Call Search
     

New to Ham Radio?
My Profile

Community
Articles
Forums
News
Reviews
Friends Remembered
Strays
Survey Question

Operating
Contesting
DX Cluster Spots
Propagation

Resources
Calendar
Classifieds
Ham Exams
Ham Links
List Archives
News Articles
Product Reviews
QSL Managers

Site Info
eHam Help (FAQ)
Support the site
The eHam Team
Advertising Info
Vision Statement
About eHam.net

donate to eham
   Home   Help Search  
Pages: Prev 1 [2] 3 Next   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: $300 for a variance hearing in my back yard?  (Read 20648 times)
KF7CG
Member

Posts: 1212




Ignore
« Reply #15 on: May 24, 2011, 08:45:03 AM »

Any ramp may have required a variance also. A ramp, no matter what the purpose, is not a part of the "normal" house design or purpose and therefore, as many juridictions are begining to claim for any thing that is not "normal" and not specifically approve, a "use not provided for."

David
KF7CG
Logged
K9WN
Member

Posts: 10




Ignore
« Reply #16 on: May 24, 2011, 09:19:16 AM »

Disclaimer: I am NOT a lawyer.

Looking on-line for Madison Cty it looks like you are limited to 75 feet in hight or less. It also references sec 93.099 in the codes/ordinances which deals with "Telecommunications" uses. No mention of Amateur radio. As others have mentioned, it might be a good time to get in touch with a volunteer counsel and maybe get Ham radio written in to the codes....... in as liberal way as possible. "They" can't stop you from putting up a tower, per PRB-1, but they can make you jump thru lots of hoops to get it.

As you persue this, just remember to NOT get all huffy and argumentative. Keep it friendly. In my case, I found out I was talking to the "wrong" person at the city. He was totally unreasonable. Seems he had just completed a class geared towards commercial towers and their uses and was applying those rules to Amateur Radio towers. IE: he wanted ice loading data and other things that would never apply to a 40 foot tower. Once I got to the "right" person, the permit was issued with no problems. AND I was informed that I could go as 64 feet with no problems/hearings/meetings.

Good luck and be patient.

Jake
K9WN
Logged
KB4MB
Member

Posts: 296




Ignore
« Reply #17 on: June 14, 2011, 08:48:02 AM »

Try again - this time (and this is what I did), just tell them you are going to put up a tower for TV reception about 40ft high - you might put a ham or CB antenna on it... bet you get a different answer (most likely have to get a construction permit or something like that)
Logged
W8JI
Member

Posts: 9748


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #18 on: July 17, 2011, 01:02:33 PM »

In my county it is 200 feet with nothing required. Above that it requires compliance with FAA regulations, and 50% setback from property lines.

For commercial use it required a permit. There was nothing in the non-commercial section about any permit. Pretty much do what you want if you don't have a commercial service on the tower.
Logged
AA4PB
Member

Posts: 14948




Ignore
« Reply #19 on: July 17, 2011, 01:57:57 PM »

I'd be careful about putting up a tower without the required permit. It could cost you a lot of work and money. I had a neighbor who put up a split-rail fence without getting a permit. The inspector was driving by and notice the new fence. The installation was perfect BUT he made him take it all down, including removing the posts and filling the holes. Then he would issue a permit and the neighbor could re-install the fence just exactly like he had it. I guess that was his punishment for not getting a permit first.

My experience with a variance is that YOU notify your nighbors via a registered letter of the date and time of the hearing. Neighbors can come and speak for or against the proposed variance. You (or your representative) make a presentation about what you want to do. County staff makes a presentation to the board explaining any benefits or concerns and makes a recommendation for or against approval. Obviously it is to your benefit to talk with the neighbors and staff well ahead of time (maybe before you commit your $300). One thing you don't want is to go the the hearing and get blind-sided with a bunch of negative stuff that you aren't prepared to answer. Bottom line is to do your homework or hire an attorney to do it for you.
Logged

Bob  AA4PB
Garrisonville, VA
WA8FOZ
Member

Posts: 203




Ignore
« Reply #20 on: July 21, 2011, 06:28:50 PM »

Some folks are of a frame of mind that leads them to suggest that you go "underground," avoid asking for a permit, ask for forgiveness rather than permission, and all that. If that's your philosophy of life, knock yourself out. But if it doesn't work out, it could cost you a lot of money, and prevent you from engaging in your hobby. Plus, in your case the cat may be already out of the bag.

An ARRL VC is an excellent idea, as is a REAL ESTATE lawyer - the VC may help you find one. Not every lawyer is a real estate lawyer - so ask. Expect to pay less than a new rig, but more than an MFJ antenna switch. Unless the cat is already out of the bag. Or unless you are willing to take a chance.

Good luck!
Logged
W0MT
Member

Posts: 198




Ignore
« Reply #21 on: July 21, 2011, 09:23:12 PM »

I agree that failing to obtain the necessary permits to put up an antenna may turn out to be costly. But not only that, I think the suggestion to ignore permit and zoning requirements is offensive. I am ashamed that there are Hams who think laws don't apply to them. Every place I am aware of, building codes and zoning are prescribed by law. I think Hams with this attitude need to get one of those t-shirts that say. "It's All About Me!"
Logged
N2EY
Member

Posts: 5043




Ignore
« Reply #22 on: July 22, 2011, 03:59:31 AM »

The advice from AA4PB and W0MT is spot-on. I will just add this:

Before applying for a variance, go to the folks who decide such things and ask how the process works in general terms.

In my case, variances are granted by application to the Zoning Hearing Board (ZHB). Application is made to be on the agenda at a specific public meeting, and cases are heard similar to a court hearing, with exhibits, sworn testimony, etc.

Around here the ZHB does the notification, not the applicant. The applicant can bring witnesses and experts.

In my case (not for a tower, but for an addition) I retained an attorney who had a long history of success with the ZHB. He advised me as to what was a reasonable variance and what wasn't, what information to gather and how to present it, etc. He told me to go to a hearing or two and watch what happens, and I did. At my hearing, he did most of the talking, and the variance was granted.

Yes, it took money and time, but it was a small part of the overall project cost.

73 es GL de Jim, N2EY   
Logged
K4KWH
Member

Posts: 51




Ignore
« Reply #23 on: July 23, 2011, 02:36:17 PM »

I agree that failing to obtain the necessary permits to put up an antenna may turn out to be costly. But not only that, I think the suggestion to ignore permit and zoning requirements is offensive. I am ashamed that there are Hams who think laws don't apply to them. Every place I am aware of, building codes and zoning are prescribed by law. I think Hams with this attitude need to get one of those t-shirts that say. "It's All About Me!"

I don't think it's "all about me" per se, but I think we have too many laws and restrictions on what we can do on our OWN property.  The way I see it, neither the gub'ment, nor the neighbors have any say-so what I do on my own land.  We have allowed others to get in our business far too much!  IOW, what YOU do on your OWN property is none of MY business, and what I do on my property is none of yours.  I PAID for it, and if I want to put up an antenna, I will DO it.  Just that simple.  Now, fortunately, I don't HAVE such restrictions here and homes still can be found without stupid HOA crap, deed restrictions OR oppressive city/county regulations. IF there had been, I wouldn't have located here. I must be lucky, eh?

J
Logged
WA8FOZ
Member

Posts: 203




Ignore
« Reply #24 on: July 23, 2011, 03:54:40 PM »

I don't think it's "all about me" per se, but I think we have too many laws and restrictions on what
Quote
we can do on our OWN property.  The way I see it, neither the gub'ment, nor the neighbors have any say-so what I do on my own land.  We have allowed others to get in our business far too much!  IOW, what YOU do on your OWN property is none of MY business, and what I do on my property is none of yours.  I PAID for it, and if I want to put up an antenna, I will DO it



Vey nice but that's simply not the way it is in most places, nor is it what most people want. You might change your mind if someone opened an industrial  pig farm a half mile away from your QTH. Happened to a friend of mine. He had about 20 acres, built his house, nice place. The piggery made his place unlivable and unsellable. $100k+ in land, materials, sweat equity down the tube - no chance of recovery, no gub'mint or commie zoning or land use laws out there. The pig farm refused to buy the place - I think he eventually abandoned it and let it be sold for taxes - for almost nothing - to the pig farm.

Most people want more protection than that. Some don't.
Quote
Quote

Just that simple.  Now, fortunately, I don't HAVE such restrictions here and homes still can be found without stupid HOA crap, deed restrictions OR oppressive city/county regulations. IF there had been, I wouldn't have located here. I must be lucky, eh?
J
 
 

I hope you are, for the sake of your antennas and your property values.
Logged
AA4PB
Member

Posts: 14948




Ignore
« Reply #25 on: July 24, 2011, 06:47:39 AM »

I was glad for county regulations when my next door neighbor decided to run an 18-wheeler truck repair shop on his property. I woke up Sat/Sun mornings to the sound and black smoke comming into my windows.

Again when he decided to run his septic overflow into the drainage ditch on the back of our property.
Logged

Bob  AA4PB
Garrisonville, VA
AD6KA
Member

Posts: 2243




Ignore
« Reply #26 on: July 24, 2011, 03:22:58 PM »

Quote
The way I see it, neither the gub'ment, nor the neighbors have any say-so what I do on my own land.

Such as running a Meth Lab, moonshine still, or growing a marijuana patch?
Logged
K4KWH
Member

Posts: 51




Ignore
« Reply #27 on: July 24, 2011, 05:46:16 PM »

I don't think it's "all about me" per se, but I think we have too many laws and restrictions on what
Quote
we can do on our OWN property.  The way I see it, neither the gub'ment, nor the neighbors have any say-so what I do on my own land.  We have allowed others to get in our business far too much!  IOW, what YOU do on your OWN property is none of MY business, and what I do on my property is none of yours.  I PAID for it, and if I want to put up an antenna, I will DO it



Vey nice but that's simply not the way it is in most places, nor is it what most people want. You might change your mind if someone opened an industrial  pig farm a half mile away from your QTH. Happened to a friend of mine. He had about 20 acres, built his house, nice place. The piggery made his place unlivable and unsellable. $100k+ in land, materials, sweat equity down the tube - no chance of recovery, no gub'mint or commie zoning or land use laws out there. The pig farm refused to buy the place - I think he eventually abandoned it and let it be sold for taxes - for almost nothing - to the pig farm.

Most people want more protection than that. Some don't.
Quote
Quote

Just that simple.  Now, fortunately, I don't HAVE such restrictions here and homes still can be found without stupid HOA crap, deed restrictions OR oppressive city/county regulations. IF there had been, I wouldn't have located here. I must be lucky, eh?
J
 
 

I hope you are, for the sake of your antennas and your property values.

I don't know how much "luck" is involved in it or careful selection of the location.  After discovering a house with a very restrictive "historic' designation and an HOA full of snoots and snobs (read control freaks), I bailed......QUICK!  I found a house in the city on a dead end street with city amenities (to appease the wife) and country living in the same package.  There are woods behind and beside me and there WAS a cow pasture at the end of the street.  The cows made better neighbors than the sniveling control freaks would!  And I don't have to even be bothered with HOA's or zoning officials.  If I want to put up an antenna, I can just DO it.  My city doesn't CARE!  That's what I wanted.  My garage is downstairs (as is my radio shack and faces the back of the house.  If you come to my house, it would appear to be a modest, 1950's single-level ranch despite the fact there is a full basement downstairs. In fact people DO come to the house and leave thinking there's nobody home when, actually, I am likely downstairs puttering in the wood shop/garage, fiddling with my old '51 Willys Jeep, or messin' in the back yard.  I don't HAVE anybody coming over here telling me "You can't build a cabinet down there". Or you can't work on that old jeep.  They best NOT, either! Sad  I try to be a good neighbor by stopping any work in progress NLT 9 PM and by cleaning up any mess, although people can't really see much in my yard down there anyway. And, btw, I'll park as durn many cars on my grass as I please! Wink

This is exactly the way I think it ought to be!  I PLANNED it that way.  And it's gonna STAY that way.  If anyone has other ideas (snooty neighbors, HOA nazis, etc) I've got one word fer 'em!   

GIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!   Smiley Smiley

J
Logged
W0MT
Member

Posts: 198




Ignore
« Reply #28 on: July 24, 2011, 09:20:33 PM »

I don't have any problem with individuals who decide to locate where there is little or no zoning or building code enforcement. I assume they understand some of the downsides. For example there they might wake up some morning and discover the nice, quiet pasture next to them is going to be a truck stop with semis idling all night long. Or they might decide to sell their house only to discover that potential buyers are reluctant to buy a house where building code has not been enforced.

My issue is with individual who buy property in a location where there are strong zoning restrictions and strict building code enforcement and then they decide that zoning and building code don't apply to them.
Logged
N2EY
Member

Posts: 5043




Ignore
« Reply #29 on: July 25, 2011, 03:38:55 AM »

Now, fortunately, I don't HAVE such restrictions here and homes still can be found without stupid HOA crap, deed restrictions OR oppressive city/county regulations. IF there had been, I wouldn't have located here. I must be lucky, eh?

You were lucky in that you could find a home that:

1) Met the no-restrictions criteria
2) Was in the right place
3) Was affordable to you
4) Was for sale when you were looking

That's not always the case.

And while you probably can't be forced into an HOA, things like zoning and building codes can be changed without your approval if the city/county/state so decide. And while existing stuff will probably be "grandfathered", new stuff probably won't be.

73 de Jim, N2EY
Logged
Pages: Prev 1 [2] 3 Next   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!