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Author Topic: What makes "old" or "vintage" expensive?  (Read 99907 times)
NK7Z
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« Reply #15 on: October 10, 2014, 04:49:04 PM »

NK7Z I think you made my point albeit unwittingly. I'd like to have an old Stanely Steamer just to putt around the yard once in awhile. Would I pay $100.00 for one  -no.  Fresh ground oats are a neat change.
Would I pay extra as opposed to already processed  -no. Would I opt for either on a regular basis no - That doesn't mean they are not fun just like using the latest and greatest. It's a "Mood of the Moment" thing with me! Turning g an old ARC 5 transmitter / Receiver combo into a working radio is fun but not something to do every day.
Enjoy the day
Dick  KH2G

Just keeping things in the same vain is all... Smiley
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Thanks,
Dave
Amateur Radio: RFI help, Reviews, Setup information, and more...
https://www.nk7z.net
AC5UP
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Posts: 4546




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« Reply #16 on: October 10, 2014, 06:49:37 PM »

When the VW Beetle first came out you could by a new one for about $1500. Today they start at $20,295.

Which is a valid point, but are the two automobiles comparable?

Did the original Beetle have airbags?  Fuel injection?  GPS?  Air conditioning... Or even seat belts?  They do now, and more.  While the older and newer models share the same body profile and name they are not exactly the same car, so consider that as well.  On the flip side of comparison is the pocket calculator that started out in the 70's at a $300 + price point that's now faster, more powerful and less than a tenth of the price.  Ditto for the VCR over its product run.  The audio CD player and video DVD player.  Much cheaper and loaded with features today, much like the latest amateur transceivers.

Damn shame the top of the line KenYaeCom rigs didn't follow the same price / performance curve as MaxSeaQuan hard drives over the past 20 years.

But the funny thing is..... You don't see many geezers on eBay (or at a local flea) paying way too much for a vintage VCR.  Black & white TV.  Or a Super Mario Brothers game cart with matching Atari.

Hams, on the other hand, will haggle over pre-digital designs that consumer markets rejected a decade ago.  Because we're nuts.  Which then begs the question:  Do we not have the ham equivalent of HF Smartphones because we keep buying big boxes with too many knobs and value our toys by the pound?

I plead guilty to the last comment 'cuz I went through a stage many years ago that if I couldn't lift it I wanted it real bad.   Wink
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G3RZP
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Posts: 1321




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« Reply #17 on: October 11, 2014, 10:01:00 AM »

KS2G Said

>ham gear has never been cheaper.<

That is very true.  But if I have more than adequate performance from my (admittedly much modified)old rig, what is the point of changing? Not all new rigs offer performance that is really adequate.

I did buy a new 2m handheld which does 12.5 kHz channeling. The old IC2A operation was simple: the new FT250 needs the handbook referring to if you want to change from simplex to repeater! Like a cellphone: I want to receiver calls, enter a number an call it, and have an alarm clock. I don't need or want anything else....
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KB4QAA
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« Reply #18 on: October 11, 2014, 10:08:51 AM »

KS2G Said

>ham gear has never been cheaper.<

That is very true.  But if I have more than adequate performance from my (admittedly much modified)old rig, what is the point of changing? Not all new rigs offer performance that is really adequate.
The discussion isn't about you or your desires.

Whether you should upgrade, and whether new equipment is a better value than keeping your old gear is a completely different discussion from the original topic of present value versus value from 40 years ago.

b.
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KA0HCP, ex-KB4QAA Relocated to Ks. April 2019.
N8CMQ
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Posts: 723




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« Reply #19 on: October 11, 2014, 11:31:12 AM »

I upgraded my 2 meter gear due to the repeaters upgrading to PL tones, but it didn't cost me much to do so.
A Radio Shack HT cost $100, and a Radio Shack mobile rig with a bazillion memories and public service band
only cost $30. The old 2 meter gear sold, but not at hyper inflated value like the old HF gear I see at hamfests
and fleabay.

I am surprised when my HF gear still commands a high dollar value even when it is old to very old. Like someone
said, 'Hams are crazy!' when it comes to boat anchors. Even trash I wouldn't pay $20 for, is selling over $100 on fleabay, and at hamfests. Nostalgia? Reliving the past? Is it worth that kind of money? Not for me, but I am not upgrading my HF gear, nor am I buying and selling HF gear.

The only thing that I dislike, is seeing gear that doesn't sell for top dollar, getting chopped up and sold as parts. But I have bought some of those parts, so, I guess I shouldn't complain!
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N8CMQ   Jeff Retired...
W1BR
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Posts: 4196




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« Reply #20 on: October 11, 2014, 01:19:08 PM »

Rarity and nostalgia drive prices, esp. for the more desirable gear. Just being "old" is no gauge of worth.

Older hams are likely to able to afford the rigs they could only dream about when they were novices. WARC bands aside, a good OT can have a lot of fun and make a lot of contacts using vintage.       

One thing for sure, the old timers are a dying breed, and I suspect the demand for vintage gear will diminish as the number of SK's increases over time.  And very few new hams are able to deal with vacuum tube technology, nor do some care or have any desire to.   
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N3UIQ
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« Reply #21 on: October 13, 2014, 09:07:15 AM »

I don't understand why so many hams consider old vintage gear expensive, I see complete functioning HF transceivers go for $100 to $300, theses are Drakes, Swans etc. They get you on the air, the receivers are .5uv capable and the RF outputs are 100+ watts, they have great "voices" and great "ears", and I don't have to pay anybody to fix them (I can), for the price in today's market these radios are practically free, which seems to be the only reasonable figure for a lot of operators. I'm working on getting back into the hobby after many years and am grateful these vintage rigs are available. Nobody is making anybody buy the old "crap" so why so much complaints about what they're selling for? Yes they are old and for the most part they are the cheapest things out there.
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K8AC
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« Reply #22 on: October 14, 2014, 07:27:32 AM »

I think it's true that the price of much of the used gear is indeed higher than it should be, assuming that price is (or should be) related to function and condition.  When I started in amateur radio, the concept of someone collecting old ham gear was unknown, at least in my part of the country.  As newer and better stuff came on the market, guys sold their older gear for whatever they could get for it locally and the prices compared to new gear were quite good.  The market for older gear today is somewhat distorted by the collectors, and the market for old gear is no longer just local, but international thanks to eBay and online classified sites.  Prices for boatanchor gear have leveled off in the past couple of years and will begin to decline as the older amateurs pass out of the hobby.  Once the nostalgia value fades, old gear may once again be valued based on how it performs against modern equipment (generally poorly). 
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K8AC
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Posts: 1912




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« Reply #23 on: October 14, 2014, 07:29:42 AM »

I think it's true that the price of much of the used gear is indeed higher than it should be, assuming that price is (or should be) related to function and condition.  When I started in amateur radio, the concept of someone collecting old ham gear was unknown, at least in my part of the country.  As newer and better stuff came on the market, guys sold their older gear for whatever they could get for it locally and the prices compared to new gear were quite good.  The market for older gear today is somewhat distorted by the collectors, and the market for old gear is no longer just local, but international thanks to eBay and online classified sites.  Prices for boatanchor gear have leveled off in the past couple of years and will begin to decline as the older amateurs pass out of the hobby.  Once the nostalgia value fades, old gear may once again be valued based on how it performs against modern equipment (generally poorly). 
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G3RZP
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Posts: 1321




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« Reply #24 on: October 14, 2014, 07:34:52 AM »

I have puzzled for some time over the answer to 'Where do the old rigs go?' Surely such a large number cannot all have gone to landfill - or can they? Think how many HROs, BC610s, BC348s, SX28s and so on were made....
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W9GB
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« Reply #25 on: October 14, 2014, 09:44:29 AM »

Quote from: K4COP
I think as we get older we sometimes yearn for the good old days and try to get back some of the youth we have seen go by all too quickly.
The "Good Olde Days" were not that great.

At the beginning of 1970s, before the 1973 Arab Oil Embargo -- USA was facing economic issues (Nixon's wage/price controls of 1970).  The gasoline pump prices were around 25 cents a gallon (if you lived in Missouri, it was as low as 19 cents a gallon.  Some urban areas as high as 29 cents a gallon).

By Autumn of 1973, OPEC achieved power and for the remainder of the 1970s ... many retail gasoline stations closed and there were shortages.  Gasoline had increased 3 times (75 cents a gallon) and inflation was out of control ... Gerald Ford's Whip Inflation Now (WIN) in 1975.

By the time we get to Carter's 1979/1980 ... Things go crazy.
12-month CDs at some banks as high as 20%.  
The Iran hostage crisis, OPEC, and partial embargo drove gasoline prices to $1.25 a gallon,
with some areas of eastern US even higher ($1.45 was one NY pump price I remember in 1980)
during the winter months.

So, in less than 7 years the price of gasoline (pump) increased by 6 times!!

« Last Edit: October 14, 2014, 09:48:13 AM by W9GB » Logged
KS2G
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Posts: 1081




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« Reply #26 on: October 14, 2014, 12:22:00 PM »

I have puzzled for some time over the answer to 'Where do the old rigs go?' Surely such a large number cannot all have gone to landfill - or can they?

Yes they can -- and have.

Just like old cars ... hundreds of thousands of what otherwise might have been "classics" had they been retained and maintained.

On the other hand ... the world of "classic cars" is full of "barn finds".

Likewise with old ham gear -- often found at yard and garage sales.
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N2EY
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« Reply #27 on: October 14, 2014, 12:54:00 PM »

I have puzzled for some time over the answer to 'Where do the old rigs go?' Surely such a large number cannot all have gone to landfill - or can they? Think how many HROs, BC610s, BC348s, SX28s and so on were made....

Not all that many, really. Not when you consider how many hams there are today. Nor how many were simply discarded over the decades because "nobody wants that old junk any more".

Consider the BC-348. It was used in all USAAF medium and heavy bombers. Maybe 50-100,000 were made in all. Of those, many didn't survive the war. Some others were scrapped with the planes they were in. So maybe half made it to the surplus market.

Of those that wound up in civilian hands, a certain percentage just disappeared in various ways - hacked up, thrown away, forgotten in attics, tossed out by families of an SK, etc.

So if we started with 100,000, maybe 25,000 are left today. Maybe.

But there are over 724,000 hams in the USA today. Of those who have a BC-348, at least some have several.

What was once common became rare.

73 de Jim, N2EY
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G3RZP
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Posts: 1321




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« Reply #28 on: October 14, 2014, 01:11:26 PM »

Jim,

I'll agree on ex mil gear. But things like 75A receivers, SX101, SX88 - all those ham rigs. Surely so many of the families of deceased hams didn't just land fill them? They can't all be that dim as to realise that there MIGHT be some value......

Like I have a Drake TR3 mobile PSU which is apparently VERY rare. And a WW2 spy set - an AMarkIII which is pushing $4000 worth.......You would think that people faced with a pile of gear might figure it COULD be worth something, even if it's only cents on the pound from the flippers.
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N8CMQ
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« Reply #29 on: October 14, 2014, 03:22:21 PM »

Another thing about the old gear, much of it went overseas lately, Japan bought tons of tube gear for some odd reason...
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N8CMQ   Jeff Retired...
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