eHam
eHam Forums => Emergency Communications => Topic started by: KB8VUL on March 30, 2022, 07:28:06 PM
-
What things outside of having a portable HF/VHF/UHF rig or 'GO KIT' are you doing to prepare for an emergency situation and what situations are you preparing for?
Doesn't need to be directly ham related but has to involve some sort of technology.
And sorry, but don't what to hear about your prep's for the preppers out there. But keep the faith guys. With the prices of stuff right now it may be a good time to cycle the older stuff out and wait for the prices to fall to restock.
-
Troll Alert
-
And sorry, but don't what to hear about your prep's for the preppers out there.
You somehow incorrectly differentiate between preppers and your question. A difference with no distinction.
-
It could probably be argued that there are way more "preppers" better prepared than hams. My go-kit includes radios, but the intent isn't to support radio activities.
Mark K5LXP
Albuquerque, NM
-
I'm an ARES member so that if the SHTF at least I'll have some people I'm connected with. In my area, and most highly populated cities and suburbs the municipality is well prepared. I'll just relax and not worry to much about what might or might not happen. To me it seems that ham radio in my area, even if called to act will only have a very minor role.
-
And sorry, but don't what to hear about your prep's for the preppers out there.
You somehow incorrectly differentiate between preppers and your question. A difference with no distinction.
Yeah, He asks what you are prepping for, but doesn't want to hear about preppers? :-\ ::)
Well if the SHTF , I'm preparing to bend over and kiss my ass goodby!
-
Troll Alert
Thank You. And don't dare give your honest opinion least someone starts screaming POLITICS POLITICS !!! There is a plus side...it will wake up some of the ops who have been staring at their FT-8 screen all morning.
-
I keep in mind an earthquake or major weather event that takes down the grid. My baseline priority is really to just be able to get word out to my family 2000 miles away that I'm ok. I would do the same for neighbors and friends. This would be done via HF WINLINK. I use HF Winlink weekly and terminate with stations well outside my region, so I'm confident I could get the word out regarding me and my family's well being.
I keep my station equipped and ready to participate with my local ARES/ACS group; I don't anticipate much more than local VHF/UHF FM comms in that capacity.
I have generators, fuel, and portable antenna's to ensure I'm flexible and can adapt as needed.
-
I am preparing for the day when I can no longer prepare.
-
And sorry, but don't what to hear about your prep's for the preppers out there.
You somehow incorrectly differentiate between preppers and your question. A difference with no distinction.
What I meant was this is a radio forum. I don't want to hear about someones 200 pounds of rice and beans, 10,000 of water or the like.
As far as the Troll thing... not this time. Actually asking a serious question.
The group I am with are working on doing multisite microwave hops that will be carrying ARDEN, Emergency Weather data, radio links and a number of other things.
I was asking for idea's outside the "I have a box of radios and a battery." I have that. I have a tower site with racks of batteries, a 60KW generator and a stack of repeaters, and a BUNCH of radios tied to a dispatch console. Trying to get idea's of other stuff we can be doing.
-
Here in So. Cal. It would be for the big one. An earthquake that would kill power for the entire area for days, damage transportation routes, bridges and roads, buildings toppled which will lead to chaos.
What have I done? My daily driver, 4x4 Tacoma has VHF, UHF and HF so that’s covered. I keep a tote filled with a semi survival kit with water, some food, flashlight, first aid, rope and a bunch of just stuff, shoes, pants and the all-important TP. At home, again VHF, UHF & HF covered. A cheapo 900-watt 2 cycle generator, the travel trailer with 2 RV batteries and a 3500-watt generator. The garage freezer has 3 2 ½ gallon waters frozen in the bottom for water supply and keep the freezer cold longer.
When it finally hits it’s gona be bad. Mostly because the common person does not prepare and within 2 to 3 days let alone a week desperation will set in and it will turn to protection what you have. But that’s another story for another thread and another site.
Erik N6NWW
-
Running out of a steady supply of dark STOUT BEER and fun women, everything else beyond these two items is of minor importance.
-
Running out of a steady supply of dark STOUT BEER and fun women, everything else beyond these two items is of minor importance.
Or could that be stout women and fun beer?
-
The Amish are the best preppers.
1. Find strength in community
2. Live without electricity
3. Be self-sufficient for food
4. Keep your shelter simple
5. Clothing independence
6. Real "horse powered" cars
7. Personal protection (they're weak on this...)
(https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-3lAX7Hi8J5A/WIE9aFgQApI/AAAAAAAAIho/79z3PSv4vMsPmSakkC9Avf6BpAFAujPUgCLcB/s1600/Amish_Family_Buggy.jpg)
-
I live near the Lancaster County line in Pa. The Amish also make great neighbors. When you take the time to learn about them you will find among other positive things they are mostly hard-working and self-sufficient people.
-
I hate to give a serious answer, but...
I am surprised our electric grid has not been attacked (that we know of), so I think we should be preparing for an episode where large region(s) without power for extended periods. There have been hearings on this going back to the 1980s, but I don't know of any serious effort to address the weaknesses. Not debating this, just putting it out there as a real and probable disaster scenario.
This suggests we radio-preppers should have batteries to allow operation for at least a few hours a day ... two 15 amp hour Bioenno batteries. Also a way to charge them, first a generator and longer-term, 100 watt solar panel(s) and charge controller.
Also need to consider you will need both local - VHF as well as longer - HF communications.
I have HTs for VHF and an HF radio.
And yes, guns, ammo, food and water.
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-3lAX7Hi8J5A/WIE9aFgQApI/AAAAAAAAIho/79z3PSv4vMsPmSakkC9Avf6BpAFAujPUgCLcB/s1600/Amish_Family_Buggy.jpg[/img]
-
Preparing for one thing in particular is called gambling... And the house always wins. Prepping is not something for which you can pick and choose what you invest in. It is hard cold survival and implies learning and investing in things that interests us as well as those that do not. There are no aspects of prepping that you can favour or ignore. So preparing for one thing makes no sense. Either you prepare for everything, or you don't prepare. Now we all have preferences, and that's fine, but even if we favour certain parts, we can't ignore any.
Gil.
-
Prepping. When you think about it, you have to get down to the basics. What is "prepping for everything?"
Maslow's hierarchy of needs:
Self-actualization
Esteem
Love/belonging
Safety
Physiological
All you can really prep for is the bottom two. That translates into:
Food
Water
Fire
Shelter
...and protection against those who want to take the above away from you.
And in our case, only after that's met, then radio.
-
Right,,, but what I am asking is for things like you know there is a building that is typically used for a shelter. You have installed a wireless mesh to it connected to a satellite Internet connection for people to use in the shelter. You have build charging kiosks for people to charge their phones during a disaster, and maybe it's battery powered so it doesn't need utility to work. That sort of thing.
-
Maybe someone will be interested to know how everything looks during the war.
Radio.
Most likely you will be banned from transmitting. But you yourself will decide how to act according to the circumstances. If your safety will depend on being able to call for help, then it would be foolish not to use the radio for this. You must understand that in the occupied areas or in the area of combat operations your signal will be immediately detected and a mine can simply be sent to you. The most important benefit of radio is the ability to listen. Amateur radio chatter is the last thing you'll be interested in.
I was extremely interested in listening to two things - the conversations of russian pilots (yes, they use the AM band without encryption) and the local police and amateur repeaters that were used by the territorial defense.
Air raid alerts sometimes went off after the first explosions, and if you started to hear the pilots, that meant you had 10-15 minutes before they were overhead.
I think it is not necessary to explain the importance of knowing the situation in your area or on the next street.
You must understand that electricity can run out at any moment, and with it the Internet and local FM/AM radio stations. Therefore, you need a good little receiver to listen to the news on medium and short waves. This will help you make the right decision when you need to urgently leave your place.
So my base Icom IC-756pro3 transceiver was packed and goes under the bed the first day and I was listening to the little all-wave Icom IC-706mk2g. It was also ready to go with me in case of evacuation by car. For evacuation on foot, a home-made little QRP transceiver with built-in tuner and battery was prepared. The coil of wire and power are always important.
Food and water.
I always had a supply for 2 weeks and I was practically not affected by the fact that the stores immediately closed and nothing could be bought. I immediately decided for myself that if the situation does not improve in 2 weeks, then there is no point in staying there.
Shelter.
If you understand that you need shelter, then you need to leave. It will not help at all from rockets and bombs, and even more so from enemy soldiers who can easily get you out of there.
-
Some of you may not know this, but WLAD (US7IGN) is a solid voice of *real* advice when it comes to ham radio, emergency communications and "prepping."
He's not allowed to leave Ukraine and his family is now surviving in Krakow.
Most people are surprised to find out what they "think" is necessary is not what they "really" need when you start to feel the waves in the ground (like large ripples in a pond) from the large explosions happening within a mile of you. (I experienced this in Baghdad in 2003/2004.)
And Wlad is in a situation where "transmitting" can allow someone who's trying to kill you to actually paint a target on you from a long distance. (I did not participate in any ham radio in Iraq.)
From what I've seen/heard, we hams, here on this side of the pond, are woefully unprepared if our lives are turned upside down from any natural or man made disaster. In reality, as Wlad points out, ham radio's only real value to us during times of disaster is listening to what others are doing for our own situational awareness.
Thanks Wlad. Stay safe. (I need to change my call sign on this sight... WW5F)
-
Thank you Guy!
Probably worth adding that the psychological state is also very important. I spent the first few days with a friend who was very nervous. People tend to do stupid things in normal situations, but in a stressful situation, they just lose their heads. Therefore, the first thing I did I was forced him to listen to the radio and look for useful information on certain frequencies. He calmed down almost immediately. It distracted and captivated him. I stopped smelling the fear that had upset me.
Also, you will always have the confidence that you will be in touch with your closest friends or pass on the necessary information to your loved ones if you loss the communication. You just need to agree in advance how you will do it. For example, I told my wife that if I did not get in touch on the Internet or by phone within 24 hours, she should check my activity on the site http://www.reversebeacon.net/. If the problem is only in the loss of communication, then I can always send my call sign a couple of times and this will mean that I am at least alive.
-
Thank you Guy!
Probably worth adding that the psychological state is also very important. I spent the first few days with a friend who was very nervous. People tend to do stupid things in normal situations, but in a stressful situation, they just lose their heads. Therefore, the first thing I did I was forced him to listen to the radio and look for useful information on certain frequencies. He calmed down almost immediately. It distracted and captivated him. I stopped smelling the fear that had upset me.
Also, you will always have the confidence that you will be in touch with your closest friends or pass on the necessary information to your loved ones if you loss the communication. You just need to agree in advance how you will do it. For example, I told my wife that if I did not get in touch on the Internet or by phone within 24 hours, she should check my activity on the site http://www.reversebeacon.net/. If the problem is only in the loss of communication, then I can always send my call sign a couple of times and this will mean that I am at least alive.
Yes, it's been proven time and time again in dire situations, some people will literally freeze up, many will listen to anyone who sounds like they have authority, and a few will be level-headed enough to direct the people around them to safety.
And using reversebeacon.net as a means of sending a one-way "I'm OK" message is BRILLIANT! I'm going to remember that one!
-
Also, you will always have the confidence that you will be in touch with your closest friends or pass on the necessary information to your loved ones if you loss the communication. You just need to agree in advance how you will do it. For example, I told my wife that if I did not get in touch on the Internet or by phone within 24 hours, she should check my activity on the site http://www.reversebeacon.net/. If the problem is only in the loss of communication, then I can always send my call sign a couple of times and this will mean that I am at least alive.
And while ham radio COULD be a method, GMRS in the US is also a viable means for the first 48 hours as well. And the nice thing with it is you get the license and everyone in the family is covered to use the radios. So you either put up a repeater with 48 hours of battery backup, or you find one someone else has and you help him out with the battery part so there is something there. Now NOTHING is 100% reliable, But that being said, my setup is on an AT&T tower that is rated for 10 PSI with the horns on it. And while that's not a nuclear blast, it's gonna take an F1 tornado and an F3 off the side. you start talking F4 and nothing sticking out of the ground stays up for the most part. Tie the top of the antenna into the structure and it's pretty stable. Put one of the zero gain UHF ground planes on it that were used for Air Force One communications that were rated for a 600 MPH wind with the proper mount and it will not talk far, but it will be there through most disasters.
-
Years ago I had a couple field service guys that worked for me from upstate NY. An ice storm that took down the utility poles caused their rural homes to be without power for several weeks!
I assume an upset that would disable power and transport for several days or weeks.
This means I need a reliable source of water, stored food, fuel for heating and cooking, a modest off grid power supply, and some communications capability. Also a way to secure my resources if the upset is more than a few days.
All of those things can be acquired without a significant investment if the limit of the upset is weeks. Water and stored food can just be a somewhat larger than average pantry. Lots of options for heating and cooking fuel. A typical HF/VHF ham station with a couple deep cycle batteries would have everything needed with the possible exception of a NVIS antenna which would be easily implemented.
If the scenario is an upset that lasts for months a much greater effort is required.
-
Running out of a steady supply of dark STOUT BEER and fun women, everything else beyond these two items is of minor importance.
Or could that be stout women and fun beer?
Nothing else matters beyond these two items and I'm happy to report that there is no shortage of any of these two critical items here in the Pacifist Northwest.
So I'm still a happy camper for sure and nothing else matters when these two items are still available.
When one or both of these critical items is in short supply then WE WILL BE ROYALLY DOOMED!
-
If the scenario is an upset that lasts for months a much greater effort is required.
There is much wisdom here. What, and how, you "prep" has to do with what you are going to prepare for, and how long it lasts.
"Preparing for everything, for months" is great if you can do it. But what's realistic? What's likely to actually happen? Can you afford to buy the right property and invest in a significant infrastructure on it?
If there is an EMP event, I submit it is likely that even the most sturdy "prepper" is going to be hurting. All kinds of critical infrastructure is likely to be wiped out. The odds of not having something you need (water, medicine) is fairly great. Kudos if you can out-think everything. But nobody in the US has been put to that test. Ever.
Anything else is likely to be regional; even war, to an extent. As long as you can drive -- or even walk -- to somewhere else, you can get by until things improve.
In my case, we had two events in my lifetime. One was a devastating flood. But, it was hit and miss. I lived on the high ground and was largely unaffected. I even had power. Thousands were not. But, they went to Red Cross shelters and within a week, things were normal enough that everyone could go home. Including folks like me that volunteered a bit.
In the other case, we had a freak accident that crippled the local AC power for about three days. The whole town was affected, about 100,000 people.
Well, we all ate up our refrigerated stuff pretty fast. But, as long as you could drive, or even walk, to the next county, your life was more or less normal. You could get food, water, whatever you needed.
For my two actual events, then, all I needed for "prep" was a bank account with a little cash in it. And, barely that. I didn't even have to leave home. Maybe a working bicycle is the best prep for anything short of EMP?
Some of this is a health statement. If I were diabetic or needed dialysis, a lot of these scenarios, the ones involving very long term outages means I have to refugee somewhere fast or else simply die. If you are a regular person, then a six month shelter is fine; you can stand having your generator break down for a day or two. But, if you have problems like diabetes or dialysis, your margin for error is much less. Being a refugee makes a lot more sense if it is available to you.
To me, "prepping" is about a situation so dire that being a refugee is impossible. Being a refugee really sucks -- you have to depend on the kindness (however well or ill organized) of strangers. But, it seems to work surprisingly well.
The only scenario I can identify that probably doesn't allow one to be a refugee is the EMP event and I'm dubious if anyone can prepare well enough for that one. All you need to do is neglect one thing -- or have it spoil or something -- and you're no better off than anyone else. But, it's a free country -- try if it is important to you.
-
Preparing for one thing in particular is called gambling... And the house always wins. Prepping is not something for which you can pick and choose what you invest in. It is hard cold survival and implies learning and investing in things that interests us as well as those that do not. There are no aspects of prepping that you can favour or ignore. So preparing for one thing makes no sense. Either you prepare for everything, or you don't prepare. Now we all have preferences, and that's fine, but even if we favour certain parts, we can't ignore any.
Gil.
What makes the most sense for me is prepping for the most likely scenarios in your region of the country. I don't concur with the "all or nothing" approach. I do what I can for the most likely events.
Being in Florida, the most likely disaster is hurricanes. Besides that, I suspect an EMP or cyber attack on the grid is the next most likely possibility. No, most of my "stuff" is not hardened, although I do have HTs in ammo cans. With power out for a week, I suspect the fuel to generate power to sewage lift stations and water plants would run out unless the county is better prepared than I suspect. Those of you who have well and septic have fewer worries. You just need backup power that will last the duration.
For the ultimate SHTF situation nationwide...a farm, cattle, a crew, and good defense. But the odds for that happening compared to a Cat 4 hurricane are much slimmer. And the part of Florida I'm in even a Cat 4 hasn't occurred in several decades.
-
Prepper motto, save the last bullet for yourself.
-
Something more mundane....summer storms in our rural area (where 20 acre lots are tiny).
When the summer storms hit, flash flooding closes roads for 4 or 5 hours. Often the electricity also goes out for 4 to 48 hours. The phone company has decided that their gear along the street does not need battery backup, so the phone service is out as long as the power is out.
So...electric-phone-road problems at the same time.
-
I prepare for everything, because really it doesn’t matter what the potential disaster is, the steps needed to prepare are the same. I keep a month or two of food on hand, a generator to provide lights and water from my well, a means of communication (ham radio is actually secondary, a portable am/fm/wx radio generally more useful), and a way to heat my house without electricity. I’ve lost power for over a week twice since I’ve lived here in 5 years. It was a slight inconvenience. In case of major disaster I just need to be prepared enough to not require any immediate assistance so the government agencies’ limited resources can go to those who really need it. It’s not rocket science, and you don’t need doomsday prepper levels of crap.
-
Lunch es a nap! ;)
-
Right,,, but what I am asking is for things like you know there is a building that is typically used for a shelter. You have installed a wireless mesh to it connected to a satellite Internet connection for people to use in the shelter. You have build charging kiosks for people to charge their phones during a disaster, and maybe it's battery powered so it doesn't need utility to work. That sort of thing.
Get a satphone. Ham radio in an emergency is about as useful as a group of flying unicorns
-
Satellite phone? Sorry... Can't help myself. Don't take this the wrong way. HA HA HA HA! It'll be just as useful as GPS if the SHTF.
Practical prepping today has to do with what's going to happen *this* winter and the next couple of years.
To be honest, I've been furiously *simplifying* lately. I should be where I want to be by the end of this year.
Good luck.
-
So preparing for one thing makes no sense. Either you prepare for everything, or you don't prepare.
Bluntly put, this is nonsense. Everyone has a budget. Everyone has an idea of what is likely and even if the unlikely happens, what can be done about it.
For instance, an EMP event would be crippling. Maybe you think you can sit in your shelter with your six month food supply, but what then?
You got a horse, seed, 40 acres, and a plow?
I don't care if you were prescient enough to afford a 1960s or earlier car. You won't be getting gasoline to run it for years after. Not if the EMP event is really crippling (and designed to be by our enemy, whomever that is).
I hope you have some sort of independent source of heat because you aren't getting coal, fuel oil, or natural gas, either.
To be really prepped for an EMP event of sufficient severity is to basically replicate the entirely 19th century farmer lifestyle indefinitely. All ahead of time.
Or, you could admit you haven't the budget or the skill for that and make an economic decision to prep for something lesser.
Me, I don't care what you do or don't do. It's a free country. Do what you think best. But, there are events that are well beyond "prepping" or for which "prepping" requires, taken seriously, a scale of preparation that amounts to an entirely different life, one for which you would redundantly pay for, physical "plant, property taxes and all. I don't think most of us are up for that. But, we might decide we could be ready for lesser events -- extended outages due to natural disaster, perhaps.
Or, you could assume that the enemy is kind or somehow, it only takes three or six months to scrounge together a power grid and a transportation system after such a thing. That, too, would limit the prepper budget.
But to prepare for a dark ages level event -- that is really substantial. And far beyond what I have heard most "preppers" ever discuss.
-
The most important things are heat, food, tea, light and radio. I am the happiest person in the world as long as I still have it every day. And I don't give a sh*t about those f***g missiles.