Call Search
     

New to Ham Radio?
My Profile

Community
Articles
Forums
News
Reviews
Friends Remembered
Strays
Survey Question

Operating
Contesting
DX Cluster Spots
Propagation

Resources
Calendar
Classifieds
Ham Exams
Ham Links
List Archives
News Articles
Product Reviews
QSL Managers

Site Info
eHam Help (FAQ)
Support the site
The eHam Team
Advertising Info
Vision Statement
About eHam.net

donate to eham
   Home   Help Search  
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 Next   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: QRP Frequencies -- What's the solution?  (Read 5357 times)
VK5EEE
Member

Posts: 1179




Ignore
« on: November 17, 2017, 02:37:59 AM »

I think LONG AGO the QRO stations have forgotten and don't care about QRP and ride rough shod over all QRP which they don't hear...
On 30m there is 10106 and 10116, I think the latter more often used by QRP, but DX pile up "5NN" up use and/or clobber both frequencies.

VK9MA was destroying 10116 for an entire weekend, and now TO2SP is doing his best too. VK2WP and myself had a 2-way QRP solid for over a  half hour during which TO2SP came up but in spite of perhaps 5kW and a 19element log periodic, perhaps was pointed at USA so we were OK.

But what do those of you who use QRP suggest as a solution because it sure is not nice to not have quiet frequencies that are respected for QRP use.

3560, 7030, 14060, it's the same situation.

I only note that almost everyone especially the 5NN "DX Pedo Terrorists" use nice round .000 Hz frequencies, but of course the pile ups clobber everyone above them. I note that generally a HALF kHz above DX is free, the pile ups start at 1kHz above, and go all the way up to 30kHz or so above in worst cases. So we could simply look for the DX Pedo of the day and go half kHz above or below, but, I can tell you now having tried this, it does not work, because Frequency Cop UNLID will come up without C/S and insult your QRP for making "DQRM".

The only other permanent solution I can think of is to use a frequency at the very BOTTOM end of the band or the very TOP end of the band (SSB), or even better, OUTSIDE the band. If you're operating QRP portable, these days the regimes do not care two hoots about you, nor do they care if a 5kW SSB station is operating on 14350 USB, so they sure as hell won't care if a QRP station uses 13999 and says "UP 2".

In Australia, the regime even assigns our exclusive amateur frequencies to non-amateur services on e.g. 7000, 14000, 21000, 28000, 29700 kHz, so they clearly in Australia do not believe in the ITU regulations regarding frequency management and band spectrum allocations.

But that's me and y'all know I think outside the box and am not diplomatic on such issues, so what is the solution that you can think of?

For those who may not be familiar with QRP, and I myself have not done QRP since a long time ago when I was sometimes a QRP DXer e.g. operating 2W from ST at one point for many months until I got a stronger station, here are a few things to consider before replying, I think:

1) QRP stations are often portable and often operate from locations where there is NO noise at all. They can thus hear signals even on 40m and 30m with RST 529.

2) Thus two-way QRP contacts even between VK and EU via Long Path are easily possible, but, those contacts are sometimes not even heard by other stations due to S5-S9 local noise levels.

3) QRP contacts are destroyed not by the terrible hash of noise that destroys so many QRO contacts, but by QRO stations that cannot hear the QRP either due to the power difference and/or the noise level differences.

THIS are some of the powerful reasons why QRP frequencies are one of the very few actually specified and mentioned in the IARU Band Plans.

YET, clearly DX Pedos and their follower 5NN-philes care not one iota, nor one IOTA. I don't think 1,000 QRP stations can gather to make a voice heard against 10,000 QRO stations. I don't think QRP can make the QRO move and do the right thing. QRP need to come up with their own solution.

Shifting a little above and below those "centre of activity" frequencies would clearly be the logical first option, but, what about when the entire portion is clobbered for days and nights on end by the DX terrorists? Migrate to the bottom, top, or beyond the band edge?!

No crimes were committed in the publication of this opinion. Theories are being discussed in the hypothetical and hyper theatrical.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 02:40:02 AM by VK5EEE » Logged

Long Live Real Human CW and wishing you many happy CW QSO - 77 - CW Forever

Support CW and join CW clubs. QTT: FIST#1124, HSC#1437, UFT#728, RCWC#982, SKCC#15007, CWOPS#1714, 30CW#1,
W1JKA
Member

Posts: 2089




Ignore
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2017, 05:01:21 AM »

The easiest thing for me is changing bands/frequencies or antenna direction.
Logged
W1VT
Member

Posts: 2529




Ignore
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2017, 05:55:51 AM »

Tuning up and down the band until you hear someone calling CQ QRP?  Or watching the panadapter for a nice quiet spot and calling CQ yourself?
Logged
VK5EEE
Member

Posts: 1179




Ignore
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2017, 06:36:09 AM »

Perhaps, would be nice though if those were respected areas like they used to be... I guess that's wishing too much when everything is turning into 5NN UP unlimited, unspecified split and everyone else is then simply collateral damage.
Logged

Long Live Real Human CW and wishing you many happy CW QSO - 77 - CW Forever

Support CW and join CW clubs. QTT: FIST#1124, HSC#1437, UFT#728, RCWC#982, SKCC#15007, CWOPS#1714, 30CW#1,
K8AXW
Member

Posts: 6382




Ignore
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2017, 10:15:59 AM »

Let's see...we have the amateur bands.  The amateur bands are split up into SSB and CW....then the digital crowd demanded or at least expected their own 'area' of operation. Oh yes, let's not forget the foreign and US portions of some bands.

Now, certain frequencies are set aside for QRP and if you dare tread on these frequencies with more than 5w you hear the whining.

What ever happened to ham radio when everyone got on with whatever they wanted, could afford or simply wanted to use and had at it?

This whole thing is taking on the ridiculous aspect of our colleges and universities providing "safe/comfort rooms" and ponies to pet for comfort to those who are in a state of shock because Hillary lost the election.

Perhaps this would be a good time to start campaigning a set of QLF frequencies....for those who are CW handicapped and can send code only with their left foot?



Logged
K0UA
Member

Posts: 1465




Ignore
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2017, 11:09:08 AM »

Perhaps, would be nice though if those were respected areas like they used to be... I guess that's wishing too much when everything is turning into 5NN UP unlimited, unspecified split and everyone else is then simply collateral damage.

Whats wrong with 5NN UP?   Just because you don't like it doesn't mean that others don't.  Your in a very small minority.  There is nothing wrong with your operation, just as there is nothing wrong with DXpedition activities.  Get over it. And get over yourself.   "DX pedo Terrorist" indeed.  Harumph.
Logged
K3STX
Member

Posts: 1593




Ignore
« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2017, 11:24:46 AM »

This is silly. I think the idea of "reserved" frequencies is stupid. If I am there first it is MY frequency till I leave. Maybe a Hurricane Net frequency or something important might be an exception, but "stay off 7030 kc unless you are QRP" or "get your CW signal off of 7075 because that is a "reserved" digital frequency" (as has happened to me) is just whining. I operate QRP quite a bit and I try to make contacts just like everyone else. I just CHOOSE to make my life a bit more difficult. Having frequencies "reserved" cheapens the QRP experience (at least to me).

paul
Logged
K5LXP
Member

Posts: 5342


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2017, 04:53:41 PM »

"It sure is not nice" - ?  Time to put on the big boy pants.  It will make the achievement that much sweeter.

Mark K5LXP
Albuquerque, NM

Logged
VK5EEE
Member

Posts: 1179




Ignore
« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2017, 06:13:11 PM »

Oh I lost a nice long post in error, what a shame... ahh well, in brief, the Emperor has no clothes.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 06:31:50 PM by VK5EEE » Logged

Long Live Real Human CW and wishing you many happy CW QSO - 77 - CW Forever

Support CW and join CW clubs. QTT: FIST#1124, HSC#1437, UFT#728, RCWC#982, SKCC#15007, CWOPS#1714, 30CW#1,
VK5EEE
Member

Posts: 1179




Ignore
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2017, 06:35:04 PM »

"It sure is not nice" - ?  Time to put on the big boy pants.  It will make the achievement that much sweeter.

Mark K5LXP
Albuquerque, NM


Which is why P5 has decided to go QRO on your sound advice.
Logged

Long Live Real Human CW and wishing you many happy CW QSO - 77 - CW Forever

Support CW and join CW clubs. QTT: FIST#1124, HSC#1437, UFT#728, RCWC#982, SKCC#15007, CWOPS#1714, 30CW#1,
VK5EEE
Member

Posts: 1179




Ignore
« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2017, 06:37:40 PM »

K3STX your being silly. No one is asking you not to use a frequency. QRP CoA are in the band plan for several good reasons, including XTAL home brew very low power. We're asking you to respect that by, if you operate as a DX Pedo (big gun not good one-man-band or team REAL DX peditions) don't park one kHz below QRP frequency and say UP UP. Why would you need to do that?!
Logged

Long Live Real Human CW and wishing you many happy CW QSO - 77 - CW Forever

Support CW and join CW clubs. QTT: FIST#1124, HSC#1437, UFT#728, RCWC#982, SKCC#15007, CWOPS#1714, 30CW#1,
VK5EEE
Member

Posts: 1179




Ignore
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2017, 06:40:27 PM »

Tuning up and down the band until you hear someone calling CQ QRP?  Or watching the panadapter for a nice quiet spot and calling CQ yourself?
Yes, if you have a pandapter and/or a VFO, but many have XTAL QRP or can vary the frequency only slightly. And the rest of us, we like to have somewhere with more success to meet.
Logged

Long Live Real Human CW and wishing you many happy CW QSO - 77 - CW Forever

Support CW and join CW clubs. QTT: FIST#1124, HSC#1437, UFT#728, RCWC#982, SKCC#15007, CWOPS#1714, 30CW#1,
VK5EEE
Member

Posts: 1179




Ignore
« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2017, 06:42:31 PM »

The easiest thing for me is changing bands/frequencies or antenna direction.

The best thinking seems to come from W1 land today, two sensible comments, but still not a solution. Eg. many of us don't have antennas to change, nor frequencies, let alone bands, when QRP /P or even at home.
Logged

Long Live Real Human CW and wishing you many happy CW QSO - 77 - CW Forever

Support CW and join CW clubs. QTT: FIST#1124, HSC#1437, UFT#728, RCWC#982, SKCC#15007, CWOPS#1714, 30CW#1,
VK5EEE
Member

Posts: 1179




Ignore
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2017, 06:55:00 PM »

I think the solution is an upcoming DX PEDITION (not a DX Pedo Terrori$t operation) from P5 with QRP and non split. This may show how the elephants stampeding are their own worst enemy.

Another solution is for the ants to cause the elephants to stampede by the ants doing the right things, and then when the big elephant leader of the herd is on the ground, the ants can do as they please with it.

It's simple solution and eventually the DX Pedos will realise that too many people are fed up with the unlimited QRM. Here is how it goes:

QRP station on QRP DX QSO is swamped by QRO LID who don't do as legally required: they don't listen on their TX frequency. The DX Pedo says UP UP and the DX Pedo Philes create the Piles UP. And swamp us QRP.

Now, as we have to tell the DX Pedo-philes station(s) that are causing QRM to QSY, we have go to the DX Pedo Terrorist frequency as that is where they are listening and we have to ask the specific stations causing the QRM to please QSY.

(Un)fortunately the by product is since DX Pedo-philes have brain defects, they go QRO right on top of the DX Pedo Terrorist without callsigns they start saying LID QSY LID QSY UP UP UP and then the elephants have stampeded.

Before long, after all those QRP that suffered QRM have come on and requested the various stations to QSY, the big elephant is lying on the ground, and not only the QRP now have their band back, but the elephants are all fighting among themselves.

I think this is the best legal solution to the entire problem: exercise your right to inform the interfering station who is not listening on their own frequency, that they are causing QRM, with the by product being that the elephant falls.

When enough DX-Pedo-terrorist-elephants have fallen they will come up with their own rescue solution: avoid the QRP frequencies, specify their QSX, use a reasonable split of 200 to 400 Hz, use correct techniques, stop using the Internet, change tactics (wait for VK5EEE/P5 to show how it is done, secrets held in reserve for the big one), write a new "DX Code" etc.

It'll happen as the ants are coming and they're going to do what they do best. CW and QRP is in revival. Pedo$ will soon be ostracised on amateur radio frequencies as much as they are elsewhere. Finally, a REAL DXCC certificate will reclaim the pride and skill required to achieve it, and the "DXCC" will not be worth the paper it is written on, as it has already become devalued by rampant cheating.
Logged

Long Live Real Human CW and wishing you many happy CW QSO - 77 - CW Forever

Support CW and join CW clubs. QTT: FIST#1124, HSC#1437, UFT#728, RCWC#982, SKCC#15007, CWOPS#1714, 30CW#1,
VK5EEE
Member

Posts: 1179




Ignore
« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2017, 07:26:27 PM »

Logged

Long Live Real Human CW and wishing you many happy CW QSO - 77 - CW Forever

Support CW and join CW clubs. QTT: FIST#1124, HSC#1437, UFT#728, RCWC#982, SKCC#15007, CWOPS#1714, 30CW#1,
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 Next   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!