 9-band QRP DXCC certificates a couple of months earlier. 


Or we could say he has time to do that.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 13, 2015, 01:21:06 PM
starting to look like my old guess of "transfer in lieu of payment" could be the fact.  fits all the data.

You know that would make sense and may explain the two transfers in relatively short time frame, lack of product, etc.

Here it is, do what you want, but I'm out of here mentality. Latest owner then sells out the inventory and makes a few bucks, and when it is all gone, announces they are no longer in amateur business. Original TT owners probably made their money on just the sale of the land and building.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 13, 2015, 01:28:05 PM

Or we could say he has time to do that.


You mean you have to work for a living and don't have the time to spend with a TenTec QRP radio working the world for awards all day?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI0T on November 13, 2015, 01:29:10 PM

Or we could say he has time to do that.


You mean you have to work for a living and don't have the time to spend with a TenTec QRP radio working the world for awards all day?

Yes, I have to support the modern welfare state comrade...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 13, 2015, 03:15:48 PM
Quote from: WI0T
Or we could say he has time to do that.

sure, the cup is half empty camp might frame it that way.  it is kind of funny that the people saying that life is too short for QRP have time to add to this 500+ post thread which has been view 54,000 times and counting even though so far it is all mere speculation about the future of RKR, Alpha, and TT  ;)

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI0T on November 13, 2015, 05:51:22 PM
Quote from: WI0T
Or we could say he has time to do that.

sure, the cup is half empty camp might frame it that way.  it is kind of funny that the people saying that life is too short for QRP have time to add to this 500+ post thread which has been view 54,000 times and counting even though so far it is all mere speculation about the future of RKR, Alpha, and TT  ;)

Says the guy who has posted 1,500 times, whereas this is my 10'th post...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AC7CW on November 13, 2015, 06:17:54 PM
If it wasn't for this stupid thread I'd never have heard of RKR... is this a ploy by them to get name recognition?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 13, 2015, 07:01:47 PM
Quote from: W9KEY
it is kind of funny that the people saying that life is too short for QRP have time to add to this 500+ post thread which has been view 54,000 times and counting even though so far it is all mere speculation about the future of RKR, Alpha, and TT  ;)

Quote from: WI0T
Says the guy who has posted 1,500 times, whereas this is my 10'th post...

well i am not the one saying life is too short for ___. 
besides --I started this thread.  it's my baby :)  thanks for choosing this thread to give 50% of your posts to :)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W2NAP on November 13, 2015, 11:10:00 PM
Have we hit Godwin's Law yet ?

 ;D

its Hitlers fault
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 14, 2015, 03:15:04 AM

sure, the cup is half empty camp might frame it that way.  it is kind of funny that the people saying that life is too short for QRP have time to add to this 500+ post thread which has been view 54,000 times and counting even though so far it is all mere speculation about the future of RKR, Alpha, and TT  ;)



It takes a lot less time to type that response than it does to send a single CQ on CW with QRP power. So yes, he has the time.

As for "speculation" on TenTec, as the old saying goes, "where there is smoke, there is fire." Not to say that TenTec is burnt rubble yet, but there appears to be a fire. Question is, can they put it out, save what's left, and rebuild? One thing is not speculation. You can see it on their website, you can read the postings of people who order product and are still waiting. Their inventory of sellable products is declining. That's not speculation, it is a fact.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on November 14, 2015, 06:21:30 AM
Been a lot debate but I do not think current owners ever had any intention of keeping TecTec viable. They planned to milk it dry for every last dollar from assists. And if they actually openly stated they were going out of business the value of remaining assets would be less so they say nothing. Past Owners of TenTec and key personal bailed out because they knew it was dying.


 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on November 14, 2015, 08:47:32 AM
Been a lot debate but I do not think current owners ever had any intention of keeping TecTec viable. They planned to milk it dry for every last dollar from assists. And if they actually openly stated they were going out of business the value of remaining assets would be less so they say nothing. Past Owners of TenTec and key personal bailed out because they knew it was dying.
 


Hi,

Exactly correct.

Let us just SUPPOSE, there are three owners of a HYPOTHETICAL company.  One who recently bailed out as he felt he was losing to much money on his investment, and the two remaining owners were actively trying to sell the few remaining assets.  Do you really think that company would make that information known to the public and its remaining customers....... just saying ;D

73,

John
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 14, 2015, 10:56:15 AM
Just as I can SUPPOSE they took over a troubled business because they could pick up the rights to the intellectual properties cheap and are working up a new plan to utilize them in a profitable manner. And they don't have to announce them to the public either until things are ready and a workable plan in place.

And if the company was so unprofitable, wouldn't a top to bottom reorganization be prudent to make it profitable?

Also come to think of it, the company that became RKR may already be profitable, and they don't have to rush a reorganization and a rush back to the market. It all depends on return from investment.

I highly doubt that they are such poor investors that they would make an investment without future profitability being taken into account.

But unless you are part owner of the LLC, you have no idea what they are doing nor do I. I just believe there are still possibilities and stay positive until a true plan from the LLC owners becomes public. Like I said many times, we just have to wait and see.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 14, 2015, 12:26:58 PM
Been a lot debate but I do not think current owners ever had any intention of keeping TecTec viable. They planned to milk it dry for every last dollar from assists. And if they actually openly stated they were going out of business the value of remaining assets would be less so they say nothing. Past Owners of TenTec and key personal bailed out because they knew it was dying.
 


Hi,

Exactly correct.

Let us just SUPPOSE, there are three owners of a HYPOTHETICAL company.  One who recently bailed out as he felt he was losing to much money on his investment, and the two remaining owners were actively trying to sell the few remaining assets.  Do you really think that company would make that information known to the public and its remaining customers....... just saying ;D

73,

John

I have to agree also, they have not said a word about products since taking over the company.  Anyone who calls gets the same answer, "we are building receivers".  Like what?  TRF's for Heathkit?  There's a winner. 

Nope, the writing is on the wall and Ten Tec radios are about to become collectable like Hallicrafters.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N8YX on November 14, 2015, 02:01:07 PM
...Anyone who calls gets the same answer, "we are building receivers".  Like what?  TRF's for Heathkit?  There's a winner. 
Don't be hatin', yo. Those "aren't your grandfather's...".
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on November 14, 2015, 06:29:26 PM
Just as I can SUPPOSE they took over a troubled business because they could pick up the rights to the intellectual properties cheap and are working up a new plan to utilize them in a profitable manner. And they don't have to announce them to the public either until things are ready and a workable plan in place.

You are dreaming.... Even if was remotely true they would keep production going and interest in product and not let it slowly die in silence and put more nails in coffin. They are bleeding assists to bitter end.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 14, 2015, 06:38:53 PM
Are you talking about Alpha and TT or just one of the two?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0BKR on November 14, 2015, 08:48:16 PM
Odd they just don't come out and tell people their real intentions....I have seen companies change hands before, but this has been dragging on for some time now with no real public announcement(s)....wierd....

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on November 15, 2015, 01:48:50 AM

Just as I can SUPPOSE they took over a troubled business because they could pick up the rights to the intellectual properties cheap and are working up a new plan to utilize them in a profitable manner. And they don't have to announce them to the public either until things are ready and a workable plan in place.

So let me get this straight. TenTec was holding on to some patented advance engineering designs that are worth a whole lot of money in a new radio design but at the same time they seriously lagged their competitors designs and kept the good stuff in the closet until they literally went bankrupt!  Then they sell the high tech goodies to RKR who sits on these bombshell designs for another year while everyone else is producing more and more advanced radios.
Yep sounds like a solid business plan in looney vill.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W4PC on November 15, 2015, 04:33:29 AM
some info from a business source:

$10,000 and it can be yours

An investor making a loan for $350,000 would get things on a new track

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 15, 2015, 04:51:37 AM

Just as I can SUPPOSE they took over a troubled business because they could pick up the rights to the intellectual properties cheap and are working up a new plan to utilize them in a profitable manner. And they don't have to announce them to the public either until things are ready and a workable plan in place.

So let me get this straight. TenTec was holding on to some patented advance engineering designs that are worth a whole lot of money in a new radio design but at the same time they seriously lagged their competitors designs and kept the good stuff in the closet until they literally went bankrupt!  Then they sell the high tech goodies to RKR who sits on these bombshell designs for another year while everyone else is producing more and more advanced radios.
Yep sounds like a solid business plan in looney vill.


Like I said, when you become a board member of RKR, LLC then you can question them. Until then it is strictly your opinion just as mine is my opinion. As I stated in the part you didn't quote.

And I used the word SUPPOSE which makes this a hypothetical to offset a previous SUPPOSE.

Anybody can SUPPOSE anything. Does not make it true or false. It just is there as an alternative theory. And I know many don't like it, but it is what it is. Just as true or false as anything else.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 15, 2015, 06:16:10 AM
Stanley, for cripes sakes, stop accusing people of repeating themselves, then you go on repeating yourself and then actually admit it in your post. Just stop.

Rick's posting is very interesting. For those who want new information, well there you go. Rick is one of the owners of HRD and has John Henry now working with him. I believe Rick is giving you a big inside clue as to what is going on at TenTec.

I find it interesting that no one is willing to invest $350K to keep them a viable concern. But you can buy what's left for $10K? Seriously? That's how bad it is?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3DBB on November 15, 2015, 07:18:39 AM
some info from a business source:

$10,000 and it can be yours

An investor making a loan for $350,000 would get things on a new track


Yes.

Private equity houses buy out the owners/stockholders of company to delist it from the stock exchange. This ostensibly allows the private equity owner to make changes to the business without being punished by a low stock price. What really happens is the PE owner breaks the distressed company into pieces, selling off the good stuff (AlphaPower's medical business, Ten-Tec's metal fabrication business), loading up the vestigial remains with debt, reaping windfalls from government grants & tax advantages, and then selling the original companies.

What's left are 'living dead' companies like Sears Holdings, Staples, and ChryslerCerberus LLC (now FiatChrysler America).

The former private equity owner of Alpha and Ten Tec probably owed RKR for circuit boards and this was an easy way to "shuck the losers" as they say on Wall Street. Both of these amateur radio equipment manufacturers required profitmaking ancillary businesses to remain viable. That is now over.

The real value is in the brands "Alpha" and "Ten Tec". Both manufactured outstanding equipment in their time. These names have lives of their own. It will be interesting to see future Alpha and Ten Tec gear. It will also be interesting to take note of the manufacturer, where it is made, and what the quality is.

We now return to your regularly scheduled 'Moors versus Moops' debate.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0BKR on November 15, 2015, 08:46:23 AM
If RKR would state they are in talks with a potential buyer, I would feel somewhat more comfortable saying TT may be coming back, if not, under a new name...but for 6-8 months nothing...doesn't look too promising....hoping I am wrong...good products and now, good luck on support..no one I know will repair one anywhere...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 15, 2015, 10:17:47 AM
Based on W4PC's post I would guess you might be able to swing a pretty good deal on an remaining Eagle transceiver or Alpha amp right now.  If they don't get funded they are not going to want to hold the bag on that stuff anyway.  The biggest problem I see with late model Ten Tec stuff is not being able to get repair parts.  There are enough of the older rigs say before 2005 that you can probably find a parts mule on the internet. 

All of the 1980's and early 90's rigs used discreet components or chips that you can still buy today so they are a lot easier to keep running.  I still think the Omni VI+ was one of the best analog radio ever made for a lot of reasons.  The Omni VI+ was and still is a fantastic CW rig with the full complement of filters.

Guess I'll have to collect one now and hope I can find parts for it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on November 15, 2015, 11:03:58 AM
It's actually kind of amusing watching W9FIB and his friends come up with all sorts of posts to make lemonade out of limes when others in here already know certain facts but have been keeping quiet for legal reasons.  Normally It would be cruel but everyone in the know has been trying to let them realize it on their own but they are just too stubborn to listen.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 15, 2015, 06:41:05 PM
LOL you all just love to run down ANY other possibility. That's fine. I have big shoulders. And if I ultimately am proven wrong (which has yet to happen except in some peoples minds) that's fine too. I have big shoulders for that too.

If you all don't like what I say, why not just ignore me and my opinion? It is rather simple thing to do here. Anyone need instructions?

And by the way NUT, have you counted how many posts say that TT is dead since my comment about 20 pages still need to be added? My humorous prediction that the funeral committee restate their death sentence was not so far from the mark. Added pages are piling up. LOL

What I find amusing are all the people who feel the need to object so loudly and strongly. But if you find humor in the hopeful, that's fine too. I know I am having fun with this. Isn't that what ham radio is about...having fun?  :D

Too stubborn to listen? I have been listening and offering alternatives to the very limited credible (not I heard someone {not identified} said) news that is leaking out every so often. As for not being made public for legal reasons, that is absolutely right. Which is why you need to be a board member of RKR to really know what's really going on. Time will tell.

Maybe the stubborn ones are those that can't keep an open mind to alternatives like I am trying to do. Ah well, such is life. Always have the stubborn ones too.  :)

BTW I don't make lemonade at all. Now fresh OJ is a different story. And throw in the odd grapefruit once in a while. Oh wait, that was supposed to be a cut. LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 15, 2015, 08:23:02 PM
As with a lot of things, only partial information has been mentioned in this forum, and being partial it is very misleading and leads to a lot of rumors and untruths.

TEN-TEC is not dead.
An announcement was made in another forum.
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ten_tec_radio_net/conversations/messages/7044

If the link does not work, it is in the yahoo group ten_tec_radio_net.
message 7044.

Extracting part of it for those of you who avoid yahoo. But, the gist is the same, TT is being sold again, and this time, hopefully, the new owner can make a difference where the previous two failed.
===================================
I have spoken to the future owner of TEN-TEC tonight and I have the ok and privilege to share this with you.

I will not give out or discuss any information, only the facts that I have been given by the future owner

who wishes to remain anonymous until the deal process is completed.

THIS IS VERY GOOD NEWS for the TEN_TEC Family and Amatuer Radio.

I agree with everything that the future owner has spoken with me about.

Nobody else stepped up to save TEN-TEC and investment is still needed.

The Omni 7 will proceed in production in Feb. 2016 or sometime shortly afterwards.

The future new owner is a person that is open minded, knows the importance the TEN_TEC Nets,

can run the company, and most of all communicate with US.

I will not talk about any plans on or off the air because it is not the right thing to due as the new owner

works thru getting the TEN-TEC Train back on the tracks.

===================================


So, there ya have it, this was posted by a good friend of mine, Lloyd Price, N2KPC.
There is more in his message in the yahoo group I mentioned above

All I ask, give the new owner some time to figure out how he is really going to make this work.
It can be done, just needs the right management and focus on finishing products with quality rather than the focusing on getting inordinate amounts of units shipped and the other "stuff" we were focusing on before for the last, well, since Jack retired.

It will take time. Once a few things are settled, there will be announcements from the new owner directly.
In fact, there will be progress made immediately after the new owner becomes public. Updates ready that were held back until now.

As with everything, there will be change, and since it is change there will be rumors and controversy, just keep the rumors to a minimum and let the new man do his job. He is going to have to make decisions, that some will question, well, sometimes the hardest thing about this whole business is that everyone is an expert on someone else's business, and they know only 3 of the 50 real facts, and then condemn, which hurts chances of success.
So, what do I ask? Just give it time, let it grow and let it build.

Thanks,
73, KI4JPL
John Henry

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 15, 2015, 08:25:59 PM
You will not get a statement like this from RKR.
The current owners, R and the R, are not amateur radio savvy and do not know the business, hence, the reason they are selling to an amateur radio savvy individual who is a ham and knows the market.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry


If RKR would state they are in talks with a potential buyer, I would feel somewhat more comfortable saying TT may be coming back, if not, under a new name...but for 6-8 months nothing...doesn't look too promising....hoping I am wrong...good products and now, good luck on support..no one I know will repair one anywhere...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 15, 2015, 08:28:47 PM
The $10k is not actually correct, it was but one of several numbers that make up the whole story, remember my other post, if you know 3 of the 50 facts, then that leaves 47 very important facts out, so let's stop jumping down a rabbit hole.

The numbers aren't important, what is important is that someone is taking over the reigns, and has a better likelihood of success given his success in the past. Compared to the others.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry



Stanley, for cripes sakes, stop accusing people of repeating themselves, then you go on repeating yourself and then actually admit it in your post. Just stop.

Rick's posting is very interesting. For those who want new information, well there you go. Rick is one of the owners of HRD and has John Henry now working with him. I believe Rick is giving you a big inside clue as to what is going on at TenTec.

I find it interesting that no one is willing to invest $350K to keep them a viable concern. But you can buy what's left for $10K? Seriously? That's how bad it is?

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on November 15, 2015, 08:45:39 PM
A new mystery owner, well lets see what happens with that.  I knew TT was Dead under RKR, so if someone is going to spend $350K for TenTec and then spend more money retooling and setting back up the company, it sounds like he deserves a bit of time to get things going. (BTW it would be ironic if it's MFJ)
Best of luck to him.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 16, 2015, 03:07:03 AM

TEN-TEC is not dead.


Thank you John. That is certainly good news!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 16, 2015, 03:19:47 AM
Well I am glad someone is going to come in and rescue TenTec. However, the key point here that thinking people knew and voiced is that TenTec is clearly in trouble. Had someone not come in to save it, it would eventually die and soon. A small minority here referred to thinking people as the "funeral committee."

I believe it is better to refer to us as the paramedics. Quite possibly our diagnosis of the patient awakened some doctor out there to come to the aid of this patient to render life support. Clearly the patient was dying. Now we have someone out there who can bring the near death patient back to life.

Unfortunately, when TenTec could not deliver an Eagle last year after ordering it, I purchased another radio. Not in the market right now. Would have purchased the new Argo, but it's missing HF bands and 6 meters. Right now I have the Rebel and Patriot to play with, so not in the market.

However a friend who has been out of ham radio for quite a while approached me at church a week ago and said he was interested in getting back into ham radio with an Eagle. Hope he orders it soon and hope they have it in stock.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 16, 2015, 03:22:31 AM
A new mystery owner, well lets see what happens with that.  I knew TT was Dead under RKR, so if someone is going to spend $350K for TenTec and then spend more money retooling and setting back up the company, it sounds like he deserves a bit of time to get things going. (BTW it would be ironic if it's MFJ)
Best of luck to him.


It is NOT MFJ.  That would be a tragedy.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 16, 2015, 03:42:43 AM
Quote from: SWL2002

To keep on subject, Ten Tec and Alpha will not last another year unless someone buys them from RKR.  They are in big trouble.  Just wait and you'll see.


Sounds familiar...  so much for the "theories" that RKR were secretly planning new products...  The owners are not even Hams! I hate to say I told you so...  ;D

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JAS on November 16, 2015, 03:54:06 AM
FIB, I have been reading all these posts with interest. Might I suggest you end the use of LOL in your responses. Nothing in any of your posts is funny.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 16, 2015, 04:01:45 AM
I wonder where this will leave Alpha?  I hear that the "K" in RKR has been ousted (he was CEO) only leaving R*R.  Is the new owner of Ten Tec going to also save Alpha?  Hopefully we will get some good news about Alpha too.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 16, 2015, 04:37:53 AM
Don't know. Not a lot of details on who is the angel and what are the going to actually save beyond TenTec. Sounds like an announcement will be coming soon, I assume after the paperwork is signed.

I also hope the angel investor has some deep pockets to invest in new product development. While the Eagle is a very good radio, it continues to fall behind and there needs to be some innovation. I just hope an engineer to two are still employed to get R&D back on track soon.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on November 16, 2015, 06:01:53 AM
You will not get a statement like this from RKR.
The current owners, R and the R, are not amateur radio savvy and do not know the business, hence, the reason they are selling to an amateur radio savvy individual who is a ham and knows the market.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
This is all great news John.

I'm glad you got permission to pass this on, and I've already sent Lloyd a note thanking him for the information as well.

Many of us who believed in the company -- well, at least in the company as we knew it before all of the ownership changes started -- have had a tough time, wondering what the blazes was going on.  I'd be lying if I said I wasn't concerned... but I didn't want to speculate on rumors and on what I DIDN'T know, and the actual facts were scarce.

Take care, and keep us posted as often as you can.

73
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 16, 2015, 06:22:05 AM
FIB, I have been reading all these posts with interest. Might I suggest you end the use of LOL in your responses. Nothing in any of your posts is funny.

Awww that's to bad. I find it hilarious. LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 16, 2015, 06:46:35 AM
I would be lying myself if I said I was not anxious or nervous about all of this.
I want TEN-TEC to succeed, and there have been what I thought at the time valid chances of making it a success.
But, in the end, you see where I am at now, not at TEN-TEC. (well, it isn't just TT, there were other reasons for my change that I won't go into)
I will help the new owner where I can, and contract some software changes in the evening.
He does have someone else that can do what I did also, so, losing me is not painful to him as it was to RKR.
And in my opinion, I am ok to help with existing, and the other person is much better to work on what the new owner has planned.

And, regarding Alpha, yes, it includes Alpha. But there will be more disclosed at a later date when things really get finalized, direction settled, etc. He will disclose what he can rightfully disclose to help y'all understand where he is, where he is going, etc.

Now, people have to realize that this is one man looking at what he needs to do and to keep to keep two floundering/failing companies going. It ain't gonna be purtie for a while, but, he will do what he has to do to keep the company going. There are things I would do differently, then then that is again the guy that I am who knows 40 of the 50 facts, whereas the new owner knows all.

But you won't see me bad mouthing him, nor his decisions, I may not agree with him, but, it is now his boat to float, and if he can make it, that is all that matters. I believe he will.

Just give him time.
I don't know when he will go public, could be next month, could be next year, just give him time.

Thanks,
73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K5WLR on November 16, 2015, 06:58:09 AM
Here are my hopes and prayers for a successful rebirth for Alpha and Ten-Tec. Let's give them a chance, fellow hams!  :D

Will Rogers
K5WLR
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 16, 2015, 07:40:06 AM
As with a lot of things, only partial information has been mentioned in this forum, and being partial it is very misleading and leads to a lot of rumors and untruths.

TEN-TEC is not dead.
An announcement was made in another forum.
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ten_tec_radio_net/conversations/messages/7044

If the link does not work, it is in the yahoo group ten_tec_radio_net.
message 7044.

Extracting part of it for those of you who avoid yahoo. But, the gist is the same, TT is being sold again, and this time, hopefully, the new owner can make a difference where the previous two failed.
===================================
I have spoken to the future owner of TEN-TEC tonight and I have the ok and privilege to share this with you.

I will not give out or discuss any information, only the facts that I have been given by the future owner

who wishes to remain anonymous until the deal process is completed.

THIS IS VERY GOOD NEWS for the TEN_TEC Family and Amatuer Radio.

I agree with everything that the future owner has spoken with me about.

Nobody else stepped up to save TEN-TEC and investment is still needed.

The Omni 7 will proceed in production in Feb. 2016 or sometime shortly afterwards.

The future new owner is a person that is open minded, knows the importance the TEN_TEC Nets,

can run the company, and most of all communicate with US.

I will not talk about any plans on or off the air because it is not the right thing to due as the new owner

works thru getting the TEN-TEC Train back on the tracks.

===================================


So, there ya have it, this was posted by a good friend of mine, Lloyd Price, N2KPC.
There is more in his message in the yahoo group I mentioned above

All I ask, give the new owner some time to figure out how he is really going to make this work.
It can be done, just needs the right management and focus on finishing products with quality rather than the focusing on getting inordinate amounts of units shipped and the other "stuff" we were focusing on before for the last, well, since Jack retired.

It will take time. Once a few things are settled, there will be announcements from the new owner directly.
In fact, there will be progress made immediately after the new owner becomes public. Updates ready that were held back until now.

As with everything, there will be change, and since it is change there will be rumors and controversy, just keep the rumors to a minimum and let the new man do his job. He is going to have to make decisions, that some will question, well, sometimes the hardest thing about this whole business is that everyone is an expert on someone else's business, and they know only 3 of the 50 real facts, and then condemn, which hurts chances of success.
So, what do I ask? Just give it time, let it grow and let it build.

Thanks,
73, KI4JPL
John Henry



Thank you for posting that, it does shed some light on an interesting story.  One thing N2KPC said in his post,  "The future new owner is a person that is open minded, knows the importance the TEN_TEC Nets".

I understand that to the many loyal Ten Tec equipment aficionados that particular net is very important it is however, not a very sound reason to invest a large amount of money to resurrect a small company that is in disarray.  It is interesting that the new owner wished to remain anonymous yet will communicate with the Ten Tec net, that will be a neat trick.

As for the Omni VII, it was a really nice rig when it was introduced and hopefully there is still enough demand for it to make it profitable or at least to sell the remaining chassis and move on.

I wish the new owner well and I hope we don't see another American business disappear, that has happened too many times over the years.  So this is their chance. lets hope they make it. 


Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on November 16, 2015, 08:28:49 AM
I wouldn't read too much into N2KPC's statement with regards to the Ten Tec nets.

Consider that the post was originally made to the reflector specifically FOR & ABOUT the Ten Tec nets, this might be nothing beyond some re-assurance to the net participants to keep them from abandoning hope.

Now, WRT the prospective new owner... enough has been revealed (and thanks again John!) to indicate that not all of the t's are dotted nor are all of the i's crossed.  So until the deal is finalized, let's leave him be (directly and indirectly) and let him concentrate on closing the deal.

I don't know who it is... I have my suspicions, but no hard information... but I'm sure the last thing he (or she) needs is to start getting side comments on how to run or otherwise about a company not yet in his control. 

I'm just glad that a deal is more-or-less in place.  I did not and do not want to see Ten-Tec go the way of so many other companies that no longer exist, or exist only as a brand name for marketing purposes.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JAS on November 16, 2015, 08:33:00 AM

Awww that's to bad. I find it hilarious. LOL

Yes it is TOO bad. Simple minded people are easily amused. Seems to explain quite a bit.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 16, 2015, 08:36:11 AM
A comment on the nets:
You are right, that net in itself is not a reason to spend a lot of money to save a company.
But it does help the new owner knowing that that net is there as a means to do PR work in the future.
I think there are 9 nets, various bands, SB or CW, various days of the week, various times. The nets are streamed on the internet so those that are remote and can't check in can still listen in.
I myself listen in using a websdr.

So, anywhere there is the amateur community market listening in, well, there is the potential for very good PR for free. That is another one of my takes on it. again, JMHO.
The net does do a great service to the community, I've heard discussions on "how does this work?", "adjust your speech processor to x to get better tx", etc. all in the vain of helping others. To me, another one of my takes on it, again, JMHO.
Anyone can check in, don't have to check in with TEN-TEC only, it is open to all.

John K3UR established this set of nets with Jim Wharton's (NO4A, ex VP then President of TT) help a few years ago. Later they initiated a certificate program where Jim would sign certificates for hams that had reached x number of check ins. Nice little certificates to have.

It is also run by hams who do help TEN-TEC by being ambassadors of good will, helping make sales by loaning out their rigs to others to use, and in the case of Lloyd, he would even take orders for TEN-TEC.

Me, I'll help where I can.
You all here?
Well, just give them time, and listen to what the new owner has to say. He is looking at all kinds of options to kick start the company back to first repeat ability, break even, and then eventually back to profitability.

He has to figure out what products to continue to make, which ones to put in what order in production, order parts, figure out what new products to make, where to spend R&D, etc. A LOT of things to work through.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 16, 2015, 08:45:55 AM
One more regarding the nets.
I'm copying the "about" section below.
It can be found in the yahoo groups ten_tec_radio_net

===================================
Group Description

The TEN-TEC Amateur Radio Net Group is open to all Amateur Radio Operators Worldwide. Callsigns and full names are required for membership.

This Group is not controlled by any radio company, so you can discuss and ask questions about any Amateur Radio product.

Everyone checking into the nets is important and special to us. Everyone is treated with respect, for we are Ambassadors for Amateur Radio.

Membership entitles you to post ATTACHMENTS, FILES, PHOTOS and to post any Amateur Radio gear that you may want to buy or sell.

Membership is open to ALL members of other TEN-TEC Groups. Everyone is welcome to check in with any brand of radio.

Here are the 9 weekly TEN-TEC Amateur Radio Nets in the order in which they begin:

The 20 meter SSB net starts each Friday at 2PM Eastern on 14.325.
Bill AE7KB is Net Control.

The 75 meter SSB net starts each Saturday 8PM Eastern on 3.955.
Lloyd N2KPC is Net Control.

The 160 meter SSB net starts each Saturday 9PM Eastern on 1.875.
Lloyd N2KPC is Net Control.

The 10 meter SSB net starts each Sunday at 1PM Eastern on 28.440.
Lloyd N2KPC is Net Control

The 40 meter SSB net starts each Sunday at 2PM Eastern on 7.263.
Ted N8TJE is Net Control.

The 20 meter SSB net starts each Sunday at 3PM Eastern on 14.325.
Tony VE3DWI is Net Control.

The 40 meter CW net starts each Monday at 8PM Eastern on 7.063.
Ron WB1HGA is Net Control.

The 20 meter SSB net starts each Wednesday at 1PM Eastern on 14.325. Tony VE3DWI is Net Control.

The 40 meter CW net starts each Wednesday at 8PM Eastern Time on 7.063. Ron WB1HGA is Net Control.

We have streaming audio over the Internet while the SSB nets are in progress, by John KC2QMA. Go to QRZ and type KC2QMA and click on the blue circle.

Please zero beat the Net Control and remember that they may have to change frequencies, as not to interfere with other Amateur Radio activity.

Thank you.

John D. Occhipinti, K3UR
Group Owner and TEN-TEC Net Manager

===================================

This "about" section is publicly visible, so I didn't think it wrong to repost it here.
BUT, they do change the frequencies from time to time based on other events, e.g. 14.325 is also the hurricane net, so, they announce in the forum (sometimes) if they change it up/down/wherever.

(John K3UR will probably shoot me now, he's gonna get a lot of new membership requests, hi hi hi)

You may have met John K3UR and Lloyd N2KPC and others involved in the TT nets and not even known it. They did work Dayton several times at the TEN-TEC booth, helping with answering questions and taking orders. Ambassadors / volunteers are great, aren't they?
So, yet another real good reason to keep in good standings with the net teams, they help a lot in a lot of ways.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 16, 2015, 09:08:46 AM

Awww that's to bad. I find it hilarious. LOL

Yes it is TOO bad. Simple minded people are easily amused. Seems to explain quite a bit.

Simple minded people are those who feel the need to attack and not just enjoy. But think what you like. I will still enjoy. LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 16, 2015, 09:11:52 AM
I wonder if Ten Tec will remain in Sevierville, or Tennessee, for that matter?  It sounds like there is not much of it left in TN, so I would not be surprised if Ten Tec is moved out of state.

It would be great if the new owner revives the Ten Tec Hamfest.  I always enjoyed those.

I have my suspicions of who the new owner is.  If I am correct, I think he just acquired another company a while back that started with an "E".  Am I close?   ;D  If this is the case, then I am sure the new company will have success and it is great news.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on November 16, 2015, 11:31:36 AM
I wonder where this will leave Alpha?  I hear that the "K" in RKR has been ousted (he was CEO) only leaving R*R.  Is the new owner of Ten Tec going to also save Alpha?  Hopefully we will get some good news about Alpha too.

I think what you heard was slightly wrong.  I was told he pulled out of the company when he realized RKR had no intention of restarting the TT or Alpha product lines.  So they bought him out.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 16, 2015, 11:37:34 AM
initial desire of course is to keep it in Sevierville.
There are a lot of fluid factors involved, and it all depends upon how all of this plays out.
Plan is to keep it in Sevierville, could mean a new location, might not, etc.
There are a LOT of t's to cross, events to occur, or not occur that will direct what goes on.
It is VERY fluid, so, give him time to get through this maze created by the previous owners.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on November 16, 2015, 11:40:34 AM
I just ordered an ACOM amp from DXE.  I had thought long and hard about ALPHA and their service and warranty but what good will it be if the company is gone next month.
Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on November 16, 2015, 04:14:22 PM
I wonder if Ten Tec will remain in Sevierville, or Tennessee, for that matter?  It sounds like there is not much of it left in TN, so I would not be surprised if Ten Tec is moved out of state.

It would be great if the new owner revives the Ten Tec Hamfest.  I always enjoyed those.

I have my suspicions of who the new owner is.  If I am correct, I think he just acquired another company a while back that started with an "E".  Am I close?   ;D  If this is the case, then I am sure the new company will have success and it is great news.
Isn't it a touch early to start speculating on where the new owner may or may not be relocating, since he hasn't closed the deal yet?  Really?

FWIW, I heard back from whom I thought the buyer might be.  He politely denied that it's him. 

More than that would not be appropriate to say.  (Besides, he's reading this thread, and I don't want to tick him off! )
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 16, 2015, 04:27:14 PM
I wonder if Ten Tec will remain in Sevierville, or Tennessee, for that matter?  It sounds like there is not much of it left in TN, so I would not be surprised if Ten Tec is moved out of state.

It would be great if the new owner revives the Ten Tec Hamfest.  I always enjoyed those.

I have my suspicions of who the new owner is.  If I am correct, I think he just acquired another company a while back that started with an "E".  Am I close?   ;D  If this is the case, then I am sure the new company will have success and it is great news.
Isn't it a touch early to start speculating on where the new owner may or may not be relocating, since he hasn't closed the deal yet?  Really?

FWIW, I heard back from whom I thought the buyer might be.  He politely denied that it's him. 

More than that would not be appropriate to say.  (Besides, he's reading this thread, and I don't want to tick him off! )

I can "speculate" about anything I want.  If you don't like my speculations then don't read them.  So far, my speculations have been pretty spot on.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on November 16, 2015, 08:20:57 PM
Wow.  You can sure heap out the big buckets of criticism, but can't take a mild rebuke very well, can you?

Well, I'm sorry that the soon-to-be-corpse you were so cheerily cackling over hasn't obliged you by actually dying yet.  You'll get over it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 17, 2015, 03:10:23 AM
Wow.  You can sure heap out the big buckets of criticism, but can't take a mild rebuke very well, can you?

Well, I'm sorry that the soon-to-be-corpse you were so cheerily cackling over hasn't obliged you by actually dying yet.  You'll get over it.

I don't know why some have trouble understanding the point that many of us made and now, the assumptions we noted are all verified as being correct. Many here observed that TenTec was dying. We now are told that yes, it is correct, TenTec is dying. No one was cheering over the fact, we simply pointed out the facts and the facts lead to that obvious conclusion. Second, we now have learned that a buyer is interested in coming in to save it. I hope that is the case and look forward to a reinvigorated TenTec. However, keep in mind, that if the buyer does not come through, then TenTec will probably not be around much longer. Let's all hope TenTec will be saved, but the fact is, without an angel, it's gone just like many of us deduced.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 17, 2015, 03:23:43 AM
Wow.  You can sure heap out the big buckets of criticism, but can't take a mild rebuke very well, can you?

Well, I'm sorry that the soon-to-be-corpse you were so cheerily cackling over hasn't obliged you by actually dying yet.  You'll get over it.

Wow, you clearly have reading comprehension problems.  

If you don't like what I post, put me on ignore there, gramps...  You'll get over it.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 17, 2015, 11:40:54 AM
I don't know why some have trouble understanding the point that many of us made and now, the assumptions we noted are all verified as being correct. Many here observed that TenTec was dying. We now are told that yes, it is correct, TenTec is dying. No one was cheering over the fact, we simply pointed out the facts and the facts lead to that obvious conclusion. Second, we now have learned that a buyer is interested in coming in to save it. I hope that is the case and look forward to a reinvigorated TenTec. However, keep in mind, that if the buyer does not come through, then TenTec will probably not be around much longer. Let's all hope TenTec will be saved, but the fact is, without an angel, it's gone just like many of us deduced.

newsflash: we are all dying. but spin it how u like, the fact is that many here were prematurely announcing the funeral. people in both the hopeful and pessimistic camps here agreed on one thing -- TT under RKR was not flourishing.  the question was whether that meant we could make funeral arrangements or the patient needed time to recover.  no angel appeared and there was no divine intervention.  someone made a decision that taking over TT and making it viable for the foreseeable future is an opportunity that they find meaningful.  let's wish them luck and not make funeral arrangements until we hear the party in question (aka: TT) is no longer breathing and a death certificate has been issued. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 17, 2015, 11:53:57 AM
I sincerely hope that the new owner of Alpha and Ten Tec is able to save both companies from withering away as they have under RF Concepts and RKR.  I think that is the wish of most who have stated their concern for the state of both companies and in particular Ten Tec.  I would like to see Ten Tec flourish under the new ownership so that another American company does not fade away.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 17, 2015, 12:14:36 PM
no angel appeared and there was no divine intervention.  someone made a decision that taking over TT and making it viable for the foreseeable future is an opportunity that they find meaningful.  let's wish them luck and not make funeral arrangements until we hear the party in question (aka: TT) is no longer breathing and a death certificate has been issued. 

I guess you are not familiar with the term "angel" as it applies to the world of start-ups, acquisitions, corporate financing, etc. An "angel" is someone who provides a lot of financing to keep a company in business or help it grow during its start-up years. It has nothing to do with religion and faith, though in this case, it is bringing TenTec back from the dead as Jesus did with Lazarus.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on November 17, 2015, 08:16:35 PM
Personally I think the longer we keep this thread going is the less of a chance that the prospective buyer will make a deal.  As I stated before I would hate to see TT die, so I am willing to give this a few months and see if something positive starts to happen.

73s
Rob
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9VO on November 18, 2015, 04:30:31 AM
If this thread should kill a deal, then it truly was on thin ice.

Posters without callsigns have zero credibility.

Sure has been a most interesting thread.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 18, 2015, 04:37:59 AM
If this thread should kill a deal, then it truly was on thin ice.

Posters without callsigns have zero credibility.

Sure has been a most interesting thread.


And you think that because you post with a call sign anything you say is credible?  Ha ha, what a laugh... Give me a break!  ::)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 18, 2015, 04:40:35 AM
Personally I think the longer we keep this thread going is the less of a chance that the prospective buyer will make a deal.  As I stated before I would hate to see TT die, so I am willing to give this a few months and see if something positive starts to happen.

73s
Rob


If you really are worried about whether the deal is going to go through based on an internet thread, then why do YOU continue to post messages in this thread?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 18, 2015, 05:16:16 AM
If this thread should kill a deal, then it truly was on thin ice.

Posters without callsigns have zero credibility.

Sure has been a most interesting thread.


Agree, I seriously doubt that this website has a great deal to do with the buyers intentions.  As for finding an angel to finance the deal, that is another matter entirely.  The will require a bank or individual/individuals who are willing to gamble at least half a million dollars or more to get the company going again. 

Sometimes it is more difficult to re invigorate a defunct company than it is to start over.  We also don't know if there is any latent debt involved in the purchase which would take away from start up capitol.  Then there is the fact that they have been stagnant for over a year and will require some pretty expensive new designs in order to compete with the current market.  All of this is a daunting venture and will require a lot of money, hard work, and timing to make it happen.  So it is an interesting story of a company that has been bought and sold a couple of times in very short order, this does not bode well no matter how good the buyers intentions are. 

The amateur radio market is brutal unless you have something the other guys don't.  Small plastic single board arduino based radios running OS programs are the least expensive to manufacture and if the price point is low they are fairly easy to sell.  That might be the start up product.  I guess we will know in six months although if it takes that long,,,,,,,,hmm.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 18, 2015, 06:19:47 AM
So why not just do as John Henry asked and give it some time? He seems to have the most direct information available and wouldn't ask that unless there is a good reason...like reality maybe?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on November 18, 2015, 08:26:28 AM
Personally I think the longer we keep this thread going is the less of a chance that the prospective buyer will make a deal.  As I stated before I would hate to see TT die, so I am willing to give this a few months and see if something positive starts to happen.

73s
Rob
Nah.

I don't think the comments, even the very inflammatory ones from people who choose to snipe from the perceived relative safety of anonymity, would sink the deal.  Consider the number of amateurs who are participating, and extrapolating a guess as to how many others are reading it... it's still a tiny number.

More importantly, the bulk of the negative commentary is directed towards the current ownership.  Since the business is in the process of being sold, why would the potential new owner back out because of negative comments directed towards the sellers?  If anything, it demonstrates one or several of the reasons why the current ownership wishes to sell.

It also demonstrates that people are passionate about Ten Tec and Alpha.  Now if most people expressed indifference, that would be a different story. 

No, if the deal is not consummated, I seriously doubt that this thread would have had anything to do with it.  I'd think financial considerations would be a bigger factor
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9VO on November 18, 2015, 08:49:02 AM
Callsign gives me ZERO credibility. All is does is show I'm not afraid to be identified. Nothing more.

Last post on this. You don't exist.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 18, 2015, 09:07:37 AM
Callsign gives me ZERO credibility. All is does is show I'm not afraid to be identified. Nothing more.

Last post on this. You don't exist.

 

Credibility comes from posting evidence to back up a claim that you are making, not from posting with a call sign. 

Unfortunately for you, eHam allows user names to be other than call signs.   Doing otherwise would exclude SWLers and other people who might be interested in getting into Ham Radio.  Of course, it seems you want to exclude anyone whose opinion you don't agree with.  Just put me on ignore if you cannot handle it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on November 18, 2015, 09:26:09 AM
plenty of angel investors around, but they generally want market or better return.  look at all the hams keeping 50 and 60 year old radios alive as the main rig or first backup.  first and best argument IMHPO is that there are existing designs that can be revived with minimal setup to start off paying the investment back within a half year or so.  if you can sell 500 Eagles at $1200 with 40-50 percent margin, that's a buy-time thing that would even keep a Cerebus-type fund happy.  it would take a real sharp pencil, but probably possible.

second best bet is a SDR, perhaps a year to announcement, with the radio in FCC testing at that time.

I see Chinese QRP rigs as a non-starter toward paying back an angel investor who would like to see their money in 2 to 5 years.

target market IMHPO is the $1000-1200 range, knobs not menus, feature competitive.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 18, 2015, 11:29:40 AM
Actually, you are all wrong. well, maybe not, but JMHO.

It does not take deep pockets to save TT and Alpha, it just takes sound management and committing to getting something accomplished. Period. Richard and Rich who are the current owners realize that they don't know the amateur market, and want out. They don't want to make huge gains/profit, they want to cover their expenses and clear the debts and hand it over to someone that can get it back on track. The debts and the expenses by their self are not that much. But combine that with not knowing what products to make, well, I can't blame them. It would be like me trying to run a gun shop. Yes, I have a clue, but, no, I have no idea what to really do to make it a success. I don't know what the latest guns are to carry for sure, which ones have service problems, etc. So, if I inherited a gun shop, I'd probably sell it too. (well, maybe after I took an original 1920 Mosin-Nagant sniper rifle home, lol, just kidding)

If all it took was deep pockets, then this merged Alpha/TEN-TEC company would have been going gangbusters and drinking champagne just after Jack Burchfiled sold it a couple of years ago

The TEN-TEC business is a cyclic one, in that at times the commercial items pay ALL the bills, and at times the amateur market pays the bills. The new owner is bringing back the commercial market that went away when Jack/Jim went away. This will compliment what is made in the amateur business, and help make the company more sustainable, but, it doesn't take a million dollars, it doesn't even take half a million, the thing is, if things can be lined up cyclically, it will all fall into place. With the plans the new owner has, it will take only a cycle or two to get things running smooth. (at least that is the plan)

Yes, designs are in place for both the commercial market and the amateur market for products that are of today's technology, and some based on tomorrows are in the thought process.

Now, back to reality, how all of this will work out?
I myself have no crystal ball, I have no idea.
He could make it a huge success
He could tank in a few months.

Time will tell,

FYI, the bantering back and forth on here and on the air, that is just human nature.
Don't take things personal, and try not to say things nastily personal against others.
It's a detriment to the companies and the hobby, and YES, things said in forums can and do affect sales.
I've seen that first hand in this amateur market hobby.

But, the future, well, other than the world crisis issues we are seeing, looks great for TEN-TEC and Alpha, at least as of today.
Tomorrow? well, let's wait and see.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on November 18, 2015, 07:29:16 PM
Personally I think the longer we keep this thread going is the less of a chance that the prospective buyer will make a deal.  As I stated before I would hate to see TT die, so I am willing to give this a few months and see if something positive starts to happen.

73s
Rob




If you really are worried about whether the deal is going to go through based on an internet thread, then why do YOU continue to post messages in this thread?

Quote
Don't take things personal, and try not to say things nastily personal against others.
It's a detriment to the companies and the hobby, and YES, things said in forums can and do affect sales.
I've seen that first hand in this amateur market hobby.

Did you just read what John Henry wrote?  If you comprehend that then you should know why I said it is a good time to stop.  Anyway I am pretty sure your motives have nothing to do with TenTec or Alpha but just another opportunity to bash ham operators.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 19, 2015, 03:24:13 AM
Personally I think the longer we keep this thread going is the less of a chance that the prospective buyer will make a deal.  As I stated before I would hate to see TT die, so I am willing to give this a few months and see if something positive starts to happen.

73s
Rob




If you really are worried about whether the deal is going to go through based on an internet thread, then why do YOU continue to post messages in this thread?

Quote
Don't take things personal, and try not to say things nastily personal against others.
It's a detriment to the companies and the hobby, and YES, things said in forums can and do affect sales.
I've seen that first hand in this amateur market hobby.

Did you just read what John Henry wrote?  If you comprehend that then you should know why I said it is a good time to stop.  Anyway I am pretty sure your motives have nothing to do with TenTec or Alpha but just another opportunity to bash ham operators.

This has nothing to do with what John Henry wrote.  

You are telling everyone to stop posting, yet you continue to post yourself.  Why don't you take your own advice for once? Otherwise you are a hypocrite.  

I do not bash Ham Radio operators.  I "bash" people, like you, who post things that clearly demonstrate they have no idea what they are talking about, have closed minds who think they have all the answers, and/or have no desire to learn something new.  Your definition of "bash" is someone disagreeing with you.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 19, 2015, 03:40:34 AM

Credibility comes from posting evidence to back up a claim that you are making, not from posting with a call sign. 

Unfortunately for you, eHam allows user names to be other than call signs.   Doing otherwise would exclude SWLers and other people who might be interested in getting into Ham Radio.  Of course, it seems you want to exclude anyone whose opinion you don't agree with.  Just put me on ignore if you cannot handle it.


"Bob", or whatever your real name is, credibility comes from positive identification as you cannot claim things are fact unless they can be tied by to you as a real individual. Just like those news stories stating "trusted source" or whatever, most of the time those reports are not accurate. It's fine if you were really an SWL, but frankly, I kind of doubt it. You're just another ham who likes to hide and thus feels they can write anything they want because it cannot be tied back to them. But you are correct, you do not have to have a callsign as you can be just an SWL. However, looking at your profile on eham, you don't even post your complete name and who knows if "Bob" is really your name. For people to have complete credibility, they need to be easily identified. Since you cannot be easily and clearly identified, then everything you state is suspect, even those so-called facts.

Sure, eham does not require it and they apparently don't care, but we all realize that anything you write here is always suspect and I am sure you would not be as argumentative and sometimes nasty if people really knew who you really are.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 19, 2015, 04:21:04 AM

Credibility comes from posting evidence to back up a claim that you are making, not from posting with a call sign. 

Unfortunately for you, eHam allows user names to be other than call signs.   Doing otherwise would exclude SWLers and other people who might be interested in getting into Ham Radio.  Of course, it seems you want to exclude anyone whose opinion you don't agree with.  Just put me on ignore if you cannot handle it.


"Bob", or whatever your real name is, credibility comes from positive identification as you cannot claim things are fact unless they can be tied by to you as a real individual. Just like those news stories stating "trusted source" or whatever, most of the time those reports are not accurate. It's fine if you were really an SWL, but frankly, I kind of doubt it. You're just another ham who likes to hide and thus feels they can write anything they want because it cannot be tied back to them. But you are correct, you do not have to have a callsign as you can be just an SWL. However, looking at your profile on eham, you don't even post your complete name and who knows if "Bob" is really your name. For people to have complete credibility, they need to be easily identified. Since you cannot be easily and clearly identified, then everything you state is suspect, even those so-called facts.

Sure, eham does not require it and they apparently don't care, but we all realize that anything you write here is always suspect and I am sure you would not be as argumentative and sometimes nasty if people really knew who you really are.



The majority of Hams that use their call signs as their usernames on eHam are not credible.  They post things that have no basis in fact, and when challenged, they are not able to provide references to back them up.  Unlike the majority of posters here, I do my homework and I do not post information unless I can back it up with references.   Of the few times that I have been shown to be in error, I immediately admit that I was wrong as you can see by perusing through my posting history. 

You only care about usernames when it is a username of someone who disagrees with you.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 19, 2015, 04:30:11 AM

You only care about usernames when it is a username of someone who disagrees with you.

True, but at least I positively know who is disagreeing with me.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 19, 2015, 04:39:25 AM

You only care about usernames when it is a username of someone who disagrees with you.

True, but at least I positively know who is disagreeing with me.

You have to ask yourself why does it really matter?  Everyone has the choice to put me on ignore.  I cannot force people to read my comments.  That is their choice.  The reason why I do not put anyone I disagree with on ignore is because, when you do so, you bury your head in the sand without the possibility of learning something new or maybe getting insight into a new point of view that you have not considered before.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI8P on November 19, 2015, 04:43:26 AM
Quote from: SWL2002

To keep on subject, Ten Tec and Alpha will not last another year unless someone buys them from RKR.  They are in big trouble.  Just wait and you'll see.


Sounds familiar...  so much for the "theories" that RKR were secretly planning new products...  The owners are not even Hams! I hate to say I told you so...  ;D



If you really hated to, you would have remained silent.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 19, 2015, 04:59:33 AM
Quote from: SWL2002

To keep on subject, Ten Tec and Alpha will not last another year unless someone buys them from RKR.  They are in big trouble.  Just wait and you'll see.


Sounds familiar...  so much for the "theories" that RKR were secretly planning new products...  The owners are not even Hams! I hate to say I told you so...  ;D



If you really hated to, you would have remained silent.

I guess you are incapable of understanding sarcasm.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on November 19, 2015, 06:50:35 AM
< snip >Your definition of "bash" is someone disagreeing with you.
My definition of "bash" involves books written by a Tech with a KL7 call who published previously secret FCC Amateur Radio exam questions, and answers.

Which is not germane to the question at hand...

One can disagree without being nasty or without adding personal insults and perjoratives to the conversation.  It's when those are interjected than a disagreement may turn into a "bash"

So what are you worried about anyway?  As was just noted, you wanted to see the company under new ownership, did you not? ( If not, what did you want? )  That seems to be in progress.  So what's the problem?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 19, 2015, 07:25:09 AM
good grief.  ???

The facts are....
The new owner is a ham.
He has a plan to get the company back on track.
Give him time.

Reply to whatever you want, however you want, it is your right,  cut down your fellow hams if you want, but that really goes against the general principles of being a goodwill ambassador for the hobby. Only thing missing here is the guy (or gal, lol) that belches continuously throughout the day on 40 and 20.

Y'all take care,
73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 19, 2015, 07:56:30 AM
good grief.  ???

The facts are....
The new owner is a ham.
He has a plan to get the company back on track.
Give him time.

Reply to whatever you want, however you want, it is your right,  cut down your fellow hams if you want, but that really goes against the general principles of being a goodwill ambassador for the hobby. Only thing missing here is the guy (or gal, lol) that belches continuously throughout the day on 40 and 20.

Y'all take care,
73, KI4JPL
John Henry

What frequency?? ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N8YX on November 19, 2015, 08:03:58 AM
...
What frequency?? ;D
All of them, if he's running a Swan product. If he hasn't made it to yours yet, just wait.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 19, 2015, 08:06:36 AM
< snip >Your definition of "bash" is someone disagreeing with you.
My definition of "bash" involves books written by a Tech with a KL7 call who published previously secret FCC Amateur Radio exam questions, and answers.

Which is not germane to the question at hand...

One can disagree without being nasty or without adding personal insults and perjoratives to the conversation.  It's when those are interjected than a disagreement may turn into a "bash"

So what are you worried about anyway?  As was just noted, you wanted to see the company under new ownership, did you not? ( If not, what did you want? )  That seems to be in progress.  So what's the problem?

Is there something wrong with your reading comprehension or do you need new glasses or something?

I am not worried about Ten Tec and the new owner.   I am sure the new owner will make it a success as I HAVE STATED PREVIOUSLY.   I have also said that I am glad that another American company is not going to disappear.  I have said nothing derogatory concerning the new ownership and I have never wished anything bad on Ten Tec or Alpha.  I like both companies.  I don't know where you get that I am not happy about the announcement.  You seem to be pulling that out of your you-know-what.  Take a chill pill!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 19, 2015, 08:10:25 AM
good grief.  ???

The facts are....
The new owner is a ham.
He has a plan to get the company back on track.
Give him time.

Reply to whatever you want, however you want, it is your right,  cut down your fellow hams if you want, but that really goes against the general principles of being a goodwill ambassador for the hobby. Only thing missing here is the guy (or gal, lol) that belches continuously throughout the day on 40 and 20.

Y'all take care,
73, KI4JPL
John Henry

John, what has gotten your panties all up in a bunch?  I wish the new owner well, I wish him success.  The only reason this thread started and has continued so long is because people care what happens to Ten Tec and they were concerned.  That should be a positive sign to you and also to the new owner.  I don't think anyone here wishes ill will on Ten Tec or Alpha.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 19, 2015, 08:20:53 AM
good grief.  ???

The facts are....
The new owner is a ham.
He has a plan to get the company back on track.
Give him time.

Reply to whatever you want, however you want, it is your right,  cut down your fellow hams if you want, but that really goes against the general principles of being a goodwill ambassador for the hobby. Only thing missing here is the guy (or gal, lol) that belches continuously throughout the day on 40 and 20.

Y'all take care,
73, KI4JPL
John Henry

What frequency?? ;D

Usually something near 7.2
or did you mean the frequency of the belch? maybe 400hz or so.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on November 19, 2015, 08:30:34 AM
7.2 MHz?  Figures, it sounds like it's becoming the new iteration of 14.313 and 14.300.

That aside, thanks again for the info John and for everything you're doing. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 19, 2015, 08:39:38 AM
The problem seems to start when the discussion concerns politics or religion.  This is what appears to have started the mess currently going on at 7.200.  If those old farts would keep the conversation away from those two subjects, the deranged drunks that bother them would probably find someone else to bother.  Situations like 7.200 and 14.313 makes me embarrassed to admit I am a Ham...  
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 19, 2015, 08:46:10 AM
good grief.  ???

The facts are....
The new owner is a ham.
He has a plan to get the company back on track.
Give him time.

Reply to whatever you want, however you want, it is your right,  cut down your fellow hams if you want, but that really goes against the general principles of being a goodwill ambassador for the hobby. Only thing missing here is the guy (or gal, lol) that belches continuously throughout the day on 40 and 20.

Y'all take care,
73, KI4JPL
John Henry

John, what has gotten your panties all up in a bunch?  I wish the new owner well, I wish him success.  The only reason this thread started and has continued so long is because people care what happens to Ten Tec and they were concerned.  That should be a positive sign to you and also to the new owner.  I don't think anyone here wishes ill will on Ten Tec or Alpha.

The questions about TEN-TEC, yes, I agree are a good indicator that people are concerned about TEN-TEC. It is a positive sign.

Debate on health of the company is fine, and when things get a bit erroneous or false or exagerated, I have tried to steer the facts back into the discussion so that speculation doesn't result in negative thoughts about TEN-TEC.

Personal attacks/cutdowns/namecalling is not appropriate and not representative of being a ham. A good will ambassador to the hobby. I won't discuss this anymore, I will just ignore those who are doing it, and if I miss a question in their comments, well, that was their fault.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry


Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 19, 2015, 08:58:24 AM
good grief.  ???

The facts are....
The new owner is a ham.
He has a plan to get the company back on track.
Give him time.

Reply to whatever you want, however you want, it is your right,  cut down your fellow hams if you want, but that really goes against the general principles of being a goodwill ambassador for the hobby. Only thing missing here is the guy (or gal, lol) that belches continuously throughout the day on 40 and 20.

Y'all take care,
73, KI4JPL
John Henry

What frequency?? ;D

Usually something near 7.2
or did you mean the frequency of the belch? maybe 400hz or so.



Thanks, I'll break out the spectrum analyzer. ;D ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 19, 2015, 09:00:23 AM
Thanks, I'll break out the spectrum analyzer. ;D ;D

 ::)
lol
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 19, 2015, 09:02:26 AM
7.2 MHz?  Figures, it sounds like it's becoming the new iteration of 14.313 and 14.300.

That aside, thanks again for the info John and for everything you're doing. 

I have noticed that lately that's why I avoid that frequency.  It's frustrating to see that junk creeping on to 40 but not much we can do about it.

I used to listen to 14.313 just for lulz but I don't bother anymore, it's not worth it to listen to morons act like poorly behaved kids.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 19, 2015, 09:15:55 AM
7.2 MHz?  Figures, it sounds like it's becoming the new iteration of 14.313 and 14.300.

That aside, thanks again for the info John and for everything you're doing. 

I have noticed that lately that's why I avoid that frequency.  It's frustrating to see that junk creeping on to 40 but not much we can do about it.

I used to listen to 14.313 just for lulz but I don't bother anymore, it's not worth it to listen to morons act like poorly behaved kids.

good grief, burper is on 14.313 right now, along with another laughing qrmer.....
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0BKR on November 19, 2015, 10:34:33 AM
Why not just lock this thread until there is something to really post?  Afterall, this is a company review not a company speculation thread....wow..40 pages of this...and nothing resolved yet... :D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB2WIK on November 19, 2015, 10:41:41 AM
Maybe I missed something because the belching discussion was so fascinating -- but has the "new owner" been identified?

I'd love to know who it is, and at least wish them well.

I've had "some" TT gear since the PM-2, and still have some.  It would be nice to know they will continue.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 19, 2015, 10:41:45 AM
Why not just lock this thread until there is something to really post?  Afterall, this is a company review not a company speculation thread....wow..40 pages of this...and nothing resolved yet... :D

Lock this thread?  Ha... No one made you come here to read it.  Who are you? Just another self appointed forum cop?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 19, 2015, 10:49:40 AM
Not yet.
But when he is ready he will make an announcement.
I'm not sure how or where the announcement will be made.
But I'm sure this thread, contesting.com, the tentec yahoo groups, the alpha and alpha4040 groups will light up with conversations again.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on November 19, 2015, 11:29:25 AM
There must be a special breed of stupid who are continuing this nonsense... regarding RKR, there were indeed hams involved. It is obvious NO ONE has read the original announcement.  RKR was supplying material to Ten Tec on a contractor basis. There is at least one experienced ham involved with RKR.  I do note that almost 90% of the lunatic eHam fringe on this topic have earned a special spot on my blocked poster list.


April 2, 2015) RKR Designs, LLC of Longmont Colorado has announced that they have acquired the assets of Alpha Amplifier and TEN-TEC brands from RF Concepts. RKR plans to expand the product line, while continuing to service their customers that have enjoyed their products over the years.

The principals of RKR Designs are Richard Gall, Ken Long and Rich Danielson (Gall and Danielson of QSC Systems, Longmont, Colorado have been a successful contract manufacturer, for over 20 years). Ken Long, N0QO has over 20 years in the electronics and amateur radio industry. Long will be President and CEO of the new company. QSC has been building Alpha amplifiers for over 5 years. They have also been building boards for TEN-TEC since their purchase by RF Concepts last year. Mr. Long said “QSC has always been a fantastic contract manufacturer, and has the expertise and knowledge that will allow us to bring down costs, while increasing quality and reducing manufacturing times.”


Very few of the posters to date have any clue as to the costs involved in meeting payroll, taxes, manufacturing, advertising, developing new products, marketing, etc. The bills come in, and have to be paid. This entire thread is an embarrassment.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 19, 2015, 11:36:18 AM
There must be a special breed of stupid who are continuing this nonsense... regarding RKR, there were indeed hams involved. It is obvious NO ONE has read the original announcement.  RKR was supplying material to Ten Tec on a contractor basis. There is at least one experienced ham involved with RKR.  I do note that almost 90% of the lunatic eHam fringe on this topic have earned a special spot on my blocked poster list.


April 2, 2015) RKR Designs, LLC of Longmont Colorado has announced that they have acquired the assets of Alpha Amplifier and TEN-TEC brands from RF Concepts. RKR plans to expand the product line, while continuing to service their customers that have enjoyed their products over the years.

The principals of RKR Designs are Richard Gall, Ken Long and Rich Danielson (Gall and Danielson of QSC Systems, Longmont, Colorado have been a successful contract manufacturer, for over 20 years). Ken Long, N0QO has over 20 years in the electronics and amateur radio industry. Long will be President and CEO of the new company. QSC has been building Alpha amplifiers for over 5 years. They have also been building boards for TEN-TEC since their purchase by RF Concepts last year. Mr. Long said “QSC has always been a fantastic contract manufacturer, and has the expertise and knowledge that will allow us to bring down costs, while increasing quality and reducing manufacturing times.”


Very few of the posters to date have any clue as to the costs involved in meeting payroll, taxes, manufacturing, advertising, developing new products, marketing, etc. The bills come in, and have to be paid. This entire thread is an embarrassment.

uh, that was the status as of April 2. That was months ago.
The company is being sold again.
The only two owners now are Richard and Rich, Ken left about a month or so ago.

Hence the reason for the questions, and why I'm answering them here in eham.

So I don't consider this a stupid thread, times are a changing again,

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 19, 2015, 11:56:56 AM
There must be a special breed of stupid who are continuing this nonsense... regarding RKR, there were indeed hams involved. It is obvious NO ONE has read the original announcement.  RKR was supplying material to Ten Tec on a contractor basis. There is at least one experienced ham involved with RKR.  I do note that almost 90% of the lunatic eHam fringe on this topic have earned a special spot on my blocked poster list.


April 2, 2015) RKR Designs, LLC of Longmont Colorado has announced that they have acquired the assets of Alpha Amplifier and TEN-TEC brands from RF Concepts. RKR plans to expand the product line, while continuing to service their customers that have enjoyed their products over the years.

The principals of RKR Designs are Richard Gall, Ken Long and Rich Danielson (Gall and Danielson of QSC Systems, Longmont, Colorado have been a successful contract manufacturer, for over 20 years). Ken Long, N0QO has over 20 years in the electronics and amateur radio industry. Long will be President and CEO of the new company. QSC has been building Alpha amplifiers for over 5 years. They have also been building boards for TEN-TEC since their purchase by RF Concepts last year. Mr. Long said “QSC has always been a fantastic contract manufacturer, and has the expertise and knowledge that will allow us to bring down costs, while increasing quality and reducing manufacturing times.”


Very few of the posters to date have any clue as to the costs involved in meeting payroll, taxes, manufacturing, advertising, developing new products, marketing, etc. The bills come in, and have to be paid. This entire thread is an embarrassment.

Ha ha ha... You have just joined that special breed of stupid you talk about.  Ken Long is no longer with RKR, probably because he pissed off one of their suppliers they owe money to.  Richard G. and Rich D. are not Hams.  Ken was CEO and partly responsible for the state both companies are in now.  
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on November 19, 2015, 12:02:12 PM
Show me one post, or announcement, that shows where ken Long has left the RKR stable.

Quite honestly, I am starting to lose a  lot of respect for John Henry.  He seems to be a cheerleader, yet the news only seems to get worse and worse after his latest posts extolling the virtues of Ten Tec.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 19, 2015, 12:02:52 PM
Very few of the posters to date have any clue as to the costs involved in meeting payroll, taxes, manufacturing, advertising, developing new products, marketing, etc. The bills come in, and have to be paid. This entire thread is an embarrassment.

The problems started back when Seedman got the company.  I suspect RKR got it because RF Concepts owned them money and Seedman unloaded it on them.  Ten Tec was a viable company before those two groups of owners got a hold of it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 19, 2015, 12:07:02 PM
Show me one post, or announcement, that shows where ken Long has left the RKR stable.

Quite honestly, I am starting to lose a  lot of respect for John Henry.  He seems to be a cheerleader, yet the news only seems to get worse and worse after his latest posts extolling the virtues of Ten Tec.

Pete

There is no official announcement from anyone on Ken Long other than from those who are trying to work out a deal to get a new owner started. All we can say publicly is that he is no longer with RKR.

I'm sorry if I am losing your respect, and no, I am not a cheerleader, I am only trying to answer questions as they come up. I have expressed several pros for the new owner, and several doubts for success, but I have no real idea how this will all work out. I can only hope. Like everyone else does.

I'm trying to help TEN-TEC get back in business again, so is the new owner.

If that offends you, well, there is the ignore button.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 19, 2015, 12:07:07 PM
Show me one post, or announcement, that shows where ken Long has left the RKR stable.

Quite honestly, I am starting to lose a  lot of respect for John Henry.  He seems to be a cheerleader, yet the news only seems to get worse and worse after his latest posts extolling the virtues of Ten Tec.

Pete

Don't attack the messenger.  John Henry is here attempting to help answer questions people have brought up.  That is commendable.  He has cleared a lot of things up.  If you choose to continue to bury your head in your you-know-what, then go right ahead.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on November 19, 2015, 12:15:31 PM
Again, when was Ken's departure announced in this thread??

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SWL2002 on November 19, 2015, 12:18:36 PM
Again, when was Ken's departure announced in this thread??

Pete

Start with Reply #556.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 19, 2015, 12:20:09 PM
AGAIN there has been no official announcement anywhere from any employee or representative at TEN-TEC or Alpha or RKR.
I brought it up in this thread AFTER questions about it and other TEN-TEC items in this thread started.
It was already public in a ten-tec forum on yahoo.
I do not know when, but you can browse through just as well as I can.
It sounds like you do need to go back and check out statuses before anyway.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on November 19, 2015, 02:02:16 PM
Up to this point there have been 56 posters to this thread.  Number wise that is nothing.  No wonder the owners have no comment.  As I said before, maybe Martin will buy this joint.---Then we would have something to talk about.
Art

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 19, 2015, 04:15:35 PM
Show me one post, or announcement, that shows where ken Long has left the RKR stable.

Quite honestly, I am starting to lose a  lot of respect for John Henry.  He seems to be a cheerleader, yet the news only seems to get worse and worse after his latest posts extolling the virtues of Ten Tec.

Pete

Don't attack the messenger.  John Henry is here attempting to help answer questions people have brought up.  That is commendable.  He has cleared a lot of things up.  If you choose to continue to bury your head in your you-know-what, then go right ahead.

This cat is playing a game with everyone to get attention.  Get lost creep.  Go make your videos.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N0YXB on November 19, 2015, 07:57:49 PM
Up to this point there have been 56 posters to this thread.  Number wise that is nothing.  No wonder the owners have no comment.  As I said before, maybe Martin will buy this joint.---Then we would have something to talk about.
Art

Wouldn't that be something?! A portion of the internet might suddenly spontaneously combust.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 20, 2015, 05:36:01 AM
Up to this point there have been 56 posters to this thread.  Number wise that is nothing.  No wonder the owners have no comment.  As I said before, maybe Martin will buy this joint.---Then we would have something to talk about.
Art

Wouldn't that be something?! A portion of the internet might suddenly spontaneously combust.

Well at least we would have TT kits! Everything comes partially assembled.  :D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on November 20, 2015, 07:17:51 AM
The news release stated that a ham was involved in the RKR takeover--that goes back to when this thread started.

50 posts later we finally learn that the ham, a key player,  had left RKR.  Why this was kept a secret until recently bothers me. I like Ten Tec gear... but so far every release has been puffery, or upbeat prognostications from a very few former employees.  At least the guy who posted his recent poor job experiences on QRZ was a bit more forthcoming about what was happening, although I don't agree that airing dirty laundry in public is good practice.

As an owner of  Ten Tec gear and as one who was looking forward to good news, I feel like I have been played like a cheap violin. If that bothers a few folks, I really don't care. Most of the loons are on ignore anyways. My next adventure may be a DZkit--American made, well received, good ergonomics, and no drama.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 20, 2015, 07:53:38 AM
I don't know what to make of the posts about a mysterious ham trying to buy the company since it seems to me that for less than the cost of a used car you can buy it outright.  Makes me wonder why it's taking so long but I guess it's not that easy to get seed money.  Were it me, I as the owner would appoint a minority as CEO and hire only women and minority employees.  The federal government would not only bankroll me but they would even provide people to help set up the business and get it up to speed.  All that's required is a proposal and a plan to build radio equipment for the government under 8A contract supervision.  They could also build and sell commercial radio (amateur) equipment once the company is established.  But that's just me.  There are lots of ways to skin the cat.

I do know there is a lot of interest in what happens to Ten Tec because they have been such a major player in the amateur radio hobby going back to around 1968.  One of the guys I went to high school with bought a TT Power Mite in 1968 and it was actually pretty cool compared to the HW-7.  It's no wonder there is a lot of passion here.  I am rooting for them because they are not only Iconic but also an American company that employs American workers.  Come what may this has been a very interesting saga but it may be time to just sit back and see what plays out.

73, John. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on November 20, 2015, 08:02:08 AM
I have three vintage Ten Tec radios that I love using; and as a DX'er they work flawlessly.  I'd sure hate to see the brand end.  But there is a combination of too much info, followed by periods of dead silence, followed by glimmers of good news, and the cycle repeats.  I should just move on and let the chips fail where they may.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N8YX on November 20, 2015, 08:26:01 AM
I have three vintage Ten Tec radios that I love using; and as a DX'er they work flawlessly.  I'd sure hate to see the brand end. 
Six here plus quite a few accessories; none newer than an Omni VI+. I'd sure hate to see the availability of the various OEM parts like knobs, end caps, panels and the like dry up. (Or production of in-demand spares like those knobs and end caps never be restarted.)

The equipment does everything I want, and does it well. An Orion III would be a nice-to-have...guess we'll wait and see.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on November 20, 2015, 08:38:58 AM
I'm seeing tons of Omni radios (various models) and Paragons being parted on the infamous auction site. A few guys are trying to start up a parts website for older Ten Tec gear.  That would be a good resource.  My main worry is custom ROM chips.  They seldom fail, but the loss of one could spell the end for a good radio. 

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7EXJ on November 20, 2015, 09:05:12 AM
I've had a TenTec Argonaut 509 since 1980. It was the backup xcvr for an Icom 701 that was the main radio on our cruising sailboat, Kibitka, that we lived on and cruised down into the tropics back in the early 1980s. It actually figured prominently in the rescue of the crew of the S/V Firehorse II which went aground in a bay just south of La Paz, BCS, MX. To me the 509 was the icon of QRP ham radios with SSB and CW both.

I recently tried to buy an Orion 6+ off eBay but lost out to a bid that was 19-cents higher than mine. LOL

Ended up buying a K2... sigh.

Hate to see TT go down but I've been a ham since 1957 and I've seen a lot of companies rise and fall; but the rigs they built are still out there.

73s de K7EXJ
Craig
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 20, 2015, 10:47:01 AM
I don't know what to make of the posts about a mysterious ham trying to buy the company since it seems to me that for less than the cost of a used car you can buy it outright.  Makes me wonder why it's taking so long but I guess it's not that easy to get seed money.

things take time.  ever bought a house?  (it is important to dot all the i's and cross all the t's)... and also the buyer might want to take a few weeks (at least) after a deal is closed to make any official announcements.  i guess we live in a FaceBook society where everyone wants to know what you had for breakfast today or they think you are stalling   ???

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 20, 2015, 11:34:39 AM
I don't know what to make of the posts about a mysterious ham trying to buy the company since it seems to me that for less than the cost of a used car you can buy it outright.  Makes me wonder why it's taking so long but I guess it's not that easy to get seed money.

things take time.  ever bought a house?  (it is important to dot all the i's and cross all the t's)... and also the buyer might want to take a few weeks (at least) after a deal is closed to make any official announcements.  i guess we live in a FaceBook society where everyone wants to know what you had for breakfast today or they think you are stalling   ???



Well said!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on November 21, 2015, 08:31:14 AM


things take time.  ever bought a house?  (it is important to dot all the i's and cross all the t's)... and also the buyer might want to take a few weeks (at least) after a deal is closed to make any official announcements.  i guess we live in a FaceBook society where everyone wants to know what you had for breakfast today or they think you are stalling   ???



I imagine the new owner needs to figure out exactly what assets, or what liabilities he is buying into.  Some folks might be surprised to learn that there have been instances where someone has been paid to take over a company.

What is the current inventory, cash flow, assets, liabilities-present and future, what are the paid orders, etc?  It will take some accounting time to determine a fair price. And, there is the bad karma of the past several months, and unhappy Ten Tec loyalists.  How many talented employees are left, and how many have been lost? What is the manufacturing capability for a restart?  There are tons of issues. I hope the prospective new owner is able to sort it all out, and to restore these companies to some semblance of their past glory.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 21, 2015, 08:42:34 PM

I imagine the new owner needs to figure out exactly what assets, or what liabilities he is buying into.  Some folks might be surprised to learn that there have been instances where someone has been paid to take over a company.

What is the current inventory, cash flow, assets, liabilities-present and future, what are the paid orders, etc?  It will take some accounting time to determine a fair price. And, there is the bad karma of the past several months, and unhappy Ten Tec loyalists.  How many talented employees are left, and how many have been lost? What is the manufacturing capability for a restart?  There are tons of issues. I hope the prospective new owner is able to sort it all out, and to restore these companies to some semblance of their past glory.

Pete

isn't the purchase both Alpha & Ten-Tec?  in other words twice the details and twice the assessments in two completely different geographic locations.  I would give any buyer at least until Spring to make any official announcements on their plans for the future  ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on November 21, 2015, 09:19:55 PM
Beats me :)  I am not privy to what is being sold, or kept.  Considering the earlier "E" rumor posted by someone else,  it would make some sense that the amplifier division is part of the deal.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 22, 2015, 04:41:24 AM

things take time.  ever bought a house?  (it is important to dot all the i's and cross all the t's)... and also the buyer might want to take a few weeks (at least) after a deal is closed to make any official announcements.  i guess we live in a FaceBook society where everyone wants to know what you had for breakfast today or they think you are stalling   ???


Yes, and I have purchased property in less than three weeks so I does not take too long at all. This past week my company purchased another company and the deal will be completed by December 1.

So if you are a business, you better learn to adapt or your business will die. As it applies to people, if you do not change, you will become irrelevant.

One of my favorite quotes: "If you don't like change, then you are really going to hate extinction."
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI8P on November 22, 2015, 06:39:26 AM
Quote from: SWL2002

To keep on subject, Ten Tec and Alpha will not last another year unless someone buys them from RKR.  They are in big trouble.  Just wait and you'll see.


Sounds familiar...  so much for the "theories" that RKR were secretly planning new products...  The owners are not even Hams! I hate to say I told you so...  ;D



If you really hated to, you would have remained silent.

I guess you are incapable of understanding sarcasm.

I guess you are incapable of presenting it in print.  (That's sarcasm, in case you miss it.)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on November 22, 2015, 09:14:25 AM
Yes, and I have purchased property in less than three weeks so I does not take too long at all. This past week my company purchased another company and the deal will be completed by December 1.

so did your company buy this company the day it learned of the sale, or did you do some homework and negotiating?
was the company one that has changed hands twice in the last few years and does it consist of two separate entities as far away as TN and CO?  How many employees did the company purchased employ?  iow -- are you comparing apples to apples or apples to capacitors?

Quote from: WB8NUT
So if you are a business, you better learn to adapt or your business will die. As it applies to people, if you do not change, you will become irrelevant.

if the would-be buyer doesn't understand perpetual change, he won't understand why TT no longer sells the Century 22 and he may need to just buy an old Yes album  ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on November 22, 2015, 11:59:42 AM
A quick deal is essential, the product has remained dormant for to long already.  If it's someone that has to be calculating down to the last dollar then this will probably be a long protracted deal which is not good for tenTec in particular.  It's got to be the kind of person that can make the "Misc Expenses" column a very high number and then use sheer cash to make thing work.  My Brother in Law made a killing in the early 2000's buying places using that kind of mentality and he always ended up making some huge profits even when others though he was a crazy and going to lose his shirt.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 22, 2015, 12:13:20 PM
What's amazing to me even with new ownership in the works, there are still people complaining about what's going on. They have no facts, but everything is wrong. Why not give the same time and respect you all are giving Idiom Press and its new owner.

You know, all you people with your great advice and business knowledge should have bought TT and ran it your way.

Otherwise everything else is someone else's business...mainly the new owners.

And the pages keep piling up! Should hit that 20 pages I predicted soon! LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 22, 2015, 07:27:52 PM
What's amazing to me even with new ownership in the works, there are still people complaining about what's going on. They have no facts, but everything is wrong. Why not give the same time and respect you all are giving Idiom Press and its new owner.

You know, all you people with your great advice and business knowledge should have bought TT and ran it your way.

Otherwise everything else is someone else's business...mainly the new owners.

And the pages keep piling up! Should hit that 20 pages I predicted soon! LOL

Idiom Press has a new owner.  Time to face facts, the party is over.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 23, 2015, 01:26:55 AM
What's amazing to me even with new ownership in the works, there are still people complaining about what's going on. They have no facts, but everything is wrong. Why not give the same time and respect you all are giving Idiom Press and its new owner.

You know, all you people with your great advice and business knowledge should have bought TT and ran it your way.

Otherwise everything else is someone else's business...mainly the new owners.

And the pages keep piling up! Should hit that 20 pages I predicted soon! LOL

Idiom Press has a new owner.  Time to face facts, the party is over.

Yes it does. And TT is in that same process. Something the death march wants to dismiss with all kinds of complaints, rumors, criticisms, or just plain denial.

Well turn out the lights when you leave then. There is no point in posting anymore if what you say is true. But then again, maybe you are at the wrong party. Which would explain why your standing in an empty room and say the party is over. LOL

And who's facts should I face? The funeral committee...which you clearly fall into with your last post; or someone like John Henry? Who has more credibility? You? LOL

And the pages roll on. LOL Finds that old Sonny and Cher record.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on November 23, 2015, 08:07:03 AM
Guys, if you don't do anything else, please keep this thread going.  I really enjoy coming here twice a day.
Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 23, 2015, 08:09:06 AM
Idiom Press went under in October, they were bought out in early November and the new owner started turning out product almost immediately.  It does not take six months to buy a company that is (or at least was) set up to produce radios.  A buyer who was serious could buy the company in a month and start production within another month or less.  

So Have they laid anyone off?  Yes.

Are they hiring new people?  No.

Are they producing radios?  No.

Are they producing amplifiers? Unknown but unlikely.

Keep dreaming. ::)

N9AOP, glad to oblige. ;D

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 23, 2015, 08:54:07 AM
Idiom Press went under in October, they were bought out in early November and the new owner started turning out product almost immediately.  It does not take six months to buy a company that is (or at least was) set up to produce radios.  A buyer who was serious could buy the company in a month and start production within another month or less.  

So Have they laid anyone off?  Yes.

Are they hiring new people?  No.

Are they producing radios?  No.

Are they producing amplifiers? Unknown but unlikely.

Keep dreaming. ::)

N9AOP, glad to oblige. ;D



LOL You keep guessing...I will just wait and see. I will not write them off when they are in flux.

And when you team up with the new buyer, as a business partner, then you will have credible knowledge. Until there is a statement issued by the buyer or seller, it is your opinion only and not factual. If you can do better...then do it. Stop telling me to not have faith and put your money where your mouth is. Until then, your guessing...plain and simple.

Or is it now you want them to fail out of spite? Now that would be sad. But possible based on your choice of words.

And yes...I can dream. It is not illegal yet. But in this case...

Pages and pages to go! LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on November 23, 2015, 08:54:23 AM
When you consider the size and nature of the two firms, comparing Idiom Press to Ten Tec is hardly an "apples to apples" comparison.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 23, 2015, 08:57:59 AM
When you consider the size and nature of the two firms, comparing Idiom Press to Ten Tec is hardly an "apples to apples" comparison.

Exactly...Which is why it may be more complicated and take more time to accomplish.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on November 23, 2015, 09:05:14 AM
LOL You keep guessing...I will just wait and see. I will not write them off when they are in flux.

And when you team up with the new buyer, as a business partner, then you will have credible knowledge. Until there is a statement issued by the buyer or seller, it is your opinion only and not factual. If you can do better...then do it. Stop telling me to not have faith and put your money where your mouth is. Until then, your guessing...plain and simple.

Or is it now you want them to fail out of spite? Now that would be sad. But possible based on your choice of words.

And yes...I can dream. It is not illegal yet. But in this case...

Pages and pages to go! LOL

Actually, the same can be said about me. I am helping consult with certain items that the new owner needs to know, mostly engineering stuff, some product stuff, some purchasing, some sales, etc., how hard is it to do xxx, make yyy out of zzz, etc. But, in the end, I don't have all the facts. Y'all may have 3 of the 50, and I may have 25 of the 50, but I don't have the remaining 25. Only he and Richard/Rich do.
I do see strong possibilities for success, but then the proverbial fat lady ain't sung yet, so, no one knows how it will all work out until he is ready to make things public. And, really, if things start, and an announcement is made, then I see a much much higher probability of success.
It isn't 100% signed off yet, (AFAIK), so who knows, it could fall through and fail today. But, the indications I'm given are that it is still going through.
This is NOT a Mr. Deep Pockets as Seedman was, this is Mr. Joe Blow Ham who has a successful product and has a plan to keep Alpha and TEN-TEC brands / inc's going into the future. A plan that requires certain things to play out, and they are in the process of playing out. One may take a few more weeks to finish and build the flow from, etc.
So, as I did say, it won't happen overnight, give 'em time.

Each of the two (alpha and TT) have different requirements, different levels of cash flow, different possibilities for the future, and no, they ain't even apples to oranges in comparisons. More like apples to chocolate.

I am rooting for him, so if that makes me a cheerleader, well, I guess I am.
But, I have no idea whether it will go through or not.
If it does, listen, help where you can, etc.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
(note, did anything of what I said above add to this conversation? no, probably not, just extended the life of this thread, lol)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 23, 2015, 10:15:23 AM

Actually, the same can be said about me. I am helping consult with certain items that the new owner needs to know, mostly engineering stuff, some product stuff, some purchasing, some sales, etc., how hard is it to do xxx, make yyy out of zzz, etc. But, in the end, I don't have all the facts. Y'all may have 3 of the 50, and I may have 25 of the 50, but I don't have the remaining 25. Only he and Richard/Rich do.
I do see strong possibilities for success, but then the proverbial fat lady ain't sung yet, so, no one knows how it will all work out until he is ready to make things public. And, really, if things start, and an announcement is made, then I see a much much higher probability of success.
It isn't 100% signed off yet, (AFAIK), so who knows, it could fall through and fail today. But, the indications I'm given are that it is still going through.
This is NOT a Mr. Deep Pockets as Seedman was, this is Mr. Joe Blow Ham who has a successful product and has a plan to keep Alpha and TEN-TEC brands / inc's going into the future. A plan that requires certain things to play out, and they are in the process of playing out. One may take a few more weeks to finish and build the flow from, etc.
So, as I did say, it won't happen overnight, give 'em time.

Each of the two (alpha and TT) have different requirements, different levels of cash flow, different possibilities for the future, and no, they ain't even apples to oranges in comparisons. More like apples to chocolate.

I am rooting for him, so if that makes me a cheerleader, well, I guess I am.
But, I have no idea whether it will go through or not.
If it does, listen, help where you can, etc.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
(note, did anything of what I said above add to this conversation? no, probably not, just extended the life of this thread, lol)

Hi John,

First off thank you!

Your few if not all facts are much more then most think they know. And I at least appreciate your sharing what you can. And I too wish the new owner the best and I will remain hopeful until there is a reason not to. So far that reason has not yet been said.

I would say only the buyer knows all. And only that person can share or not share all the facts. And that is where it is at this point. But so far, at least there is hope.

Thanks again!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on November 23, 2015, 11:51:35 AM
Hi John,

Again, thank you for sharing what you can.

Be aware that many of us appreciate this, and that many of us also appreciate that you're in a difficult situation, in that you know more than you're willing (or even permitted) to share.

I think part of the problem, with some people at least, is that they expect an announcement of a tentative deal, and then expect the final details to be worked out.  The type of thing you read about in the papers when publicly traded companies are bought and sold -- with disclosures at times and with details required by law or by SEC regulations, and so on & so forth.

What is not being appreciated or understood by some, I think, is that since this is a private individual (with, possibly, private investors) trying to acquire a privately held firm, or at least the assets & intellectual property thereof... these legal requirements do not necessarily apply.  Thus no disclosures are being made. 

This is being interpreted by some as having smoke blown up their... backsides.  Which (IMHO) is not the case.

We just have to be patient a little longer, and (more importantly) continue to hope that things work out.

73
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on November 23, 2015, 01:04:21 PM
if you (burp) in a publicly traded company, you have to issue a 10-K.

private firms... well, kinda like private lives.  they file tax statements, which are not public, and sales and FICA taxes, which are not public.  nobody needs to know anything else, other than they ship or not, and take care of customers or not.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JAS on November 24, 2015, 03:49:52 AM
Been reading many of these posts LOL. One thing that I noticed, LOL, is that so many really do not understand business at all LOL. The other thing, LOL, that I noticed is that one poster seems fixated LOL, on using LOL in so many of his posts LOL. I don't know why, LOL, that he has to use LOL so many times, LOL since nothing he has written had anything to laugh about, LOL. So, LOL, I am really puzzled.

Now that I have stopped laughing, seriously I read about people needing to be patient and the business of private comapnies is no one's business as long as they ship product and take care of the customer. The reality is this. The world moves extremely fast today. If your business cannot keep up, it will close. Three or more decades ago, you could wait months and months to do a transaction. You could take years to bring a product to market. Customers could wait months for a product to be delivered.

That is not the case today. When normal business moves at light speed, weeks and months delay can mean the death of a company. While TenTec flounders, Flex, Elecraft, Yaesu, Icom, and Kenwood are continuing to ship products, develop new products, innovate, and perform. Every day that TenTec does not have product to ship means they lose customers who buy products elsewhere.

A study was onec performed and I believe it is still valid. For every $1 a company spends getting a customer, it will spend $14 to get a customer back that they lost. Businesses do not have the time today. If you lose customers because you cannot deliver product, well those are customers who might never return.

As for private companies not sharing their financial data and plans. The facts are that many private companies do publish their financials because they want their customers to see that they are healthy in hopes their customers stay loyal. A long time ago I worked for a private company who did publish an annual report and provided all the financials to their current and prospective customers. It is a very common practice in Europe I am told.

To those who think TenTec and its potential buyer have all the time in the world, they really don't. So much time has been already wasted. How long has this mess with TenTec been going on now? Over a year? Time is running out. I hope this transaction is completed very soon and the new owner publicly provides detailed of his recovery and product plans.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0BKR on November 24, 2015, 04:01:57 AM
I am like you Jeff...wait and see, albeit, been a long wait thus far and not promising, regardless of the banter...but will wait and see....have no vested interest either way whether TT comes back or is buried, but I would like to see them back as a manufacturer as they did make some nice equipment/offerings....

Time will tell.  Speculation will abound and many will question, falsely state whatever, but time will tell the real outcome in the end....

Good luck to TT or whatever they may be called.  I liked their Omni 5/6s and wish I had one today regardless whether I could get any support for it, but that isn't going to happen....at least for now...

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 24, 2015, 07:53:59 AM
Been reading many of these posts LOL. One thing that I noticed, LOL, is that so many really do not understand business at all LOL. The other thing, LOL, that I noticed is that one poster seems fixated LOL, on using LOL in so many of his posts LOL. I don't know why, LOL, that he has to use LOL so many times, LOL since nothing he has written had anything to laugh about, LOL. So, LOL, I am really puzzled.

Now that I have stopped laughing, seriously I read about people needing to be patient and the business of private comapnies is no one's business as long as they ship product and take care of the customer. The reality is this. The world moves extremely fast today. If your business cannot keep up, it will close. Three or more decades ago, you could wait months and months to do a transaction. You could take years to bring a product to market. Customers could wait months for a product to be delivered.

That is not the case today. When normal business moves at light speed, weeks and months delay can mean the death of a company. While TenTec flounders, Flex, Elecraft, Yaesu, Icom, and Kenwood are continuing to ship products, develop new products, innovate, and perform. Every day that TenTec does not have product to ship means they lose customers who buy products elsewhere.

A study was onec performed and I believe it is still valid. For every $1 a company spends getting a customer, it will spend $14 to get a customer back that they lost. Businesses do not have the time today. If you lose customers because you cannot deliver product, well those are customers who might never return.

As for private companies not sharing their financial data and plans. The facts are that many private companies do publish their financials because they want their customers to see that they are healthy in hopes their customers stay loyal. A long time ago I worked for a private company who did publish an annual report and provided all the financials to their current and prospective customers. It is a very common practice in Europe I am told.

To those who think TenTec and its potential buyer have all the time in the world, they really don't. So much time has been already wasted. How long has this mess with TenTec been going on now? Over a year? Time is running out. I hope this transaction is completed very soon and the new owner publicly provides detailed of his recovery and product plans.

Well said, I agree 100% with your assessment of the situation.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KM1H on November 25, 2015, 02:28:33 PM
I wish Kenwood actually would innovate
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA1VT on December 02, 2015, 07:55:45 AM
 >:( Terrible on tube orders~!  Over a month of wait and still not hearing from them as to when 2 orders will ship.  Previous orders got screwed up, shipped to wrong addresses, waited over a month for 3-500 matched pair, waiting for 811a quads and now waiting again.  Sure they have the best prices but their order area sure lacks information - like BACK-ORDERED before or after you order.
Went on EBay and got a quad set shipped within a week!  Go figure! 
Come on
RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
GET IT TOGETHER!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on December 02, 2015, 09:43:32 PM
Boy, I wish they'd get their act together.  This is really disappointing. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 03, 2015, 04:07:05 AM
I think they will now that they have a new owner. Just read John Henry's letter. It's very good news. A new owner is in control, but it will take a few months just to get the basics in place.

John's letter clearly shows that the "funeral committee" as some like to put it, was right all along as to what was happening. They were not rumors as some like to say, but clearly facts.

Looking forward to a new, reinvented TenTec and return of superior products and service now that they have an owner that clearly cares about the company.

Viva TenTec!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on December 03, 2015, 05:34:33 AM
I think they will now that they have a new owner. Just read John Henry's letter. It's very good news. A new owner is in control, but it will take a few months just to get the basics in place.

John's letter clearly shows that the "funeral committee" as some like to put it, was right all along as to what was happening. They were not rumors as some like to say, but clearly facts.

Looking forward to a new, reinvented TenTec and return of superior products and service now that they have an owner that clearly cares about the company.

Viva TenTec!
Agreed!

The most important thing to note from John's letter (what letter, some of you may be asking?  He posted it to several of the Ten Tec email reflectors, and started a new thread on this topic in this very same Company Reviews forum) is that there IS a new owner!  So we can basically forget about RKR, or RR, or whomever they are/were. 

The new owner is no doubt putting together his management team and getting other things in place.  All will be revealed shortly. 

Patience!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on December 03, 2015, 05:44:54 AM
I said all along that RKR was bleeding asset for money. Wonder how much they made before selling what was left?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WE1X on December 03, 2015, 06:07:02 AM
John's "letter" on the new Ten Tec thread makes some critical (i.e., important points) that may on this thread missed for months. First, Ten Tec was financially hemorrhaging for years, meaning whether due to business practices and/or products it was non-competitive. Second, while hemorrhaging no one with the exception of RKR came forward to acquire the assets and keep the business going. Again, if accurate, further confirmation that Ten Tec was not competitive. Second, while some may crow about RKR's acquisition and management of Ten Tec, they were the only party willing to purchase the assets to keep the business going in some form. We can argue as to their motives, but that is largely irrelevant as they were apparently the only entity willing to do so.  Third, and most important, unless the new owner raises meaningful capital Ten Tec's future may very well remain non-competitive.  I use the term "meaningful capital" because those of us in the venture business know that start-ups and companies in transition (a) always need more working capital than they intended and (b) sales are frequently slower than forecasts.

I too wish Ten Tec and the new owner(s) well. However, ham radio is a niche business in a larger industry that is rapidly changing in so many ways. Hopefully new management can secure sufficient commercial and/or government business to help feed operations and new product development.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on December 03, 2015, 06:51:02 AM
Second, while some may crow about RKR's acquisition and management of Ten Tec, they were the only party willing to purchase the assets to keep the business going in some form. We can argue as to their motives, but that is largely irrelevant as they were apparently the only entity willing to do so. 

Stop trying to sugar coat it RKR was cherry picking and picked tree clean, It was there intent from beginning. Had it been any other intent they would of handled it differently.

I hope new owners can do some good but unless they outsource actual building of rigs to China to control costs while adding feature and value their chances are not good.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WE1X on December 03, 2015, 08:40:57 AM
Second, while some may crow about RKR's acquisition and management of Ten Tec, they were the only party willing to purchase the assets to keep the business going in some form. We can argue as to their motives, but that is largely irrelevant as they were apparently the only entity willing to do so. 

Stop trying to sugar coat it RKR was cherry picking and picked tree clean, It was there intent from beginning. Had it been any other intent they would of handled it differently.

I hope new owners can do some good but unless they outsource actual building of rigs to China to control costs while adding feature and value their chances are not good.

John, John, John....

You simply don't know. Actually, you simply don't have a clue.

Yes, maybe that was their intent. On the other hand, if the company was hemorrhaging for years it's unclear what assets were available for RKR to cherry pick. Further, what were the value of those assets? Even further, what were the value of those assets against the price RKR paid?  Going even further, what were RKR's operating costs to "bleed" those assets during the months it had Ten Tec? You don't know. I don't know.

But as usual, you miss the critical point while attempting to prove you have some business savvy. Ten Tec for years was a non-competitive entity in the ham business. This is not a statement on the quality of its technology, products it produced, or the devotion of its customers, but where it stood among other manufacturers of ham gear.  Apparently either the owners couldn't raise sufficient operating capital or elected not to and exit the business. Management for whatever reason made the company available for sale. That's the important point you fail to grasp.  And if no one other than RKR stepped up to buy the assets that's even more important.  And if RKR cherry picked and bled the assets as you claim is so obvious, then what assets of value did the now new owner purchase?  And unless an entity be it RKR, the now new owner, or my cat purchased Ten Tec based upon reasonable business assumptions and metrics (i.e., get value out of the company) then the acquisition doesn't work. Nostalgia doesn't pay the bills.

So to make this easy for you to digest: (a) Ten Tec was up for sale, (b) from John's "letter" RKR stepped up to the plate, (c) RKR likely had business reasons to acquire Ten Tec and those reasons may have included selling or leveraging Ten Tec's assets or maybe make a stab of rejuvenating the business but discovered it was beyond their skills or abilities (I've seen this happen many times with companies in transition), (c) there were assets of value to the now new owner, (d) the "new" Ten Tec will require sufficient capital to restart and become sustainable.

If you want to continue to beat the drum that RKR bled the company go ahead and do so. It really doesn't matter unless "I told you so" is so critical to your ego...which I suspect is the case.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WE1X on December 03, 2015, 08:51:06 AM
Second, while some may crow about RKR's acquisition and management of Ten Tec, they were the only party willing to purchase the assets to keep the business going in some form. We can argue as to their motives, but that is largely irrelevant as they were apparently the only entity willing to do so. 

Stop trying to sugar coat it RKR was cherry picking and picked tree clean, It was there intent from beginning. Had it been any other intent they would of handled it differently.

I hope new owners can do some good but unless they outsource actual building of rigs to China to control costs while adding feature and value their chances are not good.

And John...keep in mind that you were the guy who trashed FlexRadio and posited that company's demise because it took deposits for its then-to-be-released 6000-series rigs.  Back then you had no issue publicly disparaging an on-going business because of something you found so "suspicious". You didn't possess any real facts. You didn't have any real operating insight into that company. But that was immaterial because you had to be right.  Well...you weren't.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on December 03, 2015, 09:11:45 AM
Would you guys give it a rest already?

No wonder the new owner wants to keep his name private until everything is in place! 

You wanted news.  Now you've got it. 

And still, the wild speculations, the accusations... enough already!  Sheesh!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9VO on December 03, 2015, 09:13:48 AM
While I may have missed it, is/was there any impact on Alpha or is TenTec on its own now? What will be status of Alpha?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB2WIK on December 03, 2015, 09:55:50 AM
While I may have missed it, is/was there any impact on Alpha or is TenTec on its own now? What will be status of Alpha?


I understand Alpha has new products in Beta and trying to decide on a new antenna feed system between the Gamma and the Delta. :P

Sorry, I couldn't resist. :D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on December 03, 2015, 10:10:24 AM
While I may have missed it, is/was there any impact on Alpha or is TenTec on its own now? What will be status of Alpha?

Well, ever since the Tri-Lam's beat them at Homecoming, the Alphas have never been the same...
 ;D

It has not yet been revealed if the new company... and it is a new company under new ownership, if that's not obvious... will be just Ten-Tec, or both Ten-Tec and Alpha, in terms of the product lines.  We will find out soon enough.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 03, 2015, 10:30:24 AM
Evidently the new owner is wanting to raise startup capitol via Go Fund Me where the amateur community will donate the money to get them going and ostensibly will receive some amount of discount on a new product that is yet to be produced.  There was a similar scheme once that claimed "Double you IQ or no money back".  This sounds kind of similar. ::)

One has to wonder why the new owner simply doesn't raise the capitol the way most businesses do, by going to the bank for a small business loan?  Someone is dreaming.

And for the benefit of WE1X this isn't We told you so, this is "We Told You and You Didn't Want to Believe it".   Believe it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 03, 2015, 10:31:55 AM
The two greatest things to come out of John Henry's announcement. First is that TenTec will go on. Second that the "funeral committee" was right all along and now completely vindicated! The "committee" spoke fact from observation and not rumors. Maybe we should rename the "funeral committee" the "Lazarus Committee" as maybe the prodding helped bring back TenTec from the dead!

 ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 03, 2015, 10:34:41 AM

One has to wonder why the new owner simply doesn't raise the capitol the way most businesses do, by going to the bank for a small business loan?  Someone is dreaming.

And for the benefit of WE1X this isn't We told you so, this is "We Told You and You Didn't Want to Believe it".   Believe it.

Ever since the financial collapse, it is VERY hard for small business to get a loan...if not impossible, especially considering TenTec's situation.

As to your second point, agreed. Now to only get those deniers to say, "I'm sorry, you all were right and we are sorry." But that will probably never happen.

 :D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 03, 2015, 11:00:28 AM
The two greatest things to come out of John Henry's announcement. First is that TenTec will go on. Second that the "funeral committee" was right all along and now completely vindicated! The "committee" spoke fact from observation and not rumors. Maybe we should rename the "funeral committee" the "Lazarus Committee" as maybe the prodding helped bring back TenTec from the dead!

 ;D

wow!  really?  the funeral committee pronounced a company dead when it was only in transition.  rumors of TT's demise were premature as was the death certificate many here issued...  go ahead and re-frame it however u like, but that is a fact.  

the K part of RKR suggests that the whole premise of the gossip committee here -- that from the get-go RKR always intended to bleed TT to its death -- was false    
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 03, 2015, 01:12:04 PM
The two greatest things to come out of John Henry's announcement. First is that TenTec will go on. Second that the "funeral committee" was right all along and now completely vindicated! The "committee" spoke fact from observation and not rumors. Maybe we should rename the "funeral committee" the "Lazarus Committee" as maybe the prodding helped bring back TenTec from the dead!

 ;D

No, it won't...

The bank won't fund them so they expect hams to give them money.  This is starting to look like the three stooges playing radio.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 03, 2015, 02:11:07 PM

wow!  really?  the funeral committee pronounced a company dead when it was only in transition.  rumors of TT's demise were premature as was the death certificate many here issued...  go ahead and re-frame it however u like, but that is a fact.  

the K part of RKR suggests that the whole premise of the gossip committee here -- that from the get-go RKR always intended to bleed TT to its death -- was false    

No, we said it looked like it was in trouble and dying. Had someone not come in to save it, it would have died. The reality if you read John Henry's posting is that they were indeed bleeding it to death. The hint was selling off the equipment needed to manufacture radios or did you miss that point when he said they have to buy new equipment?

I love it when people cannot admit they are wrong when the evidence clearly shows you and the cheerleaders were completely wrong. You sound like the Global Warming fanatics who when the Global Warming label did not work out any longer, that they had to change it to "climate change." Clearly, they were not in transition; they were dying until the angel investor came into the picture.

So come on now, admit you were wrong. The first step to a cure is admitting there is a problem.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on December 03, 2015, 02:31:51 PM
And John...keep in mind that you were the guy who trashed FlexRadio and posited that company's demise because it took deposits for its then-to-be-released 6000-series rigs. 

Where is not for a few government contracts FLex would not exist. You can put any spin you want but deposits were indeed interest free venture capital.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 03, 2015, 10:15:36 PM

wow!  really?  the funeral committee pronounced a company dead when it was only in transition.  rumors of TT's demise were premature as was the death certificate many here issued...  go ahead and re-frame it however u like, but that is a fact.  

the K part of RKR suggests that the whole premise of the gossip committee here -- that from the get-go RKR always intended to bleed TT to its death -- was false    

Just goes to prove that some people are right when their right, and some people need to be right when their wrong. Lets take the new information and spin it enough to say TT was basically dead so the funeral committee can pronounce themselves as right. And renaming yourselves to take credit is simply pathetic. But that is the attitude of some...I can say anything and always be right! LOL

And just for an accurate record, before some snarky responses to my post are made, I was betting on RKR pulling TT through. So in reality I was wrong as well because RKR decided to sell instead of fix. Which based on some "facts" from John Henry, and not the wild erroneous speculation, should give them a better shot.

See...It's not hard to say your wrong! But I am also now glad I was wrong too based on some of the new facts.

Good luck and best wishes to the new ownership.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: ZENKI on December 04, 2015, 03:31:55 AM
Its not over till the fat lady sings. Ten Tec has yet to sing, we will stay tuned for all the exciting new products. Its Specifications, Specifications and  Specifications that count these days. The last thing the ham radio world needs is more crap radios with poor specifications like  that which Icom produces year after year with the same design flaws and poor transmitters. Elecraft has been a winner because it paid a lot of attentions to the needs and specifications in the K3 design. While the K3 transmitters IMD could be better it meets the specification  requirements of a high  performance radio. Ten Tec should concentrate on performance and the  success will take care of itself. You would wont be successful trying to turn a turd into a polished gold nugget!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3BJ on December 04, 2015, 04:55:41 AM
Well the news on TT is great. Maybe they can become a viable company again with quality products. But things have been very quiet on Alpha. NOt a word that I have seen. They still are selling products I guess. No updates or any communications for a good while.Alpha was a major force for a long time. They don't advertise in QST anymore. Anyone give a update?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N8YX on December 04, 2015, 05:43:57 AM
The two greatest things to come out of John Henry's announcement. First is that TenTec will go on. Second that the "funeral committee" was right all along and now completely vindicated! The "committee" spoke fact from observation and not rumors. Maybe we should rename the "funeral committee" the "Lazarus Committee" as maybe the prodding helped bring back TenTec from the dead!

 ;D

No, it won't...

The bank won't fund them so they expect hams to give them money.  This is starting to look like the three stooges playing radio.
Quiet, numbskulls...they're broadcasting.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 04, 2015, 10:29:30 AM

Just goes to prove that some people are right when their right, and some people need to be right when their wrong. Lets take the new information and spin it enough to say TT was basically dead so the funeral committee can pronounce themselves as right. And renaming yourselves to take credit is simply pathetic. But that is the attitude of some...I can say anything and always be right! LOL

i also find it hilarious that now they are proclaiming TT has risen to cover their faux pas of prematurely pronouncing TT dead when it never really completely lost a pulse.  Was its health in question?  of course.  but they said the patient was terminal, which is a pretty disrespectful way to treat anyone of questionable health unless you are a doctor or family member with facts...  
The fact right now is that TT is still in transition and though there is hopeful news we still have to wait and see where it goes from here.

Quote from: W9FIB
And just for an accurate record, before some snarky responses to my post are made, I was betting on RKR pulling TT through. So in reality I was wrong as well because RKR decided to sell instead of fix. Which based on some "facts" from John Henry, and not the wild erroneous speculation, should give them a better shot.

I was hopeful RKR would make it through too, but knew it was not a foregone conclusion.  I had heard good things secondhand about entity K in RKR wrt his vision for TT and that made me feel RKR was not intent on killing TT... i did not realize RKR actually became RR in the interim... would be neat if K gets involved again -- or already is (although i do not know K)

Quote from: W9FIB
See...It's not hard to say your wrong! But I am also now glad I was wrong too based on some of the new facts.
Good luck and best wishes to the new ownership.

well, it wasn't hard for you, but wrt much of the funeral committee -- ALL BETS ARE OFF!!!

and, yes, let's all wish the patient health -- m'kay? :)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on December 05, 2015, 06:24:31 AM
wow!  really?  the funeral committee pronounced a company dead when it was only in transition.  rumors of TT's demise were premature as was the death certificate many here issued...  go ahead and re-frame it however u like, but that is a fact.  

the K part of RKR suggests that the whole premise of the gossip committee here -- that from the get-go RKR always intended to bleed TT to its death -- was false    

While you might have been clueless, several people already knew the K was out of the picture and that TT was indeed bleeding every last asset out of the TenTec.  So for some listening to your very optimistic ideas on how this might play out was something we knew would never happen under RKR.  The fact that a person has come forward to buy what remains of TenTec is great, his plan of raising cash via the Ham Community is not so great.  Are you willing to put up $1000 or $2000 into this venture?  If it works great, if it fails then your SOL.   I really wish his plan did not rest on the Ham Community for a cash supply, half these guys would rather use the bureau than buy some stamps.  I wish him the best and hope that maybe he can find a few hams willing to be real business partners and put up tens of thousands of dollars instead of this kick starter type deal being proposed.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on December 05, 2015, 06:42:30 AM

Hi,

Let us just SUPPOSE, there are three owners of a HYPOTHETICAL company.  One who recently bailed out as he felt he was losing to much money on his investment, and the two remaining owners were actively trying to sell the few remaining assets.  Do you really think that company would make that information known to the public and its remaining customers....... just saying ;D

73,

John

Hi,

Then there were those, that weeks ago could not take a hint about what is known by some for months. ::)

73,

John

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 05, 2015, 08:45:42 AM
Couple of comments.
Regarding the previously mentioned downpayments on future rig deliveries, it is not official yet and details will come out if / when it started. So, no need to contact me directly, it will be made public on the details, who to contact, etc.
Thoughts are to try to get the website transitioned over to the new owner.
The current website still redirects to RKRDesignsllc.com.
When the new website for TEN-TEC is initially ready, you won't see it re-route to RKRDesignsllc anymore.
Then, ALL official statements/correspondences will take place there.
I would assume that then all details of what products are for sale, price, etc., any offerings of the downpayment/deposit methods will be detailed there if that method is offered.

TEN-TEC, how did this all happened, well.....
Having seen a lot of what happened first hand, I can clearly say that no one single entity was the reason for where TEN-TEC is today, and from what I can tell from any of the past and current owners, is that none of them bought TEN-TEC with intentions of bleeding it dry.
At the beginning of each, I believe they all had good intentions.
I will categorically say one thing on record though, if RKR had not bought TEN-TEC and Alpha from RF Concepts on April 1 of this year, RF C would have shut the doors within a month. And TEN-TEC would have been history.
So don't talk bad about RKR, nor bad about RF C for that matter. If Michael Seedman had not purchased TEN-TEC from Jack Burchfield when he did, then Jack would have liquidated it then, or sold it to someone else that would have liquidated it.
Two categorically undeniable facts:
If it had not been for Michael Seedman, there would be no TEN-TEC today.
If it had not been for Ken Long, there would be no TEN-TEC today.
Now, upon Ken leaving RKR, Richard/Rich (the RR in RKR), being exceptionally good successful contract manufacturers for boards/etc., having no knowledge of what amateur radio really needs in terms of products, what it takes to develop them, what it takes to manufacture dozens of boards with thousands of parts versus what they were use to, well, they made the right decision, find someone who does.
Richard/Rich were prior and are still the owners of QSC Sytems. They built boards for Alpha, then when RFC bought TEN-TEC, they built boards for TEN-TEC. Now, when RKR Is behind Richard/Rich, they will continue doing what they do best, build boards, and other services they provide.
Why did TEN-TEC fail? There is not one answer, there are hundreds, hundreds of exact events and decisions that all aided in bringing it to where it is now, close to the "funeral arrangements" mentioned in this forum, but no single event or failure or whatever caused this.

I won't discuss this any further, nor mention the above names anymore.
Now is the time for the new owner to take the reigns, to drive it, and for me/others to help where we can with effort / advice / etc., and for the community to realize what has happened, what could have happened, TEN-TEC could have been listed with the names of those who are no longer in the market.

One more thing I can leak, and I probably shouldn't, but, he does have a couple of the BEST engineers in his/her respective product type on his side, helping already make new product. I can't wait to see what they come up with. Me, I'm a bit buster, bit flipper, software developer, wanting to play with and program new gadgets. 

ok, some bad news, it won't all come back at once.
e.g. as I listed, it will include 10 OMNI-VIIs for now, they might be ready in January, maybe February, then a full run of some OMNI-VIIs shortly after.
Then the Eagle, but the others? time will tell IF/when they come back. It is all very fluid at the moment, and the concentrations are on the immediate cash flow to keep the current plans running, the current developments running, etc.
Changes, wow, unfortunate.....
(The reason for the 10 OMNI-VIIs listed above, we have 10 ready for finished goods when they get their front panel plastic. TEN-TEC is working on getting the panels, or a replacement, or something even newer, he he he, I'm a devil, aren't I, lol)

Anyway, too much BS from me on this, gotta git 'r dun other wise it will fail again.

I'll stay away from all of this for a while because there is so much to be done, and this PR stuff takes time.

Regarding Alpha, All I can say is that there are discussions regarding its disposition, possible purchase, etc. These discussions are not final, and are subject to a lot of change. So, I can't comment on it until something REAL comes to light. It is only conjecture until then. Sorry, so the public conjecturing will continue, rumors, etc.

Y'all take care,

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 05, 2015, 09:24:20 AM

i also find it hilarious that now they are proclaiming TT has risen to cover their faux pas of prematurely pronouncing TT dead when it never really completely lost a pulse.  Was its health in question?  of course.  but they said the patient was terminal, which is a pretty disrespectful way to treat anyone of questionable health unless you are a doctor or family member with facts...  
The fact right now is that TT is still in transition and though there is hopeful news we still have to wait and see where it goes from here.


I suggest you read John's latest post above this one. The "funeral committee" did not "prematurely" pronounce TT dead. Clearly, it was dead. Read John's email as he posted "Why did TenTec fail?" That's pretty clear. If a business fails, it's dead. Without question, all the history John wrote shows that it was dead. Some folks just kept it on life support for a few more months. Read what he wrote. If RF Concepts would not have purchased it, it was going to be closed. If RF Concepts would not have sold it, it would have been closed within a month. Had this unknown owner had not come in, it would have been closed. To me and many others who read the tea leaves correctly months ago, the business was dead. You can spin this any way you want, and you all wanted facts, well John is giving you the facts. It was dead. The only thing that some on the "funeral committee" may have stated incorrectly is that RKR was trying to intentionally bleed it dry. John says they were not, but had no idea what it took to run the business. I can believe that as a real possibility. But let's be clear. TenTec was dead. It was not going to resurface until this angel came in to bring it back from the dead. The "funeral committee" was absolutely right.

What TenTec needs are hams buying the radios once they come back. There are too many cheerleaders here that say we need a U.S. ham company, then go out and buy Japanese or Chinese radios. That's crap. Get some skin in the game. When the radios are available, sell your Japanese radio, get what cash you can, then buy a TenTec. Use a credit card for the balance and pay it off over time. Enough of the cheerleaders sitting on the sidelines who bash those of us who supported TenTec for a long time, but who stated CORRECTLY that we saw TenTec in a death spiral. We were right, the cheerleaders were wrong.

Pony up folks with your money instead of just your words. W9KEY I know you are a supporter and not simply one of the cheerleaders, but you did not see the writing on the tombstone; but at least you supported TenTec with a purchase in the past. The Jupiter was a great radio and I also had one once. But the rest who cheer on TenTec without being a customer, just shut up with the rhetoric and put your money on the line with a purchase. That's what is going to keep the new TenTec going, not the BS written here.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on December 05, 2015, 09:48:57 AM
Just as I can SUPPOSE they took over a troubled business because they could pick up the rights to the intellectual properties cheap and are working up a new plan to utilize them in a profitable manner. And they don't have to announce them to the public either until things are ready and a workable plan in place.

And if the company was so unprofitable, wouldn't a top to bottom reorganization be prudent to make it profitable?

Also come to think of it, the company that became RKR may already be profitable, and they don't have to rush a reorganization and a rush back to the market. It all depends on return from investment.

I highly doubt that they are such poor investors that they would make an investment without future profitability being taken into account.

But unless you are part owner of the LLC, you have no idea what they are doing nor do I. I just believe there are still possibilities and stay positive until a true plan from the LLC owners becomes public. Like I said many times, we just have to wait and see.


Hi,

"But unless you are part owner of the LLC, you have no idea what they are doing nor do I. I just believe there are still possibilities and stay positive until a true plan from the LLC owners becomes public".

Above is your reply to my above  November 14, 2015 post.  Speak for yourself, you were wrong again.....

73,

John
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 05, 2015, 06:16:27 PM
I suggest you read John's latest post above this one. The "funeral committee" did not "prematurely" pronounce TT dead. Clearly, it was dead. Read John's email as he posted "Why did TenTec fail?" That's pretty clear. If a business fails, it's dead. Without question, all the history John wrote shows that it was dead. Some folks just kept it on life support for a few more months. Read what he wrote. If RF Concepts would not have purchased it, it was going to be closed. If RF Concepts would not have sold it, it would have been closed within a month. Had this unknown owner had not come in, it would have been closed. To me and many others who read the tea leaves correctly months ago, the business was dead. You can spin this any way you want, and you all wanted facts, well John is giving you the facts. It was dead. The only thing that some on the "funeral committee" may have stated incorrectly is that RKR was trying to intentionally bleed it dry. John says they were not, but had no idea what it took to run the business. I can believe that as a real possibility. But let's be clear. TenTec was dead. It was not going to resurface until this angel came in to bring it back from the dead. The "funeral committee" was absolutely right.

do you realize you just admitted TT never got off life support? ??? 
do you really still find it proper that some people here formed a funeral committee and pronounced the patient dead when TT was still on life support and there was still a medical possibility they would recover ??? 

also note that RKR only owned the company for about half a year and yet the funeral committee here was suggesting RKR only bought TT to profit off killing it.  at least you now acknowledge most of the reasons why the funeral announcements made here were premature, even though you ended your acknowledgement with the rather bizarre suggestion that: "The 'funeral committee' was absolutely right."    :D
 
let's give this new venture at least a year before any more talk of funerals, okay?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 05, 2015, 09:13:00 PM
Just as I can SUPPOSE they took over a troubled business because they could pick up the rights to the intellectual properties cheap and are working up a new plan to utilize them in a profitable manner. And they don't have to announce them to the public either until things are ready and a workable plan in place.

And if the company was so unprofitable, wouldn't a top to bottom reorganization be prudent to make it profitable?

Also come to think of it, the company that became RKR may already be profitable, and they don't have to rush a reorganization and a rush back to the market. It all depends on return from investment.

I highly doubt that they are such poor investors that they would make an investment without future profitability being taken into account.

But unless you are part owner of the LLC, you have no idea what they are doing nor do I. I just believe there are still possibilities and stay positive until a true plan from the LLC owners becomes public. Like I said many times, we just have to wait and see.


Hi,

"But unless you are part owner of the LLC, you have no idea what they are doing nor do I. I just believe there are still possibilities and stay positive until a true plan from the LLC owners becomes public".

Above is your reply to my above  November 14, 2015 post.  Speak for yourself, you were wrong again.....

73,

John

Gee John, already said I was wrong. Guessed you missed that post. Ah well, at least TT never died as some say. Was in trouble, but never dead. But as I said, in the post you obviously didn't read, I was betting on RKR saving TT and stood up for what I believed. Just as the funeral committee did.

But in the post quoted...You were not part of RKR Designs LLC and you didn't know. A very select few on the inside did, but they did not post anything. I refer you to the lack of communication from RKR complaint, which so many used as a part of the basis for the funeral committee. Seems like people want to say they knew, but were also the ones questioning the lack of information. No one knew for sure about anything.  Funny how that gets overlooked now. And can use facts very recently revealed to rewrite history and say they were right all along. LOL

So to say speak for myself...I did. Based on the same information everyone in the general public had. I was wrong in thinking that RKR could save TT, but I was right in that TT is still alive. We did have to wait and see at the time, just as we have to wait and see now what happens next.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 06, 2015, 04:23:00 AM
KEY, I hope you understand that a patient can be dead but only technically alive because the patient had some external means keeping it breathing and the heart beating; but in reality the patient was dead. The life support was simply the illusion of having a viable company but not officially shutting the doors, having a website, and taking orders for remaining stock.

Now John Henry said that they were not trying to bleed it. I'm am taking his word for it. But to those of us who can and did see a company in trouble and for all intents and purposes, dead, it still appears that way. Why I'm sure you will ask? Well they were not manufacturing any new radios. Second as John did state, they apparently sold off equipment to manufacture radios. So if you are not bleeding it, why are you selling off the equipment you need to produce radios?  If you are not bleeding it, why is there no support or repair for existing radios? How many here have stated that when they called about radio repair they were quoted months?

So I know what I said but this company was dead and simply kept artificially alive to create an illusion of life. It was not premature to announce it was dead because it was dead. John stated the business failed. A failed business is a dead business.

What is left of TenTec now? Well we have a body and some body parts. We have a new owner. For the sake of discussion we'll call the new owner Dr. Frankenstein. Because the good doctor is going to have to take something dead and bring it back to life.

The reality is that what was once TenTec is no more. Dr. Frankenstein we are told has a couple of great engineers. But I take it they are not the same engineers as before. Stan is long gone. Much of the fabrication is gone. Apparently much of the service is gone. I'm guessing some people in manufacturing are still there if it is true they are working on a commercial order, but who knows if that is accurate. They are close to having enough parts to building 10 Omni 7's. The good doctor has radio designs for the Eagle, the Omni 7, Patriot, Rebel and the Argo. Of course, he also owns the name TenTec. In other words, the old TenTec (the body) is gone. The good doctor is going to have to take all these dead body parts and create a new TenTec.

What I am surprised is that you and a few others cannot see what the "funeral committee" accurately observed months ago. TenTec was dead with only the illusion of life that I call life support. We hope Dr. Frankenstein brings it fully back to life, but we all have to face the reality that the new TenTec is not going to look anything like the old TenTec because most of the old TenTec is gone.

The real point of all of this is to show that if some (not you KEY) of the cheerleaders on your squad did less verbal support for TenTec and more financial support, TenTec may have never failed. So when a new TenTec returns, let's hope the rest of your cheerleads start buying their radios to help keep the new TenTec viable. TenTec and its new owner cannot have a viable business on simply cheers and good wishes.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on December 06, 2015, 06:30:49 AM

The real point of all of this is to show that if some (not you KEY) of the cheerleaders on your squad did less verbal support for TenTec and more financial support, TenTec may have never failed. So when a new TenTec returns, let's hope the rest of your cheerleads start buying their radios to help keep the new TenTec viable. TenTec and its new owner cannot have a viable business on simply cheers and good wishes.

That brings up an interesting point.  I own two Omni VI transceivers, and a Paragon II.  The problem that exists is that there are many Ten Tec fans who are still satisfied with the performance of the older rigs.  The early Ten Tec rigs are fairly easy to repair and too keep running. The Sherwood test scores show they can hold their own. A guy on QRZ told me that I was the problem, since I was fixing my old radios and not going out and buying replacements whenever a new model came out.

But, from what I see, Ten Tec fans usually gravitate to newer Ten Tec rigs. It is a small market, and easy to saturate.  Unless the company has military contracts, or other revenue generating ventures, I'd dare say it is going to be hard to be competitive.
 
I came close to pulling the trigger on an Orion, but being board level repair only, and a total lack of service level documentation scared me off.  And the aging fleet of Orions are developing encoder and display problems which is leaving owners scrambling for "near" replacements on eBay or via other venues.

I'm sure there are tons of hams still holding onto their TS-830 rigs and loving them... and I  am sure there are a few with TS-850 radios with defunct PLL boards due to part nonavailability that now own doorstops.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 06, 2015, 12:11:48 PM
KEY, I hope you understand that a patient can be dead but only technically alive because the patient had some external means keeping it breathing and the heart beating; but in reality the patient was dead. The life support was simply the illusion of having a viable company but not officially shutting the doors, having a website, and taking orders for remaining stock.

Now John Henry said that they were not trying to bleed it. I'm am taking his word for it. But to those of us who can and did see a company in trouble and for all intents and purposes, dead, it still appears that way. Why I'm sure you will ask? Well they were not manufacturing any new radios. Second as John did state, they apparently sold off equipment to manufacture radios. So if you are not bleeding it, why are you selling off the equipment you need to produce radios?  If you are not bleeding it, why is there no support or repair for existing radios? How many here have stated that when they called about radio repair they were quoted months?

So I know what I said but this company was dead and simply kept artificially alive to create an illusion of life. It was not premature to announce it was dead because it was dead.

okay, then please cite some examples of where a patient on life support is given a funeral and a death certificate.  since you equate life support with death -- there ought to be ample examples ;)

RKR owned the company for little over half a year.  it intended from the start to make TT vibrant.  RR already made the boards for TT rigs.  K was a TT fan and an amateur; i am not sure how long it took before K left -- but even then what forced the sale was not an intention to kill or dump TT.  The funeral committee *was* premature as was the issuance of the death certificate.   the short amount of time it took for the funeral committee to form here is sad.  and these are hams who purport to want to see American companies succeed?

let's give the new venture at least a year before any funeral talk absent formal official announcements.  73
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 06, 2015, 12:36:37 PM
let's give the new venture at least a year before any funeral talk absent formal official announcements.  73

A year???  You must be very young and inexperienced in life.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on December 06, 2015, 02:48:02 PM
let's give the new venture at least a year before any funeral talk absent formal official announcements.  73

A year???  You must be very young and inexperienced in life.


Well I have been saying lets cut out making comments in this thread and give the guys some time.   I would say six months is reasonable to see some real movement.
With the way the market is moving, A year is crazy!  By then a whole new batch of radios will be on the market.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 06, 2015, 03:26:17 PM
okay, then please cite some examples of where a patient on life support is given a funeral and a death certificate.  since you equate life support with death -- there ought to be ample examples ;)


OK, maybe its more accurate to call TenTec a Zombie company....you know, the undead, or dead but revived by witchcraft!  ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 06, 2015, 04:25:44 PM
KEY, I hope you understand that a patient can be dead but only technically alive because the patient had some external means keeping it breathing and the heart beating; but in reality the patient was dead. The life support was simply the illusion of having a viable company but not officially shutting the doors, having a website, and taking orders for remaining stock.

Now John Henry said that they were not trying to bleed it. I'm am taking his word for it. But to those of us who can and did see a company in trouble and for all intents and purposes, dead, it still appears that way. Why I'm sure you will ask? Well they were not manufacturing any new radios. Second as John did state, they apparently sold off equipment to manufacture radios. So if you are not bleeding it, why are you selling off the equipment you need to produce radios?  If you are not bleeding it, why is there no support or repair for existing radios? How many here have stated that when they called about radio repair they were quoted months?

So I know what I said but this company was dead and simply kept artificially alive to create an illusion of life. It was not premature to announce it was dead because it was dead. John stated the business failed. A failed business is a dead business.

What is left of TenTec now? Well we have a body and some body parts. We have a new owner. For the sake of discussion we'll call the new owner Dr. Frankenstein. Because the good doctor is going to have to take something dead and bring it back to life.

The reality is that what was once TenTec is no more. Dr. Frankenstein we are told has a couple of great engineers. But I take it they are not the same engineers as before. Stan is long gone. Much of the fabrication is gone. Apparently much of the service is gone. I'm guessing some people in manufacturing are still there if it is true they are working on a commercial order, but who knows if that is accurate. They are close to having enough parts to building 10 Omni 7's. The good doctor has radio designs for the Eagle, the Omni 7, Patriot, Rebel and the Argo. Of course, he also owns the name TenTec. In other words, the old TenTec (the body) is gone. The good doctor is going to have to take all these dead body parts and create a new TenTec.

What I am surprised is that you and a few others cannot see what the "funeral committee" accurately observed months ago. TenTec was dead with only the illusion of life that I call life support. We hope Dr. Frankenstein brings it fully back to life, but we all have to face the reality that the new TenTec is not going to look anything like the old TenTec because most of the old TenTec is gone.

The real point of all of this is to show that if some (not you KEY) of the cheerleaders on your squad did less verbal support for TenTec and more financial support, TenTec may have never failed. So when a new TenTec returns, let's hope the rest of your cheerleads start buying their radios to help keep the new TenTec viable. TenTec and its new owner cannot have a viable business on simply cheers and good wishes.

LOL The BS is piling up fast. Revisionist history lovers must be drooling for more to pile up! I may not be able to see it, as you say, but I sure can smell it. LOL

Maybe those that can see just see the trees and not the forest.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA0HCP on December 06, 2015, 05:02:54 PM
Funeral business as usual, I see.

Off to make myself miserable using my expensive, crappy Icom radio.  :)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 07, 2015, 02:49:01 AM
let's give the new venture at least a year before any funeral talk absent formal official announcements.  73

A year???  You must be very young and inexperienced in life.


okay then, taking my above qualification -- absent any official announcements -- how long do you think the gossip committee here should wait before publicly insinuating a death has occurred and it's therefore time for them to talk funeral ???  
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 07, 2015, 03:42:30 AM

okay then, taking my above qualification -- absent any official announcements -- how long do you think the gossip committee here should wait before publicly insinuating a death has occurred and it's therefore time for them to talk funeral ???  

You would have been great if they had the Internet back before WWII. All the people warning Roosevelt of a Japanese attack would have been called the "funeral committee" or the "gossip committee" because they were not believed for their astute observations of reality until the bombs starting dropping.

It is not a matter of a specific time frame. The issue is that TenTec has a serious uphill battle to come back from the dead. They have already lost a year, so another six to twelve months puts them even further behind. The Eagle is old, the Omni 7 is even older, the Argo is crippled in that it does not have all the HF bands and lacks 6 meters. The Patriot and Rebel have a demand, but they are not being manufactured now so buyers are looking elsewhere to satisfy that need. In other words, they are far behind the competition.

Over the past year we saw new innovations from Flex, Elecraft, Kenwood, Icom and Yaesu. Those manufacturers will continue to innovate, improve and remain competitive. Meanwhile, TenTec is trying to rebuild basic manufacturing. How long will it take to bring out an Eagle II, Argo VII, Omni VIII, Orion III or whatever?

It is not how long we on this board will give them. It's about how long the market will give them. I think one other person commented on this board that even 6 months was too long.

Look at it another way, when I tried to purchase an Eagle last year, I was told I had to wait almost three months for the radio. I was not going to wait that long. I bought another radio instead. How many others are going to do the same thing. As the amateur population ages, some just don't have a year to wait. Time is precious and TenTec has little time left to waste. They need to make a big splash at Dayton this year with product and not promises.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 07, 2015, 03:55:24 AM
I had hoped the bickering had stopped with the posts I had made. Maybe they will some day so that people can see real statements when they come out....... ok?

Back to a real bit of text...

I am getting a lot of interest in ways people can help fund TEN-TEC,
I have made a boiler plate message I am sending out to those that do request info, here it is....

Thank you very much for your interest.
A way to do a donation or a downpayment is not set up yet, but when it is, the particulars/details will get announced on the TEN-TEC website.
How to tell when the website has transitioned to the new owner?
If going to www.tentec.com still reroutes to RKRDesignsllc.com, well, the website isn't transitioned yet.
Once he gets that set up, he will also announce any kind of a gofundme or kickstarter or donation or deposit policy there.
Still not 100% sure it is necessary yet, but if/when it is, the news will be on the TEN-TEC website, officially.
Will feel good to get that going again.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 07, 2015, 04:27:54 AM
Time is precious and TenTec has little time left to waste. They need to make a big splash at Dayton this year with product and not promises.
While I do agree, TEN-TEC has to come out with new products asap.
But, with what it is going to take to get to the new product, the main objective for now is to at least get the current product line (a subset thereof) back on the production line and get cash flow flowing.
There is enough interest in the Eagle and the OMNI-VII and others to warrant getting them back into production. Their profits will pay to finish the development of the products that are close, and to fund the future products, e.g. the Orion III mentioned by the new owner in my previous post.

I myself view the Orion III as possible, but there may be other rigs/stuff out before then. Time will tell how all of the technology gets wrangled up together with new featuring/technology into something new that is not on the market, filling other use cases by customers.... Jack had some fantastic ideas that were in the works that aren't in the market yet, so did others that followed.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on December 07, 2015, 10:22:04 AM
I'd suspect many Orion, Eagle, Jupiter owners are very concerned about continued support for their radios.  You can't leave a new Eagle owner hanging for future support. Even the Orion owners deserve some degree of support.

Opining about future products along the lines of Orion III is great... but unless TT owners have some assurance that recently purchased radios won't become obsolete or unsupported by whatever factory emerges is another major consideration.

As a personal opinion, besides the name dropping (Jack) I suspect John Henry has some skin in this game. Which, is a good thing in my opinion. Software engineers are what drive the newer products, and losing their familiarity with the product lineage would be a major loss if TT is to move forward.

And there is only ONE "Jack" who comes to mind, considering past history...   ;D
Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 07, 2015, 11:49:53 AM
It is not how long we on this board will give them. It's about how long the market will give them. I think one other person commented on this board that even 6 months was too long.
[....]
They need to make a big splash at Dayton this year with product and not promises.

i am going to leave your Pearl Harbor reference lie as it seems absurd to treat the banter here like serious talk of national security with as many lives on the line as were lost on our side as well as by Japan in our horrific subsequent decision to nuke two of their cities when we already knew they were nearing surrender.

the question was not how long the market gives an entity, but how long the people here will give the new venture before they start expressing their funeral, death, and demise talk...
i guess you pretty much answered it -- not long. i guess internet forums are what they are...

but since you are bringing up the pressure to release new models before the next rooster crows -- let's look at that.  A brand new company can show up and have a shot at getting a share of the market.  When Elecraft was founded in 1998, were they 30 years behind TT and yet are doing okay today?  Did they instantly come out with several different levels of transceivers? TT has going for them the good wishes of a lot of American hams who have owned TT products in the past and who have a fondness for those rigs.  I am not going to put up undue pressure suggesting what their goals and timeline should be.  that is literally their business.  But they will need to produce quality products that hams will enjoy and want.  

I wish them success and I am looking forward to their having a go at it.  I am not going to put up any expectations, especially not as far as them needing to rush out 5 new rigs in time for Dayton.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 07, 2015, 01:13:01 PM
Where do I fit in this?
I have no vested interest financially whatsover in this sale of the TEN-TEC.
I am not getting paid by the new owner, nor do I expect to in the future. I don't need it, don't ask for it.
I have a job that I enjoy during the day and expect to stay there indefinitely.
I am here to help the community get a better picture on what is going on, and to help the new owner where I can.
My interest resides in the company, the products, the people at TEN-TEC (and yes, even at Alpha), and I hope that this turns into a reboot that eventually pulls them all back into gainful employment and company growth.
There have been several layoffs through the year, leaving some very good people without full time employment, and hours cut on others.
To quell a ton of questions, Jack B is not involved, Scott R is not involved, Rick R is not involved, Stan B is not involved, MFJ is not involved, this is one person with some people inside TEN-TEC for development, manufacturing, purchasing, sales, and a couple of other people outside of TEN-TEC assisting with their spare time with their expertise.

Given my commitments, I will help with software and consulting of other stuff in the evenings as time permits. I may be an idiot, but I am not looking for any kind of compensation for this, just the possibility of my friends continued employment is good enough for me. I'm very happy where I am at now in the day, and with my consulting in the evenings.

Yes, the ship has a hole in the side, it is teetering, but it ain't sunk yet.

Also as I have said on a couple of other forums.
If a specific donation/downpayment/??? program is put in place, it will show up announced on the tentec.com website.
If tentec.com still routes you to rkrdesignsllc.com, then the new owner has not had the domain transferred yet.
When he does, he will use it as the official announcement form. e.g. for the downpayment program (IFF it occurs), the products for sale, the prices, the policies, etc.

me, I'm about done with the front end "status update" help, so, I may drift away for a bit.
So, look for the next step to be the website, or if the new owner wants me to publicize something, etc.
Roller coaster, huh, ......

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 07, 2015, 01:14:14 PM
Forgot,
Regarding Alpha, that is a whole different acquisition. So I can't speculate nor give anything concrete.
Negotiations still ongoing. Might include the same person as TEN-TEC, might not. not sure yet.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 07, 2015, 02:01:39 PM
I am here to help the community get a better picture on what is going on, and to help the new owner where I can.
My interest resides in the company, the products, the people at TEN-TEC (and yes, even at Alpha), and I hope that this turns into a reboot that eventually pulls them all back into gainful employment and company growth.

John your taking the time to post in this forum is *greatly* appreciated and quite helpful, thank you.  
Hopefully there are a LOT of us here who share that same hope for a successful reboot and with that in mind can stop all the side bickering -- at least until Dayton. ;) 

73
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 07, 2015, 04:37:35 PM
I am here to help the community get a better picture on what is going on, and to help the new owner where I can.
My interest resides in the company, the products, the people at TEN-TEC (and yes, even at Alpha), and I hope that this turns into a reboot that eventually pulls them all back into gainful employment and company growth.

John your taking the time to post in this forum is *greatly* appreciated and quite helpful, thank you.  
Hopefully there are a LOT of us here who share that same hope for a successful reboot and with that in mind can stop all the side bickering -- at least until Dayton. ;) 

73

I agree.  They should be able to sell off the rest of the old stuff and get started on the go fund me program by then.  I wonder if they will have a red bucket and a bell at Dayton?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on December 07, 2015, 06:16:29 PM
I am here to help the community get a better picture on what is going on, and to help the new owner where I can.
My interest resides in the company, the products, the people at TEN-TEC (and yes, even at Alpha), and I hope that this turns into a reboot that eventually pulls them all back into gainful employment and company growth.

John your taking the time to post in this forum is *greatly* appreciated and quite helpful, thank you.  
Hopefully there are a LOT of us here who share that same hope for a successful reboot and with that in mind can stop all the side bickering -- at least until Dayton. ;) 

73
I agree.  They should be able to sell off the rest of the old stuff and get started on the go fund me program by then.  I wonder if they will have a red bucket and a bell at Dayton?
Well, the Salvation Army won't be using them until next Christmas...   :)

OK, c'mon guys, give John a break.  Some of you gripe that there's no info, he got you some.  But I guess that wasn't good enough?

Some of you sure seem to be chomping at the bit to be the pall bearers.  The patient ain't dead yet.  Hurting, yes, but the prognosis isn't final. 

So give the man a break and quit acting like you're waiting for your rich uncle to kick the bucket so that you can find out what's in the will.  I have a sneaking hunch you're not in it.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI0T on December 08, 2015, 05:54:11 AM

<...snip...>

i am going to leave your Pearl Harbor reference lie as it seems absurd to treat the banter here like serious talk of national security with as many lives on the line as were lost on our side as well as by Japan in our horrific subsequent decision to nuke two of their cities when we already knew they were nearing surrender.

<...snip...>


That is not true. They were prepared to defend the home islands to the death.  

In our western view of warfare, they were beaten and should surrender.

In their eyes, they still had an undefeated army in Korea/Manchuria to ferry to the home island to defend
Kyushu and Honshu, and had civilians willing to die for their country.

It took both the bomb AND the Russian invasion of Korea/Manchuria to shock them into discussing surrender at the
Imperial War Council with the Emperor voting to break the tie vote...even then junior officers revolted and tried
to destroy the surrender message recording... Remember, Japan had already already ignored the Potsdam
declaration calling for their surrender.

Horrific ? Definitely, but so was Bataan, Nanking and Unit 731.

Ending the war this way was far less costly that invading the home islands.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 08, 2015, 10:40:06 AM
this is way off topic here, so i will begin a thread under 'misc' category in response.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA5IPF on December 08, 2015, 10:47:44 AM
So much for some peoples history lessons. My dad was in WWII. He was a supply sgt in the Pacific(Borneo, Philippines, New Guinea). He already knew his slot in landing on the mainland of Japan. He was in the 7th wave to start coordinating supplies which they were already massing. The invasion was being planned and no GI wanted any part of it. In terms of human life it was going to be very expensive.

The bombs saved untold thousands of lives as the people back then knew the japs were not going to surrender.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on December 08, 2015, 10:53:16 AM
this is way off topic here, so i will begin a thread under 'misc' category in response.

Good idea... I can not imagine how a Ten Tec survival thread could have morphed into nuclear warfare during WWII...except for the passion of some of us Ten Tec supporters.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 08, 2015, 11:10:50 AM
Quote from: W9KEY
this is way off topic here, so i will begin a thread under 'misc' category in response.

Quote from: K1ZJH
Good idea... I can not imagine how a Ten Tec survival thread could have morphed into nuclear warfare during WWII...except for the passion of some of us Ten Tec supporters.

No, it was a funeral committee member -- see post #703 in which NUT brought it into the discussion.

please do not discuss WWII here -- i started a thread in Misc:
http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,106553.0.html

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KASSY on December 08, 2015, 02:41:34 PM
The problem I'm having with the way this is being presented is this -

If the "new" owner wants to remain anonymous, wouldn't it have been a lot easier to simply not announce anything at all?  Why the titillating "I can't tell you who it is but he has plans" stuff?  Isn't this what we've been hearing about Heathkit on and off for 20 years?

This whole thing of saying some stuff, but then keeping things a big dark secret smacks of someone who's more of a used car salesman than someone who knows how to operate a business.

My predictions, which are worth less than a cup of coffee:

::If Mister Invisible shows up at Dayton, and it turns out that he's already a reasonably well-known entity with a history of producing well-accepted products, then the market will embrace him owning and running Ten-Tec.  Like whoever runs LDG, or the Expert amplifier people, Acom...someone who already makes electronics successfully and knows this market and has a track record.

::But, if Mister Invisible turns out to be one of the many who can't quite get their business off the ground, making lots of promises that don't happen, such as the long-awaited KK3AN twin 8877 amp, or the failed Patcomm transceiver or that guy who has been claiming to be the next Heathkit for 10 years...then the market won't trust.  And without trust, there won't be sales of $1500 radios.

So far, the method of communications resembles what we normally expect from Category B.

- k
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 08, 2015, 02:51:50 PM
The updates are giving to let people know what is going on. Many were asking, so I answered.
The anonymity right now is so that he can get a lot of business decisions worked out, service policy set up, sales process set up, factory processes working, invoicing, parts procurement, engineering priorities, new product roadmaps, etc..
He is in the market today, and with that in mind, so is his contact information.
If he were known today, he would be spending a lot of time answering questions, emails, people telling him what rigs to make, what they should look like, explaining why they had bought TEN-TEC rig 30 years ago and the service incident they had 20 years ago, etc. Time, that is why he is anonymous at this moment.
I don't know when he will pony up and announce it, but I do guess that by January or so he will be known across the market.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry


Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 09, 2015, 02:47:57 AM
Quote from: W9KEY
this is way off topic here, so i will begin a thread under 'misc' category in response.

Quote from: K1ZJH
Good idea... I can not imagine how a Ten Tec survival thread could have morphed into nuclear warfare during WWII...except for the passion of some of us Ten Tec supporters.

No, it was a funeral committee member -- see post #703 in which NUT brought it into the discussion.

please do not discuss WWII here -- i started a thread in Misc:
http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,106553.0.html



It's called an analogy - not a discussion of WWII. Geez, unbelievable.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 09, 2015, 02:49:15 AM
not sure why you would rush to go public if you are still ironing out details and directions...

again, this is literally *their* business. feel free to buy your own company, and show us how it is done.  Alpha may be attainable ;)

this is not a publically traded company nor one geared toward average consumers
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 09, 2015, 02:56:27 AM
The updates are giving to let people know what is going on. Many were asking, so I answered.
The anonymity right now is so that he can get a lot of business decisions worked out, service policy set up, sales process set up, factory processes working, invoicing, parts procurement, engineering priorities, new product roadmaps, etc..
He is in the market today, and with that in mind, so is his contact information.
If he were known today, he would be spending a lot of time answering questions, emails, people telling him what rigs to make, what they should look like, explaining why they had bought TEN-TEC rig 30 years ago and the service incident they had 20 years ago, etc. Time, that is why he is anonymous at this moment.
I don't know when he will pony up and announce it, but I do guess that by January or so he will be known across the market.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry


Yup, I don't blame the new owner staying under the radar. Just look at what happens when Jerry at Connect Systems asked for comments on CS7000 he has under development. For two years he is getting bombarded with "must haves." The problem when you do that is if a person's suggestion is left out, that person is offended and does not buy a radio. I hope the engineers this guy has are awesome and they surprise us with a fantastic product. I also hope the new owner is smart enough to know what products need to be manufactured and does not ask for input. That's a rat hole no ham business wants to go down. The suggestions and argument never stop and it ends up building an Edsel, a product no one wants.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 09, 2015, 06:29:10 AM
To answer Kassy's questions:
The announcements were made because there was leakage, and there were ensuing rumors. I was just trying to help the community stay a bit more informed, and realize that things were in the works and would let them know when things were final, which I have. I is now up to the new owner to handle from here, when he goes public, gets the website up, what products to make, etc.

Yes, people were asking, I am very connected and dozens had asked me personally via email, heard discussions on nets with "facts" that were completely untrue. So I felt it necessary at the time to quell the "it was closed, it was bought by xxx, it was gutted and empty, etc.)

It is a one man owner operation, but the staff is still there (what is left after RFC/RKR layoffs), so there are a lot of people pitching in to help the transition, invoicing, shipping, builds (mainly all commercial at the moment), etc. The amateur products had basically stopped shipping because RKR ran out of cash to buy parts with. At the sale price the rigs were still at, there was no room for profit let alone future parts purchases for future builds. No cash flow, no production, no shipments, no money, eternal cycle.

To add a bit more.
I am working with him on getting existing products back into production and back into the market to create a cash flow. Working with him to add things that can make things more attractive (sorry, things is all I can say now, kinda like, "do you want to trade your mercedes for what is behind curtain #3" (remember price is right?) lol.

The others comments on amount of time he will need to devote to public interface is correct. Once he goes public, he will be inundated with all kinds of calls, offers to help, why didn't you do this, my 1973 Paragon was such a great rig and I've used it in 8000 contests so why don't you bring it back, etc........

I have said enough, so, it is time for me to go back to being quiet, working on the transition in the evening, and y'all can wait for real stuff to come from him when he goes public with the website, official announcements will be there for TEN-TEC, and any offerings of a kickstarter or gofundme or downpayment method/offerings will be there.

Something others do need to realize, with things being out of production for almost 6 -8 months or so now (the main rigs), it takes 14 weeks to get them back into production before they can be shipped. That is the longest lead time item that needs purchased.
So, when he is at a point where he can pay for the parts, that 14 week cycle will start.
He is finishing a commercial build, that should ship in January.
So, sometime between now and mid to end of January he will be able to start the 14 week clock.
In the meantime, there may be some OMNI-VIIs that might be able to be shipped.
A certain number were mostly assembled and tested, with a couple of parts remaining then final test.
Once he gets those missing parts in, he may put those x units up for sale right then, sometime in January.
Eagles, not enough to beat the 14 week cycle for it.

I wish him luck, I have no vested interest, but will help where he needs it when I have time.

I wish y'all luck too, hopefully people can go from being negative naysayers to simply waiting for a bit for this guy to pull TEN-TEC from the depths it is at now.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 09, 2015, 08:38:38 AM
With all due respect John I don't recall any leakage other than your posts.  Like KASSY said if the new owner really wanted to stay under the radar and remain totally anonymous then it would be prudent to withhold any comment, let the community speculate all they want but go about business in the shadows. 

It also makes sense that if he is making some kind of announcements having an employee make them would be more appropriate but since he doesn't yet have any employees I get that part.

As for Ten Tec, I called yesterday to see if I could buy a 238C, I was serious because I still think that is one of the best tuners ever made and I wanted to get one while I could.  Guess what??  They don't have any more, seems I was beaten to it by others who feel the same way.  I was told they (RKR mind you) are planning to make another run of these in the first quarter of next year.  Say what??  If a new owner is in the works then why would they say that.  Even more odd is that " we will make more in the first quarter next year is the standard answer for everything.  I guess they are just going to go full throttle production starting in January.  We all know that is a fairy tale.

They are going to finish up the Omnis if they get the stuff they need so they don't have to pay taxes on the excess inventory, that is paid quarterly so in their best interests to get stuff off of the shelf. I don't really see much else happening except for maybe some DYI SDR boards or something similar because those can be bought wholesale from China and rebranded.

So I wish them luck but I remain skeptical at this point, there is just too much hocus pocus surrounding this whole deal and the idea of funding a company via donations is about a ten on the BS meter.  I know there is a small cadre of Ten Tec worshipers who, if you sold a 2X4 with a nail in it and put a Ten Tec logo on it would pay a ridiculous price for it.   I don't think however, they are going to be willing to cough up thousands of dollars on what is a very shaky promise. 

Sorry John but this whole mess just smells like rotten fish.  I wish you and your friends well, it's good of you to think of them.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KASSY on December 09, 2015, 09:22:08 AM
I sure wish them well, but the leakage isn't being handled well, as I see it.

Do you have control over the Ten Tec website?  Why not just put a notice up there "company is in transition and production is temporarily halted.  Expect to see activity in January".  John, your time is valuable, too.

- k
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 09, 2015, 09:23:24 AM
KA4DPO and KASSY, I completely understand your quandry.
I was NOT the original one to bring this up in a public forum, it was brought up by another ham in the ten tec net yahoo group before I ever said anything.
I was alerted to that posting by several hams, they asked me what was going on, etc. I then heard more info on the air.
At the time, it was a post asking for help in purchasing TEN-TEC because the President of RKR at the time had resigned, and it was made known to a few that the RnR wanted out of this business that they were not experienced enough in to manage.
All of this came out before I ever said anything.
They were looking for a buyer then, no one had really come forward until very shortly after that.

So, I'm not the originator, I was brought into this because of my affiliation with TEN-TEC and that most hams trusted me.
I was asked to make the statements I had made, by the new owner when he was in the process of buying the company.

The current TEN-TEC employees are still RKR employees and they are probably still going by the plan sheet that they had been given by RKR. Whether there is a 238C build in January or not, will now fall on the new owner to decide or not.

There has been no place to give donations yet, no downpayments. That will be announced (IFF it happens) on the new TEN-TEC.com website when that is ready.
(added) If I were to have started this already, without identifying the owner, that would have been unethical, JMHO, but I did not. It is up to him if he will even do this, and when.

Honestly, whether you believe me or not, I don't care.
I was asked to give out the information I gave out, and to quell the doomsday sayers that were starting to become vocal just after The K in RKR resigned, and during the time of the announced "if TEN-TEC doesn't get a new owner it will close" announcements made in the ten tec net yahoo group.

As I said before, I am mainly making it public that there is a transition going on, it is not closing. That is probably all I should have ever said, but then that would have started thousands of questions. I already get about 50-75 emails a day, 95% of them are positive saying that whatever happens they wish TT the best, 20% or so are offering to put money down now sight unseen without the knowledge of whom the new owner is, but that won't happen until he has been made public and everything set up.

Just give it time, and early 2016 all will be transitioned, products will start flowing, and everyone can then nit/pick/analyze to death what I said then.

For now, just be patient, and see if the proof is in the pudding.

Granted, something may come up between now and then that the new owner decides to back out, but, he is optimistic with his plan still, and he does have to finish two commercial receiver builds that are in process for various reasons anyway.

(added)
Of course, ALL plans are subject to change, but, the information I am given to post, are items that the new owner has said I can disclose, and are the plans of the moment. REMEMBER, It is still all in transition, so, things could change tomorrow.

I wish you the best

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI0T on December 09, 2015, 12:08:58 PM

<...snip...>

It's called an analogy - not a discussion of WWII. Geez, unbelievable.

It was until he brought in his revisionist views on the use of the atomic bombs on Japan.

And once challenged, he moves it to a new thread that begins with him quoting Wikipedia as a source...

At that point Duffy, I could see it was pointless to discuss anything with him.

73,
Rod

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 09, 2015, 01:37:11 PM

<...snip...>

It's called an analogy - not a discussion of WWII. Geez, unbelievable.

It was until he brought in his revisionist views on the use of the atomic bombs on Japan.

And once challenged, he moves it to a new thread that begins with him quoting Wikipedia as a source...

At that point Duffy, I could see it was pointless to discuss anything with him.

73,
Rod

I understand that you are trying desperately to get this thread closed by dragging it way off topic and introducing politics.  Please take it down the hall to Miscellaneous.

We are not done discussing the Issues surrounding Ten Tec and we have hardly scratched the surface of where Alpha fits into all of this.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 09, 2015, 02:37:03 PM

I understand that you are trying desperately to get this thread closed by dragging it way off topic and introducing politics.  Please take it down the hall to Miscellaneous.

We are not done discussing the Issues surrounding Ten Tec and we have hardly scratched the surface of where Alpha fits into all of this.

Politics? There is nothing political. Don't try to take it where it was never meant to go.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 09, 2015, 02:39:43 PM

I know there is a small cadre of Ten Tec worshipers who, if you sold a 2X4 with a nail in it and put a Ten Tec logo on it would pay a ridiculous price for it.   


Are those available now? I did not see them on the website. Probably not in stock right now. I guess we'll have to wait until the January 2x4 production run.  ::)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 09, 2015, 06:46:26 PM
Only 4 pages left to hit my 20 pages to be added prediction. That was page 33. Good job everyone! LOL

And TT is still alive!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 10, 2015, 02:54:53 AM
Quote from: W9KEY
absent any official announcements -- how long do you think the gossip committee here should wait before publicly insinuating a death has occurred and it's therefore time for them to talk funeral ???

Quote from: WB8NUT

You would have been great if they had the Internet back before WWII. All the people warning Roosevelt of a Japanese attack would have been called the "funeral committee" or the "gossip committee" because they were not believed for their astute observations of reality until the bombs starting dropping.

since you called my reply unbelievable -- above is your unbelievable 'analogy' -- you basically likened the TT funeral committee to astute advisors who warned of an imminent attack on Pearl Harbor but were not sufficiently heeded  ::)   

since the Misc thread i started on WWII was deleted as not ham radio related (even though there were some great & varied perspectives offered) -- how about we tone down the hyperbole here and not make any more war analogies? 

An attempt is being made to get TT back to full health -- let's support that venture by giving it time and calling a cease fire.  73
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 10, 2015, 03:07:12 AM

 -- how about we tone down the hyperbole here and not make any more war analogies? 

An attempt is being made to get TT back to full health -- let's support that venture by giving it time and calling a cease fire.  73

Wait just a darn minute there partner, but isn't your "cease-fire" comment another war analogy after you just asked that it be stopped?   ::)

I think you are violating the armistice!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 10, 2015, 03:17:46 AM

Wait just a darn minute there partner, but isn't your "cease-fire" comment another war analogy after you just asked that it be stopped?   ::)

I think you are violating the armistice!

after consulting with my attorneys, i can neither confirm nor deny anything except that i am endorsing the armitice, and wishing the best for Ten-Tec 2016  :)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 10, 2015, 09:27:10 AM
Quote from: W9KEY
An attempt is being made to get TT back to full health -- let's support that venture by giving it time and calling a cease fire.  73
[/quote]


So I have to assume judging by your statement that you plan to give/donate a substantial amount of money to the Ten Tec bail out effort.  I personally will not give them anything since there is simply no guarantee of any return on investment and it has all of the earmarks of total failure.  That means that any money you donate is simply gone and is not even tax deductible.

I still have a lot of curiosity about Alpha.  For many years Alpha has been the gold standard of Amateur power amplifiers and I would really like to see them succeed as well but again I would never just give them money.  Even common stock is a better deal if it fails because the loss is tax deductible, a gift is money down the toilet.  I am curious what you are going to say when your deity goes down the drain?  Seem to me like you might have to keep it on the down low for a while. 

So does anyone have any new information regarding the fate of Alpha?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: DL8OV on December 10, 2015, 10:16:30 AM
Just a thought, rather than issue appeals for donations to refloat the company why not issue a new batch of shares? Price them at 100 USD each and make sure that there's a nice certificate to hang on the wall next to the DXCC and the WAS awards.

Peter DL8OV
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 10, 2015, 11:27:57 AM
Quote from: W9KEY
An attempt is being made to get TT back to full health -- let's support that venture by giving it time and calling a cease fire.  73

Quote from: KA4DPO
So I have to assume judging by your statement that you plan to give/donate a substantial amount of money to the Ten Tec bail out effort.  I personally will not give them anything since there is simply no guarantee of any return on investment and it has all of the earmarks of total failure.  That means that any money you donate is simply gone and is not even tax deductible.

yep, this is a true donation and not one invented by the wealthy as a strategy to defray taxes.  actually i am in no position to throw a chunk of change their (or anyone else's) way.  money has not been something i have chased or accumulated, and i was not born into any.   my support will be in not putting pressure on them in terms of a timeline nor will i presume to tell them how to run their business. i will speak highly of TT rigs i have owned and continue to have a nostalgic fondness for the brand.  when it comes time to buy a new rig, i will look for something like a Jupiter II if they offer such an animal.  or i might possibly go in the direction of an Argonaut VII.  Fortunately for now, my Jupiter does everything i need.  73
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 10, 2015, 01:40:52 PM
Quote from: W9KEY
An attempt is being made to get TT back to full health -- let's support that venture by giving it time and calling a cease fire.  73

Quote from: KA4DPO
So I have to assume judging by your statement that you plan to give/donate a substantial amount of money to the Ten Tec bail out effort.  I personally will not give them anything since there is simply no guarantee of any return on investment and it has all of the earmarks of total failure.  That means that any money you donate is simply gone and is not even tax deductible.

yep, this is a true donation and not one invented by the wealthy as a strategy to defray taxes.  actually i am in no position to throw a chunk of change their (or anyone else's) way.  money has not been something i have chased or accumulated, and i was not born into any.   my support will be in not putting pressure on them in terms of a timeline nor will i presume to tell them how to run their business.

Whoopti Freakin Doo.  99.999999 percent of the worlds population is already supporting them by not pressuring them because they never heard of them.  AFWIW no one is pressuring anyone here, I am just pointing out what has got to be the screwiest company buyout plan that I have ever heard of.  Hot dog vendors in DC get small business loans all the time so I have to wonder why the maybe sort of might be new owner can't do the same.  If you can't get start up money for a business you have got some serious problems and no one with any sense will want to throw money at that..
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 11, 2015, 02:49:25 AM
Whoopti Freakin Doo.  99.999999 percent of the worlds population is already supporting them by not pressuring them because they never heard of them.  AFWIW no one is pressuring anyone here, I am just pointing out what has got to be the screwiest company buyout plan that I have ever heard of.  Hot dog vendors in DC get small business loans all the time so I have to wonder why the maybe sort of might be new owner can't do the same.  If you can't get start up money for a business you have got some serious problems and no one with any sense will want to throw money at that..

If it is so easy to get business loans, why are their so many non traditional sources for business funding thriving? Could it be because there is a need for them?

Just because you think it is the screwiest thing in the world does not stop thousands of business start ups as well as existing businesses from using them. It is all part of our capitalist economy. Banks are no longer the be all - end all for business financing.

So why can't the new owner of TT do as other businesses have done?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 11, 2015, 05:50:14 AM
I don't think he has considered a small business loan path. I'm sure that a quick review of the profit / loss statements for the last year would probably end up in a bank denying a small business loan. Just my opinion, could be wrong.
Plus, in my opinion, if you take out a small business loan, yes, you are able to do things now that you would not be able to do until later, e.g. new location (the rent in the current location is rather high for what you get, again, RFC, argh), samples for new product R&D, ability to start buying OMNI-VII parts for production now rather than wait until the commercial radio shipments start on the current run (commercial receiver is in production now, boards coming in, expect to ship the first delivery qty in January, so, can invoice and get the $$$$ for them then), etc.
But it also extends the time when he is not making money from his own investment and rolling it into the next build. So, it might push out other things later. e.g. he would be making loan payments rather than spending that mosly payment on other things needed, parts for the 2nd run, etc.
So, he is trying to do it without a loan. Using his own personal funds, and not funds from his current business, so this whole thing if it crashes down he doesn't lose his current business as well.

Kickstarter might work well. I have seen a LOT of interest in emails from hams saying "where do I send the $ now".
I am not 100% a proponent of a downpayment method. Reason being, to me, it is similar to a loan. You use that money now to buy parts, and when you ship, you collect x$ less. Well, that x$ less eats into what would have been profit at that time. But, it is a bit better than a loan, in that (hypothetical numbers here, ok?) if you make a run of 100 where 10 had deposits, well, $1000*10 now helps get parts, but $1000*10 does not eat any of the profit from the 90 units sold without deposits. So he should have enough from the 90 to still pay salaries, overhead, and purchase the next run, and have some left over to bank on. Then, after a few runs, there would always be money to bank on to start runs without having the previous one pay for the next, etc.
Cash flow, it needs to sustain itself without a loan, otherwise it will not sustain itself after the loan is paid.
Similar to the result of the megasale.
Megasale prices were actually losses on each radio for TEN-TEC. Some models worse than others. There is a sweet spot between the pre-megasale prices and the varying megasale prices.
So, after parts were depleted that were in stock for the megasale, the funds captured during the megasale, since it was a loss when you consider overhead, board issues using a new board house, parts issues from some date codes (all taken care of, identified the issue early, isolated to a given date code, put in place a selection step, limited exposure to 16 units only, and all were taken care of immediately once the problem was found), repair time, etc., was not sufficient to sustain follow on production runs.
The new owner does not want a repeat of any of the above, using other "pre-funding / rob Peter to pay Paul / methods".

Anyway, that is my twisted thinking, could be wrong, been wrong before....

If it can sustain itself with the current balance sheet (negative) through the first two runs, then it will definitely sustain itself later once runs are cycling paying for their selves, and covering overhead. If he finds that the first run doesn't profit enough to do the second, then he can deal with it then, a smaller small business loan, etc. baby steps until things are flowing and sustaining itself.

I've had suggestions to have him work with other 3rd party vendors for now for development, that is actually in process, e.g. myself, another, another, etc.

I myself wish he would speed up his timetable a bit, e.g. get the website running (granted, that is in the works, and I don't know all of the time / effort required to get that going, domain changes, etc.), get phone and internet accounts transitioned, etc. and make his own announcements now. So, I'm like most on here, I do want the info out now, but, he knows more about what he is dealing with than I do. I at least know that it ain't easy, e.g. both Alpha and TEN-TEC invoicing goes through the same software package, meaning, for now, since he has bought TEN-TEC and the Alpha negotiations are ongoing, then they have to figure out how to get the money to RKR/QSC for alpha expenses and sales, or to the new TEN-TEC owner, website work, product planning, marketing planning, the day to day hassle of RKR doing the commercial build with the RKR employees, while he is trying to get things started with those same employees to transition things over to his MRP process, production process, engineering methods, sales policy, future service policy, getting a bank set up for business purposes WHILE the existing business still is active, that is not that easy, you have to change how sales are entered and how funds are captured from the customer, how service/repair jobs are handled financially, etc. TONS to do.
The RFC deal was in the works for months after he had officially bought it before it was announced.
The RKR deal was almost immediate because nothing really changed except that the banking changed which really only affected sales being captured at that point in time.

Hopefully he doesn't have to change to many of the current TEN-TEC policies to survive.
e.g. today someone can call service and when the service man is in, can talk with him for hours to trouble shoot a shack problem. Well, that really needs to change. If he spends 2 hours on the phone with someone, then he is losing money for two hours for the company. That is a luxury that TEN-TEC can't afford at the current time, so, my thought would be to give the customer a period of time where they can talk,then if it goes longer than x minutes (5? 10? 15?) then either end the call or start charging per 15 minute increments. A 5-10 minute or less call is plenty to identify the problem in the rig, and decide whether to ship it to TT for repair or not. A call that is starting to take more than 5-10 minutes, well, that means they are probably having to trouble shoot the shack as well, and the rig probably won't come back to TT for service repair anyway. That type of help should be performed by hams outside of TEN-TEC, e.g. similar to an elmer process. EVENTUALLY, this type of repair policy might go back to the way it was, but for now, the extra time could be bleeding away $ and could be a reason why some rigs now take 4 weeks or longer to get back.
Imagine this 2 hour call happening twice a week, and the 1 hour call happening 20 times a week. That is 24 hours there that TEN-TEC provided for free to the customers. WHILE NOT performing actual rig service work. That is probably 5-10 rigs that would have been resolved and shipped back to a customer and invoiced for the time for TEN-TEC to pay for their time, of course, depending upon the problem.
Again, that is my twisted thinking, and things have to be done to cut costs, wasted time, for now. Eventually, time will tell. Almost all repair shops I know of do not allow you to talk incessantly on the phone, trouble shooting everything from the antenna to the rig and finding out that you have insufficient connections in the path.......
Granted, some items may require that amount of time, e.g. getting drivers installed when the process itself takes 30 minutes to do anyway. Do those stepwise.....
Anyway, again, my twisted thinking.

For now, I'll still disclose what I can when he says it is ok.

I'll answer what I can here, and in email (prefer here so others see)

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on December 11, 2015, 07:28:57 AM
Now 50 pages and 740 posts about "ifs, ands, maybes, and buts". Starting over and competing against the five (Icom, Yaesu, Kenwood, Elecraft, Flex) well-established ham radio manufacturers in a niche market as it is, I hope the guy knows what he's doing. Under-capitalizing an essentially new business (that requires a LOT of money) is a recipe for disaster. Sounds like a risky venture to me, a retired retail owner/businessman.

With that being said, I wish him luck. I'm sure he's done his research and due-diligence.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on December 11, 2015, 08:36:57 AM
Hopefully he doesn't have to change to many of the current TEN-TEC policies to survive.
e.g. today someone can call service and when the service man is in, can talk with him for hours to trouble shoot a shack problem. Well, that really needs to change. If he spends 2 hours on the phone with someone, then he is losing money for two hours for the company.


There is a solution. NE1U, Barry, runs an excellent Ten Tec Wiki site that contains loads of useful support information for older Ten Tec rigs.  And the Ten Tec reflector on the contesting.com site is another source to contact knowledgeable Ten Tec fans, for both technical and support related questions. 

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 11, 2015, 09:39:33 AM
Hopefully he doesn't have to change to many of the current TEN-TEC policies to survive.
e.g. today someone can call service and when the service man is in, can talk with him for hours to trouble shoot a shack problem. Well, that really needs to change. If he spends 2 hours on the phone with someone, then he is losing money for two hours for the company.


There is a solution. NE1U, Barry, runs an excellent Ten Tec Wiki site that contains loads of useful support information for older Ten Tec rigs.  And the Ten Tec reflector on the contesting.com site is another source to contact knowledgeable Ten Tec fans, for both technical and support related questions. 

Pete
Yes, I agree, and there are other groups as well, e.g. the OMNI-VII and Eagle and Argonaut VI user groups on yahoo, there are a lot of hams in there that have done just about everything with those rigs in combination with things that TEN-TEC doesn't have on hand to test with, and in a real world environment rather than in the lab. e.g. Bob McGraw K4TAX, Rick DJ0IP, etc. etc. (I am not mentioning the dozens of names, so, don't take leaving a name out as slighting anybody or promoting anyone over anyone else, geesh disclaimers)
People in the Rebel and Patriot yahoo groups that not only answer simple usage questions but many have created their own sketches (software and hardware changes to add featuring) and posted them to the yahoo group for others to take and use. granted TEN-TEC can and will only answer questions when using the TEN-TEC version of the hardware and software, as they have no clue as to where the "glitch" came from. So, service questions for these two (rebel/patriot) are probably best answered in the yahoo groups anyway. JMHO.

These groups sometimes have a better answer from real world use, sometimes they have a differing opinion on certain things than TEN-TEC service does, but they are all there to help,

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 11, 2015, 09:46:50 AM

If it is so easy to get business loans, why are their so many non traditional sources for business funding thriving? Could it be because there is a need for them?

Just because you think it is the screwiest thing in the world does not stop thousands of business start ups as well as existing businesses from using them. It is all part of our capitalist economy. Banks are no longer the be all - end all for business financing.

So why can't the new owner of TT do as other businesses have done?

They seem to do well in third world counties for tiny cottage industries where one or two women make scarves or something like that.  We are not talking about a cottage industry here.  The amount of money needed to re-establish and operate a radio manufacturer is much bigger than that.  They are going to need a line of credit on the order of a million dollars or so for the first year.  They have to hire employees, purchase equipment, lease a building, establish and pay for utilities, salaries, insurance, and a host of other expenses.  Even JH admits that the corporate leger would scare the banks away from such risk.  So where do you get a million plus dollars?

Are you going to provide funding?  how much?  If you can find one thousand people each willing to donate $1000.00 then you have your million.  You will not find 1000 people who are willing to give a large sum of money as a gift because that is what it is, a gift.  I don't know how old you are or what your experience in life is but I worked for Harris Corporation in Melbourne, FL many years ago and I have a very good idea of what it takes to produce radios at a reasonable profit.  I also know what takes to set up a small manufacturing facility and believe you me it aint cheap.

Anyway, please let us all know how much you invest in the company and how much return you get on your investment.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on December 11, 2015, 10:20:07 AM
There are those of us who think of $1000 as just pennies.  What I am not willing to do is to dump my money down a pit.
Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 11, 2015, 11:39:24 AM
Actually, this doesn't require the funding of a new company. A new company has no followers, no communication chains, no products in the market of their own, etc. etc.
TEN-TEC has thousands of avid followers, it also already has the internal infrastructure setup to do business, to do engineering, service, etc.
There are products that are sort of in the production pipeline, existing stock parts to use for a majority of the rigs (maybe not 100% of stocked parts on 100% of the rigs, but, enough to start with that cuts lead times down quite substantially), already have metal in house for parts of each rig, already have the entire factory / test equipment, engineering computers / test equipment / solder, bare metal for future rigs, etc. etc.
With what is in stock, after the purchase price of the company, it could just take $50k more investment in parts, and a month or two of overhead/labor/lights/etc before products ship, giving return on investment of the purchase price of the company itself.

So, this is a reboot which is a huge difference in cash required and marketing required that a new business requires.
Making the investment hundreds of thousands less to make this successful.
Millions isn't required to start cash flow, just tens of thousands.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 11, 2015, 01:09:43 PM

They seem to do well in third world counties for tiny cottage industries where one or two women make scarves or something like that.  We are not talking about a cottage industry here.  The amount of money needed to re-establish and operate a radio manufacturer is much bigger than that.  They are going to need a line of credit on the order of a million dollars or so for the first year.  They have to hire employees, purchase equipment, lease a building, establish and pay for utilities, salaries, insurance, and a host of other expenses.  Even JH admits that the corporate leger would scare the banks away from such risk.  So where do you get a million plus dollars?

Are you going to provide funding?  how much?  If you can find one thousand people each willing to donate $1000.00 then you have your million.  You will not find 1000 people who are willing to give a large sum of money as a gift because that is what it is, a gift.  I don't know how old you are or what your experience in life is but I worked for Harris Corporation in Melbourne, FL many years ago and I have a very good idea of what it takes to produce radios at a reasonable profit.  I also know what takes to set up a small manufacturing facility and believe you me it aint cheap.

Anyway, please let us all know how much you invest in the company and how much return you get on your investment.

Obviously you have no clue on modern non-banking business funding. You get a Hollywood style glimpse if you watch an episode of Shark Tank. Did you ever do a google search and look at all the possibilities from many sources? Too numerous to mention here. And they are not 3rd world women making scarves. Some of the products you use in life may have used this style of funding.

Yes you worked for a mega corporation that can spend buckets of money on bloated R+D labs, start from scratch on each design, re-invent the wheel with each new system, and work with the newest thing-a-ma-bob that may be some new feature that would never be adapted to anything else. Just because that's what you worked for does not mean every company works the same way.

The problem is you think too much like this is still the 1970's or 80's in the business world. Things have changed drastically. And obviously you have not changed with it. Your commentary shows it.

I grew up and started working in the late 70's. I worked in my fathers business for some years. As his business slowly died, I went back to college and got my electronics degree. Graduated in 88. Worked for large companies like Navistar, ABB, and Siemens. Worked at several smaller companies as well. So I do have some business knowledge as well as electronics production. I am still working so I need to keep up to date with many of the latest developments. I also have my own small part time business. So I understand getting funding in these modern funding opportunities.

I would invest, if needed, based on a thorough look at what they need, rate of return, risk assessment, background of management; just as I would any other investment. Like John Henry said, TT probably doesn't need a Harris style budget to reboot the company. But I can also see where a small investment by a large group could help the company, and not even be a major outlay of my own cash.

The real question is why do you hate TT so much that no matter what news comes out, you always find fault? And then you and NUT try to find fault with those that post, and make remarks about them when you have no knowledge of them or their families or their work background. Why is that? In my case the personal questions have been ones I took the time to answer mainly because the remarks were usually wrong. I know it bores the hell out of most, but if the remarks were not made, I would not have to correct you and NUT. Or pass on boring details to answer your questions.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 11, 2015, 02:07:47 PM

They seem to do well in third world counties for tiny cottage industries where one or two women make scarves or something like that.  We are not talking about a cottage industry here.  The amount of money needed to re-establish and operate a radio manufacturer is much bigger than that.  They are going to need a line of credit on the order of a million dollars or so for the first year.  They have to hire employees, purchase equipment, lease a building, establish and pay for utilities, salaries, insurance, and a host of other expenses.  Even JH admits that the corporate leger would scare the banks away from such risk.  So where do you get a million plus dollars?

Are you going to provide funding?  how much?  If you can find one thousand people each willing to donate $1000.00 then you have your million.  You will not find 1000 people who are willing to give a large sum of money as a gift because that is what it is, a gift.  I don't know how old you are or what your experience in life is but I worked for Harris Corporation in Melbourne, FL many years ago and I have a very good idea of what it takes to produce radios at a reasonable profit.  I also know what takes to set up a small manufacturing facility and believe you me it aint cheap.

Anyway, please let us all know how much you invest in the company and how much return you get on your investment.

Obviously you have no clue on modern non-banking business funding. You get a Hollywood style glimpse if you watch an episode of Shark Tank. Did you ever do a google search and look at all the possibilities from many sources? Too numerous to mention here. And they are not 3rd world women making scarves. Some of the products you use in life may have used this style of funding.

Yes you worked for a mega corporation that can spend buckets of money on bloated R+D labs, start from scratch on each design, re-invent the wheel with each new system, and work with the newest thing-a-ma-bob that may be some new feature that would never be adapted to anything else. Just because that's what you worked for does not mean every company works the same way.

The problem is you think too much like this is still the 1970's or 80's in the business world. Things have changed drastically. And obviously you have not changed with it. Your commentary shows it.

I grew up and started working in the late 70's. I worked in my fathers business for some years. As his business slowly died, I went back to college and got my electronics degree. Graduated in 88. Worked for large companies like Navistar, ABB, and Siemens. Worked at several smaller companies as well. So I do have some business knowledge as well as electronics production. I am still working so I need to keep up to date with many of the latest developments. I also have my own small part time business. So I understand getting funding in these modern funding opportunities.

I would invest, if needed, based on a thorough look at what they need, rate of return, risk assessment, background of management; just as I would any other investment. Like John Henry said, TT probably doesn't need a Harris style budget to reboot the company. But I can also see where a small investment by a large group could help the company, and not even be a major outlay of my own cash.

The real question is why do you hate TT so much that no matter what news comes out, you always find fault? And then you and NUT try to find fault with those that post, and make remarks about them when you have no knowledge of them or their families or their work background. Why is that? In my case the personal questions have been ones I took the time to answer mainly because the remarks were usually wrong. I know it bores the hell out of most, but if the remarks were not made, I would not have to correct you and NUT. Or pass on boring details to answer your questions.

I just don't like BS is all.  As for the "alternative funding" Please.   You can run across the freeway blindfolded and you might make once or twice.  I know that no one with any sense just gives money away to a company that is on life support and standing on a banana peel at the edge of the cliff.  The problem is that you think you're correct.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on December 11, 2015, 02:30:33 PM
thing about a SBA backed small business loan is that you have to cross all the Ts and dot all the Is that a business the size of your dreams in 3 years would have to do.  one of my stepsons found that out.  includes a percentage of personal investment, etc, just like buying a house larger than maybe you should.  the process also grinds out over months.

the unnamed potential buyer sounds like he's got a business, so he has that knowledge.  not all here do.  I couldn't do it, either.

one thing from The Source nags at me... The New TenTec does not have metal fab facilities.  I presume they remain from the RKR era with RR, otherwise they can't continue what they're doing.  TnTT would have to go to a stamper, get dies made, get in line with the production schedule, etc.  that's going to add a couple months someplace in the Gantt chart, in parallel with other tasks or not.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 11, 2015, 04:29:06 PM
These posts just get more outrageous. Some people still hold onto the belief that TenTec never died. Then others state it will essentially be a new business. You are correct, TenTec was dead, they just failed to tell anyone about it.

John Henry talks about there being a big following for TenTec and that they are not really starting from scratch. Well sort of, kind of as the real TenTec does not really exist anymore. The people are mostly gone, parts for older rigs maybe gone, service must be gone because they are quoting months to complete the repair, the manufacturing equipment was reportedly sold, the new building is tiny and a rented building with other occupants besides TenTec. The radio designs they own are somewhat outdated except for the Rebel and the Patriot. They have parts for building maybe a few radios. So folks, the original TenTec does not exist any longer except in name.

Then you have some guy who sits in front of a CAD screen all day purporting to be knowledgeable on small business financing. He also says he could invest in the business if he had all the information, but claims he does not have the money to buy a TenTec radio to help keep them in business. As I said before, TenTec cannot come back on good wishes and hot air. It needs money and a lot of money. It needs customers buying radios now.

And then you have those who express doubts about the company whose opinions are being referred to as "hate." A disagreement is not hate. I guess that is the way the world is today, if you disagree, you must be hateful. It is not further from the truth. To make an informed decision about anything you need to evaluate two or more points of view.

I loved TenTec and owned numerous TenTec radios bought directly from TenTec. So I supported them with more than words. I gave them my money. But as much as I want to see them succeed, I have serious concerns about their future viability. The old TenTec I knew and loved does not exist today; it's gone. So someone is going to pick up the name and try to bring it back to life. Great, but given what I know now, I would not buy a TenTec radio today. The business is not capitalized or severely undercapitalized. It is not making money so no bank will extend it a loan. Shark Tank would not invest as the market is far too small. Not sure if you can find enough hams to risk crowd funding since most hams are very cheap. I would not want to buy a radio I think had a reasonable chance of being soon orphaned. Been there with the Patcomm years ago and not going to do it again.

Now if the business were adequately capitalized, I might feel quite a bit differently. The risk is too great for my taste right now. This is not just an uphill climb, this is like climbing Mount Everest in gym shoes.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 11, 2015, 04:46:53 PM
These posts just get more outrageous. Some people still hold onto the belief that TenTec never died. Then others state it will essentially be a new business. You are correct, TenTec was dead, they just failed to tell anyone about it.

John Henry talks about there being a big following for TenTec and that they are not really starting from scratch. Well sort of, kind of as the real TenTec does not really exist anymore. The people are mostly gone, parts for older rigs maybe gone, service must be gone because they are quoting months to complete the repair, the manufacturing equipment was reportedly sold, the new building is tiny and a rented building with other occupants besides TenTec. The radio designs they own are somewhat outdated except for the Rebel and the Patriot. They have parts for building maybe a few radios. So folks, the original TenTec does not exist any longer except in name.

Then you have some guy who sits in front of a CAD screen all day purporting to be knowledgeable on small business financing. He also says he could invest in the business if he had all the information, but claims he does not have the money to buy a TenTec radio to help keep them in business. As I said before, TenTec cannot come back on good wishes and hot air. It needs money and a lot of money. It needs customers buying radios now.

And then you have those who express doubts about the company whose opinions are being referred to as "hate." A disagreement is not hate. I guess that is the way the world is today, if you disagree, you must be hateful. It is not further from the truth. To make an informed decision about anything you need to evaluate two or more points of view.

I loved TenTec and owned numerous TenTec radios bought directly from TenTec. So I supported them with more than words. I gave them my money. But as much as I want to see them succeed, I have serious concerns about their future viability. The old TenTec I knew and loved does not exist today; it's gone. So someone is going to pick up the name and try to bring it back to life. Great, but given what I know now, I would not buy a TenTec radio today. The business is not capitalized or severely undercapitalized. It is not making money so no bank will extend it a loan. Shark Tank would not invest as the market is far too small. Not sure if you can find enough hams to risk crowd funding since most hams are very cheap. I would not want to buy a radio I think had a reasonable chance of being soon orphaned. Been there with the Patcomm years ago and not going to do it again.

Now if the business were adequately capitalized, I might feel quite a bit differently. The risk is too great for my taste right now. This is not just an uphill climb, this is like climbing Mount Everest in gym shoes.

Well said.   I liked my Omni C a lot but that was a long time ago.   I'll still buy a used Ten Tec radio if the price is right.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 11, 2015, 06:35:18 PM
Quote from: WB8NUT
These posts just get more outrageous. Some people still hold onto the belief that TenTec never died. Then others state it will essentially be a new business. You are correct, TenTec was dead, they just failed to tell anyone about it.  

did u make a bet that TT was toast and now you are trying to get out of paying it by pretending you were spot on all along  ???

Quote from: WB8NUT
This is not just an uphill climb, this is like climbing Mount Everest in gym shoes.

of course it is.  in fact i doubt anyone could surpass your rather superb analogy  ::)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 11, 2015, 11:03:21 PM
Quote from: WB8NUT
These posts just get more outrageous. Some people still hold onto the belief that TenTec never died. Then others state it will essentially be a new business. You are correct, TenTec was dead, they just failed to tell anyone about it.  

did u make a bet that TT was toast and now you are trying to get out of paying it by pretending you were spot on all along  ???

Quote from: WB8NUT
This is not just an uphill climb, this is like climbing Mount Everest in gym shoes.

of course it is.  in fact i doubt anyone could surpass your rather superb analogy  ::)

Well said. NUT and DPO need to come to the real world. And stop pretending they are TT fans when all they do is spread hate and death of TT. And DPO, if you don't like BS, stop spreading it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on December 12, 2015, 06:09:39 PM
I just hope when the gofundme.com page is launched that certain names show up right away with the much needed $1000-$2000 or else a lot of this has been all talk.

  
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 13, 2015, 04:28:07 AM
I just hope when the gofundme.com page is launched that certain names show up right away with the much needed $1000-$2000 or else a lot of this has been all talk.
  

We all know that they will never put their money on the line. Cheerleaders never actually play the game. They just stand on the sidelines cheering those on who actually do the work and put themselves out there, win or lose. When the game is lost, the cheerleaders are no where to be found. They'll only show up at the party if their team wins, feasting on the food and drink others have provided to award the victors.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 13, 2015, 11:07:08 AM
I just hope when the gofundme.com page is launched that certain names show up right away with the much needed $1000-$2000 or else a lot of this has been all talk.
  

We all know that they will never put their money on the line. Cheerleaders never actually play the game. They just stand on the sidelines cheering those on who actually do the work and put themselves out there, win or lose. When the game is lost, the cheerleaders are no where to be found. They'll only show up at the party if their team wins, feasting on the food and drink others have provided to award the victors.

LOL And you base that opinion on what for all the hams who wish and hope TT carries on? Your own twisted opinion again? Or can you factually back it up? (real statistics)

Again the BS is piling up.

Only a couple pages left...LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on December 13, 2015, 02:28:22 PM
One thing I don't see on this thread is much about Alpha.  Was Ten Tec bought to siphon off their assets to prop up Alpha?  With all the dust swirling around RKR, I bought an Acom amp instead of Alpha because I am not sure they if Alpha will be around for a while or not.
Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI0T on December 13, 2015, 02:36:17 PM

<...snip...>

Well said. NUT and DPO need to come to the real world. And stop pretending they are TT fans when all they do is spread hate and death of TT. And DPO, if you don't like BS, stop spreading it.

TT died. Deal with it.

It may come back, but viable business don't use go-fund-me accounts or ask for donations.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 13, 2015, 05:41:32 PM

<...snip...>

Well said. NUT and DPO need to come to the real world. And stop pretending they are TT fans when all they do is spread hate and death of TT. And DPO, if you don't like BS, stop spreading it.

TT died. Deal with it.

It may come back, but viable business don't use go-fund-me accounts or ask for donations.



LOL

Show me the court resolution that the corporation that contains all assets and liabilities has filed to dissolve the company. It needs to be the one that a judge has signed off on. Then it is dead.

And if it were dead, it would have no assets. Anything of value needs to be liquidated to end a corporations life, and debts retired, and any remaining monies (if any remain) distributed to the membership of the corporation. There would then be nothing to buy out. So it is alive since RKR is selling TT to a new ownership. Along with any liabilities as well as assets of TT.

And yes they do. Only lazy people afraid to do a little research would make that statement.

Deal with it! LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 13, 2015, 08:05:56 PM
thing about a SBA backed small business loan is that you have to cross all the Ts and dot all the Is that a business the size of your dreams in 3 years would have to do.  one of my stepsons found that out.  includes a percentage of personal investment, etc, just like buying a house larger than maybe you should.  the process also grinds out over months.

the unnamed potential buyer sounds like he's got a business, so he has that knowledge.  not all here do.  I couldn't do it, either.

one thing from The Source nags at me... The New TenTec does not have metal fab facilities.  I presume they remain from the RKR era with RR, otherwise they can't continue what they're doing.  TnTT would have to go to a stamper, get dies made, get in line with the production schedule, etc.  that's going to add a couple months someplace in the Gantt chart, in parallel with other tasks or not.
TEN-TEC, when it was RFC, sold the metal fab to a local company with the intentions of getting all of their metal done there. The company that bought them was going to do other things also with the punch/press and bender and other equipment that they bought. The idea was, TEN-TEC did not have to pay the overhead of the metal shop, maintenance, fixing them (they weren't cheap to repair, did that a few times), the salary and overhead of the worker (who, by the way, two of the TEN-TEC metal shop employees were hired by the company that bought the metal shop). So the very same process we used in house to make the drawings, and then hand it to the metal fab shop to do, well, it was the same, nothing new to buy, learn, etc. Going with other metal shops would have required stepping up to 3d, a big step for our guys.

Personally, if I were to do it, I don't think I would have sold the metal shop. I would have re-evaluated what it cost to make metal for others, and price accordingly, and open it up for more work hours. It would have then been a continuous cash generator, like it use to be years ago.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JAS on December 14, 2015, 03:14:58 AM

LOL

Show me the court resolution that the corporation that contains all assets and liabilities has filed to dissolve the company. It needs to be the one that a judge has signed off on. Then it is dead.

And if it were dead, it would have no assets. Anything of value needs to be liquidated to end a corporations life, and debts retired, and any remaining monies (if any remain) distributed to the membership of the corporation. There would then be nothing to buy out. So it is alive since RKR is selling TT to a new ownership. Along with any liabilities as well as assets of TT.

And yes they do. Only lazy people afraid to do a little research would make that statement.

Deal with it! LOL

Mr. LOL is back again showing ignorance. You know, the guy who has no money to buy a radio from TT, but is willing to invest in the company if shown the finances.

A judge does not have to sign off on the closing of a business. It goes to court and is adjudicated if a business files for bankruptcy. A business can close down without bankruptcy for many reasons and no court has to be involved at all. No judge needs to sign off on anything if a business just decides to close the doors.

As we have seen with Heathkit, a business can basically dissolve, but then the owner of the name can sell the name. The buyer of the name can then attempt to start the business all over again. But the new business while similar to the old business is not the same business as the old business. The old Heathkit essentially died and a new Heathkit resurfaced in its place. Which is what we essentially see with TT.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 14, 2015, 05:20:15 AM
A judge does not have to sign off on the closing of a business. It goes to court and is adjudicated if a business files for bankruptcy. A business can close down without bankruptcy for many reasons and no court has to be involved at all. No judge needs to sign off on anything if a business just decides to close the doors.

As we have seen with Heathkit, a business can basically dissolve, but then the owner of the name can sell the name. The buyer of the name can then attempt to start the business all over again. But the new business while similar to the old business is not the same business as the old business. The old Heathkit essentially died and a new Heathkit resurfaced in its place. Which is what we essentially see with TT.

Have you or a close family member ever dissolved a corporation? I have been there and done that. You can close anything, but there are rules to dissolve a corporation.  And a corporation is not dead until dissolved. Brush up on your business law.

Yes you can claim old names if they are no longer trademarked. TT is still trademarked because the corporation still exists.

And BTW...LOL to you.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI0T on December 14, 2015, 05:51:03 AM

<...snip...>

Have you or a close family member ever dissolved a corporation? I have been there and done that. You can close anything, but there are rules to dissolve a corporation.  And a corporation is not dead until dissolved. Brush up on your business law.

Yes you can claim old names if they are no longer trademarked. TT is still trademarked because the corporation still exists.

And BTW...LOL to you.

Yes, a couple of them. And that is one of the very last things you do - and it's optional.

You can just stop advertising and selling the product, dispose of assets and employees. The corporation still
exists (on paper), but it's dead.

Regarding TT: I do not where they are at, but if they are not selling or advertising, they are likely dead. You
don't need the legal proof for that.

What happens next is anyone's guess, but the TT we knew and loved is likely dead.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0BKR on December 14, 2015, 06:25:32 AM
No new status on TT?
Okay.
Will check back in another 6 months...yawn.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JAS on December 14, 2015, 06:26:46 AM

Have you or a close family member ever dissolved a corporation? I have been there and done that. You can close anything, but there are rules to dissolve a corporation.  And a corporation is not dead until dissolved. Brush up on your business law.

Yes you can claim old names if they are no longer trademarked. TT is still trademarked because the corporation still exists.

And BTW...LOL to you.

Yes, we have closed a corporation. No, a judge did not have to sign off. Your statement was not about "rules" to follow for shutting down a corporation. So now you are trying to backpedal. Bzzzzt, won't work here. Your statement was that a judge had to sign off and that is just FALSE. A corporation has to follow rules to shut down, mostly financial related. A Subchapter S corporation is much simpler.

A corporation can also be a paper corporation. It can exist. It can file financial/tax reports, but if the corporation produces nothing, does nothing, they are essentially DEAD.

A person can also trademark a name and it does not have to be part of the corporation. Also a corporation can sell a name or trademark to an individual. It does not have to be a corporation and just because a paper corporation still holds title to a trademark, does not mean the corporation is viable. And if a corporation is not viable, then it is essentially dead.

FYI, I was an officer in a corporation in the past, so I know what I am talking about.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 14, 2015, 06:56:02 AM
Yes, a couple of them. And that is one of the very last things you do - and it's optional.

You can just stop advertising and selling the product, dispose of assets and employees. The corporation still
exists (on paper), but it's dead.

Regarding TT: I do not where they are at, but if they are not selling or advertising, they are likely dead. You
don't need the legal proof for that.

What happens next is anyone's guess, but the TT we knew and loved is likely dead.


LOL Dead in your head, not legally. LOL

Yes, last step, but needs to be done to satisfy all stock and stake holders. Otherwise the corporation and its members are always and forever open to any lawsuits for anything the corporation did or didn't do. As to optional, that may depend on what state it was incorporated, and in some cases, the type of corporation. In WI, even a sole proprietor LLC has to file a final annual report with the state indicating that the LLC has ended, and the state removes them from the list of operating businesses. Otherwise you are liable for not filing and it does have penalties.

TT was still communicating with potential customers. They were selling product. They were still promising to make more product. RKR did deliver product. OOOPS guess you forgot that too so you can say it is dead.

Come on people, TT may be temporarily suspended, but its not dead. Come up with all the excuses you want. Since they didn't die, they can all be countered. But it sure is fun debating all you dead TT believers. LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 14, 2015, 09:05:13 AM
WI0T - Give it up. Listen to and heed Ron White's basic rule of life. "You can't fix stupid." So all of your responses will have zero impact; you can't fix him. Or course I'll trust your knowledge and intelligence before most other people in the cheerleading camp any day. Isn't that degree of yours in advanced engineering with a major in nuclear as I recall?

LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL! :o
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI0T on December 14, 2015, 09:20:43 AM
WI0T - Give it up. Listen to and heed Ron White's basic rule of life. "You can't fix stupid." So all of your responses will have zero impact; you can't fix him. Or course I'll trust your knowledge and intelligence before most other people in the cheerleading camp any day. Isn't that degree of yours in advanced engineering with a major in nuclear as I recall?

LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL! :o

Yep.

But in tribute: LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL!....


Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 14, 2015, 09:27:10 AM
WI0T - Give it up. Listen to and heed Ron White's basic rule of life. "You can't fix stupid." So all of your responses will have zero impact; you can't fix him. Or course I'll trust your knowledge and intelligence before most other people in the cheerleading camp any day. Isn't that degree of yours in advanced engineering with a major in nuclear as I recall?

LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL! :o

LOL Of course. I don't truly trust any comment unless there is a genuine basis of reliability. As far as stupid, could say the same for your commentary, but it is more fun to rebut it and prove you wrong. Funny you have to call me stupid when you never do prove me wrong other then what I admitted was wrong.

And I know you would trust WI0T. He agrees with you NUT. LOL

Nice tribute WI0T. Thank You! Humor is a great thing!

See NUT...you should follow your own advice and not comment on what I say. You should have stayed "done" with me. Then this post never would have happened. LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 14, 2015, 09:29:18 AM
WI0T - Give it up. Listen to and heed Ron White's basic rule of life. "You can't fix stupid." So all of your responses will have zero impact; you can't fix him. Or course I'll trust your knowledge and intelligence before most other people in the cheerleading camp any day. Isn't that degree of yours in advanced engineering with a major in nuclear as I recall?

LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL! :o

Yep.

But in tribute: LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL!....


OK but LOL on your LOL.  

LOL, because LOL...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 17, 2015, 08:33:18 AM
These posts just get more outrageous. Some people still hold onto the belief that TenTec never died. Then others state it will essentially be a new business. You are correct, TenTec was dead, they just failed to tell anyone about it.

John Henry talks about there being a big following for TenTec and that they are not really starting from scratch. Well sort of, kind of as the real TenTec does not really exist anymore. The people are mostly gone, parts for older rigs maybe gone, service must be gone because they are quoting months to complete the repair, the manufacturing equipment was reportedly sold, the new building is tiny and a rented building with other occupants besides TenTec. The radio designs they own are somewhat outdated except for the Rebel and the Patriot. They have parts for building maybe a few radios. So folks, the original TenTec does not exist any longer except in name.

Then you have some guy who sits in front of a CAD screen all day purporting to be knowledgeable on small business financing. He also says he could invest in the business if he had all the information, but claims he does not have the money to buy a TenTec radio to help keep them in business. As I said before, TenTec cannot come back on good wishes and hot air. It needs money and a lot of money. It needs customers buying radios now.

And then you have those who express doubts about the company whose opinions are being referred to as "hate." A disagreement is not hate. I guess that is the way the world is today, if you disagree, you must be hateful. It is not further from the truth. To make an informed decision about anything you need to evaluate two or more points of view.

I loved TenTec and owned numerous TenTec radios bought directly from TenTec. So I supported them with more than words. I gave them my money. But as much as I want to see them succeed, I have serious concerns about their future viability. The old TenTec I knew and loved does not exist today; it's gone. So someone is going to pick up the name and try to bring it back to life. Great, but given what I know now, I would not buy a TenTec radio today. The business is not capitalized or severely undercapitalized. It is not making money so no bank will extend it a loan. Shark Tank would not invest as the market is far too small. Not sure if you can find enough hams to risk crowd funding since most hams are very cheap. I would not want to buy a radio I think had a reasonable chance of being soon orphaned. Been there with the Patcomm years ago and not going to do it again.

Now if the business were adequately capitalized, I might feel quite a bit differently. The risk is too great for my taste right now. This is not just an uphill climb, this is like climbing Mount Everest in gym shoes.

It looks like almost everything is gone and RKR's original idea of liquidating the assets is almost complete.  It is kind of sad to see another American manufacturer go down but I suppose it was inevitable since they failed to turn any profits for the last few years.

I guess this means that Ten Tec gear is officially collectable like Hallicrafters and Drake.  Now the prices should go up on the older stuff.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 17, 2015, 09:58:37 AM
These posts just get more outrageous. Some people still hold onto the belief that TenTec never died. Then others state it will essentially be a new business. You are correct, TenTec was dead, they just failed to tell anyone about it.

John Henry talks about there being a big following for TenTec and that they are not really starting from scratch. Well sort of, kind of as the real TenTec does not really exist anymore. The people are mostly gone, parts for older rigs maybe gone, service must be gone because they are quoting months to complete the repair, the manufacturing equipment was reportedly sold, the new building is tiny and a rented building with other occupants besides TenTec. The radio designs they own are somewhat outdated except for the Rebel and the Patriot. They have parts for building maybe a few radios. So folks, the original TenTec does not exist any longer except in name.

Then you have some guy who sits in front of a CAD screen all day purporting to be knowledgeable on small business financing. He also says he could invest in the business if he had all the information, but claims he does not have the money to buy a TenTec radio to help keep them in business. As I said before, TenTec cannot come back on good wishes and hot air. It needs money and a lot of money. It needs customers buying radios now.

And then you have those who express doubts about the company whose opinions are being referred to as "hate." A disagreement is not hate. I guess that is the way the world is today, if you disagree, you must be hateful. It is not further from the truth. To make an informed decision about anything you need to evaluate two or more points of view.

I loved TenTec and owned numerous TenTec radios bought directly from TenTec. So I supported them with more than words. I gave them my money. But as much as I want to see them succeed, I have serious concerns about their future viability. The old TenTec I knew and loved does not exist today; it's gone. So someone is going to pick up the name and try to bring it back to life. Great, but given what I know now, I would not buy a TenTec radio today. The business is not capitalized or severely undercapitalized. It is not making money so no bank will extend it a loan. Shark Tank would not invest as the market is far too small. Not sure if you can find enough hams to risk crowd funding since most hams are very cheap. I would not want to buy a radio I think had a reasonable chance of being soon orphaned. Been there with the Patcomm years ago and not going to do it again.

Now if the business were adequately capitalized, I might feel quite a bit differently. The risk is too great for my taste right now. This is not just an uphill climb, this is like climbing Mount Everest in gym shoes.

It looks like almost everything is gone and RKR's original idea of liquidating the assets is almost complete.  It is kind of sad to see another American manufacturer go down but I suppose it was inevitable since they failed to turn any profits for the last few years.

I guess this means that Ten Tec gear is officially collectable like Hallicrafters and Drake.  Now the prices should go up on the older stuff.

I agree with part of WB8NUTs inputs, yes, the "big TEN-TEC following" is undoubtedly getting smaller. Of course it is, the following was still ok after the RFC purchase, and might have dwindled some after the subsequent RKR transition just due to it being another sale that soon after the first, and now with this new one, it is probably dropping more, and as months go by, it will decline more.
But as of today there are still a sizable chunk out there that have expressed to me that they still want to get their dream OMNI-VII or Eagle and will make that purchase as soon as they are available again even if it is mid next year. Of course, proof is in the pudding, it is easy to say in an email that you want one, it is another thing to actually purchase one. I personally won't hold anyone to their email, they need to do what they feel is right. So, there may be enough interest still in the current TEN-TEC product line, both amateur and commercial products that will keep it afloat for at least a year without having anything new, and also provide the profit to cover factory, purchasing, engineering of new products, etc.

KA4DPO, you could be right, but I don't think it was RKR's intention to liquidate the company. I don't. I think that they had the best intentions on making the company work and profitable. Certain things got in the way that prevented a few new items coming out, and also problems generated in past regimes, well, their effect was too much to overcome at the time. To me, the effect of the Megasale is still being felt, in qty of parts available, vendor viewpoint, each rig was basically a loss, etc. I still go back to a conversation that the CEO and I had. Had he not ponied up that one Thursday evening, then RFC would have started closing up shop starting that following Friday morning. I do thank him for that.

I can say this though, certain changes instituted by the latest owner are beginning to have a positive effect in certain cash flow areas already, so, time will tell if it is a success or not.

Is this the same TEN-TEC, I would have to agree with KA4DPO, in reality, it isn't. It is another "TEN-TEC", using some of the same staff from the very first original TEN-TEC, and some of the technology of the original TEN-TEC, with the intent of improving it within his first year of ownership. The only part of the same is the staff, and technology, and of course service. The existing products (some of them) will make the cut, and continue, and some others may be brought back in time, but the new owner has other new products he is already designing (with TEN-TEC engineering, myself, and others)

I'm actually very psyched over one new addition to the team, he has made very rapid progress on a specific item that has been lingering for a LONG time. (sorry, can't say, but could turn into the proverbial cash cow in a very expensive market......)
See, something like this one product, if delivered (which now looks more promising of getting finished than ever before) will generate more income for TEN-TEC than anything they have ever made before. Supplementing the products that kept TEN-TEC open for years, the RX331/RX340. With that cash flow alone, he can then build back and fund engineering and other departments to get back to creating real new stuff again. Focused, gettin' er dun. This new person working on this product also brings several new products of his own to the TEN-TEC amateur line that will help boost TEN-TEC's image and again, the most important thing for business survival, cash flow.

The new owner plans to eventually get back to a "do it all" in house model like TEN-TEC was at one time. Eventually could be very soon for pieces of the "do it all" in house model. All depends upon how certain non-disclosed transactions work out. He is not afraid to spend the cash to build infrastructure when cash flow is positive.

The future TEN-TEC does look promising, to me, but has some SERIOUS hurdles to cross, some known, and some of course tbd. So, be aware, there will be bad news from time to time, but hopefully, well, this arm chair quarterback is going to watch and see, helping where possible

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 17, 2015, 10:07:29 AM
Of course, disputable, to me, the biggest reasons for the dwindling of the following and the shrinking of sales comes down to two main items.
1 - lack of new products
2 - lack of marketing what is there. (so many have commented to me on they had never heard of the rebel and patriot before, not until these threads, and wanted to know where they could get one now.....many have even asked what the "Eagle" was.....  and now wish they had known last year when they bought the xxx instead.... argh. Many didn't know they could remote the OMNI-VII, and since these threads they connected with a friends remotely and want one now theirself due to how well it is working now..... argh.....)

The new owner is addressing the "lack of new products", and once cash flow permits will address the marketing side.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3DBB on December 18, 2015, 07:33:05 AM
A few years back I saw the advertisement for the then recently-introduced Ten-Tec Eagle, which has state-of-the-art specs for an amateur rig. I noted the resemblance to the Ten-Tec Argonaut V, a QRP rig that was arguably the best available in its time. The Eagle is a great rig but TT shorted themselves by not opting for better, larger, and more expensive packaging. In their defense, for $1800 or whatever the introductory price was, Eagles were already expensive enough.

The ad for the Eagle stated at the bottom that Ten Tec was now "The SSB Company". For someone who thought Ten-Tec made its reputation on outstanding receiver circuitry and well-integrated QSK CW in their transceivers, the SSB proclamation caught my eye. A marketing effort, probably an attempt to target Restructuring II types.

I didn't know the company was for sale, but suspected things might not end well when they were purchased by a private-equity buyer. Sometimes things work out well for a company purchased by a PE buyer but frequently things do not work out very well. Private equity houses tend to be lucrative ventures, explaining their existence.

At present Ten Tec is a shell of its former self and people lost their jobs. There is nothing funny about it.   
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: DL8OV on December 18, 2015, 12:41:19 PM
A thought just occurred to me, did Ten Tec attend Dayton or the big ham expo in Japan? I am asking this because I do not remember seeing Ten Tec at Friedrichshafen any time over the last ten years but Kenwood, Icom, Yaesu and Elecraft were present. Sure, a stand at any show is a major expense, but for many European amateurs TT just don't exist and that's probably a third of the market.

Peter DL8OV
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 18, 2015, 12:45:16 PM
W3DBB, good points. I had an Argonaut V that I really liked and eagerly waited the Argonaut VI, but what a disappointment that was compared to the V version. Instead of max of 25 watts, the VI had only a max of 10 watts. While the V had all HF bands, the VI was missing HF bands and did not include 6 meters at all.

I recall going to the TenTec booth at Dayton the year they announced it and asked one of the guys at their booth why it was missing some of the HF bands and did not include 6 meters? His answer was the could not fit that all into that small of an enclosure.

So I said, how is it that Elecraft can produce a smaller 10 watt QRP radio, with all HF bands, with 6 meters, optional internal tuner, batteries and even a 2 meter module? His response was, I don't know, you'll have to ask Elecraft. So I did.

Elecraft's response, they have better engineering. Seemed like TenTec at the time was regressing instead of progressing. I guess with what we all know now, maybe the lack of a competitive product with the Argonaut VI was just due to the financial difficulties they were starting to enter. It also took away a lot of my enthusiasm for TenTec.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on December 18, 2015, 01:02:02 PM
A thought just occurred to me, did Ten Tec attend Dayton or the big ham expo in Japan? I am asking this because I do not remember seeing Ten Tec at Friedrichshafen any time over the last ten years but Kenwood, Icom, Yaesu and Elecraft were present. Sure, a stand at any show is a major expense, but for many European amateurs TT just don't exist and that's probably a third of the market.

Peter DL8OV
Yes Peter, Ten-Tec was at Dayton this year (2015), in the same location that they'd been in for as long back as I can remember.

If memory serves, even during the "glory days" under the original ownership, the company did not make many hamfests.  Dayton and a very small handful of others. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 18, 2015, 01:41:55 PM
Dayton 2016 - New Owner says he is going to be in the same booth space.
Other hamventions, all depends upon how things play out. Possibles are Huntsville, Orlando, Visalia, etc. etc. Leaving a few out...

Argonaut VI - yep, could've added the bands, but this is how the owner wanted it at the time, and that is how it went out. I did experiment in code using different filters in the preselector to give the two HF bands, requires a couple of hardware value changes, so, that might come out next year if the Argonaut VI makes the new owners cut.

Eagle Front Panel - The Eagle originally had VERY few features, and was meant to be a mobile rig, so the front panel made a LOT of sense. It evolved into a LOT of features, and unfortunately the front panel had to be kept the same due to the expense of a new front panel at the time. There were plans to make a second rig that was basically an OMNI-VII with Eagle innards, but, it didn't make it to the engineering priority list. Maybe it will now, who knows.

Profitability, Business Model, actually, TEN-TEC had a great business model until around sometime before the first TEN-TEC Inc was sold. Commercial paid the bills 90% of the time, when it didn't all of the other divisions paid the bills. So, whenever there was a commercial product change, or creation project or feature addition, etc. The engineer responsible for that software or hardware or whatever would have to leave the amateur project they were on, and work on that commercial item. So, commercial made money hand over fist when it sold, so of course it took priority. Advantage is the featuring in the commercial product, when proven, would get ported into an amateur product, and sometimes be considered a first for the amateur market. Disadvantage is that it always kept yanking people from amateur product development, meaning things came out VERY slow, and sometimes there were years of "nothing new", when in reality, the "new" was in commercial.

Combining some of these commercial attributes with the new owners own stuff and inventiveness and getting them into the amateur market, well, for the new owner, that is a priority. So, if all goes well, there will be more "firsts" coming in 2016/2017 from TEN-TEC. Time will tell.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
I know, probably sounds like cheerleading, but, that is the state of things, there are several fantastic items in the works, if/when they come out, that is another story.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 18, 2015, 07:38:33 PM
probably sounds like cheerleading, but, that is the state of things, there are several fantastic items in the works, if/when they come out, that is another story.

works for me, i will take information-based cheer-leading over speculative funeral announcements any day :)

John, do you have any inkling of the future of Alpha?  What is your best guess on where it goes from here (or the different trajectories it may take)???
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on December 19, 2015, 08:38:00 AM
First, I am a Ten Tec fan club member... but I still have a bad taste in my mouth when folks were proclaiming that RKR was going to to great things for both Alpha and Ten Tec going into the future.

Fast forward several month's later, we find out the ham involved, the "K" in RKR, has abandoned the ship.

Ten Tec sold off the land under the old factory to Walmart... no doubt the land was worth more than the factory's ability to produce a profit going forward.  Many AM radio stations are under similar circumstances--the land beneath the tower arrays becomes more valuable than the revenue. I don't fault the owners... they were getting old, and have done what they could to keep TT viable until their retirement.

Ten Tec sold off the metal fabricating department, which was profitable, and was used by several popular ham equipment suppliers under contract. 

I can understand where owners reach an age and desire to retire and divest themselves.  I suspect Ten Tec has had lean and profitable years.  But, I've seen to much cheer leading in the recent past to give much credence into the recent posts. What happens happens...   New owner has a significant hurdle to overcome.

Can anyone suggest how many hundreds of thousands of dollars were lost in the promise Alpha automatic tuner?  I suspect the losses would astound most folks!

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 19, 2015, 09:31:19 AM
Congrats all! Someone asked how long this thread could go a while back. I predicted at least 20 more pages back on page 33. And it happened.

Now can we get another 20? Wouldn't 73 pages look great? Then again 73 is a good number to end on.

Merry Christmas!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on December 19, 2015, 09:41:53 AM
 .  This all I see when you post:

W9FIB


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RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
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Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 19, 2015, 09:55:49 AM
Drop dead.  You are a total idiot.  This all I see when you post:

W9FIB


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RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
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LOL Cool! I love being ignored! Means I am right! LOL

Maybe a few need some anger management sessions? Or just plain lighten up? Life is way to short to take a forum that seriously. But I got big shoulders. I will just say LOL to the name calling. Cause I find such comments funny. And humor is a wonderful thing.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 19, 2015, 10:16:32 AM
Congrats all! Someone asked how long this thread could go a while back. I predicted at least 20 more pages back on page 33. And it happened.

Now can we get another 20? Wouldn't 73 pages look great? Then again 73 is a good number to end on.

Merry Christmas!

winner, winner -- chicken dinner!  :)  73 x 73
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on December 19, 2015, 01:14:30 PM
  .  
W9FIB


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Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on December 20, 2015, 10:11:44 AM
Of course, disputable, to me, the biggest reasons for the dwindling of the following and the shrinking of sales comes down to two main items.
1 - lack of new products
2 - lack of marketing what is there. (so many have commented to me on they had never heard of the rebel and patriot before, not until these threads, and wanted to know where they could get one now.....many have even asked what the "Eagle" was.....  and now wish they had known last year when they bought the xxx instead.... argh. Many didn't know they could remote the OMNI-VII, and since these threads they connected with a friends remotely and want one now theirself due to how well it is working now..... argh.....)

The new owner is addressing the "lack of new products", and once cash flow permits will address the marketing side.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry

John, Is there any news on Alpha?  Are they a financially viable company with a future?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 21, 2015, 06:25:54 AM
Last I knew the new TEN-TEC owner was still considering purchasing Alpha too, but it has not been finalized.
The guys in CO may know more, but, given certain issues/items that are in play they may not be at liberty to discuss it yet.
Of course, I'm sure if one of y'all made a good offer it could be yours.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on December 21, 2015, 07:42:15 AM
Too much foreign competition these days cutting into American products.  I was wondering if RKR wasn't going to rebadge some of the Alpha amps with TT nameplates to avoid having to make amps for two different product lines.

I'd bet that never delivered automatic antenna tuner was an endless money pit.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 21, 2015, 09:42:54 AM
I'd bet that never delivered automatic antenna tuner was an endless money pit.

Pete

How much of a money pit could it be? The technology already exists. And with an adaptation of some batch control software, not very hard to do either. The algorithm is tried and true for reading a value and adjusting other values to reach a goal value.

We use the same algorithm in synchronizing our VFD output to line input so the VFD can then be bypassed. The VFD becomes basically a fancy softstart for the motor.

But the math is basically the same. Compare the actual SWR to the goal SWR and adjust the LC network to achieve the goal within a defined percentage of error.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WE4RR on December 22, 2015, 03:19:12 AM
I believe that the problem is that Alpha's original design specifications were a bit too "blue sky" (as opposed to "practical") when it came to the overall load VSWR range and power handling capacity, not the algorithm for adjusting the network branches.  To cover the VSWR extremes all around the Smith Chart (from very low to very high impedances including combinations of high reactance and low resistance) means managing both high voltages and high currents with components that will fit in a box small enough to sit on an operating desk that can be built at a price that will be acceptable for the ham radio market. 

Being a designer of high power RF networks in my day job, I wondered how they were going to do that when they first announced the specifications for the 4040.  If they had made it work, I would have wanted one.  The auto tuner never came to market, though, because they are a company of very high integrity that would not ask their customers to accept less than they had promised.  I respect them for that - and for trying.  At this point I'm not going to hold my breath to see the product.

I hope that Alpha and Tentec find their way back together, or their separate ways.  I respect both companies a lot and they have given our hobby great products over the years.       
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on December 22, 2015, 03:41:30 AM
I believe that the problem is that Alpha's original design specifications were a bit too "blue sky" (as opposed to "practical") when it came to the overall load VSWR range and power handling capacity, not the algorithm for adjusting the network branches.  To cover the VSWR extremes all around the Smith Chart (from very low to very high impedances including combinations of high reactance and low resistance) means managing both high voltages and high currents with components that will fit in a box small enough to sit on an operating desk that can be built at a price that will be acceptable for the ham radio market. 

Being a designer of high power RF networks in my day job, I wondered how they were going to do that when they first announced the specifications for the 4040.  If they had made it work, I would have wanted one.  The auto tuner never came to market, though, because they are a company of very high integrity that would not ask their customers to accept less than they had promised.  I respect them for that - and for trying.  At this point I'm not going to hold my breath to see the product.

I hope that Alpha and Tentec find their way back together, or their separate ways.  I respect both companies a lot and they have given our hobby great products over the years.       

Thanks for the explanation. It makes sense now as to how it could have become a money pit. I think based on that a whole bunch of people would like to have had one if they made it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on December 22, 2015, 03:15:06 PM
at some point, you have to slap the table, and say "ship it!" if you are a manufacturer.

this means no perfection, but it should not shoot flames across the room.

to match any current sink at DC to daylight, be it a block of Styrofoam to a chunk of solid metal deep in the ocean, is not a completable task.  they well may not have chosen a good solution set.

so maybe a 4039 some day?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 23, 2015, 08:02:08 AM
at some point, you have to slap the table, and say "ship it!" if you are a manufacturer.

this means no perfection, but it should not shoot flames across the room.

to match any current sink at DC to daylight, be it a block of Styrofoam to a chunk of solid metal deep in the ocean, is not a completable task.  they well may not have chosen a good solution set.

so maybe a 4039 some day?

I would settle for a 238C but they don't have any more to sell.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 31, 2015, 07:09:09 AM
so, place your predictions here for when www.tentec.com (http://www.tentec.com) will no longer redirect to http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/ (http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/) signaling the phoenix could be rising from the ashes:

funeral committee i have your back and will put you at the top of the list:

predicted date of Ten-Tec being born again:

Funeral Committee: never

myself: Jan. 1, 2016

disclaimer: i have no insider info and if/when my prediction proves wrong it does not necessarily portend necrosis
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 31, 2015, 07:23:39 AM
so, place your predictions here for when www.tentec.com (http://www.tentec.com) will no longer redirect to http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/ (http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/) signaling the phoenix could be rising from the ashes:

funeral committee i have your back and will put you at the top of the list:

predicted date of Ten-Tec being born again:

Funeral Committee: never

myself: Jan. 1, 2016

disclaimer: i have no insider info and if/when my prediction proves wrong it does not necessarily portend necrosis

Well, in a way, your guess is as good as mine.
I do know he is in process of creating a statement to publish.
Other than that, I am not privy to the website transition process, so, I am going to throw an unbiased uninsider viewpoint on this as well.

Statement Publish date:     By Mid January (he he he, mid, I win, LOL....)   Say January 9, 2016
(again, just a guess, only inside knowledge I have is that... he has created a draft, and is making some adjustments, but, it is in process)

Funeral Committee: Also agree, Never
(granted, I do gauge two main milestones, if products are back in production in 2nd or 3rd quarter 2016, then the answer is almost never, then if new product makes it to the way by Dayton 2017, then my answer is probably never, if either of those two uninsider estimates are not met, well, then it really is in question... AGAIN, JUST MY TWO CENTS). I could be totally wrong.

Website going to TENTEC.com instead of RKR:   January 15, 2016
(again, I do not know the status of this at the moment, so my guess is as good as anyone elses)

There is internal progress, things do take time unfortunately due to a lot of things.
TENTEC Inc is still owned as a legal entity by the original TENTEC owners (Jack Burchfield and other stockholders), and is in the process of dissolving this year. Should take place end of 2015 - Jan of 2016, then, the new owner of the TEN-TEC brand has to go through a waiting period before he can apply to incorporate TEN-TEC Inc again, which is still his desire, to not just carry it as a brand, but to hold it as a company on it's own again.

RKR holds the lease on the facilities, so, transition the lease or move, and I am not privy to that status at the moment. I know they were in the process of moving out of the upstairs location, but not sure if they were going to move it all downstairs or move it ALL to a different more economical facility.

Phones, ADT, Water, Electric, Internet, etc. etc. takes time to either transition or close out those items, transition either from RKR to new, or from current building to new, etc., and some of those may not be needed to do anything about, or may not even be needed in the current form.....

I understand some getting very anxious with the snails pace, but, as a friend of mine told me about software development, "It takes what it takes"......

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: DL8OV on December 31, 2015, 07:27:30 AM
My guess, April 14th 2016, it will be a nice birthday present.

Peter DL8OV
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 31, 2015, 07:33:48 AM
I'd bet that never delivered automatic antenna tuner was an endless money pit.

Pete

How much of a money pit could it be? The technology already exists. And with an adaptation of some batch control software, not very hard to do either. The algorithm is tried and true for reading a value and adjusting other values to reach a goal value.

We use the same algorithm in synchronizing our VFD output to line input so the VFD can then be bypassed. The VFD becomes basically a fancy softstart for the motor.

But the math is basically the same. Compare the actual SWR to the goal SWR and adjust the LC network to achieve the goal within a defined percentage of error.

Yes, the technologies are know, in theory, not in practice. It had such (in my opinion almost unobtainable) high specs/able to work in any environment/able to handle changing any loading/frequency/etc requirements, that theory goes out the window due to interrelationship of
"unknowns". e.g. parasitics when loads vary and power is at 1500.
It is one thing to make a 100W auto tuner. Theory holds well
It is a bit different to make a 1KW auto tuner, and in most cases, people require specific inputs in order for the calculation/math to hold out well.
It is an order of magnitude harder to hit 1.5KW or 2KW. Theoretically the same beast, but, depending upon a bazillion factors, it almost has to be MilSTD in order to handle the variances, loads, shielding, etc. etc. That is why you haven't seen a beast as highly spec'd as this one to date.

The money pit part, that is mainly in testing, re-engineering, figuring out where theory hits the roads and where theory hits the skids, making new engineering build runs, etc. etc.

I don't know myself if we would have ever considered making such a beast for the amateur market back in the original Ten-Tec days, but I don't condemn Alpha and crew for trying.

In reality, they were (as of the last I talked with the Alpha crew) very close. Just a few changes and only an issue in a couple of areas that needed resolved. And if memory serves me correctly, they thought they knew the resolution, just needed to get on that part to resolve/test/build/etc.

One also does have to admit, they did (well, I should say we since I was demo'ing them as well) they did have 4 operational units they were demonstrating on multiple loads at Dayton, and except for a hiccup or two (that were related to the known issues of the time) they worked.

Will we ever see it? don't know. Proof is in the pudding, or when the rubber hits the road.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 31, 2015, 10:03:10 AM
I understand the challenges of high power impedance matching John.  In the 1980's at Harris we built 5 KW auto tuners for the military.  Now granted they were not specd to operate using a random wire but then most hams who operate full legal power are almost always using antennas that are near resonant and the tuners job is to keep the amplifier happy.

Quite frankly I don't really need or want an auto tuner and prefer a manual antenna tuner but I suppose I can see the big gun contest stations wanting them.  That is unfortunately, a very small market which goes back to cost to manufacture vs. profits.
I suspect the real issue with the Alpha 4040 tuner is the cost of components and the price point vs. profit to build the thing vs. market share. 

Anyway, as I said earlier I am a big fan of the Ten Tec 238 series of tuners and I think they are the best tuners to ever hit the amateur market although I think they have always been a bit over priced.  I presently have a 238 tuner that bought used and I would buy a brand new 238 C right now if they had one.  So if the new owner is serious then the 238 tuner should be high up the priority list once they get started.  I remain skeptical however,  that we will see anything that looks like the Ten Tec we are used to and instead will see a small company offering Chinese SDR's and small kits that can be found elsewhere.  Sorry but I am just not as optimistic as you are.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on December 31, 2015, 10:11:10 AM
I understand the challenges of high power impedance matching John.  In the 1980's at Harris we built 5 KW auto tuners for the military.  Now granted they were not specd to operate using a random wire but then most hams who operate full legal power are almost always using antennas that are near resonant and the tuners job is to keep the amplifier happy.

Quite frankly I don't really need or want an auto tuner and prefer a manual antenna tuner but I suppose I can see the big gun contest stations wanting them.  That is unfortunately, a very small market which goes back to cost to manufacture vs. profits.
I suspect the real issue with the Alpha 4040 tuner is the cost of components and the price point vs. profit to build the thing vs. market share. 

Anyway, as I said earlier I am a big fan of the Ten Tec 238 series of tuners and I think they are the best tuners to ever hit the amateur market although I think they have always been a bit over priced.  I presently have a 238 tuner that bought used and I would buy a brand new 238 C right now if they had one.  So if the new owner is serious then the 238 tuner should be high up the priority list once they get started.  I remain skeptical however,  that we will see anything that looks like the Ten Tec we are used to and instead will see a small company offering Chinese SDR's and small kits that can be found elsewhere.  Sorry but I am just not as optimistic as you are.


I agree, the 238 is a good tuner and should be brought back. He just has to decide which products and in which order.

I don't see him offering Chinese SDR's, his intention is to continue the normal TEN-TEC product line, and if he gets into the SDR world it will be with stuff we have designed, not from overseas. Now, how TEN-TEC can compete with the new Xiegu HF-6 5w sdr for $500, I don't know. (looks like a Chinese knockoff of the KX3, but for less cash)
http://yaesuft817.com/wp/xiegu-x5105-hf-6-m-sdr-transceiver/
It will have an optional auto tuner, 125W amp, etc. So, who knows.
I don't think the big button rig will go away, too many people still like the knobs/buttons, even if it is an SDR internally, I think the big rig will still be there for ease of use and hard front panel controls. But, it HAS to be able to be connected to the PC to sell any volume. JMHO, been wrong before.

I agree, it won't be the same TEN-TEC, but that doesn't mean it won't provide the same existing products (well, a subset of), and new innovative stuff. I am privy to some of the future product designs that are ongoing at the moment and some of them are exceptional. Innovative.

I understand the skepticism, even with what I know, I have some reservations, and hopefully they will get squashed. I'm trying to keep as positive as I can, but in the end, as we will all see, proof is in the pudding, when the rubber hits the road.......

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on January 04, 2016, 02:17:38 PM
The following is excerpted from an email sent out by John Henry KI4JPL to the various Ten Tec related reflectors earlier today:
Quote
The following is from the new owner of TEN-TEC
----------------------------------------------------------------------
As some of you may be aware, Dishtronix has purchased the assets (but not the liabilities) of Ten Tec from RKR Designs. .  I had desired to keep this under wraps  until Ten Tec is reorganized, but there is too much speculation concerning the service department to continue without an announcement of some sort.

There is a myriad of things that must be accomplished before everything is formalized. Unfortunately these things must be done before we can continue with jobs that were sent in for repair to RKR. At this time I would ask people to be patient and please do not call or email me about your repair. When we get the phone numbers transferred successfully or new phone numbers we will post them. As we progress with the change, someone will contact you about your repair. When service resumes we will be contacting the repair customers.

As some of you may be aware I have been looking at all aspects of operation of the company and restructuring operations has been necessary. In reviewing the service department accounts, it is apparent that some customers use the service department to diagnose the radio and elect to not proceed with the repair. Unfortunately this open door policy costs the company one hour of billable time to receive, unpack, open, diagnose, provide an estimate and repack a radio for return to the customer.

Effective immediately, all radios including those sent in to RKR, will incur  a 140.00 minimum charge to look at a radio, even if it is not repaired.  Service time is 125 per hour with the average repair requiring from one to two hours. This means you can expect to pay at least 265.00 plus parts and return shipping for any repair.

For customers who sent radios in to RKR which were not repaired, who object to these terms, we will return your unit to you at your expense.

A second problem in the service department is with the time technicians spend on the telephone that quite often ends up having nothing to do with the Ten Tec product but is some other station deficiency.  The problem here is Ten Tec is not compensated for that time, yet Ten Tec pays wages to the technician. When the service department resumes operation, Ten Tec will charge the customer for any telephone call or email that consumes more than five minutes of technician time.  That time will be billed in quarter hour increments at the prevailing service rate.

I am fully committed to bring Ten Tec back to a sustainable state. This will take some time. Please give us time to finalize these plans since there are so many business related issues to get through. We will definitely need to rely on you as customers to help continue the Ten Tec tradition of innovative product and cutting edge technology.
The complete email, include personal comments from John, can be found at https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ten_tec_radio_net/conversations/messages

And no, John did not say anything (either way) in regards to the fate of Alpha Amplifiers and/or of RKR.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on January 04, 2016, 02:24:51 PM
The following is excerpted from an email sent out by John Henry KI4JPL to the various Ten Tec related reflectors earlier today:
Quote
The following is from the new owner of TEN-TEC
----------------------------------------------------------------------
As some of you may be aware, Dishtronix has purchased the assets (but not the liabilities) of Ten Tec from RKR Designs. .  I had desired to keep this under wraps  until Ten Tec is reorganized, but there is too much speculation concerning the service department to continue without an announcement of some sort.

There is a myriad of things that must be accomplished before everything is formalized. Unfortunately these things must be done before we can continue with jobs that were sent in for repair to RKR. At this time I would ask people to be patient and please do not call or email me about your repair. When we get the phone numbers transferred successfully or new phone numbers we will post them. As we progress with the change, someone will contact you about your repair. When service resumes we will be contacting the repair customers.

As some of you may be aware I have been looking at all aspects of operation of the company and restructuring operations has been necessary. In reviewing the service department accounts, it is apparent that some customers use the service department to diagnose the radio and elect to not proceed with the repair. Unfortunately this open door policy costs the company one hour of billable time to receive, unpack, open, diagnose, provide an estimate and repack a radio for return to the customer.

Effective immediately, all radios including those sent in to RKR, will incur  a 140.00 minimum charge to look at a radio, even if it is not repaired.  Service time is 125 per hour with the average repair requiring from one to two hours. This means you can expect to pay at least 265.00 plus parts and return shipping for any repair.

For customers who sent radios in to RKR which were not repaired, who object to these terms, we will return your unit to you at your expense.

A second problem in the service department is with the time technicians spend on the telephone that quite often ends up having nothing to do with the Ten Tec product but is some other station deficiency.  The problem here is Ten Tec is not compensated for that time, yet Ten Tec pays wages to the technician. When the service department resumes operation, Ten Tec will charge the customer for any telephone call or email that consumes more than five minutes of technician time.  That time will be billed in quarter hour increments at the prevailing service rate.

I am fully committed to bring Ten Tec back to a sustainable state. This will take some time. Please give us time to finalize these plans since there are so many business related issues to get through. We will definitely need to rely on you as customers to help continue the Ten Tec tradition of innovative product and cutting edge technology.
The complete email, include personal comments from John, can be found at https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ten_tec_radio_net/conversations/messages

And no, John did not say anything (either way) in regards to the fate of Alpha Amplifiers and/or of RKR.

The complete posting shows up in the news section of eham.
Including my comments on the owners text.
Since they were referred to in this forum, I've included the text.... But, please be aware that there is a LOT going on and responses may not happen overnight.....

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Given the content of the new owners announcement above, I (John Henry) also request that if you can wait a while for your product to get serviced in the Ten Tec service department, please let them alone until they get back with you as he described above. If you absolutely have to have your unit back now, then the service@... email address is still working, and will continue to work. The phones are in transition, so I doubt you will be able to call and get an answer for a while. once phones are set up, the numbers will be announced. Once the website is ready, everything will be on it. Remember, if going to tentec.com takes you to rkrdesignsllc.com, then the website transition has not completed yet.

Given the nature of this announcement, and it will almost positively bring out more questions, again, please be patient. The new owner is working through a lot of business issues, and I myself work a full time day job and consult into the evening, so, answers may be few and far between. Though this announcement is going out to a lot of venues, I will attempt to monitor

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ten_tec_radio_net/conversations/messages
If this link gets shortened, it is basically the ten_tec_radio_net yahoo group.

73, KI4JPL

John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on January 04, 2016, 02:32:59 PM
Regarding Alpha, and/or RKR, I have no information to add.
(uh, I know nothing..... as Schultz of Hogans Heroes would say....)

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on January 04, 2016, 03:04:13 PM
Regarding Alpha, and/or RKR, I have no information to add.
(uh, I know nothing..... as Schultz of Hogans Heroes would say....)

73, KI4JPL
John Henry


Thanks for the updates John!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA5IPF on January 04, 2016, 07:00:05 PM
At his service policies and shop rate he outlined all I can say is "Good Luck"
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: ZENKI on January 04, 2016, 11:48:36 PM
Recipe for Success?

Bring back the Corsair 2. Package it with similar ergonomics to the Omni 6 or  FT1000D.

It would not take much to update the design of the Corsair 2 to make it a modern competitor with the Elecraft K3S. A bigger box with better ergonomics and equal performance with
the K3S will deliver a winner for Ten Tec.

THIS CORSAIR 2 MK2016 would include:

200 Watt Clean low IMD PA
Built In power supply
Big Box with knobs
Everything in 1 box no external accessories required
Phase coherent receivers, 2nd RX optional
Ultra Linear LOW IMD RX Audio amplifier chain
Calibrated S-meter
High performance 2nd RX
IF out
Interface to slave a SDR receiver
RX antenna inputs protected
A interface to plug in a RTL dongle for a pan adapter
Cool Blue OLED display
Keep the RX totally analogue
Use some of the design techniques used in AOR7070 receiver
Maybe even manufacturer the AOR7070 receiver design since AOR is not interested in doing this. This would be very a popular receiver.

Make a chopped down 100 watt version with RTL dongle support for the pan adapter and Single receiver. Built in power supply. Use a COTS
Meanwell or some other clean power supply design.

The Eagle could also be  spun into a bigger box with Knobs along the lines of Yaesu FT950. It would have better
performance and support for RTL dongle for the pan adapter. A 100 Watt clean PA and in built switch mode supply would
make it a popular radio. Another nice option for the Eagle would be a 200 watt remote head/internet version of the Eagle much like the TS480HX.
The noise blanker in the  Eagle in a mobile rig design with internet and remote head capability would be another big seller if Ten Tec
got it right. Ten Tec can beat the Japanese at their game if it was innovative, bold and researched what hams are doing today  and not produce radios
that are updated  clones of 30 year old products with dismal performance. If Ten Tec produces crap  it will disappear again within a year.

All of the above in an updated Orion design if the Corsair is considered old hat!

Basically Ten Tec has to stick to delivering performance and exceeding all the benchmarks. The last thing the ham
radio market needs is another mediocre radio with rubbish specifications like those coming out of  Japan currently.
Pigs with lipstick on them and no performance!

They have a chance now to fix up their designs and deliver the goods. Its one of the only reasons Elecraft has been so successful because
it could deliver the performance that hams wanted. Now if Ten Tec could only deliver on  both performance, ergonomics in a big radio they  should
be more successful than Elecraft. They need to produce a radio that is more mainstream, performs better in all areas and is palatable
to broader range of tastes. The Orion  could have been the king of radios today if they invested more time and thought in the design. Instead
Ten Tec squandered the opportunity and potential of the Orion.

The Omni 7 could also be fixed up. Throw out the crap chunky graphics display and put a high resolution TFT display in  the Omni 7.
Clean the transmitter PA design up and put in a calibrated S-meter along with excellent specifications and you there. The Ten Tec radios have nice big displays
but the poor graphics and screen quality makes them look like a video game from the 80's its so crap. In the era of  cheap tablets nothing less than a tablet quality screen would do.

Good luck to them, its all about performance metrics not the name!

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on January 05, 2016, 04:48:47 AM
At his service policies and shop rate he outlined all I can say is "Good Luck"

Yup, first to go is TenTec's legendary service. Cost more to repair a Rebel or Patriot then the original selling price. Not to mention, never heard of Dishtronix. Have they ever appeared at Dayton?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on January 05, 2016, 06:20:04 AM
At his service policies and shop rate he outlined all I can say is "Good Luck"

Yup, first to go is TenTec's legendary service. Cost more to repair a Rebel or Patriot then the original selling price. Not to mention, never heard of Dishtronix. Have they ever appeared at Dayton?
You guys are starting to remind me of my Aunt.

She's the type that would give you two ties for your birthday.  You randomly pick one to wear first to show her, and she'd say "What?  You didn't like the other one?"

Some people always look for the silver lining.  Others look for the dirt to dig up.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on January 05, 2016, 06:27:26 AM
At his service policies and shop rate he outlined all I can say is "Good Luck"

Yup, first to go is TenTec's legendary service. Cost more to repair a Rebel or Patriot then the original selling price. Not to mention, never heard of Dishtronix. Have they ever appeared at Dayton?
Service isn't going away, it is getting scaled back so that it as an entity does not lose money anymore.
The new owner has to cut all losses, and try to bring back some form of profitability so that the business as a whole can sustain itself.
These are measures for now, who knows what the rates will be once the business can sustain itself again, may go down, never know.
Yes, Dishtronix is usually set up with the Prometheus in the same hall as TEN-TEC.
It's a heck of an amp.
It is rather expensive, and that is not the route the new owner wants to go, he does not want to raise prices out of sight, he wants to put them at a point where they are profitable. Probably close to what they were when TEN-TEC Inc owned itself, before Jack sold TEN-TEC.

Anyway, appreciate the thoughts, inputs,
73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KASSY on January 05, 2016, 08:16:32 AM
Dishtronix?  I had to look them up.  One ref, 2003, to a Prometheus amplifier, 2.4kW.  Haven't seen/heard them discussed on the bands or in a shack.

Also turned up:
http://cq-amateur-radio.com/dayton_new_products/2015_dayton_new_products/misc/Dishtronix-Emtron.pdf

Emtron website says nothing about this, are his hands full of this acquisition, or has he dropped it?

Also turned up:
http://forums.qrz.com/index.php?threads/array-solutions-dishtronix-rip-off-not-really.209927/

Here he announces a new all-american made wattmeter for winter of 2009, but I can't find refs that it ever happened.

In the Ten-Tec announcement, it is written "As some of you may be aware, Dishtronix has purchased the assets (but not the liabilities) of Ten Tec from RKR Designs. " 

As I understand things, warranty on existing equipment is called a liability, so is this announcement telling us that existing warranties will not be honored?


But I guess this is why he wanted to remain secret for a while, so he could figure out good messaging.  I'm sure he intends to honor warranties, he just wrote what he wrote without realizing the implications.


Good luck to him, perhaps third time is a charm.

- k
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on January 05, 2016, 09:30:30 AM
Dishtronix?  I had to look them up.  One ref, 2003, to a Prometheus amplifier, 2.4kW.  Haven't seen/heard them discussed on the bands or in a shack.

Also turned up:
http://cq-amateur-radio.com/dayton_new_products/2015_dayton_new_products/misc/Dishtronix-Emtron.pdf

Emtron website says nothing about this, are his hands full of this acquisition, or has he dropped it?

Also turned up:
http://forums.qrz.com/index.php?threads/array-solutions-dishtronix-rip-off-not-really.209927/

Here he announces a new all-american made wattmeter for winter of 2009, but I can't find refs that it ever happened.

In the Ten-Tec announcement, it is written "As some of you may be aware, Dishtronix has purchased the assets (but not the liabilities) of Ten Tec from RKR Designs. " 

As I understand things, warranty on existing equipment is called a liability, so is this announcement telling us that existing warranties will not be honored?


But I guess this is why he wanted to remain secret for a while, so he could figure out good messaging.  I'm sure he intends to honor warranties, he just wrote what he wrote without realizing the implications.


Good luck to him, perhaps third time is a charm.

- k

go look at:
http://www.dishtronix.com/

You will see the Prometheus for sale and the wattmeter for sale there.
You will also see his contract manufacturing services he provides, engineering design, board stuffing, etc.
He has not dropped his emtron offering.
A lot of acquisitions that are still ongoing, a lot of business building for TEN-TEC, etc.
Sleep is a luxury for him lately.

73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on January 05, 2016, 09:38:47 AM
At his service policies and shop rate he outlined all I can say is "Good Luck"

I can understand the new owners policy of charging for service.  In the past Ten Tec was very liberal with their service charges and service technicians time.  That is probably one of the bleeders that was killing their bottom line.  I don't know of any other company that provides service free of charge or at a rate of return that is less than the cost of providing it.  I don't see that as a game changer so perhaps they can at least keep their heads above water on service charges.

I don't see how that is going to have any significant impact on sales.  The quality of the products will be the driver.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KASSY on January 05, 2016, 10:01:55 AM


go look at:
http://www.dishtronix.com/

You will see the Prometheus for sale and the wattmeter for sale there.


On the top of the wattmeter page there's an 8 year old announcement:

"THIS PRODUCT IS DISCONTINUED DUE TO THEFT OF THE PRODUCT BY THE TAIWANESE SUBCONTRACTOR.

ANY “NEW” METERS FOR SALE AFTER 2008 ARE PIRATE "

Apparently, Winter '09 came and went.  And I don't see anything related to Emtron.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on January 05, 2016, 10:11:14 AM


go look at:
http://www.dishtronix.com/

You will see the Prometheus for sale and the wattmeter for sale there.


On the top of the wattmeter page there's an 8 year old announcement:

"THIS PRODUCT IS DISCONTINUED DUE TO THEFT OF THE PRODUCT BY THE TAIWANESE SUBCONTRACTOR.

ANY “NEW” METERS FOR SALE AFTER 2008 ARE PIRATE "

Apparently, Winter '09 came and went.  And I don't see anything related to Emtron.

yes, my apologies, I had forgotten about that regarding the wattmeter. An unfortunate event that occurs, products getting cloned and hijacked from the Far East.

Regarding Emtron, I know about the acquisition, and last I knew he still owned it, and operations of it are of the owners knowledge, not mine, just what has been stated publicly already.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KASSY on January 05, 2016, 10:21:14 AM


Regarding Emtron, I know about the acquisition, and last I knew he still owned it, and operations of it are of the owners knowledge, not mine, just what has been stated publicly already.


According to the qrz thread, the wattmeter was not cloned.  Dishtronix, instead, literally gave it away to an off-shore manufacturer to build for them, apparently not realizing that international copyrights don't work.  The notice is 8 years old and still on the website, is this the kind of guy who holds a grudge?

I haven't seen him at any 'fest I attend, but maybe he only goes to Dayton.

- k
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on January 05, 2016, 10:23:13 AM


Regarding Emtron, I know about the acquisition, and last I knew he still owned it, and operations of it are of the owners knowledge, not mine, just what has been stated publicly already.


According to the qrz thread, the wattmeter was not cloned.  Dishtronix, instead, literally gave it away to an off-shore manufacturer to build for them, apparently not realizing that international copyrights don't work.  The notice is 8 years old and still on the website, is this the kind of guy who holds a grudge?

I haven't seen him at any 'fest I attend, but maybe he only goes to Dayton.

- k

I know he has been to Dayton many times, that is where I met him many years ago.
Other fests? don't know.
I know he has hopes of hitting several this year, time will tell.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on January 05, 2016, 10:24:30 AM


go look at:
http://www.dishtronix.com/

You will see the Prometheus for sale and the wattmeter for sale there.


On the top of the wattmeter page there's an 8 year old announcement:

"THIS PRODUCT IS DISCONTINUED DUE TO THEFT OF THE PRODUCT BY THE TAIWANESE SUBCONTRACTOR.

ANY “NEW” METERS FOR SALE AFTER 2008 ARE PIRATE "

Apparently, Winter '09 came and went.  And I don't see anything related to Emtron.

I was not able to find anything regarding the buyout of Emtron either in fact, if you look online it looks like Emtron is still doing business as usual.  As for the Peak reading wattmeter I don't blame Dishtronixs one bit, theft of intellectual property is rampant in China.  The don't have the same sense of fair play that we do here in the US and they steal patented designs, knock them off at reduced prices, and thumb their noses at the Federal trade Commission and the US Attorney General.

I saw a Prometheus amplifier at Dayton a few years ago and it was nice, big too and pretty quiet for a QRO amp.  At $14K they were too rich for me.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KASSY on January 05, 2016, 10:40:38 AM

I was not able to find anything regarding the buyout of Emtron either


I posted Dishtronix' own press release earlier:

http://cq-amateur-radio.com/dayton_new_products/2015_dayton_new_products/misc/Dishtronix-Emtron.pdf


 in fact, if you look online it looks like Emtron is still doing business as usual.


Yes, quite in conflict with the press release from May 2015.


 As for the Peak reading wattmeter I don't blame Dishtronixs one bit, theft of intellectual property is rampant in China.


Except that it was not stolen, it was GIVEN to them by Dishtronix who then complained about the use of information given to them.

The Distronix' website claims many years experience doing international business, yet they did not expect a Taiwanese (not Chinese) company, a well-known supplier to MFJ, to use a design freely given to them?


The don't have the same sense of fair play that we do here in the US and they steal patented designs, knock them off at reduced prices, and thumb their noses at the Federal trade Commission and the US Attorney General.


As I read it, all of those wattmeters were built by one company.  It was never American-made.  Therefore, if the Taiwanese company is selling for less, it's merely wanting less profit.  Nothing about that meter appears patented.

A US patent applies only to people in the US.  It is not theft when someone elsewhere uses the technology.  International patents do not exist.  According to the Dishtronix discussion linked to earlier, the Taiwanese company did not sell the meters in the US, which would have violated some law.  They did sell them to a UK distributor who offered them to US customers, so it was the distributor who violated laws - although this is such a murky area that the distributor probably did not know about it.


I saw a Prometheus amplifier at Dayton a few years ago and it was nice, big too but pretty quiet for a QRO amp.

Well, if you make something big, but not any more powerful, you can make it quieter.  IMO it doens't matter in a solid state amp, I've never seen a ham shack whose auto-tune amp was even near the operating desk.  Out of sight, out of mind.

Dishtronix is clearly very small, so I don't think it's a bad thing that I haven't seen them at 'fests.  They're just being properly frugal.



- k
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on January 05, 2016, 03:40:57 PM

 As for the Peak reading wattmeter I don't blame Dishtronixs one bit, theft of intellectual property is rampant in China.


Except that it was not stolen, it was GIVEN to them by Dishtronix who then complained about the use of information given to them.

The Distronix' website claims many years experience doing international business, yet they did not expect a Taiwanese (not Chinese) company, a well-known supplier to MFJ, to use a design freely given to them?

- k

Are you sure about this?
When a US company goes abroad and contracts out a Chinese company to make a product, they have fairly standard contracts that make it clear that the designs of the items being made are the property of the US company and that the company in China will not steal or use the design or even build any other product that is similar.  Of course most Chinese companies ignore this, but that is not the same thing as saying they were "Given it freely".

73s
Rob
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KASSY on January 05, 2016, 05:38:10 PM

Are you sure about this?
When a US company goes abroad and contracts out a Chinese company to make a product, they have fairly standard contracts that make it clear that the designs of the items being made are the property of the US company and that the company in China will not steal or use the design or even build any other product that is similar.  Of course most Chinese companies ignore this, but that is not the same thing as saying they were "Given it freely".

73s
Rob

Because of what I do for a living, I've taken many courses on patent law.

When I said "given freely", I didn't mean it was "legal" in US terms...but rather, that it was fully within accepted normal behavior.

For instance, if everybody in the US who drove 1 mile over the speed limit, ever, were thrown in jail, unemployment would hit 95%.  Therefore, the law de facto, allows for modest speeding.

Similarly, since almost all Asian countries and almost all Eastern European countries "allow" patents to be infringed upon without filling (expensive) lawsuits, it has set a precedent.

A patent violation is not a legal violation, it is a contract violation, and therefore, in the US, is a civil matter.  That means the person who believes they've been harmed must pay for, and file, the lawsuit.

Because of all this, said my instructors, only a fool depends on patents to keep someone else from building the same product.

Similarly, business contracts committing vendors to not compete also are just as visibly trampled, and nobody files a lawsuit, therefore, only a fool would expect such a contract to be enforceable.

If you get any gaggle of business managers together to discuss outsourcing, a common thread is that once you've allowed your design to leave your premises, it's open season, and especially so if it crosses international borders.

The recommendation I've received from these courses is that if you must outsource to a foreign country, you either do it by building and owning your own factory, where you can control things.  Or you only outsource sub-assemblies, so that no one sub-contractor has the ability to copy your entire product.

There's the written law...

and there's practical.  And practical says if you send a design to certain parts of the world, you have more or less made it public domain, no matter what the law says. 

And that's how it's been since at least the early 1980s.

- k
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WD8DKB on January 05, 2016, 08:36:38 PM
If nothing else, this entire forum has been one heck of an education . I've learned a great deal about the legalities of business and human nature in general. So, my thanks to all involved. Personally, I like and have owned a lot of TT gear. i truly wish the new owner the very best of luck in the future. But, that said, I own 2 Eagles and I'm sweating bullets as to whether they will drop in value as this issue wears on. They are going on the classifieds this week. I was a victim twice to companies going under in the past. I'm not going to be a victim again. I'll take my blows and carry on I guess.   KE8ADH  Max
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on January 06, 2016, 03:23:35 AM
You guys are starting to remind me of my Aunt.

She's the type that would give you two ties for your birthday.  You randomly pick one to wear first to show her, and she'd say "What?  You didn't like the other one?"

Some people always look for the silver lining.  Others look for the dirt to dig up.
[/quote]

No some of us deal with reality. Others live in Peter Pan's world.

BTW, just sounds like your aunt was one mean person.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on January 06, 2016, 03:28:04 AM
At his service policies and shop rate he outlined all I can say is "Good Luck"

I can understand the new owners policy of charging for service.  In the past Ten Tec was very liberal with their service charges and service technicians time.  That is probably one of the bleeders that was killing their bottom line.  I don't know of any other company that provides service free of charge or at a rate of return that is less than the cost of providing it.  I don't see that as a game changer so perhaps they can at least keep their heads above water on service charges.

I don't see how that is going to have any significant impact on sales.  The quality of the products will be the driver.

That rate is very high.

If you pay your bench techs $40 an hour, then add burdened labor rate of 50% on to that, it is $60 an hour. Then add another 50% for overhead and profit, you arrive at $80. So that is some massive profit percentage being charged to a customer.

Now many customers like me in the past paid more for their radio from TenTec because of the former legendary service and support. Now that support and service is going to be very costly, why do I want to pay more for the radio? So if service pricing is going up dramatically, then the cost of the radios needs to come down to be more competitive with the Japanese brands.

At this point, we are no longer dealing with the old TenTec. What was TenTec is largely gone. We have someone who owns the name, and designs, but other than that, TenTec is pretty much starting from scratch so it is really going to be a new company.

Looks like the Patriot was my last TenTec purchase for a long time.

JMHO
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on January 06, 2016, 05:59:25 AM
At his service policies and shop rate he outlined all I can say is "Good Luck"

I can understand the new owners policy of charging for service.  In the past Ten Tec was very liberal with their service charges and service technicians time.  That is probably one of the bleeders that was killing their bottom line.  I don't know of any other company that provides service free of charge or at a rate of return that is less than the cost of providing it.  I don't see that as a game changer so perhaps they can at least keep their heads above water on service charges.

I don't see how that is going to have any significant impact on sales.  The quality of the products will be the driver.

That rate is very high.

If you pay your bench techs $40 an hour, then add burdened labor rate of 50% on to that, it is $60 an hour. Then add another 50% for overhead and profit, you arrive at $80. So that is some massive profit percentage being charged to a customer.

Now many customers like me in the past paid more for their radio from TenTec because of the former legendary service and support. Now that support and service is going to be very costly, why do I want to pay more for the radio? So if service pricing is going up dramatically, then the cost of the radios needs to come down to be more competitive with the Japanese brands.

At this point, we are no longer dealing with the old TenTec. What was TenTec is largely gone. We have someone who owns the name, and designs, but other than that, TenTec is pretty much starting from scratch so it is really going to be a new company.

Looks like the Patriot was my last TenTec purchase for a long time.

JMHO

I think the rate is just fine. Hams have had it way too easy with Ten Tec service in the past. Time to pay the piper or do what hams are supposed to do...fix it yourself.

But then I thought you would be happy to pay the rate. It really helps support TT financially, right? Isn't that your big beef is that supposedly I and others don't do that? Here is your big chance!

LOL Will never happen though. But the hot air will continue! LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on January 06, 2016, 06:53:22 AM
KASSY, the wattmeter design wasn't "given to", no, it was sent to a house to be built. This required he send them the board layout and BOM and hex files for the programming of the board, etc., whatever else was required to build the product. It is my understanding that he then saw this exact same item being sold elsewhere, with his exact board etchings, metal, etc. Whether I call it cloning, or you call it "given to", makes no difference. They manufactured and sold his end product without his knowledge. Another case of "knockoffs". So, let's not argue semantics, he got "screwed" by the people he had contracted to build his product for him. He is not alone in this, a lot of people have had similar experiences over the years with other mfgrs in other countries as well. It happens.

WB8NUT, you are correct, you are not dealing with the same old TEN-TEC. Hopefully this new TEN-TEC will be a reboot that will survive unlike what happened with the last two regimes. His plan is different, slow, meticulous, but selling and building products right now that had kept the original TEN-TEC in business for years. Amateur products will start production again and etc. etc.

Give 'em time, let's see where he gets to.
I'm confident you will see him still around after a few months, I'm confident you will see him around with new product, possibly in 2016 but more definite by 2017. In the meantime, ship existing product to keep doors open.

Time will tell, I wish him well,
73, KI4JPL
John Henry
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on January 06, 2016, 09:42:30 AM
If nothing else, this entire forum has been one heck of an education . I've learned a great deal about the legalities of business and human nature in general. So, my thanks to all involved. Personally, I like and have owned a lot of TT gear. i truly wish the new owner the very best of luck in the future. But, that said, I own 2 Eagles and I'm sweating bullets as to whether they will drop in value as this issue wears on. They are going on the classifieds this week. I was a victim twice to companies going under in the past. I'm not going to be a victim again. I'll take my blows and carry on I guess.   KE8ADH  Max

it doesn't look like Ten-Tec is going under now so why not wait and see?  besides, Collins and Drake gear still seem to command decent prices and there are peeps out there who will fix em for ya if you don't have the inclination. if people sell their TT rigs out of panic and the price is really low, some of us out here will be happy buyers, that is for sure. Meanwhile the funeral gawkers are sure to suggest the sky is falling.  we are just going to have to wait and see.  it would be great if people gave the new owner a fair chance.  73  



Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: NN4ZZ on January 06, 2016, 01:49:53 PM
I've been following the thread and although I don't have any Ten-Tec rigs, I have worked with Mike Dishop for years.  I've had one of the
Prometheus DX2400 amps for about 6 years.  Mike provides quality products and top notch customer service in my experience.  I set up a Yahoo forum for the amp back when I bought it expecting to need a place to discuss problems, etc.   There have been almost zero issues from anyone on the forum. 

So while I don't know how the Ten-Tec deal will go, I can say that Mike is a honest guy and will give it his best. 

Regards, Al / NN4ZZ 
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on January 06, 2016, 02:56:33 PM
if hams are supposed to fix it themselves, a lot of the technology is going to have to go bye-bye.  if you lose a custom chip... well, things move so quickly on the fabrication side that none of them are going to be reorderable in two or three years.  the line density and wafer size are changing every 2-3 years, meaning your masks and logic are trash.  or you pony up another tens of thousands to remake them for a short run of parts.

which is not happening.  even with PGAs and ASICS that you can blow yourself, it's not happening.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB2WIK on January 06, 2016, 03:09:11 PM
if hams are supposed to fix it themselves, a lot of the technology is going to have to go bye-bye.  if you lose a custom chip... well, things move so quickly on the fabrication side that none of them are going to be reorderable in two or three years.  the line density and wafer size are changing every 2-3 years, meaning your masks and logic are trash.  or you pony up another tens of thousands to remake them for a short run of parts.

which is not happening.  even with PGAs and ASICS that you can blow yourself, it's not happening.

Responsible manufacturers stock spares for years and years, purchased during the production cycle.

In the automotive industry, that's a given.  You can buy NIB parts for old cars all the time, and it seems that will always be the case.

Ham rigs don't have the production volumes of cars, but then the parts aren't as expensive either. 

In "my" industry, which is high-end computing and data acquisition/storage systems, we stock parts for at least 10 years for anything we've ever sold; in some cases, more like 20 years.  By contract, we're required to do this for all our defense/aerospace programs.  We still stock 386 and 486 uPs (new, unused) for stuff that was designed in the early 1990s and the hardware is actually not only still serviceable, but a lot of it is still shipping!  (Aerospace programs move very slowly.)

Biggest problem is stuff like BGA rework, which requires specialized equipment and is still labor intensive; but we do it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WA2VUY on January 07, 2016, 05:29:32 AM
http://qrznow.com/dishtronix-purchases-ten-tec-assets/
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on January 07, 2016, 07:30:32 AM
http://qrznow.com/dishtronix-purchases-ten-tec-assets/
Why not read the original post, not the reprint?
http://www.arrl.org/news/dishtronix-purchases-ten-tec-assets
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on January 07, 2016, 07:43:01 AM
Looks like things are in pretty good hands with Mr. Dishop. Market knowledge, drive to make HR products, manufacturing knowledge, and long time business knowledge. A great combination to lead TT into a new era.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WA2ONH on January 07, 2016, 08:11:28 AM
W1MST's Amateur Radio TOPIC: Ten Tec: 2016 and Beyond is on

http://www.amateurradio.com/ten-tec-2016-and-beyond/

"Although there had been much speculation that Dishtronix was the mystery buyer of Ten Tec, we got confirmation in the last couple of days.

I wrote to Mike Dishop of Dishtronix, Ten Tec’s new owner, to ask him for more information about what we can expect from Ten Tec going forward. Here is his response: ... "
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WA2VUY on January 07, 2016, 08:12:53 AM
Because I didn't see that. I didn't go searching the world wide web.

http://qrznow.com/dishtronix-purchases-ten-tec-assets/
Why not read the original post, not the reprint?
http://www.arrl.org/news/dishtronix-purchases-ten-tec-assets
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on January 07, 2016, 10:17:59 AM
Looks like things are in pretty good hands with Mr. Dishop. Market knowledge, drive to make HR products, manufacturing knowledge, and long time business knowledge. A great combination to lead TT into a new era.

Don't get your feathers all puffed up just yet, Mr. Dishop has a mountain to climb and he knows it better than anyone.  Knowledge and experience are great assets and so is drive but designing and manufacturing products costs money, lots of money.  A lot of new businesses operate at a loss for the first couple of years before things really take off.  I am looking forward to the game changer that will make the amateur community beat a path to Ten Tecs door but I know that might take a year or two. 

Don't forget also that new products have to got through the FCC approval process and that can tie up funds for quite a while.  Like I said once before there is a handful of Ten Tec devotees who would buy a board with a nail in it if it had a Ten Tec logo, the rest of the ham community is going to take more convincing.

I wish them well and expect to see a red hot transceiver come out of the ashes at a competitive price sometime in the next two years.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on January 07, 2016, 01:14:16 PM
Don't get your feathers all puffed up just yet, Mr. Dishop has a mountain to climb and he knows it better than anyone.  Knowledge and experience are great assets and so is drive but designing and manufacturing products costs money, lots of money.  A lot of new businesses operate at a loss for the first couple of years before things really take off.  I am looking forward to the game changer that will make the amateur community beat a path to Ten Tecs door but I know that might take a year or two. 

Don't forget also that new products have to got through the FCC approval process and that can tie up funds for quite a while.  Like I said once before there is a handful of Ten Tec devotees who would buy a board with a nail in it if it had a Ten Tec logo, the rest of the ham community is going to take more convincing.

I wish them well and expect to see a red hot transceiver come out of the ashes at a competitive price sometime in the next two years.

Feathers puffed up? Am I some kind of bird now? Hardly think so since I have no feathers.

And I don't buy a board from TT, I go to a lumber yard for that kind of a board. Just as I don't go to a lumber yard to buy HR equipment.

I sure wish if your going to comment on what I say, you use facts and intelligence. Like that's going to happen...LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on January 07, 2016, 02:34:43 PM
Reading thru this thread it isn't hard to see why a company would want to stay away from wading in.  Too many critical armchair quarterbacks and no way for them to get sacked or benched when they drop the ball -- which leads to their belief that their QB rating is off the charts.  LOL

don't get me wrong -- their are GREAT hams, but all too often we seem like a bunch of cheap & know-it-all whiners
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KB4MNG on January 07, 2016, 03:26:42 PM
Ten Tec still lives!  This was on another forum...

Although there had been much speculation that Dishtronix http://www.dishtronix.com/about.html was the mystery buyer of Ten Tec, we got confirmation in the last couple of days.

I wrote to Mike Dishop of Dishtronix, Ten Tec’s new owner, to ask him for more information about what we can expect from Ten Tec going forward. Here is his response:

Although Ten Tec has changed hands several times in the last couple of years, I would like to state that Ten Tec has changed hands for the last time in the foreseeable future. Dishtronix has been continuously operating for 17 years, is financially stable and will continue managing in a manner that promotes and maintains financial stability. My vision is strictly long term. I have no plans to leave this business and will continue to operate Ten Tec as long as I am physically able to do so. I believe the Ten Tec transceivers to be some of the best transceivers available at any price and personally have been operating an Orion II until the first change of ownership. Everyone who uses a piece of equipment long enough, develops a personal wish list of things they would change or improve. I feel extremely fortunate to now be in the position where I can use my skills and expertise from more than forty years of ham radio and SWLing to implement changes which I hope will make fantastic products even better.

Unfortunately I have had to make some tough decisions which were made for the long term health and viability of the company. The Ten Tec team is the nicest bunch of people you could hope to work with and have overall reacted positively to the changes. Some team members have chosen to pursue retirement or other opportunities but the core competency remains. We are extremely fortunate to have retained former engineering manager John Henry on a consulting basis and I must give him the greatest credit. I certainly would not take on this project without him and the other team members like Boyd Lichlyter and Patty Gann. Ten Tec is like a big family, and I do not view this as me acquiring Ten Tec but more like me joining an extended family of talented and skilled people. I hope anyone reading this who is in the market for a new radio will help me support this great group by at least trying one of their radios. Of the present production the Eagle is my favorite for having the best sound out of the box, and that is what my personal preference is always based on – good sound. My all-time favorite is of course the Orion II so an Orion III is on my personal wish list for the future. There are numerous Ten Tec user nets on the air and it is my intention so support them by posting the time and frequency schedules on the website. If I can accomplish one thing at Ten Tec it will be to be more customer-centric. I want to build the radios that you the customer wants! I am looking for ways to reliably engage with our customers so we can do that, and I think factory support of the nets is one way to start.

The Ten Tec team is working on production improvements to our facility and business. We are fully occupied with our commercial business at this time. When I have capacity the next step is to run the first batch of Omni 7+ which is the Omni 7 with some minor cosmetic changes and improvements such as a flat metal front for improved shielding. Following this we are releasing the Super Eagle which brings into the Eagle most of the DSP features found on the Orion II and is the first step on the path to the Orion III. This is different hardware from existing product so it is not a firmware upgrade. There are no firm dates or guarantees for when these things will occur.

The blow out sale prices are over and any outstanding orders at those prices are terminated The prices will be the regular list price. Those prices were previous owners intent to liquidate all inventory and will never be repeated.

I am pleased to state that we have completed some firmware updates which will be posted on the new Ten Tec website once it is up and running to entice people to visit the site.

Dishtronix has other new products under development as well. The DX2400MKII replaces the DX2400L1 legal limit + solid state amplifier and should be unveiled at Hamvention, to mention just one. We are close to beginning production of our Emtron DX2/3-SPd tetrode amplifiers which will also be shown at Hamvention. Further, there are some other exciting things happening which we may announce in the near future.

There has been some speculation if Ten Tec will move to Ohio. I do not plan to move anything at this time from the Sevierville – Knoxville area, but we may move within that area.

If I could ask the ham community to do one thing, it would be to please be patient with us. Things like this take time.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on January 07, 2016, 05:55:24 PM
Ten Tec still lives!  This was on another forum...

Although there had been much speculation that Dishtronix http://www.dishtronix.com/about.html was the mystery buyer of Ten Tec, we got confirmation in the last couple of days.

I wrote to Mike Dishop of Dishtronix, Ten Tec’s new owner, to ask him for more information about what we can expect from Ten Tec going forward. Here is his response:

Although Ten Tec has changed hands several times in the last couple of years, I would like to state that Ten Tec has changed hands for the last time in the foreseeable future. Dishtronix has been continuously operating for 17 years, is financially stable and will continue managing in a manner that promotes and maintains financial stability. My vision is strictly long term. I have no plans to leave this business and will continue to operate Ten Tec as long as I am physically able to do so. I believe the Ten Tec transceivers to be some of the best transceivers available at any price and personally have been operating an Orion II until the first change of ownership. Everyone who uses a piece of equipment long enough, develops a personal wish list of things they would change or improve. I feel extremely fortunate to now be in the position where I can use my skills and expertise from more than forty years of ham radio and SWLing to implement changes which I hope will make fantastic products even better.

Unfortunately I have had to make some tough decisions which were made for the long term health and viability of the company. The Ten Tec team is the nicest bunch of people you could hope to work with and have overall reacted positively to the changes. Some team members have chosen to pursue retirement or other opportunities but the core competency remains. We are extremely fortunate to have retained former engineering manager John Henry on a consulting basis and I must give him the greatest credit. I certainly would not take on this project without him and the other team members like Boyd Lichlyter and Patty Gann. Ten Tec is like a big family, and I do not view this as me acquiring Ten Tec but more like me joining an extended family of talented and skilled people. I hope anyone reading this who is in the market for a new radio will help me support this great group by at least trying one of their radios. Of the present production the Eagle is my favorite for having the best sound out of the box, and that is what my personal preference is always based on – good sound. My all-time favorite is of course the Orion II so an Orion III is on my personal wish list for the future. There are numerous Ten Tec user nets on the air and it is my intention so support them by posting the time and frequency schedules on the website. If I can accomplish one thing at Ten Tec it will be to be more customer-centric. I want to build the radios that you the customer wants! I am looking for ways to reliably engage with our customers so we can do that, and I think factory support of the nets is one way to start.

The Ten Tec team is working on production improvements to our facility and business. We are fully occupied with our commercial business at this time. When I have capacity the next step is to run the first batch of Omni 7+ which is the Omni 7 with some minor cosmetic changes and improvements such as a flat metal front for improved shielding. Following this we are releasing the Super Eagle which brings into the Eagle most of the DSP features found on the Orion II and is the first step on the path to the Orion III. This is different hardware from existing product so it is not a firmware upgrade. There are no firm dates or guarantees for when these things will occur.

The blow out sale prices are over and any outstanding orders at those prices are terminated The prices will be the regular list price. Those prices were previous owners intent to liquidate all inventory and will never be repeated.

I am pleased to state that we have completed some firmware updates which will be posted on the new Ten Tec website once it is up and running to entice people to visit the site.

Dishtronix has other new products under development as well. The DX2400MKII replaces the DX2400L1 legal limit + solid state amplifier and should be unveiled at Hamvention, to mention just one. We are close to beginning production of our Emtron DX2/3-SPd tetrode amplifiers which will also be shown at Hamvention. Further, there are some other exciting things happening which we may announce in the near future.

There has been some speculation if Ten Tec will move to Ohio. I do not plan to move anything at this time from the Sevierville – Knoxville area, but we may move within that area.

If I could ask the ham community to do one thing, it would be to please be patient with us. Things like this take time.

So I assume you are best buds with Mike?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KB4MNG on January 07, 2016, 06:38:39 PM
Nope, don't know mike. this was on a reflector.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on January 07, 2016, 08:35:03 PM
Nope, don't know mike. this was on a reflector.

Yeah, saw it two days ago along with a couple of others.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on January 07, 2016, 10:21:53 PM
So I assume you are best buds with Mike?

So I assume you are best buds with Oscar the Grouch?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N4RSS on January 08, 2016, 09:43:11 AM
We are close to beginning production of our Emtron DX2/3-SPd tetrode amplifiers which will also be shown at Hamvention.

Emtron ?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on January 08, 2016, 09:50:56 AM
We are close to beginning production of our Emtron DX2/3-SPd tetrode amplifiers which will also be shown at Hamvention.

Emtron ?
Yes, Dishtronix acquired Emtron last year.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WA2VUY on January 08, 2016, 04:10:03 PM
Where does all this leave Alpha? 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KB4MNG on January 09, 2016, 06:07:11 AM
Alpha is gone >:(
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on January 09, 2016, 07:33:17 AM
so, place your predictions here for when www.tentec.com (http://www.tentec.com) will no longer redirect to http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/ (http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/) signaling the phoenix could be rising from the ashes:

great news: the website no longer redirects to RKR -- http://www.tentec.com/ (http://www.tentec.com/)

I believe the change started yesterday???

73 from a pleased Jupiter owner.  
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0BKR on January 09, 2016, 08:14:56 AM
Just glad at this point in time, I no longer own a TT.  Hopefully, in a year or two, they get things rolling....then maybe...
I sincerely hope TT will be around but I seriously doubt it will be the TT we remember...and doubtful it will have the product offerings we once saw and at prices that we were comfortable with...

Again, I will wait a while and see.  Dishtronix isn't exactly an affordable manufacturer and certainly doesn't have a wide selection of products to offer the amateur market.   I don't need an amp that costs 2,3 times more then what is available presently, that does an adequate job.  Then again, I don't own a Hillbering either (nor will)....

GL TT, under whatever name you emerge as....GL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KG4RUL on January 09, 2016, 08:51:27 AM
The TenTec 507 Patriot transceiver is listed on the new website as "no longer available".  Why even show it if you CAN'T BUY IT?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0BKR on January 09, 2016, 08:55:09 AM
Likely, the new "owners" haven't updated all the data out there as this announcement of new "ownership" just happened...check in another week or so...if interested...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on January 09, 2016, 09:34:03 AM
Where does all this leave Alpha? 

I don't know that Alpha is gone but I do know that when you look up Emtron there is absolutely nothing that says Dishtronix owns them.  For all intent and purpose they appear to still be operating in Sydney, AU as if nothing has changed hands.  Also, nowhere does it show Emtron amplifiers available for sale in the US, I don't even think they have FCC approval.

So if Dishtronix did buy EmtronI don't see why they would want to buy Alpha unless they could get it for a steal and then combine the product lines under the Alpha brand. 

So as far as I know Alpha is still in business under RKR, for the time being anyway.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WA2VUY on January 09, 2016, 11:46:15 AM
Went googling and found this post from VK2UW, made sometime in 2015:

Dishtronix (promethious) and Emtron have now "Merged" into one.
This means that the Emtron DX-2SP along with the DX-3SP will now be built / sold and serviced in the USA along with Emtron doing services of Emtron's here in Australia along with selling and being an agent for Dishtronix S/S 2.5kw amplifiers
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on January 09, 2016, 03:04:16 PM
The TenTec 507 Patriot transceiver is listed on the new website as "no longer available".  Why even show it if you CAN'T BUY IT?
It is?  That's odd, I don't see ANY rig currently listed on the one page web site.

There is a short paragraph talking about the future, including a "Super Eagle", an "Omni 7+", and possibly an "Orion III."  But nothing specific about the Patriot (or Rebel or Argonaut VI) being "no longer available"

Mind posting a link to your source, please?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0BKR on January 09, 2016, 04:28:36 PM
When one goes to

http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/products/transceivers-receivers/507-patriot-open-source-arduino-based-ssbcw-qrp-transceiver/


and hits "Add to Cart", it comes up, no longer available..
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WA2VUY on January 09, 2016, 05:10:24 PM
You should be going here http://www.tentec.com/
When one goes to

http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/products/transceivers-receivers/507-patriot-open-source-arduino-based-ssbcw-qrp-transceiver/


and hits "Add to Cart", it comes up, no longer available..
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AE0Q on January 09, 2016, 05:41:23 PM
Alpha is not gone.  We're shipping new amps and repairing amps, too.  We answer e-mail and the telephone when we can but working on amps is the priority.  All the spare parts in stock are available, as they have been for years, on the web site.

Glenn AE0Q
RKR Designs LLC
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0BKR on January 09, 2016, 08:09:49 PM
Where are the equipment selections (Patriot, etc.)?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on January 09, 2016, 09:54:24 PM
Where are the equipment selections (Patriot, etc.)?

your link was to the RKR site which no longer owns Ten-Tec (apparently they do still own and sell Alpha).  

The correct website for Ten-Tec is: www.tentec.com (http://www.tentec.com)

as it just changed hands, don't be surprised if it takes a little while before you can buy stuff... calling them might be fruitful...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WK3B on January 10, 2016, 06:22:50 PM
>:( Terrible on tube orders~!  Over a month of wait and still not hearing from them as to when 2 orders will ship.  Previous orders got screwed up, shipped to wrong addresses, waited over a month for 3-500 matched pair, waiting for 811a quads and now waiting again.  Sure they have the best prices but their order area sure lacks information - like BACK-ORDERED before or after you order.
Went on EBay and got a quad set shipped within a week!  Go figure! 
Come on
RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
GET IT TOGETHER!

I ordered a 3CX800 from them late last year.  They quoted a six week lead time, had it on my doorstep in three.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on January 11, 2016, 08:38:04 AM
When one goes to

http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/products/transceivers-receivers/507-patriot-open-source-arduino-based-ssbcw-qrp-transceiver/

and hits "Add to Cart", it comes up, no longer available..
It has been announced that as of 1 January 2016, Ten-Tec is no longer owned by RKR Designs LLC.  The brand (specifically the assets) has been acquired by Dishtronix.

The new owner of Ten-Tec has asked for everyone's patience as they get the new web site up and determine which products will be the first to be re-introduced to the market.

See http://www.tentec.com

So, with that in mind... of course, it's no wonder that Alpha (still owned as AFAIK operated by RKR) is no longer making Ten-Tec gear available for sale.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3QE on January 11, 2016, 09:31:46 AM
As Referenced:
==============================
SALES ORDERS
Any outstanding transceiver purchase order at the fire sale price is cancelled. All sales orders shipped after 1/1/16 are invoiced at the list price without exception. You may cancel your sales order without any penalty by contacting sales@tentec.com

SERVICE POLICY
We have changed how service is conducted. Effective immediately for all units in for repair, there is a minimum charge on one hour labor at $140.0 for any unit sent in, even if it is not repaired. It takes the service department one hour to receive, unpack, set up on the bench, evaluate, estimate the repair, repack and box the unit, prepare shipping documents and prepare the invoice.  If your unit is repaired during this time period there will not be additional labor charges. If further work is required it will be billed at 125.00 per hour in quarter hour increments. Parts and return shipping is charged additionally. It takes on the average two hours to repair a unit.
=================================================================================================

NICE, different face same smell
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on January 11, 2016, 11:25:56 AM
the shelves were cleared for cash.  TT then went dormant, or close to it, before Dishtronix bought them.

so a little reinvention of the company is in order.  that's not overnight delivery.

be cool or be gone, assuming I win the Powerball on Wednesday, I can wait to see if I want to buy one.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WA6BPE on January 11, 2016, 02:27:28 PM
As Referenced:
==============================
SALES ORDERS
Any outstanding transceiver purchase order at the fire sale price is cancelled. All sales orders shipped after 1/1/16 are invoiced at the list price without exception. You may cancel your sales order without any penalty by contacting sales@tentec.com

SERVICE POLICY
We have changed how service is conducted. Effective immediately for all units in for repair, there is a minimum charge on one hour labor at $140.0 for any unit sent in, even if it is not repaired. It takes the service department one hour to receive, unpack, set up on the bench, evaluate, estimate the repair, repack and box the unit, prepare shipping documents and prepare the invoice.  If your unit is repaired during this time period there will not be additional labor charges. If further work is required it will be billed at 125.00 per hour in quarter hour increments. Parts and return shipping is charged additionally. It takes on the average two hours to repair a unit.
=================================================================================================

NICE, different face same smell

Have you been reading the thread on qrz.com?  The new owner of this outfit is coming off like a combative jerk.

When was the Orion out, about 10 years ago?  They were owning ham radio then - how fast and how far they have fallen to go from that to out of business. 

RIP Ten-Tec.  When's my new Elecraft rig getting here?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on January 11, 2016, 03:26:33 PM
As Referenced:
==============================
SALES ORDERS
Any outstanding transceiver purchase order at the fire sale price is cancelled. All sales orders shipped after 1/1/16 are invoiced at the list price without exception. You may cancel your sales order without any penalty by contacting sales@tentec.com

SERVICE POLICY
We have changed how service is conducted. Effective immediately for all units in for repair, there is a minimum charge on one hour labor at $140.0 for any unit sent in, even if it is not repaired. It takes the service department one hour to receive, unpack, set up on the bench, evaluate, estimate the repair, repack and box the unit, prepare shipping documents and prepare the invoice.  If your unit is repaired during this time period there will not be additional labor charges. If further work is required it will be billed at 125.00 per hour in quarter hour increments. Parts and return shipping is charged additionally. It takes on the average two hours to repair a unit.
=================================================================================================

NICE, different face same smell

VERY poor sales practices and customer service. I was in retail for over 40 years, and not honoring an advertised price, when purchased/ordered in good faith before any posted sale price expiration date, will erode consumer confidence and question the (new) company's business ethics going forward. People purchased from Ten-Tec, no matter who owned it at whatever time. What he's doing is not illegal, but IMO, he should suck it up as part of an ongoing business entity, and honor the "fire sale" prices. Just part of good business. I don't have a dog in this fight, just had to express my opinion.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: NN4RH on January 11, 2016, 03:48:32 PM
I think some people are a little confused.

If there are indeed any outstanding orders, then it's the previous owners were the ones who took orders for radios they were unable to deliver at an unrealistic price.

Why should the new owner of the brand take a loss on something he had nothing to do with?   As was announced, he purchased the assets, not the liabilities. Those orders accepted by previous owners were liabilities not assets. Seems pretty simple.

Anyone is upset, their beef should be with one or more of the sets of previous owners.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: NN4RH on January 11, 2016, 04:01:06 PM
Quote
... will erode consumer confidence and question the (new) company's business ethics going forward.

Not at all. Just the opposite. It makes me feel like there's hope.  Any damage done to the Ten Tec name was done by one or more of the previous sets of owners, not the current one. This guy might be able to rebuild it. Taking losses to fulfil zombie orders from previous incarnations of TenTec isn't going to achieve that..

If anyone is upset, they should be bitching to the previous owners who accepted orders for radios they did not have to sell.



Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: NN4RH on January 11, 2016, 04:22:03 PM
Quote
The new owner of this outfit is coming off like a combative jerk.

As much as I hope this works out, I would agree with that statement. I think people would feel better about all this if he'd "take the high road" and not sink to the level of the trolls attacking him.  Let his spokesperson do the spokesperson thing. KI4JPL seems calmer.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on January 11, 2016, 08:16:53 PM
As Referenced:
==============================
SALES ORDERS
Any outstanding transceiver purchase order at the fire sale price is cancelled. All sales orders shipped after 1/1/16 are invoiced at the list price without exception. You may cancel your sales order without any penalty by contacting sales@tentec.com

SERVICE POLICY
We have changed how service is conducted. Effective immediately for all units in for repair, there is a minimum charge on one hour labor at $140.0 for any unit sent in, even if it is not repaired. It takes the service department one hour to receive, unpack, set up on the bench, evaluate, estimate the repair, repack and box the unit, prepare shipping documents and prepare the invoice.  If your unit is repaired during this time period there will not be additional labor charges. If further work is required it will be billed at 125.00 per hour in quarter hour increments. Parts and return shipping is charged additionally. It takes on the average two hours to repair a unit.
=================================================================================================

NICE, different face same smell

Have you been reading the thread on qrz.com?  The new owner of this outfit is coming off like a combative jerk.

When was the Orion out, about 10 years ago?  They were owning ham radio then - how fast and how far they have fallen to go from that to out of business. 

RIP Ten-Tec.  When's my new Elecraft rig getting here?


It's true he is coming out swinging but there is a cracker jack box extra with a vanity call pressing his buttons pretty hard.  He really should not have even have acknowledged the guy.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8TUT on January 11, 2016, 09:34:24 PM
It's true he is coming out swinging but there is a cracker jack box extra with a vanity call pressing his buttons pretty hard.  He really should not have even have acknowledged the guy.

As a person who doesn't have a dog in the fight, I see it as a tactical error to be making comments of any kind at this point. Especially since the ham community is so fickle.

Might have been better to leak a little information here and there- and hold off doing any repairs until things were further along- or taking a loss on those repairs in the short term.

A service, "tech", or repair department is really difficult to run as a profit base these days, and has been in many industries, for the last 15 years. Better to take a minor loss or break even rather than incite the natives.

Than again- I could be mis-reading the situation terribly.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on January 12, 2016, 03:20:59 AM
Quote
The new owner of this outfit is coming off like a combative jerk.

As much as I hope this works out, I would agree with that statement. I think people would feel better about all this if he'd "take the high road" and not sink to the level of the trolls attacking him.  Let his spokesperson do the spokesperson thing. KI4JPL seems calmer.


RH, I agree to a point. However somewhere along the way you have to draw a line that says "this is where I begin, the past is/was not part of MY business". The way I look at it, there have been far too many people ready to condemn or outright have a funeral when there were no facts to base that on. And now that the facts are being revealed, some people don't like that.

He has publically asked for time to get things into place. Can you blame him when some can't get it through their thick sculls that what he says about needing time to reorganize is true? And criticized because he is not answering stupid questions until he is organized enough to give factual answers?

I think it shows fire in the belly to make this work. And some people deserve rudeness as an answer. And in reality, how many of those people with the thick heads are going to buy TT anyway? So why bend over backwards for them?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: NN4RH on January 12, 2016, 04:12:12 AM

RH, I agree to a point. However somewhere along the way you have to draw a line that says "this is where I begin, the past is/was not part of MY business".

The thing is, he and his spokesperson have already done that. Multiple times. The trolls and haters have latched onto a few things  about it and have gone ad-hominem,  and he's taken the bait and now is engaged in an unproductive and probably endless tit-for-tat.

The longer it goes on the more likely that it's going to become a permanent thorn in his side.  

It's just a handful of trolls and haters causing the ruckus - in fact mostly just one guy - the rest are drive-bys -  and anyone who's been around QRZ long enough knows that you will never change the minds of trolls and haters. The only way to defeat trolls is to stop feeding them, or be smarter than them and draw them into rules violations until the moderators get fed up enough to ban them.

Their policy and plans are posted and clearly explained.  He's not doing himself any favors by continuing to engage the trolls and haters. It's only confusing things for everyone else and encouraging the trolls and haters to continue.

The thing that needs to be kept in mind is that it's not the handful of haters and trolls that he has to convince, it's the other 24,000 people reading the thread.  And that's where it won't pay off to come across as insecure, defensive, reactive, etc.  

I think most people would rather buy stuff from someone who comes across as calm, confident, in control, etc.

In my opinion, he'd be better off to just ignore QRZ and get to work. The trolls and haters will eventually run out of steam, and by then the products and services of the new company will speak for themselves.


Just my take on things. Others will feel differently.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on January 12, 2016, 05:35:32 AM
Have you been reading the thread on qrz.com?  The new owner of this outfit is coming off like a combative jerk.

When was the Orion out, about 10 years ago?  They were owning ham radio then - how fast and how far they have fallen to go from that to out of business. 

RIP Ten-Tec.  When's my new Elecraft rig getting here?
It's true he is coming out swinging but there is a cracker jack box extra with a vanity call pressing his buttons pretty hard.  He really should not have even have acknowledged the guy.
To be perfectly honest, no, he shouldn't have.

So the guy isn't a polished PR professional. 

If you read through that thread carefully... and if you say "I'd rather not!" I don't blame you at all, it's fugly... you'll see that the new owner was under attack for not saying anything, and then when he (first through John and then directly) did say something POSITIVE, the same trolls attacked him again. 

Gee.  Sounds almost like some people in THIS thread.  ( Come to think of it, some of them may even be the same people. )

I've said before & will say again:  GIVE THE GUY A CHANCE and GIVE THE GUY A BREAK. 

He didn't have to buy Ten-Tec and spend time, money, and effort to try and restore the brand and turn the company around.  He did.  When no one else who could, would.

The damage done can not be undone overnight.  It will take time.  Give him the time.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on January 12, 2016, 05:53:40 AM
VERY poor sales practices and customer service. I was in retail for over 40 years, and not honoring an advertised price, when purchased/ordered in good faith before any posted sale price expiration date, will erode consumer confidence and question the (new) company's business ethics going forward. People purchased from Ten-Tec, no matter who owned it at whatever time. What he's doing is not illegal, but IMO, he should suck it up as part of an ongoing business entity, and honor the "fire sale" prices. Just part of good business. I don't have a dog in this fight, just had to express my opinion.
Ok, let's look at this logically.

The "blowout" sale was actually, for all practical purposes, an inventory reduction or clearance sale, by the previous owners.  (Why they didn't say as much is another story)

Usually, when someone holds a sale like this (be it radios or mattresses), there is or should be a disclaimer to the effect of "quantities are limited"/"while supplies last" or "for a limited time only."  In fact, I'm pretty sure I remember the "limited time" statement being made in the advertising in one form or another. 

Once inventory was sold out, the previous owners took additional orders on the caveat that IF AND WHEN the items went back into production, the sales prices (presumably) would be honored.  I do recall emails to that effect, if not in those exact words. 

They were never built, and in hindsight, it's now clear that they never would be.  (I do not know if the intentions at the time were to build them, eventually; that's again another story)

Now:  The assets of Ten Tec were sold to Dishtronix.  I do not know if those assets included the pending additional orders. 

If they did not, then those orders are still "owned" by RKR.  Clearly, by selling the assets, they do not now intend to build Ten Tec gear again.  So those orders become moot.

If they did... Dishtronix has indicated that the radios in question may not go back into production.  Specifically mentioned as upcoming products are an Omni 7+, which is not an Omni VII (in terms of product identification), and a Super Eagle, which is not an Eagle.

One can gather from that that the original Eagle and Omni VII, therefore, will not return to production.  Those those outstanding orders can never be filled.

So:  Do you want those people who placed those orders with RKR in good faith, on the presumption that production of those radios would resume one day, to be left hanging indefinitely?  Especially when there was not a solid guarantee that they ever would be?

One can argue that the announcement could have been done better, been more polished and such.  That said... you got the news short, direct, and to the point.  It may have been blunt, but there was no ambiguity.  In the long run, that's probably the better way to do things. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KB4MNG on January 12, 2016, 08:22:21 AM
I don't think they care about the unfilled orders. I also got the feeling from the process that they were selling out stock and was going to crank out more. I thought they were trying to get TT more main stream and you would see a continuation of lower prices.

Crystal clear now they were just clearing out the old stuff so they would not be sitting on it. I kicked my self at the time for not getting in on an eagle. Glad it did not work out now 8)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on January 12, 2016, 08:55:31 AM
If they can end up producing a product that hams want it will not matter if the owner is abrasive or not.  Where I live there was a major appliance dealer that was absolutely abrasive.  If he didn't like you he told you to get out and don't come back.  Didn't matter because for every one he threw out, 4 more came in.  He ran the business this way for 60 years till he retired.
Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on January 12, 2016, 09:40:46 AM
VERY poor sales practices and customer service. I was in retail for over 40 years, and not honoring an advertised price, when purchased/ordered in good faith before any posted sale price expiration date, will erode consumer confidence and question the (new) company's business ethics going forward. People purchased from Ten-Tec, no matter who owned it at whatever time. What he's doing is not illegal, but IMO, he should suck it up as part of an ongoing business entity, and honor the "fire sale" prices. Just part of good business. I don't have a dog in this fight, just had to express my opinion.
Ok, let's look at this logically.

The "blowout" sale was actually, for all practical purposes, an inventory reduction or clearance sale, by the previous owners.  (Why they didn't say as much is another story)

Usually, when someone holds a sale like this (be it radios or mattresses), there is or should be a disclaimer to the effect of "quantities are limited"/"while supplies last" or "for a limited time only."  In fact, I'm pretty sure I remember the "limited time" statement being made in the advertising in one form or another. 

Once inventory was sold out, the previous owners took additional orders on the caveat that IF AND WHEN the items went back into production, the sales prices (presumably) would be honored.  I do recall emails to that effect, if not in those exact words. 

They were never built, and in hindsight, it's now clear that they never would be.  (I do not know if the intentions at the time were to build them, eventually; that's again another story)

Now:  The assets of Ten Tec were sold to Dishtronix.  I do not know if those assets included the pending additional orders. 

If they did not, then those orders are still "owned" by RKR.  Clearly, by selling the assets, they do not now intend to build Ten Tec gear again.  So those orders become moot.

If they did... Dishtronix has indicated that the radios in question may not go back into production.  Specifically mentioned as upcoming products are an Omni 7+, which is not an Omni VII (in terms of product identification), and a Super Eagle, which is not an Eagle.

One can gather from that that the original Eagle and Omni VII, therefore, will not return to production.  Those those outstanding orders can never be filled.

So:  Do you want those people who placed those orders with RKR in good faith, on the presumption that production of those radios would resume one day, to be left hanging indefinitely?  Especially when there was not a solid guarantee that they ever would be?

One can argue that the announcement could have been done better, been more polished and such.  That said... you got the news short, direct, and to the point.  It may have been blunt, but there was no ambiguity.  In the long run, that's probably the better way to do things. 

Dishtronix's Ten-Tec statement: "SALES ORDERS: Any outstanding transceiver purchase order at the fire sale price is cancelled. All sales orders shipped after 1/1/16 are invoiced at list price without exception"

OK, here's more logic. I dug up the old QST ads:

May, 2015: Last RF Concepts ad...599 AT Eagle and 539 Argonaut VI, regular and sale prices posted. Also states  that
                 "Prices subject to change without notice". No mention of prior ads 588 Omni VII regular and sale pricing.
June, 2015: First RKR Designs ad...Same Eagle and Argonaut regular and sale prices, and "prices subject to change
                  without notice". Also states that "RKR Designs...has acquired the Alpha Amplifier and Ten-Tec brands...will
                  honor the terms of sale and warranty for any Alpha or Ten-Tec product that was purchased from RF
                  Concepts...". 588 Omni VII "returning to production soon".
September, 2015: FINAL RKR Designs ad...Same Eagle and Argonaut regular and sale prices, 588 Omni VII "returning to
                  production soon", and NO mention of "prices subject to change without notice" (supersedes previous ads).

NO mention anywhere of "fire sale, blowout, going out of business, quantities are limited, limited time only, while supplies last, sale prices good until (date), discontinued, out of production, bankruptcy, moving sale, etc"...all normal phrases and disclaimers of ethical business practices in advertising.

RKR was willing to honor RF Concepts sale prices (at least that's what was stated in their first ad). Someone here mentioned that RKR's sales orders were a liability...can't agree with that, based on the definition of "liability".

The above mentioned "SALES ORDER" statement absolutely could and should have been more detailed, "done better", and "polished". Blunt?...yes. Ambiguous?...also yes. Reading that statement, to me, implies that sale prices (bought in good faith, from "Ten-Tec", based on their advertisements) on previous sales orders would not be honored, and billed at list price...indicates that those models will be shipped, albeit at the higher price. No mention that those products were now (as W3WN states), with the new owners, discontinued and out of production, therefore orders for those SPECIFIC models cannot be fulfilled. Just tell us the "why". No apologies, no regrets, no explanation...just a short, terse statement that can rub people the wrong way. It did to me. I understand his service and repair policy going forward...just stating the facts.

Look, I wish Mike nothing but the best in Ten-Tec's resurgence, but with all the questions and hoop-la surrounding the subject in recent months, I would think that a little more tact in statements from the Company would be in order. He not only has to rebuild the line, but also has to instill trust and confidence in his current and future customers if he's going to succeed.   

   
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on January 12, 2016, 09:41:50 AM
In communication with the new owner, I suggested to him that he would be nice for him to hold the price on the radios for those already ordered. The issue is that the price is LESS than the cost to build the radio. The reason is that the old owners were in the process of shutting down TenTec. They apparently never had any intention of building new radios; the pricing was just to clear out the inventory to get out of it any money they could. Then, the rest of the equipment, parts, assets of any kind they did not want, would be auctioned off. In other words, TenTec was dead.

Along comes the new owner, he buys whats left ("the assets"), and wants to restart the company from scratch. He said he cannot lose money on each newly built radio. I understand that and we all have to accept it. Remember, he did not buy TenTec. TenTec was DEAD. What he bought were only the assets, and he is going to use those assets and his new investment to launch a new TenTec and keep the tradition of quality built US transceivers alive.

I did suggest that he communicate better, and that the anger is mostly due to how the situation is being communicated - not actually what has been communicated, as a result, it has come off very negative.

So let's give the guy a break, see what he can do and stop hammering him for the decisions he HAS to make to bring TenTec back from the dead. Businesses are not benevolent organizations, they have to make money.

To Mr. LOL and the rest of the deniers who always wanted direct communication, I did. Those of us who realized months ago TenTec was dead were right. But now someone is trying to bring it back to life, and based on his personal commitment to me, in the future I will again buy a TenTec radio.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on January 12, 2016, 09:49:57 AM
If they can end up producing a product that hams want it will not matter if the owner is abrasive or not.  Where I live there was a major appliance dealer that was absolutely abrasive.  If he didn't like you he told you to get out and don't come back.  Didn't matter because for every one he threw out, 4 more came in.  He ran the business this way for 60 years till he retired.
Art

Good for him. Either he was the only dealer in town, or his PRICES were much lower than anyone else. Most people today won't put up with that crap, especially now with all the online competition and social media gossip and ratings. Good thing he's retired...a stupid way to run a business.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on January 12, 2016, 10:07:33 AM
In communication with the new owner, I suggested to him that he would be nice for him to hold the price on the radios for those already ordered. The issue is that the price is LESS than the cost to build the radio. The reason is that the old owners were in the process of shutting down TenTec. They apparently never had any intention of building new radios; the pricing was just to clear out the inventory to get out of it any money they could. Then, the rest of the equipment, parts, assets of any kind they did not want, would be auctioned off. In other words, TenTec was dead.

Along comes the new owner, he buys whats left ("the assets"), and wants to restart the company from scratch. He said he cannot lose money on each newly built radio. I understand that and we all have to accept it. Remember, he did not buy TenTec. TenTec was DEAD. What he bought were only the assets, and he is going to use those assets and his new investment to launch a new TenTec and keep the tradition of quality built US transceivers alive.

I did suggest that he communicate better, and that the anger is mostly due to how the situation is being communicated - not actually what has been communicated, as a result, it has come off very negative.

So let's give the guy a break, see what he can do and stop hammering him for the decisions he HAS to make to bring TenTec back from the dead. Businesses are not benevolent organizations, they have to make money.

To Mr. LOL and the rest of the deniers who always wanted direct communication, I did. Those of us who realized months ago TenTec was dead were right. But now someone is trying to bring it back to life, and based on his personal commitment to me, in the future I will again buy a TenTec radio.

I understand all the reasons...NOW. But the people that bought the radios at "sale" prices then had no idea what was going on behind the scenes. It was just a "sale" from a seemingly reputable, ongoing company, and they placed their orders in good faith. In that light, IMO, Ten-Tec's "SALES ORDER" statement should have conveyed those reasons as to the "why". I'm sure that most of us would have understood and accepted it. Communication is the key to a good relationship, whether it be person-to-person, or  company-to-person.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on January 12, 2016, 10:26:21 AM
Funny how people still say TT died. Did RKR dissolve it? No. Did they sell it to a new owner? Yes. Assets and name. It had; and if my information is correct; still has employees. Regardless if in the interim if they actually built a product or not, TT never really died. Except in some peoples minds.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on January 12, 2016, 10:47:02 AM
Funny how people still say TT died. Did RKR dissolve it? No. Did they sell it to a new owner? Yes. Assets and name. It had; and if my information is correct; still has employees. Regardless if in the interim if they actually built a product or not, TT never really died. Except in some peoples minds.

you are correct.  however even an admission that they were technically wrong does not seem to be in the funeral committee's playbook. 

(http://designisblank.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/Screen-shot-2013-02-20-at-10.38.10-AM-660x330.png)

oh well, this never was about them anyway -- it was always about TT.  Let's see if we can't wait till summer before declaring the new baby terminal or superman.

I'd love to see the new Super Eagle have some Jupiter heritage, but we are going to have to wait and see...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB5PGX on January 12, 2016, 11:35:04 AM
I want to thank the new Ten Tec owner for stepping up and taking on the challenge. The ham community  needs to make sure that the negative voices are countered by all of us that would really like to see Ten Tec make it. If the service department stops giving away their work and the radios cost the same or more than before the fire sale - so be it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on January 12, 2016, 12:34:36 PM
I don't think they care about the unfilled orders. I also got the feeling from the process that they were selling out stock and was going to crank out more. I thought they were trying to get TT more main stream and you would see a continuation of lower prices.

Crystal clear now they were just clearing out the old stuff so they would not be sitting on it. I kicked my self at the time for not getting in on an eagle. Glad it did not work out now 8)
You do seem to have failed to realize that there is an ownership change in the middle of that.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on January 12, 2016, 12:42:49 PM
< snip >
Look, I wish Mike nothing but the best in Ten-Tec's resurgence,
< snip >
Do you?  I wonder.

Well, OK, maybe you do.  I'm not so certain about some of the other posters in this thread, and the thread over on QRZ.COM .  (And a few, I have no doubts about whatsoever)

The big difference is... RKR Designs, for all practical purposes, took over the RF Concepts operation, intact and running. 

Dishtronix, however, is only buying the assets of Ten Tec, which it appears RKR (for whatever reasons) was not doing so well with, and now has to put the company back together & back in full operation again.

Either that is being lost on some of the posters on these threads, or they could care less and just enjoy heaping more and more on it.

Is this the new sport?  Kick them when they are (or appear to be) down? 

I have said before, I will say again:  Give the guy a break, and give the guy a chance. 

I didn't think that was too much to ask for.  Obviously it was.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on January 12, 2016, 03:23:20 PM
< snip >
Look, I wish Mike nothing but the best in Ten-Tec's resurgence,
< snip >
Do you?  I wonder.

Well, OK, maybe you do.  I'm not so certain about some of the other posters in this thread, and the thread over on QRZ.COM .  (And a few, I have no doubts about whatsoever)

The big difference is... RKR Designs, for all practical purposes, took over the RF Concepts operation, intact and running. 

Dishtronix, however, is only buying the assets of Ten Tec, which it appears RKR (for whatever reasons) was not doing so well with, and now has to put the company back together & back in full operation again.

Either that is being lost on some of the posters on these threads, or they could care less and just enjoy heaping more and more on it.

Is this the new sport?  Kick them when they are (or appear to be) down? 

I have said before, I will say again:  Give the guy a break, and give the guy a chance. 

I didn't think that was too much to ask for.  Obviously it was.


Yes, I really do want Mike to succeed. I have no axe to grind. My comments were based on, and referred solely to, his new "SALES ORDER" policy regarding pending orders from RF Concepts and RKR. Based on my extensive experience in retail (for whatever that's worth ::)), I felt that the policy wording came off as terse, blunt, cavalier, and unsympathetic to the folks that previously ordered in good faith. They had no idea what was going on behind the scenes, and the advertisements didn't let on to anything other than business as usual. I never saw (in the ads) the words "fire sale", or any connotation of the sort, mentioned, as he referred to it in his policy. I don't blame people for feeling misled, in the dark, and pissed off. While they were waiting for their radios to (never) be shipped, they could have purchased elsewhere at other manufacturers' legitimate "sale" prices and promotions.

Again, he didn't do anything illegal. He just, IMO, should have offered an addendum to his policy, explaining the business reasons and decisions for not honoring the "fire sale" prices (like what he told WB8NUT in a previous post), not just in essence saying "that's it, no exceptions, take it or leave it...period". I don't think that's too much to ask, especially with all the controversy posted here and on qrz.com. When you're trying to "revive" a business, you need to instill faith and confidence in operations going forward, especially with all the big-name competition out there. I honestly believe most people would have understood, and given him a break to get things up and running. I'm sure he's a smart, honest person, and really wants to make a go of the "new" Ten-Tec. He just needs a savvy retail PR man (or woman) to advise him, write his statements, and deal with the public  ;)

73,  Bob K7JQ 



 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N0YXB on January 12, 2016, 05:18:46 PM
If they can end up producing a product that hams want it will not matter if the owner is abrasive or not.  Where I live there was a major appliance dealer that was absolutely abrasive.  If he didn't like you he told you to get out and don't come back.  Didn't matter because for every one he threw out, 4 more came in.  He ran the business this way for 60 years till he retired.
Art

Good for him. Either he was the only dealer in town, or his PRICES were much lower than anyone else. Most people today won't put up with that crap, especially now with all the online competition and social media gossip and ratings. Good thing he's retired...a stupid way to run a business.

No soup for you!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3QE on January 12, 2016, 05:36:58 PM
Apologist for a pompous blow heart is how I see some on here.

Funny how money excuses dignity, but then look where it's getting Trump in this twisted world where the term righteous is defined in mirror image.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on January 13, 2016, 10:44:25 AM
Apologist for a pompous blow heart is how I see some on here.


I believe the correct term is "blow-hard."
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on January 13, 2016, 11:01:08 AM
Funny how people still say TT died. Did RKR dissolve it? No. Did they sell it to a new owner? Yes. Assets and name. It had; and if my information is correct; still has employees. Regardless if in the interim if they actually built a product or not, TT never really died. Except in some peoples minds.

You just don't don't get it. Tentec died, the old TenTec is gone. When you buy the assets of a company, you are NOT buying the company. The old TenTec is gone, it died, the owners not only were not manufacturing radios, they were selling the assets to shut it down and get whatever money they could get out of it. So along comes Dishtronix. They buy the assets - not the company. Had RKR sold the company, then yes, it did not die. Dishtronix did not buy the company, they bought the assets from what was TenTec. He bought the name, the designs, and whatever parts and equipment was left. RKR effectively shut down the old TenTec, then sold the assets.

Look at it this way, if Joe Doe dies, there is a body and most likely some assets that Joe Doe owned. The family (RKR in this case) buries the body. The family (RKR) then sells Joe's assets to people who want to buy them. Maybe Joe had a business that owned a building and guess what, Joe's name was on the building. Just because someone comes along and buys Joe's assets and a building with his name on it, does not mean that Joe did not die and is still alive. Joe is still dead. The old TenTec (Joe) is dead. Now Dishtronix (the company/individual who bought Joe's assets, likes the name of the company Joe used to own and run and they like the business. So they are keeping the name, and the type of business Joe used to be in. In fact, they like it so much, they are going to run it like it used to run in Joe's glory days. In fact, they decided to hire some of Joe's old employees. Joe (TenTec) is still dead. But there is a new Joe's Business and it even looks like the old Joe's Business. Buying assets is not the same as buying the company. When you buy the company you buy the assets and the liabilities. When you buy the assets of a company, the old legal entity is dissolved or just kept within the corporate framework of what remains of RKR.

Now maybe you can understand. I doubt it, but worth a try.....LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3QE on January 13, 2016, 12:21:27 PM
.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on January 13, 2016, 01:30:37 PM
Funny how people still say TT died. Did RKR dissolve it? No. Did they sell it to a new owner? Yes. Assets and name. It had; and if my information is correct; still has employees. Regardless if in the interim if they actually built a product or not, TT never really died. Except in some peoples minds.

You just don't don't get it. Tentec died, the old TenTec is gone. When you buy the assets of a company, you are NOT buying the company. The old TenTec is gone, it died, the owners not only were not manufacturing radios, they were selling the assets to shut it down and get whatever money they could get out of it. So along comes Dishtronix. They buy the assets - not the company. Had RKR sold the company, then yes, it did not die. Dishtronix did not buy the company, they bought the assets from what was TenTec. He bought the name, the designs, and whatever parts and equipment was left. RKR effectively shut down the old TenTec, then sold the assets.

Look at it this way, if Joe Doe dies, there is a body and most likely some assets that Joe Doe owned. The family (RKR in this case) buries the body. The family (RKR) then sells Joe's assets to people who want to buy them. Maybe Joe had a business that owned a building and guess what, Joe's name was on the building. Just because someone comes along and buys Joe's assets and a building with his name on it, does not mean that Joe did not die and is still alive. Joe is still dead. The old TenTec (Joe) is dead. Now Dishtronix (the company/individual who bought Joe's assets, likes the name of the company Joe used to own and run and they like the business. So they are keeping the name, and the type of business Joe used to be in. In fact, they like it so much, they are going to run it like it used to run in Joe's glory days. In fact, they decided to hire some of Joe's old employees. Joe (TenTec) is still dead. But there is a new Joe's Business and it even looks like the old Joe's Business. Buying assets is not the same as buying the company. When you buy the company you buy the assets and the liabilities. When you buy the assets of a company, the old legal entity is dissolved or just kept within the corporate framework of what remains of RKR.

Now maybe you can understand. I doubt it, but worth a try.....LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL.

Nice try. Dead would mean everything was already gone. Like the reincarnation of Heathkit. It was not, by your own admission. And you don't have to buy liabilities to purchase a company. That is all negotiated in the sale contract. Which, BTW, makes it even a better deal. You don't have the huge debt load while transitioning the company. Rather smart on Dishtronix side.

But you just need to be right even when your wrong. So be it. That's why I LOL. Your so desperate to be right that it is funny. You keep posting and I will keep laughing.

BTW, I thought you were not going to respond to me anymore. Or at least that's what you said. LOL So you were wrong again! LOL So when do we know when you are right? LOL Reminds me of CQ mag. LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8TUT on January 13, 2016, 02:46:34 PM
Funny how people still say TT died. Did RKR dissolve it? No. Did they sell it to a new owner? Yes. Assets and name. It had; and if my information is correct; still has employees. Regardless if in the interim if they actually built a product or not, TT never really died. Except in some peoples minds.

You just don't don't get it. Tentec died, the old TenTec is gone. When you buy the assets of a company, you are NOT buying the company. The old TenTec is gone, it died, the owners not only were not manufacturing radios, they were selling the assets to shut it down and get whatever money they could get out of it. So along comes Dishtronix. They buy the assets - not the company. Had RKR sold the company, then yes, it did not die. Dishtronix did not buy the company, they bought the assets from what was TenTec. He bought the name, the designs, and whatever parts and equipment was left. RKR effectively shut down the old TenTec, then sold the assets.

Look at it this way, if Joe Doe dies, there is a body and most likely some assets that Joe Doe owned. The family (RKR in this case) buries the body. The family (RKR) then sells Joe's assets to people who want to buy them. Maybe Joe had a business that owned a building and guess what, Joe's name was on the building. Just because someone comes along and buys Joe's assets and a building with his name on it, does not mean that Joe did not die and is still alive. Joe is still dead. The old TenTec (Joe) is dead. Now Dishtronix (the company/individual who bought Joe's assets, likes the name of the company Joe used to own and run and they like the business. So they are keeping the name, and the type of business Joe used to be in. In fact, they like it so much, they are going to run it like it used to run in Joe's glory days. In fact, they decided to hire some of Joe's old employees. Joe (TenTec) is still dead. But there is a new Joe's Business and it even looks like the old Joe's Business. Buying assets is not the same as buying the company. When you buy the company you buy the assets and the liabilities. When you buy the assets of a company, the old legal entity is dissolved or just kept within the corporate framework of what remains of RKR.

Now maybe you can understand. I doubt it, but worth a try.....LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL.

Nice try. Dead would mean everything was already gone. Like the reincarnation of Heathkit. It was not, by your own admission. And you don't have to buy liabilities to purchase a company. That is all negotiated in the sale contract. Which, BTW, makes it even a better deal. You don't have the huge debt load while transitioning the company. Rather smart on Dishtronix side.

But you just need to be right even when your wrong. So be it. That's why I LOL. Your so desperate to be right that it is funny. You keep posting and I will keep laughing.

BTW, I thought you were not going to respond to me anymore. Or at least that's what you said. LOL So you were wrong again! LOL So when do we know when you are right? LOL Reminds me of CQ mag. LOL

Ok- but who's Joe?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on January 13, 2016, 03:21:54 PM
Doesn't  matter...Joe died  ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on January 13, 2016, 03:56:07 PM
Yea gonna buy Joe Doe's wife a sympathy card. Then tell her that Joe's business is dead because he died, and she will have to sell everything. It can't exist after Joe died!

RIP Joe!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on January 14, 2016, 04:30:05 AM

BTW, I thought you were not going to respond to me anymore.

I wasn't, but have been on a mission to try to end ignorance in this country as there is so much of it. It's a daunting task and I thought I was up for it. However, I should have heeded Ron White's advice, but I didn't. Ron White is right. I just can't fix it.

Yes, I will admit, I did think CQ was going to have to close down. It didn't. I also thought Jimmy Carter was going to be the worst president in history, but the last seven years proved me wrong on that belief.

But the new owner of the assets of the former TenTec confirmed my belief. The old TenTec is dead and gone. Long live the new TenTec.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on January 14, 2016, 03:20:20 PM
Does anyone know what the deal is going to be with Alpha?  Are they going to continue to exist?  Are they going to advertise again in QST mag? 

Thanks,

Steve
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on January 14, 2016, 03:27:55 PM
Does anyone know what the deal is going to be with Alpha?  Are they going to continue to exist?  Are they going to advertise again in QST mag? 

Thanks,

Steve

See reply #855 on page 58 in this thread.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on January 14, 2016, 03:44:26 PM
The old TenTec is dead and gone. Long live the new TenTec.

well sure, if you want to get esoteric, then --

just as you cannot step in the same stream twice because it is constantly changing, everything dies and is reborn every moment. you are not the same WB8NUT you were 2 days ago. 

but TT never died in the conventional sense: it has simply gone thru 3 ownership changes in the last few years and now the 4th owner is here. 
The 4th Doctor Who is my favorite -- maybe that will be true of TT too :)

(http://redrocketrising.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Fourth-Doctor-in-Legacy.jpg)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N0YXB on January 15, 2016, 07:25:33 AM
have been on a mission to try to end ignorance in this country as there is so much of it. It's a daunting task and I thought I was up for it.

You're not.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on January 16, 2016, 04:04:21 AM
You're not.

I agree. It is an insurmountable task. Just too much of it to overcome.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KK5DR on January 16, 2016, 06:58:46 AM
Begging for cash on "Go fund me.com" is not the way to run a company. It's NOT a good model. It means the banks refuse to loan you anymore than you already have.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on January 16, 2016, 10:25:52 AM
Begging for cash on "Go fund me.com" is not the way to run a company. It's NOT a good model. It means the banks refuse to loan you anymore than you already have.

I agree with everything you said however, I don't think they have implemented the go fund me strategy.  That was something they threw out there, I suspect they were kind of thinking out loud on that proposal.  But you are right, that is a dumb strategy.

The thought process behind it is that they know there is a small group of hard core of Ten Tec worshipers who, if the new owner said they were going to make radios out of recycled dog doo doo and needed cash to do it, would robotically grab their check books and send in their tithe no questions asked.

Fortunately thus far it looks like they will be able to make it on their own without any creative funding schemes.  There was a lot of backlash over the charges for service but they have a right to charge for service and packing/shipping so I don't see that as unreasonable at all.  I have a couple pieces of Ten Tec equipment that I like a lot but I'm not a zealot, if they make it good deal, if they don't I will miss them.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KASSY on January 16, 2016, 02:34:03 PM
Begging for cash on "Go fund me.com" is not the way to run a company. It's NOT a good model. It means the banks refuse to loan you anymore than you already have.

Does nobody on here understand anything about business?  Most finance managers consider a bank to be the LAST place you want money to grow a business from!  Because it puts you into debt to someone who knows nothing about your business or your customers, cannot in any useful way give you business advice and don't really care about your company, just your money. 
A bank is a good source for funding, say, an annual burst in sales...many small mall stores realize 90% of their business just at Christmas rush, so it's an annual event to borrow enough to buy inventory, then have a good Christmas, and pay back the loan - in weeks.  But as a source of money for the risky business of growing or starting a business?  No, formal finance managers would consider a bank the source of last resort.

An INVESTOR, on the other hand chooses to invest in you because they like your business model, they might want to become a customer and because they are likely a customer they're ideally suited to let you know what products to produce that they would buy.  I'm speaking small business, here, that's not how it works for the Fortune 500.

A GRANTOR is the best!  This is someone who reads your plan, thinks you have a shot at doing something great and DONATES money - money you do not have to pay back, because they believe in you and they think that the marketplace/country/whatever they feel strongly about, will be better with you and your company in it.

The crowdfunding concept is based on grants, which are far better than loans, any time, all the time.  Some financial managers call them "angels" because they're giving you money on the strength of their belief that you will do good things.  They expect nothing in return, nothing at all.

However...for most crowdfunding websites, you are required to offer "perks", which are the equivalent of the NPR reward for donating this much or that to the radio station.  The perks are never worth as much as the donation amount you contribute to get them.

Here's a company seeking funding to produce basically a souped-up Arduino kit.  At the $69 level, you get one of the kits.  When they hit the market for real, they'll be about half that.  Notice that they've already received $36,000 in donations (donors are advised that there are risks - the company may fail at the attempt to produce the product, therefore the donor agrees that they are making a donation and if they get the perk, it's a nice bonus) already way above their $25,000 goal, and there's 40 days left.

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/tinylab-prototype-easier-than-ever--2#/

What's great about this is that those donors are telling you YES, produce that product, there is demand.  If you put up a crowdfunding campaign and it falls flat, then you just got taught that you're doing something wrong and you can stop spending time and money chasing something nobody will buy...time to change directions and try again.

Crowdfunding is part of a whole set of new technologies are are making money, labor, investors and customer contact "liquid"...easy to access without a middleman.  It's been hailed by business writers from stodgy old magazines like the Wall Street Journal and Forbes, all the way down to maker Faires as the best thing that's ever happened in terms of funding new companies, connecting them directly with their customers and providing instant feedback on whether their latest idea will sell after the 5 years and $2 million it takes to create it.

- k
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on January 16, 2016, 02:52:12 PM
Does nobody on here understand anything about business? 

Based on the many wild tales in this thread alone, sadly there are not many. And some still think the world runs on mid 20th century business practices. Ah well change is hard to accept by some.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on January 16, 2016, 04:39:45 PM
Does nobody on here understand anything about business? 

Based on the many wild tales in this thread alone, sadly there are not many. And some still think the world runs on mid 20th century business practices. Ah well change is hard to accept by some.

this thread is swarming with armchair quarterbacks who think the are Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers, and Cam Newton all rolled into one :D
they have never been sacked for their poor ideas or had their errant throws picked off -- because they only play in the dream world and are not subject to failure.
one thing they do know how to do well though is opine, offer advice & criticize...  ::)  the internet age has bred that kind of thing...

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on January 17, 2016, 05:05:36 AM

Does nobody on here understand anything about business? 
- k

Actually no, most here have never run a for-profit business, a nonprofit organization, a government entity, or managed any kind of a major budget or large group of employees. Most here have no idea what they are talking about. I've actually done all of it yet people want to argue from their positions of ignorance.

But I'm guessing your question was actually a rhetorical one.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on January 17, 2016, 09:54:41 AM
RE: KASSY

Quote
KK5DR:  Begging for cash on "Go fund me.com" is not the way to run a company. It's NOT a good model. It means the banks refuse to loan you anymore than you already have.

KASSY:

Quote
Does nobody on here understand anything about business?


Well You don't.

Quote
A GRANTOR is the best!  This is someone who reads your plan, thinks you have a shot at doing something great and DONATES money - money you do not have to pay back, because they believe in you and they think that the marketplace/country/whatever they feel strongly about, will be better with you and your company in it.

They are called suckers.

Quote
The crowdfunding concept is based on grants, which are far better than loans, any time, all the time.  Some financial managers call them "angels" because they're giving you money on the strength of their belief that you will do good things.  They expect nothing in return, nothing at all.

That is the most stupid thing I have ever heard.  Only a complete idiot with absolutely no common sense would just give money to a company with no expected return on investment.  

I think you are confusing people who give money to charitable organizations that do humanitarian work, is Ten Tec a charity?  

There are angels in the business world.   Fifty years ago my dad and his partner found an Angel who invested a hundred and fifty thousand dollars in their new Chevrolet dealership.  The Angel got all of his money back over 7 years plus six and a half percent.   That's how it works, not some idiotic notion that anyone is going to be stupid enough to just say "here, have some money".  You family might do that but no one else will.

Please get real.  I didn't want to feed the trolls but I just had to respond.  Over and out.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on January 17, 2016, 01:27:09 PM
I didn't want to feed the trolls but I just had to respond.

LOL
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KASSY on January 17, 2016, 02:00:46 PM
That is the most stupid thing I have ever heard.  Only a complete idiot with absolutely no common sense would just give money to a company with no expected return on investment.  

I think you are confusing people who give money to charitable organizations that do humanitarian work, is Ten Tec a charity?  

By your definition then, $34.8 billion dollars were donated by complete idiots via Crowdfunding in 2015.

Some people don't believe that the charitable organizations pursue benefits that the donor values.  Many donors are in low enough tax brackets (e.g. retired) or have so few deductions that they don't do long form, therefore they realize no tax benefit from a donation, so they needn't donate only to 501c3 organizations.

I've evaluated the books of about 70-80 small to midsized companies in my job as M&O consultant.  Quite a few of them show donations, gifts, bequeathment and so on as part of their startup.  A common story is that someone knows he's not far from death, and really really wants to see a business succeed - might be a friend's business or just a business whose ethics and methods he admires - so he grants some of his wealth to the company in his will.

In my effort to not use too many words, I left out some details that perhaps I shouldn't.  Donors on crowdfunding sites aren't donating without any expectation.  The recipients have stated their case...and the risks.  Donors believe that the recipients will do their best to produce the product...but donors also have signed a contract with the Crowdfunding site that explictly states that "I understand that there are risks, and it is possible that the company involved may not be able to ever produce the perk chosen, and I agree that I accept that outcome if it occurs."

Remember Venture Capitalists?  They expected a return on only 10% of their investments, 90% would die without return.  They expected that the 10% would succeed so wildly as to compensate for the 90% total loss rate.


Your opinion of these people does not change the fact that this activity goes on, and is rapidly growing.

The only choice a company has to make is whether they're willing to go through the effort to tap into this flow of relatively low-expectation money.

- k
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: SOFAR on January 17, 2016, 02:29:33 PM
Kassy, you type a lot of words, but don't say much...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on January 17, 2016, 05:11:37 PM
Kassy, you type a lot of words, but don't say much...

yeah Kassy, how dare you speak with informed competence on this subject when the armchair quarterbacks are trying to strut their stuff!  
you seem to be the kind of person who would call the police if you see a drunk driver on the road ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KI4JPL on January 21, 2016, 06:12:34 AM
In reality, Jack Burchfield and the original shareholders still own TEN-TEC Inc. as a company.
RFC bought the assets and brand name, not the liabilities, and Jack paid off all liabilities and the shareholders on the sale of the land.
RKR bought the assets and brand name from RFC, not the liabilities, I have no clue what RFC did with the liabilities they built up.
Dishtronix brought the assets and brand name from RKR, not the liabilities, I have no clue what RKR did with the liabilities they built up.
All 3 transactions retained the employees that they could, the equipment, the IP, and yes, inherited a lot of good will, ill will, etc. from the previous owner(s). So, in a sense, TEN-TEC never really died because the same people (well, some), are still there. It just changed hands/ownership.

So, Jack and shareholders actually still own TEN-TEC Inc. but, as of the end of this year, TEN-TEC Inc as a corporation will get formally dissolved.
Then, after a wait period after dissolution is final, Dishtronix is going to apply to incorporate and own TEN-TEC Inc.

So, yes, in a way, I do agree with some that the original TEN-TEC Inc is dead, in that it will never be the same as it was under Al and then Jack.
Some employees were let go when RFC took over, some when RKR took over, and so on.
So, the staff is not going to be exactly the same when TEN-TEC gets back into real production.
Some are still there, but most likely some will not come back due to the number of corporation changes over the years.
You have no idea what it means when there is a new boss with totally different views on how things should be run, even day to day business. Changes in what programs to run for order entry, shipping, MRP, parts, etc. etc. etc. argh, I really feel for the guys in service, the people in production and purchasing, their whole world was thrown upside down each time in how things were run and the policies and the computer interfaces for the paperwork part of their jobs, etc. argh, no fun. I was lucky, I still used the same compiler, IDE, test tools, etc.
And some people are not willing to give that change one more shot. Good or bad.
But, there will be others that will come back, there will be new faces.
Hopefully enough skilled join or rejoin to make it a success.

So, yes, TEN-TEC, the original company, is no more, BUT, TEN-TEC, the brand, is getting a defib kickstart.

The commercial business got it's defib kickstart and is running along smooth now, in fact more orders (well, more units total) now than there had been in the last two years. That had been the lifeblood of the original TEN-TEC since the mid 90s or so.

The amateur business is getting ready to get going again, time will tell how well it fares.

I have to admit, it will be tough against the Icom 7300, but, one never knows what products are in development, or have been in development for years at TEN-TEC, Mike seems to be very capable in recognizing what has been done, and how to create something new, and on short order (ok, what is short order? well, for a new big rig, may be a year, for smaller adaptations, well, time will tell). He understands how to improve what is there, notice he did just release a new Orion II firmware update, and others are in the works. He knows how to take some of the existing designs, incorporate them a different way, add in some new state of the art hardware and functions, improve some of the features in them, create whole new looks, etc. and make some kick butt products that will eat away sales at the Icom 7300 and the fantastic E products. All I ask, be patient, give him time, and if you really want to or need to have something before the next TEN-TEC product hits the air, well, then get what you want/need when you want/need it. YOU have to enjoy your hobby with what you want when you want it.
Case in point, I myself, if I had been in the market for an auto tuner, I doubt I would have waited for the 4040 to get finished. But, I know of other hams that are very willing to wait, and in the meantime, work out with what they have. All a matter of preference.
BUT, if the 4040 did make it on the air some day, then I might consider selling what I bought in the meantime to get one. Who knows, only time.

gofundme.com/kickstarter.
Well, those are interesting approaches that are available today.
I know personally of a few companies that went the kickstarter route when they first incorporated, and they are EXTREMELY profitable now. They could not have started without the kickstarter donations. The donations came in the amounts of $10, $20, $100, and a very few amount of $1000 or more. These all came from people who said, "wow, that is a neat idea, I think I'll help", and expect nothing in return. Nothing, nada, zilch. Well, not actually, some of these people will watch that company, and if/when they go public, and it appears that they are viable, THEN they sink more cash into it expecting a return.
Those that do it only do it out of the kindness of their heart and wish the idea behind the company success.
I myself have donated to various kickstart companies, and I do not want anything in return, all I hope for is that their dream becomes a reality, in that the ideas they had, I thought, were slicker'n snot, cool, deserved a chance.
And no, people don't go to gofundme or kickstarter just because they had been turned down by a bank.
That is absolutely NOT the case here with TEN-TEC. Dishtronix has not approached a bank for funding, mainly because funding at a bank brings with it payments, interest, etc.
I would rather get $10,000 in free kickstarter cash than pay the interest on a $100,000 business loan.
Especially when the $10,000 would be enough to float something new, while the $100,000 would float something bigger, it brings with it a requirement to get more mature and profitable as a business quicker.
That ain't gonna be the way with TEN-TEC.
You can't shoot out a new Orion III in 2 mos to start paying for the interest on the loan. Ain't gonna happen.
So, all that would have done is to build in a death sentence for the new TEN-TEC.
The new owner does not want to do that.
ESPECIALLY if it had a chance to kill the business so bad that it jeopardized Dishtronix itself.
But as far as finances at the moment are concerned, gofundme and kickstarter are still just ideas, and nothing that is necessary, at least not if everything that is planned continues on the path and plan that has been laid out.
So far, commercial shipments are more than paying the bills and development of the core company that is there now. And there are more coming in that weren't expected.
He may decide at some point that he wants a cash infusion to fund something specific, but until then, the business model that is there is self sustaining, and starting to turn enough profit to start to look towards what investments need to be made next to make the business model more self sustaining and profitable in the future.
Self-sustaining is something that has not been met in 5 years or so.
So, he is doing something right that the previous had not.

ok 'nuff said,

Y'all enjoy the hobby, go out and get on the air, some of the best ideas I've heard in rig featuring have come from listening to hams on the air, (well, the Orion and Eagle and OMNI-VII beta test teams have had their fair share of "I'd like it to do ...." ideas, simply fantastic). 
It is amusing watching the arm chair quarterbacks throw bombs that are totally, well, I won't go any further...
"If you can't say nothing nice, then don't say nothing at all...."

73, KI4JPL
John Henry


Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI4P on January 21, 2016, 08:41:17 AM
Thanks John Henry for a thorough, lucid explanation of what is and isn't happening.

As a very satisfied user of a full price Eagle, I look forward to seeing Ten-Tec succeed and the introduction of new and improved products.

Please continue your updates.

73, John
WI4P

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on January 22, 2016, 04:35:53 AM
Thanks John for the corporate history. Maybe that will put an end to the blind cheerleaders denial of reality.

Exchanged a few emails with the new owner and he seems confident and dedicated to reviving the Ten-Ten brand. Wish him the best and could even be a customer again when the new radios start rolling out.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on January 22, 2016, 06:22:19 AM

I would rather get $10,000 in free kickstarter cash than pay the interest on a $100,000 business loan.
Especially when the $10,000 would be enough to float something new, while the $100,000 would float something bigger, it brings with it a requirement to get more mature and profitable as a business quicker.


Problem with a small kick start loan 10 grand is peanuts in this bossiness and of very limited value. If you cannot find some serious capital to reboot with you are better off closing doors.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on January 22, 2016, 07:26:35 AM

I would rather get $10,000 in free kickstarter cash than pay the interest on a $100,000 business loan.
Especially when the $10,000 would be enough to float something new, while the $100,000 would float something bigger, it brings with it a requirement to get more mature and profitable as a business quicker.


Problem with a small kick start loan 10 grand is peanuts in this bossiness and of very limited value. If you cannot find some serious capital to reboot with you are better off closing doors.

Problem with that statement is how much is really needed is not quantified. And I think that John meant it as a general statement since TT/Dishtronix is not currently (per John) doing this.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on January 22, 2016, 11:00:43 AM

I would rather get $10,000 in free kickstarter cash than pay the interest on a $100,000 business loan.
Especially when the $10,000 would be enough to float something new, while the $100,000 would float something bigger, it brings with it a requirement to get more mature and profitable as a business quicker.


Problem with a small kick start loan 10 grand is peanuts in this bussiness and of very limited value. If you cannot find some serious capital to reboot with you are better off closing doors.

Problem with that statement is how much is really needed is not quantified. And I think that John meant it as a general statement since TT/Dishtronix is not currently (per John) doing this.

I was just making the general comment that 10 grand is not enough to have any real impact today in this business. (unless you are maybe operating on a shoe string budget like Flex which took deposits for seed money for 6000 series rigs but that too was more than 10 grand total for pre-orders)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KB4MNG on January 24, 2016, 05:49:33 AM
I remember the flex seed money turned out to be a nightmare for flex. Most complaints came from that process. Then there were complaints about the performance when the units were received.

I almost bought a 3000. I read a lot of complaints about interfacing it with a computer and unable to get a  100% performance from the radio.

No thanks!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AB9GO on January 24, 2016, 12:27:25 PM
This post is directed at John Henry KI4JPL,

What will be the availability of repair parts for older Ten-Tec rigs especially mechanical parts such as vfo rebuild kits? Will there be any available or are we on our own? 

Thanks,
Randy AB9GO.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KK5DR on January 24, 2016, 04:35:41 PM
OMG! This thread is the thread that is like the energizer bunny. It just keeps going, and going, and going.....
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD8MJR on January 24, 2016, 06:44:58 PM
And going nowhere!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on January 24, 2016, 08:00:02 PM
This post is directed at John Henry KI4JPL,

What will be the availability of repair parts for older Ten-Tec rigs especially mechanical parts such as vfo rebuild kits? Will there be any available or are we on our own? 

Thanks,
Randy AB9GO.

How long should Ten Tec be expected to supply kits for radios that haven't been made for decades?

There are a few options that are being provided by outside parties:  VFO assemblies can be replaced with modern DDS modules for modest cost.

I am far more concerned about the future viability for factory repair for any of the Orion series radios, or the later Omni VII series.  I suspect Paragons and early Omni radios are slowly falling off the radar.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: MEKONGRF on January 25, 2016, 01:25:29 AM
I have an idea that I think many would support as crowd funding: An open source lab development receiver. Big as an IC 765, basic analog as an Elecraft K2, with real knobs and keypad and a lot of meters and displays on the front. The buses for signal, control and power are in a big motherboard, all units of the rig are on plug in PCBs. All impedances and levels between units must be clearly defined.

Ten Tec already made the tiny Rebel and Patriot. Elecraft has several popular boxes that are so densely stuffed that you fear opening them. What I want is a boat anchor sized open spacy development radio-motherboard.

The basic version should be just a large alu front and a big PCB with an Arduino - and sockets for all imaginable modules. In order to get it to run all you need is a simple FET VFO board, a 602 mixer board, an Xtal filter board, a 1350 IF amp board, a 602 Detector board and a 386 AF board with speaker.

There must be room for a small transmitter in a screened corner. But later on a separate box for transmitter / amplifier / tuner could be next project.

I think a project like this will get a lot of activity on the forums. Also there will probably be many modules developed by amateurs and vendors. Given the fact that a rig like this can be modified in many ways by just modifying/building/swapping plug-in modules will be great fun for many.

May be I am old and longing for post-tube pre-SMD tech for shaky hands and weak eyes. If so, my bet is that in RF/Ham activity I am not the only one.

Just an idea...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on January 25, 2016, 11:44:25 AM
Perhaps John Henry can answer this, but I thought the two SDR packages (Rebel and Patriot) were being made by a Chinese vendor for Ten Tec.  They did carry a few small QRP rigs that were Chinese for a short period.  Hopefully they will continue with the "maker" tradition for the digital experimenters.  There is a good market and resource for those radios, although I doubt it would support a large company as a sole product line. That is the sort of product you can take to a Makers Faire and interest kids who like the digital end of the hobby spectrum.
 
Peter
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on January 25, 2016, 12:36:23 PM
a number of upgradeable-section radio projects have been in QST over the years.  issue with motherboard/daughterboard deals is crosstalk causing birdies.  you can overcome much using stripline techniques, but it's still tighter and quieter for the homebrewer to use coax runs.

I would propose that rather than use some funky display board, which becomes unobtainium in short order, the screen info be sent out an Ethernet port in HTML, and you watch your radio on a plain old browser window.  platform independent, supportable as far as the mind can conceive.  put it at the top of the private C network, say 192.168.234.250, someplace nobody is going to duplicate on any home network.  and party on.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on January 26, 2016, 05:20:47 AM
Perhaps John Henry can answer this, but I thought the two SDR packages (Rebel and Patriot) were being made by a Chinese vendor for Ten Tec.  They did carry a few small QRP rigs that were Chinese for a short period.  Hopefully they will continue with the "maker" tradition for the digital experimenters.  There is a good market and resource for those radios, although I doubt it would support a large company as a sole product line. That is the sort of product you can take to a Makers Faire and interest kids who like the digital end of the hobby spectrum.
 
Peter
The Rebel and the Patriot were both made at Ten Tec in Tennessee. 

Ten Tec did remarket a few of the YouKits QRP rigs for a short time.  When this started, they were very open that these versions of the HB-1A (R4020 and R4030) were built for them to their specs.  (I think there were some issues with the 3 band radio, from Ten Tec's perspective, so they went with the 2 band versions instead.)  You can read about this at http://qrper.com/2010/05/ten-tec-adds-two-new-qrp-transceivers-models-r4020-amd-r4030/

If memory serves, they later simply marketed existing units.

I don't know if this was an experiment, or if sales weren't what they hoped, or if there were other factors involved, but eventually the YouKits line was dropped by Ten Tec and picked up by Vibroplex.   
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on January 26, 2016, 03:11:09 PM
Does anyone have any information on the financial viability of RKR Design?   Are they going to continue producing Amps?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on January 26, 2016, 05:38:46 PM
Does anyone have any information on the financial viability of RKR Design?   Are they going to continue producing Amps?

post 855 of this thread from earlier this month --
Quote
Alpha is not gone.  We're shipping new amps and repairing amps, too.  We answer e-mail and the telephone when we can but working on amps is the priority.  All the spare parts in stock are available, as they have been for years, on the web site.

Glenn AE0Q
RKR Designs LLC
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8NF on January 26, 2016, 06:04:09 PM
Does anyone have any information on the financial viability of RKR Design?   Are they going to continue producing Amps?

I am happy to report that they appear alive and very well.

I am resurrecting an old Alpha 76 and through the weblink, sought availability of what I thought would be an obscure older part.  Glenn AE0Q, replied within a half hour of my inquiry...they had the part, and to make it easy to order, he added it to the website's list of replacement parts for the model 76.  That's what I call speedy - and excellent support of a 30+ year old product.  This occurred just yesterday.


73,

Dave W8NF
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on January 27, 2016, 08:43:07 AM
Does anyone have any information on the financial viability of RKR Design?   Are they going to continue producing Amps?

I am happy to report that they appear alive and very well.

I am resurrecting an old Alpha 76 and through the weblink, sought availability of what I thought would be an obscure older part.  Glenn AE0Q, replied within a half hour of my inquiry...they had the part, and to make it easy to order, he added it to the website's list of replacement parts for the model 76.  That's what I call speedy - and excellent support of a 30+ year old product.  This occurred just yesterday.


73,

Dave W8NF

That's good news.  Am glad to hear they still appear to be doing ok.  Would like to see them begin getting some tubes back in stock & to begin advertising again in QST.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KB4MNG on January 29, 2016, 03:48:47 AM
Awsome news
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AB9GO on February 03, 2016, 05:46:43 AM
This post is directed at John Henry KI4JPL,

What will be the availability of repair parts for older Ten-Tec rigs especially mechanical parts such as vfo rebuild kits? Will there be any available or are we on our own? 

Thanks,
Randy AB9GO.

"How long should Ten Tec be expected to supply kits for radios that haven't been made for decades?"


That is up to the new owner of Ten-Tec.  The VFO rebuild kits were available up until the latest ownership xfer.  It was a legitimate question.  I need one for an Omni series and another for a Triton IV digital.  You could also purchase replacement knobs, screws etc for the older rigs for restoration.  Selling spare parts is not a huge profit center for a business but it is profit and Ten-Tec will need all it can get to get going again. 

"There are a few options that are being provided by outside parties:  VFO assemblies can be replaced with modern DDS modules for modest cost."

I am not interested in modern addions.  I have modern rigs if I seek modern features.  I wish to restore the rig to it's original performance.


"I am far more concerned about the future viability for factory repair for any of the Orion series radios, or the later Omni VII series.  I suspect Paragons and early Omni radios are slowly falling off the radar."

"Pete"

Many electronic components especially DSS, DSP, LCD displays, RF output devices and microcontrollers become unavailable so quickly that a manufacturer after a few years cannot source them at any price.  The Orion series and Omni's and for that matter all currently sold rigs will be unsupportable within 10 years of manufacture.  Your only parts source will be from a carcass or a surplus house (Mendelson's for example).  That was the charm of the older Ten-Tec's was that Ten-Tec custom parts were more or less still available at a more or less reasonable cost.    I do need a shaft for the 744 vfo and an plastic end plate for the Omni D.  I could 3D print the end plate and I could turn another shaft for the VFO on my lathe if the rebuild kits are NLA, but I would perfer to purchase them if possible.  I'll give a call to the new Ten-Tec and see if any are available and report back to the group.   


Randy
[/b]
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N7BMW on February 21, 2016, 12:57:59 PM
Come on guys, only 68 more posts to make 1000.  Don't drop the ball now!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on February 21, 2016, 11:27:03 PM
I'll play.  Here is my favorite (and present) Ten-Tec Transceiver.  Easy to operate, buttons not crowded, and easy on the ears:

(http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/static/media/slider/Ten_Tec_Jupiter-Front.jpg)

Jupiter 538 (Blue Screen)

i am hoping the new owner obtains this great web info on obselete TT xcvrs...

source: http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/support/product-documentation/product-documentation/ten-tec-obsolete-products/ (http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/support/product-documentation/product-documentation/ten-tec-obsolete-products/)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on February 22, 2016, 12:01:10 PM
So, does anyone have information on what's going on with Alpha (RKR)?  Is this company going to remain viable or go under?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on February 22, 2016, 01:28:51 PM
So, does anyone have information on what's going on with Alpha (RKR)?  Is this company going to remain viable or go under?

already answered upthread (and pasted below)

Does anyone have any information on the financial viability of RKR Design?   Are they going to continue producing Amps?

see post 855 of this thread from earlier this month below --

Alpha is not gone.  We're shipping new amps and repairing amps, too.  We answer e-mail and the telephone when we can but working on amps is the priority.  All the spare parts in stock are available, as they have been for years, on the web site.

Glenn AE0Q
RKR Designs LLC

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on February 22, 2016, 01:45:38 PM
I'll play.  Here is my favorite (and present) Ten-Tec Transceiver.  Easy to operate, buttons not crowded, and easy on the ears:

(http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/static/media/slider/Ten_Tec_Jupiter-Front.jpg)

Jupiter 538 (Blue Screen)

i am hoping the new owner obtains this great web info on obselete TT xcvrs...

source: http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/support/product-documentation/product-documentation/ten-tec-obsolete-products/ (http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/support/product-documentation/product-documentation/ten-tec-obsolete-products/)

The Jupiter is a sweet rig.  One of the best they made.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on February 22, 2016, 02:20:24 PM
So, does anyone have information on what's going on with Alpha (RKR)?  Is this company going to remain viable or go under?

already answered upthread (and pasted below)

Does anyone have any information on the financial viability of RKR Design?   Are they going to continue producing Amps?

see post 855 of this thread from earlier this month below --

Alpha is not gone.  We're shipping new amps and repairing amps, too.  We answer e-mail and the telephone when we can but working on amps is the priority.  All the spare parts in stock are available, as they have been for years, on the web site.

Glenn AE0Q
RKR Designs LLC


Appreciate the post.  But the company has stopped advertising in QST mag & it's doubtful they'll even attend Dayton this year.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N2SR on February 23, 2016, 08:56:12 AM
Appreciate the post.  But the company has stopped advertising in QST mag & it's doubtful they'll even attend Dayton this year.

From www.hamvention.org:

Vendor Company                                               Booth Number                         Registration Status   Vendor Name
RKR Designs / Alpha Amplifiers / Ten-Tec, EH0548 EH0549 EH0550 EH0551  Reserved and Unpaid  Jim Wharton

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on February 23, 2016, 09:08:19 AM
Appreciate the post.  But the company has stopped advertising in QST mag & it's doubtful they'll even attend Dayton this year.

From www.hamvention.org:

Vendor Company                                               Booth Number                         Registration Status   Vendor Name
RKR Designs / Alpha Amplifiers / Ten-Tec, EH0548 EH0549 EH0550 EH0551  Reserved and Unpaid  Jim Wharton



I've been to that website.  Notice the information says unpaid.  I was told on the phone yesterday they are undecided in regards to attending Dayton. And as I already posted, they are no longer advertising in QST.  It's just my opinion that this is not a very healthy sign for a company to have.
If anyone else has any information on them I would be interested in hearing it.   
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W4PC on February 23, 2016, 12:59:09 PM
dayton is expensive.. costs us around $4000 to $5000 to do it.   For a company that is restarting, its not a bad sign, it means they want to put the money into the company..

However, john Henry may be in our booth, he is welcome there and he does work for us part time.

Rick - W4PC
HRD
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N2SR on February 24, 2016, 02:31:53 AM
Appreciate the post.  But the company has stopped advertising in QST mag & it's doubtful they'll even attend Dayton this year.

From www.hamvention.org:

Vendor Company                                               Booth Number                         Registration Status   Vendor Name
RKR Designs / Alpha Amplifiers / Ten-Tec, EH0548 EH0549 EH0550 EH0551  Reserved and Unpaid  Jim Wharton



I've been to that website.  Notice the information says unpaid.  I was told on the phone yesterday they are undecided in regards to attending Dayton. And as I already posted, they are no longer advertising in QST.  It's just my opinion that this is not a very healthy sign for a company to have.
If anyone else has any information on them I would be interested in hearing it.   

LOTS of vendors are unpaid.  Most likely because they don't pay until they "have" to.   Even 2 weeks prior there are unpaid vendors.   Think dara wants unused booths?   

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on February 24, 2016, 05:42:32 AM
Reserved and Unpaid  Jim Wharton


Reserved by Jim Wharton?  Is he still with the company at this point?  Last I saw he resigned in 2014.  I suspect they were placing booth orders a few years ahead to get prime locations.  That is old, old news to place a bet on.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9CW on February 24, 2016, 07:09:10 AM
Pete,

Yes, you are correct... Jim Wharton resigned from Ten-Tec (under the RF Concepts banner at the time), and took a management position in a different industry, in 2014.  Rather, this is just another example of DARA not maintaining the database properly for an exhibitor's contact person (e.g. the person who interfaces with DARA to reserve the booth spaces).  For example, I had to call Janet Margelli KL7MF at HRO Anaheim last year, and inform her that DARA was still listing George Varvitsiotes K6SV (HRO VP) as HRO's contact person in the 2015 Hamvention Online Exhibitor list... And, George had been a SK since August 2012!  

A number of companies wait until the last minute to send in their funds for payment of the booth spaces.

73
Don W9CW
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on February 24, 2016, 01:38:24 PM
so then here we are talking about an RKR / Alpha booth at Dayton separate from the new Ten-Tec, roger?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on February 24, 2016, 02:34:10 PM
so then here we are talking about an RKR / Alpha booth at Dayton separate from the new Ten-Tec, roger?

Who's Roger?  ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on February 24, 2016, 04:54:21 PM
My first draft had it as "Roger" -- but i changed it to a lower case 'R' thinking that would pre-empt shenanigans... :)

Roger is the unlucky guy on "I Dream of Jeannie" (the lucky guy is pictured below)

(http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/i-dream-of-jeannie/images/4/45/I_dream_of_jeannie_hagman_eden_tony_%26_jeannie.JPG)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on February 25, 2016, 05:40:02 AM
My first draft had it as "Roger" -- but i changed it to a lower case 'R' thinking that would pre-empt shenanigans... :)

Roger is the unlucky guy on "I Dream of Jeannie" (the lucky guy is pictured below)

(http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/i-dream-of-jeannie/images/4/45/I_dream_of_jeannie_hagman_eden_tony_%26_jeannie.JPG)

Roger that!...shenanigans will never be pre-empted ;)  I didn't know J.R. Ewing knew Jeannie (more shenanigans) ::)

Sorry to hijack the thread. Back to topic....
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on February 25, 2016, 07:13:47 AM
so then here we are talking about an RKR / Alpha booth at Dayton separate from the new Ten-Tec, roger?
Roger is busy with his Ramjet...

Mike N8WFF, the new owner, has indicated (within the last 30 days) in posts on other sites that Ten-Tec will be at Dayton this year.  I do not know if they will have a separate both from Dishtronix or if the two will be exhibiting together.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on February 25, 2016, 07:17:12 AM
Appreciate the post.  But the company has stopped advertising in QST mag & it's doubtful they'll even attend Dayton this year.
Let's put this into perspective.

RKR stopped advertising in QST.  At the time, Ten Tec was still owned by RKR.

Ten Tec is no longer owned by RKR, as of January 1st.

So why aren't they in QST right now?  Because there is a lead time of several months between the time an ad is ordered and the magazine is printed.

I do NOT know when Ten Tec, under Dishtronix (Mike N8WFF) ownership, will resume advertising.  I have a few guesses, but I do not want to post speculation less it be claimed as "fact" by the casual reader.

Like so many other things in bringing the company back to life, I'm sure that this is in the works.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on February 25, 2016, 09:48:13 AM
so then here we are talking about an RKR / Alpha booth at Dayton separate from the new Ten-Tec, roger?
Roger is busy with his Ramjet...

Mike N8WFF, the new owner, has indicated (within the last 30 days) in posts on other sites that Ten-Tec will be at Dayton this year.  I do not know if they will have a separate both from Dishtronix or if the two will be exhibiting together.

so the new Ten-Tec (Dishtronix / Ten-Tec) will be at Dayton as will Alpha (RKR/Alpha).

sure hope Dayton has its act together and does not use the old names for the Booth locations and signs  :o :o :D (RKR/Ten-Tec/Alpha & just Dishtronix)...

probably the best thing for Dayton to do would put the two next to each other so they can just steer people back-and-forth   ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on February 25, 2016, 10:00:06 AM
if you don't have anything to advertise yet, why waste the cash on an ad?  shades of the signal/one separates....
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on February 26, 2016, 12:55:01 PM
I didn't know J.R. Ewing knew Jeannie

to be fair, had he not been seen so much with Jeannie he probably never could have become J.R. ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on March 14, 2016, 01:54:26 PM
Anyone know if Dayton will try to locate RKR/Alpha Amplifiers and Dishtronix/Ten-Tec in the same general area of the convention center to make it easy to redirect would-be visitors to the right place?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KK5DR on March 14, 2016, 06:28:58 PM
You can look it up on the arena map on the Hamvention website.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WA2ONH on March 15, 2016, 08:24:08 AM
Anyone know if Dayton will try to locate RKR/Alpha Amplifiers and Dishtronix/Ten-Tec in the same general area of the convention center to make it easy to redirect would-be visitors to the right place?

Follow the already paid vendors vs still unpaid status but have RESERVED booths at this site...
Hamvention® 2016 Indoor Vendor Booth Assignment Summary
http://pcboard.ca/hamvention2016/indoor_vendors.php

Also gives vendor area/booth assignments.
As of March 14th, NO Dishtronix/Ten-Tec as yet listed. (Coming?)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI4P on March 15, 2016, 01:45:57 PM
East Hall EH0548, 0549, 0550.
Alpha/Dishtronix/Emtron/Ten-Tec. Reserved but unpaid per pcboard site.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WA2ONH on March 15, 2016, 02:38:55 PM
East Hall EH0548, 0549, 0550.
Alpha/Dishtronix/Emtron/Ten-Tec. Reserved but unpaid per pcboard site.

I stand corrected - Time for that eye exam!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI4P on March 15, 2016, 03:17:31 PM
Just had mine.  new bifocals and all.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on March 17, 2016, 01:46:39 PM
East Hall EH0548, 0549, 0550.
Alpha/Dishtronix/Emtron/Ten-Tec. Reserved but unpaid per pcboard site.

I'll be very interested to see if RKR (Alpha) actually pays & attends Dayton this year.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on March 17, 2016, 04:23:10 PM
did all the Ten-Tec parts RKR/Alpha had become property of Dishtronix/Ten-Tec after the sale? 

being a cheap ham (and having a meager budget) i had hoped a 307B speaker or 712 USB Sound Card Digital Mode Adapter Cable would go on sale (hah)  :)

RKR's webiste still shows xcvrs and parts for sale: http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/products/transceivers-receivers/ (http://www.rkrdesignsllc.com/products/transceivers-receivers/)  ???
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on March 18, 2016, 07:40:13 AM
If you click on any of the TenTec products at the RKR website and try to add them to the cart, it gives the message that they are no longer available.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on March 18, 2016, 04:10:46 PM
If you click on any of the TenTec products at the RKR website and try to add them to the cart, it gives the message that they are no longer available.
Which begs the question: Why do they still have TT gear on their website?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on March 18, 2016, 05:19:36 PM
Obviously they have not updated the web site completely.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on March 18, 2016, 08:16:07 PM
I understand that if they are still in business next month they will take care of this.
Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on March 18, 2016, 11:35:42 PM
so, did all Ten-Tec parts and accessories which were owned by RKR/Alpha become the property of Dishtronix once Dishtronix bought Ten-Tec?

if so i guess that means Dishtronix has the parts, rigs, etc but is not selling anything for the time being? 

John Henry -- if you happen to read this -- any updates?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on March 21, 2016, 07:36:30 AM
Dishtronix bought whatever assets remained of the old TenTec. The old/original TenTec was shut down and now out of business. I believe many in the know have already stated that a lot of stuff was sold off to generate cash by previous owners, so unless someone gives details of what they did get in inventory, you can assume that not much was remaining. I am not even sure many radios even remained.

From what I can determine, Dishtronix got the rights to the name, the rented building, the service operation or what was left of it, the radio designs and maybe SOME parts.

Mike, the new owner of the TenTec brand, is trying to basically build a new TenTec almost from scratch. We all wish him the best!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on March 21, 2016, 09:01:59 AM
Dishtronix bought whatever assets remained of the old TenTec. The old/original TenTec was shut down and now out of business. I believe many in the know have already stated that a lot of stuff was sold off to generate cash by previous owners, so unless someone gives details of what they did get in inventory, you can assume that not much was remaining. I am not even sure many radios even remained.

From what I can determine, Dishtronix got the rights to the name, the rented building, the service operation or what was left of it, the radio designs and maybe SOME parts.

Mike, the new owner of the TenTec brand, is trying to basically build a new TenTec almost from scratch. We all wish him the best!

Out of business? When? The corporation was never dissolved that I could find. The trademark was never released that I could find. And it was acquired by Dishtronix from RKR. They may have suspended some operations. But out of business? No documents to support it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on March 21, 2016, 11:19:07 AM
Seriously, did you read John Henry's previous post about the chain of ownership of the corporation, assets and trademarks? If not here is the text in whole:

>>>In reality, Jack Burchfield and the original shareholders still own TEN-TEC Inc. as a company.
RFC bought the assets and brand name, not the liabilities, and Jack paid off all liabilities and the shareholders on the sale of the land.
RKR bought the assets and brand name from RFC, not the liabilities, I have no clue what RFC did with the liabilities they built up.
Dishtronix brought the assets and brand name from RKR, not the liabilities, I have no clue what RKR did with the liabilities they built up.
All 3 transactions retained the employees that they could, the equipment, the IP, and yes, inherited a lot of good will, ill will, etc. from the previous owner(s). So, in a sense, TEN-TEC never really died because the same people (well, some), are still there. It just changed hands/ownership.

So, Jack and shareholders actually still own TEN-TEC Inc. but, as of the end of this year, TEN-TEC Inc as a corporation will get formally dissolved.
Then, after a wait period after dissolution is final, Dishtronix is going to apply to incorporate and own TEN-TEC Inc.

So, yes, in a way, I do agree with some that the original TEN-TEC Inc is dead, in that it will never be the same as it was under Al and then Jack.
Some employees were let go when RFC took over, some when RKR took over, and so on.
So, the staff is not going to be exactly the same when TEN-TEC gets back into real production.
Some are still there, but most likely some will not come back due to the number of corporation changes over the years.
You have no idea what it means when there is a new boss with totally different views on how things should be run, even day to day business. Changes in what programs to run for order entry, shipping, MRP, parts, etc. etc. etc. argh, I really feel for the guys in service, the people in production and purchasing, their whole world was thrown upside down each time in how things were run and the policies and the computer interfaces for the paperwork part of their jobs, etc. argh, no fun. I was lucky, I still used the same compiler, IDE, test tools, etc.
And some people are not willing to give that change one more shot. Good or bad.
But, there will be others that will come back, there will be new faces.
Hopefully enough skilled join or rejoin to make it a success.

So, yes, TEN-TEC, the original company, is no more, BUT, TEN-TEC, the brand, is getting a defib kickstart.

The commercial business got it's defib kickstart and is running along smooth now, in fact more orders (well, more units total) now than there had been in the last two years. That had been the lifeblood of the original TEN-TEC since the mid 90s or so.

The amateur business is getting ready to get going again, time will tell how well it fares.

I have to admit, it will be tough against the Icom 7300, but, one never knows what products are in development, or have been in development for years at TEN-TEC, Mike seems to be very capable in recognizing what has been done, and how to create something new, and on short order (ok, what is short order? well, for a new big rig, may be a year, for smaller adaptations, well, time will tell). He understands how to improve what is there, notice he did just release a new Orion II firmware update, and others are in the works. He knows how to take some of the existing designs, incorporate them a different way, add in some new state of the art hardware and functions, improve some of the features in them, create whole new looks, etc. and make some kick butt products that will eat away sales at the Icom 7300 and the fantastic E products. All I ask, be patient, give him time, and if you really want to or need to have something before the next TEN-TEC product hits the air, well, then get what you want/need when you want/need it. YOU have to enjoy your hobby with what you want when you want it.
Case in point, I myself, if I had been in the market for an auto tuner, I doubt I would have waited for the 4040 to get finished. But, I know of other hams that are very willing to wait, and in the meantime, work out with what they have. All a matter of preference.
BUT, if the 4040 did make it on the air some day, then I might consider selling what I bought in the meantime to get one. Who knows, only time.

gofundme.com/kickstarter.
Well, those are interesting approaches that are available today.
I know personally of a few companies that went the kickstarter route when they first incorporated, and they are EXTREMELY profitable now. They could not have started without the kickstarter donations. The donations came in the amounts of $10, $20, $100, and a very few amount of $1000 or more. These all came from people who said, "wow, that is a neat idea, I think I'll help", and expect nothing in return. Nothing, nada, zilch. Well, not actually, some of these people will watch that company, and if/when they go public, and it appears that they are viable, THEN they sink more cash into it expecting a return.
Those that do it only do it out of the kindness of their heart and wish the idea behind the company success.
I myself have donated to various kickstart companies, and I do not want anything in return, all I hope for is that their dream becomes a reality, in that the ideas they had, I thought, were slicker'n snot, cool, deserved a chance.
And no, people don't go to gofundme or kickstarter just because they had been turned down by a bank.
That is absolutely NOT the case here with TEN-TEC. Dishtronix has not approached a bank for funding, mainly because funding at a bank brings with it payments, interest, etc.
I would rather get $10,000 in free kickstarter cash than pay the interest on a $100,000 business loan.
Especially when the $10,000 would be enough to float something new, while the $100,000 would float something bigger, it brings with it a requirement to get more mature and profitable as a business quicker.
That ain't gonna be the way with TEN-TEC.
You can't shoot out a new Orion III in 2 mos to start paying for the interest on the loan. Ain't gonna happen.
So, all that would have done is to build in a death sentence for the new TEN-TEC.
The new owner does not want to do that.
ESPECIALLY if it had a chance to kill the business so bad that it jeopardized Dishtronix itself.
But as far as finances at the moment are concerned, gofundme and kickstarter are still just ideas, and nothing that is necessary, at least not if everything that is planned continues on the path and plan that has been laid out.
So far, commercial shipments are more than paying the bills and development of the core company that is there now. And there are more coming in that weren't expected.
He may decide at some point that he wants a cash infusion to fund something specific, but until then, the business model that is there is self sustaining, and starting to turn enough profit to start to look towards what investments need to be made next to make the business model more self sustaining and profitable in the future.
Self-sustaining is something that has not been met in 5 years or so.
So, he is doing something right that the previous had not.

ok 'nuff said,

Y'all enjoy the hobby, go out and get on the air, some of the best ideas I've heard in rig featuring have come from listening to hams on the air, (well, the Orion and Eagle and OMNI-VII beta test teams have had their fair share of "I'd like it to do ...." ideas, simply fantastic).
It is amusing watching the arm chair quarterbacks throw bombs that are totally, well, I won't go any further...
"If you can't say nothing nice, then don't say nothing at all...."

73, KI4JPL
John Henry<<<

So the original Ten-Tec may still exist as a paper corporation, but it is for all intents and purposes, not in business and will be shut down by the end of the year.

I know it is hard for some of you cheerleaders to deny the truth, but the truth is the original Ten-Tec is GONE as a viable business. It is a business on paper only. Now someone is trying to build a new Ten-Tec from the assets of the old. It is really that simple and not a difficult concept to understand. READ - Jack still owns Ten-Tec as a company but it will be shut down. So what Jack owns is the original Ten-Tec. What was formed after the assets were bought and sold (a number of times now) is not the original Ten-Tec.

If you still cannot understand the concepts of how businesses come and go, sales of assets and liabilities, trademarks, etc. please go consult an attorney friend who is competent in business law to explain it to you. When you are only selling a corporation's assets, you are NOT selling the corporation. How many times does this have to be explained?

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on March 21, 2016, 11:53:46 AM
If you still cannot understand the concepts of how businesses come and go, sales of assets and liabilities, trademarks, etc. please go consult an attorney friend who is competent in business law to explain it to you. When you are only selling a corporation's assets, you are NOT selling the corporation. How many times does this have to be explained?

So lots of wheeling and dealing, debts being paid, corporation bylaws being enforced, and things changing hands etc. Don't need a lawyer to see that. But I do not see an answer as to WHEN they went out of business and then later went back into business. That's why I asked the question cause I find no documentation that says they "went out of business" as you say. If you don't know the date it stopped doing business, maybe you are using the wrong phrase to describe what happened. Maybe you need to see the lawyer friend to examine your phrase and its meaning. Seems like that phrase is more the last emotional gasp of those on the funeral committee who really needed a death to be right, rather then fact.

Also I never at any time said things are/were going to be the same. Businesses change all the time. Methodology changes all the time. Ownership changes all the time. Any 1 of these signals a change in the business, but does not mean they went out of business and went back in business.  As usual your emotional response brings up things I didn't say and try to attribute them to me. Now if your speaking of others, then you should make sure it is separated from commentary actually directed to me.

But thank you for reposting old news. Maybe some people didn't see it.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on March 21, 2016, 12:47:16 PM
Seems like that phrase is more the last emotional gasp of those on the funeral committee who really needed a death to be right, rather then fact.

sure but look on the bright side: only 30 more posts till this thread hits 1000.  and, not only did the new owner not have to dig a corpse out of the ground -- the body never stopped breathing and never was sent from Rehab to a morgue.  if and when this phoenix rises from the proverbial funeral committee ashes, it is going to be a bright day for Ten-Tec believers.  but it wont be a resurrection, just a make-over  ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on March 21, 2016, 04:49:05 PM
So lots of wheeling and dealing, debts being paid, corporation bylaws being enforced, and things changing hands etc. Don't need a lawyer to see that. But I do not see an answer as to WHEN they went out of business and then later went back into business. That's why I asked the question cause I find no documentation that says they "went out of business" as you say. If you don't know the date it stopped doing business, maybe you are using the wrong phrase to describe what happened. Maybe you need to see the lawyer friend to examine your phrase and its meaning. Seems like that phrase is more the last emotional gasp of those on the funeral committee who really needed a death to be right, rather then fact.

Also I never at any time said things are/were going to be the same. Businesses change all the time. Methodology changes all the time. Ownership changes all the time. Any 1 of these signals a change in the business, but does not mean they went out of business and went back in business.  As usual your emotional response brings up things I didn't say and try to attribute them to me. Now if your speaking of others, then you should make sure it is separated from commentary actually directed to me.

But thank you for reposting old news. Maybe some people didn't see it.
To answer your question...

No one publicly appears to know the date that the powers that be at RKR decided to convert the Ten Tec business that they bought from RFConcepts from a viable business to a liquidation candidate.

To be more precise, I'm sure SOMEONE does know the date, but said date has never been publicly stated.

It is obvious now that the last big sale was the start of a liquidation of inventory.  Well, part of the start.  And had the owner of Dishtronix not stepped up and bought what assets that remained at the beginning of the year, it is highly probably that the Ten-Tec business would have continued to slowly erode and evaporate, and eventually disappear completely.

You see speculation because those speculating don't know the specifics.  Yes, many of us didn't want to believe what we were seeing.  Some refused to believe it; others of us were becoming frustrated because we didn't know WHY it was happening or what, if anything, could be done to stop & reverse it.

So the Ten-Tec business operation did at some point last year cease, and RKR did at some point start liquidating the remaining assets.  We just don't know precisely when that decision was made.

As the earlier posts have indicated, the original Ten-Tec corporation still exists on paper and will be dissolved, from all indications, sometime in the near future.  I would presume that it has lasted this long (since the sale of the business to RFConcepts) to wrap up remaining liabilities and debts, and to satisfy other legal requirements. 

I hope that pretty much explains, at least what I think, happened.  I could be wrong, and I'm sure I'm wrong on some of the details.

The Funeral Committee seems to have taken much delight in watching the Ten Tec business fall.  And it appears that a good many members of that group don't want to see it get back up. 

Those of us who think highly of the equipment and of the people who worked for the company (at least prior to the RFC sale) are, naturally, not too thrilled about this (the reaction from the Funeral Committee, that is).  I think it's safe to say that a good many of us are rooting for Mike to bring the business back from the dead, even if it's not in the form that we all remember (as that form of the company is gone, never to return)

Is that an adequate answer?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on March 21, 2016, 06:13:26 PM
To answer your question...

No one publicly appears to know the date that the powers that be at RKR decided to convert the Ten Tec business that they bought from RFConcepts from a viable business to a liquidation candidate.

To be more precise, I'm sure SOMEONE does know the date, but said date has never been publicly stated.

It is obvious now that the last big sale was the start of a liquidation of inventory.  Well, part of the start.  And had the owner of Dishtronix not stepped up and bought what assets that remained at the beginning of the year, it is highly probably that the Ten-Tec business would have continued to slowly erode and evaporate, and eventually disappear completely.

You see speculation because those speculating don't know the specifics.  Yes, many of us didn't want to believe what we were seeing.  Some refused to believe it; others of us were becoming frustrated because we didn't know WHY it was happening or what, if anything, could be done to stop & reverse it.

So the Ten-Tec business operation did at some point last year cease, and RKR did at some point start liquidating the remaining assets.  We just don't know precisely when that decision was made.

As the earlier posts have indicated, the original Ten-Tec corporation still exists on paper and will be dissolved, from all indications, sometime in the near future.  I would presume that it has lasted this long (since the sale of the business to RFConcepts) to wrap up remaining liabilities and debts, and to satisfy other legal requirements. 

I hope that pretty much explains, at least what I think, happened.  I could be wrong, and I'm sure I'm wrong on some of the details.

The Funeral Committee seems to have taken much delight in watching the Ten Tec business fall.  And it appears that a good many members of that group don't want to see it get back up. 

Those of us who think highly of the equipment and of the people who worked for the company (at least prior to the RFC sale) are, naturally, not too thrilled about this (the reaction from the Funeral Committee, that is).  I think it's safe to say that a good many of us are rooting for Mike to bring the business back from the dead, even if it's not in the form that we all remember (as that form of the company is gone, never to return)

Is that an adequate answer?

So a business is out of business even though they are still selling product as a business? But then didn't completely sell out everything until it sold the TT brand to someone else? Who in turn produced some commercial stuff and sold it? They are still out of business? So when in the process of a liquidation sale is a business out of business? Isn't it when everything is gone and the building is closed permanently and nothing more is bought or sold in any form? And isn't acquiring a business that is still in business mean it never really went out of business?

Maybe a date is not known because it does not exist?

I wish Mike well and many happy years. And also for TT. It has hit a very low spot but a slow controlled rebound is what it will take to become anything like the past. But on the other hand it needs to exceed the past and become stronger then ever under new and enthused management. It takes time and lots of painstaking effort to accomplish that.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KB4MNG on March 22, 2016, 02:32:26 AM
"Slow rebound", I'm  not sure we are ever going to see a reboot.... >:(
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KK5DR on March 22, 2016, 03:21:58 AM
I'm sure TT was sold at a "Fire sale" price, however, a restart eats up huge amounts of cash, I'm just not sure the new owner has that much in the tank to pull it off.
The present business environment is competitive to say the least, hostile to "new comers" that don't have a totally unique product line. The only thing "established" about TT right now, is the name recognition, they have no new products, will likely be eliminating most if not all of the old products when and if they do reboot.
Good luck, but don't be surprised if it doesn't happen, or resembles the Heathkit effort of late.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on March 22, 2016, 05:28:15 AM
So a business is out of business even though they are still selling product as a business? But then didn't completely sell out everything until it sold the TT brand to someone else? Who in turn produced some commercial stuff and sold it? They are still out of business? So when in the process of a liquidation sale is a business out of business? Isn't it when everything is gone and the building is closed permanently and nothing more is bought or sold in any form? And isn't acquiring a business that is still in business mean it never really went out of business?

Maybe a date is not known because it does not exist?

I wish Mike well and many happy years. And also for TT. It has hit a very low spot but a slow controlled rebound is what it will take to become anything like the past. But on the other hand it needs to exceed the past and become stronger then ever under new and enthused management. It takes time and lots of painstaking effort to accomplish that.
I see.

I now regret answering you.   But that's OK. 

Mr. Debakey's free, but he's a little bit conciliatory.  Try Mr. Barnard, Room 12.  No, I'm sorry, Room 12A, just along the corridor.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: V47JA on March 22, 2016, 08:19:23 AM
So a business is out of business even though they are still selling product as a business? But then didn't completely sell out everything until it sold the TT brand to someone else? Who in turn produced some commercial stuff and sold it? They are still out of business? So when in the process of a liquidation sale is a business out of business? Isn't it when everything is gone and the building is closed permanently and nothing more is bought or sold in any form? And isn't acquiring a business that is still in business mean it never really went out of business?

Maybe a date is not known because it does not exist?

I wish Mike well and many happy years. And also for TT. It has hit a very low spot but a slow controlled rebound is what it will take to become anything like the past. But on the other hand it needs to exceed the past and become stronger then ever under new and enthused management. It takes time and lots of painstaking effort to accomplish that.
I see.

I now regret answering you.   But that's OK. 

Mr. Debakey's free, but he's a little bit conciliatory.  Try Mr. Barnard, Room 12.  No, I'm sorry, Room 12A, just along the corridor.


Hi,

Someday "dawn" may break in Marblehead......

73,

John
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N3QE on March 22, 2016, 09:38:34 AM
It is obvious now that the last big sale was the start of a liquidation of inventory.

One aspect that is far from obvious: the big Eagle sale was supposedly being done at a loss (according to John Henry and others), but if so why did they restart the production line and even come out with new firmware during the sale event, and then even extend the sale event requiring further additional production runs?

I'm happy that I bought a second Eagle during the big sale, and I strongly believe it's a better radio than others that sell for twice the price. Many top 5 box scores in big-boy contest categories back up my satisfaction with the Eagle :-)

But I obviously do not understand radio company finances.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on March 23, 2016, 11:08:00 AM
It is obvious now that the last big sale was the start of a liquidation of inventory.

One aspect that is far from obvious: the big Eagle sale was supposedly being done at a loss (according to John Henry and others), but if so why did they restart the production line and even come out with new firmware during the sale event, and then even extend the sale event requiring further additional production runs?

I'm happy that I bought a second Eagle during the big sale, and I strongly believe it's a better radio than others that sell for twice the price. Many top 5 box scores in big-boy contest categories back up my satisfaction with the Eagle :-)

But I obviously do not understand radio company finances.
Are you thinking of the big "summer sale" in 2014?  That was shortly after RFConcepts took over, and that was not just the Eagle but the Omni VII and other rigs as well.

The "last big sale" I was referring to was in 2015, after RKR took over.  I think that's the one John was referring to as well, and that was what was more of an inventory liquidation sale.  There were more than a few hams whose orders were either put on back-order pending a new production run that never happened, or were told point blank that TT was out of stock.

While the Eagle had some issues, especially when it came to working split, I really liked the rig a lot.  Had I not already had an Omni VII, and no room for another rig (let alone the shekels to buy one, especially not with a daughter about to embark on college!), I would have gladly snapped one up during one of those two sales.   
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WD8DKB on March 24, 2016, 10:11:28 AM
Someone just entered a review regarding a recent repair by TT on his Eagle. I found it to be a promising note.  ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on March 24, 2016, 05:21:07 PM
Someone just entered a review regarding a recent repair by TT on his Eagle. I found it to be a promising note.  ;)

took me a while to find it, but yes -- that is a pretty good sign re: how Ten-Tec is doing since the Dishtronix acquisition!  thanks for the head's up:

http://www.eham.net/reviews/detail/2280 (http://www.eham.net/reviews/detail/2280)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on March 24, 2016, 08:02:47 PM
Funny how the funeral committee sits quietly when good news is posted.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on March 24, 2016, 10:26:06 PM
I figure it is going to take some time to get this company back together.  They were run into the ground, and Mike has a huge task.  Apparently the front panel mold for the OMNI VII was lost, and thus they are coming out with new metal front panel for the next production run. It also seems that getting the repair facility in Tennessee back up to speed is one of their first priorities.  I'd rather see support for Orions and other newer products before they introduce gear they can't repair.

JH posted that he was being buried with emails and that he couldn't handle the volume.  I'd give Ten Tec four or five months before worrying about what is happening.  It ain't going to be overnight.  I figure they will have a much leaner product line when the dust settles.  I'm looking forward to seeing an Orion III or Omni VI++.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on March 25, 2016, 08:54:30 AM
I figure it is going to take some time to get this company back together.  They were run into the ground, and Mike has a huge task.  Apparently the front panel mold for the OMNI VII was lost, and thus they are coming out with new metal front panel for the next production run. It also seems that getting the repair facility in Tennessee back up to speed is one of their first priorities.  I'd rather see support for Orions and other newer products before they introduce gear they can't repair.

JH posted that he was being buried with emails and that he couldn't handle the volume.  I'd give Ten Tec four or five months before worrying about what is happening.  It ain't going to be overnight.  I figure they will have a much leaner product line when the dust settles.  I'm looking forward to seeing an Orion III or Omni VI++.

Pete

I inquired via email to Ten-Tec regarding whether there are any 307B (speakers) or 712 USB Sound Card Digital Mode Adapters in stock and received a reply that they are not and that they do not know yet when they will be back in stock.  It sounds like they are focusing on meat & potatoes stuff right now and it seems to me that is a good sign.    An Omni VII + or VIII sounds good, though i am going to keep hoping for a Jupiter II :)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on March 25, 2016, 12:23:34 PM
I figure it is going to take some time to get this company back together.  They were run into the ground, and Mike has a huge task. 

Pete

The reality is the old Ten-Tec is gone. This is an entirely new Ten-Tec. It is not just getting Ten-Tec back together, it is about starting a new Ten-Tec.

What Distronix is doing is taking the assets from the old Ten-Tec, and trying to start a new Ten-Tec from those assets. The old Ten-Tec as a legal entity still exist and as John Henry previously pointed out, it will be shut down later this year.

Distronix bought the assets from the RKR, which bought assets from RF Concepts which bought assets from Ten-Tec. Included in those assets is the name and trademarks, assume patents, etc. The reality is that Ten-Tec legally has existed in several forms. The Dishtronix reincarnation is the latest venture under the Ten-Tec brand.

We wish Dishtronix the best with this new venture and hope that they can bring back the quality and service of the old Ten-Tec.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on March 25, 2016, 04:05:58 PM
The reality is the old Ten-Tec is gone. This is an entirely new Ten-Tec. It is not just getting Ten-Tec back together, it is about starting a new Ten-Tec.

isn't it ironic when the funeral committee reads everything as confirmation of their premature prognostications?  :) 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on March 25, 2016, 07:51:03 PM

What Distronix is doing is taking the assets from the old Ten-Tec, and trying to start a new Ten-Tec from those assets. The old Ten-Tec as a legal entity still exist and as John Henry previously pointed out, it will be shut down later this year.

I find this really amusing too. TT supposedly died. Yet the assets were sold from the old TT corporation that still exists, as by the statement above, to a new owner along with the brand name and has operations ongoing. That's why I asked the question, "when did it die?". Seems like the statement above shows it never did die. Looks to me like it has and still is going through a transition phase, not death and rebirth since both now exist simultaneously.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on March 26, 2016, 10:53:03 AM

What Distronix is doing is taking the assets from the old Ten-Tec, and trying to start a new Ten-Tec from those assets. The old Ten-Tec as a legal entity still exist and as John Henry previously pointed out, it will be shut down later this year.

I find this really amusing too. TT supposedly died. Yet the assets were sold from the old TT corporation that still exists, as by the statement above, to a new owner along with the brand name and has operations ongoing. That's why I asked the question, "when did it die?". Seems like the statement above shows it never did die. Looks to me like it has and still is going through a transition phase, not death and rebirth since both now exist simultaneously.

Until I see Ten Tec producing amateur radio equipment they are dead.  Just because they repaired some guys rig doesn't mean anything, there are a whole bunch of independent service companies that do the same thing.  So all of this Pollyanna rose colored glasses stuff means very little.  

American companies (with lots of resources) who made ham radio equipment realized that there was not enough profit in it for serious business investment, they tried to make it work but they just couldn't.  Hallicrafters couldn't do it, Swan couldn't do it, Cubic couldn't do it, Drake couldn't do it, Hammarlund couldn't do it, National couldn't do it, Globe couldn't do it, Textron couldn't do it, Collins couldn't do it, and Heathkit couldn't do it (even though they are pretending now).  

There are a couple of small niche companies like Elecraft and Flex who operate on a thin margin but even they know their existence is precarious in todays market and competition from the big three is as tough as ever.  

So when I see Ten Tec advertising new radios in QST or online then I will relinquish my skepticism.  Until then they are still just a name as far as I'm concerned.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on March 26, 2016, 11:41:39 AM
They are a subsidiary of Dishtronix, Inc.  The new owner has spelled out his intentions. Again, the funeral committee is actively shoveling dirt into a yet undug grave. Most of the Ten Tec fans are hoping for a comeback, while the haters are proclaiming Ten Tec is dead and gone.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on March 26, 2016, 11:47:31 AM
Until I see Ten Tec producing amateur radio equipment they are dead.  Just because they repaired some guys rig doesn't mean anything, there are a whole bunch of independent service companies that do the same thing.  So all of this Pollyanna rose colored glasses stuff means very little.  

Tell that to Mike and all of his employees. I highly doubt it means nothing or very little to them.

As far as glasses, take off your black funeral glasses so you can see. At least you can see through rose colored.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KC0W on March 26, 2016, 01:18:41 PM
Lot's of individuals are sure getting so worked up over this thread. How many of you would actually purchase a brand new Ten-Tec radio if they were made available tomorrow? I bet less than 5%.

 The usual reasons would be stated for not purchasing one. "I have enough radios"........"Money is tight right now"........."My present radio works just fine".........."I don't wanna be a beta tester for a brand new product"...........Blah, blah, blah.

Pontificators & old washer women seem to be the vast majority of comments here.  :)


Tom KCØW         
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KD0REQ on March 26, 2016, 05:23:17 PM
most of the companies DPO mentioned thought they could make a killing in the CB craze, ramping up and up... and then the crash took them all out across 1977/78.

Ten-Tec was not head to head, box to box, with the Japanese Three across all markets, either.  they were also niche manufacturers.

we'll see what happens in the rebuilding here.  I'm on the fence.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on March 26, 2016, 06:29:17 PM
Again, the funeral committee is actively shoveling dirt into a yet undug grave. Most of the Ten Tec fans are hoping for a comeback, while the haters are proclaiming Ten Tec is dead and gone.

QSL -- i guess noone ever taught them that when you throw dirt: you lose ground  ;)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: DL8OV on March 27, 2016, 06:37:54 AM
"How many of you would actually purchase a brand new Ten-Tec radio if they were made available tomorrow?"

I own a Ten-Tec Corsair II and, bearing in mind its age, it's a hell of a rig. If Ten-Tec were to come out with a modern replacement for the Corsair then I would seriously consider it but the last rigs they produced were butt ugly. The Eagle is a prime example where they fit a low contrast blue display with the digits sloping backwards, what where they thinking of when they did that?

Give me a decent sized rig with an OLED display, widely spaced controls and some of the modern items such as DDS signal sources and a 48v PA stage and I will beat a path to their door.

Peter DL8OV
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9VO on March 27, 2016, 06:53:20 AM
All I know is I bought a Eagle at a good price to help them out. Now I'm stuck with a rig with NO warranty. Might not need it and probably won't but it does leave ya with a hollow feeling!!!!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on March 28, 2016, 08:55:51 AM
That is a good point.  If a rig was sold by RKR with a warranty, I would expect RKR to honor the warranty for as long as they are business???

On the other hand, the new Ten Tec owner is losing a bit of karma but not stepping up to the plate...

but on the other hand the TT warranties were good for one year; so a good question is how much time has elapsed since the last Ten Tec radio rolled out the door under RKR's failed leadership?  If their are a few months' time remaining, then someone should be there to support the hopefully very few warranty issues that have or may arise.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on March 28, 2016, 11:38:11 AM
Lot's of individuals are sure getting so worked up over this thread. How many of you would actually purchase a brand new Ten-Tec radio if they were made available tomorrow? I bet less than 5%.

 The usual reasons would be stated for not purchasing one. "I have enough radios"........"Money is tight right now"........."My present radio works just fine".........."I don't wanna be a beta tester for a brand new product"...........Blah, blah, blah.

Pontificators & old washer women seem to be the vast majority of comments here.  :)

Tom KCØW         
Fair enough, Tom.

At the moment, I don't need another radio, regardless of brand.  But I do need an accessory for my Omni VII -- an item that was originally an option, and later became a de-facto included item, namely, the internal auto-tuner.

Prior to the announcement of Dishtronix buying Ten Tec, a question was asked, on behalf of the then-unnamed new owners, whether or not people on the list would be interested in purchasing an Omni VII.  I replied at the time, and committed to, buying the AT, if it will be available as an option again.

I also indicated that I had, and still have, an interest in the Rebel (Open Source QRP rig), and if the price on the new Rebel is still reasonable, I plan to get one.  I can't and won't commit further until i see what happens with it, since the original processor is no longer available & some engineering changes will be required to fit the replacement processor into it.

Now,  should an updated Eagle be made available, I would consider it.  And depending on what happens with the proposed Orion III or equivalent, in terms of features, options, and costs, I am definitely interested. 

But I also have to balance this with a daughter in college, and when there aren't enough shekels to cover her costs and my radio room needs, well, the radios lose.

But as the current owner of an Omni VII, Omni VI+, Corsair II, 2591 HT, and PM2B, along with assundry accessory items, I think I can safely say that even if I can't purchase a new rig for a few months or years yet, I'm in pretty good shape.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on March 29, 2016, 02:05:27 AM
Lot's of individuals are sure getting so worked up over this thread. How many of you would actually purchase a brand new Ten-Tec radio if they were made available tomorrow? I bet less than 5%.

 The usual reasons would be stated for not purchasing one. "I have enough radios"........"Money is tight right now"........."My present radio works just fine".........."I don't wanna be a beta tester for a brand new product"...........Blah, blah, blah.

Pontificators & old washer women seem to be the vast majority of comments here.  :)

Tom KCØW         

so, this thread has garnered 1000 posts in less than a year and 140,000 views.  you are free to denigrate the vast majority of comments here if that is your inclination, but i think what it really shows is that many hams have a warm spot in their hearts for Ten-Tec and would love to see the new owner succeed.  yes, a portion of the crowd here are probably those who like doom & gloom or want to see Ten-Tec fail because they buy & operate rigs made by other manufacturers -- but if Dishtronix can revitalize Ten-Tec to anything close to the kind of company it was ten years ago -- don't you worry -- they will find plenty of customers.

I don't plan to buy a rig for a few years at least, but Ten-Tec will be the first place I'll look when that times comes if they are still alive & kicking. 


Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W0BKR on March 29, 2016, 04:13:55 AM
Once Ten Tec (or under whatever name) advertises a product and once product has been out there a bit to insure no quality issues/performance issues, then I will look at the offering(s).  Until then, just a thread of much ado about nothing.

Nothing advertised, nothing available no sales possible at this point.  Wake me up when there is something tangible.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on March 29, 2016, 01:26:51 PM
I have bought a number of good products from TT in the past.  But for now  I will continue to buy Elecraft products and check back with TT in about a year to see what is new.  By then they should be doing well or be gone.
Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on March 29, 2016, 01:34:37 PM
I have bought a number of good products from TT in the past.  But for now  I will continue to buy Elecraft products and check back with TT in about a year to see what is new.  By then they should be doing well or be gone.
Art

Dayton should be interesting, both in terms of news from Ten-Tec's old owners (RKR / Alpha Amps) and the new owner of Ten-Tec (Dishtronix).

I hope both Alpha and Ten-Tec are alive & kicking at least as long as me  :) 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on March 29, 2016, 01:42:32 PM
I have bought a number of good products from TT in the past.  But for now  I will continue to buy Elecraft products and check back with TT in about a year to see what is new.  By then they should be doing well or be gone.
Art

Dayton should be interesting, both in terms of news from Ten-Tec's old owners (RKR / Alpha Amps) and the new owner of Ten-Tec (Dishtronix).

I hope both Alpha and Ten-Tec are alive & kicking at least as long as me  :) 

It should be interesting to see if either survive over the next year.  RKR still has not purchased a spot for Dayton.  Nor have they advertised in QST mag for many many months.  And they have not revised their website & deleted Ten Tec products.  Non of these are good signs for their future.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KASSY on March 30, 2016, 12:23:19 PM

One aspect that is far from obvious: the big Eagle sale was supposedly being done at a loss (according to John Henry and others), but if so why did they restart the production line and even come out with new firmware during the sale event, and then even extend the sale event requiring further additional production runs?

I'm happy that I bought a second Eagle during the big sale, and I strongly believe it's a better radio than others that sell for twice the price. Many top 5 box scores in big-boy contest categories back up my satisfaction with the Eagle :-)

But I obviously do not understand radio company finances.

It is better to recover some costs than none, even if at the end of it, you're negative.


Hypothetical example:
Ham radio manufacturer SDR R US decides to build a standalone SDR-based transceiver.  They estimate cost of manufacturing (parts, labor, customer support, inventory management, warranty) at $1000 per unit, and they expect the market will eagerly pay $1800 per unit.

But development takes 18 months longer than they expected, and during that time, other companies introduce radios that have more compelling performance, size and feature sets, retailing for $1300.  Worse, because they scoped the project wrong, it will cost SDR R US $1200, not $1000, to build each unit.  And, anticipating high sales, they already put in stock for 5,000 radios.  At least, for 80% of the parts.  So, they've already put in $960 per radio, or $4.8 million, into parts inventory.

They perform a head-to-head market focus group and find out that customers would consider $850 per radio to be a reasonable price, if they want to move 5,000 units.  Should they buy more inventory and build?

Scenario A: Take the $4.8 million loss and don't build anything.
Net: Lose $4.8 million

Scenario B: Spend another $1.2 million (total cost now $6 million) to get the remaining parts inventory and sell the radios, grossing $4.25 million.
Net: Lose $1.75 million.

They lose money either way, just less if they proceed to build and sell.

- k
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on March 30, 2016, 02:47:04 PM
it was my understanding Ten-Tec sold many radios to the US govt. 
Does anyone know how long ago that started and also: did that stop with the RF Concepts (2014) or RKR (2015) purchase of TT?  (i believe those dates are right)

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N3QE on March 31, 2016, 11:58:04 AM
it was my understanding Ten-Tec sold many radios to the US govt.  
Does anyone know how long ago that started and also: did that stop with the RF Concepts (2014) or RKR (2015) purchase of TT?  (i believe those dates are right)

Rise of Ten-Tec in govt HF receiver sales coincides with decline of Watkins-Johnson sales.

This era began in earnest with the Ten-Tec RX-330 around 1995.

RKR Designs website still lists prices for RX-331 and RX-340 but I have the distinct impression these are not "new govt contracts" but rather stragglers.

I have a WJ-8716 and have used the TT RX-340. They are nice radios for SWL or utility reception, but aren't as nice as a real "ham" receiver for ham usage.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WD9Q on April 01, 2016, 11:06:42 AM
I am really becoming worried about the Alpha Amplifier end of this whole situation.

I have an 8410 which I purchased around 2 years ago and just sent it in for warranty repair after it quit producing power out on 12M and 15M band.  When I called to get the RA number I was told it should be no more than two weeks turnaround time for the repair to be completed.  That was February 16.

After two weeks I tried calling back to find out what was going on but no one would ever answer the phone.  I finally left a message and got an email from Pam saying that it would be 10-12 more days before they got to my amplifier.  So it has now been 2 weeks since the 10-12 days was up.

I called on Monday March 28 and somebody, Pam, did answer and all she could tell me was that my amplifier was in assembly and that meant it was being worked on.

From what I understood this should not be that big of a deal.  But, now I have heard nothing further.  I was expecting to hear that it was ready to ship on Wednesday but not a peep from Colorado.  So I tried calling again yesterday and got no answer.  So I sent an email back yesterday to Pam which also had Glenn and Brad Focken copied on it asking for an update on when and if my amplifier would be repaired.  I got an automatic reply from Pam saying she is out of the office and would be back Monday but I have got no reply from anybody else.

Does anybody else have any other experiences like this recently with Alpha Amplifiers?  I am very disappointed and discouraged.  When I made the original call I asked about the turnaround time so I would hopefully have my 8410 back in time for VK0 and FT4.

They have now had my Alpha for 6 weeks and I have been without it 7 and greatly missing it with VK0 and FT4 going on.

Mat Hardman, WD9Q
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on April 01, 2016, 02:31:58 PM
I am really becoming worried about the Alpha Amplifier end of this whole situation.

I have an 8410 which I purchased around 2 years ago and just sent it in for warranty repair after it quit producing power out on 12M and 15M band.  When I called to get the RA number I was told it should be no more than two weeks turnaround time for the repair to be completed.  That was February 16.

After two weeks I tried calling back to find out what was going on but no one would ever answer the phone.  I finally left a message and got an email from Pam saying that it would be 10-12 more days before they got to my amplifier.  So it has now been 2 weeks since the 10-12 days was up.

I called on Monday March 28 and somebody, Pam, did answer and all she could tell me was that my amplifier was in assembly and that meant it was being worked on.

From what I understood this should not be that big of a deal.  But, now I have heard nothing further.  I was expecting to hear that it was ready to ship on Wednesday but not a peep from Colorado.  So I tried calling again yesterday and got no answer.  So I sent an email back yesterday to Pam which also had Glenn and Brad Focken copied on it asking for an update on when and if my amplifier would be repaired.  I got an automatic reply from Pam saying she is out of the office and would be back Monday but I have got no reply from anybody else.

Does anybody else have any other experiences like this recently with Alpha Amplifiers?  I am very disappointed and discouraged.  When I made the original call I asked about the turnaround time so I would hopefully have my 8410 back in time for VK0 and FT4.

They have now had my Alpha for 6 weeks and I have been without it 7 and greatly missing it with VK0 and FT4 going on.

Mat Hardman, WD9Q

Mat,
I don't have any experience with an Alpha Amp, as I've never purchased one.  However, I was planning on buying one soon.  But I'm taking a wait & see with RKR to find out if going forward they'll be a fiscally viable company.  So far the answer seems to be NO.  I hope I'm wrong.  Your story is just another example that Alpha may no longer be in the future of Ham Radio.  And that's sad.

But just look at the evidence besides what you just stated.
Their tuner has been in development for many years, yet still nothing.
They can't seem to be able to keep their tubes in stock.
There's no one to answer the phone.
They stopped advertising in QST mag.
They have not paid for Dayton & probably won't be there this year.

These are many red flags.  It's a shame since Alpha was the premier name in Amps for decades in this Hobby.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on October 10, 2016, 06:33:10 PM
Here's the new Alpha website:

https://www.alpharfsystems.com/
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 10, 2016, 08:28:50 PM
Here's the new Alpha website:

https://www.alpharfsystems.com/

RKR is officially kaput and Alpha is back in business, at least in the near future.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 11, 2016, 03:56:10 AM

RKR is officially kaput and Alpha is back in business, at least in the near future.

Back in business? When you click on the store link it says "under construction." Being back in business means a lot more than a website. It means producing and selling products. FWIW, the Ten-Tec website is similar; click on the store link and it says "under construction."
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AB4D on October 13, 2016, 06:00:41 PM
The status is speculative at this time, and seems to mirror what's going on with Ten-Tec.  A recent review I read regarding the Alpha 9500, the reviewer stated he was told that all warranties are void.  Surely, that is not going to sit well with anyone that has an RKR built Alpha product, that's still within the original warranty period.

I'm confident the Alpha name will survive in some form or fashion.  However, IMO they should begin concentrating less on tubes amplifiers, and starting moving towards solid state.   

Jim
 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on October 13, 2016, 06:06:02 PM
If RKR is still in business and not bankrupt, and sold equipment with a warranty, I am somewhat confused as to how selling that division alleviates of them their responsibility to provide warranty service.

Perhaps some of the lawyers on the board can offer some generic advice. I'd think a class action against RKR should be considered.

Pete
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 14, 2016, 05:42:55 AM
If the new owner only bought the assets of the company, he does not have to honor the warranty as the warranty is a liability until it expires. Now a good business practice would be for the new owner of the assets to honor the warranty, but he does not have to do so. Which would make me concerned about buying any new products from Alpha or TenTec that are brought to market.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on October 14, 2016, 06:03:01 AM
and why does that leave RKR off the hook? They "sold" the warranty, and did not go bankrupt.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 15, 2016, 07:42:35 AM
The status is speculative at this time, and seems to mirror what's going on with Ten-Tec.  A recent review I read regarding the Alpha 9500, the reviewer stated he was told that all warranties are void.  Surely, that is not going to sit well with anyone that has an RKR built Alpha product, that's still within the original warranty period.

I'm confident the Alpha name will survive in some form or fashion.  However, IMO they should begin concentrating less on tubes amplifiers, and starting moving towards solid state.   

Jim
 

Thank's, I had not heard about that but it certainly puts a new twist on things.  I don't see how RKR can get out of providing warranty service unless they have dissolved the corporation.  LLC's are limited liability corporations which means that they cant be sued.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 15, 2016, 09:30:23 PM
The status is speculative at this time, and seems to mirror what's going on with Ten-Tec.  A recent review I read regarding the Alpha 9500, the reviewer stated he was told that all warranties are void.  Surely, that is not going to sit well with anyone that has an RKR built Alpha product, that's still within the original warranty period.

I'm confident the Alpha name will survive in some form or fashion.  However, IMO they should begin concentrating less on tubes amplifiers, and starting moving towards solid state.   

Jim
 

Thank's, I had not heard about that but it certainly puts a new twist on things.  I don't see how RKR can get out of providing warranty service unless they have dissolved the corporation.  LLC's are limited liability corporations which means that they cant be sued.

In a word...wrong. Look up the laws. I have an LLC and it can be sued. The people who own it are shielded from personal liability but not the LLC itself. If someone wins a judgment against the LLC, the court can order a liquidation of the LLC assets to recover any reward. If there are no assets, the judgment is mute unless the LLC somehow gains assets after the judgment.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 16, 2016, 08:03:13 AM
The status is speculative at this time, and seems to mirror what's going on with Ten-Tec.  A recent review I read regarding the Alpha 9500, the reviewer stated he was told that all warranties are void.  Surely, that is not going to sit well with anyone that has an RKR built Alpha product, that's still within the original warranty period.

I'm confident the Alpha name will survive in some form or fashion.  However, IMO they should begin concentrating less on tubes amplifiers, and starting moving towards solid state.   

Jim
 

Thank's, I had not heard about that but it certainly puts a new twist on things.  I don't see how RKR can get out of providing warranty service unless they have dissolved the corporation.  LLC's are limited liability corporations which means that they cant be sued.

In a word...wrong. Look up the laws. I have an LLC and it can be sued. The people who own it are shielded from personal liability but not the LLC itself. If someone wins a judgment against the LLC, the court can order a liquidation of the LLC assets to recover any reward. If there are no assets, the judgment is mute unless the LLC somehow gains assets after the judgment.

I guess I made my point poorly, I did say "unless they dissolved the corporation".  My point was that if the have then there is nothing to sue for, you can't squeeze blood out of a turnip.  I seem to recall something on their website that said they would only warranty any new purchases for one year and I think they waited until a year had passed from the last sale before they unwound RKR.

That said I still have to wonder what is going to happen with Alpha and Emtron.  I wonder if they will get rolled up into one or be separate entities?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9IQ on October 16, 2016, 11:07:48 AM
Legally the question comes down to if the acquiring party assumed the warranty liability of the seller as part of the acquisition agreement. If so the acquirer must honor or defend the warranty claims. If not the selling company retains the liability of the warranties.

In either case an LLC is a company, not a corporation. If you have not been harmed from the transition of ownership - such as a denied warranty claim - then you are not an aggrieved party able to file, or participate in, a class action lawsuit.

- Glenn W9IQ
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on October 16, 2016, 12:18:33 PM
LLC should only protect the individual owners', not the company's assets.  Saying one cannot sue a LLC is incorrect. And not honoring the warranty is cause.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W8JX on October 17, 2016, 08:12:20 AM
LLC should only protect the individual owners', not the company's assets.  Saying one cannot sue a LLC is incorrect. And not honoring the warranty is cause.

It is not that simple. When you purchase a company you do not always get its liabilities. The devil is in the details that are rarely published. You will likely have more luck getting water from a rock than money from new owners for warranty claims.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W7AIT on October 18, 2016, 04:17:13 PM
I'M TRYING TO BUY A TEN TEC 507 PATRIOT TRANSCEIVER.  THEY DID HAVE THEM FOR SALE FOR AROUND $300 AT ONE TIME.  TODAY, THEY SHOW PICTURES, SPECS,  ETC FOR THE PATRIOT BUT I HAVE BEEN UNABLE TO GET ANYONE'S ATTENTION VIA EMAIL.

I'VE TRIED EMAIL TWICE NOW.  YESTERDAY, I MAILED, VIA US SNAIL MAIL,  TYPED LETTER TO THEM ASKING IF I COULD BUY A PATRIOT AND IF SO HOW?  I EVEN OFFERED THEM MONEY!  IMAGINE THAT!!

WE SHALL SEE. 

FRANKLY, I THINK THE WHOLE COMPANY IS GONE.   THAT'S TOO BAD TOO AS I ALSO OWN A TEN TEC RX-340 AND ITS ONE SUPERB RECEIVER.   MINE IS BEYOND WARRANTEE AND I HAVE NO ISSUES THERE.  IF IT BREAKS, OH WELL.   

WHAT I FIND TOTALLY UNPROFESSIONAL AND DISTURBING IS THIS STRING EVERYBODY ALONG ATTITUDE.  IF ITS BANKRUPT AND THEY DON'T WANT TO DO BUSINESS, SAY SO, TAKE EVERYTHING DOWN, BE PROFESSIONAL BUSINESSMEN ABOUT IT, SHUT IT DOWN PERMANENTLY.  TO CONTINUALLY STRING EVERYBODY ALONG, INCLUDING  PREVIOUS CUSTOMERS LIKE ME OR WORSE, POTENTIAL NEW CUSTOMERS, WITH CONTINUED FALSE HOPE MESSAGES, JUST IS NOT FAIR.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on October 18, 2016, 04:38:53 PM
I'M TRYING TO BUY A TEN TEC 507 PATRIOT TRANSCEIVER.  THEY DID HAVE THEM FOR SALE FOR AROUND $300 AT ONE TIME.  TODAY, THEY SHOW PICTURES, SPECS,  ETC FOR THE PATRIOT BUT I HAVE BEEN UNABLE TO GET ANYONE'S ATTENTION VIA EMAIL.

I'VE TRIED EMAIL TWICE NOW.  YESTERDAY, I MAILED, VIA US SNAIL MAIL,  TYPED LETTER TO THEM ASKING IF I COULD BUY A PATRIOT AND IF SO HOW?  I EVEN OFFERED THEM MONEY!  IMAGINE THAT!!

WE SHALL SEE. 

FRANKLY, I THINK THE WHOLE COMPANY IS GONE.   THAT'S TOO BAD TOO AS I ALSO OWN A TEN TEC RX-340 AND ITS ONE SUPERB RECEIVER.   MINE IS BEYOND WARRANTEE AND I HAVE NO ISSUES THERE.  IF IT BREAKS, OH WELL.   

WHAT I FIND TOTALLY UNPROFESSIONAL AND DISTURBING IS THIS STRING EVERYBODY ALONG ATTITUDE.  IF ITS BANKRUPT AND THEY DON'T WANT TO DO BUSINESS, SAY SO, TAKE EVERYTHING DOWN, BE PROFESSIONAL BUSINESSMEN ABOUT IT, SHUT IT DOWN PERMANENTLY.  TO CONTINUALLY STRING EVERYBODY ALONG, INCLUDING  PREVIOUS CUSTOMERS LIKE ME OR WORSE, POTENTIAL NEW CUSTOMERS, WITH CONTINUED FALSE HOPE MESSAGES, JUST IS NOT FAIR.



Here we go again, let the flames begin.......
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 20, 2016, 03:02:06 AM
I'M TRYING TO BUY A TEN TEC 507 PATRIOT TRANSCEIVER.  THEY DID HAVE THEM FOR SALE FOR AROUND $300 AT ONE TIME.  TODAY, THEY SHOW PICTURES, SPECS,  ETC FOR THE ....................


Please do not type in all caps. There is a "shift" key on all keyboards that allows the user to type in both upper and lower case. It is a rude practice to type in all caps and it is considering yelling. You lose a lot of credibility typing in all caps.

As for your screaming question. TenTec is not building any new radios right now and if you read all the previous comments, it may not build any radios in the future or it may. Who knows really since the owner of the new TenTec does a poor job of communicating to the current and potential future customer base. The only thing I think they are doing right now is servicing previously sold TenTec models.

Your best bet to buy a Patriot is to buy one used.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 20, 2016, 07:30:47 AM
Here we go again, let the flames begin.......

Good prediction.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on October 20, 2016, 10:20:14 AM
TO ALL YOU YUPPIES, THE MILITARY USES ALL CAPS AND IT IS USUALLY EASIER TO READ.  WHEN USING SOCIAL MEDIA, PLEASE DO NOT USE ALL CAPS AS USERS FIND THIS TO BE OFFENSIVE.

Caps or not, I almost bought an Alpha and was worried about the health of this company so I bought Acom and have not looked back.
Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on October 20, 2016, 12:58:04 PM
The status is speculative at this time, and seems to mirror what's going on with Ten-Tec.  A recent review I read regarding the Alpha 9500, the reviewer stated he was told that all warranties are void.  Surely, that is not going to sit well with anyone that has an RKR built Alpha product, that's still within the original warranty period.

I'm confident the Alpha name will survive in some form or fashion.  However, IMO they should begin concentrating less on tubes amplifiers, and starting moving towards solid state.   

Jim
 

Thank's, I had not heard about that but it certainly puts a new twist on things.  I don't see how RKR can get out of providing warranty service unless they have dissolved the corporation.  LLC's are limited liability corporations which means that they cant be sued.
From the RKR Designs web site:

Alpha RF Systems LLC has purchased Alpha
Please visit our new web site at www.alpharfsystems.com

Ten Tec is a subsidiary of Dishtronix, Inc
Visit Ten Tec at www.tentec.com

RKR Designs LLC has ceased operations.

I do not, and probably will never, know all the details. 

The word from others is that RKR acquired RFConcepts (the company that owned Alpha Amplifiers and then purchased Ten Tec) because RFConcepts was heavily in debt to them and did not have or could not in time get the funds to pay their bills.  RKR itself was formed to act as a holding company by the firm that was an RFC contractor.

At some point after the acquisition, RKR changed from operating Alpha and Ten Tec to liquidating the two -- essentially cutting their losses and trying to get as much $$ back as they could.

That, the story goes, is why both companies stopped selling new equipment and started selling off remaining inventory, and so on and so forth. 

Mike Dishop of Dishtronix acquired most of the remaining assets of what had been Ten Tec sometime last December; the official announcement came in January.  He, sad to say, did NOT acquire a working, functioning company.  He has been working very hard since the acquisition to put the company back together -- hiring staff, restocking parts so that the Service Department could get going again; I've heard he was looking to buy a new building, since TT is currently in rented quarters.  And there's a lot more, I simply don't have the details. 

He did not acquire the liabilities, which includes warranties.  Those remain with RKR, and with RKR now out of business (and it's been more than a year for most of the equipment sales anyway, so most warranties expired), the warranty work is a moot point.

Don't blame Mike for the situation.  He is trying to undo a lot of damage.  It may prove to be too much; I'm hopeful it's not.

WRT to Alpha, Mike and some partners were able to acquire the remnants of Alpha sometime before Hamvention, and the "official" announcement came shortly after (though seeing Alpha on display at the Ten Tec booth was kind of a big clue).  Like TT, he acquired remaining assets.  Not liabilities.  And he is also trying to put Alpha back together.  I don't know the specifics of the acquisition, but since TT is listed as a Dishtronix subsidiary, but Alpha is not, I don't know how much of Alpha he actually owns/controls.  Time will tell.

I know there are people upset about warranties not being honored.  Blaming the current ownership of both companies for the sins of the past owners -- such as failing to honor warranties -- is pointless.  The current ownership is NOT responsible for those sins, even as they are being raked over the coals for them. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 21, 2016, 03:08:26 AM
TO ALL YOU YUPPIES, THE MILITARY USES ALL CAPS AND IT IS USUALLY EASIER TO READ.  WHEN USING SOCIAL MEDIA, PLEASE DO NOT USE ALL CAPS AS USERS FIND THIS TO BE OFFENSIVE.

Caps or not, I almost bought an Alpha and was worried about the health of this company so I bought Acom and have not looked back.
Art

This is not the military. The military also uses tanks and missiles and we civilians don't use those either. So in civilian life, enough of the all caps. Using all caps also shows ignorance and lack of a proper education; not something that most people want to advertise.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on October 21, 2016, 06:28:06 AM
I'M TRYING TO BUY A TEN TEC 507 PATRIOT TRANSCEIVER.  THEY DID HAVE THEM FOR SALE FOR AROUND $300 AT ONE TIME.  TODAY, THEY SHOW PICTURES, SPECS,  ETC FOR THE PATRIOT BUT I HAVE BEEN UNABLE TO GET ANYONE'S ATTENTION VIA EMAIL.
< snip >
The new Ten Tec's new website does not have a working "store" yet.

Several people (on the TT Rebel email reflector) claimed that they were selling Rebels and Patriots earlier this year.  I do not have information on price or availability.  It's possible that they were selling some existing inventory that came with the purchase of other assets.

With that in mind, word from the reflector was that the CPU used in the Rebel & Patriot was discontinued.  There is a newer version, which does not have the same pin-out that the original did.  So if, and hopefully when, those two radios return to production, they may be slightly redesigned to match the new CPU. 

If you are interested in one of these radios, ask on the Rebel or Patriot reflector(s).  You'll find one.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 21, 2016, 07:51:39 AM
I'M TRYING TO BUY A TEN TEC 507 PATRIOT TRANSCEIVER.  THEY DID HAVE THEM FOR SALE FOR AROUND $300 AT ONE TIME.  TODAY, THEY SHOW PICTURES, SPECS,  ETC FOR THE PATRIOT BUT I HAVE BEEN UNABLE TO GET ANYONE'S ATTENTION VIA EMAIL.
< snip >
The new Ten Tec's new website does not have a working "store" yet.

Several people (on the TT Rebel email reflector) claimed that they were selling Rebels and Patriots earlier this year.  I do not have information on price or availability.  It's possible that they were selling some existing inventory that came with the purchase of other assets.

With that in mind, word from the reflector was that the CPU used in the Rebel & Patriot was discontinued.  There is a newer version, which does not have the same pin-out that the original did.  So if, and hopefully when, those two radios return to production, they may be slightly redesigned to match the new CPU. 

If you are interested in one of these radios, ask on the Rebel or Patriot reflector(s).  You'll find one.

Didn't you say they are going to begin production at the end of this month?  If so are they only going to be producing the Rebel and Patriot?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: NY7Q on October 21, 2016, 08:09:43 AM
I don't understand the thinking of the new owners. You have an inventory reduction sale to eliminate the inventory of the radio? Now there are no Eagles in stock? The Eagle is not currently in production? And to get to this you take another $400 off the price? Why would a company do such a thing?

The problem with their current pricing methodology is that now people will be afraid to purchase a radio at list because if they do, and TenTec or whatever they are calling the company now, discounts the radio steeply, the value of their radio on the used market plummets.

So it seems that all TT is left with now is the Omni, Argo, the Rebel and the Patriot. Not much of a leadership position now. It appears from this that Elecraft must be kicking their butts when it comes to the U.S. manufactured radio market.

Seems so sad to me and I have had a number of TT transceivers over the years.
Reading your posts isalmost like reading a funny book.....I get a big laugh out of you.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W7AIT on October 21, 2016, 11:05:38 AM
WB8NUT - I TYPE ALL CAPS DUE TO DISABILITY.  SO THERE...DON'T PICK ON ME.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on October 22, 2016, 06:18:42 AM
The news that RKR Designs is out of business is a revelation.  That probably explains why they were able to avoid warranty issues.  I wonder what in the world they did before acquiring Ten Tec's and Alpha's assets and product lines?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 22, 2016, 06:24:49 PM
The news that RKR Designs is out of business is a revelation.  That probably explains why they were able to avoid warranty issues.  I wonder what in the world they did before acquiring Ten Tec's and Alpha's assets and product lines?

From W3WN: "The word from others is that RKR acquired RFConcepts (the company that owned Alpha Amplifiers and then purchased Ten Tec) because RFConcepts was heavily in debt to them and did not have or could not in time get the funds to pay their bills.  RKR itself was formed to act as a holding company by the firm that was an RFC contractor."

While it may not be gospel, it fits as a plausible explanation or at least a partial explanation.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on October 23, 2016, 08:04:31 AM
The news that RKR Designs is out of business is a revelation.  That probably explains why they were able to avoid warranty issues.  I wonder what in the world they did before acquiring Ten Tec's and Alpha's assets and product lines?

From W3WN: "The word from others is that RKR acquired RFConcepts (the company that owned Alpha Amplifiers and then purchased Ten Tec) because RFConcepts was heavily in debt to them and did not have or could not in time get the funds to pay their bills.  RKR itself was formed to act as a holding company by the firm that was an RFC contractor."

While it may not be gospel, it fits as a plausible explanation or at least a partial explanation.

That would certainly explain the liquidation of Ten Tec and Alpha assets to repay some of the money owed to them.  I recall doing a search on RKR and they were listed as a holding company and a liquidator.  I don't think they ever had any intention of bringing back Alpha or Ten Tec but they kept telling people that because they new no one would buy a radio from a company that no longer existed.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on October 23, 2016, 10:24:36 AM
The news that RKR Designs is out of business is a revelation.  That probably explains why they were able to avoid warranty issues.  I wonder what in the world they did before acquiring Ten Tec's and Alpha's assets and product lines?

From W3WN: "The word from others is that RKR acquired RFConcepts (the company that owned Alpha Amplifiers and then purchased Ten Tec) because RFConcepts was heavily in debt to them and did not have or could not in time get the funds to pay their bills.  RKR itself was formed to act as a holding company by the firm that was an RFC contractor."

While it may not be gospel, it fits as a plausible explanation or at least a partial explanation.

That would certainly explain the liquidation of Ten Tec and Alpha assets to repay some of the money owed to them.  I recall doing a search on RKR and they were listed as a holding company and a liquidator.  I don't think they ever had any intention of bringing back Alpha or Ten Tec but they kept telling people that because they new no one would buy a radio from a company that no longer existed.

If that's true, that's a pretty awful thing to have done!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3PH on October 25, 2016, 02:03:20 PM
He did not acquire the liabilities, which includes warranties.  Those remain with RKR, and with RKR now out of business (and it's been more than a year for most of the equipment sales anyway, so most warranties expired), the warranty work is a moot point.

The warranty on the Alpha 9500 was supposed to be 4 years on the amp, 1 year on the tube.  I took delivery of mine 9/2015, and that lovely 4-year warranty turned out to be smoke.   

That's possible with any vendor, of course, and I was aware that I was rolling the dice since RKR didn't seem all that stable a year ago.  I'm babying the amp so hopefully the warranty issue will be moot.  I just hope there will be somebody around to support it long-term.  If not, I still have my old Alpha 76PA and SB221 ;-)

Mike may find himself wishing he had decided to honor warranties just to ensure good will.  I know he has pretty much zero funds (thus lack of progress with reviving either TenTec or Alpha manufacturing & sales) but if he -does- manage to revive either product line he'll have to work extra hard to overcome the ill will generated by deciding not to honor warranty promises that were made.  He's off to a bad start with the "we'd like to support you but we can't" section of the web site:  https://www.alpharfsystems.com/?page_id=1423
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AE0Q on October 26, 2016, 07:52:06 AM
Paul,

We are repairing existing Alpha amps and building new amps every day at Alpha, same location in Colorado since 2010. Alpha amplifier support via e-mail is the best way to contact us.

Glenn AE0Q
Alpha RF Systems
Longmont, CO
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3PH on October 26, 2016, 01:02:03 PM
We are repairing existing Alpha amps and building new amps every day at Alpha, same location in Colorado since 2010. Alpha amplifier support via e-mail is the best way to contact us.

Excellent - that's a big relief.  My 9500 (knocking on wood) has been completely trouble-free, but if it broke, it definitely isn't like the SB200 and SB221 I rebuilt with Harbach parts and it's not likely that I'd be the one fixing it.

The support part of the www.alpharfsystems.com site has what I took to be a not-encouraging we'd-like-to-help-you-but-we're-not-even-sure-we-can-get-parts tone - maybe somebody can polish that up a bit. 

Also really glad to hear that you're building new amps - that's very positive news.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 26, 2016, 01:33:09 PM
WB8NUT - I TYPE ALL CAPS DUE TO DISABILITY.  SO THERE...DON'T PICK ON ME.

Sorry Chip, not buying that excuse. If you can transmit CW, if you can use a keyboard, then you can also use the darn shift key.

Actually, your posts would be easier to read and be less offensive if you just typed in all lower case instead of all upper case if for some reason your fingers cannot use the shift key.


Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on October 26, 2016, 02:17:33 PM
CHIP, DON'T LISTEN TO THIS ETIQUET PATROL BOY.  IF YOU WANT TO USE CAPS, THEN DO SO.  LIKE I SAID IN A PREVIOUS POST, UNTIL GEN-X AND NOW THE MILLINEALS CAME ALONG, CAPS WERE JUST FINE. 
ART
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AB4D on October 26, 2016, 03:58:52 PM
Paul,

We are repairing existing Alpha amps and building new amps every day at Alpha, same location in Colorado since 2010. Alpha amplifier support via e-mail is the best way to contact us.

Glenn AE0Q
Alpha RF Systems
Longmont, CO


Glenn

As I stated,  I am sure Alpha will survive. IMO, still some of the best amplifiers ever manufactured.  However, the million dollar question. The amps you are repairing, is that repair work, where applicable, being performed under warranty?  Or have existing warranties expired with the cessation of RKR?

Jim AB4D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N1CX on October 26, 2016, 04:01:16 PM
WHY ARE YOU YELLING  ;D

CHIP, DON'T LISTEN TO THIS ETIQUET PATROL BOY.  IF YOU WANT TO USE CAPS, THEN DO SO.  LIKE I SAID IN A PREVIOUS POST, UNTIL GEN-X AND NOW THE MILLINEALS CAME ALONG, CAPS WERE JUST FINE. 
ART
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on October 26, 2016, 05:29:52 PM
THE YELLING IS ONLY IN YOUR MIND.  WHEN I WENT TO THE UNIVERSITY IN THE EARLY 60'S A PAPER IN ALL CAPS PROBABLY MEANT THAT YOU WERE USING A MILL.  ONCE THE INTERNET AND SOCIAL MEDIA CAME ALONG SOME GENIUS DECIDED THAT CAPS MEANT YELLING.  THAT IS FINE FOR THE YUPPIES BUT I AM PAST THAT.
ART
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 26, 2016, 05:59:36 PM
They need a new test to keep lids out of the hobby.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI0T on October 27, 2016, 07:21:49 AM
THE YELLING IS ONLY IN YOUR MIND.  WHEN I WENT TO THE UNIVERSITY IN THE EARLY 60'S A PAPER IN ALL CAPS PROBABLY MEANT THAT YOU WERE USING A MILL.  ONCE THE INTERNET AND SOCIAL MEDIA CAME ALONG SOME GENIUS DECIDED THAT CAPS MEANT YELLING.  THAT IS FINE FOR THE YUPPIES BUT I AM PAST THAT.
ART

So I take it when you write letters you use all caps too ?

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on October 27, 2016, 07:38:35 AM
Probably since so many people choose to stay ignorant and ignore social graces and norms. I get a laugh out of the many ways and arguments people will use to justify and support ignorance and laziness.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on October 27, 2016, 08:02:23 AM
Paul,

We are repairing existing Alpha amps and building new amps every day at Alpha, same location in Colorado since 2010. Alpha amplifier support via e-mail is the best way to contact us.

Glenn AE0Q
Alpha RF Systems
Longmont, CO
Glenn,

Good to hear from you again.  Glad to hear that you're still with the company!

73
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on October 27, 2016, 08:10:49 AM
The warranty on the Alpha 9500 was supposed to be 4 years on the amp, 1 year on the tube.  I took delivery of mine 9/2015, and that lovely 4-year warranty turned out to be smoke.    

That's possible with any vendor, of course, and I was aware that I was rolling the dice since RKR didn't seem all that stable a year ago.  I'm babying the amp so hopefully the warranty issue will be moot.  I just hope there will be somebody around to support it long-term.  If not, I still have my old Alpha 76PA and SB221 ;-)

Mike may find himself wishing he had decided to honor warranties just to ensure good will.  I know he has pretty much zero funds (thus lack of progress with reviving either TenTec or Alpha manufacturing & sales) but if he -does- manage to revive either product line he'll have to work extra hard to overcome the ill will generated by deciding not to honor warranty promises that were made.  He's off to a bad start with the "we'd like to support you but we can't" section of the web site:  https://www.alpharfsystems.com/?page_id=1423
Sorry, I was not aware that the amp had a 4 year warranty when it was sold by RKR.

With regards to Mike and warranties, I understand where you're coming from, and I agree (in the abstract) that it would be nice if he decides to honor them even when he doesn't (legally) have to.  

I also have an idea of how big a job he's had to put the two companies back together.  Both in terms of the work involved and the costs involved.  So as a practical matter, I see where he's coming from, and why.

I had the chance to meet Mike last spring at Hamvention, and talk with him briefly.  Suffice to say that he didn't strike me as the type of guy who would just blow people off, and I think he is very cognizant of the value of goodwill.  I don't think he wants to piss people off.  Suffice to say, if someone had a warranty issue with any item bought under the RKR or RFC auspices, I'd suggest that they ASK about it first.  I can't say much beyond that, less someone think I'm making a commitment on Mike's behalf that (obviously) I can't make.

BTW, I noticed this morning that the online store on the new Alpha site is up and running.  Right now, only spare parts for various amp models are shown, and some are shown as currently out of stock -- but at least the store is there.  I'm hopeful that the online store for Ten Tec pops up pretty soon as well.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on October 27, 2016, 11:27:21 AM
They need a new test to keep lids out of the hobby.

Proves the fact that some licensed hams who have their tickets don't want the diversity of others to interfere with "their" norms and should be banned simply for that reason.

And since when did "lid" pertain to what others do outside of operating ham radio equipment?

You hit the nail on the head...its a hobby. It is not a narrow minded group of high precision engineers that must conform to a certain standard to predict the outcome...just a hobby.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on October 27, 2016, 11:59:33 AM
They need a new test to keep lids out of the hobby.

Cranky!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 03, 2016, 03:20:50 AM

Cranky!

Yeah, I get that way at times dealing with the ignorant.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 03, 2016, 03:53:03 AM

Cranky!

Yeah, I get that way at times dealing with the ignorant.

Says the high and mighty!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K7JQ on November 03, 2016, 06:23:21 AM

Cranky!

Yeah, I get that way at times dealing with the ignorant.

Apparently, some "ignorant" people can at least pass the Extra exam.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI0T on November 03, 2016, 10:15:08 AM

Cranky!

Yeah, I get that way at times dealing with the ignorant.

Apparently, some "ignorant" people can at least pass the Extra exam.

The Extra exam is really nothing anymore. A basic college Calculus test is far more difficult.

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N0YXB on November 03, 2016, 12:45:15 PM

Cranky!

Yeah, I get that way at times dealing with the ignorant.

Apparently, some "ignorant" people can at least pass the Extra exam.

The Extra exam is really nothing anymore. A basic college Calculus test is far more difficult.

As it should be.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3PH on November 03, 2016, 04:49:17 PM
Sorry, I was not aware that the amp had a 4 year warranty when it was sold by RKR.

With regards to Mike and warranties, I understand where you're coming from, and I agree (in the abstract) that it would be nice if he decides to honor them even when he doesn't (legally) have to.

For what it's worth, I noticed today that Mike's web page for the 9500 says the warranty is still 4 years, 1 year on tubes.  Even mentions it twice, calls it 'industry leading':   https://www.alpharfsystems.com/?p=1480

I'm just going to keep babying my 9500 so I won't need to find out what the warranty reality is.  So far so good. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 04, 2016, 04:42:03 AM

Apparently, some "ignorant" people can at least pass the Extra exam.

Thanks for helping me make my point. Ignorance and motivation are not the same thing.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on November 10, 2016, 05:15:22 PM
So someone posted in September that Ten Tec was going to start making radios in October.  Wonder where that went?  The online store is still under construction.

The Alpha online store is up and loaded with out of stock items that can be purchased at a dozen other places right now so whoop de doo.  Looks like they are ready to take out of the oven for the fork test.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI0T on November 18, 2016, 01:11:26 PM
So someone posted in September that Ten Tec was going to start making radios in October.  Wonder where that went?  The online store is still under construction.

The Alpha online store is up and loaded with out of stock items that can be purchased at a dozen other places right now so whoop de doo.  Looks like they are ready to take out of the oven for the fork test.

Is it April 1'st already ?

"He's dead Jim"...

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9AOP on November 18, 2016, 01:35:37 PM
I guess that a warranty is only as good as the company behind it.  From what I have been reading this company is close to vapor.
Art
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 18, 2016, 06:55:04 PM

Apparently, some "ignorant" people can at least pass the Extra exam.

Thanks for helping me make my point. Ignorance and motivation are not the same thing.

And some can't.

Motivation is a better teacher then stagnant thinking. And achievement is the result of motivation.

Ignorance is the product of lack of motivation.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on November 19, 2016, 07:26:15 AM
Getting close to the end of the year, and still no signs of life from TenTec. No news updates. No product updates. No radio production. No updates to website. Web store still notes "under construction."

I think you can pretty much stick a fork in them. The amateur radio world has passed them by.

How many hams would really risk their money on a new radio from Ten-Tec?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K6AER on November 19, 2016, 04:43:42 PM
I was a contract engineer at Alpha and designed the 8406 and did there FCC type acceptance work when Molly was there. The folks at Alpha were very hard working and a wonderful group to work with but there was a black cloud on the horizon.  The business model was running up against the on slot of foreign amplifiers. Labor cost is a bear.

Today you can buy the OM-2000+ with 160-6 meter coverage and 2000+ watts out for $3600. That is less than half of the 8410 and the 8406 combined cost. Most new hams are very happy with 600-1000 watt amplifiers. This means solid state. More and more new hams have no desire to have a big gun station. 150 hams assume room temperature every month and their amplifiers are on the used market. Last week I counted 12 Alphas from the model 86 all the way up the newer 9500 on QTH.com. Most were under $2700.00. The market is soft. I understand Brad (lead tech) is no longer with Alpha. Molly Is enjoying a new carrier at the university.

Sigh….
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AG6JU on November 19, 2016, 06:32:02 PM
I too work in electronics Radio Frequency industry in USA.  It is true price pressure are very high.  However, TEN TEC receiver use analog design with good narrow IF filter, and quiet Local Oscillator,  while competition use DSP IF filtering.  I think Analog Filter design are quieter, and do handle stronger near signal.  When Analog receiver receive strong near frequency signal, output distort.  But, when DSP radio face such signal output disappear ( over load of AD converter ) .   Strong signal can be strong noise as well.  So I prefer Analog IF filter receiver.  But, Digital is word people believe superior, so consumer Choose digital over analog.  Same go with Cellular phone , there was nothing wrong with well established FM AMP system, it had great coverage , Good sound quality.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K6AER on November 20, 2016, 08:34:27 PM
I too work in electronics Radio Frequency industry in USA.  It is true price pressure are very high.  However, TEN TEC receiver use analog design with good narrow IF filter, and quiet Local Oscillator,  while competition use DSP IF filtering.  I think Analog Filter design are quieter, and do handle stronger near signal.  When Analog receiver receive strong near frequency signal, output distort.  But, when DSP radio face such signal output disappear ( over load of AD converter ) .   Strong signal can be strong noise as well.  So I prefer Analog IF filter receiver.  But, Digital is word people believe superior, so consumer Choose digital over analog.  Same go with Cellular phone , there was nothing wrong with well established FM AMP system, it had great coverage , Good sound quality.

If you look at Sherwood's web site The DSP radios have the highest intercept, greatest dynamic range and lowest phase noise. All resulting in generally the best performing receivers and transmitters. The next year is going to be a blood bath for conventional transceiver design. Many models will disappear along with their inflated price tags. When an analog receiver is overloaded you just had distortion. Most hams just turned down the RF gain control. Now you have a OVRLD light that flashes and the new hams get all a fritter. They have no idea what the RF gain control knob is for.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 21, 2016, 06:03:35 AM

Now you have a OVRLD light that flashes and the new hams get all a fritter. They have no idea what the RF gain control knob is for.

Which is why Elmering is still important to Ham Radio.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4KOE on November 21, 2016, 07:00:59 AM
A basic college Calculus test is far more difficult.

---and then your head explodes when they throw integrals at you.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WI0T on November 21, 2016, 12:58:19 PM
A basic college Calculus test is far more difficult.

---and then your head explodes when they throw integrals at you.

Not integrals...differential equations..until you catch on...
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KB2WIG on November 21, 2016, 08:04:35 PM


I lost my footing on the four step rule.


klc
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on November 22, 2016, 05:31:48 AM
Getting close to the end of the year, and still no signs of life from TenTec. No news updates. No product updates. No radio production. No updates to website. Web store still notes "under construction."

I think you can pretty much stick a fork in them. The amateur radio world has passed them by.

How many hams would really risk their money on a new radio from Ten-Tec?
The local undertaker called.  He wants you to return his shovel.

Mike Dishop N8WFF posted a long update to the Ten Tec reflector yesterday, discussing the current status.  Some of the highlights:

- Their current location is too small for their needs, so they are currently in the process of moving to new quarters.
- Because of the booming tourist trade in the Sevier County area, prices for commercial real estate are 'sky high', which is why finding a new home has taken so long.
- The Service department is not taking additional rigs in for repair RIGHT NOW, but will do so as soon as the move is complete... simply because they don't want to move rigs in for repair along with everything else
- They have resumed doing their PC Board work internally
- As many have speculated, they have been very busy with a commercial order for the RX340, proceeds of which have paid the bills for the new equipment they have acquired
- If you'd like an RX340, they are available right now on "short notice"
- New radios are on the horizon, but still in the design phase
- And finally, Mike would like to know if anyone is still interested in buying a Ten Tec Eagle.  It looks like a production run of at least 100 Eagle's is about to take place. 

I'm skipping a lot of detail here.  Suffice to say, the owner of the company has made a commitment, and is spending his time running the company (along with Alpha, which is again a separate company from Ten Tec) and trying to put it back together.  In short, he's busier than a one armed man in a wallpaper hanging contest.

But they're not dead.  Not yet, at least.  So quit trying to bury them.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on November 22, 2016, 06:04:53 AM
Too bad the funeral committee can't give anyone a break. They just want to see it die so they can be right. And they will keep saying TT is dead in hopes of killing any possibility of being wrong in their predictions. They can't stand the fact that Mike is still putting time, effort, and money into keeping it alive.

Even a baby needs a few years to become self sustaining. Why does a rebirth of an infant company need to become an adult right away without some time to grow up?

The previous owners destroyed the company. If anyone were truly honest, do you really think less then 1 year is enough to rebuild the damage? If you do, your either being dishonest or you have no clue on operating ALL facets (not just bits and pieces) of a business.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on April 13, 2017, 05:20:42 PM
For the first time in a very long time, I saw an AD in QST magazine for Alpha Amps this month.  That's a good sign!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K9MHZ on May 21, 2017, 03:47:12 AM
They had a booth at Dayton.  Not a big presentation, but they were definitely present.

FWIW.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N0YXB on May 21, 2017, 07:48:19 AM
They had a booth at Dayton.  Not a big presentation, but they were definitely present.

FWIW.


Although some may disagree, more progress.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on May 22, 2017, 08:16:22 AM
They had a booth at Dayton.  Not a big presentation, but they were definitely present.

FWIW.


Anything about Emtron?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on May 22, 2017, 10:33:39 AM
They had a booth at Dayton.  Not a big presentation, but they were definitely present.

FWIW.


Anything about Emtron?
Yes.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K2FW on May 22, 2017, 06:15:29 PM
They had a booth at Dayton.  Not a big presentation, but they were definitely present.

FWIW.


Although some may disagree, more progress.
I agree.  Baby steps but headed in the right direction!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W7WRJ on July 20, 2017, 05:45:45 AM
Well the latest news on the streets, is that Dishtronix has also purchased Alpha and now controls it.  Saw it someplace on the WEB. 

73's,

Mike Chasse
w7wrj
https://www.qrz.com/db/W7WRJ/
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3WN on July 20, 2017, 07:53:23 AM
Well the latest news on the streets, is that Dishtronix has also purchased Alpha and now controls it.  Saw it someplace on the WEB. 

73's,

Mike Chasse
w7wrj
https://www.qrz.com/db/W7WRJ/
Yes, that was announced by Mike Dishop at the Dayton Hamvention. 

In May 2016.

See also http://www.alpharfsystems.com/
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on July 20, 2017, 12:39:24 PM
Well the latest news on the streets, is that Dishtronix has also purchased Alpha and now controls it.  Saw it someplace on the WEB. 

73's,

Mike Chasse
w7wrj
https://www.qrz.com/db/W7WRJ/
Yes, that was announced by Mike Dishop at the Dayton Hamvention. 

In May 2016.

See also http://www.alpharfsystems.com/


That was announced before then, there was something on RKR's blog back around December 2015 that said they were selling out to Dishtronix.  Still wondering what's happening with Emtron?  Looks like the folks in AU still provide some limited service but there are none being manufactured.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9JKP on July 22, 2017, 05:16:19 AM

Mike Dishop N8WFF posted a long update to the Ten Tec reflector yesterday, discussing the current status.  Some of the highlights:

...

But they're not dead.  Not yet, at least.  So quit trying to bury them.

Ron, Any further updates?  I am patient, but also mortal.  I truly want an Alpha 4040.  Also I spoke with Mike Dishop last Winter and he had hoped to have his new 160-6 Dishrtonix amp completed.  I love his design philosophy and that the design and manufacturing will be here in the USA.

Wishing him luck and thanks for the info from the Ten-Tec reflector
Kevin N9JKP
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on July 22, 2017, 06:27:49 AM
Hi,

I do not have any skin in this game. But it would seem to me that a statement from Mike, as to what is going on with the Amateur Radio lines, every few months would be nice, and seems like common business sense. But it appears they  are treating any supporters and potential remaining customers like mushrooms.

73,

John
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on July 22, 2017, 09:17:42 AM
Hi,

I do not have any skin in this game. But it would seem to me that a statement from Mike, as to what is going on with the Amateur Radio lines, every few months would be nice, and seems like common business sense. But it appears they  are treating any supporters and potential remaining customers like mushrooms.

73,

John

Not only do I agree with you John but why does Mike Dishop insist on posting updates to the Ten Tec reflector instead of the companies website?  That just seems very odd to me that he would limit information to a reflector site where only a very select audience of blindly faithful Ten Tec supporters will see it.  

I have never heard of any company operating like that.  If he is serious about re-entering the amateur radio market then he needs to reach out to all amateurs, not just the supporters and potential remaining customers, many of whom won't buy anyway.  That is just a poor way to do business.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on July 23, 2017, 01:49:23 PM
Hi,

I do not have any skin in this game. But it would seem to me that a statement from Mike, as to what is going on with the Amateur Radio lines, every few months would be nice, and seems like common business sense. But it appears they  are treating any supporters and potential remaining customers like mushrooms.

73,

John

Given the volume of contentious unsolicited advice that peppers almost any thread here about how to properly own & run Ten-Tec, i am not that surprised Mike is choosing instead to provide occasional updates via the Ten-Tec reflector.  Until TT has their production lines & website store going strong, why give oxygen to all the flame-throwers here who aren't fans of TT anyways?

This thread for example is one started by me 2 years ago when Mike had NOTHING to do with Ten-Tec -- it's from back when RKR took over and then went on to have a big Summer sale.
Although someone is inquiring about Alpha Amplifiers and that is now something Mike controls -- for present TT ownership to respond here in a thread about RKR would be kind of off-base...

when TT starts really being back in the game, i would expect advertisements and website announcements;  not sure it would really be appropriate for Mike to start a thread here and sell his wares.
 
here is the TT website announcement that perhaps could stand an update: https://www.tentec.com/?page_id=10 (https://www.tentec.com/?page_id=10)

I'd suggest patience, but fear that might encourage deficit spending given some of the tenor here  :-\
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on July 23, 2017, 04:31:51 PM
Hi,

I do not have any skin in this game. But it would seem to me that a statement from Mike, as to what is going on with the Amateur Radio lines, every few months would be nice, and seems like common business sense. But it appears they  are treating any supporters and potential remaining customers like mushrooms.

73,

John

Given the volume of contentious unsolicited advice that peppers almost any thread here about how to properly own & run Ten-Tec, i am not that surprised Mike is choosing instead to provide occasional updates via the Ten-Tec reflector.  Until TT has their production lines & website store going strong, why give oxygen to all the flame-throwers here who aren't fans of TT anyways?

This thread for example is one started by me 2 years ago when Mike had NOTHING to do with Ten-Tec -- it's from back when RKR took over and then went on to have a big Summer sale.
Although someone is inquiring about Alpha Amplifiers and that is now something Mike controls -- for present TT ownership to respond here in a thread about RKR would be kind of off-base...

when TT starts really being back in the game, i would expect advertisements and website announcements;  not sure it would really be appropriate for Mike to start a thread here and sell his wares.
 
here is the TT website announcement that perhaps could stand an update: https://www.tentec.com/?page_id=10 (https://www.tentec.com/?page_id=10)

I'd suggest patience, but fear that might encourage deficit spending given some of the tenor here  :-\

+1
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on July 25, 2017, 07:38:46 AM
Hi,

I do not have any skin in this game. But it would seem to me that a statement from Mike, as to what is going on with the Amateur Radio lines, every few months would be nice, and seems like common business sense. But it appears they  are treating any supporters and potential remaining customers like mushrooms.

73,

John

Given the volume of contentious unsolicited advice that peppers almost any thread here about how to properly own & run Ten-Tec, i am not that surprised Mike is choosing instead to provide occasional updates via the Ten-Tec reflector.  Until TT has their production lines & website store going strong, why give oxygen to all the flame-throwers here who aren't fans of TT anyways?

This thread for example is one started by me 2 years ago when Mike had NOTHING to do with Ten-Tec -- it's from back when RKR took over and then went on to have a big Summer sale.
Although someone is inquiring about Alpha Amplifiers and that is now something Mike controls -- for present TT ownership to respond here in a thread about RKR would be kind of off-base...

when TT starts really being back in the game, i would expect advertisements and website announcements;  not sure it would really be appropriate for Mike to start a thread here and sell his wares.
 
here is the TT website announcement that perhaps could stand an update: https://www.tentec.com/?page_id=10 (https://www.tentec.com/?page_id=10)

I'd suggest patience, but fear that might encourage deficit spending given some of the tenor here  :-\

No one has suggested that Mike Dishop post anything on this thread.  Neither is anyone telling him how to run his company.  The discussion is focused on the lack of information on the Ten Tec website.  The discussion looked at the fact that there were multiple posts made to the Ten Tec mailing list by a former employee and a couple of hams who are also not employees of the company.  Please name for me, if you can, any other company who does that?

They, Ten Tec,  went to the trouble to build a website (pretty much a knock off of the old RKR site) that shows a list of equipment, none of which is for sale.  There is a drop down called news which is, and has been, conspicuously blank.  They do repair radios but so what?  a dozen other people do that as well.

They show up at Xenia and talk about great things to come but nothing on the website.  The discussion is just that, a discussion, not a funeral committee, not bashing, and not telling them how to run their company.  We are discussing the merits of information and how important it is to keep potential customers informed lest they drift away. 
The discussion also is about the fact that the longer a company is off the market the more difficult it is to return.  Included in that discussion is the notion that in order for an amateur radio company (any amateur radio company), but especially a small start up to be successful in this time of explosive technological change, they have to have products that are really cutting edge and appeal to amateurs in both price and performance.

It is only a discussion, that's all it is.  No one cares if Mike posts here or not in fact, that would be stupid, Ten Tec has a web site and that is where they should be posting updates.

As for fear and deficit spending?  All companies do that, they get a loan for start up capitol and they roll the dice.  That's how it works.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W5JON on July 25, 2017, 11:10:43 AM

No one has suggested that Mike Dishop post anything on this thread.  Neither is anyone telling him how to run his company.  The discussion is focused on the lack of information on the Ten Tec website.  The discussion looked at the fact that there were multiple posts made to the Ten Tec mailing list by a former employee and a couple of hams who are also not employees of the company.  Please name for me, if you can, any other company who does that?

They, Ten Tec,  went to the trouble to build a website (pretty much a knock off of the old RKR site) that shows a list of equipment, none of which is for sale.  There is a drop down called news which is, and has been, conspicuously blank.  They do repair radios but so what?  a dozen other people do that as well.

They show up at Xenia and talk about great things to come but nothing on the website.  The discussion is just that, a discussion, not a funeral committee, not bashing, and not telling them how to run their company.  We are discussing the merits of information and how important it is to keep potential customers informed lest they drift away. 
The discussion also is about the fact that the longer a company is off the market the more difficult it is to return.  Included in that discussion is the notion that in order for an amateur radio company (any amateur radio company), but especially a small start up to be successful in this time of explosive technological change, they have to have products that are really cutting edge and appeal to amateurs in both price and performance.

It is only a discussion, that's all it is.  No one cares if Mike posts here or not in fact, that would be stupid, Ten Tec has a web site and that is where they should be posting updates.

As for fear and deficit spending?  All companies do that, they get a loan for start up capitol and they roll the dice.  That's how it works.

Exactly, well said.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on July 25, 2017, 02:43:03 PM
Quote from: N9KX
I'd suggest patience, but fear that might encourage deficit spending given some of the tenor here  :-\

Quote from: KA4DPO
As for fear and deficit spending?  All companies do that, they get a loan for start up capitol and they roll the dice.  That's how it works.

 ::) the deficit spending i was referring to regarded asking the armchair critics here to show some patience, since they seem to have none to spend  ;)
I believe Mike already has experience starting & running a company (Dishtronix)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N0YXB on July 25, 2017, 04:52:29 PM

::) the deficit spending i was referring to regarded asking the armchair critics here to show some patience, since they seem to have none to spend  ;)


I got it, and was impressed with your wordsmithing. Well played.   :)
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on July 25, 2017, 08:12:57 PM

::) the deficit spending i was referring to regarded asking the armchair critics here to show some patience, since they seem to have none to spend  ;)


I got it, and was impressed with your wordsmithing. Well played.   :)

Indeed, nice job of weasel wording.  ;D
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on July 26, 2017, 02:45:12 AM
Quote from: N9KX
::) the deficit spending i was referring to regarded asking the armchair critics here to show some patience, since they seem to have none to spend  ;)
Quote from: N0YXB
I got it, and was impressed with your wordsmithing. Well played.   :)
Quote from: KA4DPO
Indeed, nice job of weasel wording.  ;D

your attempt to weasel out of your own misreading and your quickness to find fault with the way others word things -- OR THE WAY OTHERS RUN THEIR COMPANY -- is noted, with amusement  :)

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3PH on July 26, 2017, 06:08:28 AM
As for fear and deficit spending?  All companies do that, they get a loan for start up capitol and they roll the dice.  That's how it works.

I wish Mike well, but he's taking way too long, and the ham world is moving on.  I watched Rob Sherwood's talk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owaaT6u4XkY) where he pointed out that the IC-7300 sold more units in its first year than Elecraft sold in ten years (they sold 1000 at Dayton alone).  Unless Mike can raise enough capital to design a new generation of TenTec rigs that somehow competes with the SDR gear that's flooding the market, it's hard to see him succeeding in the ham market.  Same goes for the Alpha amps (I have a 9500) - there are cheaper, excellent choices now, from companies that have established distribution and service, and within the next few years amps will be pretty much all solid-state. 

He may be able to make enough sales in the commercial/gov't markets to keep going, but unless he raises some capital and hires the right people ASAP, Ten-Tec as a provider of ham gear is effectively over.  Even if he hires some great people today, it'll be 2 years before they have any shipping products, and the ham world will *really* have moved on by then.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W9FIB on July 26, 2017, 07:10:26 AM
As for fear and deficit spending?  All companies do that, they get a loan for start up capitol and they roll the dice.  That's how it works.

I wish Mike well, but he's taking way too long, and the ham world is moving on.  I watched Rob Sherwood's talk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owaaT6u4XkY) where he pointed out that the IC-7300 sold more units in its first year than Elecraft sold in ten years (they sold 1000 at Dayton alone).  Unless Mike can raise enough capital to design a new generation of TenTec rigs that somehow competes with the SDR gear that's flooding the market, it's hard to see him succeeding in the ham market.  Same goes for the Alpha amps (I have a 9500) - there are cheaper, excellent choices now, from companies that have established distribution and service, and within the next few years amps will be pretty much all solid-state. 

He may be able to make enough sales in the commercial/gov't markets to keep going, but unless he raises some capital and hires the right people ASAP, Ten-Tec as a provider of ham gear is effectively over.  Even if he hires some great people today, it'll be 2 years before they have any shipping products, and the ham world will *really* have moved on by then.

To follow your logic here, no company could start or restart no matter how good the product is. If the ham world "moves on" to something different, why couldn't they "move on" in the future to a new Ten Tec product? Seems like HR "moves on" to something different every few years. And who ever has the new innovation will be the current hot ticket.

As consumers, do we not choose a product based on its price, form, fit, and function? Or is it simply you buy only a "long standing" name?

Again, following you logic, Elecraft could never have gotten off the ground. But HR "moved on" to innovation which brought popularity of a new brand and old brand names. Capitalism works!
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N3QE on July 26, 2017, 07:22:56 AM
As for fear and deficit spending?  All companies do that, they get a loan for start up capitol and they roll the dice.  That's how it works.

I wish Mike well, but he's taking way too long, and the ham world is moving on.  I watched Rob Sherwood's talk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owaaT6u4XkY) where he pointed out that the IC-7300 sold more units in its first year than Elecraft sold in ten years (they sold 1000 at Dayton alone). 

Interesting statistic!

Among heavy duty contesters Elecraft wins every which way. I'd estimate more than 80% of the top contesters have K3's or later.

But I see what you mean about the marketplace much broader, a broad marketplace of not-so-active hams who still buy rigs.

Ten-Tec even when it was a going concern a couple years ago, had an even smaller niche than Elecraft.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on July 26, 2017, 12:47:24 PM
Quote from: W3PH
[....] the IC-7300 sold more units in its first year than Elecraft sold in ten years (they sold 1000 at Dayton alone).  Unless Mike can raise enough capital to design a new generation of TenTec rigs that somehow competes with the SDR gear that's flooding the market, it's hard to see him succeeding in the ham market. 

i think it is safe to say that when Mike bought TT and announced plans to continue TT's tradition of being an innovator he was fully aware of the above condition.
 

Quote from: W3PH
He may be able to make enough sales in the commercial/gov't markets to keep going, but unless he raises some capital and hires the right people ASAP, Ten-Tec as a provider of ham gear is effectively over.  Even if he hires some great people today, it'll be 2 years before they have any shipping products, and the ham world will *really* have moved on by then.

TT can provide ham gear as long as it chooses to, and if the product is a good one ham radio operators WILL buy them.
regardless of how you or i spin it, it pretty much goes without saying that the present owner of TT is aware that to be successful as a company one needs customers who like, buy and use the product(s)...

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: GM1FLQ on July 26, 2017, 10:51:43 PM

He may be able to make enough sales in the commercial/gov't markets to keep going, but unless he raises some capital and hires the right people ASAP, Ten-Tec as a provider of ham gear is effectively over.  Even if he hires some great people today, it'll be 2 years before they have any shipping products, and the ham world will *really* have moved on by then.........


...........absolutely,  will be looking something like this - edging closer to it by the day..........

              (http://sadeq.me/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/c4a8d15a4b8a48b66218b121a593aa7ec8d791f3.jpg)

                      
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3PH on July 27, 2017, 05:50:55 AM
Again, following you logic, Elecraft could never have gotten off the ground. But HR "moved on" to innovation which brought popularity of a new brand and old brand names. Capitalism works!

That isn't what I'm saying.  Every company has to reinvent itself every few years now because technology and competitors are constantly changing.  Partly because of this constant change, anybody can start a new company from scratch if they have a plan to make something that people are going to want, and they're able to raise the capital to invest in development and manufacturing before the sales start rolling in. There's a large graveyard of ham providers who didn't change quickly enough and are now gone, but there are plenty of others who've been innovating and have guessed right about what people will buy and have managed to start from scratch in the past decade (Elecraft, Flex) and are well-managed and are doing well. 

The steam went out of TenTec starting about a decade ago, so what Mike bought was a product line that was already pretty long in the tooth.  There are plenty of TenTec fans who'd probably buy one of the old designs if it was offered today.  Mike wouldn't have to sell as many units as Icom's IC-7300, but he'll need something to sell. 

I just took a fresh look at the tentec.com web site - you can't buy anything, even parts, so it really looks as if TenTec is dormant.  Maybe Mike has a great team together working hard on an amazing new SDR radio that we won't be able to resist, or he'll start producing and selling an older TenTec analog rig that people might want because they like the way TenTec rigs of yore work.  In the meantime, at least viewed from the web, TenTec isn't open for business at this point if you're looking to buy radios or parts.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: AC7CW on July 27, 2017, 05:29:58 PM
I think that Heathkit could bring out an SDR rig sooner than Ten-Tec. They could make a very simple design that worked.. worked to get on the air, just like the original Heathkit stuff. Nobody associates super-high performance with the Heathkit name, right? If Ten-Tec made a really modest rig it wouldn't fly: People expect some really good characteristics out of a Ten-Tec.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on July 30, 2017, 10:29:50 AM
I think that Heathkit could bring out an SDR rig sooner than Ten-Tec. They could make a very simple design that worked.. worked to get on the air, just like the original Heathkit stuff. Nobody associates super-high performance with the Heathkit name, right? If Ten-Tec made a really modest rig it wouldn't fly: People expect some really good characteristics out of a Ten-Tec.

Ten-Tec has a new factory full of state of the art PCB assembly equipment and is actively servicing their commercial contracts. Heathkit is struggling to produce over priced clocks and TRF kit radios.  Ten Tec has already announced what products would be put back into production at first. 
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: K6AER on August 27, 2017, 10:39:56 AM
Unless the new Ten-Tec units out performs the IC-7300 for less than $1250 it is a non starter.  ICOM is struggling to bring the IC-7610 to market and FLEX is offering their 6400M for $600 less with better performance.  Not even they (ICOM) are immune to a changing market place.

The business model in ham radio has changed dramatically.  Cost of production and performance drive product sales.  In little over a year the IC-7300 is the second most produced amateur HF radio. The Kenwood TS-2000 is still number one but has been in production for over 16 years.

The price point in used radios had dropped by as much as 50% on some models.

Don't forget with the boomers assuming room temperature more and more radios are hitting the used market.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W3BJ on August 27, 2017, 03:09:55 PM
Just how do you go about ordering a new Alpha amp from Alpha RF systems. Every time I log in I get redirected because it says the website is crooked.?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: W1BR on August 27, 2017, 03:26:25 PM
I get into both websites, Alpha and Distronix.  Certificate is expired, but you can permit access.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 18, 2018, 08:58:51 AM
I get into both websites, Alpha and Distronix.  Certificate is expired, but you can permit access.

Both websites are still up but there have been no significant changes in quite some time.  The Alpha 9500 is still listed as backordered when you put one in your cart.  Similarly, the 8410 says there is one in stock.  The store does list parts for sale and some tubes also.  

 I have not seen any advertising for either company in QST or on this, or any other amateur radio site.  I assume they are both still in the repair business.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: NN4RH on December 18, 2018, 10:28:31 AM
.  I assume they are both still in the repair business.

Just an FYI,  Dishtronix, on November 25, applied to renew the Ten Tec Trademark registration, which had expired back in May, and was due to be permanently deleted at the end of the grace period, November 26. Although the USPTO rejected the application on December 9, they requested some documentation proving that Dishtronix owns Ten Tec now. Presumably, once Dishtronix files the necessary paperwork, the Ten Tec trademark registration would be renewed.

The point being, I doubt that anyone would go through the expense and hassle dealing with the USPTO, unless they were, in fact, "still in ... business". 

Ref:  http://tsdr.uspto.gov/#caseNumber=73158963&caseType=SERIAL_NO&searchType=statusSearch

Ref:  http://tsdr.uspto.gov/documentviewer?caseId=sn73158963&docId=OOA20181207134805#docIndex=0&page=1
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: DL8OV on December 18, 2018, 12:09:10 PM
So let me get this straight, when I tried to purchase a Ten-Tec transceiver in early November (and failed) they didn't even own the trademark of the name on the front panel.

Interesting way of doing business, I wonder who let that one slip?

Peter DL8OV

Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: KA4DPO on December 18, 2018, 12:14:49 PM
.  I assume they are both still in the repair business.

Just an FYI,  Dishtronix, on November 25, applied to renew the Ten Tec Trademark registration, which had expired back in May, and was due to be permanently deleted at the end of the grace period, November 26. Although the USPTO rejected the application on December 9, they requested some documentation proving that Dishtronix owns Ten Tec now. Presumably, once Dishtronix files the necessary paperwork, the Ten Tec trademark registration would be renewed.

The point being, I doubt that anyone would go through the expense and hassle dealing with the USPTO, unless they were, in fact, "still in ... business".  

Ref:  http://tsdr.uspto.gov/#caseNumber=73158963&caseType=SERIAL_NO&searchType=statusSearch

Ref:  http://tsdr.uspto.gov/documentviewer?caseId=sn73158963&docId=OOA20181207134805#docIndex=0&page=1


Typical government goat rodeo.  I'm sure they, Dishtronix,  have both the appropriate documentation and the seventy five dollar filing fee, too bad Uncle Sam has such rules but it really isn't all that difficult.   If you already have the proper documentation it should not take more than about 30 minutes to complete the filing.  Looks like they have six months to get the paperwork straightened out, that seems like more than enough time.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 21, 2018, 04:38:18 AM
Almost the end of the year and no production of the new and improved Eagle or the promised Omni 7+.

Wonder what happened to the much touted resurgence of radio production?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N9FB on December 21, 2018, 07:06:09 AM
Almost the end of the year and no production of the new and improved Eagle or the promised Omni 7+.

Wonder what happened to the much touted resurgence of radio production?

1st: RKR Designs does not own Ten-Tec so your post is misplaced.

2nd: your fixation on a company you consider dead is noted with amusement.  

checking their website, one thing that HAS changed is that they are selling RX-331 and RX-340 commercial receivers thru their online store:

https://www.tentec.com/?page_id=1557 (https://www.tentec.com/?page_id=1557)

why not just give this a rest until you have bought one of these receivers and want to leave a "company review"?
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: WB8NUT on December 21, 2018, 08:00:34 AM
The subject list all three companies so the post is not misplaced at all.

Second, there is no fixation, but many posted after Dayton/Xenia this year that TenTec would be producing the Eagle+ (or whatever it is supposed to be called) at the end of the year. The Omni 7+ was supposed to be offered over a year ago with the parts that remained and the new panels. Still nothing.

Commercial receivers are great, but they are not amateur radio transceivers and of little use to radio amateurs. They have been selling them for sometime.

My interest is not in commercial receivers, but in amateur radio SSB/CW/Digital all band, fully capable transceivers.

Also hoping TT will come out with an SDR transceiver offering soon, but hopes are fading.
Title: RE: RKR Designs LLC / Ten-Tec / Alpha Amplifiers
Post by: N5KO on December 21, 2018, 08:33:18 AM
This thread has run its course and has been locked.