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Author Topic: Power Level In England  (Read 11469 times)
K6AER
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« on: December 18, 2017, 06:50:21 AM »



I have been wondering a long time (58 years) why the power limit in England and Australia is limited to 400 watts. Most of the world is 1500 watts and above. It just seems the Britt's would love the extra 6dB. Now at the bottom of the sun spot cycle the hams in the Western side of the US would love more signal.
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MM0IMC
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« Reply #1 on: December 18, 2017, 07:01:00 AM »

There's been some unsuccessful attempts to get the regulators to up the power level, but I think they are worried in case we irradiate our neighbours. Undecided  We've probably got one of the lowest power levels on HF in Europe, which makes it hard to battle against the continental QRM as times.

I believe they increased the level in VK for a while, but found that accurate records of field strength or something similar wasn't being kept. Perhaps one of our cousins from down under could comment? Huh
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W1QJ
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« Reply #2 on: December 18, 2017, 07:02:13 AM »

Britts should petition the RSGB to up the power level.
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G3RZP
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« Reply #3 on: December 18, 2017, 07:32:50 AM »

It is possible to get a 1kW licence for special reasons such as EME, but not very common. Pre WW2, the 'standard' licence was ten watts DC input, but higher powers could be obtained. In about 1936, G6MN applied for a 25 watt licence and sent the money. He got back a 250watt licence and a request for the extra money over above that of 25 watt licence!

When the system was totally changed after the war, the 'standard' licence was 150 watts DC input, but the first year had to be spent on CW with only 25 watts input power. 160m was ten watts input, and is now 32 watts PEP from 1850 to 2MHz and 400 watts from 1810 to 1850 kHz. The 400 watts is derived from the concept of a modulated Class C PA stage running 150 watts DC input and 66.66% efficiency, giving 100 watts of carrier. Fully modulated, that's 400 watts PEP, measured at the antenna - that was introduced to get around feeder loss at UHF. Measuring at the antenna has a lot of possible errors when the antenna looks something like 1200 +j 420 (my folded unipole vertical on 160) or whatever!

Foundation and Intermediate licences have different levels. But as there is practically no enforcement or inspection these days, and many amplifiers around that will give 1kW or more, the power limitations in reality are pretty meaningless. Even in the 1960s, when there was more enforcement, one station in East London who was a big 160m DXer ran his 'ten watts input' to a PA of six 813s in parallel with 2500 volts on the plates - and never got caught!

The reluctance of the authorities to raising the power level generally was a fear of more complaints of interference to domestic electronics: probably now it's the radhaz perception amongst the public. At least on that front, we aren't as badly off as the Germans.
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K8AXW
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« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2017, 09:54:51 AM »

During WWII the British latched onto every electronic hobbyist (read ham radio operator) the could get to assist them with communications and teaching communications to their fighting men.

Then after the war the same people are treated as second class citizens or something of the sort.

After reading several books about England and WWII, some written by English authors, describing how British aircrews were slaughtered because they didn't want the Germans to know that it was discovered how the German bombers could find their targets. I read the "reasons" but simply couldn't wrap my head around them.

This list goes on and on to the point that I've concluded that I will never understand British 'thinking.'  I have always liked the British and have had many British ham friends down through the years (especially when I was a DL4)

Then again, there is little doubt in my mind the British feels the same way about America.

I'm reminded of the famous line from a very old radio program called "The Shadow."  It goes like this:  "Who knows what goes on in the minds (hearts?) of men?  Only the Shadow knows!"

BTW, for those who can't understand the American love for guns, it's all England's fault!   Grin





 
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A Pessimist is Never Disappointed!
K8BYP
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« Reply #5 on: December 18, 2017, 10:29:14 AM »

"probably now it's the radhaz perception amongst the public"

You have those "Wi Fi is causing me to have bad dreams" nuts over there too?

Probably a combination of RFI with the Public, and intereference with military comms.

We have power level restrictions in US also, on 60M and prohibitions against interference with certain (Govt) sites.
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MM0IMC
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« Reply #6 on: December 18, 2017, 11:56:12 AM »

"probably now it's the radhaz perception amongst the public"

You have those "Wi Fi is causing me to have bad dreams" nuts over there too?

Probably a combination of RFI with the Public, and intereference with military comms.

We have power level restrictions in US also, on 60M and prohibitions against interference with certain (Govt) sites.

Yes, there are some people who claim to suffer from Electromagnetic Hypersensitivity...

The Ministry of Defence is the primary user of quite a few bands in the UK, 60m and 70cm are the immediate ones that spring to mind. We're allowed up to 200W EIRP on 60m, I believe.
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KM1H
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« Reply #7 on: December 18, 2017, 12:43:32 PM »

There seemed to be a high number of the SB-220 family in the UK from chats and visits Ive had bot directions over the decades. Were they available thru the Heath store there or snuck in via Canada or USA? I dont remember those details.

I also shipped dozens of modified for 6M only and listed on the customs forms as active antenna tuners to the UK and their overseas territories as well as France and their DX locations.

Carl
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K8BYP
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« Reply #8 on: December 18, 2017, 01:50:52 PM »

"Ministry of Defence is the primary user of quite a few bands in the UK,"

For good reason, the Island has many more imminent threats than does continental US.

ALso good reasons to not emit too much for the over the horizon radar installations...
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KM1H
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« Reply #9 on: December 18, 2017, 02:19:17 PM »

Most of their threats are internal these days as are many EU countries.
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K8BYP
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« Reply #10 on: December 18, 2017, 03:01:34 PM »

Most of their threats are internal these days as are many EU countries.

Boy dont you have THAT right!!

"From the inside" is a good way to destroy something...

EXIT!!
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VK5SA
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« Reply #11 on: December 18, 2017, 03:01:58 PM »

I believe they increased the level in VK for a while, but found that accurate records of field strength or something similar wasn't being kept. Perhaps one of our cousins from down under could comment? Huh

The problem was the morons who were just unable to abide by the conditions.
One reason given by the regulator was:
"Some Advanced Licensees’ knowledge and awareness of the requirements of the Apparatus Licence LCD did not meet ACMA expectations. This is borne out by the results of the desk-based audit. There were 90 Advanced Licensees that took part in the desk-based audit. Of those 90, 17 were unable to demonstrate their compliance with the Apparatus Licence LCD. The reasons for this varied; some did not respond to the ACMA’s request for information made in accordance with Apparatus Licence LCD, whilst others incorrectly assessed the compliance level of their station. This was an important consideration given that the use of Higher Power was taking place within the wider community and the Apparatus Licence LCD sets out, among other things, the EME requirements for the operation of transmitters."

So, a small number screwed the rest of us  Angry

Chris VK5SA
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K1VCT
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« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2017, 05:57:26 PM »

That explains my lack of DX contacts from the UK
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KM1H
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Posts: 5103




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« Reply #13 on: December 18, 2017, 06:12:48 PM »

Quote
That explains my lack of DX contacts from the UK

I wouldnt put any of the blame on the UK hams; they have to hear you first.

Carl
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VR2AX
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Posts: 1013




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« Reply #14 on: December 18, 2017, 07:23:23 PM »

I remember visiting one North London operator in the late 60s, who owned a Drake L4. I was mesmerized by the bright amber/yellow incandescence given out by the 3-400/3-500 finals, on 10/15.
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