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Author Topic: Better IMD please  (Read 121578 times)
ZENKI
Member

Posts: 1636




Ignore
« Reply #225 on: January 28, 2012, 03:15:55 PM »

So thats your two hot button issues, cbérs and equipment reviews?

 I have nothing against cbérs. I just dont want their operating practices leaking into the ham bands. My criticism of cbérs is related to their operating practices and the equipment that they use. I do this because its this equipment and operating practices that ruins the weak signal  areas of good bands like 10 meters. If you want to defend crap CB  radios with poor IMD and the brain dead operating practices like using class C cb amps on the ham bands, you right I have no time for people who do that. If they are ham cbérs so be it.  Wherever stupid cbérs have infiltrated the hams bands its been a disaster, just look at 2 meters! There are a lot of good hams who have come from the Cb ranks and contributed in a good way to the ham radio hobby, unfortunately the % is very small.

As for equipment reviews, its unfortunate that many hams behave like dumb cbérs when buying equipment when the technical data clearly states that the equipment performance is lousy. Why some people cant  handle others making technical criticism of equipment is beyond belief and not in the spirit of ham radio being a open technical hobby.   If anyone says that a piece of equipment is good, that piece of equipment should be analyzed, measured and it should be easy to prove that its as good as people say. Unfortunately so many want you  to believe its good just because its brand X and they own it. When hams behave like this they are no different  to the technical incompetents like the cbérs.

Its laughable that you would think that someone can come on a technical forum like this with some of the best RF engineers in the world and spin BS about equipment. I would be the last person  in the world to try and fool engineers. The fools are the people who post idiotic reviews that anyone can prove wrong by making technical tests.. The only bitter people are the people who cant understand technical review data and want to tell lies to make their favorite toy look good. Its really simple for you  or  anyone else to call out a BS artists, simply produce measured data that proves your point. That will soon destroy anyone who tells lies about equipment. In the case of IMD, if you have a piece of equipment that I have bad mouthed because of poor IMD, present your data that shows its better even if its a piece of CB equipment.

Thats a real problem with new hams  today,  it seems that they  want to  demonstrate the size of their  IQ by looking good by  boasting how expensive their equipment purchases are and not not how good the  equipment is technically. If you dare making any comment about how bad the equipment is they get upset. Once they have bought this equipment, they then try and bully others into believing that their new equipment is the greatest thing since sliced bread when it is not. If I have made any criticism of any piece of equipment it can be proven by making the appropriate tests.. I dont believe in voodoo reviews of ham equipment, only technical measurements that produces accurate data. Its really saddening to read how hams behave on equipment reflectors and lists, the  senseless bullying of anyone who dares to raise any technical faults of the equipment on these lists leads to instant bullying or banning. This is not in the spirit of a open technical hobby and certainly does not produce better equipment outcomes for hams  by silencing those who are critical.

When people like this  cant win a argument on technical merit, they then try and attack the person personally.   This is the normal gutter tactics of people who cant win a argument based solely on the facts and the argument subject matter. I did not see you present any technical measured data that proves any different of my equipment criticisms. Why dont you do that, instead of playing keystone cop.

As for me responding to identity questions I never responded because nobody else has used personal identifiable information like you have. If you want to make accusations about who someone is and use someone elses callsign and without really knowing if you are right, thats wrong. Its  not fair to the person who holds that callsign. I am really trying to save you from embarrassment and save another hams reputation from a idiot who is trying to play amateur detective. You would make a  very lousy cop and you  would be laughed out of court  if presented such flimsy  evidence. ""Oh, your honor, he verbally attacks cb''ers ""   But hey it does not bug me if you want  to damage your reputation and drag  some other persons callsign  through the mud when you not sure 100% sure You are only damaging your own credibility playing ID lottery, you gonna have a lot of enemies soon. Goodluck with the callsign lottery you have a million others to go:) Why dont  you go further and post that callsign on the thieves forum since you so sure, you might as well since you on the warpath and are 100% sure, right?



Logged
KE5JPP
Member

Posts: 0




Ignore
« Reply #226 on: January 28, 2012, 04:03:26 PM »

So thats your two hot button issues, cbérs and equipment reviews?

 I have nothing against cbérs. I just dont want their operating practices leaking into the ham bands. My criticism of cbérs is related to their operating practices and the equipment that they use. I do this because its this equipment and operating practices that ruins the weak signal  areas of good bands like 10 meters. If you want to defend crap CB  radios with poor IMD and the brain dead operating practices like using class C cb amps on the ham bands, you right I have no time for people who do that. If they are ham cbérs so be it.  Wherever stupid cbérs have infiltrated the hams bands its been a disaster, just look at 2 meters! There are a lot of good hams who have come from the Cb ranks and contributed in a good way to the ham radio hobby, unfortunately the % is very small.

As for equipment reviews, its unfortunate that many hams behave like dumb cbérs when buying equipment when the technical data clearly states that the equipment performance is lousy. Why some people cant  handle others making technical criticism of equipment is beyond belief and not in the spirit of ham radio being a open technical hobby.   If anyone says that a piece of equipment is good, that piece of equipment should be analyzed, measured and it should be easy to prove that its as good as people say. Unfortunately so many want you  to believe its good just because its brand X and they own it. When hams behave like this they are no different  to the technical incompetents like the cbérs.

Its laughable that you would think that someone can come on a technical forum like this with some of the best RF engineers in the world and spin BS about equipment. I would be the last person  in the world to try and fool engineers. The fools are the people who post idiotic reviews that anyone can prove wrong by making technical tests.. The only bitter people are the people who cant understand technical review data and want to tell lies to make their favorite toy look good. Its really simple for you  or  anyone else to call out a BS artists, simply produce measured data that proves your point. That will soon destroy anyone who tells lies about equipment. In the case of IMD, if you have a piece of equipment that I have bad mouthed because of poor IMD, present your data that shows its better even if its a piece of CB equipment.

Thats a real problem with new hams  today,  it seems that they  want to  demonstrate the size of their  IQ by looking good by  boasting how expensive their equipment purchases are and not not how good the  equipment is technically. If you dare making any comment about how bad the equipment is they get upset. Once they have bought this equipment, they then try and bully others into believing that their new equipment is the greatest thing since sliced bread when it is not. If I have made any criticism of any piece of equipment it can be proven by making the appropriate tests.. I dont believe in voodoo reviews of ham equipment, only technical measurements that produces accurate data. Its really saddening to read how hams behave on equipment reflectors and lists, the  senseless bullying of anyone who dares to raise any technical faults of the equipment on these lists leads to instant bullying or banning. This is not in the spirit of a open technical hobby and certainly does not produce better equipment outcomes for hams  by silencing those who are critical.

When people like this  cant win a argument on technical merit, they then try and attack the person personally.   This is the normal gutter tactics of people who cant win a argument based solely on the facts and the argument subject matter. I did not see you present any technical measured data that proves any different of my equipment criticisms. Why dont you do that, instead of playing keystone cop.

As for me responding to identity questions I never responded because nobody else has used personal identifiable information like you have. If you want to make accusations about who someone is and use someone elses callsign and without really knowing if you are right, thats wrong. Its  not fair to the person who holds that callsign. I am really trying to save you from embarrassment and save another hams reputation from a idiot who is trying to play amateur detective. You would make a  very lousy cop and you  would be laughed out of court  if presented such flimsy  evidence. ""Oh, your honor, he verbally attacks cb''ers ""   But hey it does not bug me if you want  to damage your reputation and drag  some other persons callsign  through the mud when you not sure 100% sure You are only damaging your own credibility playing ID lottery, you gonna have a lot of enemies soon. Goodluck with the callsign lottery you have a million others to go:) Why dont  you go further and post that callsign on the thieves forum since you so sure, you might as well since you on the warpath and are 100% sure, right?





John, all your blathering on and on above does not change the fact that you hide like a coward behind a mask of anonymity by using your CB like handles of "zenki" and "plebian99".  Cheesy  No matter how much you try to make yourself sound like you are technically competent and how clearly and well thought out your arguments are, you have next to zero credibility because you cowardly hide behind your CB handle.

I am sorry that you are upset by me revealing your identity.  I did not have to search at all to determine who you were.  One of your forum buddies slipped up and let the cat out of the bag, John.  BTW, I think Sinclair needs to be made aware of your on line activities.  I wonder how much of your nonsense was done on their time?

Gene
« Last Edit: January 28, 2012, 04:41:39 PM by KE5JPP » Logged
ZENKI
Member

Posts: 1636




Ignore
« Reply #227 on: January 28, 2012, 10:47:19 PM »

You seem to be grasping at straws with all my identities, cant you  nail down 1 ID, or do i have to give you 2 or 3 or 4? From a N2 to a Plebian which one is right? You a really confused person. Fact is that you dont have a clue.

Sinclair? who and what is Sinclair. I think you better go take your medicine for your schizophrenia. I will make it easy for you if you do know who I am, i give you my full permission to publish a full dossier and report me to Sinclair. Go Ahead LOL you can even come around for a beer.

I will call home to MARS and tell the grand poobah that i have been exposed on earth and that he needs to send a UFO to pick me up otherwise the exposure will end my mission!
 
You have provided me with a good laugh for the day, i thought keystone cops  only appeared in the movies. You should seek employment with the FBI, you can put me down as a reference I will vouch for your expert abilities in tracking people down.



John, all your blathering on and on above does not change the fact that you hide like a coward behind a mask of anonymity by using your CB like handles of "zenki" and "plebian99".  Cheesy  No matter how much you try to make yourself sound like you are technically competent and how clearly and well thought out your arguments are, you have next to zero credibility because you cowardly hide behind your CB handle.

I am sorry that you are upset by me revealing your identity.  I did not have to search at all to determine who you were.  One of your forum buddies slipped up and let the cat out of the bag, John.  BTW, I think Sinclair needs to be made aware of your on line activities.  I wonder how much of your nonsense was done on their time?

Gene
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TANAKASAN
Member

Posts: 933




Ignore
« Reply #228 on: January 29, 2012, 01:18:51 AM »

Please could this debate return to poor transmitter IMD where it belongs?

Tanakasan
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KE5JPP
Member

Posts: 0




Ignore
« Reply #229 on: January 29, 2012, 06:11:48 AM »

You seem to be grasping at straws with all my identities, cant you  nail down 1 ID, or do i have to give you 2 or 3 or 4? From a N2 to a Plebian which one is right? You a really confused person. Fact is that you dont have a clue.

Sinclair? who and what is Sinclair. I think you better go take your medicine for your schizophrenia. I will make it easy for you if you do know who I am, i give you my full permission to publish a full dossier and report me to Sinclair. Go Ahead LOL you can even come around for a beer.

I will call home to MARS and tell the grand poobah that i have been exposed on earth and that he needs to send a UFO to pick me up otherwise the exposure will end my mission!
 
You have provided me with a good laugh for the day, i thought keystone cops  only appeared in the movies. You should seek employment with the FBI, you can put me down as a reference I will vouch for your expert abilities in tracking people down.


John aka "zenki" aka "plebian99", you know very well that I am referring to your employer.  You will continue to deny and attempt to twist your way out of this, but you and I both know you have been IDed.   Roll Eyes If I was so far off you would not have even bothered to respond.  That should be clear to anyone reading this thread.  Cheesy

Gene
Logged
WD5GWY
Member

Posts: 457




Ignore
« Reply #230 on: January 29, 2012, 09:54:06 AM »

Please could this debate return to poor transmitter IMD where it belongs?

Tanakasan
+1
I would much rather continue reading a discussion of IMD than this sidetrack.
ZENKI's call/name etc. is of no importance here as it is obvious that he knows
what he is talking about. Otherwise, others here (engineers etc.) would have
destroyed his credibility a long time ago. It is clear to me that he must know
what he is talking about or that would have happened.
I for one, am glad he is here and sharing his knowledge. I have been learning
(although slowly) things I might not have learned otherwise.
james
WD5GWY
Logged
KE5JPP
Member

Posts: 0




Ignore
« Reply #231 on: January 29, 2012, 10:35:57 AM »

Please could this debate return to poor transmitter IMD where it belongs?

Tanakasan
+1
I would much rather continue reading a discussion of IMD than this sidetrack.
ZENKI's call/name etc. is of no importance here as it is obvious that he knows
what he is talking about. Otherwise, others here (engineers etc.) would have
destroyed his credibility a long time ago. It is clear to me that he must know
what he is talking about or that would have happened.
I for one, am glad he is here and sharing his knowledge. I have been learning
(although slowly) things I might not have learned otherwise.
james
WD5GWY


Seeing how that last on subject post about IMD in this thread was over 20 days ago, I'd say the subject has pretty much run its course for now.  For you guys whining about staying on subject, there is an ignore button you can use.  Whining about staying on subject is OFF subject too, BTW...

Gene
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WD5GWY
Member

Posts: 457




Ignore
« Reply #232 on: January 29, 2012, 02:42:08 PM »



Seeing how that last on subject post about IMD in this thread was over 20 days ago, I'd say the subject has pretty much run its course for now.  For you guys whining about staying on subject, there is an ignore button you can use.  Whining about staying on subject is OFF subject too, BTW...

Gene
Yes, that is true. But, I seldom use the ignore button. Reason being, there are good
posts even by those I might would want to ignore every now and then. I just did not
(and still do not) see the point for jumping into the middle of a topic and trashing another person over their user name being something other than their call sign. It certainly doesn't make their comments less valid. No more than using a call sign makes
them an expert in a field.
But, I wasn't whining, I was simply doing as another poster did, and added that I too would rather see the discussion continue on the subject of the thread instead of turning into a bash fest.
Oh, and there is another thread on the same subject now. Guess, I'll go and post there.
Have a nice day.
james
WD5GWY
 
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VE7RF
Member

Posts: 212




Ignore
« Reply #233 on: January 30, 2012, 01:39:14 AM »

Please could this debate return to poor transmitter IMD where it belongs?

Tanakasan

### other than the yaesu..and only in Class A... there are NO xcvr's  out there that are worth a damn... IMD wise... none.    The 1000-D..if tweaked right, is pretty good.... but it's no longer made.

##  And I can't use my MK-V  in class A, except for testing.   way too hot.  I know one fellow who destroyed 3 x set's of finals in his mk-V.  No air at all down heat sinks 1+2.   30vdc  @ 10A  CCS= 300w... = HOT.


##  perhaps tweaking the bias on the yaesu's..so they suck less idle current in class A... OR increasing the idle current when they are in AB...might do the trick.   Class A is gross overkill...well maybe not. -85db pep  for IMD-7-19 is pretty good.   And if u do run class A... it backfires every time.  Stations will get real close, not realizing that the class A  station will then hear the imd  fom the new  class AB  splatter box next door.

Later.. Jim  VE7RF
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VE7RF
Member

Posts: 212




Ignore
« Reply #234 on: January 30, 2012, 05:38:35 AM »


##  "Zenki" can never display his callsign  for a specific reason.  Only I know who he really is.  Suffice to say he's the real deal..and no BS artist.  His true identity can never be revealed.

Later... Jim  VE7RF

Are you sure you are the only one that knows his "true identity"?  Why can't his "true identity" be revealed? Roll Eyes

  

Gene

##  His life would be in danger.   The 'organization'  would simply rub him out.   Fed G men  have been trying to find him for months as is. To add to the confusion, there is more than one Zenki running amok.
Logged
ZENKI
Member

Posts: 1636




Ignore
« Reply #235 on: February 04, 2012, 01:11:27 AM »

haha, I heard that there is a SEAL team looking for me and my tubes!

When you discover my real identity please tell me and others on this forum. They seem to be grasping at straws in the dark!

Back to the IMD subject, found a clean driver amp for the 3cx3000 yet?

A distributed amplifier might do a better job than a solid state amplifier. A whole bunch of  Russian GI7B's might do the job?


##  "Zenki" can never display his callsign  for a specific reason.  Only I know who he really is.  Suffice to say he's the real deal..and no BS artist.  His true identity can never be revealed.

Later... Jim  VE7RF

Are you sure you are the only one that knows his "true identity"?  Why can't his "true identity" be revealed? Roll Eyes

  

Gene

##  His life would be in danger.   The 'organization'  would simply rub him out.   Fed G men  have been trying to find him for months as is. To add to the confusion, there is more than one Zenki running amok.
Logged
ZS6BIM
Member

Posts: 67




Ignore
« Reply #236 on: February 04, 2012, 03:12:52 AM »

According to the 8877 data sheet a gain of at least 15dB is achievable at 30MHz so one only needs a clean 50W to drive the tube to 1,5kW output.

It should be possible to make a broadband SS class A amplifier that can deliver 50W with -45dBc IMD3 and dissipating 150W. (200W at no RF output)

Ideally such a driver should be part of the linear amplifier with one additional stage to bring the overall amplifier gain to 42 dB or 100mW input for 1,5kW out.

At the 100mW level linear gain control is easy so a self-contained ALC loop could be implemented.

Transceivers would then have a dedicated 100 mW low distortion output for driving an external linear so avoiding the current problems.

Too expensive? I guess so!  Sad

73
Mike
 Smiley
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VE7RF
Member

Posts: 212




Ignore
« Reply #237 on: February 04, 2012, 04:39:34 AM »

According to the 8877 data sheet a gain of at least 15dB is achievable at 30MHz so one only needs a clean 50W to drive the tube to 1,5kW output.

It should be possible to make a broadband SS class A amplifier that can deliver 50W with -45dBc IMD3 and dissipating 150W. (200W at no RF output)

Ideally such a driver should be part of the linear amplifier with one additional stage to bring the overall amplifier gain to 42 dB or 100mW input for 1,5kW out.

At the 100mW level linear gain control is easy so a self-contained ALC loop could be implemented.

Transceivers would then have a dedicated 100 mW low distortion output for driving an external linear so avoiding the current problems.

Too expensive? I guess so!  Sad

73
Mike
 Smiley

##  Just use either a yaesu FTDX-5000  or a FT-2000 or a FT-1000-MK-V  or the 9000MP  All of those rigs will do 75w pep out in Class A.  The 9000MP will do 100w pep out in class A.  The difference between AB and A  on any of these xcvr's is astounding.  Listen on a 2nd xcvr, abt 3' away, with a small ant..like a 2' wire..and listen way off freq.  Then toggle the main XCVR  between class A  and AB..yikes it's like apples an oranges. The splatter drops 30-40db everytime. Now just don't do something silly, like using the K3 garbage truck, to drive a linear.  With it's
 -29db pep imd, you will not make friends.

later...Jim  VE7RF
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