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Survey Question

Question

Is interference from consumer electronics, powerline noise, deliberate QRM or BPL Trials spoiling your ham radio operating? Tell us your experiences...

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Survey Comments

LOCAL NOISE

The noise level at my QTH used to be fairly quiet, and I was able to hear the weakest DX signals...now it is getting impossible. With the widespread use of almost everything using switch mode PSU's, broadband internet radiation from telephone wires, radiation from TV antennas and downleads, and just general hash, I am having to struggle more and more to hear the signals. I'm just glad I've managed to work lots of DX over the last 40 years...Steve, G3OAG
Posted by G3OAG on 2007-03-21

Powerline noise

There are two really bad sources near my QTH, and I have located them for the power company...at least to the pole locations. If they want me to climb up and find the exact spot, I'll do that, too. I have given them pole locations and numbers, but they won't take care of it. It might be time to call Riley Hollingsworth...

The same company provides my underground feed; the neutral opened up a few years ago, blowing almost everything that was on at the time. Cost was over $12,000, and they denied the claim. Naturally, I was between insurance companies (Two days without insurance, and guess when it blew up!), so I had to replace everything out of my own pocket. I'm not really happy with my local Edison guys.
Posted by KI6DCB on 2006-05-13

RFI help

http://www.ve3hls.com/noise/rfihome.html

I used this website to lacate and solve several RFI issues in my neighborhood. I was able to demonstrate the problem, show the neighbor what solutions were available and then help them use the devices or solutions to remedy the RFI. I agree that not every interference source is easy to locate or fix but this might help you out.

73
NZ5S
Posted by N5PFZ on 2006-05-12

RFI Noise - be "smart"

I heard Steve Wozniak (Apple guy) on the Coast to Coast AM show last week. He mentioned the humorous things a "geek" can build to have fun with electronics. Now, make of it what you will, but a noisy HD plasma thingie sounds like a bit of fun. Sort of the "Great White Whale" for us all. Come on, be a Marconi, a Farnsworth or a Farraday. See if you can listen to Wozniak's adventures at U Cal. The fun he had with "rabbit ears" still evokes tears of laughter. I wish I knew this back when my neighbor pounded on my wall in time with my 40 meter morse as I worked his B&W bakelite TV set with tin foil on the antenna whip. Memories....
de KB2FBI

Posted by KB2FBI on 2006-05-11

Noisy...

Stinkin' neighbor's noisy, barking dogs -- that's real interference!!
Posted by K6SDW on 2006-05-09

Noise

Neighborhood Diplomacy, by N0AH. Ought to be a best-seller.
Posted by NI0C on 2006-05-08

Noise stupid

Nieghbor's noisy stuff has you down?

Throw him the FCC action book and have him look on his electronics manuals and equipment for a word about interference.

Then have Joe from the ham club come over and flash a badge in the nieghbor's face and tell him to turn off his junk in the house's trunk and quit whining about RFI-

Read your license- You HAVE rights- Bunch of cry babies in here-
Posted by N0AH on 2006-05-06

Noise

I found something that helped a lot at my QTH, and I intend to do more of the same.

I mail-ordered a high-current line filter - a component that is commonly found at the power input for large systems. You can get them from places like Dow-Key for a pretty small price.

Then, I put this in a grounded metal box, and ran my AC power line for the power supply that runs most of my station through it.

The result was a 3-4 S-unit improvement in the amount of noise detected in my receiver.

Now, I'm not sure if this is because the gear we're using doesn't have any filtering on the power mains - most likely the case - or if the grunge on our power lines has gotten that much worse - it could be. Today, on days when the neighbor has his plasma noise generator turned off (fortunately, he has drunken parties 24X7, and doesn't watch TV much)my noise level is S2 or less on all bands.

I am hoping that LCD TV's will supplant the power-guzzling plasma's in a few years.

Another big problem is that nobody runs more than 100 watts on HF anymore, in order to avoid QRMing the neighbor's stereos and TVs. Signals that would have been S9 years ago are S5 now. So, the S6 noise that didn't bother you before is a big problem today.
Posted by K0RGR on 2006-05-05

Much noisier

I've noticed a tremendous increase in all types of QRN and noise since my return to ham radio last summer after a half-dozen years QRT. Rarely less than a S5 level. I think this a more important issue than antenna problems in restricted neighborhoods.
Posted by W2RDD on 2006-05-04

The Noise, Oh the noise

On another thread I stated that I wouldn't upgrade because of the foul language on HF. Well here's another reason. At my qth the noise is so bad that it's S9 + all over HF. Now granted part of it might be my poor antenna, but the rest is consumer electronics and then I don't get all of it. I find that I have better luck on VHF and up. I like to SWL as well as ham radio but HF is all but useless at my place. I can and do get some good HF experience at Field Day but I am out in a state park or some remote (read no close by subdivisions) place and can receive and speak to folks on the West Coast, with proper control ops nearby of course. My point is the only time I can work HF is away from home. May be one of these days I can move to somewhere that I can reduce the noise to something tolerable.

73,

Bill Stewart, W2BSA
Posted by W2BSA on 2006-05-04

noise

should be: QRN is building, rather than QRM...just sayin'...
Posted by K3ESE on 2006-05-03

BPL is obsolete technology

BPL is obsolete technology. If it uses up to 30 mHz over the powerlines, then its total bandwidth cannot be more than 30 megabits/second, to be shared amongst users. My cable-modem gives me 7 megabits/second, and the Cable-modem in no way interferes with my Icom IC-756ProIII transceiver. However, having four broadband clients at 7 megabits/second would saturate the BPL. That is rather pathetic.

The only use I can think of for BPL would be to jam Short Wave Listeners who want to receive stations that Uncle Same does not particularly want them to listen to. Other countries used explicit jamming techniques, this may be a stealth attack on Short Wave Listening, with the same effect. I do not like the news as censored by my Government.
Posted by VE7ALQ on 2006-05-02

NOISE

I had a nice quiet place in the country until someone moved in and has a device in their house that completly wipes out most everything on the hf bands. they of course deny that they have any problems and I don't want to cause any problems (I have a wife and children to think of) in the neiborhood so... Well reading how much the ARRL has done solving BLP problems I don't think I have much hope with the FCC on any problems here. So, I either have to put up with the noise, or well ya know. It was nice before the problems I could hear more stations at my locations than most. BUT now I .... have to listen .. noise and ............ station does not..... a 20 over signal.............. less no cop.......... shame that........ quite ....... money on my eq just .......... all beca.......... FCC not .forcing.......... rules. 73
tp
Posted by KB8LZG on 2006-05-02

It kept me from operating, until I took the FCC's advice and reoriented my receiving antenna(s) (shameless dissing of FCC's cure for BPL interference).

I moved! Rural USA. Goodbye urban RFI. Good riddance. Should have done it years ago.

73 KG5JJ
Posted by KG5JJ on 2006-05-02

Speaking of QRM, I'm sure someone has noticed all the double posts being caused by the "nag message" asking for paid support for the website.
Posted by N3EG on 2006-05-01

Qrm'ers

Phil, come to think of in the past few years you just can't honestly get good qrm'ers any more. Most these new guys can't seem to stir up enough signal to do it although they sure try. I hear em trying to key up on cw op's and make stupid noises. What a waste. The only other place that reminds me of these types is the local boat launching ramp at the lake. Maybe the stupid qrm'ers all own fishing boats too. "lol" Have a great week! WR8D
Posted by WR8D on 2006-04-30

qrn? qrm ? so what

I have noticed over the last 10 years that both qrn and qrm are on the rise. We as amateurs really need to learn how to live with it or work around it. I do not think the conditions will get any better. DSP has helped some and filters seem to also help. My neighbor purchased a plasma tv a few months back wow what a lot of noise that thing makes I thought the Russian woodpecker was back a toroid was the fix it is some times hard to convince your neighbors that it is to their benefit that you are probing around their house looking for noise lucky for me they are very understanding about my silly hobby as they call it. any way guess we will have to get used to the idea just glad I am not in a BPL part of North Carolina yet when it comes suppose I eill have to deal with it.I got into the hobby for the experimentation part of it and just love a good challenge
Posted by AE4NR on 2006-04-29

QRM

You don't need a survey for this. Just turn your rigs on. Now is a good time to sell an Amp or be an Amp dealer. Just a thought. God Bless!!

Nick
W9ZXT
Posted by WB9QEL on 2006-04-29

crap consumer electronics

The other night I tuned to 1895 on 160 meters, I wanted to join a local net and a loud signal was covering the net. I tuned around the band and found several other " Birdies".. My neighbor just purchased a new HD TV Plasma type which receives TV and TRANSMITS crap. This stuff is illegal but why are we not catching this at the manufacturing level???? Its to late once this junk is sold and placed in a persons home!

Posted by WB8UHZ on 2006-04-29

crap consumer electronics

The other night I tuned to 1895 on 160 meters, I wanted to join a local net and a loud signal was covering the net. I tuned around the band and found several other " Birdies".. My neighbor just purchased a new HD TV Plasma type which receives TV and TRANSMITS crap. This stuff is illegal but why are we not catching this at the manufacturing level???? Its to late once this junk is sold and placed in a persons home!

Posted by WB8UHZ on 2006-04-29

qrm

Once the kids grow up the QRM will stop.
OH! Right they already grew up I guess.
Maybe causing QRM Is a whole new hobby.
How about having QRM contest to see if
you could get the worked all fools award
VE1PGC Phil
Posted by VE1PGC on 2006-04-29

Ooooops!

Had my glasses off and really thought it said QRN. (Must've skimmed over the deliberate part....)

But I thought Riley had cured all of the deliberate QRM?? I thought he was being recognized for this great achievements next month at Dayton?

Watch what happens in 5.5 years. You think there's deliberate QRM now.......

73, Bill - WA8MEA
Posted by WA8MEA on 2006-04-28

Give it up

Code ...Code...always Code...Give it up!
Posted by KG4PFO on 2006-04-28

move on

The subject has nothing to do with CW. If the FCC changes the rules and drops CW, get over it. Ham radio changes as the technology allows. With the increasing use of things that generate QRN we need to find ways to operate in spite of it. Always trying to blame changes in how we are licensed in not going to make it go away. Get over it or move on.
Frank
Posted by KL7IPV on 2006-04-28

NOISE

I stoped my 160 and 80 m DX operations becuse high noise level from high voltage distribution lines around my QTH.


Posted by LU1DZ on 2006-04-27

NOISE

I stoped my 160 and 80 m DX operations becuse high noise level from high voltage distribution lines around my QTH.


Posted by LU1DZ on 2006-04-27

Part 15?

It's too bad that the governmental body that should be enforcing the very regulations that it produced is now owned and operated by commercial interests. I speak of the FCC, of course, where corporate revenues matter the most.

And we pay taxes to keep them in place. They brought us BPL and virtually ignore the effects; they tell manufacturers to meet certain emission specs then refuse to do anything when the products pollute the spectrum, etc.

QRM was a problem when I got into this hobby in 1959, and it still is today, and we had to deal with the QRN from television sets. But the crap emitted by my neighbors' wall warts, refrigerators, PC's, oven timers, garage door openers, etc., is beyond belief. The FCC just lets it happen, just like it is letting BPL hose our HF bands into uselessness.

Yes, it really is a hell of a pain in the neck!
Posted by K4IQT on 2006-04-27

Mobile QRM

I'm a younger HAM, (bus bound university student) and I can be found working the local reapeaters off said bus...

some buses are ok but there are otheres that you climb on and there 40 over s9 noise ALL AROUND you....

thankfully I haven't experienced anything at my home QTH...
Posted by VE6NHZ on 2006-04-27

Mobile QRM

I'm a younger HAM, (bus bound university student) and I can be found working the local reapeaters off said bus...

some buses are ok but there are otheres that you climb on and there 40 over s9 noise ALL AROUND you....

thankfully I haven't experienced anything at my home QTH...
Posted by VE6NHZ on 2006-04-27

RFI

Power line noise, switching mode battery chargers and modified sine wave power inverters.


When I first moved into my new QTH I was greeted by enormous amounts of RFI. The first source was a modified sine wave power inverter my neighbor was using in his 5th wheel to run a lamp, TV and VCR. The interference was S9+ from 160 - 6 meters. I had to write a letter to him explaining my delema, we met and we were able to resolve the interference. With that noise source gone I quickly discovered at least 4 noise sources of power line interference; signal strengths were as high as S9+10 dB at times and would go on for days or weeks. Lastly there was and still is interference coming from the same 5th wheel, it's the switching mode battery charger that keeps the battery charged. The interference consists of lobes 10kHz across, spaced 50kHz apart and span 160 - 40 meters. They drift slowly and take as long as 45 minutes to traverse through the passband of my transceiver and are S7 - 9.


I am currently in communication with our local power company's RFI person and they are actively resolving these problems. As for the battery charger, I plan on contacting my neighbor again. He was helpful the last time and said if I had any other issues to contact him again. I'll do that when I have the snap on RFI beads in hand.



Craig - N7UQA
Posted by N7UQA on 2006-04-27

Noise

I come home from work and have to turn off the radio when I pull into my townhouse community. Consumer electronics is consuming our radio waves! I don't know if I want to spend the money on a new radio? I cannot access the repeater near my house until I leave the townhouse. Any suggestions would be great.
Posted by KI6ADA on 2006-04-26

QRM

The extremely poor operating practices heard on the CW bands are beginning to get to me! In a DX pile up, it just makes no sense at all to be calling the DX when he does not respond to you. Spotting DX on a cluster brings the uninformed to put their VFO on the DX's frequency to tune their amp. Playing 'cop' by sitting on the DX frequency and continuiously sending 'up up up LID' causes more QRM than just saying nothing.

The really sad part of this is that a large majority of these poor operators are older hams. And older hams who 'do not have the time' to elmer the new folks. Learning to fly my r/c helicopter is becoming more fun than continiously hearing the poor quality of CW operators on the bands today.

Tom - W4BQF
Posted by W4BQF on 2006-04-26

DX Clusters bringing QRM

Pardon the pun, but W4BQF's comments are spot on.
Inexperienced DX'ers need to realize that cluster spots are informational only and are not an invitation to transmit-- unless and until-- you can hear the DX and you know it's your turn to call.

Experienced DX'ers need to refrain from policing the frequencies.

All Dx'ers should be using the clusters less, and the tuning knob more.

Because of what I see as the negative impact of the clusters, I'm putting out fewer spots. Let people find their own DX.

73,
Chuck NI0C

Posted by NI0C on 2006-04-26

Back on topic....

It caused me to stop operating for a while....until I moved.

The interference was SO BAD, it got into the TV, along with the AM AND FM radios.

Consumers Power came out with their little direction finding equipment....once. And on a day that wasn't bad. Numerous calls and threats to Consumers Power did nothing. Calls to the FCC - Detroit Office resulted in my meeting some of the DUMBEST Public Service(?) people I have ever run into in my entire life.

Bought a house miles away from the crap. I went up and down the new street for WEEKS before closing, using AM, FM and amatuer radio gear just to make sure it was a interference free neighborhood.

So far, so good....

73, Bill - WA8MEA
wa8mea@hotmail.com
http://HamRadioFun.com
Posted by WA8MEA on 2006-04-26

Whaddya mean "Back on Topic"?

Re-read the question. Deliberate QRM was one of the concerns mentioned.

Posted by NI0C on 2006-04-26

BPL? What is Coming???

Well I understand that in my area BPL will pass through to reach remote small towns so that they can have service...I am happy that they will GET SERVICE, But I admit that I am worried that "THE NOISE" I've been reading about...WILL COME!!!!
Posted by NE5C on 2006-04-25

Qrm

My complaint is the eq crowd with their tx width out to God knows what. We used to be gentlemen, yeah its crowded but now with the hifi junk going on its common to hear stations splattering sometimes 10kc's. I run one and keep my tx width at 2.7, sounds as good as anyones else so i just can't understand these guys running so wide. There's just so much you can do to a ssb signal then it gets so filthy. The 10kc i mentioned was all the way from Texas to here in Wv on some weekend nights. I thought i'd mention the distance just so everyone would realize how far apart some of us are from each other and honestly how nasty it gets. The other thing about this that pukes me is many times you'll hear a guy sit there and just be saying one two, one two...you can go up the band and have a qso for a half hour then come back by that freq and he'll still be there listening to himself and saying...test test...one two, one two. Like the man said you can't fix "stupid". This is WR8D and i approved this comment. --... ..--
Posted by WR8D on 2006-04-25

Qrm

My complaint is the eq crowd with their tx width out to God knows what. We used to be gentlemen, yeah its crowded but now with the hifi junk going on its common to hear stations splattering sometimes 10kc's. I run one and keep my tx width at 2.7, sounds as good as anyones else so i just can't understand these guys running so wide. There's just so much you can do to a ssb signal then it gets so filthy. The 10kc i mentioned was all the way from Texas to here in Wv on some weekend nights. I thought i'd mention the distance just so everyone would realize how far apart some of us are from each other and honestly how nasty it gets. The other thing about this that pukes me is many times you'll hear a guy sit there and just be saying one two, one two...you can go up the band and have a qso for a half hour then come back by that freq and he'll still be there listening to himself and saying...test test...one two, one two. Like the man said you can't fix "stupid". This is WR8D and i approved this comment. --... ..--
Posted by WR8D on 2006-04-25

NOISE

Oh, my gosh, I'm finally in the majority!
Posted by AA8LL on 2006-04-24

QRM

As soon as the "broadcasters" (K1MAN and ARRL) are off the air, QRM will drop considerablly!
Posted by W9WHE-II on 2006-04-24

QRM

While the plasma TV I bought last November is part of the problem (note to self: Do your home work next time) it seems that there is some increase in the noise. I would expect it to be the porliferation of consumer electronics (dimmers, thermostats, digital TV displays) in the neighborhood.

I can live with those. The problem that I have is when the QRM comes from someone taking 10 kHz of space in SSB or PSK31, you point it to their attention and then they blame you for their problems.

I am not trying to be the enforcer here. but just to call it the operator's attention when I have problems working the weak ones through the splatter.

Kinda of a pain in the neck, isn't it?
Posted by KA2UUP on 2006-04-24

QRN

Power line QRN at my QTH is very bad. I've called the power company several times. Their tech has visted several times, but he doesn't seem to be able to provide any real, lasting solution. I just don't operate as much as I used to because of the QRN.
Posted by WB6SMX on 2006-04-24

It's building

Is what I voted. Doesn't keep me from operating and hearing contacts, but I do wonder sometimes how many I might miss because I really can't hear them.

Definitely worse today than 10 years ago, and a lot worse than 40 years ago.
Posted by WB2WIK on 2006-04-24

Living in central Bristol is like operating in an RF dustbin. I am surrounded by neighbourhood thermostats, plasma screen TVs, switches, power tools, alarms etc but I still love to operate HF CW and deal with the noise as best I can.

73 de Steve M0RNA
Posted by M0RNA on 2006-04-24

Living in central Bristol is like operating in an RF dustbin. I am surrounded by neighbourhood thermostats, plasma screen TVs, switches, power tools, alarms etc but I still love to operate HF CW and deal with the noise as best I can.

73 de Steve M0RNA
Posted by M0RNA on 2006-04-24


Many Ham's have told me they just gave up and went to EchoLink and /or IRLP to stay in touch with fellow hams on distant repeaters. :(

For them those systems,while not Ham Radio as we know, it has kept them in the loop.

If BPL is used extensively ( which I doubt ) the above scenario will only escalate.
Posted by G3SEA on 2006-04-24


Many Ham's have told me they just gave up and went to EchoLink and /or IRLP to stay in touch with fellow hams on distant repeaters. :(

For them those systems,while not Ham Radio as we know, it has kept them in the loop.

If BPL is used extensively ( which I doubt ) the above scenario will only escalate.
Posted by G3SEA on 2006-04-24

noise victum

The RFI and kerchunking impact me and I'm not the cause! Another hams activities are a problem.. I consider powerline noise a
relief!
Posted by KB1GMX on 2006-04-24

NOISE

I used to look forward to QUIET CONDX on 80
CW in the winter. Now it never happens.
Posted by WA3SLN on 2006-04-24

QRM

It's a minor irritant. I have more trouble operating mobile than I do at home.
Posted by W4KPA on 2006-04-24

Noise

So far, most of my noise have been created from sources within my own home.

I find that having the ability and skills to track down and identify sources of interference helps immensely in terms of resolving them.

So if your reading this and want to learn more about doing this on your own, then you might enjoy this site:

http://www.kyes.com/antenna/interference/tvibook.html

Posted by KC8VWM on 2006-04-24