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Author Topic: The Hazard of Knowledge  (Read 5300 times)
N2EY
Member

Posts: 4457




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« Reply #30 on: November 20, 2017, 07:41:09 AM »

Ah yes, another bash-the-engineers and down-with-education thread.

So typical.

A question:

How many of you who are putting down engineers have and use 100% homebrew stations that you designed from scratch? I don't mean kits, nor restored stuff - I mean a complete station that YOU designed and built.

And I mean today - not decades ago. How many of you are on the air, today, with such stations?

Here's a challenge:

Design an HF amplifier, start to finish, using a pair of 3-500Z tubes, 160 through 10 meters (not including 60 or 30 meters). Design from scratch; do not just copy existing designs. Draw up detailed mechanical (including PC layout) and electrical plans. Show ALL calculations - power supply, tuned circuits, etc. Describe and justify why each design choice was made. Include a bill of material and cost estimate. All parts must be currently available new in quantity, either from stock or custom made. Final result must meet all FCC and UL requirements.

How many of those of you who bash engineers could even begin to do that?

----

And consider:

Often "the engineers" who design something are not in control of the design. Often they are in situations such as:

- Having to use certain parts, even though better choices exist.

- Having to accommodate what the manufacturing folks can make.

- Having to meet a certain price point.

- Having to meet a certain schedule.

- Having to meet requirements that are not obvious (size, weight, compatibility with other products, decisions by the top brass that are clearly bad but cannot be changed).

"Nothing is ever difficult for the person who doesn't have to do the work"

73 de Jim, N2EY
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K9MHZ
Member

Posts: 1452




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« Reply #31 on: November 20, 2017, 08:13:45 AM »

Jim, seriously....kind of lighthearted, self-deprecated discussion, don’t you think?  

You’re being way, way too literal...you know, like an engineer. (Sorry!)

Truly bashing engineers on here would be like complaining about sand at a beach.

Cheers,
Brad
(BSAE)
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K8AXW
Member

Posts: 6378




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« Reply #32 on: November 20, 2017, 09:21:22 AM »

Jim....First of all the brackets for the microwave were very similar but they just put the damn holes in a different place! 

I'm smart enough to understand "bean counters" and the like and I also understand that engineers don't have the last word on their designs.

Perhaps I am being OVERLY critical of engineers because it's been my experience for 40 years that working for and around engineers was responsible for many, many headaches!

I also understand that engineers are the ones who has made the world as it is today.

I'm simply talking about the stupid stuff that is being sold with problems that leaves uneducated people like me standing there scratching my head!  Like having to unbolt the rear engine mounts, jacking the engine up so the last spark plug can be changed which in turn jacks up the tune-up costs by a factor of 3. 

You can't tell me that something like this or a weak light bulb gets past a design engineer or is over ridden by middle management!
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W1VT
Member

Posts: 2529




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« Reply #33 on: November 20, 2017, 11:47:03 AM »

I also have a built in microwave that failed, so I decided it was worth repairing.  Turns out it just needed a new HV capacitor.

Zack W1VT
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N2MG
Administrator

Posts: 10058



« Reply #34 on: November 20, 2017, 01:27:12 PM »

Sometimes the seemingly arbitrary design changes subtly improve reliability or meet new regulations.

Annoying: object designed to hang on a wall and has mounting apparatus that doesn't support 16" on-center.

Read this ages ago:  https://www.amazon.com/Design-Everyday-Things-Donald-Norman/dp/1452654123
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KM1H
Member

Posts: 2644




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« Reply #35 on: November 20, 2017, 02:44:22 PM »

I seriously doubt if any EE from the current crop could design and build a transceiver or separates that could compare to even a 40 year old Drake C Line.

Advance to SS and try emulating a Drake TR-7.

Go modern and try an IC-7300.

Quality 80-10M CW/SSB homebrew was pretty much gone by the 70's. Sure there was a lot of limited performance stuff built with surplus or junkyard parts but not something to make 5 Band DXCC Honor Roll or be competitive in an all band contest.

Some may be happy to stay on a few bands on CW and diddle around with a straight key which is their choice but I grew out of that in the early 60's and discovered a big wide world of radio to play in. Im never bored either Grin Roll Eyes

 Carl
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VE7DQ
Member

Posts: 223




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« Reply #36 on: November 20, 2017, 03:56:26 PM »

Something that was explained to me many, many years ago:

An engineer is someone that knows more and more about less and less until he knows absolutely everything about nothing.

A technician, OTOH, knows less and less about more and more until he knows absolutely nothing about everything.

I fall into the latter category!   Grin
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KB2WIG
Member

Posts: 361




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« Reply #37 on: November 20, 2017, 05:59:05 PM »



Jim,all will be explained.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idiocracy




klc
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N8AUC
Member

Posts: 318




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« Reply #38 on: November 20, 2017, 07:29:48 PM »

Having worked as an EE, and now doing software development and data analysis, it seems to me that the
problem ultimately comes down to this....

"We the willing, led by the unknowing, have been doing so much with so little, for so long, that we are now
qualified to absolutely everything with absolutely nothing."

And once you get enough dead weight, expensive overhead managers around, this quote (allegedly attributed
to the Israeli Air Force) seems to apply: "Stability is only truly achieved when you spend all your time doing
nothing but reporting on the nothing you're doing."

73 de N8AUC
Eric
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WW7KE
Member

Posts: 607




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« Reply #39 on: November 20, 2017, 07:46:12 PM »

Having worked as an EE, and now doing software development and data analysis, it seems to me that the
problem ultimately comes down to this....

"We the willing, led by the unknowing, have been doing so much with so little, for so long, that we are now qualified to absolutely everything with absolutely nothing."

That was pretty much our company slogan when I worked at a defense plant in the 1980s.

Quote
And once you get enough dead weight, expensive overhead managers around, this quote (allegedly attributed to the Israeli Air Force) seems to apply: "Stability is only truly achieved when you spend all your time doing nothing but reporting on the nothing you're doing."

Another defense industry truism.  A corollary was "Reporting to management that we were achieving non-negative headway."  In triplicate.

But it all came down to four simple words:  "You want it when?" Grin
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He speaks fluent PSK31...  One QSO with him earns you 5BDXCC...  His Wouff Hong has two Wouffs... Hiram Percy Maxim called HIM "The Old Man..."  He is... The Most Interesting Ham In The World!
K9MHZ
Member

Posts: 1452




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« Reply #40 on: November 21, 2017, 07:11:37 AM »

....In triplicate...

Oh man, you nailed it with this.  First thing I noticed when starting with an employer that actually cared about efficiency was their disdain for costly, unproductive bureaucratic activity.  They have several metrics..."is there value added to this bureaucratic activity?" being the most heard.  How refreshing after several decades serving with Uncle Sam, where the mindless bureaucratic machine feeds on itself, churns out more, and consumes resources.

 
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KC8KTN
Member

Posts: 1398


WWW

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« Reply #41 on: November 22, 2017, 12:54:00 AM »

 Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin

I feel somedays I am to smart for my own good. I have also noticed JEALOUSY. Just saying..73ssss
I will experiance JEALOUSY when I start using my Icom 7300 the Bestus radio with AWESOME Receive and Awesome AUDIO. 10-4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zdz8WlCqmCs&list=FLVdsQNtCrwd6ZgYrTfXBTBA&index=30
« Last Edit: November 22, 2017, 12:57:20 AM by KC8KTN » Logged
WZ7U
Member

Posts: 598




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« Reply #42 on: November 22, 2017, 06:23:15 PM »

Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin

I feel somedays I am to smart for my own good. I have also noticed JEALOUSY. Just saying..73ssss
I will experiance JEALOUSY when I start using my Icom 7300 the Bestus radio with AWESOME Receive and Awesome AUDIO. 10-4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zdz8WlCqmCs&list=FLVdsQNtCrwd6ZgYrTfXBTBA&index=30

This isn't one of those days you should get to experience derailing a thread
« Last Edit: November 22, 2017, 06:26:46 PM by WZ7U » Logged

================================================
WZ7U ~ originating from CN86jc +/-

Yet another imperfect being created by THE perfect God. Thank you Jesus!
N0YXB
Member

Posts: 1141




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« Reply #43 on: November 22, 2017, 09:33:25 PM »

Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin

I feel somedays I am to smart for my own good. I have also noticed JEALOUSY. Just saying..73ssss
I will experiance JEALOUSY when I start using my Icom 7300 the Bestus radio with AWESOME Receive and Awesome AUDIO. 10-4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zdz8WlCqmCs&list=FLVdsQNtCrwd6ZgYrTfXBTBA&index=30

This isn't one of those days you should get to experience derailing a thread

He seems to be trying though.
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WZ7U
Member

Posts: 598




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« Reply #44 on: November 22, 2017, 10:20:41 PM »

Geez, give that guy one nice thread and look how he acts...

Guys like him are hazardous with a little knowledge it seems.
Logged

================================================
WZ7U ~ originating from CN86jc +/-

Yet another imperfect being created by THE perfect God. Thank you Jesus!
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