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Author Topic: Giving up on Linux  (Read 39053 times)
W2BLC
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« on: February 29, 2016, 08:04:21 AM »

For many months I have been trying to convert to Linux Mint - a very good Linux distribution. However, it has become abundantly clear that Linux is just not for me There are several programs that I use on a daily basis - including HRD - that have no comparables available for Linux.

The final straw came with the wasted afternoon trying to get my PCI serial board to operate under Linux. So easy with Windows - just install and turn the computer on. It finds and installs the drivers for you and all is good.

I believe that if anything can be done easily - it will not be found on Linux.

So, I have returned to Windows - but, not for the lack of trying. If all you want to do is browse, email, Skype,and office work - then Linux will work well for you. Most other things are way too difficult for the average user.

Bill W2BLC

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K5UNX
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« Reply #1 on: February 29, 2016, 08:11:27 AM »

That's an experience that many have . . . The applications should dictate what OS is good for you. It doesn't matter if its Windows or Linux or whatever, it's about the applications you need.
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K7EXJ
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« Reply #2 on: February 29, 2016, 08:22:45 AM »

FLdigi works well on Linux as does WSJT-X.  CQRlog and LOTW (TQSL) also work well on Linux. Many of these are available via "apt-get install" command.

Kubuntu is a distribution I like, too. But my XYL uses Mint with no more issues than she has on Windows.

Linux is far more secure than Windows but it's not for everyone. And it does take some time (and searching on Google) to get everything working right, sometimes.

« Last Edit: February 29, 2016, 08:28:32 AM by K7EXJ » Logged

73s de K7EXJ
Craig Smiley
KQ9J
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« Reply #3 on: February 29, 2016, 08:30:21 AM »

Have used one flavor or another of Linux since around 1999 on my shack and home computers. Have used Linux Mint since about 2010. Xlog for logging, FLdigi for digital. I simply have not had any need to run anything else. Seriously, it does everything I need. I would never buy software that didn't run on Linux. I suppose if I absolutely had to have some software package that only came for Win or Mac I would have to reconsider, but I haven't found any need for it yet. I would probably just install the Windows in a VM anyway.

To each his or her own.
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W8JX
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« Reply #4 on: February 29, 2016, 08:30:38 AM »

Some want to believe that Linux is the holy grail and the answer to Windows haters but when reality sets in, unless you are wearing rose colored glasses, you will see that independent of how stable Linux may be, it has VERY VERY limited application support. Some will quickly claim that many businesses use it but they also only use a few applications and those are usually also custom written for their needs. For home users selection is very limited and pales badly to Windows and even Apple at times.
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Ham since 1969....  Old School 20wpm REAL Extra Class..
K7EXJ
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« Reply #5 on: February 29, 2016, 08:53:11 AM »

If you absolutely HAVE to use WIndows programs then stay with Windows. But I would not use it on the Internet. Especially not Outlook or Internet Explorer.

As far as security, here is what PCWorld has to say on the matter of Linux versus Windows security (and remember that PCWorld is a Windows-focused publisher):

http://www.pcworld.com/article/202452/why_linux_is_more_secure_than_windows.html
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73s de K7EXJ
Craig Smiley
K5UNX
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« Reply #6 on: February 29, 2016, 08:54:02 AM »

Some want to believe that Linux is the holy grail and the answer to Windows haters but when reality sets in, unless you are wearing rose colored glasses, you will see that independent of how stable Linux may be, it has VERY VERY limited application support. Some will quickly claim that many businesses use it but they also only use a few applications and those are usually also custom written for their needs. For home users selection is very limited and pales badly to Windows and even Apple at times.

Businesses use a ton of Linux . . . servers that is. I am not away of many that use desktop Linux.
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K7MEM
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« Reply #7 on: February 29, 2016, 09:10:48 AM »

Yes, Linux is not for everyone. Although, it is interesting to learn what makes it tick. I have found that its best to just use what ever OS you need for the software you want to use.

I currently use Window 10 on everything I have, but I worked as the lead Unix administrator for 30 years, or more, and managed thousands of Unix systems. I started years before Linux existed. Early on, I was quite the Unix bigot. No one could convince me that Microsoft products were good for anything. But after years of working with the IT guys that handled the PCs, and learning a lot more about PCs, I realized the importance of multiple platforms.

Just use whatever works.
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Martin - K7MEM
http://www.k7mem.com
K7EXJ
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« Reply #8 on: February 29, 2016, 09:26:57 AM »

The easiest way to try Linux for amateur radio is to burn a copy of Andy's Ham Radio for Linux and just run it from the DVD drive. You don't have to "install" anything and a lot of the major ham radio applications are right there to use (FLdigi, for instance); Andy's runs completely in RAM and will not affect your installed operating system. (However Andy's will also not "remember" your settings, either - unless you install it.)

https://sourceforge.net/projects/kb1oiq-andysham/

This was the first cut I made at using my old FT-767GX with FLdigi and CAT controls. It was pretty easy with the rig control configurations for the late 1980s transceiver right there to select. Andy's does allow you to install it to a HD but I found that to be somewhat limiting (especially when it came to installing WSJT-X) and I moved to Kubuntu.

JX's contention that Linux has a limited selection of applications is utter and complete BS. A simple Google search "linux apps" will reveal just how clueless he is. But they are not WIndows apps. Linux is a different paradigm than WIndows and if you cannot adjust to that then you will by stymied at every turn.

Wine is a way to run some Windows apps under Linux and it is also possible to run a Virtual Machine version of WIndows inside a Linux OS.

Andy's is an easy and relatively painless way to try Linux and ham radio. Once you do adjust to the Linux methodology you will find a much larger world of software that allows you far greater control over your computer than you ever could have imagined with Windows.



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73s de K7EXJ
Craig Smiley
K5UNX
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« Reply #9 on: February 29, 2016, 09:42:24 AM »

Another Linux vs Windows thread . . . same stuff another day. . . . There is not a one size for everyone operating system, just like there is not a one for all ham radio logging app.
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WW7KE
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Posts: 909




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« Reply #10 on: February 29, 2016, 10:41:57 AM »

For many months I have been trying to convert to Linux Mint - a very good Linux distribution. However, it has become abundantly clear that Linux is just not for me There are several programs that I use on a daily basis - including HRD - that have no comparables available for Linux.

The final straw came with the wasted afternoon trying to get my PCI serial board to operate under Linux. So easy with Windows - just install and turn the computer on. It finds and installs the drivers for you and all is good.

I believe that if anything can be done easily - it will not be found on Linux.

So, I have returned to Windows - but, not for the lack of trying. If all you want to do is browse, email, Skype,and office work - then Linux will work well for you. Most other things are way too difficult for the average user.

Bill W2BLC

Maybe it has a proprietary driver, like many video cards require.  Mint does have an app in its control center that searches for those drivers.  It usually finds them, but you may have one of those rare cards with no Linux driver.  There aren't many these days, but there are still some.

And Windows really is little better.  I've done hundreds of XP installs and maybe a dozen Win7.  Drivers can be found for just about anything, but only if Windows finds the Ethernet port and it works with no other drivers required.  Good luck if you have no network connectivity after a basic Windows installation, something that has happened more often than not to me, both with XP and 7.
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He speaks fluent PSK31, in FT8...  One QSO with him earns you 5BDXCC...  His Wouff Hong has two Wouffs... Hiram Percy Maxim called HIM "The Old Man..."  He is... The Most Interesting Ham In The World!
AC7CW
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Posts: 1331




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« Reply #11 on: February 29, 2016, 01:02:23 PM »


Lame article really.... 'nix systems were designed with networking in mind from the ground up. Bill Gates thought the internet was a fad for a long time. 'nix systems protect systems by protecting the memory area used by apps. Windows uses a labyrinthine system of privileges. The 'nix system is simple and way less fallible.

The article is correct in stating that windows default is for the user to have admin privileges. If one opts for more security and uses a "User" login one will soon find that they have to log out and log in as Admin to do too many things, might as well go with Linux almost...
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Novice 1958, 20WPM Extra now... (and get off my lawn)
W4KYR
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« Reply #12 on: February 29, 2016, 02:33:00 PM »

Generally speaking...Use all the operating systems out there, don't limit yourself to just one.  They ALL have advantages and disadvantages. Linux has hundreds if not thousands of FREE programs just for the taking. Android probably has even more. The iPad works great for many people and they have ditched their PC's in favor of it. 

Linux might be a good choice to upgrade old Windows XP computers with. Not everyone wants to throw out otherwise perfectly usable computers just because some company no longer supports the operating system. Put that old computer to good use in the ham shack. Or upgrade it with Linux to use on the net.

 I suggest keeping at least one working XP computer around the shack as well as older Windows operating systems around to run legacy programs. Although dated, there are some still perfectly usable ahd FREE ham radio programs kicking around the net that run on Windows 98, 95 and DOS. Programs like old packet radio and logging programs.

Some mill machines run on Windows NT 4.0. Some LMR programming software requires DOS or Windows 95. The Icom M-710 requires DOS to run the programming software on it.

You could keep a packet station going in the corner of your shack running legacy equipment. Some hams already have an old computer, an old TNC and some 25 year old HTX 202 or IC-2AT laying around gathering dust. Put it all to good use and start a packet station.

Bottom line, use whatever you want, but you don't have to limit yourself to just one operating system any more than limiting yourself to one type of ham radio manufacturer.

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The internet and cellphone networks are great until they go down, what then? Find out here. 
https://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,111948.0.html

Using Windows 98 For Packet...
W8JX
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Posts: 13268




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« Reply #13 on: February 29, 2016, 03:30:24 PM »

Generally speaking...Use all the operating systems out there, don't limit yourself to just one.  They ALL have advantages and disadvantages. Linux has hundreds if not thousands of FREE programs just for the taking. Android probably has even more. The iPad works great for many people and they have ditched their PC's in favor of it. 

There is likely more free apps for windows than all other combined. Poor logic

Linux might be a good choice to upgrade old Windows XP computers with. Not everyone wants to throw out otherwise perfectly usable computers just because some company no longer supports the operating system. Put that old computer to good use in the ham shack. Or upgrade it with Linux to use on the net.

Perfectly usable? For what standards no longer used, HD standards no longer made, obsolete ram standards ans list goes on. XP machines are pretty old and hardware is old and can die any th=ime and new hardware is dirt cheap.

I suggest keeping at least one working XP computer around the shack as well as older Windows operating systems around to run legacy programs. Although dated, there are some still perfectly usable ahd FREE ham radio programs kicking around the net that run on Windows 98, 95 and DOS. Programs like old packet radio and logging programs.

Bad idea because of reasons above and many do not understand the risks of using a non supported OS on internet and think they know more about security than authors that stopped supporting it.

Some mill machines run on Windows NT 4.0. Some LMR programming software requires DOS or Windows 95. The Icom M-710 requires DOS to run the programming software on it.

Old hardware that needs to be laid to rest

You could keep a packet station going in the corner of your shack running legacy equipment. Some hams already have an old computer, an old TNC and some 25 year old HTX 202 or IC-2AT laying around gathering dust. Put it all to good use and start a packet station.

Why keep a old system that is on borrowed time and power hungry when you can put together a computer on a stick and TNC cheap with modern technology and will likely last many years and run on very minimal power too.

Bottom line, use whatever you want, but you don't have to limit yourself to just one operating system any more than limiting yourself to one type of ham radio manufacturer.

What ever OS you pick for PC pick one as it makes using it and share data among them far easier and a hodge podge of hardware and OSes.
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Ham since 1969....  Old School 20wpm REAL Extra Class..
KK4GGL
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Posts: 1320




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« Reply #14 on: February 29, 2016, 05:06:55 PM »

Some want to believe that Linux is the holy grail and the answer to Windows haters but when reality sets in, unless you are wearing rose colored glasses, you will see that independent of how stable Linux may be, it has VERY VERY limited application support. Some will quickly claim that many businesses use it but they also only use a few applications and those are usually also custom written for their needs. For home users selection is very limited and pales badly to Windows and even Apple at times.
"VERY VERY limited application support" means nothing without definition. If you mean customer support, you can buy it just like any other support. If you mean number of applications, that is meaningless as long as applications you need do not exist.

Many business do use it, as well as various governments the world over.  They use a wide range of applications. And while some are indeed custom apps, the majority are not.

And, AGAIN, number of applications is meaningless as long as the applications you need exist.

Since you obviously know little about Linux based distributions, you might want to refrain from spouting off.
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73,
Rick KK4GGL
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